What if...your favourite superstar had done a "Benoit"?

[d_henderson1810]

This isn't a discussion on the ins and outs of the Benoit murder case.

However, I wonder what would the reaction had been, if, instead of Benoit committing such a horrendous crime, if you would be angry if your favourite superstar had done it to his family.

I think that, with Chris Benoit, he was respected, but never loved by fans. He wasn't great on the mike. He wasn't a top guy (except for one year). He was more the journeyman, the veteran who had plied his trade in all the major wrestling companies. He was the guy who could be relied upon for a great match with anyone, but rarely had any effort put into his storylines, when he wasn't being pushed.

It was easy for WWE to pretend to ignore Benoit after the murders, since he was someone often relegated to the background anyway.

But, what if it had been "Stone Cold", the Undertaker,Hulk Hogan, The Rock, Ric Flair, Triple H or higher-profile and much loved superstar who had killed his own family. How would you feel if Daniel Bryan or Dolph Ziggler did it?

Here are some questions:-

1) In this scenario, how would WWE act? Would they be as quick to erase DVDs with them on it? Would it be a more difficult task, because of their enormous impact on wrestling?

2) How would the fans feel? The fans were disgusted that Benoit did this, but, if one of your favourites had done this to their family, would your investment and connection to them be drastically affected, and how?

I think, as much as they don't condone Benoit's actions either, Vince would be relieved that it wasn't a bigger star and more high profile guy, who is a massive name in the industry, who may even have mainstream appeal. How would he pretend the superstar didn't exist then?

Also, Benoit never went into the HoF. Fair enough. But if a superstar who was already in had done it, would they remove him from the HoF? O.J. is still in the NFL HoF, so would WWE remove someone who committed such a crime?

 

[MWRedskins]

firstly, i'm not a fan of this "what if" because of how bad this "what if" is, but to me it's simple, if one of my favorite wrestlers did what Benoit did, i would want them to get the Benoit treatment where they aren't in the HOF (or they get kicked out) and aren't mentioned and have no dvd sales after the fact either.

 

[Navi]

If any wrestler I don't care who they are, how famous, how important did what Benoit did, then they should be shot and pissed on and not in that order.

It doesn't or shouldn't matter who the person is to anyone, murder is murder, plain and simple. And I believe the reason OJ is still in the NFL Hall of Fame is because he was never convicted of the murders he was accused of. Had he actually been convicted, I'm sure they would have removed him.

I'm actually quite stunned that these questions even had to be asked in the first place.

 

[Kashagi]

If any wrestler I don't care who they are, how famous, how important did what Benoit did, then they should be shot and pissed on and not in that order.

Exactly this.

Benoit actually was my favourite wrestler for quite a few years. Wrestlemania XX was the first pay per view I ever ordered and it was primarily for Benoit.

I'll say that having my favourite wrestler do something so evil turned me off wrestling for a very long time. I refused to watch it for years and even now only really tune in for major events. My opinion on Benoit is forever tarnished and I can't really watch his matches anymore knowing what he will go on to do.

No matter who did it, Hogan, Austin, The Rock etc. I would expect the same treatment and believe that the WWE would go into damage control in exactly the same manner as they did with Benoit.

 

[Prince Vee]

Yes I agree with the others too. it doesn't matter whoever that wrestler is I still wouldn't have just a pity for him in my heart and will hate him but only if there's a strong proof that it was him who committed those homicides!

There are lot of contradictual debates going around Chris Benoit's case even when police confirmed it was him who committed a double homicide and a suicide. So I still have a respect for him for his skills nothing else!

And certainly WWE would've done the same they'll just act like the star doesn't exist even if its anyone. Just a slap by Del Rio and now he never exists and they Pretended like CM Punk never existed for a long while and even before Raw Reunion they suspended Kevin Nash's Legends contract because his son filed a law suit against him!

So it doesn't matter who it is, both the WWE and his fans would treat the same!

Cheers!!

