WWE TLC 2012 General Discussion & Review

[Jack-Hammer]

Over the course of the pretty damn lousy AJ/Cena scandal, Ziggler has been tossed into the mix. This past Monday on Raw, things got physical resulting in a couple of altercations between the two. Ziggler ultimately gets the best of Cena during a locker room brawl after he pulls AJ off of him.

So the stage is pretty much set for a match between these two for the TLC ppv. Now since Cena is involved, this match will certainly garner a lot of attention in the coming weeks. While there's always a possibility of WWE doing something ridiculous, like maybe doing some sort of mixed tag at the ppv with Cena & AJ taking on Vickie & Ziggler, I don't see that happening. We might get something like that on the go home show to TLC but I don't see a mixed tag match being anything remotely resembling a draw for the ppv, even with Cena in the mix.

Ziggler has a lot of momentum right now. He's had a good week and I'm hoping that WWE keeps it going rather than going backward. I'm expecting WWE to book these two in a tables match for the ppv. Cena's "injury" has all the markings of WWE building up protection for Cena for not coming out with a win against Ziggler. A tables match also gives Cena another way out as Cena is somebody that's got a lousy history with them. With AJ in the mix, she could also be used as an accidental distraction that causes Cena to be put through the table. Or, WWE could wind up having Cena beat Ziggler and put him through a table.

Sheamus vs. Show already has the Chairs stipulation and I expect the full blown TLC match to be between Punk & Ryback for the WWE Championship. They could possibly just keep this match as a standard one on one match to use the Tables stipulation for something else, maybe for a tag title match. At any rate, I think this match will go down and I see no downside to Ziggler getting the win. Ziggler is the one who needs it as there's practically no way to tarnish Cena's stock at this point.

 

[Sexcellence of Sexecution]

Like you said, it's going be Sheamus/Big Show in a Chairs Match, but I think the Ryback/Punk match could possibly be a Tables Match, and due to the build-up of Ryback getting put through the announce table at Survivor Series and again on RAW it would make a lot of sense. Of course, this doesn't mean WWE will go with it, but it would fit the story.

In terms of the Ziggler/Cena match, I'm not really sure which gimmick, if any, they'll give it, as the storyline hasn't really led to one. The only think I could think of would be a TLC or Ladder Match with AJs contract in the balance or something to that effect. I could also see the Tag-Titles being defended in a triple threat TLC/Ladder Match with Hell No vs. Mysterio & Sin Cara vs. the Prime Time Players.

As far as the prospect of Cena/AJ vs. Ziggler/Vickie goes, I'd like to think they'd build up a physical confrontation between Vickie and AJ more than this. The whole "scandal" angle has been horrible and made no sense but in spite of this Vickie has an unbelievable amount of heat and the crowd really wants to see AJ kick her ass. Obviously, the whole "no contact rule" is preventing her from doing this, which helps to build it up even more. This is a classic long-term build strategy and I don't think it's time to blow it off yet. it would make more sense for AJ to have to deal with Vickie's "enforcer" Tamina first, before finally getting her hands on Vickie.

 

[Mitch Henessey]

I could see this match happening at TLC, but at the same time, the intergender tag team match idea wouldn't surprise me. At this point, nothing about that disastrous and unbearable storyline would shock me, nothing.

Anyway, I hope that doesn't happen, because Ziggler is riding a nice wave of momentum right now. Their locker brawl last week on Raw was pretty fun to watch. Dolph looked good after slamming Cena through the bathroom stall and hammering the injured knee. WWE tried to spark this same type of momentum with the Jericho/Ziggler feud a few months ago, but they horribly botched any attempt to give Dolph a boost (i.e. having Jericho win the match at Summerslam, and then having Dolph beat him in the MITB briefcase VS career match the very next night).

Cena is the right guy for a rub, and unless your name is R-Truth, Cena is more than capable of elevating any heel. So yeah, I would love to a see a tables match at TLC, but I have this horrible feeling about WWE right now. They might find some way to screw this up.

 

[FlexAmerican Dynamite]

I actually think Punk/Ryback will be a standard Tables match. The way things went at SS and the RAW after that they put a lot of emphasis on Ryback being put through announce tables. I think the way Cena/Ziggler will happen is Ziggler goes on and on about how he's Mr. MITB and how Cena failed to cash in his, Cena challenges him to either a ladder match or a full blown TLC match for the briefcase. Either way I think Ziggler needs to walk out with the win. Clean or dirty it doesn't matter but as Jack Hammer put it Ziggler has had a great week since Survivor Series and they should continue his momentum not kill it. Ziggler has pretty much lost all his one on one PPV encounters since winning MITB. Maybe things will change come TLC.

