The World Cup: Right Time?

[Brilliant Human Being]

The World Cup. Quite possibly the most anticipated event in many peoples sporting calendars all over the world, and definately the most watched even in the world. And quite rightly too, held every four years, it is a celebration of football, gathering the world's foremost and best footballers, serving as a showcase for those such as Messi and Ronaldo to show their undeniable talents; and also a shopping window for those such as Simon Kjaer of Denmark to prove their talents to any potential suitors. No-one is denying that it is a great spectacle, and this current World Cup is proof of this, the vibrance of the South African support maing for some truly fantastic atmosphere in every one of the grounds. However, I ask you... is the World Cup played at the right time of year?

I ask this for a couple of reasons, all revolving around the same main topic. Firstly, I give you the words of Franz Beckenbauer, spoken about the England team:

Lions in winter, lambs in summer.

For those who dont't understand, Beckenbauer is referring to the perceived poor conditioning of the Engalnd team, proved by our COMPLETELY inept display. Basically, Beckenbauer is referring to the fatigue problem. This problem is not just English, we see it with many teams throughout the World Cup. Fernando Torres and Iniesta with Spain, Wayne Rooney and Gareth Barry with England. This is not just fatigue, their poor form throughout this tournament is due to injuries sustained in the latter stages of the domestic season.

And therein lies my problem with the timing of the World Cup.

It is supposed to be a celebration of the best footballers in the world coming together in one place. So why does it make sense to have some of the best players in the world injured or unfit for the tournament? The World Cup starts in June. Specifically, the 11th June. The domestic season in England finished on May 9th. A month. A month for many players to recover from injuries in time to play, and even then their rehabilitaion is rushed, maening they are still unfit. The solution? Move the World Cup to August. Why? To make sure that the best players in the world are fit, rested up from an arduous season, rested from any niggling injuries.

Your thoughts.

 

[Ferbian]

I would say that it's played in the right time of the year.

A thing you have to think about is that you're watching football, at least as a kid you're gonna want to play it yourself, you idolize the players, say "I'm ...." when you're playing, trying to be that person.

Soccer just doesn't cut it in the winter period, at least from that perspective in terms of kids wanting to play, it's cold outside, and soccer generates heat in terms of exercising, so why would you wanna run around playing soccer in a coat?

Also you have to think of the fact that even for the wrestlers it's climatically better, they don't have to deal with icy cold weather to play in if we're thinking playing in the winter, and besides winter is the only actual period they could be playing as well due to world cups not interfering with the regular season plays.

Interfering with season plays would grind one of them to a halt, and one of them wouldn't benefit from it, as much as playing in different time periods.

You talk about injuries, again, someone is always gonna be injured, there's no sport there's injury free, some is gonna miss it, but who's to say that said player wouldn't be injured if the world cup was played in the winter, spring or autumn?

Taking all of these things into consideration, I'd say the world cup is played in the right period of time.

 

[Brilliant Human Being]

I would say that it's played in the right time of the year.

A thing you have to think about is that you're watching football, at least as a kid you're gonna want to play it yourself, you idolize the players, say "I'm ...." when you're playing, trying to be that person.

Soccer just doesn't cut it in the winter period, at least from that perspective in terms of kids wanting to play, it's cold outside, and soccer generates heat in terms of exercising, so why would you wanna run around playing soccer in a coat?

Also you have to think of the fact that even for the wrestlers it's climatically better, they don't have to deal with icy cold weather to play in if we're thinking playing in the winter, and besides winter is the only actual period they could be playing as well due to world cups not interfering with the regular season plays.

Interfering with season plays would grind one of them to a halt, and one of them wouldn't benefit from it, as much as playing in different time periods.

You talk about injuries, again, someone is always gonna be injured, there's no sport there's injury free, some is gonna miss it, but who's to say that said player wouldn't be injured if the world cup was played in the winter, spring or autumn?

Taking all of these things into consideration, I'd say the world cup is played in the right period of time.

Re-read my post, I said nothing about moving it the winter, I said August. Although the winter qould be a stupid idea. And yes, as you say, no sport is injury free, which is quite true. However, moving it to August, when the majority of the players have no competitive football to play, which gives them three months, from May to August, to let those that are injured completely recuperate and rehabilitate properly, leaving them raring to go and perform to their fullest potential in what should be the pinnacle of their sporting lives. Some names here, and ask yourself, what do all these three have in common?

