What is the one thing Hardcore Justice is Missing?

[Kenny Powers]

The following names have been confirmed for the TNA Hardcore Justice PPV
-Tommy Dreamer
-Mick Foley
-Rob Van Dam
-Team 3D
-Raven
-Rhino
-Stevie Richards
-Simon Diamond
-Al Snow
-Axl Rotten
-Johnny Swinger

There is great possibility that other ECW Originals like Sandman, Sabu, Axl Rotten, and even Justin Credible could appear. Jerry Lynn is pretty much confirmed to be in the main event against RVD.

Other names like Shane Douglas, Tajiri, Lance Storm, Roadkill, SuperCrazy, Mikey Whipwreck, and Steve Corino have turned down the invitation to appear. Paul Heyman is another source that is highly unlikely to appear.

I read a great article by Jason Powell at PROWRESTLING.NET
http://www.prowrestling.net/artman/publish/powellsblog/article10013268.shtml

To sum up the article he says that Hardcore Justice is basically a bust without the original ECW fans. The TNA fans in the Impact Zone are basic ECW fan wannabes. Take for instance One Night Stand in 2005 and 2006. Even though it was a WWE PPV with WWE superstars, the event was held in the heartland of ECW. Both events were held in the Hammerstein Ballroom in New York city.

The last thing you think about when you think of ECW is Orlando Florida or the Impact Zone. Would this PPV be better if it were held in New York or Philadelphia instead of the Impact Zone? Is that the primary thing this PPV is missing, or is there more?

 

[bigbadwolf2010]

this ecw thing is just an embarrasment.. im ashamed to be a tna fan right now.....it seems like it will be so much worse than the last stand in 2005...

 

[The Holy One]

It's missing a lot of key wrestlers that made ECW such as Lance Storm, Shane Douglas, Bam Bam Bigelow and Mike Awesome (may they R.I.P.), Mikey Whipwreck, New Jack, The Pitbulls, and of course Paul Heyman and Joey Styles. Although the key piece, is the one you mentioned. Hardcore Justice needs the ECW environment. Tampa, Florida isn't that place. WWE had the right idea holding both ONS in the heart of ECW land, the Hammerstein Ballroom. TNA won't have that same luxury and in the end it will hurt them.

 

[DangerousDave]

In the Impact Zone when these e c dub guys are out there a "Sabu" chant always breaks out, so he is the man they need to complete the last piece of the puzzle.

 

[sTyLnK]

It's missing the right time frame. No one cares about this junk. Yeah there going to go all out and fans will chant ECW all night long and for what? A chance to do it up one last time? Give me a break. It's embarrassing to every single wrestler participating that night. Everyone is past their prime. A shell of their former selves. If they think they can go crazy hardcore for one night and people will think it's "cool". I don't think so. It's not cool and it's not fun to watch.

 

[Tenta]

Why do I feel like a broken record on these forums? Or, better yet, why does no one listen to me?

This is what I've been saying for the past two months about this whole ECW Angle. As a matter of fact, here's me, about a month and a half ago;

Look, I can rattle off names until the third Saturday in October. My point is, simply, that TNA has none of the good workers of ECW left with them. Storm has no chance of coming, Jericho and Rey aren't walking through them doors, and Eddie and Chris... You get my point. With the idea TNA is going through, it's turning what (in spoilers) sounded awesome into something I'm thoroughly dissapointed for, because they can't bring in the good workers

I mean, how hard is it folks? No Tajiri, no Super Crazy, Probably not Justin Credible. What made eCW so good for so many years were the workers they could bring in, the ones that actually put on great matches. We don't even have a sign of that here. Instead, we have workers past their prime, who just don't have it. I like the Simon Diamond addition, would like it more if he weren't an agent, and love Lynn. Either than there, and I'm going to say this just so everyone fuckig hears me.

Where the fuck are the good workers?

I've been saying this for months. Why is this such a shock now?

