Triple H Post-2001 Injury

[Emmet]

Throughout all of 2000 and the first half of 2001 Triple H was arguably the best performer in the WWF. He was at the pinnacle of his game, and he was only 30/31 years old at the time.

Then he tore his quad in May 2001 and was on the shelf for nine months, when he came back he was never again the same wrestler as he was pre-injury. He had some good matches but it was clear to all that he wasn't the same. Something became missing from his game (no pun intended)

Why do people think this happened? Did he put on too much muscle in his rehab process from the quad tear? He was only 32 by the time he came back, other wrestlers have come back from serious injuries and regained their previous levels of excellence. Trips never did.

Like to hear peoples' insights on this as I was a big Trips fans in 2000 and 01.

 

[dsotm5150]

Not everybody comes back from an injury the same way, some aren't too effected by them some are, but a total quadracep tear is a pretty serious injury, and fairly uncommon so you've done some major damage if you tear that tendon, so I'm not surprised he lost a step or two. The fact he came back looking bigger than he did when he left probably didn't help any either.

 

[Wolf Pac]

I don't know if there was anything wrong with him physically but it was his booking that ruined him and why he never felt the same.

His comeback at MSG on Raw and his Royal Rumble win were awesome but after that he was in a shitty programme with Jericho and Stephanie, where Jericho was 4th relevant after Triple H, Stephanie and Lucy The Dog, he lost the WWE Title to Hogan one month after winning it at Wrestlemania, didn't really do anything memorable until his programme with Shawn Michaels started, and then came the reign of terror with the World Heavyweight Title, which turned off a lot of people from WWE.

After Austin and Rock left, he was the top dog, whereas he was second/third to Austin and Rock in the Attitude Era, which was the perfect role for him and he made a great rival for the both of them. Jim Cornette was right when he said "he was the guy that worked with THE guy". Also he should have never closed Wrestlemania X8 with Jericho, Rock vs. Hogan should have went on last.

 

[Rhodes2TheFuture3313]

I think you're being waaayy too hard on HHH. This guy IMO is STILL one of the best performers that WWE has. He was a very credible WWE WHC at 45. He's STILL THE GAME, IMO. I was a huge fan of his WHC reigns. He carried Raw along with Evolution for years. Also his feud with HBK is all-time great. What I will agree with you is having him lose to HOGAN right after WM 18 was bad. Also, having him dominate Y2J was bad after Jericho did such a great job as the cowardly, heel champ. Also if you remember around that time HHH was supposed to join the NWO, but Nash tore his quad and they squashed the whole angle. What Vince should have done is either make HBK the new leader of the NWO faction or bring Hall back and have the NWO feud with HHH. I remember how mad I was when Vince came out and said the NWO was finished.

 

[xavyer]

After an injury like that no one is ever 100% again, but in my opinion, performance wise i don't exactly think he lost a step, he was always the guy who stepped up big when the top guys where out due to injury or whatever the case might have been, on this last run people criticize him for becoming Champion and main event Wrestle Mania, but with all the big names injured what choice did he had, and it turned out to be a great decision, he got to put another start over, so in my opinion instead of being criticized he deserves major props......

 

[S.J. Maximus]

I actually find this thread to be pretty interesting because I thought the general public would agree with my belief that Triple H's best in-ring performances actually happened after the major quad injury in 2001. Hunter's main event run from mid 1999-2001 was very well booked and gave us a whole bunch of memorable moments but I wouldn't exactly call that time period a 'golden era' for match quality. Apart from two 5-star efforts with Foley to start the millenium I wouldn't really say HHH had a real standout match from this time period despite being the clear #1 heel in the business.

In 2002 however, he was able to carry Hogan through a main event before giving us one of the most memorable matches of all-time with HBK at Summerslam. I will admit he didn't show us much in 2003 but I'd attribute that more to the quality of opponents (Scott Steiner, Booker T, Goldberg, Kevin Nash) than him losing a step. I'd say that belief was validated when he returned to top form in 2004 against the likes of HBK, Chris Benoit, and Randy Orton.

I guess you could argue he wasn't as quick as he used to be but IMO he was quick enough and was much stronger than he was pre-tear. He retained all of the main moves he used pre-tear and didn't even make any adjustments after his second quad tear return in 2007! Honestly the main difference between HHH post 2001 and HHH pre 2001 is his look, where post 2001 is significantly larger. But all in all, I think you can look at HHH's greatest in ring performances and see that both quad tears he had were just bumps in the road of an otherwise stellar career.