Wayne Rooney.
Fernando Torres.
Cristiano Ronaldo.

All in the upper echelon of players, they've got that in common. All came into this tournament with niggling injuries, got that in common. All would have performed to their fullest potential had they recovered from said injuries, got that in common. Moving the World Cup to August, would I believe, make sure that these players have the best possible oppurtunity to perform well, obviously without any freak training ground accidents.

And yes, as you said, children watch the World Cup to catch a glimpse of their idols, so what good is it for them to see Ronaldo dragged along as a passenger as he was tonight? They want to see their idols in top form.

Furthermore, a move in timings for the World Cup will give every one of the 32 teams more time to train with each other, learning hwo to play with one another, improving as a team together, and thus creating a better spectacle.

 

[Ferbian]

I read your post, and just argued for winter also being a bad place to move it because of the cold, August would be nearing the end of summer, entering a cold season, besides I discussed the fact that you have to take club seasons into consideration, club seasons start in August, if we're to move the seasons, we have to either cut off some of the games, or move them into periods where playing wouldn't be ment to be active neither.

And those seasons would be winter or later summer, and even considering that if they played the seasons in different periods, who's to say the player wouldn't be injured during that period of time? hell people get injured during practice, which happens all the time, so there's really no way of creating a redundant system to take care of injuries to include the greater players just because they're great.

So I say it again, everybody gets injured from time to time, and have to deal with it, it's nothing we can work against, and it'd be awfully unfair to take into consideration that "oh well, Ronaldo is ready, let's play the tournament, up yours less talented player" which could be a potential thing to happen because the "less talented player" gets injured during the time where the world cup was supposed to be played.

And even with that, who's to say that Ronaldo wouldn't be injured in again just after returning from injury? I know it's a odd way to draw experience from, but I've played Football Manager 2010, having Agger injured the match right after him returning after 3 months of injury, he was out another 2 months, to get injured 2 matches later to be out for 3 weeks.

Dragging out the tournaments due to someone being injured is just unfair to the rest of the talent who could get injured in that period of time.

Sure the children would have to watch their idols being injured or something, but there might as well be someone they like that isn't injured, personally I couldn't give a damn about any of the 3 you mentioned besides Torres, but I still enjoyed watching someone not injured that I did care about: Steven Gerrard.

 

[Miko]

Soccer just doesn't cut it in the winter period, at least from that perspective in terms of kids wanting to play, it's cold outside, and soccer generates heat in terms of exercising, so why would you wanna run around playing soccer in a coat?

Well, because like you said, playing football generates heat, thereby removing any need for a coat?

Anyway, the World Cup is probably in the only place it can be, clubs are starting to want to play warm up fixtures again during August and unfortunately with the premier league players, club does seem to come before country. July would be the best month, start in July then finish at the begginning of August, gives all the players time to rest from their seasons.

That being said, the whole "tiredness" excuse is pretty pathetic, it's only really the England side that seems to suffer from it, the German's played as many games if not more than what we did last season, they didnt look tired.
Maicon's just finished a season in which Inter Milan won the treble, meaning that he had to play an unbielevable amount of games, yet he's in cracking form for Brazil.

Maybe some of these other guys need more time in the gym.

 

[Brilliant Human Being]

I read your post, and just argued for winter also being a bad place to move it because of the cold, August would be nearing the end of summer, entering a cold season, besides I discussed the fact that you have to take club seasons into consideration, club seasons start in August, if we're to move the seasons, we have to either cut off some of the games, or move them into periods where playing wouldn't be ment to be active neither.

August is not entering a cold season, the temperatures on average in August are perfect for football. Warm but not too warm, like it is in South Africa now, where its winter. WINTER! It's cold in winter, yet there's a pretty good World Cup going on at the moment wouldn't you say? And I'm not proposing the World Cup be moved to overlap with the domestic season, as that is complete folly, rather starting perhaps in the last week of July, and finishing in the second week of August. Three weeks, and then afterwards one or two weeks for the clubs to get the players into shape.

And those seasons would be winter or later summer, and even considering that if they played the seasons in different periods, who's to say the player wouldn't be injured during that period of time? hell people get injured during practice, which happens all the time, so there's really no way of creating a redundant system to take care of injuries to include the greater players just because they're great.

