Why The Austin Comparisons?

[justinept]

I'm sure there will be some that hate the idea of a comparison thread - some will say that comparing a current superstar to a superstar of yesteryear only creates unrealistic, unattainable expectations. I'm not of that mindset. For me, comparisons provide historical context and offer up some really fun debate. And so I'll try my hand at that with this thread -

The McMahon family is running things again, hand-picking champions and holding down the most popular superstars on the roster. This clearly conjures up memories from the old Corporation days when Vince handpicked The Rock to be the Corporate Champion. That Triple H and Randy Orton are simply taking the place of Vince and The Rock is obvious, but who is Daniel Bryan supposed to be in this ongoing story arc?

Until now, all I've read is that Daniel Bryan is taking the Steve Austin role. This makes sense since Vince's stated goal was to keep the belt off Austin at all costs. As Triple H's stated goal is to keep the belt off Daniel Bryan at all costs, the comparison seems to work. But I'm going to offer a differing opinion: Daniel Bryan is playing the Mick Foley role.

Don't mistake that statement as me comparing Daniel Bryan's in-ring work or promo work with Mick Foley - instead, consider the similarities between their roles.

When The Rock became the newly-minted, hand-picked champion of the McMahon family, he did so by winning a controversial match against Mick Foley. Paying homage to the Survivor Series from a year prior, Vince McMahon demanded that the referee ring the bell immediately after The Rock put Foley in a sharpshooter. Similarly, Orton became the newly-minted, hand-picked champion of the McMahon family by defeating Daniel Bryan in controversial fashion - taking advantage of a Triple H pedigree.

Whereas the McMahon family didn't want Austin as a champion because of his foul language and beer-drinking ways, the McMahon family wanted to keep Foley away from the title because of the way he looked. Simply, Foley was a slob - an overweight, unshaven, slob who wrestled in dirty clothes that looked like they hadn't been washed in weeks. Similarly, the McMahon family wants to keep Bryan away from the title because of the way he looks. Simply, Bryan is a troll - a 5-foot-7 troll with long, matty hair and a beard that looks like it has small organisms living in it.

Foley played the perfect transitional foil for a corporate champion - the perfect superstar to keep Steve Austin from challenging The Rock for the title between Survivor Series and WrestleMania - because of his huge popularity. Now what sustained that popularity was his years of work - from the death matches in Japan to his wars with Terry Funk in ECW, the fans had serious respect for the journey Mick Foley traveled to get where he was, and they wanted to see him rewarded with the WWF Title. Coincidentally, what spawned his popularity in the WWF was a stupid one-off joke (Mr. Socko) that happened to catch fire.

Similarly, Bryan is equally over with the crowd right now. What's sustaining his popularity is his years of hard work - from wrestling in Japan to wrestling in half-filled gymnasiums across the country, people just want to see this guy rewarded with the WWE Title. And like Foley, what spawned his popularity in the WWE was also accidental as VKM's decision to let Sheamus go over Bryan in 18 seconds at WrestleMania 28 caused near riot among the fans at Raw the next night.

So the question is this - do you guys see Bryan more as Mick Foley - taking on the role of keeping Orton busy for a few months - or is he more of an Austin, the guy meant to eventually take down the new corporation? If you see him more as a Foley, who do you see eventually taking down Orton and Triple H?

 

[Poop Master Flex]

Bryan playing either the Austin role or Foley role makes sense, it all depends on how you look at it I guess. I would rather not compare Bryan to either guy (honestly why does it matter and who gives a fuck?) but if I had to choose I would go with Austin.

Austin and Bryan are both top faces, they are both anti-establishment, they are both guys who the company doesn't want to be champion and they are both connecting with the crowd in a big way. Foley could fit in that as well but Foley was never the top babyface and was alway #2 behind Austin. That's where the biggest and most obvious difference in lies. Austin and Bryan are #1 whereas Foley was never #1.

Foley's look was never that of a champion (like Bryan), the company didn't want him to be champ (like Bryan) and Foley also got noticed and mentioned his life in the indys (like Bryan) but once again Foley was never #1 and was never designed to be the top face. Bryan is #1, Bryan is being groomed for that top baby face spot and for that reason alone he's more like Austin.

