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Teaching English Abroad
- Thread starter Coco
- Start date
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
Gelgarin does it I believe.
Sounds legit then. I don't think he parties.Gelgarin does it I believe.
As a Canadian, I have much experience with vodka.Yeah, in Siberia. As far as I know their idea of a party is inviting a few polar bears over for some vodka.
Must be my eastern European blood.
I bet you didn't see that coming.
Mighty NorCal
SHALL WE BEGIN?
Whatevs, the women out that way are sexy.
I bet thats what XFear is doing right now. In a speakeasy, or flop house.
I bet thats what XFear is doing right now. In a speakeasy, or flop house.
"Abroad" is a big place. Out which way?Whatevs, the women out that way are sexy.
Mighty NorCal
SHALL WE BEGIN?
"Abroad" is a big place. Out which way?
In reference to Gelgarin teaching in serbia, and their apparent lack of fun times to be had.
I would be having an immense amount of fun in serbia.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
In reference to Gelgarin teaching in serbia, and their apparent lack of fun times to be had.
I would be having an immense amount of fun in serbia.
Actually it's Siberia, as in northern Russia.
Snitsky4GM
Dark Match Winner
A friend of mine taught English in Vietnam and either Thailand or South Korea (I forget which one between the two). He was never really the party every weekend type, but I am sure there are some nights while there he had more than his fair share of fun.
He really enjoyed his time abroad but at the same time he wasn't enjoying that there wasn't much money to be made in that particular job. He had gotten an offer from a larger company to teach in Uganda I believe but he turned it down because he didn't like that while teaching English he also had to teach them our financial and education systems.
He really enjoyed his time abroad but at the same time he wasn't enjoying that there wasn't much money to be made in that particular job. He had gotten an offer from a larger company to teach in Uganda I believe but he turned it down because he didn't like that while teaching English he also had to teach them our financial and education systems.
CM Punk is a Jew
Dark Match Jobber
It's fine so long as you pick a European country. Otherwise you run a serious risk of race-mixing and miscegenating the Great White Race. As long as you're within trustworthy ethnic company, go ahead and help them conform to a common culture.
Conveniently my last two students canceled today.
If you legitimately care then I'll write you an extended discourse on the subject over the weekend and answer any questions you might have. I'm in EFL myself, and have a network of friends in the industry spread all over the world, so I'm quite well clued up at the moment.
As for 'is it legit'? It depends where you go. Much of Asia does have the stink of the party scene about it. Language schools are a huge growth industry over there, so you have hundreds of lower tier schools popping up who aren't that picky about who they take. You do a handful of lessons with sprogs and spend the rest of the time visiting various clubs. If that's your idea of a good time then more power to you, but I think it's telling that nobody who enters the profession via that door sticks around very long. It's a fun novelty, and you make good money whilst not working that hard, but there isn't much job satisfaction and it's hard to grow or develop.
The alternate route is to go for the more legitimate language schools, which are either long standing independent institutions or corporate entities. This means much less clubbing (no clubbing in my case), much harder work in a much less enjoyable part of the world for much less money (for perspective, I make $8000US a year, whilst someone in China will be pulling in closer to $20000 for a considerably smaller work load).
From an objective standpoint you get a worse deal in every sense of the word, but I think it's the best way to go if you're serious about it as a career choice. Instead of just filling time between parties I'm able to build up experience of teaching business English, medical English, IELTS, CAE, TOEFL and proficiency, and in a few years I'll have a whole host of interesting doors opening to me all over the world. If everything goes according to plan then twelve months slumming it in Russia will be well worth it.
Of course, if you want to get a legit job you really need the qualification first. CELTA is easily the most prized certificate out there, and comes with a glowing recommendation from me. It'll cover basically everything you need to know to construct a lesson and will give you a very good impression of whether efl teaching is something you could enjoy as a profession. Do not, under any circumstances, opt for an online qualification, nobody will take you seriously and you won't be even remotely prepared for the realities of the job.
