What does Obamacare mean for me?

[Slyfox696]

Did anyone else find the idea that Jenks is only here because Sly is such a benevolent being to be ridiculous?

Don't be stupid. I could ban him right now if I wanted.

To recap, brings him back solely to amuse his boredom and toy with him. Decides/forgets to re-ban him when a different shiny idiot catches his attention. Proclaims his greatness.

Again, it's not like I can't ban him again right now. I haven't, which is where the "me being nice" comes into play.

Cut the bullshit. The sad thing is that the prison actually worked and Sly was too caught up in his persona to do the right thing and now it is just pointless again.

Jenks was not put into Prison to "work". The Prison has "actually worked" on several occasions. This was not a time where it was meant to work. So quit saying stupid things.

Why can you toy with Jenks but he can't come back at you?

I'm not toying with Jenks. I've been honest with him for over a year now.

The better question is why do you always have to say stupid things when it doesn't concern you? You know what? Don't answer that. If you do respond, to that question or anything else in this thread, I'll just ban you immediately. I won't even both infracting you, because I would hate the thought of you thinking I was toying with you.

Do we understand each other? Don't bother answering that.

 

[Natural Selection]

Or we could have rich people actually pay a tax and stop having these massive wars bleeding our budget dry. It amazes me how the economy was fine under Clinton, then Bush came in, we started two wars and cut taxes, and all of a sudden the economy tanks. It's like we cut income and increased spending and now we have this massive debt.

Gee, it's almost like it's way simpler than you're making it out to be.

The top 1% of earners in this country pay 90% of the taxes. You know why the country was in such good condition when Clinton got in office? Because of the tax that Bush 1 put into place the very tax that got him voted out of office in the first place. Now granted hes the one who ran on "No new taxes" so its his own damn fault he lost to Clinton, who he would of lost to anyways simply because Clinton is a far better speaker. Now I won't even try to defend Bush two because that would be silly, but I will say I'd rather have him as our leader on 9/11 then Gore or Kerry. Obama has convinced the world that he is a liberal when he is actually a Marxist and Romeny has convinced everyone he is a conservative when he is actually a democrat at best. Obamacare has the potential to flat line this country IMO

And Heaven forbid we raise them to take care of millions of people.

Heaven forbid we get rid of welfare, food stamps, and all other entitlement programs and force millions of people to provide for themselves.

 

[klunderbunker]

The top 1% of earners in this country pay 90% of the taxes. You know why the country was in such good condition when Clinton got in office? Because of the tax that Bush 1 put into place the very tax that got him voted out of office in the first place. Now granted hes the one who ran on "No new taxes" so its his own damn fault he lost to Clinton, who he would of lost to anyways simply because Clinton is a far better speaker. Now I won't even try to defend Bush two because that would be silly, but I will say I'd rather have him as our leader on 9/11 then Gore or Kerry. Obama has convinced the world that he is a liberal when he is actually a Marxist and Romeny has convinced everyone he is a conservative when he is actually a democrat at best. Obamacare has the potential to flat line this country IMO

No, it doesn't. Also, if Obama being a socialist means that millions of Americans don't have to worry about being wiped out because of an illness, rock on Marxism.

 

[Natural Selection]

No, it doesn't. Also, if Obama being a socialist means that millions of Americans don't have to worry about being wiped out because of an illness, rock on Marxism.

You have got to be kidding me. We already have the best health care in the world. That is why people come here from Canada, the U.K, etc for medical treatment. EDIT: Healthcare is like everything else in this world NOT FREE, hell sometimes its downright expensive. Healthcare for all means healthcare for none.

 

[klunderbunker]

You have got to be kidding me. We already have the best health care in the world. That is why people come here from Canada, the U.K, etc for medical treatment.

You're an idiot if you believe that. The care itself is the best, but the system to get it is ridiculous on all grounds. Any system where a private company can make money off people's health is absurd, period.

 

[Natural Selection]

You're an idiot if you believe that. The care itself is the best, but the system to get it is ridiculous on all grounds. Any system where a private company can make money off people's health is absurd, period.

Receiving a service and not paying for it is absurd. I realize you need healthcare to not die and all, but you need food and water as well does that mean it should just be given to you? You need clothing and shelter as well should those too be given to you? If you are in need of care and can't afford to pay for it you go to the E.R and they by law have to treat you. And when you can't pay for it it simply fucks your credit up. Nobody in this country is dieing because they can't be treated.