 

[Jerichoholic8894]

Not sure if this has been suggested, but what is they throw Cena losing his MITB shot into the story? Have a Ladder match for the MITB that Ziggler wins. I hope they wouldn't do that, but I wouldn't be surprised:
Ziggler-"Not only being humiliated, you lost your MITB shot unlike me"
Cena-"At least i've tried to cash in, put your money where your mouth is"

Ultimately, I suspect a street fight stipulation just to let the feud blow over.

 

[Kodo Sawaki]

I(same as the OP) expect Punk/Ryback to be full TLC and this match to be Tables match. Make sense in some way...

Ziggler has good momentum and this feud with Cena will give him a chance to show to WWE that he is not just some midcarder and that he is ready for big things as they are expecting. I dont belive that the briefcase will be involved, it's just goba ve standard Tables match with involvement of Vickie in one and AJ in the other side. I don't think it's necessery for this to be briefcase involved...

I could see Ziggler win in this one. He needs it more then Cena but you never know with Cena because he too has not won some PPV match in quite some time and this could be one of his rubs for the road to Wrestlemania. I could even see Dolph cashing in his briefcase before or after the match( depends wheather Show- Sheamus match happens before or after his match), and I expect for this to be very good and interesting match.

 

[WhatCripplesTheLegend?]

Ziggler for the win would be an excellent method to polish the future main event star. "Super Cena" maybe annoying and trite, but to beat him cleanly is a great catapult for up and coming talent.

I would love to see Ziggler beat Cena, go on to win the Rumble and lose at Wrestlemania...only to cash in his briefcase immediately therein after and win the title.

 

[XXJJ]

I think its got to be a mixed tag match or something. Cena/AJ vs Dolph/Tamina with Vickie in their corner. Their really was no reason to go through all this Cena/Vickie/AJ nonsense just to have a singles match between Cena and Ziggler at TLC. They could of just came up with something involving only Ziggler and Cena if that was the case.

 

[JJ15776]

Clearly Ryback/Punk is going to be a tables match, with Ryback getting put through three tables on Survivor Series and on Raw the next night.

Cena/Ziggler makes the most sense for a TLC/Ladder match...but what are they going to hang? Ziggler's MITB contract? Ziggler's MITB contract would make sense, if only it could be cashed in on Punk. It'd be believable that Cena could win, since he could get another shot at Punk, but why would Cena even want to go after Big Show's title? You'd think their match will have some stipulation regarding the AJ thing, but that doesn't really lend itself to a TLC/Ladder match. What are they going to do, hang Cena's unedited voicemail tapes? A contract to be the permanent GM, on behalf of AJ And Vickie?

Unless they're going to hang the briefcase and then Ziggler wins, which I guess could work, but it'd be a bit predictable.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

This match was announced as the main event for the TLC ppv. Ryback demanded Punk at the ppv and demaded that it be a tables, ladders & chairs match for the WWE Championship. Vickie Guerrero granted the request.

I've no doubt that Punk will retain, probably due to some interference I see happening on behalf of The Shield. The storyline will probably involve them seeing Punk as being a victim of "injustice" in the eyes of the group since he's already defeated Ryback twice. This sort of match also gives Ryback the chance to continue to look like a beast while giving CM Punk a means of evening things up in an anything goes environment. As we've seen lately, WWE is moving Ryback away from the guy that simply can't be hurt or stopped no matter what as part of his development as a character. So I expect Punk will get in far more offense in this match in general then we saw against Ryback at HIAC.

It wouldn't surprise me if The Rock suddenly popped up after this match ends and delivers the Rock Bottom. But, they'll probably wait until Raw the next night to do that as it'll be in front of a much larger audience.

 

[hatehabsforever]

I have a slightly different spin on the Ryback/CM Punk match at TLC. I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that Punk retains the title over Ryback at this secondary PPV, maintaining control of the WWE Championship until he relinquishes it against the Rock at the Royal Rumble. And I equally am certain that there will be involvement of The Shield in this encounter.

However, I'm not totally convinced that these guys are affiliated with Punk or even Heyman. I think they may have their own agenda, as they alluded to this week on RAW, and it just so happens that Punk has been the beneficiary of their actions on a few occasions now.