 

[ilapierre]

Funny how so many 'classy' and 'righteous' posters here have such a hard time answering simple questions honestly. As much as I don't like the topic, I have to admit this is quite a thought provoking thread. My favourite all time wrestler is Randy Savage. My first reaction was that there is no way I would never not be his greatest fan had he pulled a 'Benoit'. He was too amazing over his 25 years in wrestling to be remembered by one horrible, life ending action. But then I got to thinking just how awful it was for Benoit to kill his wife and young son. My next reaction was that I would possibly live in denial about it and believe some other conspiracy theory rather than face the brutal truth. A lot of Americans to this day live in complete denial over what happened on 9-11 so perhaps I'd go down that same route. I really don't know how I'd deal with the cognitive dissonance of knowing something so awful about somebody so full of integrity I admired my whole life. I can only really think of one thing that was remotely similar and that was when video tapes were released years ago of Hulk Hogan visiting his son Nick in jail. Hogan can be heard reminding Nick that although he was the driver, it was in fact his friend's fault and God's plan that he was now a vegetable. I lost all my respect for this American coward I had grown up idolizing. My hero Savage hated him too. No wonder. However, I've come back around and have forgiven Hogan for his disgusting words. I am not Hogan's judge. Although I despise those who murder, I truly believe people do and say things they don't mean and probably wish they could take back if they had the chance. And most of these people didn't have traumatic brain injuries like Benoit did.

It's safe to say that no matter how despicable Benoit's actions were, he had become to some degree mentally handicapped due to a career spent delivering finishing move, money shot flying headbutts with no insurance because Scrooge McMahon only cared about using easily replaceable meatheads to make him billions of dollars. Anyone with a healthy, undamaged brain can deduct that McMahon is partly responsible for Benoit's mental deterioration. And it was that deterioration that led to the Benoit family murders. So then why do all us posters turn a blind eye to this fact and still support a company that doesn't provide some sort of basic health care protection for it's amazing entertainers? The answer. Cognitive dissonance. We don't want to hear it.

Now to answer the questions. How would WWE act if say Shawn Michaels killed himself and his family? Who knows? I guess it would depend on whether or not he definitely did it. If it was definitive, then yes he would be erased just like Benoit. It would have more to do with company image than it would penalizing Shawn's legacy for one last bad life decision. Of course it would be a near impossible task to wipe Shawn off the record. But in time it could be done so that future generations of wrestling fans would know very little about the man and his accomplishments. 2) How would the fans feel? They'd probably feel the same way they do about Benoit. There were some hardcore Benoit fans who hate the guy to this day and then there are others who say they can separate the wrestler they loved watching in the ring from the man who killed his family. I was never really a big Benoit fan and his personality always made me sleepy. So nothing much has changed there. 3) Wrestler would be automatically removed from HOF. Of course!

One last thing. As much as I hated Benoit for what happened, I have come to find it within myself to forgive him because he was obviously a tortured soul. My heart hurts when I see pictures of him with his son during happier times. I have a wife and son myself and the mere thought of something so horrific happening to either of them makes me beyond sick to my stomach. The years of physical abuse and mental deterioration with no paid health plan nor insurance really is the thing here with Benoit that is deplorable. You could almost forgive the McMahon family EXCEPT they have done everything in their power since to fight calls for regulations..They've done this by conveniently changing the word wrestler to entertainer and putting Linda into politics to block wrestler rights. Just look at all the dead middle aged wrestlers. Is it only their own fault for juicing, popping pain pills and damaging their bodies 250-300 days a year? Or is it a bit their bosses' fault too for caring more about becoming rich at their expense? And is it also a bit our faults too for following a company that cares so little about its employees? Sometimes it's the hard questions in a thread like this that need to be asked and answered no matter how unclassy some righteous, unthinking fool deems them to be.
So kudos to the OP.

 

[Wrestlingaholic]

First off, from the WWE's point of view, if a Hogan or Austin committed the Benoit crimes then there would be no network, and very little reminiscing of the 80s or Attitude Era, the two WWE peaks. I dare say that if one of the top faces in history did it, the WWE would be even more child-friendly and less risqué today.

