[Official] John Cena Thread

[TWJC: The Beginning]

K, this is double posting but I don't care, I posted this in another thread, but I don't want to retype it in a different way, so I'll just copy and paste. READ THE FOLLOWING:

John Cena does NOT suck by any means. Think about it, what's the point of a WWE wrestler, is it to put on 5 star matches? No, is it to innovate new moves? No, has it EVER been about having the best in ring product? NO, it has ALWAYS been about selling. Selling merch, selling tix, ratings etc.

Cena gets these for WWE, that's the truest way to judge a pro wrestler, is he over. Yes Cena is massive over. "O, but they boo him because he sucks" no, you boo him because he WANTS you to boo him. That's right, Cena WANTS smart (and I use that loosely) marks to boo him. Why? Because he gets the best reactions that way, another goal of WWE. How does he do it? Well, he's a cheesey corny face that kids love and you hate, plus he puts on formulaic safe matches weekly (another goal for WWE, being safe) and on PPV he delivers with the best matches. His matches vs Umaga, HBK, and Orton were all great, he carried Khali to his best match ever that had a great story with it and how Cena beat him with the STFU.

If Cena was in ROH would he still be good? No, but the point of ROH isn't the same as WWE, there's a different criteria. Do you honestly think that a match like Aries vs Dragon would sell well with the WWE crowd? No, they'd shit all over it, just like the ROH crowd would shit all over Cena vs Orton.

Cena is an AMAZING WWE wrestler, he has the WWE main event style down perfectly, he sells a shitton of merch, he gets the loudest, most dynamic reactions, and anyone who he's associated with immediately gets the rub. Internet fans need to realize that their opinion does not matter with the WWE, why would they cater to your needs when you're not the main fanbase? That'd be stupid.

There's a reason ROH is a niche product, because the mainstream doesn't want to see 5'9" 185 pound pale Bryan Danielson work a deep story into every match, I want to see that, but I don't confuse personal preference with truth. The truth is that entertainment sells better than sport, all the proof you need is that American Idol gets higher ratings than MLB, NFL, and NBA playoffs. Only the Superbowl outdraws it, and the Superbowl is in a different category because it's just as much a social and entertainment event to hang out with friends and laugh at the commericals as it is a sporting event.

Just so you don't think I'm a mindless Cena mark (which is probably what most of you Meltzer Kool Aid drinking, "smart" mark sheep are thinking right now) just know that I have a collection of VHS/Tapes that's about 45 days long that contains WCW, WWF/E, ECW, ROH, Chikara, PWG, NOAH, AJPW, NJPW, Tourymon, Dragon Gate, CZW, and various other biographies, documentaries, best ofs, and instructional wrestling. I have been a fan for over 10 years and go to a ton of local indy events.

Bottom line, think outside the box, what makes wrestling great is it's versatility, I don't want WWE to look like ROH, I like ROH seperate from WWE, WWE is a different product, you just have to learn to understand the qualities, that's why Shelton Benjamin isn't a good wrestler in the WWE. Sure I like him, but he has 0 charisma and no character, which is what a WWE wrestler is should be all about.

Think of it this way, there are "E" standards and (for the sake of this) "ROH" standards, Shelton Benjamin is a B+ ROH wrestler and a C WWE wrestler, CM Punk was an A ROH wrestler, and has moved to the WWE and changed his style to become a B WWE wrestler.

Pro Wrestling is all about catering to your audience and Cena does that very well in the WWE, just like Bryan Danielson does a great job at what he does in ROH.

 

[Lil Wes]

Brought this in from another thread. I expect to be bashed to little peices...

Who carried Khali?

Nobody. Khali has never had one. Not one good match. Cena marks just use that too make him look better. Both matches were so pitiful it's ridiculous.

Worst feud of the year by a landslide.

Who had MOTYC with Umaga

I hope you are talking about the gimmick match? If not, I may piss myself with laughter because the singles match at NYR was poor.

HBK

The HBK match at Mania is extremely overrated by Cena marks like yourself. On RAW? Yes that was a damn fine match, worthy of 4 stars but when people say that the Mania match that HBK carried Cena throughout was good. Please, Shoot yourself for ignorance.

That match bored me almost as much as HHH/Cena from 22.

Orton?

Lawlz.

3 stars.

Who gets smarks to boo him by being cheesey and formulaic on Raw then stealing the show 60% of the time on PPV?

What? He is a babyface he doesnt try to draw heel heat genius.

He tries to work the crowd for loads of cheers. Which doesn't work anymore. Why? Because he is extremely stale.

CENA, you sound like such a sheep.