 

[T Dub EPT]

Let me first say that i enjoy having TNA around right now because more wrestling companies means more wrestling on TV. We are close to having wrestling every night of the week and that makes me happy... However all this ECW "reunion" show PPV is, is an excuse to have a bloodbath. Thats the only way to salvage anything out of this situation. I respect everything the "originals" have/will/and do contribute to the wrestling world but none of these guys were known for their stellar moveset or athleticism. Hardcore Justice will be a brutal bloody shell of what ECW was with none of the substance. So many people whine and cry about the no blood rule in WWE, but to have a bloodbath just because you can is tacky, lame, and lazy. To those "wrestling" fans that cry about PG ratings and no blood rules but love brutality mixed with silliness, enjoy. For the rest of us... well we sigh as TNA is sadly in need of direction because on this path... we will lose yet another promotion. Oh and by the way i am WWF/E loyal but a fan of all wrestling succeeding.

but this is just one mans opinion -TDub

 

[Captain Jive]

I agree that Orlando doesn't really seem like an ECW place, but what it's truly missing is Paul Heyman. Without his direction, the company never would've survived as long as it did. Many promotions have tried to copy what they thought made ECW so big, but failed. Companies like CZW and 3PW took hardcore to a stupid level (sorry but Nick Mondo jumping off of a roof and weedeaters do not excite me). To me hardcore never meant just blood, fire, and weapons, it was about them being the only company around at the time where it was possible to see excellent matches from the bottom all the way up. Because of Heyman, they used a perfect blend of all types of matches and for a while, it really worked.

 

[wushady]

This show is going to be a disaster in my opinion. There's going to be no Heyman, Styles, and wrestlers like Lance Storm and Shane Douglas. I don't see the point of doing a ECW show without them especially Heyman. The fact they will be in Orlando is a huge negative too. The fans were a major part of ECW. I doubt many of the TNA fans ever saw the original ECW when it was around.

 

[Krobra]

The PPV will certainly be a disaster, there is no doubt in my mind. You can't do an ECW PPV with only 12 names. You are missing major components the WWE had and did right the first time. 1. WWE use Paul Heyman, the founder of ECW. This guy is a genius and he is a great addition to the creative team or anything he wants to do. 2. WWE used the birthplace of ECW to do the reunion. This had a two prong effect. You had the ECW fans attending live, and you hosted the PPV where ECW had its lineage. That in itself made the PPV more special. 3. You had more ECW names like Sabu, Sandman, Terry Funk, RVD, and other names. You also had Sabu face Rey Mysterio for the World Heavyweight title that ended in no contest, and you had RVD defeat John Cena, the face of the company for the WWE Championship. Two good matches, and you had RVD defeat John Cena for the top prize in WWE. He is also the only one to ever cash in Money in the Bank with the opponent knowing it was coming. And two days later, RVD was crowned ECW World Champion and he held both WWE and ECW Titles. One Night Stand in 2005 will be ten times better than what TNA will try to pull.

 

[covieo81]

I agree this ppv is gonna be a disaster. Strike 2 for tna. What is this ppv missing? How bout tna mgt minds? All these guys are way past their primes and aren't gonna deliver. I guess if u don't mind just watchin to see some blood than go for it. Imo this is gonna flop and flop bad. Too bad too cuz tna has the talent to take them places unfortunately the peeps that make decisions are partially ******ed and seems like they have a want for failure.

 

[Captain Jive]

I agree this ppv is gonna be a disaster. Strike 2 for tna. What is this ppv missing? How bout tna mgt minds? All these guys are way past their primes and aren't gonna deliver. I guess if u don't mind just watchin to see some blood than go for it. Imo this is gonna flop and flop bad. Too bad too cuz tna has the talent to take them places unfortunately the peeps that make decisions are partially ******ed and seems like they have a want for failure.

I loved TNA from the beginning but they really have dropped the ball lately so I disagree with your statement, they haven't gone partially ******ed, they have gone completely ******ed. They have all the talent in the world and they piss all over them to make room for guys that had their time 10 years ago. I used to be a huge Raven fan, but now I cant even stand looking at him. They should pull their heads out of their asses and be the company that got them the fans that they have now.

