Why Don't They Seem To Care or 13,000 vs 1,300

[Evenflow DDT]

I've watched TNA since damn near the begining. I was there when R-Truth won his first "world title". I was there when Raven attacked Jeff Jarrett in his debut. I was there when Christian, Sting and Angle all made there debuts in TNA.

TNA is well known for bringing in wrestlers that have been released from WWE. It seems 80% of Vince's castoffs end up in Orlando, let's face it Indy guys don't draw and if you want attention from the mainstream you need big names i.e Angle, Nash, RVD, Sting, Hardy, & Hogan.

Yet with few exceptions (Angle, Anderson, Christian, & Raven '03-'05) these big names seem to lack interest in the ring. Guys like RVD and Hardy seem to be going thru the motions and collecting a sizeable check. I remember the Ladder Match those two had for the Hardcore title at Summerslam '01. I know it was 10 years ago and they were younger and faster but after watching the title match they had on impact i was glad i didnt have to pay for that.

It's not just those two. It's most everyone TNA brings in that have been thru the WWE/WCW experience. My question is Why?

After watching the Royal Rumble again it finally hit me. Watch when Booker T and Kevin Nash entered. Listen to the crowd reaction. 13,000 people standing and cheering. The roof damn near came off. That's what is missing in TNA (besides a good creative team). TNA is nothing more than a glorified indy that happens to have a TV deal. And could you imagine how depressing it would have been to see Hogan, Savage, HBK, or the Rock in an Indy fed like ROH? When you are used to wrestling in front of tens of thousands of fans its hard to get it up to go out and wrestle in front of 1000 people. I guarantee if Cena or Edge came to TNA they would fall into the same trap.

It's like seeing a big band in concert. I'd much rather see a band like Metallica at MSG or The Staples Center than at a local club. Sure it would be more intimate but the they wouldn't bring their A game.

I would say 99.999% of big stars need to be able to feed off of the crowd. Watch The Rock, Austin, HHH, HBK, Hogan (many years ago), Sting, and Flair. Whether its on the mic or in a match crowd reaction is the fuel they need to get thru the night. Especially faces.

Yes a guy like RVD has experience wrestling in front of small crowds back in his ECW days but then he was brought into the WWE then finds his way to TNA. It's like going from playing High School ball, to the NBA and then getting sent to the D-League.

Thoughts?

 

[RatedCharisma59]

This is a great thread! I actually agree 100% with you! Its like when you watch wrestlemania with like 80,000 fans all around, popping so loud for guy when they come through the curtain it must get the blood rushing! That many people cheering your name! Then imagine having all that then going to TNA, to perform infront of just over 1000 people, when your used to atleast 10x that.

And the worst thing is its not even just the weekly shows infront of that many people, most PPVs are in the same impact zone (studio!) so the reaction the wrestlers get on a weekly basis on impact, they also get on PPV.

I do think TNA need to travel a bit more, they need to perform infront of different crowds, different people, bigger crowds, might actually help the wrestlers feel a lil like they did when they were competing on the big stage in front of thousands of people week in week out.

Even if TNA puts on a 5 star match, it dose not have the same feel as if WWE put on a 5 star matches because the crowd is a lot smaller in TNA so there's less MAIN EVENT feel, where as in WWE there are always thousands and thousands of people on their feet making the match feel as good as it is with the crowd popping for moves, and chanting each guys name, its just a totally different feel in TNA.

 

[GameOver]

As you pretty much said so will try not to rehash what the rest of you have said
wonder why. TNA has little exposure, they have a lighter schedule and pay people to be useless, everything about TNA is amatuer most of the time, they are probably getting paid alot less then they would if WWE still wanted them, and the fans at the Impact arena's don't seem to know what the hell a heel or face nor for that matter do the writers/bookers are they even wrestling fans at all?. That's the few fans that there is in attendance.
pretty much all you hear is. "This is Awesome" regardless of what's going on....

But they bring em in for one reason. a name = exposure then hope to capitalise on the name and there talent, which they don't for the most part.
and can't do if they have noone to feed of of, no major star to work with and a different wrestling style

Problem is, there's a reason WWE don't these guys/gals too (generalisation here on the one's with talent).
They stopped being a draw
They are over the hill and refuse to be just a spokes person or help out backstage
a constant problem with injuries or drugs
bad attitudes

Hogan, Bischoff, Nash, Flair obviously don't give a shit about TNA they just want a paycheck, to boost there ego's thinking they are still the top draws which is understandable but it also shows in there actions and want desperately to recreate the Monday Night Wars again in hopes they'll make big bucks again, .

and i bet guys that have been there for along time and get the shaft time and time again so some big name star can come in and revolutionise the business they haven't revolutionised in ages in the biggest company there is, and then do nothing notable in TNA those die hard TNA stars are probably not too happy either but have nowhere else to go other then back to the indy's.

