TNA's booking sucks!!!!!

[RD_21]

Islam is actually the least logical of religions but whatever.

If you can enjoy TNA despite piss poor booking and insulting story lines bullies for you but the majority of the people cannot. This is why TNA is not attracting a wider audience and not a credible number two company. I in fact do have a life which is why I do not watch Impact, I watch the clips on youtube so I can speed through the boring and unwatchable.

Well you are saying it's bad, but you are making it worse than it is. It's getting really interesting lately. Most of the storylines you guys are bitching about will only conclude at BFG.

You are pointing to Samoa Joe's kidnapping, Sting Deception, Abyssmania and other storyline but I saw a video lately on the origin of "They" in another thread and everything was tied together, we should wait for the payoff before saying it's not good or cohesive.

What if Hogan, Bischoff and Tessmacher are "They", Abyssmania as a pioint, Joe was kidnapped by "They" and finally decided to join the battle after being told to stay away from it, Sting Deception angle was that he knew about it, everything would be tied together and all of you would be dumbfounded, then maybe the payoff will suck but who knows just yet.

TNA booking isn't perfect but I prefer that any day of the week to thrown together tag team, Super Wrestler, female feud based on school yard insult (Piggy James and Smelly Kelly.....) and announcer who blame a wrestler because he doesn't eat meat.

It's not perfect but it's far from being awful.

 

[mrbooker]

Honestly people are so quick to judge TNA but its not like WWE's is that much better, it will be very intersting in 2 to 3 years when guys like taker, kane, jericho, HHH, Edge(he has gone on record saying he will soon) are gone and the WWE doesnt have those stars who the 21 and older crowd remember from their childhood, who tune in to see those individuals.

Some booking is bad some booking is good the problem with TNA is they have problems figuring out who to but their chips behind, like one of the posters said keeping the MCMG away from the titles for so long is a prime example, but people never want to give TNA credit either, remember AJ being Angles bitch, only to end up winning the title at bound for Glory, then ther was the whole side story line between AJ and sting that showed in the ending of the match at BFG

TNA booking is not consistent which is the problem no organization alive today has consistent booking TNA's problem is they dont have mega stars to attract the viewers regardless of the storyline. I have four brothers two elementary school aged ones could give a shyt less who John Cena is facing or the storyline as long as cena is in that ring. The other two that are in highschool could carless about the storyline as long as they see orton go crazy slapping the ground and Rko's someone.

For people who say TNA has stars they just dont book them well i say, sorry but watching wrestling for many years i tuned in to see certain guys HBK, Sting, Savage, The Rock and if I saw them in ring action I was content, and good booking just made it all that more captivating, TNA has good in ring workers, a handlefull (5-8 potential stars, when I say potential I mean that some point in the future they will be able to do what memorable wrestlers do and thats draw). That MIGHT be able to start a strong fanbase to bring too the company. Its all about how they elevate their game when they are on that camera, and Yes! I understand booking plays a large roll but its NOT everything... Imo TNA has 5 guys worth while to put their chips behind Samoa Joe, Anderson, Abyss, Aj Styles, The Pope. Add on Jeff Hardy( If he doesnt get charge with a jail or worse prison sentence) After BFG, TNA needs to have consistent booking around these guys, first and foremost. To me 10-10-10 will be the final factor alot has been building up to it. Booking sucks yes some of it those, some of it isnt that bad either it seems like TNA put all their chips in at BFG because I trully believe if the totally bomb at BFG they are in trouble. At the same I dont think the are going to do something that monumental in wrestling history, it will most likely be something that elevates TNA as a company in some fashion

 

[Phenomenal]

Islam is actually the least logical of religions but whatever.

Yeah, and wrestling is real but whatever.

If you can enjoy TNA despite piss poor booking and insulting story lines bullies for you but the majority of the people cannot. This is why TNA is not attracting a wider audience and not a credible number two company. I in fact do have a life which is why I do not watch Impact, I watch the clips on youtube so I can speed through the boring and unwatchable.[/QUOTE]

I also watch it on Youtube and skip most of it. TNA will attract a wider audience when the time comes. not when we or TNA want.

Islam is actually the least logical of religions but whatever.

Yeah, and wrestling is real but whatever.

If you can enjoy TNA despite piss poor booking and insulting story lines bullies for you but the majority of the people cannot. This is why TNA is not attracting a wider audience and not a credible number two company. I in fact do have a life which is why I do not watch Impact, I watch the clips on youtube so I can speed through the boring and unwatchable.

I also watch it on Youtube and skip most of it. TNA will attract a wider audience when the time comes. not when we or TNA want.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

I also watch it on Youtube and skip most of it. TNA will attract a wider audience when the time comes. not when we or TNA want.

Wow back the truck up, Sally! You watch it on YouTube, you skip most of it, yet you come 'ere and you shit on it. Joe's kidnapping makes more sense than that, and that's a very low bar!

You know what, I give up. I refuse to watch a wrestling show with flaws in their booking. That is why from this moment on I'll watch a wrestling show with little to perfect booking. I will watch WW-..no wait. I will watch RO-...no wait. I will watch NJP-...no wait. I'll watch DGU-..no wait. I need some help. Anyone? C'mon, bad booking must be such a rare occasion if people make entire threads about it.