How about if Ryback is in the process of giving Punk a solid beat down, when right on cue, Ambrose, Rollins, and Reigns appear. They jump Ryback and decimate him again, causing Ryback to win the match by DQ, but of course he doesn't win the belt because of this. And just as the fans are beginning to whine and complain that this is getting redundant, they jump Punk and assault him too, leaving both guys laid out in the ring. This could involve another guy(s) from NXT jumping into the fray, or it could still be the same three.

The end result? Ryback gets the win but doesn't win the title, and still looks strong in the process, dominating Punk again until three (or more) guys take him down. Punk retains the WWE Championship, keeping it warm until the return of the Rock in late January. And the collective fan base, whether it be in attendance, via PPV, or the IWC, are left with a collective WTF is going on?

 

[Mustang Sally]

The end result? Ryback gets the win but doesn't win the title, and still looks strong in the process, dominating Punk again until three (or more) guys take him down.

That's likely the way it will turn out, but they'd better not go to the well too often with that scenario. Most folks don't expect Ryback to win the title this early in his WWE career; it seems the only reason he's in the title picture was the Cena injury that occurred before a PPV match with Punk. Now, the company has made a program revolving around Ryback's chase for the belt.....and it will interesting to see what happens to him after it's over.

But the attacks from this new group are reminiscent of Nexus, 3MB and other mini-factions put together for a short time to interfere with someone or something. I say, let Punk legitimately defeat Ryback.....or let Ryback win the title for a brief time. If they do the latter, get the belt back around Punk's waist in time for the Rock.

The world won't come to an end if Ryback pulls the upset.

 

[sanefan_har]

I have a slightly different spin on the Ryback/CM Punk match at TLC.
How about if Ryback is in the process of giving Punk a solid beat down, when right on cue, Ambrose, Rollins, and Reigns appear. They jump Ryback and decimate him again, causing Ryback to win the match by DQ, but of course he doesn't win the belt because of this.

You say that Ryback can win by DQ in a TLC match? What kind of wrestling have you been watching? Yes, Vince can be crazy but he can't be that stupid!

Regarding the OP however, its no surprise that Punk will retain. However what intrigues me is whether Brad Maddox will get involved somehow in this mix-up or whether Brock Lesnar comes back. The aftermath of this match will revolve around the highly probable interference rather than the final outcome i.e CM Punk retaining, thereby taking the focus away from him for the umpteenth time.

 

[TheBadGuy92]

causing Ryback to win the match by DQ

You're not allowed to post anymore..

But Im personally getting sick of Ryback being built up as this unstoppable force who gets screwed to protect his image just because they dont wanna put the main strap on him yet.. Just send him to Smackdown and let him run with the World Heavyweight Title!

 

[hatehabsforever]

You say that Ryback can win by DQ in a TLC match? What kind of wrestling have you been watching? Yes, Vince can be crazy but he can't be that stupid!

If I were to guess, I would imagine I have pretty much been watching the same wrestling that you have, possibly for a little longer. And you may be correct, except for the fact that you aren't.

Typically, TLC matches don't end in DQ. No earth shattering revelation there. However, it's not like WWE hasn't done things unconventionally or in a seemingly illogical manner in the past. Just because it has not happened before, doesn't mean it cannot happen. I stand to be corrected, but I'm unaware of any rule which states that a TLC match cannot end in a DQ.

Punk could be beating Ryback within an inch of his life with every table, ladder, or chair in sight, and there'll be no disqualification, or vice versa. However, blatant interference from an outside invading force, I'm not so sure that this couldn't fall within the confines of a DQ. Especially when in the referee's opinion (as well as likely most of the fans watching), they are interfering to benefit Punk and adversely affect Ryback. The ref could call it. Vickie Guerrero could come out and be involved. I'm not convinced that three or more guys can necessarily come to the ring and definitively affect the outcome of the match, and get away with it simply because its a TLC match. I do stand to be corrected on this point though.

Plus, that's not even the point. In your haste to use mastery of the smilies, you overlooked my basic point. The point is that they beat down Ryback, but then turn their efforts to Punk, shocking everyone in the process. Even if you are right (which you aren't), it could still be the same bottom line. They cost Ryback the title, they keep it around Punk's waist, and progress their storyline in the process. If you prefer, after Punk has been beaten down by Ryback, the guys jump Ryback and destroy him. A near dead Punk crawls over to pin Ryback, does that make you happier? Then, rather than celebrating with Punk as people would think, they jump him too. Same end result.

I appreciate the feedback though. At least you've got more than four posts.

