The Debate of the Decade

[Disturbed]

Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls of all ages, this is it. This is what you have all been waiting for. This is the official debate between Macios and Jackiz Kirey. The rules are simple... There will be a poll, asking which poster won this epic debate. The poll will close monday. Whomever has the most votes will win. You can post as much as you want. I have come up with the amazing oppurtunity to decide the topic that these two sausage farmers will be debating on this weekend. I have decided that the question will be, Are Factions in Pro Wrestling, Good Or Bad?

I swear to God, if either of you two ask me(or anyone else for that matter) what a faction is you will be disqualified in a blink of an eye.

Prisoners, Debate!!!

This is going to be epic.

 

[UltimateHitman]

<-------- sits down w/his bowl of popcorn

 

[Tech N9ne]

I have come up with the amazing oppurtunity to decide the topic that these two sausage farmers will be debating on this weekend.

That had me dying!!

 

[Disturbed]

No one has anything?

 

[Tech N9ne]

It's lookin' bleak.

 

[Mac Attack]

Sorry I had to go to a suprise birthday dinner for me. Starting on it right now.

 

[Disturbed]

Go ahead and Happy Birthday!

 

[Mac Attack]

A faction in the wrestling is most certainly a good thing. The simple reason is because it allows unpredictability and chaos to be always present on WWE/TNA T.V. Also, it allows multiple personalities to collide together into one group. Factions are also what made up the better part of the Attitude Era. Some of the more notable factions during this time were legendary factions like D-Generation X, Nation of Domination or The Corporation, and the Ministry of Darkness. Also currently there are the two main factions that dominate the current status of the WWE in The Nexus and the Corre.

Over last decade we have seen some notable factions appear on WWE take for example the sucesses of Evolution. At the height of Evolution's power, the group controlled all of the male-based championships of Raw after Armageddon. Batista teamed with Flair to win the World Tag Team Championship from the Dudley Boyz (Bubba Ray Dudley and D-Von Dudley) in a Tag Team Turmoil match, Orton captured the WWE Intercontinental Championship from Rob Van Dam, and Triple H regained the World Heavyweight Championship from Goldberg (in a Triple Threat match that also involved Kane), with the help of the other members.
In January 2004 at the Royal Rumble, Flair and Batista successfully defended the World Tag Team Championship against the Dudley Boyz in a Tables match, and World Heavyweight Champion Triple H fought Shawn Michaels to no contest in a Last Man Standing match, thus retaining the championship. Flair and Batista exchanged the World Tag Team Championship with Booker T and Rob Van Dam.[ At WrestleMania XX, Evolution defeated the Rock 'n' Sock Connection (The Rock (in his final professional wrestling match) and Mick Foley) in a 3-on-2 handicap match. Later that night, Triple H lost the World Heavyweight Championship to Chris Benoit (in a triple threat match that also involved Shawn Michaels) when he tapped out to the Crippler Crossface. At Backlash, Flair lost to Shelton Benjamin in one-on-one action.[ Later that night, Orton defended the WWE Intercontinental Championship successfully against Cactus Jack in a Hardcore match, while Chris Benoit retained the World Heavyweight Championship in a triple threat match against Triple H and Shawn Michaels, this time forcing Michaels to submit with the Sharpshooter. Triple H and Shawn Michaels would later continue their feud at Bad Blood 2004 inside a Hell in the Cell, which was won by Triple H and thus ending their feud.

Factions are clearly very sucessful and add unpredictability to the programming. This helps captivate the audience and allows for WWe creative to truly have free reign over what happens. Also, it helps establish wrestlers in the WWE for example Randy Orton in both evolution and Legacy, Wade Barett in Nexus and Corre, even Triple H in evolution was something new for his character. It also helps establish memories that will last in the WWE minds forever. Just like the Nexus invasion of Raw.

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLrUmWwvrYc&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Mac Attack]

This link helps also helps prove my point as this is when Nexus did invade Raw. This is one of those nights that will never be forgotten in the WWE from my opinion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLrUmWwvrYc&feature=related

 

[Disturbed]

I am certainly most suprised by your answer. I am suprised you went into that much detail and I dount Kirey can do that. You went into some detail that wasn't needed though but it wasn't to bad. I don't really agree with you but it wasn't bad.

