The current sad state of WWE

[Professor]

Im a long time wwe fan for about 25 years. Totally stopped watching since 2004 because it was so crap. Recently started watching a little bit out of curiosity, and sadly it hasnt got any better, its gotten a lot worse. Some Observations.

All the wrestlers seem like clones of each other. All generic clean cut, good looking well spoken educated guys, who seem to share the exact same 'arrogant' gimmick. Yawn.

Almost every character has at least a level of douche bag, and plays for laughs. The whole feel the show is immature. The promos seem very forced and scripted, and generally crap. You can tell these college boys are heavily coached and scripted and every expression has been practiced in the mirror 100 times.

Now lets get to some specific characters.

I saw some short, generic looking character, who would not stand out from a crowd, was until recently WWe champ. He was called the miz. Generic, haircut, face, body, and arrogant gimmick, 13 years ago this guy would have been a jobber for goldberg, and this guy was wwe champ? I guess it shows how bad things are. Probably the worst wwe champ in history. Generic in every way. WWE champs should be larger than life or unique in some way.

Then I see Orton acting like a zombie, walking around really slowly and squinting his eyes and giving out long stares, I guess he is trying to act 'bad ass' but it just seems contrived and over done and lame. not cool at all, well unless your under 15. Apparently he is doing a austin time character, what a joke. Austin was bad ass and cool because he wasnt acting, it was natural and an extension of his real personality, and he was dynamite on the mic. Orton is just a pretty college boy pretending to act bad ass, who has clearly practiced every pose and expression in the mirror 1000 times. He is also devoid of any charisma, he just acts like a zombie. At least when he was cocky he had some personality. Now he has zero, yet for some strange reason he seems over. The fans must really be deprived.

I see Edge is a main eventer now. Whats his gimmick exactly? Just seems to act like a clown. Infact I have trouble noticing any genuine gimmicks from anyone. They all just act like arrogant or try hard funny douche bags.

I saw some guy, called Morrison trying to do a Rock impression on the mic and try to smack down a heel, I think it was sheemus. He was trying to be funny and witty, but problem was he was not at all, it was pathetic, and cringeworthy. And this guy is apparently a big up and comer? Oh dear.

Everything about the production seems overly corporatised and sanitised. There is no edge, no realism, nothing and no one is convincing at all, they all look and sound like bad actors. We all know wresting is fake but at least in the past, the wrestlers looked and acted realistic to a certain extent. No one could accuse Scott Steiner of faking or acting, he really seemed like an out of control lunatic.

To sum it all, Vince has clearly lost the magic and gone a long way in the wrong direction. The product is stale beyond belief and I cant see it changing, its just getting worse and worse. The roster is full of talentless tryhards. The only real superstar I see is John Cena, who clearly has an X factor. The big show is great but is just wasted as a clown. The rest are a waste of time.

Last of all the announcers. They are a bunch of juvenile douche bags. Not convincing, and just annoying. They go well with the rest of the product.

 

[marklouis]

I was thinking about this the other day, & pretty much every heel in the WWE is the same: arrogant smart ass. They're all cocky, they all try to come up with sarcastic comments, & most of them fail. The only heel who is different is Kane, & he's been around for what, 13 or 14 years? He won't be around much longer. I think there's a complete lack of creativity, both from the writers & talent. I agree with you on The Miz, I think he's the worst world champion since David Arquette. And Vince actually brought Arquette back a couple of weeks ago, & he liked what he did! What does it say about the state of the WWE that the best heel in the company is Vickie Guerrero? Too bad they can't put the title on her.

The wrestling industry as a whole is in a major funk right now. There's no buzz, no heat, just nothing you have to watch. It's similar to what was happening immediately before the Monday Night Wars & Attitude Era. But the difference is that back then, WWE had a very real rival in WCW, a company which was about to start arguably the greatest angle in pro wrestling history, the NWO. While I watch TNA, it is nowhere near the level WCW was at in 1996. There's no pressure on Vince to change course, because he owns the market. Even though the market is smaller, he's still owns 95% of it, which means he's still making money. This is why I say that even the biggest WWE marks should root for TNA to succeed, because competition will make the WWE better. Vince seems more interested in being on TMZ than putting on a decent wrestling show, & that's the easiest way to drive away your most loyal fans.

 

[Alastor]

Reasons why I feel there is less edge in recent wrestling:

A lot of wrestlers wrestle with similar styles as they are conditioned by WWE to wrestle in a particular way. It is good to have an identity to your company's wrestling but a little variety can go a long way to spice it up.

The real athletes might see MMA as a better career option compared to the WWE. The potential to make money in a less taxing schedule coupled with being seen as legit can make a career in MMA more attractive than wrestling.

The success of the Rock and to a certain extend Austin in the mainstream media. Younger wrestlers nowadays might be seeing wrestling as a stepping stone to a movie career rather than the profession to remain in. Some might perceive WWE as similar to reality TV to grab attention and hopefully translate that into a celebrity career.

 

[Grizzly0u812]

I am not liking the state of wwe either, the product is so water down some of the wrestlers who they can really use they totally drop the ball with, recently released Low-Ki who to me was a great light weight wrestler do some pretty good movies in other places but wwe seem to just humiliate him and make him look weak and useless then gets rid of him. what a waste of talent.

they have matches the involve a cage but whats the sense, if any blood happens they stop the match and fix the wrestler up, even at a pay-per-view, pathic, you have someone using a move called the cobra to win matches and they are tag champs now, wow vince must really be bored with things.