..wait I started this thread.

C'mon, booking must be such a rare occasion if so many people refuse to watch TNA because of it.

I want to watch something! Quickly!

 

[schaeffershawn]

I also watch it on Youtube and skip most of it. TNA will attract a wider audience when the time comes. not when we or TNA want.

So a Tv program can do nothing at all to increase ratings except wait until people discover it. That is the most assinine logic I think I have ever heard of.

The fact is eventually Spike will not want to pay as much as they do now for Impact if ratings do not increase. Which means if TNA cannot bring in a wider audiance they will eventually be forced to A. take a deal were they get paid less per episode of Impact, B. shop the show to other networks and as there is not exactly a heavey market for wrestling programs they could in fact lose Impact altogether. or C. pull and ECW and go out of buisness altogether.

The reason myself and others bitch about the bad booking is after 8 years we would love for TNA to imerge from being a glorfied indie company and be a legitament number two. A number two not only with quality programing but one that makes Vince take notice and step up his game.

 

[Reddannihilation]

So a Tv program can do nothing at all to increase ratings except wait until people discover it.

I suppose they could send wrestlers round to people's houses and force them to watch at gun point. That might be illegal though, I'll have to check.

The fact is eventually Spike will nto wnat to pay as much as they do now for Impact if ratings do not increase.

Spike doesn't pay for iMPACT!, Spike gives iMPACT a slot in their schedule, advertisers pay Spike to broadcast advertisments during TNA's commercial breaks. Spike takes that huge amount of money, and distributes part of it to TNA. To help you out, those midnight infomericals cost a few grand. In primetime ads can cost up to 700,000 for 30 seconds during standard programming, for major sporting events like the Superbowl it's even larger. During TNA's primetime slot with their ratings, every 30 second ad would probably cost around $100,000+ fairly decent pull for a company with other sources of revenue.

Which means if TNA cannot bring in a wider audiance they will eventually be forced to A. take a deal were they get paid less per episode of Impact,

Nope.

B. shop the show to ther networks and as there is not exactly a heavey market for wrestling program they could in fact lose Impact altogether.

No again.

or C. pull and ECW and go out of buisness altogether.

Trifecta, Hat Trick, Amy Winehouse: No, no ,no.

See this is the probelm with you Apocalypse Prophets. You don't understand what you're talking about. I mean you actually think Spike is where TNA's money comes from. It comes from the commercials played during the program. If TNA is getting a 1.0 then 1 million people are watching. How long to commerical breaks go for in the US? Over here they go between 3 and 5 minutes during primetime. So for 3 minutes of commercial Spike pulls in around $600,000 roughly during TNA. IF TNA gets 10% of that that's $60,000 for 3 minutes. And it's not as though that's their sole source of income.

The reason myself and others bitch about the bad booking is after 8 years we would love for TNA to imerge from being a glorfied indie company and be a legitament number two.

Being broadcast in multiple countries worldwide, having 3 televisions hows and beating the WWE in several international markets isn't good enough? What else to they have to do?

A number two not only with quality programing but one that makes Vince take notice and step up his game.

McMahon isn't going to step his game up until he's getting beaten. If you need an example of that look at the Attiude Era. WCW had to spank him for 84 weeks straight before he finally did enough to get back in control. You think TNA drawing a 2.0 is going to change how McMahon books? Even when WCW had Hogan, Vince still didn't care, it wasn't until WCW started forcefully sodomizing him that he looked around and tried something new. You said you want TNA to be a #2 company, they are. For what you're actually suggesting TNA wouldn't be #2 they'd need to be #1, because as long as McMahon is drawing as little as .1 higher than his competition in the ratings he will never change what he's doing.

 

[RD_21]

To be honest BFG 10.10.10 is the make or "break" date for TNA.

If they pull it with the They angle and Angle/Anderson angle and the Deception angle and deliver good payoofs the ratings will go up, but if they don't it will stay the same.

Why am I saying that, because I am the only person I know who really watch TNA, my friends used to but give up a good while ago, I just started. So if BFG is awesome I will tell them to watch it that it's getting better lately. That's just me but I am sure that I am not the only one in that case, that's how TNA can improve their ratings imo

 

[mrbooker]

Being broadcast in multiple countries worldwide, having 3 televisions hows and beating the WWE in several international markets isn't good enough? What else to they have to do?


McMahon isn't going to step his game up until he's getting beaten. If you need an example of that look at the Attiude Era. WCW had to spank him for 84 weeks straight before he finally did enough to get back in control. You think TNA drawing a 2.0 is going to change how McMahon books? Even when WCW had Hogan, Vince still didn't care, it wasn't until WCW started forcefully sodomizing him that he looked around and tried something new. You said you want TNA to be a #2 company, they are. For what you're actually suggesting TNA wouldn't be #2 they'd need to be #1, because as long as McMahon is drawing as little as .1 higher than his competition in the ratings he will never change what he's doing.

Thank you for making two of the greatest points i have thought for awhile now TNA is broadcast internationally and gets more viewers in other countries than WWE not everything is about the USA, and the VIince statement is so tru he wont change a thing its silly to think if TNA raises their game he would change anything until people give up on WWE and go to TNA.


