A Difficult Decision

So KB says I should post this thread in the Bar Room so I'm taking his advice. While I understand that the Bar Room shows leniency towards spam, I would greatly appreciate it if I could get some real, genuine thoughts on the matter. Now on to the matter at hand.


I've been asking me this question over and over again: is the military right for me? I've spent a good amount of my last month thinking this over. There was a perk to the military that I've been thinking about most: the concept of comradeship among members of a unit. Whether it be in actual battle or a desk job, I've come to understand that people in the same or even close units for an unusual bond that is unknown to those of us in the civilian world. That "brotherhood" if you will, is incredibly appealing to me. Let me explain:

I played football earlier this year (my senior year) in high school. There was a tight bond that I had with a lot of the other players and the team as a whole. People on that team wanted each other to do well at games and even at each practice after school. The feeling of community among all of us was all too prevalent: we wanted to be there and we loved coming to practice and seeing each other. Although none of us had ever served with each other in combat, I still felt that each one of them was a member of an alternate family that I had at school. I loved that family feeling and I didn't want it to end.

That's a pretty big driving force for me right now. I truly want to feel that family feeling again, no matter what it takes. Now don’t get me wrong: I do feel this way about my actual family. But that reason that this felt so unique was because I had never actually known any of the people on the football team. They were not related to me by blood or by marriage, but simply by the activities that we took part in with each other: a competitive team sport.

But I digress… There are more important things for me to discuss here. What role would I fulfill in the military? Would I work a desk job, or would I serve in a combat role? These different roles flood my mind for one main reason: because I know that I could fulfill them to the best of my ability. I know that if my weapon of choice were a keyboard, or an M-4 Carbine, I would do it, and I would succeed, no matter what. I have nothing but faith in myself to carry out any task that is assigned to me.

There is also something else that has been getting at me lately. Most of the time when I’m at home, I have to be told by my parents to do the dishes, or walk the dogs, or do this or that. I’ve come to believe that I’m not self-sufficient enough to be able to do these things without being told to do so. This idea of self-insufficiency coupled with the fact that I am an extremely lazy person has made me believe that the military would be a good way to get some discipline in my life. When I think of it this way, it almost sounds like a “that’s what I need in my life” line or something like that.

This also brings on another topic that is bothering me: if I have to be told what to do, what kind of officer would I be? Most likely a bad one I think. Anyone in any leadership role needs to be able to think on his or her feet (which I can do), but also know what is the right decision in any given situation (which I’m not too good at). I’m sure that some of you tagged here have witnessed this lack of judgment in one way or another while spending time with me. Usually (from what I’ve seen), it’s a lack of common sense on my part. And if I have little common sense and I need to be told what to do, that’s a great formula for a bad leader/officer.

Then again, maybe I’m just not giving myself credit. Maybe I do have self-sufficiency; I don’t really know to be honest. I’m just putting my thoughts down at first glance.

Anyway, time for the research part of this note. From what I’ve found, a student enrolled in ROTC for the last two years of their college career MUST “sign on the dotted line” so to speak. Students that enroll in ROTC as a first time freshman have the option of not signing on the dotted line. What does that mean for me? It means that I’m nowhere near a conclusion with respect to this subject, so it looks like I won’t be taking ROTC in college. Plus, from what I’ve seen, San Francisco State (the college I'm currently aiming at) doesn’t offer it anyway.

However, there is another program called OCS (Officer’s Candidate School) which the person in question must be physically fit, possess a college degree and be of a certain age. It is a separate course that is taking after college has ended. Upon graduation from this course, the candidate is donned with the gold bar of second lieutenant and is contracted to serve a designated number of years in the army or reserves.

The bottom line is that I am currently not inclined to join the armed forces, nor do I plan on enlisting after college. This is all just research at the moment and I still plan on a civilian life after college. I'm just trying to find myself.

I've made some great friends on these forums and I would very much appreciate your thoughts (whether I know you or not). And please... Leave the politics out. Thanks in advance.
 
If you can take orders well, then do it. Besides going to war, there are a shit load of benefits to joining the military (namely, being able to pretty much get whatever kind of government job you want after you are discharged). Although I'm a civilian and I think military personnel do get too many benefits, I won't deny that there are a a lot of advantages to enlisting.
 
I am currently enlisted in Air Force so I might be able to help you with any questions you have. I am enlisted though and enlisted and officers are completly different. So if you have any questions I can try to answer them the best I can.
 