 

[Mac Attack]

Throughout the years there have been many factions in the WWE. The following list is the past of the WWE. The countless storylines that all these people have had are what makes the history of the WWE. This history is good history and it proves that these factions are a good thing because they are what the WWE Universe remembers down the road after the members of the factions retire. They remember the crazy things these groups did to get their name out there and that is also why factions are good.





The Union (1999) Mankind, Test, Ken Shamrock, Big Show

The Brood (1999) Gangrel, Jeff Hardy, Matt Hardy

The Brood (1998-1999) Gangrel, Edge, Christian

Pretty Mean Sisters (1999) Jacquline, Terri, Ryan Shamrock, Meat

The Corporate Ministry (1999) Shane McMahon, The Undertaker, Paul Bearer,

The Acolytes (Farooq and Bradshaw), Mideon, Viscera, Hunter Hearst Helmsley, Chyna, Greenwhich Posse (Rodney and Pete Gas), Big Boss Man, Vince McMahon

Ministry of Darkness (1999) The Undertaker, Paul Bearer, The Acolytes (Farooq and Bradshaw), Mideon, Viscera, Gangrel, Edge, Christian
The Corporation (1998-1999) Shane McMahon, Pat Patterson, Gerald Brisco, The Big Boss Man, Chyna, Hunter Hearst Helmsley, Mankind, Sgt Slaughter, Shawn Michaels, Kane, Paul Wight, Ken Shamrock, Rocky Maivia, Test, Vince McMahon

DeGeneration X (1997-1999) X-Pac, Jesse James, Billy Gunn, Rick Rude, Jim Neidhart, Mike Tyson, Shawn Michaels, Chyna, Hunter Hearst Helmsley, Tori

Camp Cornette (1995) Jim Cornette, Yokozuna, Owen Hart, The British Bulldog, Vader, Clarence Mason (manager-attorney), Mr. Fuji (manager), Tom Prichard & Jimmy Del Ray, Mantaur

Demolition (1988-1991) Mr. Fuji, Smash, Crush, Axe

Disciples of Apocalypse (1998) Paul Ellering, Chainz, 8-Ball, Skull, Crush

Hart Foundation (1987) Jimmy Hart, Bret Hart, Jim Neidhart, Danny Davis, Honky Tonk Man, Lelani Kai, and Judy Martin

Hart Family (1985) Jimmy Hart (manager), The Missing Link, King Kong Bundy, Greg Valentine

Hart Family/Foundation (1991) Jimmy Hart (manager), Jerry Saggs, Brian

Knobs, Earthquake, Dino Bravo, Typhoon, The Mountie, Ray Rougeau, Ted Dibiase, Irwin R. Shyster

Hart Foundation (1997) Bret Hart, Owen Hart, The British Bulldog, Jim Neidhart, Brian Pillman

Bobby Heenan Family (1986-1990) Bobby "The Brain" Heenan, Andre the Giant, Haku, The Red Rooster, Rick Rude, Mr Perfect, The Barbarian, Tama, Hercules, Harley Race, Paul Orndorff, Arn Anderson, Tully Blanchard, King Kong Bundy, Big John Studd, Brooklyn Brawler

JOB Squad (1998-1999) Al Snow, Bob Holly, Scorpio, Duane Gill, The Blue Meanie

Kaientai (1998) Yamaguchi San, Dick Togo, Sho Funaki, Mens Teioh, Taka Michinoku

LOD 2000 (1998-1999) Road Warrior Hawk, Road Warrior Animal, Darren "Puke" Drozdov, Sunny, Paul Ellering

Los Boricuas (1997-1998) Savio Vega, Miguel Perez, Jose Estrada, Jesus Castillo

The Machines (1987) Capt Lou Albano, Giant Machine, Big Machine, Super Machine, Hulk Machine