The way I see it though is you can compare a lot of things. At the end of the day all 3 have different characters from each other (although all 3 were often in similar situations story line wise), they all have different styles altogether and most of all they all got over in very different ways. Bryan can be compared to Austin and Foley but at the same time he's very different from Austin and Foley as well. Instead of comparing Daniel Bryan to Austin or Foley just compare him to nobody.

 

[d_henderson1810]

Bryan playing either the Austin role or Foley role makes sense, it all depends on how you look at it I guess. I would rather not compare Bryan to either guy (honestly why does it matter and who gives a fuck?) but if I had to choose I would go with Austin.

Austin and Bryan are both top faces, they are both anti-establishment, they are both guys who the company doesn't want to be champion and they are both connecting with the crowd in a big way. Foley could fit in that as well but Foley was never the top babyface and was alway #2 behind Austin. That's where the biggest and most obvious difference in lies. Austin and Bryan are #1 whereas Foley was never #1.

Foley's look was never that of a champion (like Bryan), the company didn't want him to be champ (like Bryan) and Foley also got noticed and mentioned his life in the indys (like Bryan) but once again Foley was never #1 and was never designed to be the top face. Bryan is #1, Bryan is being groomed for that top baby face spot and for that reason alone he's more like Austin.

The way I see it though is you can compare a lot of things. At the end of the day all 3 have different characters from each other (although all 3 were often in similar situations story line wise), they all have different styles altogether and most of all they all got over in very different ways. Bryan can be compared to Austin and Foley but at the same time he's very different from Austin and Foley as well. Instead of comparing Daniel Bryan to Austin or Foley just compare him to nobody.

But is Bryan only #1 at the moment because of the absence of John Cena?

When Cena comes back, he may go back to #1 again, with Bryan being #2. Don't think it won't happen.

But maybe this new "Corporation" see Cena as a champion, as well (since that is the case in real life), so maybe he will join the Corporation instead, and turn on Bryan, setting up a match at WMXXX.

 

[SharpShooter083]

I agree with everything deanerandterry said. All three of those guys, early in their WWE careers were considered very good performers but never really looked at as main event top guys. All three eventually got themselves over with the fans and the system (WWE brass, VKM) had no choice but to run with them due to their overwhelming popularity. I also agree that they are 3 completely different characters but the common denominator is 'anti-establishment.' Its been a crowd pleaser for years (Austin, DX, nWo) and it just goes to show that it still is to this day. It's something that we all can relate to which makes it so great. I'm a big fan of Daniel Bryan and his work and excited to see where this goes. This is a major feud that can really make him a prime time player in the WWE for years and years to come. WWE has given Bryan the ball, lets see if he can run with it!!

 

[Tom]

But is Bryan only #1 at the moment because of the absence of John Cena?

When Cena comes back, he may go back to #1 again, with Bryan being #2. Don't think it won't happen.

But maybe this new "Corporation" see Cena as a champion, as well (since that is the case in real life), so maybe he will join the Corporation instead, and turn on Bryan, setting up a match at WMXXX.

Wishful thinking, but won't happen. Honestly, by some miracle that Cena's merchandise sales plum-it, kids stop making him their wish and he does something so bad such as buy 8 escorts, grab a TMZ reporter and go crazy in a hotel apartment, IT WON'T HAPPEN.

The idea is good though. Even if all this is to have John Cena return to the aid of everyone, it was still a good angle whilst it lasted. And Like I've said loads of times before, it's good for Bryan either way.

 

[MCMG]

We will never know how this storyline would have happened if Cena and indeed Sheamus remain healthy. Currently, Bryan is the main-man feuding with HHH. That is where the similarities between him and Austin lie. It is all about Bryan as it was about Austin. I personally think that the ultimate pay off is Bryan winning the belt and becoming WWE champ. Even when Cena is healthy I don't think he could be used in a feud with The Undertaker.

As it stands, I still think that Bryan is playing the Austin role simply because I think he is so immensely popular and him winning the WWE title at WM30 could be an incredible moment. I think that Cena will come back and briefly be used in this angle but I'm convinced he is facing The Undertaker.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

But is Bryan only #1 at the moment because of the absence of John Cena?