Unless BFG is an EPIC fail TNA is going no where

 

[Rayne]

Spike doesn't pay for iMPACT!, Spike gives iMPACT a slot in their schedule, advertisers pay Spike to broadcast advertisments during TNA's commercial breaks. Spike takes that huge amount of money, and distributes part of it to TNA. To help you out, those midnight infomericals cost a few grand. In primetime ads can cost up to 700,000 for 30 seconds during standard programming, for major sporting events like the Superbowl it's even larger. During TNA's primetime slot with their ratings, every 30 second ad would probably cost around $100,000+ fairly decent pull for a company with other sources of revenue.

In America, television stations pay for programming. The network then sells advertising, and keeps the larger portion of it. Your figures are completely made up; you might see a $700,000 figure for major events like the World Series or (god help us all) American Idol finales, but that would be an absolutely insane sum to pay for "standard programming". Episodes of How I Met Your Mother in primetime aren't fetching $3.5m every commercial break.

It's also clear you have no idea how people pay for commercials in the States. There is not a "flat fee" companies pay to whomever for the right to broadcast their product, with the exception of special national events (like the Super Bowl). Typically, a 30 minute show has 8 minutes of advertising; 6 for national, 2 for local. You pay X dollars per 1,000 impressions for Y seconds (the amount of impressions is an average, no longer calculated during sweeps- thank you, internet), and an average rate for cable programming (understanding the wide disparity in the quality of cable, and, sorry, SpikeTV isn't in the ESPN/CNN class) is $5 per 1,000 for 30 seconds. Let's assume TNA has an absolutely FANTASTIC deal and they're getting $10 per 1,000. At 1.2 million viewers, we still aren't anywhere near this $100,000 per 30 figure you're espousing; we're short a full order of magnitude there.

Nope.


No again.


Trifecta, Hat Trick, Amy Winehouse: No, no ,no.

Well, it's good to see those epic debate skills you go on about are still intact.

See this is the probelm with you Apocalypse Prophets. You don't understand what you're talking about. I mean you actually think Spike is where TNA's money comes from. It comes from the commercials played during the program. If TNA is getting a 1.0 then 1 million people are watching. How long to commerical breaks go for in the US? Over here they go between 3 and 5 minutes during primetime. So for 3 minutes of commercial Spike pulls in around $600,000 roughly during TNA. IF TNA gets 10% of that that's $60,000 for 3 minutes. And it's not as though that's their sole source of income.

And if we completely make up figures, I can prove to you the earth is flat. But we've already determined that you know absolutely nothing about how advertising is sold in America. This isn't even a rough guesstimation; you're starting off with figures that you know are made up, performing math on them and presenting the results as some form of proof.

Being broadcast in multiple countries worldwide, having 3 televisions hows and beating the WWE in several international markets isn't good enough? What else to they have to do?

Are we counting Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and Great Britain as individual markets? What "several international markets" are you talking about? Is there some hidden huge market for professional wrestling in France that the rest of the world is unaware of? Maybe there are seven people in Papau New Guinea that like TNA, and only five that like the WWE. Specifics, please.

 

[Reddannihilation]

In America, television stations pay for programming.
The network then sells advertising, and keeps the larger portion of it. Your figures are completely made up; you might see a $700,000 figure for major events like the World Series or (god help us all) American Idol finales, but that would be an absolutely insane sum to pay for "standard programming".

If you could actually read, you'll notice I said up to $700,000. I'd consider a football game or a American Idol episode Standard programming.

Episodes of How I Met Your Mother in primetime aren't fetching $3.5m every commercial break.

How I Met Your Mother is beaten by 2 and A Half Men routinely, why you even bring up HIMYM is beyond me.

It's also clear you have no idea how people pay for commercials in the States. There is not a "flat fee" companies pay to whomever for the right to broadcast their product, with the exception of special national events (like the Super Bowl).

Never said there was a flat fee so you can drop the quotation marks. There isn't a flat fee over here either. Stop putting words in my mouth.

Typically, a 30 minute show has 8 minutes of advertising; 6 for national, 2 for local.

Well TNA is 2 hours so 28 minutes of advertising.

You pay X dollars per 1,000 impressions for Y seconds (the amount of impressions is an average, no longer calculated during sweeps- thank you, internet), and an average rate for cable programming (understanding the wide disparity in the quality of cable, and, sorry, SpikeTV isn't in the ESPN/CNN class) is $5 per 1,000 for 30 seconds. Let's assume TNA has an absolutely FANTASTIC deal and they're getting $10 per 1,000. At 1.2 million viewers, we still aren't anywhere near this $100,000 per 30 figure you're espousing; we're short a full order of magnitude there.

Like I said it was an estimate. Here's a graph http://www.frankwbaker.com/prime_time_programs_30_sec_ad_costs.htm

Now according to that graph, up until a few years back when the US economy hit the shitter regular American Idol episodes were getting $705,000 per 30 seconds. My bad, I forgot the US had no fall back plan for the economic downturn. So it is less money than I assumed, then again TNA was on during the 05-06 and 06-07 schedule so they were probably getting a fair share of money back when the networks had buckets of it.

Well, it's good to see those epic debate skills you go on about are still intact.

You know what funny is that everytime you've tried to argue with me you always fall back on "oh you haz suxxorz debate skillz" I've never said I had great debate skills, you apparently have though.

