What makes you not Hall Of Fame material?

[RicSpade]

It was tweeted this week that Chris Benoit would never be considered for the hall of fame because of the infamous double murder suicide of his family, but my question to you is what really makes you not hall of fame material? I mean look at this, Von Erichs had suicides, but all of them are in the HOF, Abdullah has been accused of giving people Hep but still in the hall of fame. Bret Hart for almost a decade blasted the WWE for the screw job, but in the end he got inducted into the hall of fame.
So really who isn't hall of fame material? Is Warrior not going to be inducted now cause he's lost his mind, will Savage never be inducted because he use to run his mouth about Triple H and Stephanie? Will Brutus Beefcake never make it cause he had a drug addiction? Owen Hart because his death was a WWE Tragedy? I mean whether we want to admit it or not as controversial as it may be they will have to acknowledge Chris Benoit at some point in history for the hall of fame just like any other superstar, even if its a decade from now you just cannot deny his mark in history...

 

[justinept]

I don't blame this thread for having minimal activity - but I'll bite on it because there's a lot I have to say on this topic.

CHRIS BENOIT NEARLY DESTROYED THE WRESTLING INDUSTRY. That's why he will NEVER go into the Hall of Fame. There isn't one person in the history of pro wrestling that damaged the industry like Chris Benoit did. So to answer your question ... What makes you not Hall of Fame material? Nearly destroying the industry. That's what.

None of the examples you mentioned are even remotely close to the actions of Chris Benoit. When it was found that he murdered his family - that he killed his son using a crippler cross face - before killing himself, the mainstream media was screaming for the WWE to be shut down.

When a wrestler dies of an overdose - or commits suicide - the mainstream media picks up on it for maybe a day ... maybe two days ... they talk about the number of wrestlers to have died since 1990... And then they forget about it.

When Benoit killed his family, the mainstream media covered that for more than a month. It was the single most damaging incident in the history of pro wrestling -- and yet, you, along with a few other dumbasses on this website, think that his history of having a few good matches more than makes up for it. Really?

In the future, I advise that you either

A) Stop asking if Bret Hart bitching about the WWE is comparable to Chris Benoit murdering his family

OR

B) Seek some serious help from a mental health professional.

 

[asiatic7]

I think what hurts a wrestlers ability to be insrined in the HOF is the politics involved in wrestling now. WWE is a publicly traded company that answers to a board of directors and after the whole Benoit situation, they tried to clean themselves up to appease their share holders. The whole Von Eric suicide saga started in the 80's into the early 90's. Most people who look try their best to damage wrestlings image usually go for high profile stories like Benoit or Vince's 1992 federal trial (steroids).

Those stories made National news. The Von Eric's story was minimal at the time. Bottom line, it's all about protecting the buisness from criticism that's damaging to the brand. They won't induct Benoit because of the impact that the story had NATIONALLY. Those other topics you mentioned were things that weren't so well known (except the Owen tragedy).

Most of the guys not in the HOF who deserve to go don't take the HOF seriously. Bruno was asked, but he has a beef with Vince he won't let go of, same with Warrior. By the way, Warrior isn't crazy. I heard him do a interview on MLW.com, he's just misunderstood.

Anyway it's all about keeping a clean image for investors and Linda's campaign runs.

Good topic. You make some interesting points. It does make WWE seem hypocritical though, right?

 

[alinaroberto]

Some people are born to be in controversies. Their each action become an issue. But the real fighter is the one who comes out to be the best tearing all the bad fame and evolve as a winner.

new york activities for kids for fun and entertainment.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

It's a tough one as there are no fixed criteria for entry in the first place... on the TEW game their equivalent has a list of achievements that you could say "should" translate to the real world. In the real world these might be and some guys who might qualify but aren't in yet:-

Headlining at least 2 of the Traditional "Big 5" shows (Brutus Beefcake, Kevin Nash, Bam Bam Bigelow, Lex Luger)

Winning one or more major titles at Wrestlemania or Summerslam (Davey Boy Smith, Rick Rude, Undertaker, Randy Savage)

Long Service with the company (Undertaker, Mark Henry, Chris Jericho, Triple H, Big Show

"Services" To Wrestling or Sports Entertainment (this is how celebs get in)
Appearing in at least 5 Wrestlemania's (Rick Martel, Matt/Jeff Hardy, The Dudleys, Chris Jericho, Undertaker, Kane, Billy Gunn, Jake Roberts)

Outstanding Contribution/Creativity (The Hardys/Dudleyz/Edge & Christian for the TLC, The Rock, Chris Jericho, Randy Savage, Jake Roberts, The NWO

Of course you'd need perhaps a combination of these to be a "shoe-in" and most if not all to be a headliner.