When Cena comes back, he may go back to #1 again, with Bryan being #2. Don't think it won't happen.

But maybe this new "Corporation" see Cena as a champion, as well (since that is the case in real life), so maybe he will join the Corporation instead, and turn on Bryan, setting up a match at WMXXX.

I don't see Cena coming back and just being handed the top spot again. He may take the ball from Bryan again if Bryan can't swim but I don't see that happening either. I think the WWE is having a change in the guard. I've seen Cena get injured before but in all cases I always got the impression they were just killing time until Cena got back. Even when he was supposed to be gone for 9 months in '07 they just had Orton dick around with HHH and HBK until Cena came back to take his spot.

At the current time it more feels like they are using this opportunity to make a new top dog in Daniel Bryan, not just eating up time. Since Cena I can't think of a single new face who got pushed quite to the extent of Daniel Bryan. Usually guys who were getting popular would get a push for a bit but would fizzle out. None of that's happening with Bryan. His popularity hasn't fizzled, its grown, even Punk fizzled after the summer of '11, Bryan has been mad over for quite some time and i dont see that stopping soon, I think Bryan would have taken Cena clean without his injury to be honest.

I think the WWE realized that Bryan kept getting mad reactions every week but unlike others they just kept growing. It may not be who WWE usually goes with but when you get over as strong as Bryan has its a good idea to run with him as far as you can take him. I think Vince and Trips see that too and they also realize that 8 years with the same face is a long time. Cena is mad popular but he isn't gonna get more popular than he already is, Daniel Bryan is closing in on Cena in terms of reaction but unlike Cena Bryan still hasn't hit his peak as a face. He's drawing pretty decent so far, he's doing well in merch (I'm assuming from all the Bryan T shirts I see) and with his push he has a chance to catch up and eclipse Cena.

I know some forum vets would crucify me for saying that but its true. WWE has something special with Bryan and they know it and when he gets his revenge on the new corporation will be glorious.

 

[nightmare]

Honestly the only reason anyone is comparing DBD to Austin is because he is going up against the boss in a storyline to keep the belt off him, a one-syllable catchphrase that is fun to chant and a very loud crowd reaction the likes of which few wrestlers will ever cause. The similarities end there really. This storyline is even playing out another story in parallel which will eventually intersect. One which was not there during the big SCSA angle - Allies.


What wrestlers were vocal about how Austin was treated? Which stars were publicly disciplined\humiliated for wanting to help Stone Cold? See where I am going? Even on the surface, it isnt so similar. Lets go deeper shall we?




There is a bit more to this. This is something that will play out until others join in the fight officially (survivor series), unlike before where SCSA was a one man army week in and week out. This isnt about flipping your boss the bird and raising hell to go against the system or the 'every day' guy who hates his boss and becomes a thorn in his side. This is about the indy guy who does not fit the part- proving he is better than the hand picked corporate guy. This is about the real wrestler vs the corporate poster boy and the powers that be. This is not 4x4's, beer bashes and brawls.


This has a different feel to it and will play out differently. Austin became a sensation by being the bad ass type of babyface which grew in popularity seemingly out of nowhere. Bryan is the defacto babyface out of necessity- cashing in on his already passionate fan base- to fill a void for the company. Unfortunately, as much as I love Daniel Bryan- he is not going to become the next SCSA no matter how well this all goes. Why? Because before Steve Austin there was no-one who really captured that spirit\gimmick as well as he did. As for Bryan....


Daniel Bryan is basing his argument and fight on being better than you, better than the cookie cutter WWE type guys because he is an indy star who got to the big leagues under his own merit. His claim is that he is 'the best wrestler'..... A claim that we just saw CM Punk prove with the longest title reign in the past 20 years. You know, the indy guy with heart\fire that proves the world wrong by beating the 'corporate' types? The guy who made a paycheck by proving each night he was the 'best wrestler in the world'?