Bahhh?

You DO realize that the new trend is actually to like Cena because he's a great WWE wrestler.

No. Not many on the internet like him. I have found only one board that likes the guy. He is hated like nobody I think I've ever seen before and what's sad about it is he's the fucking top babyface...

He isn't a "great" wrestler. For fucks sake, watch the goddamn words you use.

Greats are like Hogan, Rock, Austin, Angle, HBK, Sting, Flair and Many others. Please, stop using that fucking word. You have no idea whatsoever what a "great" wrestler is if you think Cena is one.

It's like when stupid motherfuckers try to compare Cena to Steve Austin. It's pure ignorance.

Let me ask you this, who's a better WWE wrestler, Cena or Shelton?

Cena because he is a draw and is experience in the main event scene. Plus, he has more charisma and mic skills than Shelton to carry a feud.

But if you asked me who I would be more entertained by in a one on one singles match against anyone. I'll take Shelton.

See, I prefer Shelton, but I realize that Cena is a better WWE wrestler because he is everything WWE looks for.

Well look at my above post and I pretty much agree with you.

NO, he's not supposed to be JUST babyface, he really is wanting YOU to boo him.

I disagree. Point out to me where Cena tries to get heel heat. I know maybe when he is talking about "Section C telling him he sucks". But that isn't a constant trend.

sells the most merch,

He has about twice the merch as anyone on the roster so I'm not really surprised.

Can you back this statement up with proof?

and puts on great WWE style matches,

Yeah but don't you think the same trend of booking is stale?

you fail to realize that WWE is not ROH,

I don't like ROH.

WWE does not want to put on innovative or "classic" matches and they don't want to put on spottacular crazy hardcore matches.

I know. But they do want to put on entertaining television. Which I just think Cena lacks the entertainment factor. I just don't appeal to him.

WWE isn't in a "slump" they are at a plateau, an average point.

How is it average when it is at it's lowest point since 97?

WWE's merch is still great, globally they're still up there, they're going to draw 100,000 fans for wrestlemania, they're not exactly in a "slump."

I'll post an article for you in a little bit. It will take me a bit to find.

It's not as popular as it was in the Attitude era, but if you REALLY want it to go back that way, I guess they could find 15 punch/kick guys, give them stupid gimmick and have an old woman give birth to a hand.

Made me laugh.

Who's generalizing now? You said that I don't know anything about wrestling because I'm a Cena fan?

It was sarcasm. Don't take it seriously.

So basically, because I have an open enough mind to be fans of KENTA, Bryan Danielson, Harley Race, Cena, HBK, Kurt Angle, Samoa Joe, AJ Styles, Sacred Little Mask, and Chris Hero that I don't know anything about wrestling?

Same, I have an open mind to be fans of Hogan, Austin, Rock, HBK, Edge, JBL, Jeff Hardy, Kurt Angle, Sting, Cage, Styles, Flair, MVP, Kennedy and a hell of alot more.

I'm not familiar with the indy stuff like you are.

Let me get one thing straight, you don't seem to like WWE fans, and you call ROH fans "bitter ECW fans" what promotion DO you like? TNA?

Honestly, None of them. All wrestling at the moment is garbage too me. It's just not my type of entertainment. I'm not too familiar with ROH, but it looks like a spotfest in a bingo hall and they don't appeal to me. I'm a WWE guy, but the product just isn't very good right now.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

By ROH I mean a more wrestling focused ideal.

Also, YES, he wants YOU to boo him, not the kids, but you, the smart mark, why? Because it makes the kids cheer louder, then you boo louder, then they cheer louder, if you honestly think that the WWE and Cena expect to get 16-30 year olds to cheer him then you're on drugs. Think outside the box, there is no more classic and split heel/face, he's a mix, the first of his kind (to the extent that he is at anyways).

Yes, the gimmick match, gimmick matches can be great too, a match doesn't have to be a technical match, ESPECIALLY not in the WWE. I remember I went to Judgment Day '07, people said that Punk vs Burke was MOTN, I LOLed, the truest way to judge a wrestler or a match is how over it is. Your star scales don't mean shit, sorry, because the point of wrestling, the whole stinkin' point is to get a reaction. During Punk vs Burke, people were taking piss breaks, during Cena vs Khali, people were going nuts, did I like Cena vs Khali more than Punk vs Burke, fuck no, I loved Punk vs Burke and was my MOTN, but that's not the goal, the goal is to get a reaction, so, by WWE standards, Cena vs Khali was better.


People fail to realize that what matters is fan reaction, merchandise sales, etc., especially in WWE and that your minority opinion doesn't matter.