As you said yourself in your previous post, half the appeal for kids to watch the tournament is to see the players they idolize. Whats's the fun of not seeing their favourite player in full flow? But maybe using the example of world class players was a bad one, the point I'm trying to make is that moving the it back a month would create a better spectacle, and put all teams on a level playing field by having their best players fit. As I said before, the whole point of the World Cup is to gather the world greatest footballers together at the peak of their powers.

And are you seriously telling me that there is more risk of a serious injury in training than in a competitive domestic match? The likelohood is that training ground injuries are freaks, most injuries come from competitive games.

So I say it again, everybody gets injured from time to time, and have to deal with it, it's nothing we can work against, and it'd be awfully unfair to take into consideration that "oh well, Ronaldo is ready, let's play the tournament, up yours less talented player" which could be a potential thing to happen because the "less talented player" gets injured during the time where the world cup was supposed to be played.

Yes, everyone does get injured from time to time. 3 months from the end of the domestic season to the start of the tournament however, would completely enable the player concerned to heal their injury prperly. As for your second point, thats completely not what I'm saying and you know it. And yes, there is nothing we can do about people getting injured just before the start of the tournament, HOWEVER, we can sure as hell give them every oppurtunity to be at their best for it.

And even with that, who's to say that Ronaldo wouldn't be injured in again just after returning from injury? I know it's a odd way to draw experience from, but I've played Football Manager 2010, having Agger injured the match right after him returning after 3 months of injury, he was out another 2 months, to get injured 2 matches later to be out for 3 weeks.

Football Manager has no indication as to actual football, and as such can not be used in this discussion. Good game though. Nice choice.

Dragging out the tournaments due to someone being injured is just unfair to the rest of the talent who could get injured in that period of time.

It's not delaying the tournament for one person to recover from an injury, it is to give the rest of the squad as well a chance to recover properly from any strains they have sustained from the domestic season. If being tired is a valid reason to not perform, and I'm not saying it is, but if it is; then surely waiting a couple of months to start would be beneficial to everyone watching the event, and participating in it.

Sure the children would have to watch their idols being injured or something, but there might as well be someone they like that isn't injured, personally I couldn't give a damn about any of the 3 you mentioned besides Torres, but I still enjoyed watching someone not injured that I did care about: Steven Gerrard.

Sorry, but I disagree. Some kids tune in to a match thinking 'Yes, I'm finally going to see Ronaldo play' and then after it feel distinctly underwhelmed. I fail to see what relevance Steven Gerrard has in this discussion.

 

[Ferbian]

Well, because like you said, playing football generates heat, thereby removing any need for a coat?

Speaking of personal experience in terms of freezing like hell playing soccer in the winter without a jacket on.

August is not entering a cold season, the temperatures on average in August are perfect for football. Warm but not too warm, like it is in South Africa now, where its winter. WINTER! It's cold in winter, yet there's a pretty good World Cup going on at the moment wouldn't you say? And I'm not proposing the World Cup be moved to overlap with the domestic season, as that is complete folly, rather starting perhaps in the last week of July, and finishing in the second week of August. Three weeks, and then afterwards one or two weeks for the clubs to get the players into shape.

True, August is not entering a cold season, I should've rephrased that in terms of the fact that entering September it will slowly get a little colder, even though I do know that you plan on having the world cup starting a little later on.

South Africa is an odd one I would say, seeing as South Africa is a pretty damn warm place no matter the season from my understanding, but I would say the world cup right now is mediocre (but that's a personal preference in the way that I was disappointed to see the majority of big nations gone already)

As you said yourself in your previous post, half the appeal for kids to watch the tournament is to see the players they idolize. Whats's the fun of not seeing their favourite player in full flow? But maybe using the example of world class players was a bad one, the point I'm trying to make is that moving the it back a month would create a better spectacle, and put all teams on a level playing field by having their best players fit. As I said before, the whole point of the World Cup is to gather the world greatest footballers together at the peak of their powers.

Like I have already said, there's nothing stopping the worlds greatest players from getting injured during the period of time that the world cup is being pushed forward.

Certainly the world cup should be allowed to display the greatest, I'm not denying that, I'm just saying pushing the period of which the world cup is started could leave someone in place for another injury in between that period, or someone else with less talent but just as deserving to be on the national squads wouldn't be included, how is that fair?