So even in his claim, Daniel is already a step behind another guy who already cashed in on that gimmick quite recently. SCSA was unique and an out of nowhere phenomenon that grew more than anyone ever thought possible. As good as Daniel is (we know he is a bad ass) he will never capture the spirit of what Austin did in his storyline against the McMahon's or what Punk did in his initial run at\with the belt.



I love this storyline and cannot wait to see where it goes, but the path of Stone Cold- it will not be. The moment Bryan and eventually others (Rhodes, Show, etc) get their revenge- it will be fantastic. It just wont be anything really like the SCSA\McMahon angle. Great- but not so similar. So sit back and enjoy a great series of events for once, instead of constantly comparing past storylines. In 10 years people will be grasping straws to compare this story to something new and ultimately people will miss the best part- Enjoying the moment as it happens.

 

[shalliin]

Bryan playing either the Austin role or Foley role makes sense, it all depends on how you look at it I guess. I would rather not compare Bryan to either guy (honestly why does it matter and who gives a fuck?) but if I had to choose I would go with Austin.

Austin and Bryan are both top faces, they are both anti-establishment, they are both guys who the company doesn't want to be champion and they are both connecting with the crowd in a big way. Foley could fit in that as well but Foley was never the top babyface and was alway #2 behind Austin. That's where the biggest and most obvious difference in lies. Austin and Bryan are #1 whereas Foley was never #1.

Foley's look was never that of a champion (like Bryan), the company didn't want him to be champ (like Bryan) and Foley also got noticed and mentioned his life in the indys (like Bryan) but once again Foley was never #1 and was never designed to be the top face. Bryan is #1, Bryan is being groomed for that top baby face spot and for that reason alone he's more like Austin.

The way I see it though is you can compare a lot of things. At the end of the day all 3 have different characters from each other (although all 3 were often in similar situations story line wise), they all have different styles altogether and most of all they all got over in very different ways. Bryan can be compared to Austin and Foley but at the same time he's very different from Austin and Foley as well. Instead of comparing Daniel Bryan to Austin or Foley just compare him to nobody.

I would argue that Bryan is still #2 until he gets to the end of the feud. Either with a win and a championship, or some kind of loss that while keeping him from 'winning' shows the world that his claims are true and that HHH's reasoning is wrong. Bryan is in a position that is different from the others as he can actually loose the matches but win the feud depending on how the matches are booked and those losses takes place. As long as there are no clean, one on one, no gimmick victories by any of the new corp/ally/dx/evolution then Bryan wins over all as it shows that he's a better in ring performer then any one of that group.

Until there is a heel turn by him, Cena will be #1. There is almsot nothign that anyone else can do to take that position from him until he decideds to relinquish it. Either through a full on retirement or the long awaited by many heel turn, his popularity, non wrestling based appearances on shows, make a wish, other charity events and so on are the core of what makes him #1. He is the closest to what Hogan was in the 80's that we are likely to see. At this point, he supercedes wrestling, but unlike other recent people (rock.) he is still dedicated to the business that made him famous and that he frankly has helped to keep going during some tough times in the last 10 years.

Bryan is only known by wrestling fans and even after 3+ years in wwe, it's only th last year or so that he's started to make a connection with the fans and earn the attention to be put in his current position. Punk has had similar struggles and is still in that secondary class within the wwe. Cena is 1, Punk has been 2, and Bryan has only recently started pushing Punk for that 2nd spot. He might leap over Punk into solid 2nd but both are going to remain behind Cena. The current story is almost more centered on trying ot bring Orton back into relevance as he has fallen in recent years. At one time he was being groomed to try and replace Cena as top guy (face or heel), but he fell and others moved past him. Henry, Ziggler, Ryback and others have surged ahead while Orton has remained stagnant and static. Orton needs Cena gone and to be the 'chosen' hhh champ more then Bryan needs to have the title since he firmly has the crowd behind him.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

The primary reason people are comparing Bryan to Austin has to do with the fact that Bryan is currently involved in a storyline/feud in which he's taking on the WWE brass. Back in Austin's day, it was just Vince McMahon, his various stooges and whatever wrestlers aligned themselves with him. In the here & now, it's Vince, Triple H & Stephanie, their corporate champion Randy Orton, The Shield and possibly even Ryback at some point. As with Austin at the time, Bryan's someone with a lot of potential and talent, people have recognized that talent and gotten behind him.