From what I've gathered is that you think he is stale, well who's fault is that? It's the BOOKING. He's doing a great job, he's getting fantastic reactions and selling a shitton of merch and making millions, why would he say "no, some smart marks (who are making his reactions amazingly dynamic) don't like me, so I want to change it up"

Think about it, you have a guy who is getting the best, most dynamic reactions, turning anyone he wrestles into a big deal, selling merch, and not injuring people, why would you change that?

 

[xAsianRejectx]

Point blank, most people don't like Cena because of his gimmick. He's known as Superman Cena that has no kryptonite. A lot of people hate seeing the same old thing over and over again. Cena beating the odds and retaining the belt is just boring. There are a lot of other wrestlers that deserve the title too. But when it comes down to it, when it comes to getting a crowd reaction, good or bad, Cena delivers.

Also, I think the WWE is trying to make him into another Rock or Austin. I'm sorry, but there can only be one Great one and one Texas Rattlesnake. Cena may be the Champ, but can't be the People's Champ. I'm not a Cena Basher nor a Cena supporter. I just think the WWE should focus on pushing other great wrestlers. Maybe they should take Cena away from the title picture for awhile and then maybe people will loosen up to Cena. Right now I'm just hoping Cena won't get another 2-3 year title reign.

 

[mr zbow]

Cena doesnt deserve to be wwe champ for at least a year. He already had a long as reign as 'superman cena' and i think it just got boring. edge, HBK, Orton, Khali and Umaga are just some of the people that he beat. I like him and i was cheering for him when he was against Khali, umaga and orton but i was still boerd to death because he just wouldnt go down. WWE are trying to make him immortal like Hogan was in his 3 yr reign or whatever it was. But Hogan was different and more loved by the fans than cena. Hogan carried the company by himself. Cena helped Taker, Lashley, Batista etc carry the company.

Another thing that really gave me the shits was that cena won the rumble. It was such a good match with batista, HHH and all of them until he came in. I just felt so bored like 'Oh great hear come "superman" cena, way to ruin the royal rumble WWE".

Someone like Jeff Hardy who has been busting his ass for wwe since 1998 (although he did take a 3 year break) taking 30 foot drops through tables and off ladders and who has never been fully rewarded for that deserves a title reign. Not John Cena who has only been with WWE for 5-6 years, has never taken a 30 foot drop and has already had 3 title reigns, won an elimination chamber and a RR match. Cena has already been rewarded for nothing with all of those career highlights. why not for once, reward someone who actually deserves it.

 

[Papa Shango]

I am really tired of hearing "There are loads of other people more deserving to hold the belt." The fact of the matter is, there isn't. The belt is about the top of the industry, which means only the guys who generate interest, and of course, revenue, get the title. It's about caring who the champ is, love him or hate him. And you can tell who the fans care about by the reaction they get. And I know exactly, right off the top of my head, which guys have what is needed to hold the title and can hold it right now. Let's take a look.

For a laugh, we'll start with Shelton Benjamin. People are always singin' the praises of Shelton Benjamin, how he should be pushed. True, he has natural talent. He could raise the prestige of the title. EXCEPT for the fact that noone gives a shit about him.

HHH. 11 World Title reigns. Gets one of the biggest pops every night, as both face and heel. Proven bankabilty. (1 legitimate title holder)

Shawn Michaels. Undoubtedly one of the best of all time. Lock for the WWE HOF. Gets a huge reaction, selld merch, always brings his best. However, HBK does not want the title because he knows he's past his prime and wants none of the stress that comes with being the Champ. Besides, he knows that he's one of the rare instances where a wrestler's legacy transcends title reigns.

Randy Orton. Top heel on RAW. Has the look, the heel heat, and his family legacy practically ensures added prestige to the belt while he holds it. (2 legitimate title holders)

Chris Jericho. Well known outside of the ring as well as inside it. Had one of the biggest, most hyped comebacks of all time. Gets the crowd fired up. Tons of accolades, one of the most impressive resumes in the history of the biz. However, His only World title reign was a huge disappointment, and throughout his career he has lost to other title contenders HHH, Orton, Cena, and HBK.

Umaga. Gets a big heel reaction from the crowd. And his gimmick is reminiscint of legendary wrestlers such as The Wild Samoans and Yokozuno. But he, like Y2J, has jobbed to way too many of the other top stars to have a believable title run.

JBL. Plays the despicable heel very well. Has huge heat with the crowd right now. His gimmick reeks of prestige and respectablity. But he's in the middle of a fued with Y2J right now, and if the guy you're fueding with isn't in the title hunt that pretty much means that you're not title hunt either.