Going off topic, but replying directly to this thread, Ilapiere is essentially blaming Vince McMahon for the Benoit crimes as well as numerous wrestler deaths. Can we stop this character assassination of McMahon, please? First off, people don't seem to complain when you're watching the show - how many people watched Benoit perform his headbut and thought, "wow he'll suffer major head trains in the future!"? And how many popped for the move? Secondly, there are barely any wrestlers who only fought for WWE; the vast majority started elsewhere, including Benoit. Did Benoit only perform diving headbuts in WWE? Did he only receive chair shots in WWE? No, he was doing the same in WCW, ECW, NJPW and more, LONG before joining WWE. So how exactly is it Vince's fault?

As for wrestler deaths, it admittedly isn't a great record when you can watch, say, the 1990 Survivor Series, and realise that over a quarter of the featured wrestlers are no longer with us. But again, why blame Vince specifically? Did they all die due to steroids? No (Savage, Bravo and Perfect to name but 3); again, did they only wrestle for Vince? What of the likes of Gino Hernandez, or 3 of the 4 deceased Von Erichs? Or Bobby Duncum Junior? People who all died far too young but NEVER wrestled for Vince. Is that his fault too? You don't realise how uniformed and bitter you sound when you blame Vince McMahon for the deaths of dozens of people.

Anyway, back on topic...

 

[Navi]

Funny how so many 'classy' and 'righteous' posters here have such a hard time answering simple questions honestly. As much as I don't like the topic, I have to admit this is quite a thought provoking thread.

Really, I thought most people answered the questions honestly. I did. I would be disgusted as hell if anyone doesn't matter who they are did what Benoit did. How is that being "righteous". Sorry but I don't condone murder of a woman and an innocent child.

Have you read the details of the case, do you even know what happened? If you did then you might not be trying to blame the WWE for his head injuries. Which by the way was never proven as the reason for what happened. Fans just jumped on that as a reason to try to exonerate his behaviour that weekend.

The bottom line is the man killed his wife and a day later killed his son, then he killed himself. There is only two ways you can come down on this topic, either you agree with what he did, or you don't. I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who agrees with Chris Benoit killing his family. And if it were Hulk Hogan, Daniel Bryan or anyone else on the roster past or present, who did the same thing, fans wouldn't agree with it either.

Sometimes fame can be a double edged sword. If Benoit wasn't a famous wrestler, the story would have made the front page of his local paper, as it is it affected a whole industry for a time.

 

[Hollywood Naitch]

No, my reaction would be exactly the same if one of my favourite wrestlers had commitment the evils acts that Chris Benoit did, and I think almost every fan would say the same.

I'd react in the same way if one of my favourite actors, football players and musicians killed their family..why wouldn't I? Just because I am a fan of theirs it doesnt change what they did. I'd be disgusted, and my opinion of that person would be forever changed, and rightfully so.

 

[MartialHorror]

I'd probably turn against them.

While I try to stay away from my favorite wrestlers personal lives, as most probably have dirt under their sheets, sometimes their actions stand out and piss me off. I was a big Jesse Venture fan, but when he sued the widow of that "American Sniper" guy not long after his death, I was disgusted. Even if the sniper had lied about the incident, that just seemed petty.

So if my favorite murdered anyone, I don't see why I'd give them a pass. I'm surprised that WWE promoted Snuka for as long as they did.

 

[Mustang Sally]

But, what if it had been "Stone Cold", the Undertaker,Hulk Hogan, The Rock, Ric Flair, Triple H or higher-profile and much loved superstar who had killed his own family.

Actually, that's an interesting question. How in the world would WWE be able to "ignore" or "erase" the accomplishments of the people you mention? Can you imagine attempting to expunge Hulk Hogan from the WWE record books? Can you fathom what the WWE network's library would look like if they eliminated all footage of the man in question? I shudder to think.

