Why do we celebrate Columbus Day?

[Police Penis Sucking Goat Fucker]

Yeah I meant to post this yesterday but I forgot and got busy with other stuff so I will post it now. That is the big question that we all want to know. Why do we celebrate Columbus day? Why honor a day from someone who stole land from some one else and claimed it as his discovery. We should celebrate Columbus day by breaking into are neighbors house and kick them out and live in their house for a day. You can say that it is your house when it clearly isn't. Columbus did nothing but take the country that belonged once belonged to the Native Americans. It's just another bullshit holiday as a kid I didn't see too much of a problem with Columbus day because you got the day off from school, but I began to discover how America is where Native American originally lived then a some Italian named Chris Columbo who changed his last name to Columbus to make it sound more Latin stole the land for himself. We talk about today about all this stuff about illegal immigrants, Christopher Columbus was the original illegal immigrant why don’t we celebrate a holiday for all the Mexicans who cross the border illegally. Too bad I didn't post this yesterday we could have celebrated the right way by breaking into our neighbors house and taking over for the day. Next year we will celebrate right we have a whole year to prepare.

 

[Rayne]

Wow. You belong here.

The conversation about the nature of ownership and the nature of legality would be way the fuck over your head, so I'll just leave it here for you.

For the multicellular visitors here, the ability to enforce a law is the ability to create a law. If you can't enforce the laws that you have, then you don't have the authority, or ability, to create laws. You can't make something 'illegal' if you don't have the ability to DO anything about it.

The concept of ownership is similar. Ownership is the ability to possess something. If someone can take it from you, then it's no longer yours. As a society, we've created laws and an enforcement mechanism to protect people against changes of ownership through force. In the late 1400's, the New World had no such ability. They didn't have the capacity to enforce laws that they had, and were swept aside by powers that DID have the ability to enforce law.

Might makes right. Always has, always will. What you think of as 'law' is just a very large actor exerting its might to enforce what it believes is right.

For the record, Christopher Columbus didn't establish major colonies, and was mostly a failure at establishing trade. Your angst is better directed at people like Cortes and Pizarro.

 

[Барбоса]

He never even made it to the territory of the now United States.

 

[DirtyD79]

That dumb putz didn't even know what country he was in. I hope he got laughed at when he got back to Spain.

 

[The ShIT Factor]

Columbus was just a dipshit without a map

 

[Rayne]

Columbus was just a dipshit without a map

Not having a map was sort of the point of the whole expedition. It was to discover a quicker trade route to the East Indies. If he had a map, it would have just been an ordinary trade mission, and no one would remember his name.

This was back in a time when you couldn't go on Google Earth to see whatever you wanted. There was still half of the planet which hadn't been discovered by Europe. Seeing as Europe went on to conquer the globe over the next three centuries, that's why we remember Christopher Columbus. If the Ming Dynasty had been interested in ocean exploration as opposed to westward expansion, we'd all be speaking Mandarin right now.

It's fashionable to hate on Christopher Columbus, because we have the benefit of hindsight. And GPS. He had celestial navigation, and considering he was a hemisphere away from where he started- in an age where the term 'hemisphere' didn't exist- that wasn't much use to him.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

It's people like Todd that make 'righteousness' confusing if not completely moronic.

 

[Ming]

Didn't even know there's a Columbus day until reading this thread.

 

[Police Penis Sucking Goat Fucker]

Wow. You belong here.

The conversation about the nature of ownership and the nature of legality would be way the fuck over your head, so I'll just leave it here for you.

For the multicellular visitors here, the ability to enforce a law is the ability to create a law. If you can't enforce the laws that you have, then you don't have the authority, or ability, to create laws. You can't make something 'illegal' if you don't have the ability to DO anything about it.

The concept of ownership is similar. Ownership is the ability to possess something. If someone can take it from you, then it's no longer yours. As a society, we've created laws and an enforcement mechanism to protect people against changes of ownership through force. In the late 1400's, the New World had no such ability. They didn't have the capacity to enforce laws that they had, and were swept aside by powers that DID have the ability to enforce law.

Might makes right. Always has, always will. What you think of as 'law' is just a very large actor exerting its might to enforce what it believes is right.

For the record, Christopher Columbus didn't establish major colonies, and was mostly a failure at establishing trade. Your angst is better directed at people like Cortes and Pizarro.

So what your saying is that some guy came along stole someone else's land and then claimed he discovered it. Then a bunch of laws were made by the people who stole the land to to protect their stolen land from being stolen and also made a bunch of other laws that only benefit themselves and screws over the rest of the country.


http://whistleblower-newswire.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/columbus-day-sitting-bull-copy.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kEuiU0w6VFM/TLMzPrzc2rI/AAAAAAAACzg/KRuU8SYF9Tw/s1600/columbus_day.png

 

[Rayne]

So what your saying is that some guy came along stole someone else's land and then claimed he discovered it. Then a bunch of laws were made by the people who stole the land to to protect their stolen land from being stolen and also made a bunch of other laws that only benefit themselves and screws over the rest of the country.

See, this is what I was saying about the concept of ownership and the nature of legality being way the fuck over your head.

First, Christopher Columbus never successfully established colonies. He was mostly a failure at establishing trade, and his only real success was pointing out to the rest of Europe, "hey, there's land in this direction."