I have not bought the last few pay-per-views cause I found them to be such a yawn these days, I will save the what $50 bucks per event and just read the results on line.

instead of shooting down wrestlers who come to wwe to shine again like Low-Ki who could of did great things and other wrestlers who wwe just buried, they do not allow them to shine, not sure why

 

[AlwaysHasBeen]

FINALLYYYY some SENSE has ARRIVED to Wrestlezone forumssssss!

Professor, you summed up everything I feel about the current product so well. The mere fact that I watch WWE programming fairly regularly (not PPVs in a while though) and feel like you do and you just happened to tune back in recently and yet STILL were able to arrive at the conclusions you did says a lot about how pathetic the product has become.

Vince needs to push his stacks of greenbacks aside as they are obstructing his vision of creating a genuine competitive and entertaining and consistent product. Everyone does act the same- be it a generic face or heel, the only difference being some are given more mic time than others. Heels have no wrestling cred anymore, they all win by DQ or by cheating like 4 mins into their matches. The commentators regurgitate the same material week after week and now such commentators as Cole and Matthews do not even attempt to put the superstars over but instead berate them and the quality of the programming (NXT)?? Everyone is a walking billboard and soon enough Vince will make the wrestlers start wearing their T-shirts while they wrestle. The fact that Shane left and Triple H and Shawn Michaels show no signs of wanting to return prove that WWE is no longer the dream it used to be for them. I know wrestlers get older but competition always drives athletes and the lack of competition in the WWE is apparent.

 

[AlwaysHasBeen]

There's no pressure on Vince to change course, because he owns the market. Even though the market is smaller, he's still owns 95% of it, which means he's still making money. This is why I say that even the biggest WWE marks should root for TNA to succeed, because competition will make the WWE better. Vince seems more interested in being on TMZ than putting on a decent wrestling show, & that's the easiest way to drive away your most loyal fans.

Totally agree. It's what makes a market work: competition. Separating the RAW and Smackdown brands was a step in a better direction but now WWE has ruined that concept. Never understood why Smackdown never went live...it's like WWE just accepted it as a second-rate show to RAW which, if I were Vince, I would not allow to happen.

It's funny how Vince is so unwilling to really change anything in the structure of his industry like the number of PPVs or the spinning title belt or having John Cena lose cleanly or main eventing with an IC or US title match. Everything is so predictable week to week its sickening.

 

[CH David]

Yeah the product is just horrible!

If you couldn't tell I was being sarcastic. The WWE is at the top of the food chain, and nothing is challenging them at the moment (sorry TNA fans). Why should they risk everything like they had to do in the Attitude Era? We are in a lull period similar to the early to mid '90s. Young stars are being pushed, Miz and Morrison to name two.

There may not be the star power of the late '90s and early '00s, but when the older guys are out or gone, Triple H, HBK, Taker, you need to push the young guys. It's the same thing that happened in the early to mid '90s when Hogan and company went to WCW. The product has been damn solid the past probably 6 or so months, and with the Royal Rumble coming up the heat will get turned on as the push for WrestleMania goes full blast.

The product and the talent definitely aren't as bad as some people say. The Miz is the arrogant ass who went from reality star to WWE Champion. He is a cowardly heel like most have been in history, and is having a nice run with the title. Morrison is a flashy wrestler who put on some good matches with Sheamus and we will see him go for the WWE Championship soon. Orton surely isn't a zombie but he is playing to his gimmick, that of a Viper who can strike at any time. As far as the announcers, they are doing what they are told. Cole has become a huge heel announcer, I legitimately hate him, he is doing that good of a job at being a douche.

Not to mention the rest of the talent on the roster. CM Punk is gold on the mic and arguably one of if not the best all around guy currently around. Alberto Del Rio plays a great Mexican aristocrat and you can just feel that he thinks he is better than everyone. Daniel Bryan has been putting on some good matches and the crowd is behind him. Sheamus is a big Irish brute. I could go on.

So no, it's not as horrible as you'd like to think it is.

 

[darbare]

ummm...last time I checked Orton did not go to college and has been wrestling in WWE including their developmental territory since he was like 21. Yea, you complain about the current product, but what you dont realise is that it isnt geared toward you....wrestling is a never ending cycle...its not going to appeal to the same people....youre either a die hard fan, or fair weather fan...Im guessing you were a fan of the Attitude era...yea, thats what made you a fan...you watching back then helped WWE stay afloat...they lose viewers everyday and gain new ones everyday...its business.....and you talk about these college boys like they arent good enough...at least they have some damn common sense in their head and dont sound like idiots like Steiner or Luger on the mic.....its easy for everyone to sit back and criticise everyone instead putting themselves in their shoes...these guys are traveling non stop week in and week out....rental cars, flights, hotels, live shows, live events, I respect what these guys do just to entertain the fans....or whatever their reason may be....dont like the product? dont watch it...we dont care, i dont care, NO one cares....and the obvious response coming after this is Oh we dont care about your rant man! I dont give a shit....its that simple....not trying to sound mean....but does everyone have to complain about shit they cant control....you want the Bills to make the playoffs, too fuc*king bad.....thats how life is...deal with it...they arent going to change the entire product from one opinion....are buying merchandise? no.....so many people complain about Cena and his merch....and then act like other guys should get a chance....why dont you buy a damn cm punk shirt or daniel bryan shirt to help them get bigger instead of complaining...you havent even been watching to see the evolution of The Miz, instead you complain that hes a loser from a reality show....hes marketable...deal with it....he actually has a love for the business....morrison is EXTREMELY talented..if you dont see that you need glasses....yea hes not the best on the mic.....hes not the next Stone Cold or The Rock who by the way left the wrestling you love to do movies.....but hes damn good.....bret hart sucked on the mic, but he was the best in the ring....why does everyone need a gimmick...this isnt the 90s...the guys they have now are better athletes than the ones in the past....wrestling is never the same so why complain about it when it changes on a daily basis