Million Dollar Corporation (1995) Ted DiBiase, Irwin R Shyster, Nikolai Volkoff, Kama, Tatanka, Bam Bam Bigelow, The Undertaker II (Brian Lee), The Ringmaster (Steve Austin), The 1-2-3 Kid, Sid, X-anta Klaus, King Kong Bundy

The Nation (1997-1998) Clarence Mason, Crush, Savio Vega, J. C. Ice, Wolfie-D, Ahmed Johnson, Faarooq, Rocky Maivia, Owen Hart, Kama Mustafa, D-Lo Brown, Mark Henry

National Wrestling Alliance (1998) Jim Cornette, Barry Windham, Bombastic Bob, Bodacious Bart, Jeff Jarrett, Ricky Morton, Robert Gibson, Dan Severn
The Oddities (1998-1999) Kurrgan, Giant Silva, George "the Animal" Steele, Jackyl, Hank, the Angry Drunken Dwarf, Fred, the Elephant Boy, Crackhead Bob, Insane Clown Posse (Shaggy-2-Dope and Violent-J), Luna, Golga, Sable
Truth Commission (1998) Jackyl, Kurrgan the Interrogator, Recon, Sniper, The Commandant, Tank

The Radicals (2000) Perry Saturn, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Benoit, and Dean Malenko, Terri Runnells, Chyna

Dream Team (1986-1987) Johnny Valiant (manager), Greg Valentine, Brutus Beefcake, and Dino Bravo.

Demolition (1987-1991) Johnny Valiant, Mr. Fuji, Ax, Smash, Crush
The Powers Of Pain (1988-1989) The Warlord, The Barbarian, Baron Von Raske (manager) and Mr Fuji (manager)

Southern Justice (1998) Tennessee Lee, Jeff Jarrett, Dennis Knight, Mark Canterbury

Mean Street Posse (1999) Shane Mcmahon, Joey Abbs, Rodney, Pete Gas, and Willie Green.

Corporation X (1999) Shane Mcmahon, Shawn Michaels, Chyna and Triple H
The McMahon-Helmsley Faction (2000) Vince Mcmahon, Shane Mcmahon, Stephanie Mcmahon, X-Pac, Road Dogg, Tori, Pat Patterson, Gerald Brisco, Billy Gunn, Triple H, Chris Benoit, Kurt Angle, Test, Albert, Trish Stratus, and Bull Buchannan.

Hell's Henchmen (1999) Farrooq, Bradshaw, and The Jackyl

Acolyte Protection Agency (2000) Farrooq, Bradshaw, Mideon, and Jacquline
The Triangle Of Terror (1991) Sgt. Slaughter, Gen. Adnan, and Col. Mustapha.

T&A (2000) Trish Stratus, Test, Albert, and Val Venis

The Mega Bucks (1988) Bobby The Brain Hennan (manager), Virgil (bodyguard), Million Dollar Man Ted Debiase and Andre The Giant

The Mega Powers (1988) Hulk Hogan, Randy Savage and Miss Elizabeth

The Hulkamaniacs (1993) Jimmy Hart (Manager), Hulk Hogan, Brutus Beefcake

Right to Censorship (2000) Steven Richards, Bull Buchanan, The Goodfather, Val Venis, and Ivory

2 Cool (2000 - 2001) GrandMasta Sexay (Brian Christopher), Scotty Too Hotty (Scott Taylor), Rikishi Phatu, and K Kwick

Lo-Down (2001) Tiger Ali Singh (manager), D-Lo Brown and Chaz

Right To Nudity (2001) The Kat, Faarooq, Bradshaw, and Jacqueline.