 

[the voice of reason]

If you prefer, after Punk has been beaten down by Ryback, the guys jump Ryback and destroy him. A near dead Punk crawls over to pin Ryback, does that make you happier?

It would not make anyone happy, because it cannot happen. Correct me if I am wrong, but last I checked TLC matches are won by climbing a ladder and retrieving the belt, not by pinfall. So if you have been watching a long time, you must not have been paying much attention to what you watch. Punk will retain by some sort of interference by the Shield or Lesnar. Not by pinning Ryback or getting DQed.

 

[IHW]

Ryback has proven himself as a main event player, and he doesn't really need the title at this point in time. I have never been fully behind Ryback becoming WWE Champ. I was fully behind his push, and I think WWE have done a fine job at making Ryback continuously look like a machine. But, now what? Can they do it again? It doesn't look like Punk is losing his title anytime soon. Are we going to get another screw job finish, or will Punk beat the beast fair and square? I don't know which way they are going to go with this, but I am certainly enjoying the ride.

IHW's Prediction- Punk wins. He has too.

 

[sanefan_har]

If I were to guess, I would imagine I have pretty much been watching the same wrestling that you have, possibly for a little longer. And you may be correct, except for the fact that you aren't.

Typically, TLC matches don't end in DQ. No earth shattering revelation there. However, it's not like WWE hasn't done things unconventionally or in a seemingly illogical manner in the past. Just because it has not happened before, doesn't mean it cannot happen. I stand to be corrected, but I'm unaware of any rule which states that a TLC match cannot end in a DQ.

Punk could be beating Ryback within an inch of his life with every table, ladder, or chair in sight, and there'll be no disqualification, or vice versa. However, blatant interference from an outside invading force, I'm not so sure that this couldn't fall within the confines of a DQ. Especially when in the referee's opinion (as well as likely most of the fans watching), they are interfering to benefit Punk and adversely affect Ryback. The ref could call it. Vickie Guerrero could come out and be involved. I'm not convinced that three or more guys can necessarily come to the ring and definitively affect the outcome of the match, and get away with it simply because its a TLC match. I do stand to be corrected on this point though.

Plus, that's not even the point. In your haste to use mastery of the smilies, you overlooked my basic point. The point is that they beat down Ryback, but then turn their efforts to Punk, shocking everyone in the process. Even if you are right (which you aren't), it could still be the same bottom line. They cost Ryback the title, they keep it around Punk's waist, and progress their storyline in the process. If you prefer, after Punk has been beaten down by Ryback, the guys jump Ryback and destroy him. A near dead Punk crawls over to pin Ryback, does that make you happier? Then, rather than celebrating with Punk as people would think, they jump him too. Same end result.

I appreciate the feedback though. At least you've got more than four posts.

Come on, at a triple threat match an outside interference isn't considered a DQ, why in hell would that not apply to a TLC match?

And now you are all about Punk pinning Ryback? PINS in a TLC match?? Now you're just being ridiculous.

I am not against them attacking Punk. If anything that makes the angle all the more better. I clearly quoted the part where you mentioned the DQ because I wasn't against the rest of your post. I was just surprised that you would assume a scenario where a TLC match would end in a DQ. And yes TLC matches cannot end in DQ. Neither do they end in pins.

 

[Skairipa Matrix]

I would be shocked to see Ryback win the belt here. I think this will be a very entertaining match and a lot of tables being used. I see Ryback beating the hell out of Punk with tables,ladders, and chairs with Punk still fighting back some until The Shield come out and stop Ryback from climbing the ladder and pulling down the belt. After he's laid out if there not working for Punk (or Heyman for that matter) I think they turn their attention to Punk and attack him...or maybe they jump him after he retains.

I can't figure out if there working for Punk/Heyman or if they have their own agenda. Punk sold being scared of them well but what reason could he have to go back in the ring with the guy who scares him so much he dived over the guard rail to avoid other then "hey thanks for saving me twice in 24 hours" if he's not working with them?

 

[XXJJ]

WTF are they doing to Ryback! Its a shame that he is going to end up losing his first 3 big ppv matches. That hurts when you are building him as an unstoppable force. No wonder he is losing some steam.

The time for Ryback to win the title was at HIAC. Some internet reports said Rock wants to be the one that ends Punk's reign which is why Vince didn't have Ryback win. Thats too bad because they had a chance to create an instant main event star.