 

[UltimateHitman]

I've been saying this about guys, like RVD for example, in TNA and I couldn't quite put it into words. This does.

I know, the guys are getting older, but they're not as old as Taker who's still outperforming them (albeit at one show).

I think another thing could be the lighter schedule/laid back authority figures. They get used to go, go, go, then they get to ok, come here, sit around, chill, go out, do your thing, return to the back, chill some more, tape the next weeks episode, chill again.

It's like if you work two jobs and then end up getting paid more at one single job and you're not running yourself to death every second you're there. Your body relaxes more and you're not so pressured so your pace slows.

Plus, I don't think Dixie is breathing down their neck like Vince probably is to everybody on the WWE roster. I know he's a stickler about what's going on at all times. Nothing wrong w/that, I think that's smart, but you get what I'm saying.

But yeah, overall, I have noticed it happening.

 

[mrbooker]

I agree with everything the OP said to put it into perspective if the night after Bound For Glory, Hogan came out infront of a smackdown sized crowd of wrestling fans, trashed the TNA WHC title and gave Jeff Hardy a new title like they did on impact im pretty sure that would have gotten one hell of a reaction from 10,000+ wrestling fans seeing a legend like hogan trash one title and debut a new title to a huge fan favorite (face or heel) like jeff hardy

 

[safeco1999]

I've said this before- it's the atmosphere.. the production team, the lighting, etc.

Remember when all WWE PPV's were just bland setups, like Raw? Compare it to now, where Raw has a red light shining on the entire place, and Smackdown has a blue light shining everywhere. The PPV's have different lighting, better stage, better sound, better production.

WWE can enhance the image we get on TV by all the production work they do, and even bring in crowd noise. Watching TNA... the fans are generally quiet, they're not all real fans, they're just people who're visiting Disney World, I suppose.

WCW got more success when Bischoff took over and changed the production values of their broadcast, and moved from, as he called it "dimly lit" places, to more vibrant venues.

Plus, Vince McMahon was aggressive in the day, and established his company as the #1 brand. He is a pro wrestling pioneer. Dixie Carter? Just a pretty face who doesn't have half the respect that VKM commands. People go to Florida to retire- which coincidentally, is where TNA is, too

 

[AndarielHalo]

Yet with few exceptions (Angle, Anderson, Christian, & Raven '03-'05) these big names seem to lack interest in the ring. Guys like RVD and Hardy seem to be going thru the motions and collecting a sizeable check.

This is one of only two reasons big-name guys go to TNA. The other is to retain a small amount of TV exposure so that they aren't forgotten when WWE wants them back.

Smarter guys know this. Only fools, dreamers, idealists believe in TNA. Anyone who truly believes in TNA would recognize that they aren't helping it by going along with the idiocy of it all. They would try to change things.

 

[TUFFY54]

Completely agree. TNA just doesn't feel important. You simply can't try to make people believe they are seeing a huge moment in wrestling when there's less people at the match than you have at a high school assembley. I could live with Impact being in the studio, but the PPV's kill it for me. It's just awful to have a PPV in front of a 1000 people. Like the guys have said, the wrestlers don't perform because they know what the crowd should be. If you've wrestled in front of 50,000 people, your not going to get the butterflies before a match in the impact zone.

 

[achromat666]

This is a very accurate observation on both the state of TNA, the issues with gathering talent, and the pitfalls of too much exposure to an inferior product.

I was a fan of TNA at the start because it was about the new talent and only had a handful of established stars to give them recognition. But not only has it become the ex-WWE retirement home and for many the place where gimmicks go to die, the impact of having the massive crowds and traveling across the country has to play a big part in the lives of the performers going from WWE to TNA.