Mr. Kennedy. Gets decent reaction, but nothing special. A unique gimmick that could bring prestige to the belt, given his victories over many past champions. I'm on the fence. The outcome of his fued with HBK and Ric Flair will determine the direction of his career for at least the next 6 months. But for now, he doesn't cut it.

Jeff Hardy is hotter than he's ever been. Seemingly the entire crowd roots for him, the pop is insane. WWE.com is touting him as the favorite to win the EC. His "I'm not finished yet" storyline is just what he needs to keep his WWE Championship aspirations believable to the crowd. If WWE were to ever give Jeff the title, now would be the best time to do it. (3 legit title holders)

John Cena. The guy who sells the most merch. The guy who has beaten almost everyone. A 3-time champion, whose last reign is considered by many to be historic. The whole crowd lets thier opinion of him be known. Love or hate, every single damn person watching cares about the outcome of John Cena's matches. Has beaten everyone else on this list in title matches, with the exception of Mr. Kennedy and Jeff Hardy, who to my knowledge have never faced Cena with the WWE title on the line. To be the man, you gotta beat the man. Cena is the man, which means he is the most prestigous man in WWE today. And that also means that WHEN someone does beat John Cena for the Title, not only does the prestige of the championship stay intact, but the prestige of the wrestler's legacy increases. Fact of the matter is, you beat Cena, you're gonna be a legit contender. (4 legit title holders)

So there it is. Four men worthy of holding the WWE Championship right now. Randy Orton, HHH, John Cena, and Jeff Hardy. But the fact of the matter is, only one man can hold the title at a time. Right now, it's Randy Orton. It appears as if pretty soon it's gonna be either Cena or HHH. It looks like Hardy's time, if it does come, will come a little farther down the line. People complain about Cena hogging the title. But what is he supposed to do whrn there's hardly anybody good enough to take the title? HHH was injured during most of Cena's last reign. Orton had to work his way back up after an attitude adjustment and a good storyline leading up to his shot at Cena. Hardy didn't start to prove himself until after Cena was injured. Y2J and JBL weren't in-ring competitors during Cena's last reign. Yes, there recently has been an influx of main event caliber wrestlers, so yes, maybe it is time for Cena to spread the Title around. But not until it is proven that they have what it takes to maintain the prestige of the title. During Cena's last reign, there was nooone else who could do for the WWE Championship what Cena does for it, and that's make people care about it.

 

[TheGame11218]

The only problem that I have with John Cena is the fact that he has one of the most limited move sets in all of wrestling. If you take a look back at Hogan's day, there wasn't much expected in terms of dates worked and the type of match expected by the fans. Today however, the average fan is accustomed to a much more fast paced and scientific showdown where a simple leg drop wont end the match. I respect John Cena for his work ethic, his never-ending, natural supply of charisma, and his decent mike skills, but cannot get behind a person who, with their limited ability to tell a simple story in the ring, can be the bearer of the company and champion for over a year. When Cena went down with his torn pec, I was looking forward to a good 6 months at least without having to endure watching somebody be put over others who work just as hard, are more talented and more deserving (e.g. Jeff Hardy, Randy Orton, Umaga). When Cena showed up at the Royal Rumble I was hoping that it was a one time only thing.......but then the unthinkable happened and he won. Now John Cena, the man who has been out of action for several months, has already been pushed right back into the WWE title picture and not only is he getting a WWE title shot stemming from his win at the Rumble, but he is receiving it a month early just so the powers that be have a stong face going into the biggest pay-per-view of the year. Which brings me to my next problem.........

The WWE writers, bookers, and yes even Vince McMahon himself.......

The amount of talent being used poorly grows more and more every few months. The WWE needs to stop building up people to a certain point just for them to hit the "glass ceiling" of WWE. Thats how you upset talent and force them to go somewhere else (e.g. Rob Van Dam, Christian). If Vince McMahon and WWE want to do something good for business, they need to start building stars within the company instead of trying to sign all of the talent that TNA lets go of. If the more unused talent is built up, it creates more stars that are happier with the company and who will remain loyal to the company (e.g. The Undertaker) because they feel that they are being treated in a good manner. However, if you take somebody who has alredy made somewhat of a name for themselves in a different promotion and now you bring them in and they dont like it, they wont hesitate to leave when their contract expires.

Not really much more to say on this topic.......but if you agree with me, read some of my other posts on different topics and you'll realize I know what I'm talking about.........Thanks for listening!!!!!!