X-Factor (2001) X-Pac, Justin Credible, Albert

Team Xtreme (2001) Jeff Hardy, Matt Hardy, and Lita

The Alliance (2001) Paul Heyman, Shane Mcmahon, Stephanie Mcmahon-Helmsley, Steve Austin, Booker T, Chris Kanyon, Billy Kidman, Lance Storm, Hurricane Helms, Chuck Palumbo, Sean O'Hare, Mike Awesome, Test, Ivory, Buh-Buh Ray Dudley, D-Von Dudley, Rhyno, Shawn Stasiak, Chavo Guerrero Jr, Tazz, Tommy Dreamer, Stacey Keibler, Torrie Wilson, Hugh Morrus, Diamond Dallas Page, Justin Credible, Raven, Mighty Molly, Christian, Steven Richards, Terri, Brian Adams, Brian Clarke, William Regal, Kurt Angle, and Debra.

nWo (2002) Hulk Hogan, Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, X-Pac, The Big Show, Booker T., Ric Flair, and Shawn Michaels

The Un-Americans (2002) Lance Storm, Christian, Test, and William Regal

The 3 Min. Warning (2002) Eric Bischoff (GM), Rosie, Jamal, Rico, and Chief Sean Morley

Team Angle (2004) Kurt Angle, Mark Jindrak, and Luther Reigns, Shelton Benjamin, Charlie Haas

Evolution (2003) Ric Flair, Triple H, Dave Batista, and Randy Orton

The Full Blooded Italians (2003) Nunzio, Chuck Palumbo, and Johnny Stamboli

Bischoff Administration (2003-2004) Buh-Buh Ray Dudley, D-Von Dudley, The Rock, Lance Storm, William Regal, Eugene, Eric Bischoff, Chief Sean Morley, Al Snow, The Coach, Garrison Cade, and Johnny Nitro, Stacy Kiebler (Bischoff's SmackDown! mole-spy),Test, Scott Steiner (Team Bischoff Survivor Series 2003), Mark Henry (Team Bischoff Survivor Series 2003), Theodore R. Long, Triple H, Ric Flair, Randy Orton (Team Bischoff Survivor Series 2003), Batista, Chris Jericho (Team Bischoff Survivor Series 2003), , Christian (Team Bischoff Survivor Series 2003), Rosey, Jamal, Rico Constantino, Road Warrior Hawk & Road Warrior Animal (from their late 2003 RAW appearance)
Followers of Mattitude (2003) Shannon Moore, Crash Holly, and Matt Hardy
La'Resistance (2003) Rene Dupree, Sylvan Grenier, and Rob Conway.
Kyo Dai (2003) Yoshihiro Tajiri, Jimmy Yang and Keji (Ryan) Sakoda.
Team Lesnar (2003) Paul Heyman (GM), Brock Lesnar, The Big Show, A-Train, Matt Morgan, and Nathan Jones.

Team ECK (2000-2001) Edge, Christian, Kurt Angle, Rhyno

The All Americans (2004) Kurt Angle, Luther Reigns, Booker T., Rene Dupree, and Kenzo Suzuki, Hiroko, John Bradshawl Leyfield, Orlando Jordan

The Hillbilly Family (1987) Hillbilly Jim, Granny Kim, Uncle Elmer, Cousin Junior, Cousin Luke

The Dudleys (1999-2004) Buh Buh Ray Dudley, D-Von Dudley, Spike Dudley, Stacy Kiebler (valet-manager)

The Headshrinkers (1992-1994) Samu, Fatu, Sionne, Afa (manager), and Captin Lou Albano (manager)

The Clowns (1993-1994) Doink The Clown, Dink The Clown, Wink The Clown, Pink The Clown, Luke (Doink-Survivor Series 93), Butch (Doink-Survivor Series 93), Oscar (Doink-Survivor Series 93), Mable (Doink-Survivor Series 93), and Mo (Survivor Series 93).

The Super Friends (2001-2004) The Hurricane, Mighty Molly, Ivory, Lance Storm, Rosey, and Stacy Keibler.

The Cabinet (2004) John Bradshaw Leyfield, Orlando Jordan, Doug Basham, Danny Basham, Gangrel, Viscera

The Bodydonnas (1994-1997) Skip, Zip, Rad Radford, Sunny (manager), Kloudy (manager)
Tough Enough Al Snow, Hardcore Holly, Bill DeMott, Jacqueline, Tazz, Maven, Chris Nowinski, Josh Matthews, John Hennigan, Matt Cappotelli, Lynda MIles-Shaniqua, Miss Jackie (Gayda), (2004 winners)

The Stooges (1998-2000) Vince McMahon, Gerald Brisco, Pat Patterson, Sergeant Slaughter

The Bushwhackers (1987-1992) Butch Miller, Luke Williams, Jamison

MNM (2005) Joey Mercury, Johnny Nitro, and Melina Perez.