For myself, although I recognize that political correctness requires us to not speak the name Chris Benoit except to damn him, I don't see the need to pretend the man never existed in WWE and WCW circles. I don't believe in this retroactive type of elimination, pretending he was never there. I enjoyed the stuff he did in pro wrestling and hated what he did in the last two days of his life, although I still feel bad when contemplating what Benoit's state of mind must have been in the hours he lived after murdering his family. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

Still, WWE seems to have been pretty successful in cutting out almost all references to the man's existence, and if they can do it with Benoit, I suppose they could accomplish the same with the other men you name. The task seems nearly impossible, yet if they instruct the TV announcers not to utter the forbidden name, and have diligent film editors cut & snip all the taped footage, they could make it seem that even Hulk Hogan was never present in WWE.

That's what they can do.....whether they should is another story.

 

[FightOwensFight]

Actually, that's an interesting question. How in the world would WWE be able to "ignore" or "erase" the accomplishments of the people you mention? Can you imagine attempting to expunge Hulk Hogan from the WWE record books? Can you fathom what the WWE network's library would look like if they eliminated all footage of the man in question? I shudder to think.

For myself, although I recognize that political correctness requires us to not speak the name Chris Benoit except to damn him, I don't see the need to pretend the man never existed in WWE and WCW circles. I don't believe in this retroactive type of elimination, pretending he was never there. I enjoyed the stuff he did in pro wrestling and hated what he did in the last two days of his life, although I still feel bad when contemplating what Benoit's state of mind must have been in the hours he lived after murdering his family. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

Still, WWE seems to have been pretty successful in cutting out almost all references to the man's existence, and if they can do it with Benoit, I suppose they could accomplish the same with the other men you name. The task seems nearly impossible, yet if they instruct the TV announcers not to utter the forbidden name, and have diligent film editors cut & snip all the taped footage, they could make it seem that even Hulk Hogan was never present in WWE.

That's what they can do.....whether they should is another story.

I could be wrong, but aren't Benoit matches on the Network? I know you can't search for him, but I know at least at one point they were there.

To the topic, I would like to think I would denounce the person, no matter who it was, and would have no interest in anything he had done. I wouldn't pretend they didn't exist (as that is kind of silly. They did exist), but I certainly wouldn't go back and watch any of their matches. I know I have made a conscious effort to avoid any matches involving Benoit, most likely due to not wanting to be reminded of the horrific things he did. He wasn't my favorite, but I did enjoy watching him. Just not anymore.

 

[Vader]

Given my favorite wrestler was Benoit I can answer this.

I was entertained by the guy in his early years in the 4 Horsemen. Benoit had a great feud with Sullivan and lead to several entertaining spots. He was a great in-ring talent and I always waited for his push into the main event scene in WCW. Once Benoit got to the WWE he had great matches with the likes of HHH, Michaels, RVD, Angle, Jericho, Lesnar, and Guerrero. He was at forefront of the WWE at a time when the main event guys truly had in-ring talent versus the ability to talk on microphone for 30 minutes (Attitude era).

Bottom Line

The comment has been made on here that had Benoit had a pysch before the event that he would have been instituted and ruled legally insane. This is probably true.

However, it's one thing for someone to have this sort of mental state due to circumstances beyond their control such as internal occurring pyschological or external sociological pressures. It's an entirely other thing to induce this kind of mental state or exasperate an already present problem by abusing substances the way he did.

Wrestling has a dark side to it. While we know what Benoit did in the ring and as a performer was great, we can't separate the fact that between him causing an affair with Woman/Sullivan and abusing roids and probably antidepressants and/or pain killers, that his character was low.

 

[Aquaman6686]

The sad thing is, my favorite Superstar DID pull a Benoit, because my favorite Superstar was Chris Benoit. He was my #1 favorite guy for over ten years, and then the incident occurred. For me the trick is to separate Chris Benoit the wrestler, who I respect immensely and was the single greatest technical wrestler of all time in my opinion, from Chris Benoit the man, who (through the effects of brain damage and not entirely his fault) committed a horrible act of murder and then took his own life rather than face justice. I don't blame Chris Benoit for what happened since it was the direct result of brain damage, but I'm also not one of the people blindly saying "he should go into the Hall of Fame for his in-ring accomplishments", because that's ridiculous. Even a hundred years from now, he'll still be remembered for how his life ended, not what he did during it.

 

[shafe_41]

This is legit the dumbest thread of all time.