And if we completely make up figures, I can prove to you the earth is flat. But we've already determined that you know absolutely nothing about how advertising is sold in America. This isn't even a rough guesstimation; you're starting off with figures that you know are made up, performing math on them and presenting the results as some form of proof.

Here's that graph again http://www.frankwbaker.com/prime_time_programs_30_sec_ad_costs.htm

see says 705,000 for primetime regular programming. It's not my fault your country fell into a shithole and can't pay much anymore.

Are we counting Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and Great Britain as individual markets?

TNA is currently broadcast in; Australia: Fox8 and OneHD
Austria, Germany and Switzerland on Sky Deutschland
Canada: Spike, Resseau des Sports and The Fight Network
Chad, Ivory Coast, Ghana, Nigeria, Sudan, Uganada and Zimbabwe: Setanta Sports Africa
Denmark: Canal 9
France: Ma Chaine Sport
India, Bangladesh, Maldives, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bhutan and Nepal: ESPN Star Sports
Israel: EGO Total
Mexico: 52MX
MENA: Al Jazeera SPORTS
Portugal: Sports TV
Italy: GXT
Ireland and United Kingdom: Previously Bravo now seeking out a new broadcaster.

What "several international markets" are you talking about? Is there some hidden huge market for professional wrestling in France that the rest of the world is unaware of?

See that list there, suck it. I don't know why but you strike as the sort of person who thinks people in Denmark speak Dutch. And I think the reason you come off that way is because:

Maybe there are seven people in Papau New Guinea that like TNA, and only five that like the WWE.

You say shit like this, proving how blatantly ignorant you are of the rest of the world.

 

[schaeffershawn]

I was about to say pretty much what Rayne said, but god that was beautiful.

In America as Rayne pointed out Networks such as Spike pay for original programing and for that matter everything else that airs when people are normally watching. The exception being infomercials. When Impact originally debuted on FSN they paid FSN to be on their network in hopes that they would find a better TV deal. They found it at Spike.

Spike which use to air Raw, paid x amount of dollars for Raw every week. They based this number when wrestling was at its peak and the WWE essentially had no out of pocket expenses for airing Raw. Plus the WWE got a portion of the ad revenue. Spike got tired of paying what they were paying when the WWE had no competition and went stale. They negotiated a lower amount and Vince said no because he Knew USA would welcome him back with open arms and open legs. Spike signs TNA and yes Spike will do the same thing if ratings do not improve that is the television market in America.


So as I have contended in the past if Impact does not improve by the time the deal with Spike runs out yes, Spike will try and negotiate for a deal more favorable to them, unless TNA does just a masterful job of explaining that with the extra revenue they would be able to improve things. Anyone else just not seeing that happen when Spike could not be convinced to pay more for a show that gets about 3.5 times more viewers.

Which international markets do they win and by how much? Is it even close enough to make up for the 2.5 million in America alone that beat it each week. Do you consider the weight of Smackdown which still pulls in about 2.5 million people a week as well. Do we consider that if both companies were running house shows in say Sydney, London, Hamberg, Paris, Tokyo, Mexico City, Quebec or virtually any other major city in the world the attendance at the WWE produced show would likely leave TNA with having to give tickets away for free.

The International "wins" are bare at best. with only a few thousand viewers separating in each one. On the other hand in the markets that matter TNA's ratings are barely that of NXT/ECW or the C brand shows.

 

[Reddannihilation]

I was about to say pretty much what Rayne said, but god that was beautiful.

In America as Rayne pointed out Networks such as Spike pay for original programing and for that matter everything else that airs when people are normally watching.

And where does that money come from? Oh right, the advertisers who pay Spike. Not to mention that some of TNA's actual production is paid via other means, TNA has the deal with Universal studios not Spike TV.

Spike which use to air Raw, paid x amount of dollars for Raw every week. They based this number when wrestling was at its peak and the WWE essentially had no out of pocket expenses for airing Raw. Plus the WWE got a portion of the ad revenue. Spike got tired of paying what they were paying when the WWE had no competition and went stale. They negotiated a lower amount and Vince said no because he Knew USA would welcome him back with open arms and open legs. Spike signs TNA and yes Spike will do the same thing if ratings do not improve that is the television market in America.

First I'll ignore the fact that you somehow know all the details of the WWE and Spike's contract issues. But beyond that, fun fact. Impact = Spikes highest rated show, because unlike TUF which occasionally picks up really big ratings like the Kimbo v. Big Country fight TNA airs year round and pulls an average of 1.0-1.2. Spike cutting off TNA would damage the network, it'd be like cancelling Glee, damaging the network more than the tv show.

So as I have contended in the past if Impact does not improve by the time the deal with Spike runs out yes, Spike will try and negotiate for a deal more favorable to them, unless TNA does just a masterful job of explaining that with the extra revenue they would be able to improve things.

Spike's going to bully the top rated show on their network? How could that possibly backfire?

Anyone else just not seeing that happen when Spike could not be convinced to pay more for a show that gets about 3.5 times more viewers.

Holy shit what math rule do you subscribe too? RAW drew a 2.7 these past two weeks, 1.2 x 3 = 3.3 even when RAW was getting 3.5 that's not 3.5 times 1.2 you sir gots to get yoself a calculator.

