What the Hell is Going On With the Knockouts?

[wrestling fan 666]

Okay, I waited for some KO fans to say something yet nothing was said. What happened to the KO division of Impact Wrestling? First, they bring back ODB for a run then keep her off TV for months. They release Angelina Love, former KO champ and tag team champ. Last time Love left, there were comments like crazy for how she was missed and how they it's not the same. Now they let their prime money maker personality (granted not best wrestler) go in Velvet Sky!!

There was a time TNA was thinking of having a PPV entirely centered on the KO division for the competition and ratings were so big. Now, there's maybe 6 people left? Is this Hogan? Is this "the new direction" of Brooke Hogan? I have been a fan of the KO division since it started. They released so many good talents that kept the fans interested that now it's the same matches over and over.

I think they need a new direction with more talent and personalities. It can come back if only the people in charge would let it. How do you feel? This is not a forum for women wrestling haters. Truly, do you think it can be fixed? Can it comeback? or will it see the fate of the Diva's division of WWE?

 

[satchmokilnt]

It's been gradually developing since hogan and bischoff first walked in. the bell might aswell have been rang then. the same could be said of the tag division, which is a mere fraction of what it once was. but atleast you could point to reasons why the tag division has suffered.(the beer money break up was for the greater good, a plethora of injurys for the machine guns.)

The knockout division has basically been ripped apart for no valid reason at all. the opportunity was there to do something that would set tna apart from wwe. but has been left to rot in favour of developing the world title and x division scene.

i suppose there will be many who think that is for the greater good. id agree. just a shame we cant have a company with all divisions firing at the same time. i do believe if womens wrestling is given a good enough platform it can get the fans. just a shame no one of real power seems to care.

 

[thesquaredcircle]

I don't know if you realized this but velvet sky and love asked for their release. I do agree though the knockouts are not what they used to be (2007-2009) but I don't think they are completely going away from them. It's just that the BFG series is underway and some things have to take a backseat.

 

[czar76]

Lets be honest here. While the KO division was better then the Diva's there have only been a handful that could put on a good match. Kong was superior but reportedly hard to work with. Love could get the job done but got stale quickly. Roxie was fun but didn't really have the total package. Daffney was also reportedly a problem backstage. Then we have Mickie, Tara and Gail who can all put on a hell of a match but only with each other. I don't think much needs to be said about Miss Tessmacher.
All in all the KO division was poor to say the least. Better then WWE but not good. The numbers came in for Velvet because of her looks and personality not her ability. So in the end it isn't much of a loss.
If they want a real division bring in some of the ladies from Mexico and Japan mixed with some indy talent and that could make up for the lack of in ring ability of some of the bigger stars.

 

[bigandpissed]

I personally was never a fan of the beautiful people and don't see it as a huge loss. While the Knockout roster may seem thin number wise, I think its a matter of quality over quantity. Besides the loss of awesome kong, I don't think they lost alot in terms of in ring ability. all of the knockouts they have now like ODB, Tara, Mickie, Gail, and Sarita, are good to great in terms of in ring ability, which to me makes them alot more watchable than the divas.

 

[LordHumongus]

Well maybe Awesome Kong will return to TNA and give the Knockout division the shot in the arm it needs.Plus Melina is still a free agent.And despite the criticism she receives she's still a solid worker.

 

[PDX_RipCity]

Can the TNA Knockout's division be saved? And is it worth saving? Absolutely, YES to both questions. However, a previous poster hit the real problem on the head...

if womens wrestling is given a good enough platform it can get the fans. just a shame no one of real power seems to care.

Totally agree. Female wrestling has shown signs of stirring interesting in the past, (such as Shimmer, Attitude Era Divas, Knockouts 2007-2009), but has never really been given a full push in the spotlight by a major national promotion. At least considering the modern era, suppose there was the short-lived WWF funded GLOW promotion of the mid-80's which had it's own issues, but that's another topic for another day.

I see 3 major things that made the Knockouts Division successful in the past, and could help them again...
1) Focus on Wrestling/Competition
2) Deep, skilled, and versatile roster
3) TV Time

First, TNA needs to stop trying to make the Knockouts become WWE Divas version 2.0. Separating themselves from the WWE is important. Creating their own brand and offering a defined product is crucial to gaining ground and having major success. Focusing on wrestling and in-ring competition is the best way. There's plenty of fans frustrated with the Divas and would give a chance to a worthy alternative. However, you can't fake it. Trying to sell Tessmacher and Velvet as world champion wrestling technicians isn't going to work.