And of course these criteria are not used... now as to whether anything would disqualify you it's hard to say... Criminal activity is not something that you can use, after all Booker T. was just inducted and spent time in jail for a violent crime. Benoit's heinous as it was is not an automatic ban for me, when Superfly, who has a civil judgement against him for killing a woman is in there.

In reality Benoit won't go in, but they can never say it's because of the murder or some may call them on it in the press... what they can do is "bury" his nomination so far into the future that it's never gonna happen.

 

[Tom]

Benoit sabotaged the entire company for his actions, he murdered his family for crying out loud of course he'd not welcomed to be in the Hall of Fame. Benoit is still in the history books, he's still in the encyclopaedia, so he isn't removed at all. Why would anyone in the right mind want to promote that man? It's bad for business.

The Von Erics do have suicide history, but so do many other wrestlers that are or will be in the hall of fame. They have rich history, oh and aren't murderers.

Personally I see Warrior and Macho been in sometime in the next few years. Vince has forgiven people before, and he'll do it again if it's good for business.

As for Owen, that's his widows decision. To blame his Hall of Fame absence on the company not wanting him in is ludicrous.

The only thing I agree with you on is Abdulah. He doesn't have a right to be there, he was never in the company from my knowledge and he did nothing but trash the hall of fame after he was inducted. "Should've come sooner" f**k that guy.

 

[Mac Attack]

Benoit sabotaged the entire company for his actions, he murdered his family for crying out loud of course he'd not welcomed to be in the Hall of Fame.

So I'm going to be a bit controversial in my post and say that Benoit could theoretically be in the WZ HOF. Now of course what he did was absolutely horrendous and terrible but in the Wrestlezone HOF there shouldn't be any politics. Now of course Benoit would be maybe the 150th guy I'd consider for this Hall of Fame (and that's a random number I don't have a list) but his actions probably shouldn't keep hm out of this HOF. Now let me clarify this with how the way that our HOF is set up that probably would NEVER be considered till about 2042. However if our HOF believes in judging people by wrestling standards and screwing politics which it has already then I think he should be eventually considered but like I said at about 4 a year and with about 20 in already were looking at 2042 for us to consider him.

Now I think NOTHING should keep you out of the HOF. What you do should put you IN the HOF. Out of the ring politics should not effect WZ HOF.

 

[Tom]

So I'm going to be a bit controversial in my post and say that Benoit could theoretically be in the WZ HOF. Now of course what he did was absolutely horrendous and terrible but in the Wrestlezone HOF there shouldn't be any politics. Now of course Benoit would be maybe the 150th guy I'd consider for this Hall of Fame (and that's a random number I don't have a list) but his actions probably shouldn't keep hm out of this HOF. Now let me clarify this with how the way that our HOF is set up that probably would NEVER be considered till about 2042. However if our HOF believes in judging people by wrestling standards and screwing politics which it has already then I think he should be eventually considered but like I said at about 4 a year and with about 20 in already were looking at 2042 for us to consider him.

Now I think NOTHING should keep you out of the HOF. What you do should put you IN the HOF. Out of the ring politics should not effect WZ HOF.

If that's how the WZ Hall of Fame works, then of course he'd end up been considered. With the WWEs stand point on the Hall of Fame, not in a million year will that guys ever be considered, let alone be put in.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

It was tweeted this week that Chris Benoit would never be considered for the hall of fame because of the infamous double murder suicide of his family, but my question to you is what really makes you not hall of fame material?

You kind of answered your own question. Did anyone else you mention kill someone, let alone their own family? Did they get national attention over it for a good portion of a month? Did their actions almost single-handedly ruin the company they worked for?