 

[deadpool]

I just think its bull that he had to come back at rr and win it.i bought the ppv feelin good but when it was done i wish i hadnt.it shocked me i wouldnt have guessed cena would come back.thanks for nothin vince.one thing is for sure cena will be at wm.i dont want to see him there but he will be.

 

[Slyfox696]

The only problem that I have with John Cena is the fact that he has one of the most limited move sets in all of wrestling.

Not really.

If you take a look back at Hogan's day, there wasn't much expected in terms of dates worked and the type of match expected by the fans.

Wrong. Wrestling actually worked MORE dates than they do now, and the crowds back then were every bit as interested in seeing a good match as they are now.

Today however, the average fan is accustomed to a much more fast paced and scientific showdown where a simple leg drop wont end the match.

Agreed. Which is one of the reasons why wrestling suffers so.

I respect John Cena for his work ethic, his never-ending, natural supply of charisma, and his decent mike skills, but cannot get behind a person who, with their limited ability to tell a simple story in the ring, can be the bearer of the company and champion for over a year.

Limited ability to tell a story in the ring? What are you basing this off of? Limited ability is a guy like RVD, who gets little in the way of crowd reaction without using his high spots. Limited is a guy like Charlie Haas, who gets no crowd reaction. Cena is one of the best storytellers in the business today.

Now John Cena, the man who has been out of action for several months, has already been pushed right back into the WWE title picture and not only is he getting a WWE title shot stemming from his win at the Rumble, but he is receiving it a month early just so the powers that be have a stong face going into the biggest pay-per-view of the year.

Which is a great business strategy. Why wouldn't you want your biggest draw headlining your biggest show?

The WWE writers, bookers, and yes even Vince McMahon himself.......

The amount of talent being used poorly grows more and more every few months.

False. People have been saying that for years. Fans just don't understand how long it takes to push talent to be respectable. Fans seem to think that anyone can get the Brock Lesnar/Goldberg push and immediately be over. It just doesn't work that way.

The WWE needs to stop building up people to a certain point just for them to hit the "glass ceiling" of WWE. Thats how you upset talent and force them to go somewhere else (e.g. Rob Van Dam, Christian).

There's not glass ceiling, just varying degrees of ability.

If Vince McMahon and WWE want to do something good for business, they need to start building stars within the company instead of trying to sign all of the talent that TNA lets go of.

Who has the WWE signed and thrusted into WWE storylines, other than Jeff Hardy, who was a WWE development to begin with?

Not really much more to say on this topic.......but if you agree with me, read some of my other posts on different topics and you'll realize I know what I'm talking about.........Thanks for listening!!!!!!

Meh, I haven't been impressed with your knowledge of wrestling. You've called the WWE idiots, despite being the number one promotion, for putting their biggest draw in the main-event of the biggest show...you called Cena limited in storytelling ability, and said he had a limited moveset as if that has anything to do with pro wrestling. Then, you said that wrestlers work more today than 20 years ago, and that fans today somehow expect better wrestling than they did 20 years ago.

I wouldn't exactly call that you knowing what you're talking about.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

LMAO at whoever thought that WWE was trying to push all the TNA released guys, it's the other way around.

K, let's see who was on top in, say 2002, Taker, Angle, HHH, HBK, Stone Cold, the Rock, Brock Lesnar, Kane.

Now, let's look at today, Cena, Batista, HHH, HBK, Taker, Edge, Orton

Hmm, me thinks they're building stars, they're just not guys like Shelton Benjamin (and rightfully show, "great" matches don't mean shit in WWE, it's about the bottom line of money and crowd reaction).


Too many people confuse personal opinion with reality. It does not matter if you think that Shelton Benjamin is a better pro wrestler, by many standards, he is, it's just that he's not by WWE standards. WWE standards is selling. You sell merch, you sell tix, you sell you character by getting a loud reaction, THAT'S a great WWE wrestler, Cena is a great WWE wrestler, Shelton Benjamin is not. Shelton Benjamin is a great IWC fan fav style wrestler, many people prefer him, but, their opinion doesn't matter because they're a minority, if you have 50,000 people who will pay money to see one thing, and 1,000 people who will pay money to see another, who do you listen to?

 

[peterf]

Firstly i like to say John cena is my favourite wwe superstar because i started to watch the wwe properly in 2006 and since then he was my favourite, and since then i havent seen him do anything to boo him its ridicolus to say that you despise him cause he holds the title for to long and i didnt think for one second that it was boring, but i can gurantee you that in 5 years time the majority of the wwe fans will love john cena, and noone has mentioned about edge he holds the whc gets injured and then comes back and gets it again and noone has not said nothing isnt that boring then?