So second, if TNA wants to focus on the in-ring product, then they need to sign some actual wrestlers capable of putting on matches that actually excite fans (i.e. see any Shimmer show). Of course you want to have some eye-candy too, but there needs to be more balance and more versatility with the roster. Right now, too many of the KO's are similar, stale, and cliche. Aside from ODB, no other knockouts really stand out. Creating more interesting/diverse gimmicks is crucial.

Lastly, they have to give the KO's more than 1 segment/storyline a show. If you're serious about pushing the division, then prove it. Have the guts to put your money where your mouth is. If the KO Division is actually going to improve and develop again, then they have to give them more than 3-5 minutes for a match. Characters can't develop if they're not involved in interesting storylines and given time for fans to become attached/invested in them.

However, sadly, all discussion is petty speculation until there's a major company who's truly willing to give women's wrestling a push. Hopefully, Linda and Stephanie Mcmahon, both strong successful females can finally convince their husbands that women can be more than just eye-candy (I mean, they should know right??), and help lead the division to something better in the future....

However, since TNA is the underdog company, they should be the ones willing to take a chance with women's wrestling...

I deeply believe, if TNA had an exciting and successful women's wrestling division it could help them standout and draw in new fans. Personally, I didn't start watching TNA on a regular basis until 2007, and the growing Knockouts division was one of the major reasons I kept coming back.

Oh yeah...another thing will also help the Knockouts division a lot....re-sign Awesome Kong ASAP!!!

 

[PDX_RipCity]

A couple responses...

I do agree though the knockouts are not what they used to be (2007-2009) but I don't think they are completely going away from them. It's just that the BFG series is underway and some things have to take a backseat.

There's definitely some truth to this statement. Also, overall as a company, it's been rumored that TNA has been "trimming down" the roster and using wrestlers in a part-time manner. Probably a good financial decision and will help them save money so they can prepare for a big push/expansion in the near future (i.e. going Live permanently, hitting the road, and getting out of the Impact Zone). SO, just have to be patient and smart...

all of the knockouts they have now like ODB, Tara, Mickie, Gail, and Sarita, are good to great in terms of in ring ability, which to me makes them alot more watchable than the divas.

Agreed, all those gals can go in the ring. But TNA still has to actually give them more time, invest in better storylines, and allow them to put on quality matches.

Also, aside from Sarita, all those women are older veterans, been-there-done-that. Of course, veterans are valuable but you can't build your division around them, they need to be mixed with and helping to "put over" fresh, younger talent that will actually get fans interested and excited. Unless you think Tessmacher counts...

 

[wrestling fan 666]

Lets be honest here. While the KO division was better then the Diva's there have only been a handful that could put on a good match. Kong was superior but reportedly hard to work with. Love could get the job done but got stale quickly. Roxie was fun but didn't really have the total package. Daffney was also reportedly a problem backstage. Then we have Mickie, Tara and Gail who can all put on a hell of a match but only with each other. I don't think much needs to be said about Miss Tessmacher.
All in all the KO division was poor to say the least. Better then WWE but not good. The numbers came in for Velvet because of her looks and personality not her ability. So in the end it isn't much of a loss.
If they want a real division bring in some of the ladies from Mexico and Japan mixed with some indy talent and that could make up for the lack of in ring ability of some of the bigger stars.

I can't disagree with you more. Daffney was hurt in a match and had medical bills that TNA refused to pay; lawsuit was made. Roxie was one of the toughest competitors in the ring-the girl brought hard core to women's wrestling. "Love could get the job done" is an understatement. She was a dominant champ and had all the skills.

At one time, they had the Beautiful People, Daffney, Taylor Wilde, Raisha Saeed, Roxxie, Christy Hemme (as a wrestler), Hamada, Awesome Kong, Salinas, Traci Brooks, the list goes on. I still think that if given the right writers, this can come back; if they want it to.

 

[wrestling fan 666]

"I see 3 major things that made the Knockouts Division successful in the past, and could help them again...
1) Focus on Wrestling/Competition
2) Deep, skilled, and versatile roster
3) TV Time "

Couldn't have said it better myself. My biggest point of this was the lack of #2; they keep losing talent and not replacing them.