ECW (2005) Paul Heyman, Chris Benoit, Tajiri, Tazz, Tommy Dreamer, Bubba Ray Dudley, D-Von Dudley, Rhyno, The Sandman, Balls Mahoney, Axl Rotten
Anti-Extremist Crusaders (RAW, 2005) Eric Bischoff, Jonothan Coachman, Gene Snitsky, Edge, Christian, Tyson Tomko, Maven, William Regal, Rob Conway, Sylvan Grenier

Anti-Extremist Crusaders (SmackDown!, 2005) Kurt Angle, John Bradshaw Layfield, Orlando Jordan, Doug Basham, Danny Basham, Carlito Carribean Cool, Matt Morgan

Mexicools (2005) Super Crazy, Juventud Guerrera, and Psychosis

Spirit Squad (2006) Ken Doane, Mike Mondo, Nick Mitchell, Johnny Jeter, and Nick Nemeth

ECW (2006) Joey Styles, Paul Heyman, Tommy Dreamer, Terry Funk, Rob Van Dam, Sabu, Axl Rotten, Balls Mahoney, Jazz, Francine, Danny Doring, The Sandman, Tazz, Tony Mamaluke, C.W. Anderson, Kurt Angle, The Big Show, Nunzio, Stevie Richards, Al Snow

Anti-ECW Crusaders (2006) Lita, Edge, Mick Foley

The King's Court (2006) King Booker T., Queen Sharmell, William Regal, Finlay

ECW New Breed (2007) Kevin Thorn, Ariel, Elijah Burke, Matt Striker, Marcus Cor Von, CM Punk

ECW Originals (2007) The Sandman, Tommy Dreamer, Balls Mahoney, Rob Van Dam, Sabu

ECW Extreme Expose (2007) Kelly Kelly, Brooke, Layla El

 

[Tech N9ne]

.[ At WrestleMania XX, Evolution defeated the Rock 'n' Sock Connection (The Rock (in his final professional wrestling match) and Mick Foley) in a 3-on-2 handicap match. Later that night, Triple H lost the World Heavyweight Championship to Chris Benoit (in a triple threat match that also involved Shawn Michaels) when he tapped out to the Crippler Crossface. At Backlash, Flair lost to Shelton Benjamin in one-on-one action.[

LOL... Copy & Paste much?

I was really disappointed that after all that, and ALL those Factions listed. Not one mention, of probably the greatest Faction ever, The New World Order.

Also, I do not get what the point was of the match results.

EDIT: This was directed at your first post.

 

[Mac Attack]

LOL... Copy & Paste much?

I was really disappointed that after all that, and ALL those Factions listed. Not one mention, of probably the greatest Faction ever, The New World Order.

Also, I do not get what the point was of the match results.

I'm just getting started this is my way of presenting and argument as if this was all in one post it would be oring to read. Yes the list was copied and pasted but do you know how hard it was to find that list. More is coming don't worry.

 

[Disturbed]

That was to much. Dude, you thought to much into it.

 

[Tech N9ne]

I'm just getting started this is my way of presenting and argument as if this was all in one post it would be oring to read. Yes the list was copied and pasted but do you know how hard it was to find that list. More is coming don't worry.

oh ok... I'll let you do your thing, Macios.

 

[Tech N9ne]

LOD 2000 (1998-1999) Road Warrior Hawk, Road Warrior Animal, Darren "Puke" Drozdov, Sunny, Paul Ellering

Bro... That is just one example of what is wrong here. They were a tag team. Those guys were not together all at the same time. Ellering managed them a couple different times, and so did Sunny. So did Droz and then he took Hawk's place on the team. They were NEVER what could really be considered a Faction.