How can you say that he only has a few moves when so does lots of superstars that you john cena haters cheer for such as: Shawn michaels, chris jericho and to many to list.

Also all you cena haters if you hate him so much dont watch the WWE you dont have to watch him you know.

 

[DeDan89]

Does anyone remember the days of Saturday Night Main Event? Not the new glorified one either, the old school Main Event show. The days when the Repo man, The Undertaker (black and gray), Jake "The Snake" Roberts, The Rockers and many more, were pitted against the "indie" talent guys to basically put over the "well-known" wrestlers. Nowadays, Cena has those matches regardless of his opponent. To be honest, every superstar has the repetitive moveset. IT'S PRO WRESTLING. I like his style, its fresh and original. His microphone skills are still some of the greatest I've ever seen, with the occasional goofy catch phrase. All in all, he is an amazing "era" in our generation. My criticism is in the form of politics. Everyone should be aware of the political pull backstage. It is something that exists everywhere. From Mickey D's, to Vinny Mac. He is a talent that can not be lost but he is a character, who does not need fourteen title runs and a winning streak of cataclysmic proportions to strengthen his legendary status. It truly gets boring after a while, it's predictable, move-sets will always be predictable, matches and "angles" should always capture a crowd. Right now, Cena does not. Good for business, but there is a point when a cow runs out of milk. Let him be, I truly believe that the talent that is dwelling in the locker rooms, with a slight push could equal that status. If you can sell a one-legged kid, a midget, and a guy with a mental handi-cap, you can sell....Gregory helms, Matt Hardy, Jeff hardy, Mr. kennedy, Umaga, CM Punk, Elijah Burke, these guys on any given night can sell out an arena. When you avert your attention to the bread and butter you miss out on that dessert and right now both WWE and TNA are doing this with no remorse. Cena is the greatest example. Love the charisma, that he brings every night and truly admire his work ethic. Whether or not hes a kiss-up, I don't really care, because if anyone was in the position that he holds, your lips would be just as brown. It's clear that the "Honor and Glory" age is on it's deathbed but can you really have evolution without losing the good with the bad? You have the talent and the means of redefining a business again, Mr. McMahon....please don't rest it on one man simply for sales but for the continuation of the greatest sports entertainment spectrum out there today.

 

[Slyfox696]

Does anyone remember the days of Saturday Night Main Event? Not the new glorified one either, the old school Main Event show. The days when the Repo man, The Undertaker (black and gray), Jake "The Snake" Roberts, The Rockers and many more, were pitted against the "indie" talent guys to basically put over the "well-known" wrestlers.

"The old days"...I wouldn't exactly consider the Repo man and the Undertaker as part of the Old Days of Saturday Night Main Event.

Good for business, but there is a point when a cow runs out of milk.

Yes, but how long until he does, and if he's not out of milk, why would you not keep using him to draw money? I mean, imagine if McMahon had said that about Hogan in 1984? How much revenue would he have lost?

Let him be, I truly believe that the talent that is dwelling in the locker rooms, with a slight push could equal that status.

Why do people not realize that being such a draw is more than just a push?

If you can sell a one-legged kid,

He was fired.

a midget,

Less than a year as a big time player.

and a guy with a mental handi-cap,

He was fired too.


Not exactly a ringing endorsement for your next statement.

you can sell....Gregory helms,

No, you can't. He's too small and uncharismatic. It's possible to be one or the other, but not both.

Matt Hardy

It'd be worth a shot, but I think he'd flop.

Jeff hardy,

He's been pushed to the main-event already.

Mr. kennedy

I don't know if I've seen a bigger push of a talent that didn't deserve than what Kennedy has gotten.

Umaga

His character is not suited to be a big draw.

CM Punk,

Was just given a push to the ECW title, and ratings were down .3 from the rest of 2007, and .2 from Morrison's reign.

Elijah Burke

Still a piss poor indy style worker.

these guys on any given night can sell out an arena.

With the exception of the Hardys, they can't even get viewers to tune into their segments on TV, how are they going to sell out arenas

When you avert your attention to the bread and butter you miss out on that dessert and right now both WWE and TNA are doing this with no remorse. Cena is the greatest example. Love the charisma, that he brings every night and truly admire his work ethic. Whether or not hes a kiss-up, I don't really care, because if anyone was in the position that he holds, your lips would be just as brown. It's clear that the "Honor and Glory" age is on it's deathbed but can you really have evolution without losing the good with the bad? You have the talent and the means of redefining a business again, Mr. McMahon....please don't rest it on one man simply for sales but for the continuation of the greatest sports entertainment spectrum out there today.