Sure we could talk about the world cup generating more money from people wanting to watch Ronaldo over, Thomas Sørensen (not same position, but sure as hell a HUGE difference in talent) but does that make Thomas any less of a worthy qualifier and a worthy name to be there because of the given time he could very well become injured?

And are you seriously telling me that there is more risk of a serious injury in training than in a competitive domestic match? The likelohood is that training ground injuries are freaks, most injuries come from competitive games.

Of course I'm not saying there's a bigger risk, don't be silly, I'm saying that there's a chance nonetheless, we've heard of people getting injured during training as well.

I will take the Football Manager into my argument again, because some of it does have a legitimate potential of happening, and from my experience it has happened to my talents in the game to get injured during training.

Yes, everyone does get injured from time to time. 3 months from the end of the domestic season to the start of the tournament however, would completely enable the player concerned to heal their injury prperly. As for your second point, thats completely not what I'm saying and you know it. And yes, there is nothing we can do about people getting injured just before the start of the tournament, HOWEVER, we can sure as hell give them every oppurtunity to be at their best for it.

Yes sure we can give them the chance of getting ready for it, that I do follow, but I don't see the need to push the world cup for it, because of the fact that no matter how you twist and turn it injuries is bound to happen.

And just as well Ronaldo could've been ready for this world cup had we pushed it a bit, but who's saying Forlan, Messi, Gerrard or Villa wouldn't have been injured? hell one of them could get injured today, or tomorrow when they're preparing for their matches (well not Gerrard, but you know where I'm getting at)

Football Manager has no indication as to actual football, and as such can not be used in this discussion. Good game though. Nice choice.

It is indeed a good game.

It's perfectly legit to use in this discussion if you ask me, considering while it's not actual football, the game in itself does generate the feeling of actually managing a game, actually being ready if someone gets injured, therefore, actually pointing out that someone could get injured the exact week, game, hell training session after returning from injury, accidents happen daily.

Who is gonna stop Gerrard from not accidentally injuring Rooney during a training session? that's right, nobody.

It's not delaying the tournament for one person to recover from an injury, it is to give the rest of the squad as well a chance to recover properly from any strains they have sustained from the domestic season. If being tired is a valid reason to not perform, and I'm not saying it is, but if it is; then surely waiting a couple of months to start would be beneficial to everyone watching the event, and participating in it.

Sure it's not delaying just for one person, I get that, but the primary focus of this is to get the greater talent ready, while in the process it certainly does help the other talent from getting ready from smaller nagging injuries, but even with that, there's nothing to say that they will recover fully, or for that sake that they won't get injured.

I know half of this post revolves around getting injured in the extra time, but it is really the primary focus because without a doubt, it's a thing that could potentially be impossible to avoid.

Sorry, but I disagree. Some kids tune in to a match thinking 'Yes, I'm finally going to see Ronaldo play' and then after it feel distinctly underwhelmed. I fail to see what relevance Steven Gerrard has in this discussion.

Don't be sorry, we can't all agree.

Certainly it'd be a bummer to watch Ronaldo not at his fullest, but not everybody is gonna be cheering for Ronaldo, and I've covered this a multiple amount of times, he could've gotten injured again during the period where the world cup should have been initially, as well as someone else.

Steven Gerrard matters in this discussion that we can't sit around waiting for someone's favorite players to be ready, as I said, I don't particularly care for Ronaldo, but I care for Gerrard, someone who is not injured, but could've gotten injured during the time where the world cup was pushed.

 

[Brilliant Human Being]

First, I want to apoligise for maybe coming off as a bit of an asshole here, reading the post again seems like I did.

South Africa is an odd one I would say, seeing as South Africa is a pretty damn warm place no matter the season from my understanding, but I would say the world cup right now is mediocre (but that's a personal preference in the way that I was disappointed to see the majority of big nations gone already)

From my understanding (and unfortunately a brief Google search could not find me data to prove this) some parts of the country are particularly cold at this time of year, indeed there have been shots of the players on the bench using towels to cover themeselves up (the French against Mexico, I believe). On average, I think you're right to say its mediocre, the first round of group games were very underwhelming, but from then on the tournament as a whole has got progresssively better, I feel.