Which international markets do they win and by how much? Is it even close enough to make up for the 2.5 million in America alone that beat it each week. Do you consider the weight of Smackdown which still pulls in about 2.5 million people a week as well.

Well I don't live in the 27 other countries that broadcast TNA, however. I do live in Australia and work for OneHD who broadcast TNA programming.
Here's a fun one for you, iMPACT is aired on FOX8 saturday nights in Australia it outdraws RAW, Smackdown and NXT which are broadcast at 3.30pm Eastern Wednesday, Thursday and Friday and rebroadcast Saturday and Sunday from 12pm Eastern.

Impact is aired once. OneHD airs Explosion which during the Football Worldcup was the 4th highest rated sports program in the country.

Do we consider that if both companies were running house shows in say Sydney, London, Hamberg, Paris, Tokyo, Mexico City, Quebec or virtually any other major city in the world the attendance at the WWE produced show would likely leave TNA with having to give tickets away for free.

Again I don't live in the other 27 countries, TNA is scheduled for their first Australian tour sometime next year. The last WWE Australian tour I went to was a Smackdown tour in 03-04 it was in Perth it drew about 9,000 people in the Burswood arena. And that was with Rapper Cena vs Big Show for the US title on the card.

The International "wins" are bare at best. with only a few thousand viewers separating in each one. On the other hand in the markets that matter TNA's ratings are barely that of NXT/ECW or the C brand shows.

Wait, didn't you already say you have no idea what the international markets are like? How do you suddenly know the wins are bare at best? You see you need to get your head out of your ass and realise that "the markets that matter" which in your opinion is exclusivley the US market isn't the same as it was in 1997. International markets matter, thanks to the power of fast track I got to see the latest Glee episode less than 11 hours after it aired in the US. TNA thrives on international markets, Dixie herself has often praised international markets for being major contributors to TNA's success. Their third Global iMPACT tour is set for next year. If you're going to criticise the international wrestling market you might want to try not living in the USA.

 

[Rayne]

TNA is currently broadcast in; Australia: Fox8 and OneHD
Austria, Germany and Switzerland on Sky Deutschland
Canada: Spike, Resseau des Sports and The Fight Network
Chad, Ivory Coast, Ghana, Nigeria, Sudan, Uganada and Zimbabwe: Setanta Sports Africa
Denmark: Canal 9
France: Ma Chaine Sport
India, Bangladesh, Maldives, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bhutan and Nepal: ESPN Star Sports
Israel: EGO Total
Mexico: 52MX
MENA: Al Jazeera SPORTS
Portugal: Sports TV
Italy: GXT
Ireland and United Kingdom: Previously Bravo now seeking out a new broadcaster.

See that list there, suck it. I don't know why but you strike as the sort of person who thinks people in Denmark speak Dutch. And I think the reason you come off that way is because:

That's cute and all, but that's not the question you were asked. You claimed that TNA was beating the WWE in several international markets. I'm well aware that American television is exported around the world. What are these several international markets where TNA is beating the WWE? Your words, not mine.

BTW, top 10 network TV programs aren't "standard programming". That's like calling Undi's pay package "standard salary".

 

[mrbooker]

That's cute and all, but that's not the question you were asked. You claimed that TNA was beating the WWE in several international markets. I'm well aware that American television is exported around the world. What are these several international markets where TNA is beating the WWE? Your words, not mine.

BTW, top 10 network TV programs aren't "standard programming". That's like calling Undi's pay package "standard salary".

England and the entire United Kingdom TNA draws more viewers then Raw, or smackdown, or NXT thats saying something seeing as TNA is filmed in Universal studios every week and is 8 years old and WWE is an empire with billions of dollars and over 20 years of prestige and fans, I live in the United States, And have been a wrestling fan for 17 years thats 17 years the WWE has had to make me a life long viewer

If you like football you watch the NFL, If you like Basketball you the NBA, If you like Wrestling you most likely watch WWE because its what you grew up watching. The mere fact the TNA is more popular in other countries goes to show just how much the WWE product has fell off, and if your opinion differs well then just look at this weeks rating.

Dont blame it on Monday night Football it was the worst rating in 13 years, Monday night football was on CABLE not even free tv, and it was WEEK 3 a game with no major playoff implication, give me a break people will stand next to WWE like its their sports team. Its a company and if a company isnt trying their best to entertain you why the hell would you stand by it. Would you stand up for the Patriots if Tom brady was just chucking 40 yard passes in the air into double coverage, or Kobe Bryant said fuck it and started shotting 35 foot 3 pointers??? Essential this is what WWE is doing a shit load of talent and straight ridiculous performance. If TNA had their lowest rating in 8 years everyone would be on here trashing them but since its WWE its ok.

And i know your response will be well if TNA had a 2.7 rating they would ape shit happy, but guess what TNA isn't WWE, TNA doesn't spend money like the WWE, they dont have a 25+ year image to uphold, they dont have major stars that are known amongst parents and their childeren, they dont have fans around the country that wait months to spend their hard earned money to see shows live in their area. Its apples and pears as you would like to say, with everything the WWE puts into their show a 2.7 rating is garbage for them.