 

[klunderbunker]

Receiving a service and not paying for it is absurd. I realize you need healthcare to not die and all, but you need food and water as well does that mean it should just be given to you? You need clothing and shelter as well should those too be given to you? If you are in need of care and can't afford to pay for it you go to the E.R and they by law have to treat you. And when you can't pay for it it simply fucks your credit up. Nobody in this country is dieing because they can't be treated.

Ah ok. I get it. You're one of those people taht think this is a handout. I'm currently on my mom's healthcare plan because of this law. Know what happened when I went onto it? The bill went up. That doesn't sound like being given to me. it sounds like making it optional to me. those people that walk into an emergency room are a big part of the problem. If you have coverage and can go to a doctor beforehand, you can fix the problem earlier and not burden anyone else. Do you think they go there because it's fun? No. They go because they have no choice and it's either go there or stay sick. This prevents that from being the only option, and that's not a bad thing at all.

 

[Slyfox696]

The top 1% of earners in this country pay 90% of the taxes.

When you say "90% of the taxes", you do realize you're referring only to income tax, correct? When you take other taxes into account, the top 1% don't pay nearly as much as you claim.

Furthermore, where do those 1% get their money? Do they create it out of thin air? Or is it provided to them because of goods and services paid for by the other 99%?

You trying to argue that just because the top 1% pays x percentage of income tax means they are paying their fair share is simply laughable. And that's before we take into account companies like GE, who don't pay income tax.

Are there other people not paying their fair share? Sure, but that doesn't mean we should let other people not pay their fair share as well.

If you are in need of care and can't afford to pay for it you go to the E.R and they by law have to treat you.

I'm sorry, but this is so funny. You do realize the practice of visiting an E.R. is largely responsible for such exorbitant healthcare costs, correct? And that if everyone was forced to have health insurance, health costs should go down, right?

My cousin works in an ER. He once told my father that roughly 48% of ER visits go unpaid. Do you think the hospital just eats those losses? Of course not, they charge more for their care. And it spirals outward, until those people who are responsible end up paying far more than their healthcare actually costs.

I haven't read through the entire Affordable Care Act (who has?), but common sense alone should tell you that making everyone have healthcare should save this country and its citizens quite a bit of money.

 

[Natural Selection]

Part of it is the hand out aspect, which we have far to many of anyways. The bigger issue is the mandating it. Its the same beef I have with auto insurance, yes its nice to have. But to have to have it is bullshit. I should be able to not have health insurance if I don't want it without being taxed. I should be able to choose whom I would like to pay for the service of insurance.

 

[Slyfox696]

Part of it is the hand out aspect, which we have far to many of anyways. The bigger issue is the mandating it. Its the same beef I have with auto insurance, yes its nice to have. But to have to have it is bullshit. I should be able to not have health insurance if I don't want it without being taxed. I should be able to choose whom I would like to pay for the service of insurance.

Just like car insurance, it's not about protecting you. It's about protecting me and my finances.

 

[klunderbunker]

Part of it is the hand out aspect, which we have far to many of anyways. The bigger issue is the mandating it. Its the same beef I have with auto insurance, yes its nice to have. But to have to have it is bullshit. I should be able to not have health insurance if I don't want it without being taxed. I should be able to choose whom I would like to pay for the service of insurance.

And when you do that, you put more of a burden on everyone else because YOU don't want to pay. In other words, screw everyone else because it's better for me. That's not fair to the masses, and this law helps to correct it. Gee, it's almost like that's making things better for the masses, which you might call the general people. You're helping make their welfare better. You might even call it "promoting the general welfare". Now where have I read that.....?

 

[Natural Selection]

If we would cut out all entitlements we could save a lot more money then mandating healthcare will. Obamacare is just another example of our government getting too big and over stepping their bounds.

 

[klunderbunker]

If we would cut out all entitlements we could save a lot more money then mandating healthcare will. Obamacare is just another example of our government getting too big and over stepping their bounds.

1. Too bad the Supreme Court of the United States says otherwise. But I'm sure you're smarter on this than them.

2. Translation: screw those people that need help, because they should be able to help themselves.

 

[Natural Selection]

2. Translation: screw those people that need help, because they should be able to help themselves.

Yeah pretty much. Its not that they should be able to help themselves, they are able to help themselves. They just won't because it is easier to get a check for nothing every first of the month and stand around on street corners begging for change and then walk into my restaurant and want me to give them dollars for their loose change. I will say that probably about 1-5% of people on govt assistance actually need it the other 95-99% of the people are flat out exploiting it.

 

[Slyfox696]

If we would cut out all entitlements we could save a lot more money then mandating healthcare will.