Like I have already said, there's nothing stopping the worlds greatest players from getting injured during the period of time that the world cup is being pushed forward.

Of course there's nothing stopping them getting injured, however as I said previously, barring a freak, freak accident, injuries in training hardly ever happen. In fact, only one person has got injured in training preparations for the World Cup meaning they cannot take part in it: Rio Ferdinand. That's one player, out of 32 squads of 23, which is 736 players. And while I may have just shot myself in the foot with that argument, I feel that this only proves serious injuries in training are very rare occurences.

Certainly the world cup should be allowed to display the greatest, I'm not denying that, I'm just saying pushing the period of which the world cup is started could leave someone in place for another injury in between that period, or someone else with less talent but just as deserving to be on the national squads wouldn't be included, how is that fair?

I see what you're saying, but also in the event of someone getting injured during that hypothetical period of June-July, there is more time for full recovery. For example, Didier Drogba broke his arm in a friendly against Japan not a week before the World Cup was due to start. He recovered in time, but was still way short of full fitness. So this two month period, as well as giving more time for the team to bond, would give a rest period to those who are injured, interspersed with friendlies to give the time for the coach to find the best system.

Sure we could talk about the world cup generating more money from people wanting to watch Ronaldo over, Thomas Sørensen (not same position, but sure as hell a HUGE difference in talent) but does that make Thomas any less of a worthy qualifier and a worthy name to be there because of the given time he could very well become injured?

Of course it doesn't, but I think we are getting to dragged down on the injuries issue here. The mian point of my OP was to address the issue of players being tired after a season. For instance, the England squad played an average of 61 games last season, the Germans played 62.5. The World Cup starts a month after the domestic season finishes. So the players will be fresher, and therefore better if the tournament moves a month back.

Yes sure we can give them the chance of getting ready for it, that I do follow, but I don't see the need to push the world cup for it, because of the fact that no matter how you twist and turn it injuries is bound to happen.

They are bound to happen, but they have more of a chance to be healed before the tournament starts.

I know half of this post revolves around getting injured in the extra time, but it is really the primary focus because without a doubt, it's a thing that could potentially be impossible to avoid.

It's fine, at least half of my post revolves around me countering your arguments. But I created this thread with the pprimary focus intended to be the fatigue aspect.

Don't be sorry, we can't all agree.

Agreed.

Certainly it'd be a bummer to watch Ronaldo not at his fullest, but not everybody is gonna be cheering for Ronaldo, and I've covered this a multiple amount of times, he could've gotten injured again during the period where the world cup should have been initially, as well as someone else.

I used Ronaldo as an example, you could substitute any player in there, Ronaldo; Messi; Tevez; Park-Ji-sung.

 

[Ferbian]

First, I want to apoligise for maybe coming off as a bit of an asshole here, reading the post again seems like I did.

Of course not, don't worry about it.

From my understanding (and unfortunately a brief Google search could not find me data to prove this) some parts of the country are particularly cold at this time of year, indeed there have been shots of the players on the bench using towels to cover themeselves up (the French against Mexico, I believe). On average, I think you're right to say its mediocre, the first round of group games were very underwhelming, but from then on the tournament as a whole has got progresssively better, I feel.

Yeah I can't comment on the cold neither, but I would assume it being Africa, stereotyping the temperature would make me believe that it's not that could, also considering how many there is sitting in some kind of t-shirt etc. in the crowd.

Some matches are played in the evening period (evening of South Africa at least) and I would assume it does get a bit chill there.

Well looking at the quarter finals card right now, the tournament looks good, but looking at the final 16 members it looks really surprising.

Of course there's nothing stopping them getting injured, however as I said previously, barring a freak, freak accident, injuries in training hardly ever happen. In fact, only one person has got injured in training preparations for the World Cup meaning they cannot take part in it: Rio Ferdinand. That's one player, out of 32 squads of 23, which is 736 players. And while I may have just shot myself in the foot with that argument, I feel that this only proves serious injuries in training are very rare occurences.

I do get that it's a rare case, but nonetheless training injuries happens, and it could happen again, there's a few people in my friend surrounding that felt a little saddened they didn't get to watch Rio Ferdinand, especially cause he could've made a difference for the English people to some extend, which would therefore leave me assuming that we actually missed some talent as well, and that he wouldn't have been ready for later on neither.