RVD went from working his ass off in ECW, coming to the WWE, staying in the upper mid card and feuding with lots of big talent to finally getting a massive title push, feuding with the 2 top performers in the company and holding 2 world titles. one screw up leads to him losing both and going back to the middle card on a quickly sinking WWE run ECW. He left on good terms and all indications, including making a brief match appearance with Santino after leaving WWE indicated he could have returned, but may have had to work to get back to his former spot. Instead he went to TNA, with a title reign people will barely remember and neither helping the product or helping himself other than getting a relaxed schedule and steady paycheck. That has to affect his work and the work of other with similar tales.

TNA has talent that can excite without having to be mired in stale stories and spend hours flailing on the mic. But with the influx of ex-WWE/WCW/ECW talent it's not so easy to stay focused on it. Add bad booking and rehashed stories and you have our current state of affairs in TNA.

I think the likes of Van Dam, Mr. Anderson, Burke/Dinero, and maybe even the Hardy's could still go back to the WWE, mend their bridges and make their way back to the arena light, huge crowds and pops, and steady paycheck. I agree the transition from that has to affect you profoundly. It can either make you just as determine to impress and get a company over, or defeat you and force you to settle for what can satisfy your pride.

Christian being a very good example of the former, and managing to go back to the WWE and still be a draw. He's worked his ass off but is coming off from an injury in line for what looks to be a good push.

History has shown that a lot of people have wronged Vince and left the company, only to come back and do something for themselves in the WWE, even if only in short term at times. It also shows what happens to guys that die in the indy scene after making it big and not knowing how to deal with life afterward. TNA is the only place keeping some of these guys from suffering one or the other fates.

Would anyone still care about Steiner, Nash, Sting, or others like them if they didn't have this company to fall back on? And look, Nash went back, has a 5 year contract and is better off than he ever was in TNA.

I don't include Flair or Hogan in this but Hogan has lost a lot of ground in credibility over the year and isn't doing TNA any favors. Yes, the world will remember Flair, but they would have remembered him just as well for the perfect send off the WWE gave him. He had no reason to come to TNA other than to fuel his ego, A legends contract and backstage work would have guaranteed his presence in the company would not be lost and he could have helped develop talent for them in a meaningful way.

But as much as Flair and Hogan wants those lights, the crowd and that pop, TNA can't give him what they need. 1,300 to 13,000 has a lot of meaning here.

Thanks for this thread, it sheds an interesting light on the state of things TNA.

 

[Jason Scene]

You're right, but here's something that I find interesting.

When TNA were doing PPVs outside the iMPACT! Zone they could never fill the arena. I remember when they did Slammiversary from Palace of Auburn Halls, and what happened? Nobody gave a shit, and TNA originally wanted a crowd of 10,000, a lot less then what can actually fill the arena, and yeah it was realistic for them at the time, but when they put on one of their signature matches in King of the Mountain, and can only get 4,000 people into an arena when they originally alocated 10,000 tickets. It's reality, and it tastes like shit.

TNA are more-or-less where the WWE guys who get released go, look at the current roster...

Brian Kendrick, Devon Dudley, Bubba-Ray Dudley, D'angelo Dinero, Jeff Hardy, Angle, Anderson, Matt Hardy, Matt Morgan, Mick Foley, Flair, Orlando Jordan, Scott Steiner, Shannon Moore, Rob Terry, Tommy Dreamer, Mickie James and others.

I know that the arguement is, "Sure they want to go to TNA because it's on TV", here's the thing, three-quarters of those guys didn't work in WWE and hence why they don't work there anymore, they work for TNA.

They've allowed a few people to shine. Matt Morgan, slightly overrated in my opinion, but hes doing a hell of a lot better as "The Blueprint" then Carlito's bodyguard with a stutter. Ken Anderson was their World Champion, it isn't big but its an accomplishment for him. Elijah Burke, underutilized in WWE, in TNA he became big as "The Pope" D'Angelo Dinero, although he sucks again.

And TNA, all they have on ROH are three things. Money, TV deal and sponsorship. That's it! Doesn't have the better wrestling, and it the line in your post of...

... let's face it Indy guys don't draw

Everyone starts on the indies. You give them the platform and they'll draw. When people found out Danielson was going to be on NXT, people who didn't know of him watched the first episode to see what everyone was on about when they talked about the guy. When Samoa Joe was arguebly the best rookie in wrestling back in ROH, TNA signed him and the fans went crazy when Joe made his debut, people watched TNA to see Samoa Joe. CM Punk, when he was debuting on ECW, did people watch? Damn right they did.