Being 17, I wouldn't get too caught up in a supposed "calling" to a way of life. You're coming up to an age where your outlook on your purpose changes VERY often. Not to mention that most people like being social and most kids your age don't want to do the dishes. While not trying to belittle how you feel about this matter, I definitely think this deserves consideration beyond those factors that you listed here.

Very heavy stuff, sir. I can understand why you'd want to get some of that off your chest.
 
From what your post leads me to believe, you've copied and pasted part of this from your Facebook. How are the people in your life responding to this?
 
It's not from his Facebook. I just checked.

I say join the military if you really feel you're up to it. You get to go places and get benefits, as well as a good career.
 
Not from his Facebook?

Well I'm sure he wasn't physically tagging people. That much is for sure.
 
You don’t necessarily go places I have been in for 4 years. I have been to San Antonio(Basic), Biloxi Mississippi, San Angelo Texas, and Panama City Florida.
 
Well I was born in England, lived in Florida for eight and a half years, Italy for four, and am now in Ohio. So :shrug:
 
You don’t necessarily go places I have been in for 4 years. I have been to San Antonio(Basic), Biloxi Mississippi, San Angelo Texas, and Panama City Florida.

Just depends on what carreer field you get into. Some travel more than others.


Dont stress over it so much kiddo. its just 4 years. If you dont like it, get out. If you do like it, here is a carreer with a shit ton of benefits.

yea, you might die and shit. Everyone else on this forum might as well, for reasons far less worthy, during every day life.
 
I wouldn't do it. At least not at the moment. I'm 18. I have a lot of time to think about it. I see you're about a year younger than me. If you wan't my advice, don't rush it. Go have some fun first, then, if you really want it, you can go for it. You only have your youth for some time, and it comes before becoming an adult. Enjoy it while it lasts, then get serious.This is a big decision. Like with marriage, you need to think this through and be sure you can see it to the end.
 
Just depends on what carreer field you get into. Some travel more than others.


Dont stress over it so much kiddo. its just 4 years. If you dont like it, get out. If you do like it, here is a carreer with a shit ton of benefits.

yea, you might die and shit. Everyone else on this forum might as well, for reasons far less worthy, during every day life.

Oh I wasnt complaining simply saying every recruiter promises travel and really it very rarely happens. With all the cutbacks the military is going through one thing they have cutback on is PCSing. I do agree it all depends on your career field.
 
I wouldn't do it. At least not at the moment. I'm 18. I have a lot of time to think about it. I see you're about a year younger than me. If you wan't my advice, don't rush it. Go have some fun first, then, if you really want it, you can go for it. You only have your youth for some time, and it comes before becoming an adult. Enjoy it while it lasts, then get serious.This is a big decision. Like with marriage, you need to think this through and be sure you can see it to the end.

why waste time fucking about "having fun"...is your idea of fun taking basketweaving classes at community college and eating mac and cheese while living on your mom's futon?

Look, man. You get a job, get paid well, and get to have what basically amounts to a full scholorship for college when its time for you to get discharged. You can still figure out what you want to do in life, and have TONS of fun (trust me, I do) while ALSO getting paid well, and receiving basically a full scholorship after 4 years.

Its just 4 fuckin years. Live somewere else, get paid, get money for college. I dont see what people get so squirly about this for.
 
You actually can you get your degree without taking any classes at all you get a lot of classes you get credit for just from doing stuff in your career field the only thing you wont get is your core classes which you can study up on and CLEP or DANTE them. When you get out you will still you have your GI bill which you can use to further your education or take the bare minimum of classes and pocket the extra money to use for cost of living.
 
Well, fuck you get a damn e-5 cost of living stipend now as it is, so you would hardly need it.

the man speaks the truth though, you can get a lot of the college done while you are in, as well. Also very dependant on your carreer feild job, as im sure not many people will want to do their 10 page final after their 6th 12 hour shift in a row
 
True you don't need it but if they are giving it to me I will take it. I think if your not sure what you want to do right out of high school join up. You have have 4 more years to figure out what you want to do get a solid paycheck pretty much free living for 4 years. Then when you know what you want to go to college for its paid for, doesn't get much better then that.
 