 

[shooter_mcgavin]

I actually find this thread to be pretty interesting because I thought the general public would agree with my belief that Triple H's best in-ring performances actually happened after the major quad injury in 2001. Hunter's main event run from mid 1999-2001 was very well booked and gave us a whole bunch of memorable moments but I wouldn't exactly call that time period a 'golden era' for match quality. Apart from two 5-star efforts with Foley to start the millenium I wouldn't really say HHH had a real standout match from this time period despite being the clear #1 heel in the business.

In 2002 however, he was able to carry Hogan through a main event before giving us one of the most memorable matches of all-time with HBK at Summerslam. I will admit he didn't show us much in 2003 but I'd attribute that more to the quality of opponents (Scott Steiner, Booker T, Goldberg, Kevin Nash) than him losing a step. I'd say that belief was validated when he returned to top form in 2004 against the likes of HBK, Chris Benoit, and Randy Orton.

I guess you could argue he wasn't as quick as he used to be but IMO he was quick enough and was much stronger than he was pre-tear. He retained all of the main moves he used pre-tear and didn't even make any adjustments after his second quad tear return in 2007! Honestly the main difference between HHH post 2001 and HHH pre 2001 is his look, where post 2001 is significantly larger. But all in all, I think you can look at HHH's greatest in ring performances and see that both quad tears he had were just bumps in the road of an otherwise stellar career.

Triple H also worked with RVD, Chris Jericho, Undertaker, and, as you mentioned, Booker T. I'd say those were quality opponents and Triple H did work pretty well with Kevin Nash during TLC. The problem with Triple H is that his injury set him back for 2 or 3 years where he was noticeably slower in the ring. The Rock also worked with Goldberg and they had a good match and The Rock isn't really known as a guy to carry a match.

You also mentioned Shawn Michaels and while he did have good matches noticed all of them were gimmick matches. So there was a lot of smoke and mirrors in that match.

Though the biggest problem with him at that time was his politics. I think a combination of Triple H getting closer to the McMahon family, him being insecure about his ring work due to his injury, and him trying to seize his opportunity with Austin and Rock gone that's when Triple H went aggressive on his power play. It's also no coincidence that Triple H and Undertaker were in separate brands to avoid any backstage political conflict.

His politics really drowned out RAW though to the point where Smackdown was the stronger show during that period. He was heel destroying every face challenger and dominated the heel scene putting down guys like Jericho, RVD, and Booker T guys who are strong enough names to help build RAW around with.

So I think from 2001 (post injury) to 2004 Triple H's aggressive politics and injury really hurt his image from his fans. And IMO rightfully so.

 

[shooter_mcgavin]

Jim Cornette was right when he said "he was the guy that worked with THE guy". Also he should have never closed Wrestlemania X8 with Jericho, Rock vs. Hogan should have went on last.

Yep I agree for the most part. Though I always felt the argument to close WMX8 with Rock/Hogan is partly based on hindsight.

As big as the match turned out I think the argument was that the World Title should always close the show. And in those days that's what happened and the only time it didn't the show was considered a disaster (WMXI).

The only problem was as anticipated the match was no one expected the match to be that big and got the reaction it got in Toronto. Remember, as I said plenty of times, WCW was just bought a year prior and all the Hogan's, Savages, and Flairs were in WCW this was the first "dream" match between a legend vs. a current top star. So I would give the WWE the benefit of the doubt that they didn't see the reaction they did coming.

Even Wrestling journalists and writers weren't too keep on Hogan/Rock because they felt Hogan didn't have it anymore.

 

[Y 2 Jake]

He started to believe his own hype and booked himself in longer matches with fewer shortcuts. He thought he was good enough to get enthralling, 30 minute, technical masterpieces out of almost anybody.

 

[nwocongo]

Triple H also worked with RVD, Chris Jericho, Undertaker, and, as you mentioned, Booker T. I'd say those were quality opponents and Triple H did work pretty well with Kevin Nash during TLC. The problem with Triple H is that his injury set him back for 2 or 3 years where he was noticeably slower in the ring. The Rock also worked with Goldberg and they had a good match and The Rock isn't really known as a guy to carry a match.

You also mentioned Shawn Michaels and while he did have good matches noticed all of them were gimmick matches. So there was a lot of smoke and mirrors in that match.

Though the biggest problem with him at that time was his politics. I think a combination of Triple H getting closer to the McMahon family, him being insecure about his ring work due to his injury, and him trying to seize his opportunity with Austin and Rock gone that's when Triple H went aggressive on his power play. It's also no coincidence that Triple H and Undertaker were in separate brands to avoid any backstage political conflict.