When Tyler Black debuts, people will watch. Indy guys draw when they're given the stage. Indy wrestling, especially ROH isn't as quiet as it once was. Most actual wrestling fans will know of ROH, they'll have heard of guys like Davey Richards and Roderick Strong and Eddie Edwards. Hell, WWE tried to sign Strong and he said no.

TNA's problems are what you said, mixed with its soap opera like storylines and the fact it sticks garbage down your throat. And it all points back at the same people. Vince Russo, Dixie Carter, Hulk Hogan and Eric Bischoff. They're the systimatic cancer of TNA.

Overall I agree with your post, great point and post. You deserve your rep.

 

[The 5th Horsemen]

TNA needs to take their show on the road for TV tapings or just go live like Raw. They need to hit small arenas though and don't do like WCW did when they were going downhill (still booked huge arenas that looked empty). JMO

 

[SpecialFNK]

does anyone know why TNA does not go to bigger arenas?
the Impact that will shown this coming March 3rd was taped in Fayetteville, North Carolina. no idea on how many seats the entire arena has, but TNA set it up to be cut in half. why not use the entire arena? from what I remember reading, tickets did go pretty fast for the half of the arena they did have set up.
but whats the reason for only using half the arena? would TNA be afraid they would not sell out and there would be a lot of empty seats shown on TV?
a bigger crowd could be really good for TNA, especially the sometimes lame crowd at the Impact Zone that is just dead. when you can hear ONE person in the arena scream something, that's a problem.

 

[Jason Scene]

does anyone know why TNA does not go to bigger arenas?
the Impact that will shown this coming March 3rd was taped in Fayetteville, North Carolina. no idea on how many seats the entire arena has, but TNA set it up to be cut in half. why not use the entire arena? from what I remember reading, tickets did go pretty fast for the half of the arena they did have set up.
but whats the reason for only using half the arena? would TNA be afraid they would not sell out and there would be a lot of empty seats shown on TV?
a bigger crowd could be really good for TNA, especially the sometimes lame crowd at the Impact Zone that is just dead. when you can hear ONE person in the arena scream something, that's a problem.

If TNA went with the full capacity it wouldn't have sold-out. And if it doesn't sell out it makes the company and Hogan look bad. And Hulk Hogan looking bad is something that TNA can't allow, because its not as if his reputation hasnt been tarnished over the years anyway.

 

[VencomHardcore]

One thing that no one has mentioned yet - TNA can sell tickets and could fill smaller arenas [ 5,000 people ]. This is how.

Develop a public relations plan. that is something that is hurting the company. You have ex WWE stars that could put butts in the seats if they went out there and sold TNA to the WWE fans that remembered them. How cool would it be to go to a festival and see Jeff Hardy signing autographs.

Imagine seeing Hulk Hogan out in a small town promoting TNA before the show happened. They could do the local high scools and middle schools. Then offer those people LOW PRICED TICKETS or just give them away.

Giving away cheap seats wouldn't hurt TNA because they could make it back on concessions and cheap T-Shirts. Like CZW does, they offer old T-shirts for $5 and have cheap concessions. I have personally spent at least $30 per show on food and shirts to give away.

My point is that TNA can do better if they use thier resources in a better way. Ex WWE talent needs to be used to promote the brand and not put over new TNA stars.


My other point - You can have a main event feel with 1,000 people !

Example, ROH . I have ordered ippvs and have been very excited and felt the main event atmosphere. Was it alot of people in attendance ? about the same as TNA and in some cases ROH draws more people in certain cities.

I am trying to say that quality in the ring creates the Big Event Atmosphere. Its not about numbers. There have been many smaller promotions that have great shows with less people. That is the job of the bookers and creative to give a compelling reason why people should care about the show.

 

[Jason Scene]

One thing that no one has mentioned yet - TNA can sell tickets and could fill smaller arenas [ 5,000 people ]. This is how.

Develop a public relations plan. that is something that is hurting the company. You have ex WWE stars that could put butts in the seats if they went out there and sold TNA to the WWE fans that remembered them. How cool would it be to go to a festival and see Jeff Hardy signing autographs.

Imagine seeing Hulk Hogan out in a small town promoting TNA before the show happened. They could do the local high scools and middle schools. Then offer those people LOW PRICED TICKETS or just give them away.

Giving away cheap seats wouldn't hurt TNA because they could make it back on concessions and cheap T-Shirts. Like CZW does, they offer old T-shirts for $5 and have cheap concessions. I have personally spent at least $30 per show on food and shirts to give away.