I see what you're saying, but also in the event of someone getting injured during that hypothetical period of June-July, there is more time for full recovery. For example, Didier Drogba broke his arm in a friendly against Japan not a week before the World Cup was due to start. He recovered in time, but was still way short of full fitness. So this two month period, as well as giving more time for the team to bond, would give a rest period to those who are injured, interspersed with friendlies to give the time for the coach to find the best system.

That's true, I heard about that, but again, there's nothing saying if the tournament had been moved, that he wouldn't have gotten injured a week before the moved world cup.

Of course it doesn't, but I think we are getting to dragged down on the injuries issue here. The mian point of my OP was to address the issue of players being tired after a season. For instance, the England squad played an average of 61 games last season, the Germans played 62.5. The World Cup starts a month after the domestic season finishes. So the players will be fresher, and therefore better if the tournament moves a month back.

Yes sure being tired is probably one of the only reasons we would move it, but then even with that who's to say that because of that, the seasons wouldn't be moved as well? I wouldn't know what they would have planned for the regular seasons.

They are bound to happen, but they have more of a chance to be healed before the tournament starts.

It's fine, at least half of my post revolves around me countering your arguments. But I created this thread with the pprimary focus intended to be the fatigue aspect.

Well we're sticking to the spam rules so it can't possibly be that bad

I used Ronaldo as an example, you could substitute any player in there, Ronaldo; Messi; Tevez; Park-Ji-sung.

I know, I was simply using Gerrard as well as someone who is not injured but I like to see.

 

[Phoenix]

As the saying goes, if it's not broke, don't fix it.

The World Cup has always been played in the summer and it's a policy that has remained well for the many years it has been featured. Most of the biggest events in sports happen in the Summer, the Olympics, Wimbledon, PGA Tours, etc. The problem is regarding the players, they seem to forget that they're paid too much for what they're worth and yet still make demands. They're suppose to be atheletic and play as often as possible. Usually every 2-4 years, they get a good summer's break, what is one year's difference going to make, especially when they usually get a month's break in advanced.

As Ferb, said, the World Cup is played at the right of year for the climate and has been fine, just people guys who get paid £30 mil a year can't keep fit simply means they shouldn't be in that field or take a pay cut. As for people playing poorly, they have no excuse, for some people like Ronaldo, he's an overpaid arrogant git who just shows up when he wants to, he's playing crap cause he doesn't care, he did this at Man Utd before he moving to Madrid. Gerrard at least played alright for England despite playing out of position, but he's not always been successful in putting his club output into England, we've seen this before, especially as him and Lampard on the field are not a decent combination for they're both attack minded.

In the end, there's nothing wrong with when the Cup is played, simply put, if they're getting paid so much, they should show up for it, it's never been a problem before, so why now?

 

[TheAnimal]

I think it is played at the right time. I think that all major leagues are basically done with by the time that it comes around for 1, im not sure about the break from season end - World Cup starting though, that could maybe be a bit longer, but the only problem with that is then it could impact on the following season starting.

Injuries are not something that can be planned for, they can occur at any given time, on the training ground or in a match. Or if you are a certain player (and i really wish i could remember his name) they could occur whilst eating a lasagne. I think maybe with the close season some players have operations scheduled or rehab time but that will occur anyway no matter when the world cup was and i dont see the domestic seasons being interrupted for an international tournament. That would cause problems due to the qualifiers and adequate preparation.

For me the World Cup has always been a memorable event that when i think of that summer, i think of the world cup. I dont think that should change.

I know the excuse for England is that they are tired, but a lot of international players are here too and they are coping ok. I think though a winter break may not help much. It would extend the season and then the world cup situation would be compounded because they would have extra time onto the season and then this would have a knock-on effect because there would be less time for the players between the tournament and season end. But other countries do it though. Thing is when would a winter break be? Christmas fixtures like Boxing Day, New Years etc have always been a good part of the festive period so it shouldnt be then.

Moving the World Cup to August would postpone the start of the season to at least October because the players would want some kind of holiday. If the season were to start straight after though, thinking of the fans, they would be going to wherever the host is, to then come home and go all around the country for the following season. Plus the World Cup after period when you kind of refelct and assess the tournament would be gone. People would have the football in quick succession if they did that.