Swerves, turns and why the WWE has not had many of them

[S.O.B. Radio]

I think the WWE is long overdue for some serious swerves and face/heel turns in the roster. I feel WWE missed an opportunity to turn Vince heel once again during The Bash PPV and I feel that right now Christian should turn heel on ECW. The rumored turn is that Edge will be a face when he returns. I find Edge as a face to be a complete waste of one of the company's better heels.

I know WWE does not want to become another TNA with heel and face turns that confuse the average TV viewer. Main Event Mafia and World Elite are similar to the nWo Wolfpac and nWo Hollywood. It still looks like writing is stuck in neutral throughout professional wrestling.

And as for the Dibiase rumored face turn, I still think we are no closer to this becoming a reality. It's an inevitable that the Legacy group will disband and Orton will feud with one or both of the members.

As for main event programs, this is where a good and well written heel or face turn could reel in viewers and keep them involved for a longer period of time with the storylines. A well written turn is badly needed.

 

[Sean Valjean]

I agree, it's been a awhile since there's been a "oh my god" calibur heel/face turn. They had a chance to do it with Batista last year in his fued with HBK but bailed out at the last chance. At HIAC, when HHH left HBK i thought it'd be great if he just abandoned Shawn to set up a heel turn, but alas.

Unfortunately, the only turn that seems to be going down is Chavo's face turn which doesn't excite me at all. Other than that, no one looks to be turning anytime soon, especially in the main event. Sad, because a good heel/face turn in the ME could help compensate for the lack of new fueds and challengers.

 

[shafe_41]

This is not a breaking news story. The E will have very few turns and swerves from now until the end up time for one reason and one reason only... the IWC.

We have killed turns and swerves with early report stories, spoilers, and endless debate and discussion about how things will play out. Though turns and swerves make things interesting, nobody in the IWC (me included) will stop talking, reading, etc... because at the end of the day, they don't really mean alot. Plus, if they were that big of a deal to us, then we would quit discussing, debating, reading and posting spoilers, etc... At the end of the day... its what the results and fallouts from said turns and swerves that make the difference. Not the turn or swerve itself. I can only remember 3 halfway memorable swerves and surprises in the past 2 years. And they're not even that spectacular.

Christian's re-debut, Cena as #30 in the Rumble, Matt Hardy heel turn. I mean sure they were big... but at the end of the day... big deal.

 

[rayisawesomeness]

I think the last time I was literally in shock was Royal Rumble '08 with Cena returning. I don't have any reasons on why there hasn't been many swerves, I'm not part of creative, I wouldn't know but my best bet is because well... fuck me, I don't know...

 

[Tyler44]

The only time in the last like 4 years i have been swerved and did not see something coming was these two times:

1. Miz playing the character as the Calgary Kid. Ironically, we heard rumors of Eugene returning and he was in a contract match against some random masked person. For some reason i forgot Miz was fired from Raw the week before.

2. This next one pissed me off so much that i think it could of been one of the most disappointing plots in wwe, Kane and the burlap bag. I was hoping, along with most fans, for kane's mask to return, but it was Mysterio's mask.

There are a few reasons why we are not swerved anymore.
1. We are a lot older and much more educated of how things work.
2. Obviously what we are doing now, the IWC.
3. We hate the Pg rating, so we will not accept anything.

 

[gtajoker01]

I agree.. They need to have hbk turn heel and drop hhh because dx is overrated sorry to say but they were the late 90's and this is now time for changes. and the thing that makes me mad the most is the faces always win well not actually always but mostly win but my point is I dont care whos heel or face i just want refreshing and new matches.

 

[Tripleb2k1]

in regards to the arguments against Edge's returning face turn...who has returned from a serious injury and wasnt brought back as a face?

 

[pyrusane]

in regards to the arguments against Edge's returning face turn...who has returned from a serious injury and wasnt brought back as a face?

I thought about this one for a moment, and one person occurred to me who returned from an injury as a heel. You have to go back a few years for this one. A relatively new performer on Smackdown injured his arm, ending a poorly conceived gimmick where he would tag with a new partner each week, lose the match, then blame himself for the loss as he promised the following weeks partner that "I'll do better this time." I think they might have been building to a jinx/cursed storyline, much like WCW did with the Armstrongs a couple decades ago.