We don't get polar bears over here you Russia-noob. It's regular old bears and vodka, with the bears being strictly optional. I've actually only been to one event where vodka was consumed since I arrived a few months ago; it's not as ubiquitous as one might think.
There is a moderate amount of fun to be had in Siberia, and that's all. It was -35 for most of today, and it'll probably get colder come January. Also, very little of the fun on offer is accessible when you're working a 54 hour week and can just about ask for potatoes in the local tongue, but not much else.
So yeah; EFL can be pretty much whatever you want it to be right now. Piss easy party vessel, incredibly challenging but rewarding career, convenient excuse to travel or pretty much anything in between.
If you legitimately care then I'll write you an extended discourse on the subject over the weekend and answer any questions you might have. I'm in EFL myself, and have a network of friends in the industry spread all over the world, so I'm quite well clued up at the moment.
As for 'is it legit'? It depends where you go. Much of Asia does have the stink of the party scene about it. Language schools are a huge growth industry over there, so you have hundreds of lower tier schools popping up who aren't that picky about who they take. You do a handful of lessons with sprogs and spend the rest of the time visiting various clubs. If that's your idea of a good time then more power to you, but I think it's telling that nobody who enters the profession via that door sticks around very long. It's a fun novelty, and you make good money whilst not working that hard, but there isn't much job satisfaction and it's hard to grow or develop.
The alternate route is to go for the more legitimate language schools, which are either long standing independent institutions or corporate entities. This means much less clubbing (no clubbing in my case), much harder work in a much less enjoyable part of the world for much less money (for perspective, I make $8000US a year, whilst someone in China will be pulling in closer to $20000 for a considerably smaller work load).
From an objective standpoint you get a worse deal in every sense of the word, but I think it's the best way to go if you're serious about it as a career choice. Instead of just filling time between parties I'm able to build up experience of teaching business English, medical English, IELTS, CAE, TOEFL and proficiency, and in a few years I'll have a whole host of interesting doors opening to me all over the world. If everything goes according to plan then twelve months slumming it in Russia will be well worth it.
Of course, if you want to get a legit job you really need the qualification first. CELTA is easily the most prized certificate out there, and comes with a glowing recommendation from me. It'll cover basically everything you need to know to construct a lesson and will give you a very good impression of whether efl teaching is something you could enjoy as a profession. Do not, under any circumstances, opt for an online qualification, nobody will take you seriously and you won't be even remotely prepared for the realities of the job.
Yeah, in Siberia. As far as I know their idea of a party is inviting a few polar bears over for some vodka.
We don't get polar bears over here you Russia-noob. It's regular old bears and vodka, with the bears being strictly optional. I've actually only been to one event where vodka was consumed since I arrived a few months ago; it's not as ubiquitous as one might think.
In reference to Gelgarin teaching in serbia, and their apparent lack of fun times to be had.
I would be having an immense amount of fun in serbia.
There is a moderate amount of fun to be had in Siberia, and that's all. It was -35 for most of today, and it'll probably get colder come January. Also, very little of the fun on offer is accessible when you're working a 54 hour week and can just about ask for potatoes in the local tongue, but not much else.
So yeah; EFL can be pretty much whatever you want it to be right now. Piss easy party vessel, incredibly challenging but rewarding career, convenient excuse to travel or pretty much anything in between.
And... I'm back!
I'd considered getting a CELTA after I finish my BA at the end of next semester. But at the same time, I already feel I've sunk a lot of money into an education I undervalue. If I were to do a year or two in Asia to get my feet wet and then make my decision whether or not to get a CELTA based off of that, would it be held against me by people in the field who don't consider the uncertified types in Asia to be serious about this line of work?
Biggest challenge of being abroad long term?
Biggest reward?
What's next for you? The middle east? I hear there's major bank to be made there if you're serious and qualified. Some truth to that?