I remember stating my thoughts on WWE and a poster said well if you dont like it change the channel guess what I have and it looks like hundreds of thousands have too.

the WWE has something TNA doesn't have mega stars but their booking is even more shitty then TNA's they just have guys like orton, cena, taker etc... that people will tune in just to see them because they are fans of that particular guy but it looks like those couple hundred thousand finally figured the might as well be entertained at 9PM-11PM on a monday, and jut catch their favorite wrestlers part of the show on youtube the next day

 

[Rayne]

England and the entire United Kingdom TNA draws more viewers then Raw, or smackdown, or NXT thats saying something seeing as TNA is filmed in Universal studios every week and is 8 years old and WWE is an empire with billions of dollars and over 20 years of prestige and fans, I live in the United States, And have been a wrestling fan for 17 years thats 17 years the WWE has had to make me a life long viewer

Fucking TNA guppies.

Saying this for what is probably the dozenth time on these boards- criticizing a TNA supporter does not mean I am head over heels fascinated with WWE. This isn't even that kind of discussion. This was a response to a poster who claimed that TNA was beating the WWE in "several international markets", then provided a list of places where TNA is aired instead, after I corrected him on the straight-up bullshit he provided about how television advertising works in this country.

I didn't bother quoting the rest of your response as it has nothing to do with what I'm arguing.

I am well aware that TNA is the higher draw in the UK. I'm wondering what these "several international markets" where TNA is beating the WWE are. If you can provide any insight on this, join on in! Redd needs some help today, he's waded over his head again and is starting to get defensive. As a forewarning, I will be looking for some kind of easily accessible proof, like television rating comparisons or house draws between the two. Nothing that would be beyond a google search; I'm not calling out 'court law' or anything.

But if you're just in here as another person to go "OMG, someone didn't praise TNA, they must blindly love WWE!!!!", save it for the weekly anti-Madden rant.

 

[Reddannihilation]

Fucking TNA guppies.

U mad? I swear Double J must've broken a guitar over your head in a past life for you to hate TNA as much as you do.

This was a response to a poster who claimed that TNA was beating the WWE in "several international markets", then provided a list of places where TNA is aired instead, after I corrected him on the straight-up bullshit he provided about how television advertising works in this country.

Corrected? Interesting because I replied to that and you seem to have completely shyed away from that reply probably because I called you out for putting words in my mouth. For the record standard programming is any regular episode of a series being broadcast on a schedule just because the show is highly rated doesn't mean it isn't a standard airing. A 2 hour special broadcast that's outside the standard. Dun dun dun.

I didn't bother quoting the rest of your response as it has nothing to do with what I'm arguing.

I am well aware that TNA is the higher draw in the UK. I'm wondering what these "several international markets" where TNA is beating the WWE are.

Australia, UK, New Zealand, Ireland. Oh look 4 right there. Now you can shut up.

If you can provide any insight on this, join on in! Redd needs some help today, he's waded over his head again and is starting to get defensive. As a forewarning, I will be looking for some kind of easily accessible proof, like television rating comparisons or house draws between the two. Nothing that would be beyond a google search; I'm not calling out 'court law' or anything.

Man keep going to the well, just told you right there 4 countries where TNA beats out the WWE. Have you ever wondered why the only users who back you in arguments are WWE marks with red rep? It's because you're shit.

Straight up New Zealand, Australia, The UK and Ireland. It seriously must pain you so much for TNA to be a success, I really am starting to wonder if you're one of Cornette's relatives I mean there's almost no rationality behind your constant bitching. However I do enjoy your eventual retreat where you disappear for a few weeks after routinely getting crushed in these threads. Looking forwar to your dissappearance.

 

[Rayne]

Australia, UK, New Zealand, Ireland. Oh look 4 right there. Now you can shut up.

See, I asked for some supporting information. After watching you completely bullshit everyone about how television advertising works in America, you have to understand I'm not at all willing to take you for your word on this. A quick google search should get you the information you're looking for; like comparative television ratings or house show attendance.

As for the rest, don't think that just because I don't readdress it with you that I'm conceding the point. Quite the opposite, in fact; when I watch a guy equivocate and go "well, what I MEANT to say was", and then turn the discussion into one over whether I'm putting words in your mouth instead of your knowledge of American advertising rates, I take that as point proven and move on. (BTW, champ- you might want to edit that original post. Everyone can still read that and determine for themselves if I'm putting words in your mouth or not, and not everyone's going to pick up on your edit timestamp.) Unlike you, I can leave a point behind once I've made it; I don't feel the need to celebrate and jump up and down everytime I think I've made a point.

 

[Reddannihilation]

See, I asked for some supporting information. After watching you completely bullshit everyone about how television advertising works in America, you have to understand I'm not at all willing to take you for your word on this. A quick google search should get you the information you're looking for; like comparative television ratings or house show attendance.

Wait are you saying what I think you are saying? Are you asking someone provide proof? Oh the hypocrisy, last time I checked when people ask other people to provide proof your general response was "oh court law lulz". So when I ask you to prove something it's "lulz" material. But you're not above asking the exact same thing of someone else. Practice what you preach broheim.