Fortunately, this angle got scrapped when this newcomer got injured. However, this injury was the catalyst of his heel turn, as he used it to start cutting annoying promo's, updating everyone on the progress of his recovery each week. The idea, apparently, was that he was so talented and popular that the fans were breathless with anticipation of his in-ring return. And when he did finally return, it was to become the third member of Evolution.

I am, of course, referring to Randy Orton, in his first heel turn.

 

[The Gribbler]

Lolz - I actually loved the Cena rumble thing - I marked out and I am not even a big Cena fan. I respect him and all but he just isnt in my top 5.

Anyway, alot of the things that the WWE does to surprise us probably does surprise the casual fan. They obviously can't swerve us too often because somehow we know all the little bits of irrelevant info so they cant sneak it by us.

We became 'educated' fans at the sacrifice of swerves and surprises. It was our choice.

As for turns, I am glad they don't happen that often, I like people to be a heel or face for a long time before a change, I mean it takes alot of irritation before you are willing to change your beliefs in one defining moment.

Just My Opinion

 

[johnbragg]

Part of the reason is that we're here analyzing everything, predicting and fantasy booking. If there's a character who could benefit from a turn, someone will be speculating on it, and someone on every forum will be beating a drum for it.

So a turn doesn't feel like a swerve to us. In some ways that's good--it's a result of turns being logical developments of a character rather than random surprises that disrupt the logic of things. A turn that is both surprising and logical in retrospect is very, very hard to pull off and so doesn't happen very often.

That said, I think Batista could use a heel turn, but I've never really dug Batista except in his first face "can someone--anyone--please beat HHH" run. (Has he ever been a heel since then?) Now that he's on Smackdown with a kind of crowded face scene with Undertaker, Morrison and Mysterio, maybe he turns on Rey Rey for costing him the title at Bragging Rights? An alliance with Vickie Guerrero, or a revelation that he was sent to Smackdown by Vince McMahon as a "man on the inside" to take down Teddy Long?

 

[healyz84]

How can you say there hasn't been any good turns/swerve's in the wwe right now. Sure, we don't see very many right now, but that is mostly because us, as fans, got tired of every other week a wrestler turning face/heel, and that is mostly because of wcw and their faction warfare. But looking at the product right now, we just had one of the greatest turn/swerve's in probably this decade. Who could have thought that, after having a grueling match of his own earlier in the night, CM Punk would come down at the end of a ladder match and 'steal' the title away from the beloved Jeff Hardy. Now as the wwe goes, this did not right away turn Punk heel, as they gauged the fan reaction. But quite frankly, the minute CM Punk's music hit after Jeff finally won the title pretty much sealed his fate. The fans instantly turned on him. It was a great heel turn in which you had that climatic moment, but then you had his justification and the inevitable growth toward the full-fledged heel. I think for the wwe, you have to give them full marks for how that played out. And really, I don't think there would be anyone better than CM Punk to have played this role.

As for future turns/swerves, there may be a few on the horizon. Edge will probably return as a face, and we havn't seen him as a face in what, 4-5 years. Also, eventually one of HHH/HBK will turn heel, for if you take Orton out of the equation, there is no other top heel on Raw, while for top faces you have HHH/HBK/Cena. I would love to see an HBK heel turn, but that is never going to happen, as the fans will cheer him regardless. If he did not turn heel after ending Flair's career, did not turn heel while feuding with the faces of Batista and Jericho(another good heel turn, I might add), and he did not turn heel with his heelish tactics against Taker, then HBK ain't turning heel.

But to end, im saying that I hope we see more turns/swerves, but I don't know who or when. Isn't that the whole point of a turn/swerve, to keep us guessing, and then to shock us in the end?? You can blame the IWC all you want, but every once in a while, the wwe does shock us.

 

[NSL]

The way the WWE is now, concerning turns and swerves, is the same as it was back in the 70's and 80's. They happened, but few and far between, and made big splashes.

The reason all of you are so jaded is because of the Russo era in WWE, swerving everything for no reason at all. Stone Cold joining the Corporation, Undertaking flip-flopping more than Kerry at a debate...It was all for nothing, and because Russo liked it. He did the same thing in WCW.