I'd considered getting a CELTA after I finish my BA at the end of next semester. But at the same time, I already feel I've sunk a lot of money into an education I undervalue. If I were to do a year or two in Asia to get my feet wet and then make my decision whether or not to get a CELTA based off of that, would it be held against me by people in the field who don't consider the uncertified types in Asia to be serious about this line of work?
Biggest challenge of being abroad long term?
Biggest reward?
What's next for you? The middle east? I hear there's major bank to be made there if you're serious and qualified. Some truth to that?
And... I'm back!
I'd considered getting a CELTA after I finish my BA at the end of next semester. But at the same time, I already feel I've sunk a lot of money into an education I undervalue. If I were to do a year or two in Asia to get my feet wet and then make my decision whether or not to get a CELTA based off of that, would it be held against me by people in the field who don't consider the uncertified types in Asia to be serious about this line of work?
For what it's worth; I recommend the CELTA route. Probably the biggest complaints I hear leveled against the lower tier Asian industry, particularly China and Vietnam, is that native teachers are given very little support in terms of methodology and development. People show up unprepared to teach, and don't leave a whole lot better. Almost nobody stays at any school there for longer than a year, so the schools are less inclined to put any effort into you.
Obviously this isn't universally true; I have friends who've gone to Asia post CELTA and are having a very positive experience whilst raking in double my salary with no risk of losing their testicles to frostbite, but it's very hard to know what you're getting before you show up.
If you do go the Asia route, try to go with an international language school such as English First (my boss tells me that they're a bunch of incompetent money sucking scumbags - but I sense she may not be totally impartial) since you're likely to get more out of the experience than just dipping your toes in the water.
On the flip side; CELTA is incredible, and managed to simultaneously be the most intense and rewarding experiences of my entire life. I have literally never met a person in my life who didn't regard it as a worthwhile investment, and this includes the people who decided not to go into EFL and the people who wound up failing the course. You'll get taught how to teach properly (which is a hell of a lot harder then teachers make it seem) and more importantly get taught how to develop. I'm a pretty fucking mediocre teacher when the chips are down, but my honest suspicion is that, without the CELTA tutelage it would have been a total train-wreck and I'd be back to freelance writing by now.
The other advantage to CELTA is that it provides experience of the aspects of ELF that most people really want to pursue (since they involve more money and less children). Go straight overseas and dollars to donuts you'll end up teaching young children, which fucking sucks. Adults are much more interesting, and more valuable experience.
Of course, CELTA ain't cheap, especially if you're just coming off Uni. In the UK there's bugger all financial support for it, so getting a job's probably necessary. If you're resigned to doing that anyway then there's certainly worse ways than dipping your feet into an Asian school.
As a CELTA fanboy, my totally biased suggestion is that, if you can afford to do CELTA, do CELTA. If you can't, try and get short term experience somewhere interesting and outside of the major metropolitan cities and save some money, then do CELTA if you still think it would be valuable. If you don't think it would be valuable, probably do it anyway since it looks impressive to potential employers, and some of them won't look at you without it.
Biggest challenge of being abroad long term?
That's gunna be different for every person in every country. Some people get homesick badly; to the point where they blow most of the money they're saving on flights to and from the UK (or wherever). Personally I'm a massive introvert, and have probably been forced to be more social in my day to day life since moving to Russian than I have at any point since high school - so being away from the people I know hasn't caused me to think twice. It is worth noting though, before leaving your country you should probably resign yourself to an intercourse free existence for the foreseeable future. There's a lot of jokes that go round about ELF teachers being "babe magnets" or "rolling in pussy" or whatever Norcal would say, and whilst being an exotic foreigner probably helps with the ladies, the number of eligible women who you can ethically sleep with is going to decrease by about 10,000% as soon as you leave the plane.
The language barrier is a big deal; especially if you're like me and feel apprehensive about making a part out of yourself in front of strangers. Be aware that the comfortable western culture where you can buy everything you ever wanted without having to exchange a word with another human being does not exist abroad. In Russia (as well as most of Asia and Africa) the vast majority of shops require you to ask for what you want directly, so you either start playing the mime game, or you do what I do and restrict yourself to a tiny number of shopping locations. Even something as simple as taking the bus or going to a cafe by myself I feel uncomfortable with at the moment, and Russia is a much easier culture to deal with than Asia.