Punk will win. The Shield with end up handcuffing or tying Ryback up or something so Punk can climb the ladder and retain his title. Ryback probably beats the shit out of all of them after the match.

 

[HBsam31]

Punk retains here, and I am not so optimistic that we won't see the same exact thing we saw the last 2 ppvs. Punk isn't going to beat Ryback clean, and I don't think Punk loses the belt this close to Rumble. The Sheild comes down attacks Ryback due to the "injustice" of Punk having to face Ryback a third time allowing Punk to climb the ladder for the win. I don't see any creative spins for this match.

 

[Kodo Sawaki]

I fully expect for Punk to retain here. Now we know with almost 100% that Punk/Rock is about to happen at RR and this would be just preparations for that. That being said, I dont expect Rocky at TLC, but rather on RAW afterward...

"Shield" will interfere, Ryback will look like a monster and probably give us some "Superman" moments and Punk will eventually retain.

 

[Wolf Pac]

WTF are they doing to Ryback! Its a shame that he is going to end up losing his first 3 big ppv matches. That hurts when you are building him as an unstoppable force. No wonder he is losing some steam.

The time for Ryback to win the title was at HIAC. Some internet reports said Rock wants to be the one that ends Punk's reign which is why Vince didn't have Ryback win. Thats too bad because they had a chance to create an instant main event star.

Punk will win. The Shield with end up handcuffing or tying Ryback up or something so Punk can climb the ladder and retain his title. Ryback probably beats the shit out of all of them after the match.

This. I wasn't against Ryback losing at Hell in a Cell, the loss didn't hurt him imo, they still made him look unstoppable in the match, with the referee screwjob & after the match despite losing, and I figured Ryback would just move onto different feuds and continue being unstoppable against others, he really didn't need to keep the streak cause he was over anyway, but losing 3 of his biggest matches in a row really does make him lose some steam.

I doubt it will happen but if they wanna make Ryback look strong again, have him overcome the interference from The Shield and beat CM Punk at TLC and then go into the Royal Rumble as champ and defeat The Rock. Ryback vs. Rock would do more wonders than Punk vs. Rock. Punk holding the title for 1 year is impressive and him facing Rock at Royal Rumble would be good, but the WWE making their next star in Ryback by having him win the title and go on to defeat one of the biggest names ever is even more impressive and better. If they wanna do a Rock vs. Punk match, they can just save that for WM instead without the belt on the line, they don't need the belt for that match, and as for Cena he could just face Ryback for the title one on one. I don't think anybody would mind if we don't get that Rock/Cena rematch at WM.

 

[XXJJ]

This. I wasn't against Ryback losing at Hell in a Cell, the loss didn't hurt him imo, they still made him look unstoppable in the match, with the referee screwjob & after the match despite losing, and I figured Ryback would just move onto different feuds and continue being unstoppable against others, he really didn't need to keep the streak cause he was over anyway, but losing 3 of his biggest matches in a row really does make him lose some steam.

I doubt it will happen but if they wanna make Ryback look strong again, have him overcome the interference from The Shield and beat CM Punk at TLC and then go into the Royal Rumble as champ and defeat The Rock. Ryback vs. Rock would do more wonders than Punk vs. Rock. Punk holding the title for 1 year is impressive and him facing Rock at Royal Rumble would be good, but the WWE making their next star in Ryback by having him win the title and go on to defeat one of the biggest names ever is even more impressive and better. If they wanna do a Rock vs. Punk match, they can just save that for WM instead without the belt on the line, they don't need the belt for that match, and as for Cena he could just face Ryback for the title one on one. I don't think anybody would mind if we don't get that Rock/Cena rematch at WM.

Yeah, thats why they are having trouble making new stars. Punk's year long title reign is going to be ended by a part-time wrestler that might not show up ever again after WM. Ryback ending Punk's title reign could of been something like Batista beating HHH where it just launched Batista's career.

If they were so locked into Rock vs Punk at RR. They should of just went with the Team Foley vs Team Punk idea at SS. Ryback get his revenge on Punk and pins him. Punk still keeps the title. Then they could of done something with the Shield on Raw after SS to get Ryback out of the title picture.

Ryback getting 3 shots in a row to win the WWE title and not getting the job done hurts him.

 

[Fire Marshall Bill]

This match shouldn't happen. I'm hoping The Shield "injures" Ryback or something soon, or maybe even at TLC before the match. This is so stupid if they book Ryback to lose 3 matches in a row, even if none of them are clean. The morons didn't consider any of this when they booked the Rock at RR.