 

[shafe_41]

What is the one thing it's missing? Simple. Something interesting. TNA was doing an amazing job about 2 years ago at booking quality matches and decent storylines. Up until about 3 weeks after they tried to go live on Mondays, they've just totally shit the bed and gave up. They're trying to quick fix themselves some ratings. Its as simple as that. These washed up ECW stars (which I'm sure some can still work pretty well) are not going to be what the company needs. They need to offer something... SOMETHING that the WWE can not offer. That's an edgier QUALITY program. I'm sorry, but bringing in these guys that had their time 10-15 years ago is NOT going to get you anywhere. All that's doing is holding back the younger talent, which will get older and less effective as time goes on. The longer you hold them back for Hall, Nash, the Nasty Boys, Flair, etc... the more your company is going to shit the bed.

What they need is something innovative. Get 10-15 wrestling fans together to run the storylines for that company and it will get interesting. Hell, make that a contest. Five lucky (but qualified) fans can write the storylines for a year and make things interesting. Anything. Like the above poster said, they have all the talent in the world and piss all over them for guys like Flair, Nash, etc... I do believe Hogan and Bischoff have ideas. But I believe Paul Heyman has more ideas. Better ideas. Pay Mr. Paul E. Dangerously the money he wants, take a risk, and get that man. Paul Heyman will lead you to the promised land. Right now, a dead cat could lead TNA to the promised land.

 

[the_whole_f'n_show]

TNA has dropped the ball! Why wouldn't you try to return to the bingo hall that started it all! The Arena still holds some of the best independent wrestling events today (ROH, Evolve, and Chikara Pro [just to name a few]) ! The whole thing just feels so rushed! Why not build up the buzz. The fact the Franchise might not be there, kills it for me. It needs Styles for it to succeed. I just hope they surprise me. I have been to ECW events everywhere from Philly to Buffalo, I understand WHY they are doing it. I just hope they don't further damage the ECW legacy. Would be great to see the Dudleys wear the tie dyed ONE LAST NIGHT. Will Taz have one more match with Sabu?? Doubt it, but it would be worth it for me.

 

[daddyJ_t]

besides whats already been said bout philly and paul e, also adding to the deceased list, is chris candio. what about bringing francine or ms. conginiality(lita) to do a one night fued with the knockouts, or the B.W.O. for comic relief. i didnt watch alot of original e.c.dub. but i know enough to comment on some of the stuff they did that i liked. whipwreck signed with wwe as a devopemental trainer so no on him, styles works on wwe.com, so same for him.scsa is doin films with the e so nope. wheres balls?
i do hope that the pope renews his fued with the originals after the whole new breed thing. angle would be good considering he snubbed the original ecw to sign with the big e. and this has been bothering me for a while, whats up with abyss pulling a perry saturn with his mop routine? my girl janis? give me a break, now tna is copying wwes lame gimmicks now?

 

[Reddannihilation]

Why do I feel like a broken record on these forums?

Because you always say the same things.

Or, better yet, why does no one listen to me?

Me personally, I tend not to listen to you because you've been wrong plenty of times and never acknowledged it. Case in point your thread bitching about continuity regarding Raven and Dreamer.

Where the fuck are the good workers?

I've been saying this for months. Why is this such a shock now?

They haven't announced everyone they've signed so far, they still have time. If the PPV occurs and it's terrible then I'll listen to you, but I'm not going to just jump on the idea that it can't be entertaining because a few people think it.

 

[WhyTravisFelt]

What is the ONE thing they are missing? Hard to pick just one, I'd lean towards Paul Heyman maybe just a little bit more than the old ECW arena or Hammerstein, but it's pretty close.

It wouldn't be as depressing though if they were only missing a few things, right now there's a lot that needs to be worked on. Whipwreck, Storm, and Corino have already turned down the offer. It really shouldn't be too hard to get Tajiri, Guido, and Super Crazy to show up for their famous (nearly weekly it seemed back then) triple-threat match, but who knows.