On a personal level, the weather isn't nearly as big a deal as I like to make out. People all over the world generally do a pretty good job of making life bearable, and outside of ten minutes each day traveling to and from work, I hardly notice the change in temperature.
You have to expect a given value of cultural differences, though this is a thousand times worse in Asia than in Eastern Europe. The worse I have to put up with is feeling like a political extremist every time I suggest that it might not be compulsory for women to do all the housework or that calling black people ******s in inappropriate. My friends in Asia keep witnessing people shitting in bins, which I'll take bigotry over every day of the week.
For the most difficult thing though, I have an unfounded hunch that you'll be the same as me, and find the biggest shift will be the fact that you're suddenly expected to hold down a proper job. EFL is really hard work; once you land a legitimate job you'll work twice as many hours as advertised putting your lessons together, and things just don't stop. As soon as you clear one hurdle of a difficult lesson another one will get shoved in your path. I've been experimenting with how easy it is to phone it in, and the answer in not very, at least not while you're still new to things.
Biggest reward?
A real job that isn't fucking boring. EFL is ten times more interesting than being a professional writer (or for that matter any other job I bothered to hold down) ever was. You know all those tiresome cliches that the adverts telling you to become a school teacher throw about? (you know, new challenges every day, being surrounded by interesting people, that kind of thing) Well most of them are true. EFL isn't boring.
There's also the fact that the world is your oyster. Get good enough and there's basically nowhere on the planet that you can't go and lead a very comfortable existence. There is nowhere, except possible North Korea, where they don't require English teachers these days. Somewhere on the planet is bound to be to your taste.
The biggest plus thoug h, at least in my mind, is that it's a career with room for development in lots of different directions, which is bloody rare at the moment. Once you progress up the ladder doors start to open up in the Middle East where it is possible to start making frankly offensive sums of money compared to the average cost of living. An old friend of mind started on $38,000 recently in Saudi, which when you consider that you can rent a high end 3 bedroom apartment for less than $12,000 per year, and that EFL teachers don't have to pay tax over there, and that you're almost certainly being given free accommodation anyway, makes things seem pretty cushy.
There's also lots of different career paths you can grow into. You can just scale up as an EFL teacher until you're making the big monies. Or you can go back and take the DELTA and start to open up university positions, managerial roles and instructional work. Or if you get sick of people with offensive skin tones you can very easily transition into traditional teaching, ether at home or abroad. You have more options available than is the vast majority of other professions.
What's next for you? The middle east? I hear there's major bank to be made there if you're serious and qualified. Some truth to that?
As I attested earlier, yes, lots of truth to it. I'm not a big one for planning, but my tentative idea is to stick out Russia for twelve months, by which time my savings should be north of the 10k mark again. Go back to England and write until I can find an appropriate job in a country like Jakarta and have my world moving foreign adventure whilst still building up worth while experience. Then once I've got three or four years under my belt make a B line for Dubai or Saudi and save some serious money whilst completing my DELTA. Retire at 30 to some nice poor country, or go back to the UK and try teaching CELTA, or whatever else seems like a good idea at the time.
Hopefully that's coherent. Now I need to start lesson planning again. CAE classes tomorrow, which means I'm teaching most of the native Russian teachers in the school. Interesting fact; Teachers make the absolute worst students.
The Dragon Saga
Whale in a Teardrop
Friend of mine was coaxed out of journalism without any degree to teach Slovakian children English on a two year trial basis. He loves it. Apparently everything in Slovakia is cheap as hell, so when he left us he was just another broke student living off noodles, pasta and the occasional chicken fajita. Now he seasons his steak with the finest Slovakian vodka... well, this is what I imagine he does, also a bit of an alcoholic but you'll have that.
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