I highly doubt stars like Randy Savage and Ultimate Warrior are going to never be inducted into the Hall of Fame. The Hall of Fame itself is hyped and sells tickets, so leaving them out is just bad business. And besides, notice how every year they try to throw a big name into the mix? WrestleMania 30 is coming up. I bet my bottom dollar one of those names are getting inducted.

If their actions didn't affect the WWE on a personal level, and if they want to be inducted, they're going in.

As far as WZ Hall of Fame, nothing I can state hasn't already been stated by Mac/iOs.

 

[samhunt391]

Benoit had a fairly good career but I still feel like that there was something missing for him to be in the WWE HoF anyway, I also feel that the WWE are inducting too many people a year, it should be a ballot where 500 people vote and only Legends with over 100 votes being put into the HoF each year.

 

[d_henderson1810]

See, where I have a problem with the HoFs of any sport and character being a criteria (and I agree about keeping Benoit out, BTW) is that a person's actions can stop them going into a HoF, but it doesn't seem to apply to removing someone from a HoF.

For example, O.J. Simpson is in the HoF, despite probably killing two people, as well as other misdemeanours, yet, because he was in the HoF BEFORE he did all this, he stays there. Is that fair?

What if Pete Rose had been inducted into the baseball HoF, and then his gambling confession came years later? Then what?

What if Chris Benoit had been in the WWE HoF already, and then committed the murders? What then? Would he be removed from the HoF? How is that publicized.

If you stop people going in for doing something wrong, then they need to be removed from it as well.

I don't if there is a cycling HoF, but if Lance Armstrong is in it, then he needs to be removed.

Otherwise, it sends the message, be inducted into a HoF, and no matter how bad the crime is that you commit, you remain in the Hall.

You can't be half pregnant. You either add and subtract according to character, or remove that stipulation, and make it purely about their sporting achievements and nothing else.

 

[d_henderson1810]

It was tweeted this week that Chris Benoit would never be considered for the hall of fame because of the infamous double murder suicide of his family, but my question to you is what really makes you not hall of fame material? I mean look at this, Von Erichs had suicides, but all of them are in the HOF, Abdullah has been accused of giving people Hep but still in the hall of fame. Bret Hart for almost a decade blasted the WWE for the screw job, but in the end he got inducted into the hall of fame.
So really who isn't hall of fame material? Is Warrior not going to be inducted now cause he's lost his mind, will Savage never be inducted because he use to run his mouth about Triple H and Stephanie? Will Brutus Beefcake never make it cause he had a drug addiction? Owen Hart because his death was a WWE Tragedy? I mean whether we want to admit it or not as controversial as it may be they will have to acknowledge Chris Benoit at some point in history for the hall of fame just like any other superstar, even if its a decade from now you just cannot deny his mark in history...

Here's another hypothetical.

What if, as unlikely as it is, Chris Benoit's case is reopened, and new evidence shows that Chris Benoit COULD NOT HAVE murdered Nancy and Daniel, and the cops got it wrong. It has happened before.

In this scenario, what would happen if Benoit is exhonarted? If he was found not to have done these crimes, can he now go in the HoF?

Furthermore, would the pressure be more to put Benoit in, since he is an innocent man wrong accused (remember, we are still playing hypothetical)? Wouldn't the WWE be under more pressure from media and the public to "right a wrong" and it would be a "make good" induction? If he was still not put in, would it be bad PR?

(Note, I don't want an argument about how you think Benoit is guilty. I am only asking a hypothetical if it ever, even a 1% chance, happened. Would this change things?)

 

[Bythedockofthebay]

Here's another hypothetical.

What if, as unlikely as it is, Chris Benoit's case is reopened, and new evidence shows that Chris Benoit COULD NOT HAVE murdered Nancy and Daniel, and the cops got it wrong. It has happened before.

In this scenario, what would happen if Benoit is exhonarted? If he was found not to have done these crimes, can he now go in the HoF?

Furthermore, would the pressure be more to put Benoit in, since he is an innocent man wrong accused (remember, we are still playing hypothetical)? Wouldn't the WWE be under more pressure from media and the public to "right a wrong" and it would be a "make good" induction? If he was still not put in, would it be bad PR?