You're asking if "someone else" that "i liked better" killed their family and then themselves, would I feel different?

No. The answer is no. How is this a thread?

 

[Jeritron5000]

This is legit the dumbest thread of all time.

You're asking if "someone else" that "i liked better" killed their family and then themselves, would I feel different?

No. The answer is no. How is this a thread?

Thank you. I thought I was nuts. The dude offed his family. Murdered his 8 year old son. Who cares who he is or how big of a fan you were of his? Austin, Hogan, Rock, HBK, doesn't matter same thing. Someone earlier said this was thought provoking. Is it? Ok.

 

[makeitvab]

Thank you. I thought I was nuts. The dude offed his family. Murdered his 8 year old son. Who cares who he is or how big of a fan you were of his? Austin, Hogan, Rock, HBK, doesn't matter same thing. Someone earlier said this was thought provoking. Is it? Ok.

Yeah, not only did that person claim it was "thought provoking" but they got all condescending on anyone who could answer without a shadow of a doubt that whomever does it, it's deplorable.

Love those that also go "well he had brain damage and didn't know what he was doing!" well considering he did 1 murder a day, put bibles by their bodies and IIRC even ORDERED the PPV he was supposed to appear at before hanging himself..... *shrug* do you have that same sympathy or mindset for serial killers because they're legally insane?

The only scenario in which that argument is remotely appropriate would be a mentally ******ed giant squeezing the life out of someone/something in an over enthusiastic hug and wondering why it stopped responding.

The fact he wasn't "himself" holds no merit as he still knew what the intents of his actions were and did it methodically over a weekend. Disgusting.

I honestly hope OP is trolling and not actually wondering if we/wwe would turn a blind eye because a bigger superstar did it.

 

[L@RISANO]

IF one of the biggest stars of the company as mentioned had done something like this... I'd say that the WWE would probably be finished, and if not finished, then we'd have loads more Bulls, Bunnies and Hornyswogglers running around on RAW and SmackDown alongwith loads of other G-Rated stuff...

 

[Double S]

He did, Benoit was my favourite at the time, since that day I've not watched any of his matches, promos, highlights anything,

There's a lot of matches I love, the best ladder match ever vs Jericho, mania triple threat, tag titles where hhh hurt his quad, angle at the rumble, rumble 04, all amazing, all unwatched in 8 years

Can't put myself back in the position I was in the first time, rooting for the amazibg wrestler knowing how it all ended, ruined the memory completely

 

[berlinbrawler]

Why is that even a question? A double homicide/suicide is a double homicide/suicide no matter how rich and famous and beloved and legendary the perpetrator is. Benoit, in the end, was a sick, brain-damaged man who did horrible crimes that simply cannot be undone, ever.

If Hulk Hogan, Steve Austin or the Rock did it, they would get the same treatment, even if that severely hurt and limited the WWE's finances and crippled their library. Not because the WWE is so steadfast on their principles, but because they wouldn't have any choice. Every time they would try to argue "Yes, he is a murderer, but..." they would harvest a massive shitstorm from fans and the media alike and deservedly so.

As it is the WWE was "lucky" it was "only" Benoit and not one of those megastars, because the company, frankly, would probably not have survived such a scandal from one of those guys.

 

[d_henderson1810]

This is legit the dumbest thread of all time.

You're asking if "someone else" that "i liked better" killed their family and then themselves, would I feel different?

No. The answer is no. How is this a thread?

Because I think sometimes, there are double standards to how wrestlers are remembered.

For example, if say, "Stone Cold" Steve Austin had beaten Debra to death, or beat her, and she subsequently dies from injuries consistent with spousal abuse, whether people would have been more forgiving.

I remember a month after Austin plead guilty to "spousal abuse", he gave Stacy Keibler a Stunner on "Raw", and people in the crowd popped for it.

Also, the fact that drugs were found at Benoit's home, the fact he had 11 times the amount of normal testosterone in his system at death (which probably came from steroid use) and even the cops verified that Benoit had maxed out credit cards buying from both legal and illegal drug websites, and the link the media made towards the murders and roid rage, that it is convienient for McMahon to dismiss Benoit, not only for the murders, but so that he won't get federal authorities on his back again, like back in the early 90's.