Bryan is someone that many people believe hasn't reached as high as he's ultimately going to go, again like we saw with Austin before his feud with Vince started up. So when they see that Daniel Bryan is involved in a storyline feud in which he's going up against the corporate machine, which includes Vince himself, comparisons are going to be drawn.

At the same time, however, I think that some fans set wrestlers up to fail with such comparisons. You always hear comparisons of Dolph Ziggler to HBK or to Curt Hennig, for instance, from some people; yet they'll often find themselves disappointed if they feel that Ziggler isn't living up to such a lofty expectation of him in the minds of those fans. Nostalgia has a way of doing that as it sometimes has us remembering things as being better than they actually were, sometimes to an almost absurd degree. Austin & Bryan are two completely different types of characters and two completely different types of wrestlers. Whenever I look at a wrestler, personally, I don't say to myself, "he could be the next Rock or Stone Cold" because it's simply not realistic most of the time. The Rock & Austin were lightning in a bottle and wrestlers who become that enduringly over and popular simply don't come around all that often. If Bryan reaches those heights, that's great. If he doesn't, I couldn't care less as long as I enjoy watching & hearing him do what he does.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

I would argue that Bryan is still #2 until he gets to the end of the feud. Either with a win and a championship, or some kind of loss that while keeping him from 'winning' shows the world that his claims are true and that HHH's reasoning is wrong. Bryan is in a position that is different from the others as he can actually loose the matches but win the feud depending on how the matches are booked and those losses takes place. As long as there are no clean, one on one, no gimmick victories by any of the new corp/ally/dx/evolution then Bryan wins over all as it shows that he's a better in ring performer then any one of that group.

Until there is a heel turn by him, Cena will be #1. There is almsot nothign that anyone else can do to take that position from him until he decideds to relinquish it. Either through a full on retirement or the long awaited by many heel turn, his popularity, non wrestling based appearances on shows, make a wish, other charity events and so on are the core of what makes him #1. He is the closest to what Hogan was in the 80's that we are likely to see. At this point, he supercedes wrestling, but unlike other recent people (rock.) he is still dedicated to the business that made him famous and that he frankly has helped to keep going during some tough times in the last 10 years.

Bryan is only known by wrestling fans and even after 3+ years in wwe, it's only th last year or so that he's started to make a connection with the fans and earn the attention to be put in his current position. Punk has had similar struggles and is still in that secondary class within the wwe. Cena is 1, Punk has been 2, and Bryan has only recently started pushing Punk for that 2nd spot. He might leap over Punk into solid 2nd but both are going to remain behind Cena. The current story is almost more centered on trying ot bring Orton back into relevance as he has fallen in recent years. At one time he was being groomed to try and replace Cena as top guy (face or heel), but he fell and others moved past him. Henry, Ziggler, Ryback and others have surged ahead while Orton has remained stagnant and static. Orton needs Cena gone and to be the 'chosen' hhh champ more then Bryan needs to have the title since he firmly has the crowd behind him.

Well technically he is #2 because Cena is of course #1 but until at the very least Cena get's back Bryan is now #1 by process of elimination. I would say at this point he has overtaken Punk as the solid #2 guy behind Cena. Bryan is #1 because the real #1 is not wrestling for a while, when he gets back its very possible Bryan falls back down the card but I really don't see that happening. I'm not saying Cena won't come back and take his spot back but I think for at least the near future Bryan will be sitting on the top of the mountain.

I know it's not what WWE usually does, I know in every other case Cena has taken back his spot when he came back but I don't think its happening this time. They wouldn't have set up a storyline where Bryan "can't be the face of the company" unless they had plans to make him the face of the company for at least a good chunk of time, that's just illogical. It may be hard to believe but Cena isn't gonna be #1 for much longer. He's still very good but he's been the face for over 8 years and that's a long time on top. WWE is at least testing the waters with Bryan to see if he can carry the torch. If he can't Cena will be #1 again, if he can then Bryan will be #1. It all remains to be seen but I think Bryan will do it.