His politics really drowned out RAW though to the point where Smackdown was the stronger show during that period. He was heel destroying every face challenger and dominated the heel scene putting down guys like Jericho, RVD, and Booker T guys who are strong enough names to help build RAW around with.

So I think from 2001 (post injury) to 2004 Triple H's aggressive politics and injury really hurt his image from his fans. And IMO rightfully so.

I think your last point is spot on. Considering how serious an injury the quad tear was, his actual work in the ring was still pretty damn good, but this is the time period where people got most of the fodder for the notion that he "buried" everyone in the company to keep his own spot safe.

 

[sMark]

In 2002 he was good enough, not quick like before, but i wasn't bored with his matches. In 2003 hovewer i don't think i can recall any match with him i was interested to rewatch, partly because he got very lazy himself (politics needed more of his attention i guess), partly because RAW main event scene was very bad (Nash, Steiner, Booker T, Kane & Goldberg? Come on. Yeah, Booker & Goldberg were ok, but 3 others don't. There was a 1 major reason why WCW died for TV fans - boring main events).
Smackdown at the same time had Taker, Angle, Lesnar, upandcoming Cena, and even Hogan (who actually had more memorable matches in WCW 1996-2000, then let's say Sting or any other main event performer excluding DDP, Savage & Booker T). RAW was nearly unwatchable when things got in the ring, bringing in all these WCW guys was a big mistake. Goldberg for ratings? Yes. Booker T? Yes. All others? No. You just can't do a good match with all of them.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

He started to believe his own hype and booked himself in longer matches with fewer shortcuts. He thought he was good enough to get enthralling, 30 minute, technical masterpieces out of almost anybody.

I'll add to this... HHH thought he could be Harley Race and Ric Flair rolled into one and nobody told him he couldn't do it... and they should have.

HHH was and is still a great hand in the ring, but at the mid 2002-2004 mark, HHH seemed to lack the cardio and body he had previously and simply got bigger instead of gaining more muscle or cardio, which could work for a bigger superstar like Taker, Kane, or Big Show, but not for a 6'4 guy like HHH.

I also believe he was unmotivated with whom he was working with aside from Nash.

That's just me though.

 

[Goldie]

2000-mid 2001 was Trippers peak as an in ring performer. At the time he was even heralded as one of the best performers in the business.
When he returned in 2002 he seemed to have packed on an extra 20 pounds of muscle mass- which physically made him look great- though it would slightly slow him down in the ring- coupled with the injury tear.
He could still go and perform at a high level with the right opponent (eg Shawn Michaels) but those high performances were not consistent like they were in 2000.

 

[HatchetMan84]

I like Hunter's matches now a lot more, only for the maybe reason that he is well established and doesn't need to keep wrestling. I don't even think it is because he insists on being in the spotlight. I could be totally wrong, but everything i read about him really paints him and Stephanie as good people outside of WWE, and HHH in fan interactions and other stuff seems like a pretty humble guy. I do not believe in the "marrying the boss' daughter" thing that people say he did just to get ahead. I think he genuinely fell in love and people can't really help when that happens. It was shitty what happened to Chyna in hindsight, but love always finds away. Vince McMahon, who for everything else seems to always come across as a straight shooter, loves Hunter like a son and constantly puts over his good deeds and good acts...

 

[AndThat'sTheBottomLine]

Personally, I don't really think he fell off performance wise. He did get a little slower but packing on 10 to 20 pounds of muscle will do that to you. Physically, he looked great. He was absolutely the best heel in WWE. He carried the company when there were no top guys. It was sort of a dark period for WWE and Hunter got them through to the other side. Even now at 45 years old, he can still work a good match. He gets a lot of hate for his reign of terror but really, who else was there? Goldberg? Sure I guess but he wasn't really entertaining in the ring after 3 minutes. Booker T? Maybe but no one ever considered him a big star. At the end of the day, Triple H was the only option. Like I said, he may have been a little slower, but he was still fantastic to watch in the ring. Especially when compared to the other options they had at the time.

 

[JeanPierre11]

This was always something that I thought about--mainly because I was, and still am, a huge HHH fan. But to be honest, he was at his very peak back in 99-01. When he came back, he was still THE guy, although his matches weren't the best. But admittedly, 2003 was an off year for him, and I would attribute that to his opponents, and the injury he had that year. But no one mentions the Elimination Chamber match in 03 that was phenomenal.