All in all, it seems like a waste of time for TNA. I loved ECW, but we don't need half of an ECW show out of the middle of nowhere when the storylines are already unintelligible as it is. Is this a one-off thing or an invasion? If it isn't an invasion, than what was Abyss talking about? Sting, Jarrett, Nash, Hogan, Bischoff, are we supposed to stop paying attention to whatever mysterious storyline they've been teasing for months to focus on this now? Why did Tommy Dreamer totally shoot on Lethal and Flair being a work in his promo last week? Did he kill that storyline? Will Lethal be joining Fourtune or are we supposed to forget Tommy Dreamer said that ("What Terry Funk did for me and Mick Foley is like what Flair is doing for Lethal" was the comment, for the record)? Ehh, it just doesn't seem like it's a mess they can go presto, and work it into something fantastic and interesting, it's seems like the kind of mess that's only going to get worse the more time you spend trying to do something with instead of just sweeping under the rug and starting over. Mind you, I'm one of those guys that gets labelled a TNA mark half the time I post on one of these, but this is how I feel this time.

 

[Ruthless-RKO]

It's missing a lot of names like Tajiri, Sabu etc.. and the only other BIG NAME missing is:

This guy is the voice...and there is no way he will be at the event...its really unlucky for TNA that he is working for WWE!!

 

[Chauncy Talon]

this ecw thing is just an embarrasment.. im ashamed to be a tna fan right now.....it seems like it will be so much worse than the last stand in 2005...

TNA is going down the toilet hole. Think of it. It's only 1 year and TNA is trying to get ECW back on it feet, which WWE couldn't do. Man throw this out on the curb for the trashmen to pick up. This is some of the most utterly stupid things ever. Why would you want to see these guys preform at this day an age.

Go and Watch WWE 24/7 to watch E.V 2.0 on ECW. Man this shit is pathetic.

One thing that missing from this event is... 10 years.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Aside from the entire concept being a bad idea to begin with, it just becomes more and more apparent that this is an obvious attempt by TNA to make some money off of the ECW brand. To hear Hulk Hogan and Eric Bischoff singing the praises of ECW last Thursday was wretched. I've never heard anything out of Hogan in the past to suggest he was ever a fan of ECW and Eric Bishoff HATED, I mean he outright HATED, ECW.

Aside from missing a few key names, especially Paul Heyman, this show doesn't seem to have the "spirit" of ECW behind it. If TNA is going to put on the show is along the same lines as the Abyss/Tommy Dreamer match last Thursday, then this will easily be the worst ppv of the year. The match was extremely slow and plodding, Dreamer could barely move and a lot of the ECW wrestlers that will be appearing in the show are in about the same physical condition as Dreamer himself.

It's impossible to whittle it down to "one thing" that Hardcore Justice is missing when it has so many things going against it already

 

[Storm4life]

What is the one thing it's missing? Simple. Something interesting. TNA was doing an amazing job about 2 years ago at booking quality matches and decent storylines. Up until about 3 weeks after they tried to go live on Mondays, they've just totally shit the bed and gave up. They're trying to quick fix themselves some ratings. Its as simple as that. These washed up ECW stars (which I'm sure some can still work pretty well) are not going to be what the company needs. They need to offer something... SOMETHING that the WWE can not offer. That's an edgier QUALITY program. I'm sorry, but bringing in these guys that had their time 10-15 years ago is NOT going to get you anywhere. All that's doing is holding back the younger talent, which will get older and less effective as time goes on. The longer you hold them back for Hall, Nash, the Nasty Boys, Flair, etc... the more your company is going to shit the bed.

What they need is something innovative. Get 10-15 wrestling fans together to run the storylines for that company and it will get interesting. Hell, make that a contest. Five lucky (but qualified) fans can write the storylines for a year and make things interesting. Anything. Like the above poster said, they have all the talent in the world and piss all over them for guys like Flair, Nash, etc... I do believe Hogan and Bischoff have ideas. But I believe Paul Heyman has more ideas. Better ideas. Pay Mr. Paul E. Dangerously the money he wants, take a risk, and get that man. Paul Heyman will lead you to the promised land. Right now, a dead cat could lead TNA to the promised land.