Also, when police said that Benoit did it, most people accepted it. But if your fave did it, would you doubt the story, and say that the police got it wrong and the superstar would never have done that? Would you accuse the police of botching the investigation? I mean, some Benoit fans say that Kevin Sullivan had motive, and have questioned if Benoit even did it? If one of your faves did it, would you be so quick to accept the police's verdict?

I have never even agreed with the suggestion of erasing Benoit from DVDs. I mean, Chris Benoit never wrestled a match as a murderer, so I can watch his matches, as he had nothing wrong at that point of time. I am glad that Benoit's matches are on WWE Network, and I wouldn't have bought it if it hadn't, because if they edited it to remove Benoit, what else would they edit from their material as well? I want PPVs in full, not matches cut out because some people are stupid enough to think the mere presence of Chris Benoit on screen means that WWE endorses what he did. Hitler has not been removed from all films, and his existence denied, so neither should Benoit. Acknowledgement of existence isn't endorsement of behaviour. In fact, it can be used as a cautionary tale instead.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

The question is not cut and dry. Benoit was not the first WWE superstar to kill a woman... Superfly did this, lost a civil judgement and STILL went on with his career and entered the HOF. If OJ did it... So did Snuka. It is right that had he survived, Benoit would have been ruled insane...the diaries alone would have guaranteed that.

Its moot and conjecture to say "what if" because the one rule WWE has is "it depends who it is..." If Austin had gone too far beating Debra then they'd have probably had to battle through... Benoit wasn't crucial to them... Its awkward that he AND Eddie died but Benoit didn't define WWE. Bear in mind this though... Until now, the only other man blackballed like this was Savage... If the Steph story was true then they hushed it...the same was rumored for Snuka with some accounts claiming he played to his gimmick with the companies help... Since Benoit all transgressions are public and dealt with publicly...so it HAS changed... Look at Nash recently... Cut off till he was cleared.

 

[The Perfect Max]

The reality is, if you actually have a decent enough soul, regardless who it could have been in Chris Benoit's position (Heaven forbid it happening again), you would hate on them. How could you not? If it was just an ordinary working man who killed his wife and child, and then himself, his community would damn him. In the same way, the WWE community, fans and workers, should damn him.

I like to keep wrestling and the real world very separate most of the time. I hate watching movies with the likes of Rock or Austin in and thinking of them as wrestlers; in that situation, they are actors, and that's that. The same with Jericho when he's with Fozzy; he's a rock and roll vocalist, and that's that. The reverse also applies in that I see them all as just wrestlers when they are on WWE TV and nothing more. But with a situation like this, I find it very difficult to watch a Benoit match and not think of the eventual affairs outside of the ring. I'm damn sure I'd feel the same if it was anybody else.

Chris Benoit was a great wrestler and a legendary superstar of the future for the years he should have had to come. But he ruined that when he killed his innocent wife and son. No one else would be forgiven for that, so he should not, and anybody else who may do that, theoretical or unfortunately in reality, should receive the same treatment.

 

[Rane]

I wouldn't take it lightly regardless of who it was but there a lot more to that then people care to think about.

In this link MVP explains it in a way that a lot of people never seem to think about almost anything these days. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3hBXypAMUY

 

[Pedigree1]

Had another superstar committed these atrocities that Benoit did,I am certain that 99% of the people would damn them to hell forever and rightfully so. If Hogan or SCSA did this erasing them from the Archives would leave the library depleted but it would be done if necessary.

I can never pretend to know what was going on in Benoits head that day nor will I ever.. As a performer he was one of the best technical wrestlers that ever hit the planet. Not great on the mic but mat wise a pure genius.

If anyone did this,they would have got the same treatment and that's complete exile. He will never be in the HOF (Although in the business we hear time and time again never say never) you can't look him up in the network,announcers aren't allowed to utter his name. I could have sworn not too long ago i heard them say only 1 man has won the Royal Rumble entering from the No1 spot and that was HBK!

What Benoit did was pure Evil! Only God knows what was in his heart