What they don't tell you though is that you have to take an aptitude test of some kind that determines what you can and can not train for, and once you choose it your stuck with it. It's not like a major in college where you can switch if you find you don't like it, your stuck. Also, they don't get paid that well, every person I have known who was in the military ended up working at gas stations or odd jobs because they couldn't get hired anywhere, you know why? Because they had no real work record, just military service that didn't make them qualified for most regular jobs. The truth is you can make more money working at a QuickTrip than being in the military and you don't have to give up your rights to do it. Is that something you are prepared to do ? Are you willing to trade government handouts for your freedom? Once you sign on that dotted line you are no longer a person, your a piece of property, another government issue soldier that they own, you want to be a slave? Be told when to eat, sleep, shit, and drop and give me 20? You want their piss poor medical coverage and G.I. bill that doesn't really cover shit when it comes to college? No. Then on top of all of it you'll probably get sent over seas to Afghanistan or something putting you in real fucking danger all for them to control how good or bad you live. You can do a lot more by just committing yourself to getting a good education. Don't sell your freedom for what they make to sound like the easy road, the cost is much higher than they make it out to be, and it's not worth it.
 
What they don't tell you though is that you have to take an aptitude test of some kind that determines what you can and can not train for, and once you choose it your stuck with it. It's not like a major in college where you can switch if you find you don't like it, your stuck.

Incorrect. You can cross train at any time. Of course, you cant get into certain jobs without proper aptitude test scores, but were in the world isnt it like that?

Also, they don't get paid that well, every person I have known who was in the military ended up working at gas stations or odd jobs because they couldn't get hired anywhere, you know why?

Your incorrect again here. I never have less then ten grand in my bank account, and live quite wildly. I make quite comparable or much more money that practically eveyone in my age group. I was doing things at the age of 18 that no one else does outside of drug dealers, entertainers, or athletes.



You want their piss poor medical coverage and G.I. bill that doesn't really cover shit when it comes to college? No.

They take great medical care of you. You are their investment, why the fuck would they allow it to get fucked up? I have never had anything but the utmost in medical care and attention.

You also receive 100% tuition coverage while on active duty, 40 grand when you get out, AND a very, VERY good living stipend when you are out as well. The GI Bill is practically a full ride scholorship these days.

if you would like, you can continue to keep talking out of your ass and being schooled by me, or you can stop taling bad about the fucking military with generalized hearsay bullshit, like everyone else who doesnt have a fucking clue likes to.
 
My advice to each of my friends who have looked into this, or went ahead and did it:

Know exactly what you are getting in to. Know exactly what those papers you sign are saying. Get real honest answers up front, don't let anything you are curious about slip away. I don't say this to knock the military; having grown up an Army brat and having seen many friends enter the service to various degrees of success or failure, often times I've found that some recruiters can be pretty shady with how they get you to commit.

There are a plethora of benefits to doing this, so educate yourself about what those are, find the path right for you, and take it for all it's worth. I hope you find some answers about this, and whatever you choose to do I wish you well. Good luck, kiddo.
 
While this thread still has NorCal's attention:

What is the upper age limit to enlist, beyond needing to be able to physically handle your shit?
 
While this thread still has NorCal's attention:

What is the upper age limit to enlist, beyond needing to be able to physically handle your shit?

28

least it was when I joined, likely the same now, I would say, although its older if you are doing the guard or reserves
 
I'd say go for it and join, my best friend and old room mate joined a few monthes back and is loving every minute of it. I plan on joining if my girlfriend and I break up.
 
Ok Norcal, we've managed to coexist for the most part here and I haven't had a problem with you, often times enjoying your work, but right now you are really fucking with the fire.

For starters, don't you dare try to fuck with me you got it ! I deal with most of you people constantly hounding me for anything I say, mostly because I have something different to say than most of you. It's not what you like or want to hear so you just beat me to death for saying anything contrary to what you think, well fuck them and fuck you if you've got a problem. I'll say whatever I god damn well want to say.


You think I'm lying about any of the info I laid out, I got most of that information straight from a recruiter you asshole. Unless he was trying to discourage my brother from going into the military why else would he tell me, "you take a test and based off of your scores there are certain things that will allow you to do, but if you don't test high enough to do what you want to do, you have to pick something else and stick with it as the job you are going to do in the military" so basically your screwed.

Your incorrect again here. I never have less then ten grand in my bank account, and live quite wildly. I make quite comparable or much more money that practically eveyone in my age group. I was doing things at the age of 18 that no one else does outside of drug dealers, entertainers, or athletes.