 

[bltz524]

Here's something for all you people that constantly whine about WWE. If you have this much disapproval for it, STOP WATCHING THE PRODUCT. Seriously im getting really sick of hearing everyone complaining the WWE isnt as good as they want it to be, you dont know any of the facts or how the ratings are going or anything like that. Obviously what they are doing is working really good because they have higher ratings now then they have in a long time. So SHUT UP!!!

 

[DirtyJosé]

Im a long time wwe fan for about 25 years. Totally stopped watching since 2004 because it was so crap. Recently started watching a little bit out of curiosity, and sadly it hasnt got any better, its gotten a lot worse. Some Observations.

Oh, this'll be good. If you managed to stick it out through the Invasion angle, there really isn't anything you could point at as being worse.

All the wrestlers seem like clones of each other. All generic clean cut, good looking well spoken educated guys, who seem to share the exact same 'arrogant' gimmick. Yawn.

Yeah, these three guys each look like clones of each other. I mean, why do they even bother having different names...

And that's just sticking with Raw. So let's see...JoMo is an LA Rockstar type, Sheamus is a bully and a stickler for Irish history, and Santino is a buffoon. Those totally all sound like the same "arrogant" gimmick. Why not try actually watching a product before you try talking about it; you won't look like such an idiot.

Almost every character has at least a level of douche bag, and plays for laughs. The whole feel the show is immature.

What, Rocky wasn't ever a bit of a douche? I'm not saying it's wrong of you not to enjoy the current product, but I do think you're quite the ass for making arguments against it with holes big enough to drive through. Are you telling me that WWE/F never EVER played for laughs? I could've sworn that humor's always been a big part of their product. The current show is skewed towards the PG market, but that just means less (obvious) penis and fart jokes. Are you ever going to get to making a valid point?

The promos seem very forced and scripted, and generally crap. You can tell these college boys are heavily coached and scripted and every expression has been practiced in the mirror 100 times.

Now we're getting somewhere. Complaining about promos being scripted and rehearsed in Pro Wrestling is pointless because, well, it's Pro Wrestling; it's all scripted. However, I see where you are coming from. Mark Madden always points out how he feels most promos sound like the same voice, and I'm inclined to agree to a point. Also, what the hell is "college boys" supposed to mean? I'm entirely behind WWE typically only going after people who have finished college because they'll have something to fall back on in the likely case that being a wrestler doesn't work out for them. And this isn't only a Wrestling thing; many sports players do the same thing, with good reason. Even the best guy can't do much about a career ending injury.

Now lets get to some specific characters.

I saw some short, generic looking character, who would not stand out from a crowd, was until recently WWe champ. He was called the miz. Generic, haircut, face, body, and arrogant gimmick, 13 years ago this guy would have been a jobber for goldberg, and this guy was wwe champ? I guess it shows how bad things are. Probably the worst wwe champ in history. Generic in every way. WWE champs should be larger than life or unique in some way.

Define "generic" as you use it. I certainly don't find The Miz generic. As someone who also took a long break from this stuff only to come back recently, The Miz has become one of the reasons I still bother to watch Raw each week. Unique? I'm sorry, I don't see anyone else out there with his charisma and presence short of Cena himself.

As for his size, let's look at someone else for a moment. You know who used to really look like a giant? The Undertaker. Even with the Big Show and Kane around, the guy used to seem like an evil skyscraper. But as more and more large guys filled up the company, his figure became less impressive to me. How is a monster supposed to stick out if everyone is 6'4'' and stacked? So no, I don't feel that having a guy of Miz's stature as a champion does it or him any harm.

Also, worst champ in WWE history? Try Diesel.

Then I see Orton acting like a zombie, walking around really slowly and squinting his eyes and giving out long stares, I guess he is trying to act 'bad ass' but it just seems contrived and over done and lame. not cool at all, well unless your under 15.

Keep in mind that "under 15" is entirely the market they are going for here, not you. Not that I'd think that would change your opinion or anything, but I just want you to keep in mind that you are complaining about the product being more appealing to younger viewers than it is to you when that is exactly what the company is doing. And as a matter of opinion, I've still yet to see much of anything on WWE television these days that match the immaturity of the late 90's product.

Apparently he is doing a austin time character, what a joke. Austin was bad ass and cool because he wasnt acting,

Lulz.

it was natural and an extension of his real personality, and he was dynamite on the mic.

And who's to say Orton isn't really a bit of a creeper in real life (actually, many reports in the past claim exactly that)? I'll give Austin the mic skill nod. But really, are you going to pull out anything at all that doesn't sound like canned IC arguments? As often as you throw around the terms "generic", "forced", and "scripted", those are the exact words I'd use to describe your post.

Orton is just a pretty college boy pretending to act bad ass, who has clearly practiced every pose and expression in the mirror 1000 times.