Thank you Shafe_41. I am personally enjoying the thought of letting the fans (qualified, as you said) write the storylines. At this point, they could do a hell of a lot better. One of TNA's major issues is their "creative team" isn't very creative. They use recycled storylines, along with recycled wrestlers and put it out their like it's their own. Which is understandable considering they're recycled themselves from other promotions. Meanwhile, their own very talented wrestlers are left standing around doing nothing. Dixie says she listens to the fans? Not from where I'm standing, but she should really start. Now to answer the question, "What is the one thing HardCORE Justice is missing?", the actual TNA roster.

 

[The Aussie Invasion]

Paul Heyman will lead you to the promised land. Right now, a dead cat could lead TNA to the promised land.

That may be the funniest (But most true) thing I've seen in these forums.

TNA doesn't just need Paul Heyman, They FUCKING MUST HAVE Paul Heyman for HardCORE Justice to have a 0.1% of a chance to succeed and not be a bigger waste of time than the WNBA.

I haven't watched a full episode of iMPACT since mid 2008, I've flicked the channel over and watch about 20 minutes of it since then, But ever since the likes of; Hogan, Flair and Bischoff have come in, TNA has gone to shit!

Now TNA are just using WWE storylines like 2 weeks after WWE finishes with it.

TNA PLEASE GET/DO SOMETHING ORIGINAL! HardCORE Justice HAS BEEN DONE BEFORE! (One Night Stand 2005/06 Anybody?) AN INVASION HAS BEEN DONE BEFORE! (The year 2001 ring any bells?) BRINGING IN A TONNE OF HUGE NAMES HAS BEEN DONE BEFORE! (Remember World Championship Wrestling?)

Bottom line is Paul Heyan MADE ECW what it was, And without Paul Heyman, HardCORE Justice is bound to fail!

 

[Tenta]

Because you always say the same things.

Says the TNA mark who really needs to get off his delusions.

Me personally, I tend not to listen to you because you've been wrong plenty of times and never acknowledged it. Case in point your thread bitching about continuity regarding Raven and Dreamer.

Which was never answered at the time, still feels really forced, and probably won't have an eighth of the emotion that it should have. What was the point of bringing them in a stable, if they were going to fight? It'd just been better to bring them back individually. So yeah, not following you there. On the other hand, I believe it wasd in the Montreal Screwjob debate where I proved just how shit you really are.

They haven't announced everyone they've signed so far, they still have time. If the PPV occurs and it's terrible then I'll listen to you, but I'm not going to just jump on the idea that it can't be entertaining because a few people think it.

Have you seen the names? It's TNA Employees, Jerry Lynn, maybe Sandman, maybe Sabu, and that's it. I don't see where the entertainment of a wrestling program is without at least having wrestling. ECW had weapons, but it also had fantastic workers to make sure the fans were satisfied.

TNA? All they have right now is the weapons. Pardon me as I contain my excitement

 

[red ass skull muhfukkah]

Hardcore Justice needs a fucking Delorian, so TNA can go back in time 5 or 6 years ago, when people actually gave a shit about ECW, when the performers weren't over 40, and when the idea hadn't been beaten to fucking death.

There is no reason for this PPV to exist, it's going to be nothing but a failure and a complete waste of a PPV. The only good things that will cpme out of this is we get the original Hard Justice PPV for free, RVD and Jerry Lynn is at least interesting but I doubt it will hold a candle to the match they put on 10-11 years ago. And last but certainly not least, maybe Tommy Dreamer, Sandman, Raven and all these ECW has beens will finally get the picture and fuck off.

 

[aphazel1]

The ECW themed HardCORE Justice is the coolest thing that TNA has done in about 2 years, but I would suggest that there are a couple of things missing. First, Paul Heymen. Althought I don't think they'll be able to land a deal with him, he would definitely make the night have a more authentic feel. Second, I'd also like to see Tazz have some other role than just an announcer...maybe he could do a run in on a match or be a manager like he did in the Main Event Mafia. He was one of my favorite ECW stars and I would love to see him involved in a storyline one more time.
Third, I'd like to see some TNA stars worked into the mix...not just ECW vs. ECW matches. For instance, Brian Kendrick versus Sabu would be pretty sweet....