And if Republicans would agree to end the tax cuts for people making over $250,000 and agree to cut our military budget which is roughly equal to the rest of the world combined, we could save over $1 TRILLION dollars of the course of the next decade.

Which would more than pay for government assistance for those in need. But hey, why help people put food on the table when we can have our rich upper class elite order things to be blown up?

Obamacare is just another example of our government getting too big and over stepping their bounds.

I assume you are Republican? On the basis of that assumption, how do you feel about government telling women they cannot have medical procedures on their bodies or that two loving people cannot be married because they are the same gender? Are those both examples of government getting too big and overstepping their bounds as well?

Genuine question, not meant to be snarky.

 

[klunderbunker]

Yeah pretty much. Its not that they should be able to help themselves, they are able to help themselves. They just won't because it is easier to get a check for nothing every first of the month and stand around on street corners begging for change and then walk into my restaurant and want me to give them dollars for their loose change. I will say that probably about 1-5% of people on govt assistance actually need it the other 95-99% of the people are flat out exploiting it.

You are an amazingly stupid person. If you believe this, I feel sorry for you. I truly do.

 

[Natural Selection]

I assume you are Republican? On the basis of that assumption, how do you feel about government telling women they cannot have medical procedures on their bodies or that two loving people cannot be married because they are the same gender. Are those both examples of government getting too big and overstepping their bounds as well?

Genuine question, not meant to be snarky.

Conservative not Republican. I estimate that there is about 5 actual conservatives in our govt. Abortion I am against, but if a woman would like to pay for that "medical procedure" then she has every right to, notice I said pay. If two gays would like to be joined in a civil union I have no problem with that, but keep preachers and pastor out of the equation.

 

[Natural Selection]

You are an amazingly stupid person. If you believe this, I feel sorry for you. I truly do.

Why always an insult KB? We can't simply respectfully disagree?

 

[klunderbunker]

Why always an insult KB? We can't simply respectfully disagree?

Because you are, in fact, an idiot if you believe that. Also I have a big problem with people that have no problem with screwing over everyone and making their lives easier in exchange for everyone else having higher costs and blaming it on Obama being a "Marxist" instead of what it really is: someone actually trying to do the right thing for a change.

 

[Natural Selection]

Because you are, in fact, an idiot if you believe that. Also I have a big problem with people that have no problem with screwing over everyone and making their lives easier in exchange for everyone else having higher costs and blaming it on Obama being a "Marxist" instead of what it really is: someone actually trying to do the right thing for a change.

Explain to me how that makes my life easier or where I ever said it did? I believe in the individual not the group. You are responsible for you not me or anyone else. I do not think it is mine or anyone else responsibility to help provide you healthcare. It is your responsibility to provided yourself healthcare.

 

[Slyfox696]

Conservative not Republican. I estimate that there is about 5 actual conservatives in our govt. Abortion I am against, but if a woman would like to pay for that "medical procedure" then she has every right to, notice I said pay.

Fair enough.

If two gays would like to be joined in a civil union I have no problem with that, but keep preachers and pastor out of the equation.

But what about the differences between marriages and civil unions? Government grants different benefits to marriages they don't grant to civil unions. Would you support government not recognizing ANY marriage and only grant benefits to civil unions?

 

[klunderbunker]

Explain to me how that makes my life easier or where I ever said it did? I believe in the individual not the group. You are responsible for you not me or anyone else. I do not think it is mine or anyone else responsibility to help provide you healthcare. It is your responsibility to provided yourself healthcare.

The minute you start causing my costs to go up because you don't want to pay for something, it becomes my business. It is indeed my responsibility, and you have no right to make me pay more because you don't want to pay.

 

[Natural Selection]

Fair enough.


But what about the differences between marriages and civil unions? Government grants different benefits to marriages they don't grant to civil unions. Would you support government not recognizing ANY marriage and only grant benefits to civil unions?

As long as a marriage is a civil union, but I think it would be more effective to keep them separate but equal. Just because I feel they're lots of people that would flip shit if you told them they weren't married they were in a civil union. A good percent of the population is to dumb to get past the part where you change the word married.

 

[Natural Selection]

The minute you start causing my costs to go up because you don't want to pay for something, it becomes my business. It is indeed my responsibility, and you have no right to make me pay more because you don't want to pay.

Yes I do and you have no right to make me pay to lower your cost.

 

[klunderbunker]

Yes I do.

No, you don't. By that logic, you have the right to steal my car if it makes your life better. It costs me money and makes my life more inconvenient. By not paying for something and therefore driving up the costs for everyone else, you're robbing other people of their money for your own benefit.