There you are with that "college boy" crap again. What is this, a class war? And didn't you use this line already? What's wrong with practicing? What's wrong with self-improvement? And finally, I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but Orton didn't go to college, so please stop projecting.

He is also devoid of any charisma, he just acts like a zombie. At least when he was cocky he had some personality. Now he has zero, yet for some strange reason he seems over. The fans must really be deprived.

Or maybe you've just been passed by. Left behind. I mean, the guy draws some great reactions from the crowds. He's most definitely better as a heel than he is a face, but zombie? I've never seen a zombie hit an RKO out of nowhere. You'll have to find that video or something.

I see Edge is a main eventer now. Whats his gimmick exactly? Just seems to act like a clown. Infact I have trouble noticing any genuine gimmicks from anyone. They all just act like arrogant or try hard funny douche bags.

Is everyone supposed to wear a mask, or have a catchphrase, or fit into some neat cookie cutter mold you have set as to what a wrestler can and can't do? For the record, he's still sitting as an opportunist with an eye for stirring the pot. Arrogant? Again? And what's more, whatever was wrong about being arrogant in Pro Wrestling? Unless you're doing some super-uber-good guy routine, isn't talking trash part of the game? Maybe try explaining your shit better instead of using the same words over and over and over.

I saw some guy, called Morrison trying to do a Rock impression on the mic and try to smack down a heel, I think it was sheemus. He was trying to be funny and witty, but problem was he was not at all, it was pathetic, and cringeworthy. And this guy is apparently a big up and comer? Oh dear.

This is really beginning to sound canned. Are you sure you aren't just copy-pasting some smark's blog? Anyway, if you keep only ever thinking in making comparisons to Rock and Austin, you are only going to be disappointed. No, Morrison is not Rock. No, Orton is not Austin. Morrison talking trash on a mic is enough to make him out to be a Rock clone (also, I always saw him as more of a HBK type)? Shit, by your standards everyone must be a Rock clone then.

Everything about the production seems overly corporatised and sanitised. There is no edge, no realism, nothing and no one is convincing at all, they all look and sound like bad actors. We all know wresting is fake but at least in the past, the wrestlers looked and acted realistic to a certain extent. No one could accuse Scott Steiner of faking or acting, he really seemed like an out of control lunatic.

And pieces of shit like Steiner are a big part of the reason I stopped watching (others too, once WCW put him in the main event). You want gritty realism? There's an indy fed for that. Go look up another company. "Attitude" wasn't sustainable for the WWE. It went away for a reason; it was driving viewers and sponsors away. It was dangerous. Having out of control lunatics on screen is all fun and games until one of them od's. Or one of them ruins a show, either by being total shit or by not showing up. Or one of them kills his wife, his child, and himself.

To sum it all, Vince has clearly lost the magic and gone a long way in the wrong direction. The product is stale beyond belief and I cant see it changing, its just getting worse and worse. The roster is full of talentless tryhards. The only real superstar I see is John Cena, who clearly has an X factor. The big show is great but is just wasted as a clown. The rest are a waste of time.

I'm sorry, I fail to see how CM Punk and Daniel Bryan are talentless tryhards. Big Show as a clown is about the best Big Show has ever been able to do to be relevant in his entire career since winning the WCW Title in his debut match. I've seen this man's entire career, and I'm hard pressed to think of any other time where he has been utilized as well as he is now.

Last of all the announcers. They are a bunch of juvenile douche bags. Not convincing, and just annoying. They go well with the rest of the product.

Funny, because King's been there for a long time, and it's actually his loss of his "juvenile douche bag" factor that's made him less interesting. And Cole is supposed to annoy and irritate you. He's pretty clearly and openly now a heel character. Of course, that's a basic subtlety you would have picked up on if you weren't getting your panties in a bunch about how a show made for people younger than you isn't up to your cliché standards.

 

[StraightEdge for Life]

Another person who complains about how the WWE isn't in the Attitude Era. Wow.

Seriously though, as someone had stated, the stars of the Attitude Era are getting older and they have either retired or their careers are winding down. So that means they have to start grooming their young stars into future main eventers. Yeah the promos and speaking angles aren't the best worked, but if that is something you hate about the product then I have two words for ya: QUIT WATCHING

If you don't like the talent, the promos, or really anything about it, you probably use the 2 (or in special episode 3) hours of your time watching something you dislike.

 

[Freddy4190]

When are these idiots going to just give it up and face the fact that the Attitude Era is not coming back anytime soon? I don't see why people still badmouth the WWE. "I stopped watching wrestling in 200-whatever" Obviously something in the WWE piqued your interest. They just seemingly capped off a kickass storyline with Nexus. Just like CH David said, WWE is King. Nothing is close. They're just in a bit of a dry spell at the moment. I still find the product quite entertaining. Blood, Chairshots, and Vulgarity, apparently that's everyone's recipe to a great wrestling promotion. Hmm.. wonder how that's working out for ECW? Oh, wait..

 

[Calderownz]

All the wrestlers seem like clones of each other. All generic clean cut, good looking well spoken educated guys, who seem to share the exact same 'arrogant' gimmick. Yawn.

Honestly, it's not the gimmick to me. It's how well they can pull it off. Wrestling has it's theme when it comes to what they try and push. In the 80's you just had to yell and be juiced up to your ears.

At that time, they also had different characters, but so does WWE in many ways currently. Also, keep in mind, most heels have historically been cocky. It kind of goes with the territories.