My point is that TNA can do better if they use thier resources in a better way. Ex WWE talent needs to be used to promote the brand and not put over new TNA stars.


My other point - You can have a main event feel with 1,000 people !

Example, ROH . I have ordered ippvs and have been very excited and felt the main event atmosphere. Was it alot of people in attendance ? about the same as TNA and in some cases ROH draws more people in certain cities.

I am trying to say that quality in the ring creates the Big Event Atmosphere. Its not about numbers. There have been many smaller promotions that have great shows with less people. That is the job of the bookers and creative to give a compelling reason why people should care about the show.

Nice points and idea, but here are the errors.

Would older fans really care for Jeff Hardy? Would older fans care for any of the others? I mean, TNA wrestlers do conventions all the time. I was at one where two of the three special guests were AJ Styles, Mick Foley and Rob Terry. The place was ALL around AJ's section, Foley got some as well but Terry kind of just sat there. And Jeff Hardy has so much negative heat, I mean if I saw him I'd punch him before asking for that scums autograph.

And then, the whole thing if they did shows like ROH? They wouldn't have the balls, because it would make them look weak. You stick 1,000 TNA marks in the Manhattan Center and let TNA do a show like how ROH does one and It'll fail for a number of reasons. The wrestling doesn't touch ROH's, the flaws would be shown all over, I mean, Hulk Hogan can barely make his ass down the ramp in the iMPACT! Zone, nevermind the Manhattan Center.

And when the show is over, and people see and start saying, "ROH could have done better." It'll expose TNA for their weaknesses. And people will be looking for TNA to get the kick and ROH to replace them.

TNA do what Paul Heyman said, and even with his methods they still produce sloppy, and occasionally unrealistic wrestling.

"Hide the negatives, exasperate the positives."

 

[nwo/the.band]

I will some it all up in one word = MONEY!!!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Kevin Nash
"When wcw took over the WWE for the short time we did, it's bc Ted Turner paid HUGE $ for talent. Wanna put tna on the map, Mrs. Carter? Set aside $50m. Start with Cena and work backwards. Don't walk into a Mercedes showroom and ask what new AMG S-63 I can buy for $25K."

 

[orton0384]

The wrestling business is not as popular as it used to be. I am also under the impression that TNA has to give freebies away to fill seats. You cannot go from 1,000 to 10,000+ overnight or over a year. It takes a long time and you need money. Not for signing ex wwe talent but for expanding and making a name to arenas. To show you have ways of selling tickets and food and money for parking etc.

Its not easy to run a business. But im sure that Vince McMahon takes all his Twitter energy and overhyping energy into looking over and improving his product. Is it great right now? Yeah it could be worse. Its not amazing like it used to be. But its not in a huge slump. If miss dixie put a little more oomph in her position and spent less time being fan interactive and more controlling developing and not relying on ex wwe people shed be fine. If she had turners money she could afford that. Hell if she had turners money and channels and arenas shed be very well off.

Sad reality she doesnt. Aj styles samoa joe the pope etc these are people you need to make the focus imo. Because only then do you really set yourself apart from your competition. Controversy used to create cash. Open your homepage on yahoo. Theres enough controversy there thats real. I dont need to watch tna to see it. Just wrestling please.

 

[TheKev]

I totally agree with this thread, I saw TNA when they came to Birmingham UK 08 I think, and it was awful. The only highlights were seeing Mick Foley, he and a few others watched the main event in the section next to me, and he even gave me a wave! Top bloke

 

[snowjorden]

And then, the whole thing if they did shows like ROH? They wouldn't have the balls, because it would make them look weak. You stick 1,000 TNA marks in the Manhattan Center and let TNA do a show like how ROH does one and It'll fail for a number of reasons. The wrestling doesn't touch ROH's, the flaws would be shown all over, I mean, Hulk Hogan can barely make his ass down the ramp in the iMPACT! Zone, nevermind the Manhattan Center.

And when the show is over, and people see and start saying, "ROH could have done better." It'll expose TNA for their weaknesses. And people will be looking for TNA to get the kick and ROH to replace them.

I respectfully and completely disagree with what you said here, so just thought I'd throw my two sense in. TNA has the talent to put on a show miles ahead of what ROH is offering right now. I'm a huge mark for ROH, but in the past 2 years it's gone slightly down hill from the level it was once at. Guys like Briscoes, KOW, Davey Richards are still miles ahead of nearly everyone in wrestling and they have the advantage of now using WGTT, Daniels, Cabana, and Corino again but ROH is a shell of it's former self.