While I understand what you are saying, what I think you need to understand is that ALL of the most profitable times in wrestling generally occur when the focus is on one mega-star, and others trying to catch him. Bruno in the 60s, Hogan in the 80s, Hogan and Austin in the 90s, And there really hasn't been a wrestler to define this decade in terms of drawing.

The times when wrestling was booming was when a single worker led the charge for a company. To deviate from that successful formula just doesn't make much sense to me.

 

[Rusty]

AS YOU ALL MAY KNOW JOHN CENA IS PROBBLY THE MOST FAN FAVORITE SUPERSTAR SINCE THE ROCKKK.. AND JUST LIKE THE ROCK THEY BOTH STARTED IN WRESTLING AND THEN STARED IN A MOVIE... SO WHOS NOT TO THINK JOHN CENA WONT PACK UP AND LEAVE THE WWE ONLY USING THEM TO HELP HIM MOVE UP AND THEN LEAVE ALL FANS SAYING WHATEVER HAPPENED TO JOHN CENA ?

First of all, why are you typing in capitals?
Umm I wouldnt say hes a fan favourite as he gets a fair share of boos from the anti-Cena marks(idiots).
John Cena has passion for this business.. probably more than any other superstars presently. Cena is apparently filming a new movie.. so he is starring in movies while wrestling for WWE. His work ethic is amazing but I dont think he will leave the fans like The Rock did.. Cena loves working for the WWE and is the top dog.. why would he want to leave when hes in such a great position as he is now?

 

[Steamboat Ricky]

I'm going to go ahead and call it right now...


Somewhere down the line, as long as they keep Cena at the top, and he stays healthy....Cena will pull a Hogan and become the Ultra-Heel. It would break kids' hearts. They would even cry.

I hope this isn't just an obvious statement, knowing that heel/face cycles happen often. Heck, Cena used to be a heel. But he obviously sucked at it. However, that was also before he headlined 3 Manias in a row and is set for number 4.

It's GOING to happen. Whether it be a few years down the road, or sometime sooner....they are going to do it. I would anticipate sooner rather than later, largely because Cena, with the exception of the kiddies, is slowly fading into the "who cares" zone.

 

[robwylde90]

WWE never take any risks at all anymore and won't dare to turn cena heel unless they absolutely have to. They dont want to take the chance that they might alienate a huge part of their fan base, I mean the kids and ladies watch RAW mainly for the uberface and worker that is john cena. If they change that then poof there go the temp fans that wwe need to keep, they just will not watch a cowardly heel cena. It just wouldnt work , at least in vinny macs mind.

 

[Steamboat Ricky]

WWE never take any risks at all anymore and won't dare to turn cena heel unless they absolutely have to. They dont want to take the chance that they might alienate a huge part of their fan base, I mean the kids and ladies watch RAW mainly for the uberface and worker that is john cena. If they change that then poof there go the temp fans that wwe need to keep, they just will not watch a cowardly heel cena. It just wouldnt work , at least in vinny macs mind.

WWE doesn't take risks anymore? Woah woah woah...I hope you aren't being serious. Let's list some recent WWE risks:

1) Jeff Hardy push.
2) Headlining Great Khali.
3) Incest angle.
4) Having the storyline of the season be revolved around a leprechaun(regardless of the Kennedy wellness violation).
5) Vicki Guererro-Edge angle.
6) Letting go of Angle.
7) Having Wrestlemania outdoors.
8) Ric Flair retirement angle.
9) Mayweather angle.
10) Chavo Guererro ECW champ.

Need more?

And it's not even a risk. You know how easy it is to turn a heel face again. Especially a guy like Cena. The best heels are the guys that people want to like (cough, Cena) but can't because they are heels.

 

[johncenalover23]

Like they said on the John Cena DVD john has a great work ethic and he presents the wwe to the media in alot of good ways. yeah the guy may only have a few moves but so does batista and edge and look where they are. Batista is NOT good on the mic at all and complains about him wanting his whc back which hes not going to get and edge cant ever win a match by himself so he has to use help from his "supposed" girl Vickie and the edgeheads. Cena doesnt need any ones help, he fights for what he wants by himself and he wins or loses fair and square. You can judge him all you want but he is the face of the WWE and there going to keep putting him in big feuds because he always makes people look good and gives it his all in every match. Whether he is champion here or now he will always be remebered for being very charasmatic and puttin the crowd on there feet in just about every match he does. That is what a true wwe superstar is and if you arent like that then you stay a mid-card wrestler and never get pushed. Last but not least John Cena will always be a champion because he never backs down or complains about who he has to face and goes out to every match giving it his all!

