Winter is Coming - The Night is Dark and Full of Spoilers
- Thread starter ÐаÑбоÑа
- Start date
Well I said there was a lot of cringe in there. Especially when you look at how the story has actually gone.
Interesting use of language there for the early drafts, describing Dany as a bigger threat to Westeros. My hopes of her causing nothing but more carnage haven't been dented.
Interesting use of language there for the early drafts, describing Dany as a bigger threat to Westeros. My hopes of her causing nothing but more carnage haven't been dented.
I sometimes wish GRRM would have kept the scope narrower and avoid all the dumb ironborn stuff in book 5 and the upcoming book 6. They clearly weren't important in his original vision of how the story would end. And they still are clearly outsiders of the main plotlines at the end of Dance.
Just let them all drown and get on with Danny's invasion, Jon's conflict at the wall and Bran becoming a time travelling piece of wood already. Then again, we wouldn't have the Dorne plotline or Cersei's arc if GRRM kept it narrow and compact.
Just let them all drown and get on with Danny's invasion, Jon's conflict at the wall and Bran becoming a time travelling piece of wood already. Then again, we wouldn't have the Dorne plotline or Cersei's arc if GRRM kept it narrow and compact.
ÐаÑбоÑа
doesn't know REAL wrestling...
All this video reminds me of is how much I want Randyll Tarly to appear in the south...
"Stannis without the birthright"
"Stannis without the birthright"
Good Golly It's Ollie
Magical Girl
True but the Dorne characters tie in to the backstory more than the Ironborn do. I love Theon though; what a great character. Torn between blood and water. Excellent stuff. His actor in the TV version's great at showing that side of him too, and the writing develops it all much earlier on.
The Ironborn aside from Theon/Asha are bloody boooooring though aren't they?
Well Dorne characters do have ties with the Lannisters so that's a plus. I agree Theon is one of my favourite characters. Hated him for his betrayal, then pity him for the abuse, and found myself rooting for him at his attempt at redemption.
The Ironborn are not boring to me, just simply a repetition of the characters from King's Landing. Power struggle, religion, brutality of the elites. It is great for fleshing out the world of Westeros if you like that stuff but I don't think we needed entire books of it to deviate from the established plots.
ÐаÑбоÑа
doesn't know REAL wrestling...
"The Wars to Come" had some real hints that there will be significant changes/removals from the story of the books.
Not sure if everyone has viewed yet so I will do this...
Not sure if everyone has viewed yet so I will do this...
First off, while Varys joining Tyrion on the boat at the end of the last season could be explained as filling the gap of where Varys disappeared to for an extended period and the conversation merely replaced Illyrio with Varys, the suggestion that he is going to accompany Tyrion to Mereen is something new. Not only does it see Varys take a more active role but it could also hint at the possibility that Tyrion will not meet Young Griff... indeed, could Young Griff be removed altogether? I would not mind at all. The survival of Aegon was a completely unnecessary addition.
The other potentially big change was the burning of Mance Rayder. I say "potentially" because of the ploy to prevent him from being burned in the books, although the fact that Mance speaks to Stannis in a composed way suggests to me that this really did happen and Mance did go up in smoke. I would have mixed feelings if that was the case - happy that one of the biggest wastes in the books (so far) in the character of Mance Rayder will not be completely repeated but disappointed that something more could not have been done with him.
Unrelated, I liked the addition of Brienne missing Sansa, although where Sansa and Littlefinger were going had me somewhat intrigued. Harrenhal? If he still lord there? Or somewhere else to get them more linked to the story?
Next week, we head to Dorne for Doran Martell, the Sand Snakes and Areo Hotah. I wonder if they will play Doran as the "scared sick man" only to reveal that he is far more on the ball than even his children recognise.
The other potentially big change was the burning of Mance Rayder. I say "potentially" because of the ploy to prevent him from being burned in the books, although the fact that Mance speaks to Stannis in a composed way suggests to me that this really did happen and Mance did go up in smoke. I would have mixed feelings if that was the case - happy that one of the biggest wastes in the books (so far) in the character of Mance Rayder will not be completely repeated but disappointed that something more could not have been done with him.
Unrelated, I liked the addition of Brienne missing Sansa, although where Sansa and Littlefinger were going had me somewhat intrigued. Harrenhal? If he still lord there? Or somewhere else to get them more linked to the story?