Almost every character has at least a level of douche bag, and plays for laughs. The whole feel the show is immature. The promos seem very forced and scripted, and generally crap. You can tell these college boys are heavily coached and scripted and every expression has been practiced in the mirror 100 times.

The show at times is geared towards a younger crowd. But, while many past superstars might have been off the cuff, the fact of the matter is that these guys need to grow into themselves. People seem to forget that someone like Jake Roberts had years and years to work on his gimmick and what have you. WWE is currently trying to find young guys that can contribute into the future. It takes time.

Some have run with it. Others have not.

Now lets get to some specific characters.

I saw some short, generic looking character, who would not stand out from a crowd, was until recently WWe champ. He was called the miz. Generic, haircut, face, body, and arrogant gimmick, 13 years ago this guy would have been a jobber for goldberg, and this guy was wwe champ? I guess it shows how bad things are. Probably the worst wwe champ in history. Generic in every way. WWE champs should be larger than life or unique in some way.

Then I see Orton acting like a zombie, walking around really slowly and squinting his eyes and giving out long stares, I guess he is trying to act 'bad ass' but it just seems contrived and over done and lame. not cool at all, well unless your under 15. Apparently he is doing a austin time character, what a joke. Austin was bad ass and cool because he wasnt acting, it was natural and an extension of his real personality, and he was dynamite on the mic. Orton is just a pretty college boy pretending to act bad ass, who has clearly practiced every pose and expression in the mirror 1000 times. He is also devoid of any charisma, he just acts like a zombie. At least when he was cocky he had some personality. Now he has zero, yet for some strange reason he seems over. The fans must really be deprived.

I see Edge is a main eventer now. Whats his gimmick exactly? Just seems to act like a clown. Infact I have trouble noticing any genuine gimmicks from anyone. They all just act like arrogant or try hard funny douche bags.

I saw some guy, called Morrison trying to do a Rock impression on the mic and try to smack down a heel, I think it was sheemus. He was trying to be funny and witty, but problem was he was not at all, it was pathetic, and cringeworthy. And this guy is apparently a big up and comer? Oh dear.

Everything about the production seems overly corporatised and sanitised. There is no edge, no realism, nothing and no one is convincing at all, they all look and sound like bad actors. We all know wresting is fake but at least in the past, the wrestlers looked and acted realistic to a certain extent. No one could accuse Scott Steiner of faking or acting, he really seemed like an out of control lunatic.

To sum it all, Vince has clearly lost the magic and gone a long way in the wrong direction. The product is stale beyond belief and I cant see it changing, its just getting worse and worse. The roster is full of talentless tryhards. The only real superstar I see is John Cena, who clearly has an X factor. The big show is great but is just wasted as a clown. The rest are a waste of time.

Last of all the announcers. They are a bunch of juvenile douche bags. Not convincing, and just annoying. They go well with the rest of the product.

Honestly.. what sounds generic here is the rest of your post. It's the same thing that all older guys crow about.

"They did it better back in my day."

Things change. Not everyone needs to have some insane over the top character with horribly loud, raging promos and more gas in them than a Texaco.

Regardless, you're entitled to your opinion. Have a good one.

 

[JDX]

I agree with most of your post but only because WWE has no one to push them so they act proper for sponsership dollars. CM Punk is the only guy allowed to be clever or bring the past but is wrangled in quickly if he crosses the line. 07 to now has been bad (except for smackdown summer of 09, everything was great and other one shots here and there) but it's getting better as of late. Wrestling always seems a bit stupid when going into it or coming back to it. Wait a while and see what gels for you.

 

[Rckstrtmmy]

You havent really watched since 2004? Well suprise, shits different now. It sounds like you havent paid attention since the attitude era. I loved the attitude era. And yes things are different now. Worse? No. Better? Yea probably. They are building up new people which makes things a little hard until the new guys come into their own. Its been this way forever...most people don't make their mark right away (The Rock, Foley, Austin, HHH, etc).
Yes its very different than it was before but things are on a huge upswing. The WWE is starting to get more unpredictable and exciting. There aren't any Russo-esque turns but thats a good thing. Things are starting to level out and get deep into things. My advice would be to watch (more than every once in a while for 6 years) and learn something because you obviously dont know what the fuck youre talking about anymore.

 

[TheRealDeal]

Apparently he is doing a austin time character, what a joke. Austin was bad ass and cool because he wasnt acting,

Austin wasn't acting that's for sure. You're right about this one. But Orton is not playing some wannabe Austin. He is playing some twisted evil psychopath also known as the Viper. I don't find that gimmick stupid at all, it's pretty reasonable and it matches with Orton's hairstyle and his moves.

Totally stopped watching since 2004 because it was so crap.

Try watching the CM Punk vs Hardy feud at 2009. That was probably one of the best feuds Hardy could have been in. CM Punk played a really solid heel and is one of the best gimmicks in WWE today and a build up of a possible John Cena vs CM Punk feud could be something really entertaining to watch.

2004 from so on hasn't be crap, there was some entertaining feuds, sure they had their bad moments but it wasn't all that bad to watch. What about One Night Stand 2005, One Night Stand 2006? If you haven't watched it yet, don't judge it cause it sure is one kickass ppv to watch.