That said, this is about TNA and not ROH so I digress on that argument. What needs to be said is that TNA has plenty of talent that could put on a FANTASTIC show in someplace like the Manhattan Center. Guys like; Fortune, MCMG, GenMe, Kurt Angle, Samoa Joe, Amazing Red, and even RVD/Daniels could match anything ROH can put on in-ring wise. The problem from top to bottom with TNA is their booking.

What is Dixie trying to accomplish? I don't think she really knows, other than hearing from HORRIBLE influences that they need to "beat WWE in ratings." She should be concentrating on building stars, and creating an exciting product with fantastic storylines. Instead, she's listened to Hulk Hogan, Eric Bischoff, and Vince Russo (I don't include Flair/Foley cause I think BOTH would help TNA if they really had the position to do so) and their goals in life, still to this day are to "beat the WWE."

If TNA would become more like ROH, I think they'd be a better show to watch.

 

[y2empleh]

The issue isn't the size of TNAs crowd or the fact that it's the same crowd week in and week out. TNAs problem is simply that they have all the talent in the world yet still put out a horrible product. ECW had a smaller venue and the same crowd every week and while some some poor business decisions put them out of business, their legacy is still strong and at one time was considered an actual threat to WWE and WCW. 500 people in a small room chanting T-N-A can make a moment seem epic. Go back a few years to old videos where this happened.

 

[Kitten Cutter]

This is a great post. It really made me think.

I noticed something in terms of the booking: have anyone noticed that the wrestlers are booked in similar fashions? Let's compare the active stars that been in both places for established amounts of time: (and we'll go with established pushes in both companies, so I'll leave off guys like Kaz and Styles who didn't get on TV much in the WWE)

Jeff Hardy - World Champion in both
Rob Van Dam - World Champion in both
C.M. Punk - World Champion in WWE, no titles in TNA
Mr. Anderson\Kennedy - World Champion in TNA, had Money in the Bank in the WWE which maybe would have led to becoming World Champion
D'Angelo Dinero\Elijah Burke - never held a title in either company
Christian - World Champion in TNA, held every belt except World Titles in WWE
R-Truth\Ron Killings - World Champion in TNA, U.S. Title along with multiple titles and high contender for World Title in WWE
Team 3D - multiple tag team champions in both
Jeff Jarrett - World Champion in TNA, held IC and Tag Team Titles in WWE and high contender for World Title in WWF (held WCW World Title when company existed)
Kurt Angle - World Champion in both
Scott Steiner - Tag Team Title reign in both, high contender for World titles in both companies (held WCW World title when company existed)
Victoria\Tara - Women's champion in both
Mickie James - Women's champion in WWE, high contender for Women's title in TNA
Katie Lea\Winter - Women's Tag Team Title reign in TNA, no titles in WWE

By this, only R-Truth, Christian, Jeff Jarrett and Mr. Anderson actually won World Titles in TNA without winning at least in the WWE, and all of them were established wrestlers in the WWE. It's one of those situations where guys like Hardy and RVD have already been World Champions, so getting the title isn't anything new for them. Wrestlers going from WWE to TNA don't move up or down, so why work any harder for them? Where's their emotional reaction to becoming the top guy? Even Mr. Anderson's reaction when he won wasn't as big as it should have been. He reacted more bringing down the MITB case at Wrestlemania. When a wrestler wins the World title for the first time, he should be overwhelmed whether he's a face or a heel. We want to see a guy who worked hard, toiled in the independent ranks, went through hell and back to FINALLY be the top guy, and TNA is putting the belt on former champions already. The former champions should be ecstatic to get the belt back, but they're not playing it. It's old news; they're established so why bother? It happens in both the WWE and TNA as well. Even A.J. Styles has been there and done that, and and even though the fans would want to see it, how big would it be for a guy like Jay Lethal? A guy like Kazarian or Robert Roode? Maybe someone like Crimson or Douglas Williams or Hernandez to win the World Champion on a big stage for them, seeing as none of them have even been established in the WWE, so for them it would be a huge moment.

How do you alleviate the problem of 13,000 to 1,300? Put somebody there who hasn't done it before. Let the established guys go through the motions and eventually let them put somebody over, and watch the crowd react when the new guy on top finally makes it there.