UKIP

[Uncle Sam]

We would not have got an AV referendum.

This I would actually consider a failure on Clegg's part. Not because he lost the referendum, but because he chose to go ahead with a referendum that was basically "Do you want to keep this massively shit system we already have or would you rather have this slightly different, slightly less massively shit one that would make hardly any difference?"

Regardless of the outcome, it was essentially a move to make real, effective electoral reform a near impossibility for years to come. If yes, well, we got our precious reform, didn't we? You want a proportional system? No, fuck off, we only just changed it. If no, well, obviously everybody loves first past the post - no need to change it.

I get the sense that Clegg recognised how miserable a compromise AV was - using those words - and was just overly keen to make even the slightest step towards a fairer voting system. But he fucked up. The definition of "one step forward, two steps back."

Edit: I agree with the rest of your post.

 

[Dan Severn's Moustache]

I don't think the liberal parties should join Labour, at least at the moment. The days of Old Labour have gone and they're essentially masquerading as "the liberal left-wing alternative", when there's enough proof out there that they're more authoritarian than a good chunk of the Conservative parties. It might work for the Liberals in the long run, but it'll take years for Labour to fall down the scale to be considered officially Liberal again.

The rest makes sense though. There's no distinctive powerful liberal party now that the media have made it their mission to alienate Lib Dem voters as much as possible.

 

[Gelgarin]

I make no argument that the AV referendum wasn't a total fuckup - although I will mention that PR and STV were never anywhere on the horizon. The AV vote didn't set them back, because they're nowhere to begin with, and sadly (at least in the case of STV - PR can fuck off) probably won't be in our lifetime.

 

[scomvp316]

So the UKIP is a modern Nazi group
Lets not forget their was a strong contingent of people supporting the Nazis in the UK before England was involved in the war

The other thing to keep an eye on with the EU is Merkel wants more power and a more constant leader for the EU Germany has mentioned they will pull out of the EU if certain concessions aren't made If their is one country in Europe that can survive without the EU it is Germany seeing they are the 3rd largest economy in the world

 

[FunKay the Inevitable]

At the end of the day, none of the major parties represent the common man or woman. At the end of the day, there are no alternatives. It's vote off centre right, vote right or vote really right (because no one's voting for the liberals).

Right now British politics is at an all time low in terms of choice and that's reflected in the lack of faith in our politicians.

 

[Gibby]

They're a bunch of cocks but I'm voting for them on the basis that they'll give the other parties a much-needed kick up the arse. If this was a proper election, I wouldn't give them a 2nd thought but as it's an irrelevant European election, fuck it. Perfect for a protest vote and sending a message.

Or a lot like shitting your hotel bed as a protest at poor service then realising you have to spend the night in a shitty bed. Not my joke.

 

[Dowdsy McDowds]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/201...deo_n_5336322.html?1400238903--#slide=2260137



The bit towards the end about people speaking English as a second language is glorious.

 

[Dan Severn's Moustache]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27567744

 

[Uncle Sam]

And then they won't win a single seat in Westminster.

 

[Dan Severn's Moustache]

And then they won't win a single seat in Westminster.

They'll make a big rise to third, much like the Lib Dems did last general election, which is pretty dangerous.

 

[Uncle Sam]

"Make a big rise to third"? "Much like the Lib Dems did"?

I'm confused on both counts.

 

[Dan Severn's Moustache]

"Make a big rise to third"? "Much like the Lib Dems did"?

I'm confused on both counts.

I'm mostly talking about Lib Dems being a deciding factor in the last general election as well as being considered more of a major player in 2010. With the EU win, more people are going to be inclined to vote UKIP, which solidifies their status as the third biggest party in the UK, obviously behind Labour and Tory.

 

[Lee]

Lib Dems had been third for about 20 years before last election. A FTP system does not benefit UKIP.

65% of the population DIDN'T vote. EU elections are always like this, last time they had 13 MEP's and the BNP had 2. All in all it's an increase of 8 for the far right. Hardly massive.

 

[HBK-aholic]

I'm not surprised. Disgusted, maybe, but not surprised. For those disillusioned with the Conservative party, or have always been anti-conservative, their options were basically Ed Milliband, who does not seem competent to run a household, never mind a country, or UKIP. People have used this as a 'Protest vote' which means there will be an influx of Anti-EU/Immigration policies 'promised' in order to pull people that way inclined away from UKIP.

I actually agree with a lot of the anti-EU arguments, and given an in/out referendum I'd vote out, though would prefer a major shake-up of their powers and our 'responsibilities' while still being involved with them. However, a vote for UKIP to achieve this is a vote for racism, sexism and homophobia at the least and is not worth it. I'd be truly ashamed if I'd made that vote. Cameron is currently the lesser of the 4 evils.

 

[Dan Severn's Moustache]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/welcome-ukipland-nightmare-vision-britain-3610179

This is an interesting read.

 

[Lee]

I'm not surprised. Disgusted, maybe, but not surprised. For those disillusioned with the Conservative party, or have always been anti-conservative, their options were basically Ed Milliband, who does not seem competent to run a household, never mind a country, or UKIP. People have used this as a 'Protest vote' which means there will be an influx of Anti-EU/Immigration policies 'promised' in order to pull people that way inclined away from UKIP.

I actually agree with a lot of the anti-EU arguments, and given an in/out referendum I'd vote out, though would prefer a major shake-up of their powers and our 'responsibilities' while still being involved with them. However, a vote for UKIP to achieve this is a vote for racism, sexism and homophobia at the least and is not worth it. I'd be truly ashamed if I'd made that vote. Cameron is currently the lesser of the 4 evils.

Can the British please understand that unless they live in Donaster North and it's a General election they can't vote for Ed Miliband.

 

[Tastycles]

The Eurosceptics all sit together in the EU and vote against everything. They are irrelevant, all you do is reduce the number of people actually making the decision if you vote for them. Because the rest of Europe has voted in a load of communists (Greece) and fascists (nice one, France) it means that all the sensible centrist parties will have to work together, so only genuinely beneficial legislation will get through. Or at least that's the optimists view.

 

[HBK-aholic]

Can the British please understand that unless they live in Donaster North and it's a General election they can't vote for Ed Miliband.

Can the patronising please understand that while most of us are aware of that, there's a bigger picture being discussed?