 

[Jamana 17]

im 13 and i like wwe. i believe sd! is bullshit but i like raw. sometimes i watch vids from the attitude era and it rockd. i wish that i could see it again especially the wwf vs wcw/ecw of wwf vs the alliance (idk if thats d same thing)

here's an idea for vince..

buy tna and have a huge war with them that would last a year. now THAT'S something people would pay 5x that of what they're paying to see. finally end tna and create a new show for the tna superstars and knockouts and make wwe tv-14 again.

 

[SmattyG]

You can't judge something you know little about. I've been watching wrestling for 35 years and in that time here in Australia there were times when all I got was a 15 minute wrap on a sports show. With no spoilers to help me out. But if you're a fan then you'll always find something to keep you interested.

And for those that discovered wrestling in the Attitude Era and complain that it's no longer like that - Attitude was the exception - wrestling is athletes with good guys trying to beat bad guys. Period. You don't need blood, profanity etc. And I loved Austin, Rock & Foley as much as the next guy.

Come back in 2015 to watch main eventers like John Morrison, Sheamus, Drew McIntyre, Daniel Bryan, Alberto Del Rio, Dolph Ziggler and Wade Barrett. Just don't complain about Mason Ryan and Jackson Andrews.

And if you're really into just the wrestling, youtube Trent Barretta V Curt Hawkins from a few weeks back on Superstars.

 

[mdj2010]

I know the point you are making, but its been made a million times before.

Would you turn on a kids show and expect to be entertained like you were when you were a child? No, of course not. So why does everyone who remembers the attitude era and before seem to expect something different from the WWE today, which is of course a PG show aimed predominantly at young kids.

Once again, I get the point, but its comparing chalk to cheese, everything you want in wrestling just doesn't exist on a PG show. Try switching over to TNA, you may like it, hell its produced awfully and the creative seem to spend their time deciding who can create the best dick joke, but at least you may find it 'edgy'.

 

[Professor]

Yeah, these three guys each look like clones of each other. I mean, why do they even bother having different names...

And that's just sticking with Raw. So let's see...JoMo is an LA Rockstar type, Sheamus is a bully and a stickler for Irish history, and Santino is a buffoon. Those totally all sound like the same "arrogant" gimmick. Why not try actually watching a product before you try talking about it; you won't look like such an idiot.

Morrison has a nice robe and sunnies, but a character needs a little bit more substance than that. Actually Sheemus is one of the few characters who stand out. I dont mind him, but the majority are workshop clones. I havent seen the last guy, he seems pretty average, WWE is full of clowns.

What, Rocky wasn't ever a bit of a douche? I'm not saying it's wrong of you not to enjoy the current product, but I do think you're quite the ass for making arguments against it with holes big enough to drive through. Are you telling me that WWE/F never EVER played for laughs? I could've sworn that humor's always been a big part of their product. The current show is skewed towards the PG market, but that just means less (obvious) penis and fart jokes. Are you ever going to get to making a valid point?

Dont twist my argument. My problem is not that some play for laughs, but the vast majority. If the wrestlers dont take themselves seriously, why should we?

Now we're getting somewhere. Complaining about promos being scripted and rehearsed in Pro Wrestling is pointless because, well, it's Pro Wrestling; it's all scripted. However, I see where you are coming from. Mark Madden always points out how he feels most promos sound like the same voice, and I'm inclined to agree to a point. Also, what the hell is "college boys" supposed to mean? I'm entirely behind WWE typically only going after people who have finished college because they'll have something to fall back on in the likely case that being a wrestler doesn't work out for them. And this isn't only a Wrestling thing; many sports players do the same thing, with good reason. Even the best guy can't do much about a career ending injury.

Come on, you should know the difference between cutting a promo and practically reading it off a script. In the past the top promo guys do their own thing with a lot of improve. When I say college boys, I mean, they are all educated, well spoken, and clean cut, so they are not realistic and varied characters, but rather like clones that have come out of a factory, card board cut outs.

Define "generic" as you use it. I certainly don't find The Miz generic. As someone who also took a long break from this stuff only to come back recently, The Miz has become one of the reasons I still bother to watch Raw each week. Unique? I'm sorry, I don't see anyone else out there with his charisma and presence short of Cena himself.

As for his size, let's look at someone else for a moment. You know who used to really look like a giant? The Undertaker. Even with the Big Show and Kane around, the guy used to seem like an evil skyscraper. But as more and more large guys filled up the company, his figure became less impressive to me. How is a monster supposed to stick out if everyone is 6'4'' and stacked? So no, I don't feel that having a guy of Miz's stature as a champion does it or him any harm.

Generic meaning the Miz would not stand out in the grocery line at kmart. His face, his height, his hair, his build, his voice is all average, there is nothing that stand outs at all, he just looks like an ordinary guy, and he is. Size still matters in wrestling and always win. People want to watch larger than life people, not common folks like them.

Miz reminds me of those jobbers on saturday night main event in the 80s. They just looked like a guy off the street who was in decent shape with a nice clean haircut, that had thrown on the trunks, and was beaten in about 2 minutes by the superstars.

Also, worst champ in WWE history? Try Diesel.

Please. Nash was a monster and had more charm and charisma in his finger than douche bag Miz has in his whole body.

Keep in mind that "under 15" is entirely the market they are going for here, not you.

Well I didnt know that. Is that actually officially confirmed?

And who's to say Orton isn't really a bit of a creeper in real life (actually, many reports in the past claim exactly that)? I'll give Austin the mic skill nod. But really, are you going to pull out anything at all that doesn't sound like canned IC arguments? As often as you throw around the terms "generic", "forced", and "scripted", those are the exact words I'd use to describe your post.