Oh really Sgt. Slaughter? Why don't you tell me about it? Oh I see, you're trumping up the benefits so you don't sound like you got fucking duped by the government, I got it. First of all, you don't have a fucking clue whether what I'm saying is correct or incorrect because you don't know any of the people I've known who've been royally fucked by uncle sam in every way they could. I know an older gentleman who used to work for the Army, his job was to find different way to screw soldiers out of their benefits, no bullshit, that's why he got out of it. Almost all of my friends enlisted, fought, and some died for the fucking military and none of them received adequate compensation, none of them. They were all poor from working for the military, they couldn't find the jobs that the military promises you are etched in stone, and they mostly all have ended up having to work at low level jobs because the truth is they don't train you for shit, but when their giving you their sales pitch boy oh boy you get it all. These fucking snakes prey on kids just like the OP who don't really have a concept of what real money is, so they say you can make $30,000 or some shit plus the free tax payer covered handouts, and that seems like a lot to a kid who hasn't been in the real world and doesn't know how much money they can really make. Not to mention that money is taxed as well so part of it is just going back to them. $30,000 seems like a lot to a kid at 18 and it may be at that time, but in the grand scheme of things it's dog shit, especially when held up as compensation for giving up your rights. Oh and why didn't you address that G.I. Joe? how come you didn't want to speak up about that? Was that another lie asshole? No, it's the fucking truth. They screw you in every way possible. If your ok with getting hand outs from the government and not being able to earn more than they think you should go ahead and give it a go, you want to maintain your freedom and make some real money, go to college, get an education, and get into a career.

They take great medical care of you. You are their investment, why the fuck would they allow it to get fucked up? I have never had anything but the utmost in medical care and attention.

Really? what about all the soldiers who were coming over from Iraq some time back who couldn't even get medical attention, or piss poor medical attention with their "Government Benefits"? Got an answer for that smart ass ? What about the common public knowledge that it's shit, and your better off getting your own personal insurance where you can pick where your own doctors, pick your coverage, and your not limited to what the government agrees to pay for or settle for the doctor they say you have to go to.


You also receive 100% tuition coverage while on active duty, 40 grand when you get out, AND a very, VERY good living stipend when you are out as well. The GI Bill is practically a full ride scholorship these days
.

Yeah I'm positive that's what the brochure says cojack. You keep selling that recruiters sales pitch and I'll stick to telling people what the fuck really happens. First of all, active duty is the only way your getting shit, and then you aren't doing anything but that so it's not like your going to be in school or anything, your on a base being the governments bitch. Secondly everyone I have known never got anywhere near that kind of tuition assistance, and when they tried to get it, the military did everything they could to try and avoid it and tried to come up with any excuse to not have to, I'm not making this shit up, it's the truth. Your experience might have been different but there are a lot more people getting fucked than what you are willing to own up to and that makes you look full of shit.

No one I ever knew ever got anything near 40k either, it was always "You get this much now, this much later, and eventually it equals what your supposed to get, but none of them ever got all that money. The most any of them I knew ever got was around 20k for reserve and just barely above that for active. One of my best friends did 2 tours of Iraq and 1 or 2 tours of Afghanistan for the Marines, after he came back he wasn't even making enough money to get by, he had to live with his parents because what he got from the military wasn't even enough to support living in a one bedroom apartment. Not to mention the others who all came back with mental problems waking up in the middle of the night thinking not able to sleep because their still fucking traumatized from all the shit they endured. Yeah, really worth it. The fact of the matter stands, you can make more money at a QuickTrip with better benefits and all your freedom.


if you would like, you can continue to keep talking out of your ass and being schooled by me, or you can stop taling bad about the fucking military with generalized hearsay bullshit, like everyone else who doesnt have a fucking clue likes to.

Schooled? You must be under the illusion that I am one of these people who can't tango with you, well you've got another thing coming if you think I'm some fucking pushover and that you can ride your wave of false superiority over me. I am telling the shit they lie about and don't tell you. If you don't like it, tough shit. That's what it is, and there are far more cases of the nature I am talking about, than wonder stories like what you are trying to promote giving a false perception of the whole deal. I watched my friends fight for this country and get the shaft you fucking asshole, you think that's here-say? When I am watching my friends who put their lives at stake struggle to make it off of the sub standard pay and benefits the government provided them? How fucking dare you? You have no idea what the fuck I have seen, and the real "Benefits" or lack thereof I have seen promised and never delivered.

My dad was a special forces officer in the Army back in the 60's when it was still tough "Orange Thunder" based in Hawaii, he told me himself not to get into it because it was a fuck-job, and then I watched everyone I knew get screwed by good old uncle sam too, don't try to dismiss the true life observations I have seen because you want to defend a crooked military that doesn't appreciate their soldiers and doesn't follow through on their end of the deal. Unless you are going to make a life long career out of it, it's a joke, it's bullshit, and if you have aspirations of living above the poverty line you probably don't want to get into it. You want the government controlling almost every aspect of your life, what kind of earning potential you have, and what field of study you can get into, go for the military. You want to make your own choices, succeed to whatever you decide your potential is, and get into anything you want, stay out of the military and go get a real education.
 

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