 

[Ovaltine]

I loved WCW, but they did the same thing. They basically saw women's wrestling as a waste of time so they axed it. Hulk and Bischoff just don't see dollars in any of the knockouts so (IMO) they are trying to (slowly) dismantle the division. Granted Velvet Sky wasn't a great wrestle by any strech of the imagination, but she was mad over! She faced Mickie James at the London Impact show and the crowd booed poor James out of the building. The Knockout tag team titles have pretty much been retired. I expect them to vanish in a few months for good. This is pretty much the end of womans wrestling in Impact Wrestling. Unless someone else comes to power who sees it as a draw expect its continued slow death.

 

[Olan]

I think it is a shame. The thing that set TNA apart fromWWE was they treated their female wrestlers with respect. They were usually involved in 2 or 3e storylines and not just who has the belt. That has slowly been erased over the last few years and it is too bad. The new regime doesn't seem tocare.The KO TAG TITLES are held by a man for pete's sake.

 

[FitFinlay4Life]

TNA isn't giving the Knockouts enough time? For a company with two hours weekly TV time, I think the KOs don't do to bad. The downside is that they don't require a large roster (btw, drop the KO Tag Belt already) and it makes more sense to hold onto the girls who put on the best matches in the ring AND are pretty well known to casual wrestling fans.

On a secondary note, why all the derision for Tessmacher? I think she is improving every week and is already displaying some brilliant athleticism. Let us not forget my WZ compadres that Trish Stratus began her WWF career in a similar vein.

 

[Chrome]

OKay whats going on with the Knockouts?

Nothing...

TBP asked for their release, TNA probably known this for a while.. so why push them? If I recall if you are not going to renew your contract you have to let the company know a head of time so they can plan around it. (I think its 60-90 days depending if you have a title) So just because the dirt sheets report it one day doesn't mean everything happend that day.. not EVERYTHING is told to the public. This seems to be something that has been in the works for a while..

Also Velvet and Sabin are a couple.. with him going to WWE I am sure she wants to follow and played into her desicion and probably thinks she can get her BFF Angelina in there with her.

On another note* I am tired of when ever "X" wrestler wants to leave the company that it becomes a conspiracy plan in TNA according to the IWC.. chill the fuck out... not everything is a conspiracy. In this case the issue seems simple.

 

[Kizzani]

Knockouts are just trying to hard to be wrestlers. They should have remained a sexpot group of girls who wrestle. But now the Knockouts are doing nothing more taking WWE's crap and pushing them to the sky.

 

[whoopin' ass]

i was wondering this myself. the one thing i do think hurts them a little is the fact that virtually every knockout is a former champ. storyline wise, it does make things harder when everyone already has had the title - you can say they want it back but it is not the same as trying to get it for the first time. but i do think the focus just isn't there like it used to be. once, they were so popular that there was talk of doing an all diva show. now, they are lucky to get a match a week. i do think part of it was having EY as the knockout tagteam champ. you need to treat the division with respect and as being important and i think that did some damage to it. but who allowed that storyline to happen? someone thought it would be a good idea. since they don't think very highly of the division, they won't push it. such a shame. right now, we have a knockouts division of really about 5 women compared to about 12 not that long ago.

 

[Ovaltine]

I also don't see Tessmacher as a legit face for the division. She isn't as good as Gail, Tara or James. She doesn't have the personality of an ODB (whos character I don't like at all) and she isn't nearly as hot or as over as Velvet was. The division is slowly dying that's all. Women's wrestling as a wrestling attraction is over.

 

[The Golden Boy]

So far all of you have excellent points. Here's an idea. Lets use the new "Gut Check" more and find more women like they did in last months episode of it. They are a lot of unseen ladies busting their buts in the indys just waiting for a chance to make it big. And it would keep the roster fresh and filled with talent. TNA is doing that in the Xdivision and it's working and I feel it would work with the Knockouts too.

 

[MrHashasheen]

What's going on? They're shaking up the division. We just lost two of the longest standing members, one of whom has done it all on multiple occasions, and the other one is while popular, a horrible wrestler despite wrestling longer than say Rosita or Tessmacher, who are actually better than her.

We've still got:
Tara
Tessmacher
Rosita
Sarita
Mickie James
Winter
Taeler Hendrix
ODB
Madison Rayne

If they kill the Knockout Tag Titles, that's a good singles division to work around, if they give them enough time.