Generic is a perfect description of what I see so I will keep using it thanks. Orton doesnt seem creepy to me, he doesnt have that look, so he just comes across as lame. If he wasnt a douche for many years before maybe I could buy his 'wierd bad ass' act, but knowing his real character I cant buy it. He is just acting.

Is everyone supposed to wear a mask, or have a catchphrase, or fit into some neat cookie cutter mold you have set as to what a wrestler can and can't do? For the record, he's still sitting as an opportunist with an eye for stirring the pot. Arrogant? Again? And what's more, whatever was wrong about being arrogant in Pro Wrestling? Unless you're doing some super-uber-good guy routine, isn't talking trash part of the game? Maybe try explaining your shit better instead of using the same words over and over and over.

Most real superstars have a great gimmick unless they have great physical ability or mic ability. If they dont then they are a nothing, and boring, like Edge, and being a smart alec is not a gimmick. I keep using the same descriptions because all the wrestlers are the same which is a main point of my post.

This is really beginning to sound canned. Are you sure you aren't just copy-pasting some smark's blog? Anyway, if you keep only ever thinking in making comparisons to Rock and Austin, you are only going to be disappointed. No, Morrison is not Rock. No, Orton is not Austin. Morrison talking trash on a mic is enough to make him out to be a Rock clone (also, I always saw him as more of a HBK type)? Shit, by your standards everyone must be a Rock clone then.

If Morrison is no rock then he shouldnt try acting like him on the mic and failing miserably.

"Attitude" wasn't sustainable for the WWE. It went away for a reason; it was driving viewers and sponsors away. It was dangerous. Having out of control lunatics on screen is all fun and games until one of them od's. Or one of them ruins a show, either by being total shit or by not showing up. Or one of them kills his wife, his child, and himself.

Attitude was dangerous? What does benoit have to do with the attitude era product? Nothing. When did it drive viewers away exactly? It was far more popular than todays product, but the problem was vince moved away from it because he lost his marbles, not because it was losing viewers. I watched wrestling well before the attitude era, and it was far superior then, than today as well. Even the mid 90s was better.

Funny, because King's been there for a long time, and it's actually his loss of his "juvenile douche bag" factor that's made him less interesting. And Cole is supposed to annoy and irritate you. He's pretty clearly and openly now a heel character. Of course, that's a basic subtlety you would have picked up on if you weren't getting your panties in a bunch about how a show made for people younger than you isn't up to your cliché standards.

There is nothing subtle about the commentators which is the problem. They are like a bunch of kids. Wrestling is fake so they should be convincing and realistic like the WCW ones used to be, or even JR. Cole is just a douche.

 

[Professor]

You can't judge something you know little about. I've been watching wrestling for 35 years and in that time here in Australia there were times when all I got was a 15 minute wrap on a sports show. With no spoilers to help me out. But if you're a fan then you'll always find something to keep you interested.

And for those that discovered wrestling in the Attitude Era and complain that it's no longer like that - Attitude was the exception - wrestling is athletes with good guys trying to beat bad guys. Period. You don't need blood, profanity etc. And I loved Austin, Rock & Foley as much as the next guy.

Come back in 2015 to watch main eventers like John Morrison, Sheamus, Drew McIntyre, Daniel Bryan, Alberto Del Rio, Dolph Ziggler and Wade Barrett. Just don't complain about Mason Ryan and Jackson Andrews.

And if you're really into just the wrestling, youtube Trent Barretta V Curt Hawkins from a few weeks back on Superstars.

I watched wrestling well before the attitude era. I dont recall the 80s and 90s being so childish. It seemed they still tried to be realistic. You guys are trying to justify the crap product, because its apparently aimed at kids, but that doesnt justify it to me, and why would they be targeting kids suddenly? Its not showing in the ratings is it?

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

I watched wrestling well before the attitude era. I dont recall the 80s and 90s being so childish. It seemed they still tried to be realistic. You guys are trying to justify the crap product, because its apparently aimed at kids, but that doesnt justify it to me, and why would they be targeting kids suddenly? Its not showing in the ratings is it?

WHHAAAAAT! You don't remember the 80's being childish!! The characters were all superheroes and super-villains! They didn't look like stereotypical good guys and bad guys but the whole show read like a comic book. Hulk hogan is down at the hands of the evil andre, tune in next weeks folks to see what happens to our hero... Don't let the characters fool you, the 80's conceptually, at least in WWE, was far more childish than it is now I assure you.

 

[Henhouse]

In my opinion, the only reason WWE will change is if TNA get better. WWE are still the no.1 wrestling company and although UFC is getting bigger, WWE is a world-renowned company. If TNA got better and provided some REAL competition to WWE, both companies would get better.

 

[DirtyJosé]

Morrison has a nice robe and sunnies, but a character needs a little bit more substance than that. Actually Sheemus is one of the few characters who stand out. I dont mind him, but the majority are workshop clones. I havent seen the last guy, he seems pretty average, WWE is full of clowns.

So, are you basing this off having actually watched either of these men the last month or two, or are you just speaking out of your ass having watched one or two episodes of Raw? Go look up Morrison's earlier career if you want something more obviously "gimmicky". Personally, I think he's better off without trying to play everything up as a gimmick.