Second, you can't 'steal' something unless there is an active authority capable of saying you've 'stolen' something, and then doing something about it. Ignoring the fact that you don't understand that Christopher Columbus never set up colonies and occupied land, in the sixteenth century the only forces who said that the Europeans were 'stealing' American land were Native Americans. Now they're all dead. Their killers were feted as heroes by their sponsoring countries. No one complained about 'stealing'. You're placing 21st century morals on 16th century history. Let me know if that gets the Native Americans their land back.

Third, you can't 'own' anything unless you are capable of defending it and protecting your ownership. In contemporary society, we have police that you can run and cry to if someone punches you in the face and takes your XBox, because as a society, we've agreed to rules about what ownership and theft are. Without that overriding authority to protect ownership, ownership is merely the ability to continue to possess something.

All that was stated above, but you've got this bizarre idea that rights are just given out freely, and not fought and earned.

You have this crazy idea that if someone is on a piece of land, then it must be theirs. History is full of societies that were wiped out by larger societies who enforced their own law, and very, very thin on societies who held a piece of land and were left alone by the rest of the world without being willing to fight, and not just die, but win the right to hold their land. Might makes right, always has, always will. Read a book.

 

[Барбоса]

International law of ownership is based initially on "dibs" and to a certain extent still is. It is why the Americans planted a flag on the moon and why the Russians just a couple of years ago placed a flag on the seabed below the North Pole.

Plus of course, gun beats spear.

 

[Alex]

Crazy Italian, trying to find a quicker way to the East Indies, finding the Americas instead.

 

[Police Penis Sucking Goat Fucker]

You keeping talking bout your legal stuff but it still makes America stolen land. Just because it wasn't a set law doesn't make it Ok for someone to just show up where someone else lives. They made those laws to protect themselves, just it wasn't a law doesn't make them wrong. Do you think slavery was Ok because there was a time where it was acceptable? Why doesn't people talk about all the people who wrongfully killed to get this country. Then you have your dumb americans that brag how they are the best when American should be taught more about our past. It's matter of right and wrong not if it's a law. How can we as country honor such a terrible man?

 

[Rayne]

You are not grasping the key concepts here about the natures of law and ownership, and the insane idea of "natural rights". But in answer to your question:

Slavery (and I'm talking about the institutionalized mass-trade version, not today's smaller scale ownership) was the natural result of a larger economy meeting a source of labor that could be transported and forced to work for cheaper than it would take to pay a worker to do the same work. In the time frame we're talking about, slavery was quite common. Does that make it "OK"? I don't deal in OK. OK is keeping a boot off of your neck. Telling a slave that it's not "OK" doesn't free him.

As a society today, we've decided that slavery isn't desirable. That doesn't make it some kind of natural right to not be a slave; it means that there is a large source of people opposed to the concept; large enough to enforce their desires. Should opinion on the topic change, slavery could easily become "OK" again.

Anything else? I'm hourly.

 

[ABMorales787]

What in the fuck is it with you and authority figures? Columbus is the reason why America got populated and seen as a new world. Regardless of him being and dying clueless of where he really was, he's pretty much the reason why America is what it is today and not a huge patch of dirt with guys in banana hammocks running around.

 

[Police Penis Sucking Goat Fucker]

Have you seen America lately? Things are not going very well at all and it doesn't help with having clueless people like you. Look at our past there is a whole lot of stuff not to be proud of.

 

[ABMorales787]

Why don't you strip to your briefs and run around town looking for fish with a wooden stake then?

 

[Барбоса]

Have you seen America lately? Things are not going very well at all and it doesn't help with having clueless people like you. Look at our past there is a whole lot of stuff not to be proud of.

Compared to the rest of the world and history in general, America is one of the best behaved countries.

The only reason that it gets slated is because it has such high standards to live up to. The moment it slips even a minute amount below those standards idiots like you are there to tell us how bad everything is, seemingly forgetting just how good you really have it.

 

[Ming]

Compared to the rest of the world and history in general, America is one of the best behaved countries.

The only reason that it gets slated is because it has such high standards to live up to. The moment it slips even a minute amount below those standards idiots like you are there to tell us how bad everything is, seemingly forgetting just how good you really have it.

Shhhhhh!

Don't let them remember just how naughty Britain was!

 

[Dowdsy McDowds]

International law of ownership is based initially on "dibs" and to a certain extent still is. It is why the Americans planted a flag on the moon and why the Russians just a couple of years ago placed a flag on the seabed below the North Pole.

Plus of course, gun beats spear.

I think lego and Eddie Izzard are what's needed here.


Pfft, books!? There's a YouTube video for that

 

[Miko]

Shhhhhh!

Don't let them remember just how naughty Britain was!

One of histories greatest monsters, makes me swell with pride

 

[Tastycles]

Christopher Colombus never went to the modern day United States, you fucking tool. If you're going to criticise someone for something, at least approach it from a position of intelligence.

 

[shattered dreams]

Don't let them get you down Todd. The OP was the first time I read a post of yours and I considered it entertaining. What are your thoughts on Groundhog Day?

 

[Moon Knight]

Don't let them get you down Todd. The OP was the first time I read a post of yours and I considered it entertaining. What are your thoughts on Groundhog Day?

What about his thoughts on Arbor Day?

 

[JenksIX]

Because it was the day Martin Luther King Jr freed the slaves... DUH!