 

[chrisddusombre]

what do you expect man?? They loose their top knockouts in love and sky and now what do we get? Brooke hogan?? I mean seriously WTF it's WCW all over again it's almost like he has the same contract he did in WCW where he had compete creative control over his character only this time he brings in a fail of a singer and puts her in charge of the knockouts? That doesn't even remotely make sense. There is a reason why CSR rarely talks about TNA or Impact Wrestling.

 

[wrestling fan 666]

i was wondering this myself. the one thing i do think hurts them a little is the fact that virtually every knockout is a former champ. storyline wise, it does make things harder when everyone already has had the title - you can say they want it back but it is not the same as trying to get it for the first time. but i do think the focus just isn't there like it used to be. once, they were so popular that there was talk of doing an all diva show. now, they are lucky to get a match a week. i do think part of it was having EY as the knockout tagteam champ. you need to treat the division with respect and as being important and i think that did some damage to it. but who allowed that storyline to happen? someone thought it would be a good idea. since they don't think very highly of the division, they won't push it. such a shame. right now, we have a knockouts division of really about 5 women compared to about 12 not that long ago.

This is what my point of the thread was. Even if you have one KO match a show; look at the wrestlers...REALLY look at them. They aren't happy, they are not hungry for any title; it's like they are sleep walking through. I really hope that someone in creative takes notice. You can't blame the talent for (like the Divas) you can only work so much with 1 match in a 2 hour show. How can you build anything on that?

 

[akathelaw]

All TNA has left in the Knockouts division is some former WWE Divas who need jobs. Tara, Mickie, Winter, ODB and Gail Kim were all given pink slips from Vince before coming over to TNA. The champion is a generic lady who isn't allowed to have a first name thanks to Hogan's daughter, and her biggest accomplishment was playing Bischoff's "sexy secretary."

TNA just doesn't care. It's too hard to get women over, so they don't try. Tessmacher will drop the belt after some time, won't be featured on TV for months and she'll ask for her release just like the rest of them. They could have done a lot with Angelina, Velvet, Daffney, Kong and some of the former Knockouts. The focus got shifted and it's just a way for older Divas to stay on TV after Vince tires of them. Pretty pathetic.

 

[OG Mark]

There seem to be a lot of rumors that TNA wrestlers as a whole are jumping ship - it's not just the KOs. See: Matt Morgan, Alex Shelley (or was it Sabin? Can't remember... anywho), talk of Bully Ray/Devon, AND Love and Sky. Sounds like TNA corporate are asking a lot of people to restructure deals under a "take it or leave it" mentality. Writing on the wall says all it has to about the deals being offered. Don't be surprised if a lot of other big name talent takes the same approach.

It's a damn shame too. The KO division was by far the best in all of wrestling, and not for the eye candy. The women in TNA could put on a true wrestling show as well as some men in other organizations. However, money talks and b-s- walks.

 

[PEP3]

People who are TNA purists recall a time when the company was, honestly, defined by the X-Division and the Knockouts. It took how long before the current TNA creative team realized the impact and value of the X-Division? Unfortunately, while reigniting some excitement for that title and level of competition, the company's commitment to the Knockouts has waned. What a shame!

While I agree 100% with those who have said The Beautiful People made great eye-candy -- they were beautiful -- I never found that story very interesting in and of itself. However, it was the efforts of the other women in the division to wrest the belts from TBP that made things interesting.

Now the best that's being developed for these women is "tension in the ranks" because Brooke Hogan is getting some endorsement deals and leaving others in the cold. This isn't even very interesting. It simply masks TNA's efforts to gain viewers through cross-promoting the women rather than allowing the women to gain fans the old-fashioned way -- by busting their asses in the ring.

To revive the KO Division, get the tag titles off ODB & EY. Return the focus to the in-ring action. Bring in a few fresh faces, who should not be given the KO title any time soon. Allow the veterans to wrestle. Stop introducing stupid WWE-style stipulation matches. Give the ladies ample air time. See how the audiences respond.

There was a time when TNA's highest rated segments were around the ladies. I believe those could be easily recaptured, if the women were given a decent story and opportunity to impress in the ring.

TNA should be doing anything to set themselves apart from the competition. Allowing the women to shine like they'd never get the chance in WWE is a great way to start!

 

[MINISTRYrising]

with how things are in the ko division at the moment tna might as well retire both the ko title and the ko tag title and just keep the knock outs that they have at the moment as managers or valets with them having the odd match know and again.