As for the rest, don't think that just because I don't readdress it with you that I'm conceding the point. Quite the opposite, in fact; when I watch a guy equivocate and go "well, what I MEANT to say was", and then turn the discussion into one over whether I'm putting words in your mouth instead of your knowledge of American advertising rates, I take that as point proven and move on. (BTW, champ- you might want to edit that original post. Everyone can still read that and determine for themselves if I'm putting words in your mouth or not, and not everyone's going to pick up on your edit timestamp.) Unlike you, I can leave a point behind once I've made it; I don't feel the need to celebrate and jump up and down everytime I think I've made a point.

If you go through this entire thread the post in which I discuss advertising costs has no edit time stamp. Uh-oh, looks like Admiral Piett will be taking your position quite soon.

 

[Rampage Bentley]

I think the thing about people bashing TNA's booking gets exaggerated.

TNA does have some illogical booking, and almost all of it has been covered. Mark Madden has said in his editorials that Vince Russo books angles and when people point out holes, fallacies, and otherwise illogical gaps, Vince just shrugs it off and replies "no one cares, it's wrestling." Whether this is completely true or not, I don't know but a wise mangod once told us to judge a tree by its fruits. There's some gaps in logic and plot holes in TNA's angles and people get all bent out of shape about them, I for example am one of these people. I don't "hate" TNA, I watch it every week making sure I give it ratings, and unless I really feel its not worth it, I buy their PPV's. But because I complain about such things I'm labeled a "TNA hater" and there are people who love TNA who defend it, and instead of just saying I disagree, they call the original complainer "stupid" which gets the first guy going and riles him up even more, his (now) hatred of TNA has just doubled. Rinse and repeat 50 times and that's why we have so many people arguing so voraciously

 

[manstis1804]

Examples of shitty TNA booking: DREAM MATCH Samoa Joe vs. RVD, first time ever!!!...unpromoted before Impact, RVD wins 9 minutes. Desmond Wolfe, voted BY THE FANS as top contender for the world title, RVD beats him in 3 minutes good bye. RVD beats Jeff Hardy and AJ Styles in the same night, no sweat, in two "DREAM MATCHES" that barely effects the rating. Desmond Wolfe going from being Kurt Angle's nemesis and having his number to teaming with Brutus Magnus on Xplosion. Jay Lethal has his star making win against Ric Flair, only to lose to Jeff Hardy the next Impact in 5 minutes and not be seen again for like 3 months. Samoa Joe, kidnapped, announcers and wrestlers do not care whatsoever, hes back a month later never mentioned again. AJ Styles vs. Sabu in a ladder match, un-promoted before the show. AJ Styles, from established loved fighting babyface champ to weak Ric Flair-wannabe/impersonator, no one buys it. Val Venis, old WWF midcarder, over Christopher Daniels, world title contender the month beofre, clean as a whistle in one of Daniels's few bad matches ever (Val's push predictably goes nowhere). The biggest match on the live Impact before the TEN TEN TEN is between a 40 year old and a 60 year old, and the main plotline is "will the 50 year old that can barely walk get back in the ring at the PPV?" AJ Styles is promoted as Mr. TNA, TNA is the house AJ built, yet he is firmly entrenched in the midcard. Bubba the Love Sponge got TV time. So did the Nasty Boys. Tommy Dreamer main evented impact like 5 weeks in a row. Abyss is THE ONLY HEEL MAIN EVENTER. Abyssamania happened. Abyss has a weapon which is pretty much unusable in any wrestling scenario, and has only managed to hit someone with it once despite carrying it to the ring for months. Stevie Richards randomly pins Abyss with no follow up. Ken Anderson goes from wildly entertaining antagonist to a boring, humble, respectful guy. Angle and Hardy have a main event style match that completely upstages and buries the actual main event match which was of equal importance, making Pope and Anderson look awful (YES this is a booking issue, 30 minutes kicking out of every finisher ever>12 minutes and a ho-hum finish(. RVD bludgeoned by nails to be sent home for a month getting kayfabe attempted murdered and needing a blood transfusion because TNA "BOOKED" him on too many shows and used up too many contract dates, his title is stripped but he his back in action before we even crown the new champ (this is bad booking on like 12 different levels lol!) This is all from this year, and there's a lot more of it but you gotta get the point by now. People always say TNA's booking sucks because there are so many instances when it really does suck.

 

[manstis1804]

Honestly people are so quick to judge TNA but its not like WWE's is that much better, it will be very intersting in 2 to 3 years when guys like taker, kane, jericho, HHH, Edge(he has gone on record saying he will soon) are gone and the WWE doesnt have those stars who the 21 and older crowd remember from their childhood, who tune in to see those individuals.

Some booking is bad some booking is good the problem with TNA is they have problems figuring out who to but their chips behind, like one of the posters said keeping the MCMG away from the titles for so long is a prime example, but people never want to give TNA credit either, remember AJ being Angles bitch, only to end up winning the title at bound for Glory, then ther was the whole side story line between AJ and sting that showed in the ending of the match at BFG

TNA booking is not consistent which is the problem no organization alive today has consistent booking TNA's problem is they dont have mega stars to attract the viewers regardless of the storyline. I have four brothers two elementary school aged ones could give a shyt less who John Cena is facing or the storyline as long as cena is in that ring. The other two that are in highschool could carless about the storyline as long as they see orton go crazy slapping the ground and Rko's someone.