Next week, we head to Dorne for Doran Martell, the Sand Snakes and Areo Hotah. I wonder if they will play Doran as the "scared sick man" only to reveal that he is far more on the ball than even his children recognise.
I've watched the leaked episodes because I couldn't resist the temptation. Let's just say they really deviate from the books from episode 2 onwards. The episodes get better after episode one which was pretty tame but it can be jarring to see the big differences from the books especially the parts where they dumb down the motivation of the characters.
Good Golly It's Ollie
Magical Girl
Барбоса;5183675 said:
Right, this is quite interesting. In the books (you guys are probably aware judging by your posts) I recall that Varys flat-out disappears until the end of Dance, I think it was, where
He assassinates Kevan, bastard, you killed one of the only cool Lannisters
This is obvs a way to keep the guy in the show as the character is popular but I don't mind.
And yeah the Young Griff thing is a bit hit-and-miss to me too, he screams "filler character" if he turns out to be a fake.
Alastor said:
Would you be able to give some details of how they've been changed, Al? I'd quite like to know what's different (I'm not sure if I will carry on watching past season 3 at this point)
ÐаÑбоÑа
doesn't know REAL wrestling...
Why the hell would you stop watching?
For one thing, it has been known for months Jamie is visiting Dorne instead of Riverrun. I'm quite excited to see some of the changes though. Parts of the later books were dire. For one thing, I feel that they made the Mareen plot much easier to watch than travelling in slave camps and pig riding. Also the lack of Greyjoys mean a chunk of Feast isn't adapted.
Also ep2-4 spoilers that I remember about the changes
They merged elements of Arianne with Elaria and Jeyne Poole with Sansa Stark. Brienne has met with both Stark sisters on the show who both reject her help. Loras is captured by the faith militant since apparently being gay is against the faith of the seven on the show. Ser Barristen appeared to have suffered mortal wounds in battle against the sons of the harpy. Though I am hopeful he isn't dead as they didn't show his throat getting cut. Bronn accompanying Jamie in his quest in Dorne was a nice change.
Good Golly It's Ollie
Magical Girl
Барбоса;5184197 said:
Eh, I was considering that I might not want to bother if I don't like the sound of how things have changed. I'm not as interested as I used to be but I'm still kinda following how they're handling the adaptation.
Now Alastor has shared some deets for me, I can say it doesn't sound like they're messing with characterisation particularly badly and I can't say I mind certain characters being turned into elements of pre-existing ones.
It was just a thought, not really a criticism of the show.
Mighty NorCal
SHALL WE BEGIN?
I both loved and fully regret embracing the big leak of 2015.
I enjoyed the shit out of a 4 episode block of viewing, but im upset that itll take a month for them to catch up to me now
I had a fucking suspiscion from day one that Varys was a underground Targaryen supporter.
I enjoyed the shit out of a 4 episode block of viewing, but im upset that itll take a month for them to catch up to me now
I had a fucking suspiscion from day one that Varys was a underground Targaryen supporter.
I enjoyed the shit out of a 4 episode block of viewing, but im upset that itll take a month for them to catch up to me now
Same here. I wish the season was leaked entirely like a Netflix series; it's so much more enjoyable watching in blocks than it is week-to-week. You don't notice the slow moments when you're binging through it.
Spoiler from episode 3...
Just want to say that Jon Snow beheading that asshole in episode 3 gave me hope that we might actually get a John Cena heel turn some day after all. The two characters are so alike that it's mind-blowing when you think about it. 
Also, I'm happy they're finally steering away from the books. You guys are great, but overall GoT has the worst fanbase in the history of fanbases and it's beautiful to see the precious book readers in the dark like everyone else for a change.
ÐаÑбоÑа
doesn't know REAL wrestling...
Its not just because of the fanbase that I am glad there are changes.
By A Feast For Crows, A Song of Ice and Fire had gotten to the point that it is too bloated to translate fully to even the small screen. Far too many characters, with too many of them doing too much or too little (my aforementioned Mance Rayder), too many plots of varying consequence to be untangled or were simply ignored, too many diversions, a timeline that was all over the place and was looking increasingly like it would never be made complete sense of - two books is not really enough to wind up all that has gone before it and have whatever mighty showdowns are planned in the fight for the Iron Throne and between Light and Dark.