Dont twist my argument. My problem is not that some play for laughs, but the vast majority. If the wrestlers dont take themselves seriously, why should we?

Well, first of all, it's not twisting your argument if you won't admit that all of those superstars of the past also had streaks of douche bag in them, even the faces. And I'm sorry, again, but I can't think of anytime when WWE wrestlers were ever that serious without making time for a bad joke. DX? Val Venis getting his penis chopped off? Beaver Cleavage? Katie Vick? The Kiss My Ass club? Rikishi's stinkface? The stooges Patterson and Briscoe? Mae Young giving birth to a hand? C'mon and tell me through all of this that these people weren't playing for laughs.

Come on, you should know the difference between cutting a promo and practically reading it off a script.

Go look up some classic Ken Patera promos and then come back to me talking about how they should be like the good ol' days. Yes, it's robotic at times, but some manage to do a great job of standing out.

In the past the top promo guys do their own thing with a lot of improve.

Top guys, sure. But how many of the guys can be top guys? You act as though no other promos before modern times ever sounded forced or scripted. Quit living in a glorified past; shitty promos have always existed.

When I say college boys, I mean, they are all educated, well spoken, and clean cut, so they are not realistic and varied characters, but rather like clones that have come out of a factory, card board cut outs.

Uh-huh, ok.

Generic meaning the Miz would not stand out in the grocery line at kmart.

Except for that whole being a celebrity thing. I mean, raise your hand if you were on two hit MTV shows....

His face, his height, his hair, his build, his voice is all average, there is nothing that stand outs at all, he just looks like an ordinary guy, and he is. Size still matters in wrestling and always win. People want to watch larger than life people, not common folks like them. Miz reminds me of those jobbers on saturday night main event in the 80s. They just looked like a guy off the street who was in decent shape with a nice clean haircut, that had thrown on the trunks, and was beaten in about 2 minutes by the superstars.

What is it with you and your thing against people with nice haircuts? Is everyone supposed to look like some bayou monster in your opinion? I get the impression that you really would be better off looking up another promotion to get your kicks, because you want an outdated version of what the product is these days. Go try TNA or something.

Please. Nash was a monster and had more charm and charisma in his finger than douche bag Miz has in his whole body.

That's just, like, your opinion, man. Really though, fuck Big Lazy. The guy looked like a beast, but he couldn't move for shit. Charisma? Sure, to a point. Charm? Nash had all the charm of finding your gym teacher drunk at the bar. At his most relevant (in WCW in early nWo days) he mainly played for laughs.

Well I didnt know that. Is that actually officially confirmed?

TV-PG, my man. TV-PG.

Generic is a perfect description of what I see so I will keep using it thanks. Orton doesnt seem creepy to me, he doesnt have that look, so he just comes across as lame. If he wasnt a douche for many years before maybe I could buy his 'wierd bad ass' act, but knowing his real character I cant buy it. He is just acting.

Real character? Oh man, that's a good one. Of course, it's only now that he's acting, right? OH WOW THIS IS TOO GOOD. It's all acting, dude. Even those guys you swear were only extensions of their own personalities. It's all acting.

Most real superstars have a great gimmick unless they have great physical ability or mic ability. If they dont then they are a nothing, and boring, like Edge, and being a smart alec is not a gimmick. I keep using the same descriptions because all the wrestlers are the same which is a main point of my post.

I manage to recognize most of todays stars as unique characters with their own traits and trademarks. Many many others do too. You are holding today's product to yesterday's standards, without acknowledging that the industry has moved on from those times. The world does not fall into your pre-determined categories of "gimmick" anymore.

If Morrison is no rock then he shouldnt try acting like him on the mic and failing miserably.

So again, what are you saying? That no one is allowed to try a talk trash on the mic ever again because they aren't Dwayne Johnson?

Attitude was dangerous? What does benoit have to do with the attitude era product? Nothing. When did it drive viewers away exactly? It was far more popular than todays product, but the problem was vince moved away from it because he lost his marbles, not because it was losing viewers. I watched wrestling well before the attitude era, and it was far superior then, than today as well. Even the mid 90s was better.

It started driving viewers away the second WCW went under. It started driving viewers away the second that that lifestyle ended up in the deaths of Eddie Guerrero and Chris Benoit. Vince moved away from it because sponsors wanted nothing to do with him any more. I know it's easier simply to remember things the way you want to, but Vince drove away those viewers using the same type of wrestler you claim to like in the same kind of style you seem to like.

There is nothing subtle about the commentators which is the problem. They are like a bunch of kids. Wrestling is fake so they should be convincing and realistic like the WCW ones used to be, or even JR. Cole is just a douche.

Guess what? JR will never be duplicated. Would he really seem so special to people like us if he was a dime a dozen? JR is a product of the old industry; a veteran with many many many years of experience. You can't easily replicate that, so why try to put out a cheap copy? I don't need announcers trying to over compensate in convincing me things are real.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Pretty easy, you said it yourself. The product mostly appeals to people under 15.

Well, no shit.

The programming is coming off some huge highs, and year chock full of amazing wrestling matches. Just becuase its not fit to your exact tastes, and your time frame of wrestling you enjoyed, does not make it bad. The point of WWE is to make money, not make 20 somethings on an internet wrestling forum feel smart for watching it.

Oh, and this is nothing. You think the gimmicks on THIS show are hard to figure out? Oh, well do I ever have a program for you...its on Spike TV, thursdays, at 9pm....