Also, all those names are listed basically as members or managers for the team. Technically Heidenreich should be on that list. He actually teamed with Animal, was called L.O.D. AND won The Tag Team Titles. They even used Christy Hemme as a Valet for a while... See where I am going with this?

LOD was a Tag Team that had different managers and sometimes would let someone wear the spikes or help them for a night.

 

[Mac Attack]

This next post is an analyis of T.V ratings during the time period of some of the most sucessful factions in the WWE. As there are many factions I am going to limit the list with the following factions as they are all a similiar distance from each other.

Ministry of Darkness in 1999

This faction had a huge impact on the ratings. When they first came to T.V around Jan 11 1999, they bosted the ratings of Raw by almost an entire point from the previous month and then when they were around it went up as high as an 8.1 which also helps the WWE.

nWo 2002

When the nWo were installed on raw rating jumped up to a 5.4 rating which before that averaged around a 4.6 and through the following weeks maintained a very hight rating. Now this is not all directly because of nWo but they did help the ratings which is good for the WWE.

Evolution, 2003 Debut Feb. 3

This time in the WWE ratings were on a decline and were constantly around a 3.6 rating. When they debut as a group the rating when to a 4.4 and continue to rise to a 4.8 which once agian helps the WWE and is good for the WWE.


Nexus present-Debut June 7 2010

The WWE was in the process of having low ratings around this time and when Nexus appeared the following weeks there was a greater amount of viewers going from a 3.1-3.6. This clearly shows how the faction is good for the WWe

 

[UltimateHitman]

Gotta give the little guy props for putting forth so much effort, though. Admitted, it could have been proofread and edited, but he's trying pretty hard instead of just throwing together a couple of sentences based on opinion.

The lad is actually doing research, I tip my hat. Now work on finesse, and you'll start to really polish your technique.

 

[Mac Attack]

All factions must disban at some point. Through the disbanning of factions we get classic matches that are once again memorable to watch which is good for the WWE and also storylines that help enhance WWE T.V.

Here are just some of the mathces that have happened throughout the years that have happened because of the break-up of a faction.

Legacy Break-Up Match
Randy Orton VS Cody Rhodes VS Ted DiBiasi at Wrestlemania

Evolution Break-Up Match

Triple H VS Orton at Unforgiven

DX (back when they were larger faction
Road Dogg Vs X-Pac Summerslam.



There are countless more memorable break-up mathces and these matches generally are remembered because they had to do with factions. Remembering the past time of the WWE is not a bad thing but a very good thing because it allows a person to recall what it was like during their childhood and comnpare it to what actually is happening now.

 

[Disturbed]

Why not save some of that for later eh? Kirey doesn't even know he is in this yet. We all just assumed he would take part.

 

[Mac Attack]

Why not save some of that for later eh? Kirey doesn't even know he is in this yet. We all just assumed he would take part.

Yeah he still has through Monday but i'm really trying to start off strong giving him less to say, and then what he does say I will find ways to refute.. I'm just trying to really establish a firm point right now and potentially make him use more opioniated statements which he is good at and crush them with facts.

 

[Disturbed]

Great.

 

[Macca]

I HATE EVERYONE WHO HAS POSTED IN THIS THREAD WITH A HIGHLY DISTINCTIVE PASSION.

JACKIE KIREY IS ABOVE THIS TRASH, AND I PRAY FOR ALL YOUR SOULS THAT WILLIAM PATRICK LESNAR DOES NOT SEE THIS ATROCITY, FOR THIS MAY FINALLY BE THE STRAW THAT BREAKS THE CAMEL'S BACK AND WE WILL FINALLY SEE THE RETURN OF THE MOST FABLED CREATURE IN WRESTLING ZONE HISTORY:

BILL MOTHERFUCKING LESNAR.

 

[Disturbed]

Is that a Bill Lesnar alt? Haha.

Throw this dude in the prison too because no one cares.

 

[Johnny Scumm]

Macca, shut the fuck up. Or should I call you Bill Lesnar?

Macios, great start, but you may have done too much too soon. Obviously a large copy & paste job in places, but if Kirey does take part and gets involved, then you better have some good stuff to go on, or you could be in the shit.