The only potential 'change' I saw in the first episode that I did not like (of course the leaks could prove my fears unfounded) was the dialogue between Jaime and Cersei. By the time of Tywin's death, Jaime should be starting to turnover his new leaf and becoming increasingly tired with Cersei's machinations and complaining. Instead, he sounded too much like the haunty prick that he was before his chastening experiences in being defeated by Brienne, losing his hand and nearly dying because of it and then being humiliated by Ilyn Payne/Bronn in his retraining.
Jaime becomes one of my favourite characters after his disarming and then return to the field. I just hope the show does not do away with that character growth.
Good Golly It's Ollie
Magical Girl
Барбоса;5184957 said:
Agreed, it's good freaking writing when the writer somehow makes you stop thinking "you incestuous child-harming kent" and start thinking "you're too good for your sister; chuck her!"
Several "extraneous" characters have been done away with then. This is good. I mean I like world-building and fluff which is ultimately meaningless as it just makes the whole thing feel larger and you can lose yourself in it, but with Ice and Fire all this is supposed to be worked into the plot and you can tell it's got quite unwieldy for the author by this point. I sort of want it simpler now so that we can reach the damn ending and have everything tie up, nicely or otherwise.
Mighty NorCal
SHALL WE BEGIN?
Same here. I wish the season was leaked entirely like a Netflix series; it's so much more enjoyable watching in blocks than it is week-to-week. You don't notice the slow moments when you're binging through it.
Spoiler from episode 3...
Just want to say that Jon Snow beheading that asshole in episode 3 gave me hope that we might actually get a John Cena heel turn some day after all. The two characters are so alike that it's mind-blowing when you think about it.
Also, I'm happy they're finally steering away from the books. You guys are great, but overall GoT has the worst fanbase in the history of fanbases and it's beautiful to see the precious book readers in the dark like everyone else for a change.
Oh goodness, the fact that the snooty book readers got the tables turned on them has been one of the sweetest things to come along in a GREAT while, JMT, right with you.
DUUUUUUUUUUDEEEE.....I mean, I guess it was supposed to cause tension, but I knew he would do it. Fuck him , this dude JUST got elected Lord Commander and his FIRST decree you pull that shit? We make heads roll up here at CB, you fuck. He will never heel turn, but the HUGGGEEE dilemma with Stannis trying to pull him away to go trash the Boltons (which I am just fucking begging for) is the real development. How good was that scene with Milesandre and Snow in the elevator? hah. All in all, the scene with Queen Danyrs having to execute the one dude was way more tension filled. Huh....I wonder if putting them in such similar situations is forecasting...
Am I the only one scared we are getting back to the glacial pace since Tyrion is still not made it to Mereen yet?"
Also super pumped that Bronn is back. One of my favorite characters.
Am I the only one scared we are getting back to the glacial pace since Tyrion is still not made it to Mereen yet?"
Also super pumped that Bronn is back. One of my favorite characters.
Барбоса;5184957 said:
Book spoiler;
Really? Abel? Book Mance is a total boss, and I am gutted they'll be cutting him beating the ever loving piss out of Jon "I am a fucking dull bastard" Snowflake.
Feast as a book is fantastic, and Dance is pretty good since it focuses mainly on my favourites, but Feast is the eye of the storm of the series, where we realise that despite, say, Robb Stark originally being perceived as an avenging angel everything has calmed down and you can see that he has caused as much damage as anyone, its a sort of "all that violence you've been enjoying has consequences, and little teenage shits who go to war whatever the reasons ruin things for people, etc. Oh and rape, lots and lots of rape! King in da Norf! Right guys!?! Guys!?!" Plus you get to see what everybody else has been up to while the Storm has been going on... its challenging at points, though, I'll agree.
Thank fuck they didn't try to adapt it, ten episodes, we need that shit streamlined, tv watchers don't really want to think about all that.
Spoiler for leaked episode;
Personal fave, "I am going to mount Roose Bolton's head on a spike" even I don't know how this one turns out, legit shitting myself, I've always thought show Stannis, while straight up nastier, was more honest than his book counterpart who's head I am waiting to explode from all the cognitive dissonance going around in his brain, anyway, Westeros' (or mine anyway) favourite complete and utter cunt will come into his own this season.
Loved the nod after Janos lost his head, exactly how I imagined it.
Loved the nod after Janos lost his head, exactly how I imagined it.
ÐаÑбоÑа
doesn't know REAL wrestling...
For the boss that Mance is in the books, I still think not enough has been done with him.
Similar threads