For people who say TNA has stars they just dont book them well i say, sorry but watching wrestling for many years i tuned in to see certain guys HBK, Sting, Savage, The Rock and if I saw them in ring action I was content, and good booking just made it all that more captivating, TNA has good in ring workers, a handlefull (5-8 potential stars, when I say potential I mean that some point in the future they will be able to do what memorable wrestlers do and thats draw). That MIGHT be able to start a strong fanbase to bring too the company. Its all about how they elevate their game when they are on that camera, and Yes! I understand booking plays a large roll but its NOT everything... Imo TNA has 5 guys worth while to put their chips behind Samoa Joe, Anderson, Abyss, Aj Styles, The Pope. Add on Jeff Hardy( If he doesnt get charge with a jail or worse prison sentence) After BFG, TNA needs to have consistent booking around these guys, first and foremost. To me 10-10-10 will be the final factor alot has been building up to it. Booking sucks yes some of it those, some of it isnt that bad either it seems like TNA put all their chips in at BFG because I trully believe if the totally bomb at BFG they are in trouble. At the same I dont think the are going to do something that monumental in wrestling history, it will most likely be something that elevates TNA as a company in some fashion

This is about TNA, of course WWE has shitty booking its WWE. That doesn't mean its okay for TNA to also suck. 'But-but WWE pushes John Cen-er he only haz FIVE MOVEZ"...c'mon guys really? I know thats not this posters main point, but there's way too much "well WWE suxcks too, how come no one calls them out on it (which people most certainly do)" from 'you people'.

 

[GREENGHOSTMBAUVLN]

Abyssamania, the MCMGs not getting a title run for 3 years, Samoa Joe's kidnapping, The unexplained Deception angle, Hardcore Justice, Orlando Jordan and pushing Rob Terry. And that's off the top of my head.

TNA's booking gets shit on because they do a lot of illogical angles and rapidly change direction. Not a new criticism either, fans were chanting "Fire Russo" years ago.

so every angle gotta be explained to u huh what is u like 12 what u dont got yo own mind to assume or predict huh aint no unexplained angles in wrestling everything gets explained sooner or later and im wit u on orlando jordan friutcake azz but whats wrong wit rob terry

 

[Zeven_Zion]

Just for the record, anyone who bitches and moans about the "Deception" Angle and the "They" Angle, is officially a big, fat, greasy, nasty moron.

Look at this way : some of you like CSI, right? There's a bunch of mysteries and hidden plots in every episode, and you watch 'till the end to see who was the killer, who helped him, how it happened, when it happened, so on and so forth. There's that thrill of going "Ohhhhh! So that's why this happened!". You put the pieces together when you're given the answers IN THE END and it all suddenly makes all the sense in the world!

That's exactly what TNA is doing. Except that their episode is nine or ten or whatever months long. Little of this makes sense, but it will soon enough. We WILL be given all the answers, and ONLY THEN can we look back on the entire nine months, put the pieces together and see if it all fits. Judging and hating the "they" and "Deception" angles before they're done, is like turning CSI off in the middle of the show, 'cause it has no answers yet. It's like saying that that delicious pie yo momma is making is disgusting before it's even half-baked. Capisce? Just wait it out. Once we get all the answers - then shit away or praise away. Until then, shhh and enjoy what TNA's doing, 'cause trust me, nobody else would care enough to do such huge storylines.

 

[GREENGHOSTMBAUVLN]

thats exactly what im saying dont shit on something becuz its confuses u wheres the fun in that half of the tna viewers watch it cuz they give u that suspence that wwe used to so just like zion said sit back and enjoy

 

[manstis1804]

Just for the record, anyone who bitches and moans about the "Deception" Angle and the "They" Angle, is officially a big, fat, greasy, nasty moron.

Look at this way : some of you like CSI, right? There's a bunch of mysteries and hidden plots in every episode, and you watch 'till the end to see who was the killer, who helped him, how it happened, when it happened, so on and so forth. There's that thrill of going "Ohhhhh! So that's why this happened!". You put the pieces together when you're given the answers IN THE END and it all suddenly makes all the sense in the world!

That's exactly what TNA is doing. Except that their episode is nine or ten or whatever months long. Little of this makes sense, but it will soon enough. We WILL be given all the answers, and ONLY THEN can we look back on the entire nine months, put the pieces together and see if it all fits. Judging and hating the "they" and "Deception" angles before they're done, is like turning CSI off in the middle of the show, 'cause it has no answers yet. It's like saying that that delicious pie yo momma is making is disgusting before it's even half-baked. Capisce? Just wait it out. Once we get all the answers - then shit away or praise away. Until then, shhh and enjoy what TNA's doing, 'cause trust me, nobody else would care enough to do such huge storylines.

So, since the angle is like a CSI episode streched over 10 months, its...good? Where are we going here? They weren't giving any information to keep things interesting, here finally the last month before the PPV they're starting to drop hints and make it interesting but there was literally nothing of note done with both of these angles for approximately 8 months. That is why people think they suck, and I agree with them.

And, for the record, I hate CSI and there are plenty of shitty whodunnit crime dramas on cable tv. I have done exactly what you said, watched 10 minutes of an episode and turned it off because I didn't give a shit why that dude got killed or who did it because it was UNINTERESTING TO ME. I don't want a CSI episode, I want a wrestling show. I'm pretty sure a lot of people would agree with me.