(Note, I don't want an argument about how you think Benoit is guilty. I am only asking a hypothetical if it ever, even a 1% chance, happened. Would this change things?)

Well on the 1 percent chance he didn't do it, with the mental problems he was having and being murdered. They'd put him in the next day. That said I really don't want to argue guilt or innocents but I don't think that'll ever happen.

 

[Bythedockofthebay]

See, where I have a problem with the HoFs of any sport and character being a criteria (and I agree about keeping Benoit out, BTW) is that a person's actions can stop them going into a HoF, but it doesn't seem to apply to removing someone from a HoF.

For example, O.J. Simpson is in the HoF, despite probably killing two people, as well as other misdemeanours, yet, because he was in the HoF BEFORE he did all this, he stays there. Is that fair?

He was found innocent and people were still talking about pushing him out of the HOF.

What if Pete Rose had been inducted into the baseball HoF, and then his gambling confession came years later? Then what?

Baseball is the harshest of sports when it comes to that stuff, so yeah I think he'd be put. Just a guess though.

What if Chris Benoit had been in the WWE HoF already, and then committed the murders? What then? Would he be removed from the HoF? How is that publicized.

Benoit would be like he is now. Not mentioned hidden from and any memory of him would be erased from the HOF.

If you stop people going in for doing something wrong, then they need to be removed from it as well.

I don't if there is a cycling HoF, but if Lance Armstrong is in it, then he needs to be removed.

Agreed.

Otherwise, it sends the message, be inducted into a HoF, and no matter how bad the crime is that you commit, you remain in the Hall.

You can't be half pregnant. You either add and subtract according to character, or remove that stipulation, and make it purely about their sporting achievements and nothing else.

But I don't think any example can be given of a guy like that ATM. OJ is the closest and you can't get ride of a guy because he was found not guilty of a heinous crime, and found guilty of lesser charges for something else. I don't expect Tom Brady to be cast out if he robs a liquor store. Yeah, it won't be great but still he's a HOFer and that won't do harm to the overall sport, like OJ and Benoit did.

So I'm going to be a bit controversial in my post and say that Benoit could theoretically be in the WZ HOF. Now of course what he did was absolutely horrendous and terrible but in the Wrestlezone HOF there shouldn't be any politics. Now of course Benoit would be maybe the 150th guy I'd consider for this Hall of Fame (and that's a random number I don't have a list) but his actions probably shouldn't keep hm out of this HOF. Now let me clarify this with how the way that our HOF is set up that probably would NEVER be considered till about 2042. However if our HOF believes in judging people by wrestling standards and screwing politics which it has already then I think he should be eventually considered but like I said at about 4 a year and with about 20 in already were looking at 2042 for us to consider him.

Now I think NOTHING should keep you out of the HOF. What you do should put you IN the HOF. Out of the ring politics should not effect WZ HOF.

Honestly, I don't think Benoit deserves to be in the HOF without those murders on his head. Not WWE not here, now the WWE standards are so low that I could've seen it, but honestly in the WZ HOF I'd be highly disappointed, and when you're saying 150 guys comes before I think you're a little light on that list just for the fact that he didn't have the career most of us would be looking for. He's not close. Take into account the fact that WWE is basically using there guys, and we have a much deeper poll to pull from I'd like to think that Chris will never be in the WZ HOF

 

[TheHitMark-SirJoseOle]

In regards to the WWE Hall Of Fame, what makes you not a candidate is if you are not on good terms with Vince McMahon for whatever reason, or the families of potential posthumous candidates don't want their loved one inducted for whatever reason, be it acrimony like Martha Hart, or Lanny Poffo's claims that Randy Savage didn't want a solo induction. Now before all you people go and accuse Lanny of saying that wasn't Randy's wish, it very well could have been so, there are rumors that per Randy Savage's contractual demands/requests when he jumped ship to WCW, that his father Angelo Poffo be inducted into WCW's Hall Of Fame, I don't know how much truth there is to that, but at the same time, it very well could be.

Also, the Chris Benoit thing goes without saying, anyone that commits a heinous act is likely to be denied induction.