 

[robwylde90]

WWE doesn't take risks anymore? Woah woah woah...I hope you aren't being serious. Let's list some recent WWE risks:

1) Jeff Hardy push.
2) Headlining Great Khali.
3) Incest angle.
4) Having the storyline of the season be revolved around a leprechaun(regardless of the Kennedy wellness violation).
5) Vicki Guererro-Edge angle.
6) Letting go of Angle.
7) Having Wrestlemania outdoors.
8) Ric Flair retirement angle.
9) Mayweather angle.
10) Chavo Guererro ECW champ.

Need more?

And it's not even a risk. You know how easy it is to turn a heel face again. Especially a guy like Cena. The best heels are the guys that people want to like (cough, Cena) but can't because they are heels.

No I mean major risks that the fans might not respond too :

1)Pushing one of the most over faces in the company. How is this a risk?
2)Pushing a heel that everyone hates. Risk?
3)Il admit this is a pretty big risk cause people might not respond to it at all. Fair Point.
4)Theres a line between risks and utter stupidity.
5)Havent we had many backstabbing females who used to support a face turn on them storylines?
6)Angle didn't want to stay. Not exactly WWE's choice.
7) I thought we where talking storylines here? anyway theyv arranged a massive tarp to hang over the ring in case of rain.
8)Have we never had a retirement angle before?
9)Bringing in a celebrity for extra publicity. Its a tried and tested formula. Not exactly dangerous.
10)Remember that line I mentioned before?

Anyway My main point is that turning Cena heel would have massive implications for the WWE and that they arent willing to take THAT particualr risk in my opinion.

 

[darylwain]

lets face it cena is good on the mic,and thats as far as it goes.his ring skills are basic.and he just dosent execute his moves with agression.People say its not his fault which i agree with to an extent,its not his fault if they book him to win the rumble or to get the title off somebody cos lets face it who would say no to that.But as far as moves go there is no reason he cant come up with new moves or even a more spitefull finisher to switch up his stale routine

 

[pg04]

Same old Triple threat BS? That's actually only happened twice in the history of Wrestlemania that one of the World Titles was decided in a Triple threat Match. Couldn't we say that Edge vs. Undertaker is the same old Single Match BS we see at each WM?

IMO, there will be a more interesting dynamic having all 3 of them in the match:

Orton: The ultra evil heel and reigning champion. Has had feuds with both men.
Cena: The Ultra Babyface that all the kids and women love. The one that the IWC hates.
HHH: The edgy face that you feel could turn heel at any moment. The one that all the IWC wants to win so that Cena doesn't win the title again and incense them all.

I'll be there, and I'm sure the atmosphere will be great.

 

[robwylde90]

Same old Triple threat BS? That's actually only happened twice in the history of Wrestlemania that one of the World Titles was decided in a Triple threat Match. Couldn't we say that Edge vs. Undertaker is the same old Single Match BS we see at each WM?

IMO, there will be a more interesting dynamic having all 3 of them in the match:

Orton: The ultra evil heel and reigning champion. Has had feuds with both men.
Cena: The Ultra Babyface that all the kids and women love. The one that the IWC hates.
HHH: The edgy face that you feel could turn heel at any moment. The one that all the IWC wants to win so that Cena doesn't win the title again and incense them all.

I'll be there, and I'm sure the atmosphere will be great.

The one that the whole IWC wants to win? Your kidding right? Theres a hell of a lot of Trips haters out there bud . Like me. ORTON should win the match , with trips turning heel and helping him. Not a 12th title reign for a washed up meglomaniac.

 

[FoleyIsGod]

Just read a little story on the homepage about Cena blasting the Rock.

Sorry, but Cena isnt fit to lace The Rocks boots. Rock is a better wrestler, better on the mic, better actor and even a better and bigger draw than the robotic and predictable Cena.

 

[Uncle Sam]

That must have been misquoted. And grossly so. I can't imagine the company's top star attacking the company's former top star in an English news paper. It just doesn't make any sense to me. Either that, or it's been taken completely out of context. If it is genuine, properly genuine, Cena's a complete moron, and not as intelligent as I would have given him credit for before this. Hopefully this won't turn into another Rock thread.

 

[TMEWoody]

I meet John a few years ago in a pub in Dublin (Ireland) after a house show. He is one of the nicest guys I have ever met. He took the time out to sit down with me and my girlfriend and he chatted to us for over an hour, bought us a drink and took some pictures with is.