You almost never saw major swerves and turns in ECW, and you got them rarely in WWE. I don't see the problem with the way it is now.

 

[thachozenonebx]

in regards to the arguments against Edge's returning face turn...who has returned from a serious injury and wasnt brought back as a face?

Randy Orton before he was in Evolution

they actually transitioned him into a heel while he was injured

but i get your point

 

[johnbragg]

And really, I don't think there would be anyone better than CM Punk to have played this role.

The Punk heel turn was great because it fit with his existing character and motivations, but still surprised people.

 

["Cool Guy" Jensen]

I am not a very big fan of too many face/heel changes, and with this year alone... we've seen turns ffrom Mark Henry, M.V.P., Matt Hardy (TWICE), C.M. Punk, Carlito, Santino Marella, Alicia Fox, Charlie Haas, John Morrison, and Shelton Benjamin. I know these aren't those "Oh My God" turns, since the biggest star from the list would be C.M. Punk, but take a turn for what it's for.

I do not know why you people want to see Christian turn heel so fast. Why rush it? From what I remember, I don't think Christian has ever been a single's face. And from what I've seen and been seeing with him on ECW... he's pretty damn good. Listen to the crowd every time his music hits. We know he has to turn heel sometime, but why can't it happen for another year or so. His pops are still outstanding.

Vince McMahon has been playing a bit of a tweener role on Smackdown, but more of a face on Raw. He will likely screw The Undertaker out of the World Heavyweight Championship at some ppv, whether it be Bragging Rights or at Survivor Series. I am not really happy that it might happen, but it is the most likely scenario.

Most face or heel turns happen for stupid reasons. So, even if I am not a fan of too many heel or face turns... if it gets my attention, I'm okay with it, I guess.

As for swerves... I don't like too many of them either. The Undertaker winning the title at Hell in a Cell was a bit of a swerve, I think (despite it being reported that it was the plan from the start). Chris Jericho winning the World Heavyweight Title at Unforgiven was not predictable, until he was added to the match. John Cena's #30 Royal Rumble entrance, which was stupid. Some swerves don't make sense, so I can't really say if I like them or not.

 

[Ubiquitous]

in regards to the arguments against Edge's returning face turn...who has returned from a serious injury and wasnt brought back as a face?

I'm 100% certain as to how long he had been out, but when Edge returned at the one Hell in a Cell match between 'taker and batista, he r$eturned as a heel, screwing the Undertaker. Although he was a heel when he left, he still returned as a heel. It also started the Vickie/Edge storyline.

 

[LCShazardous]

the last good heel turn in the WWE was matt hardy's which did'nt go anywhere for him but it still had that omg calibur for little kids and a mild shock to the older people.

someone who needs to go heel is Finlay he's just awful as a face.

someone who i want to go face is Jericho. granted he is one of the best heels out there but i just want to see how he could go face? he's done so much to the face talent. and insulted the fans night in and night out. what could make him go back ot being the ayatollah of rock n rolla.

someone that needs a heel turn is HHH that way we could see him lose once in a while.

 

[The Gribbler]

[QUOTE="Cool Guy" Jensen;1431558]John Cena's #30 Royal Rumble entrance, which was stupid. [/QUOTE]

Why was it stupid, I didn't see it coming and I went bananas when it happened (it might have been because I had a random draw pool going, and the last three men were numbers 28, 12 and 30 and I had numbers 28 and 30 and when I saw John I knew the $30 in the jar was mine) But I went nuts because I was surprised. I didn't see it coming.

I mean John Cashing his title shot at NWO was ******ed but the win itself was awesome.

 

[spinningtorturerack]

someone that needs a heel turn is HHH that way we could see him lose once in a while.

Problem is we've been told he doesn't want to do heel anymore, and apparently wants to stay face till he retires (what a glorious day that shall be) which is a shame as even though i don't like him, he has played amazing heel characters!

I know we might be jaded by russo's swerving and turns but you do need that sometimes! It can become bland and predictable otherwise. I think Austin WMx7 is a great example of what a heel turn should be.

 

[Tastycles]

The difference in the WWE's swerves these days is that they are generally what you expect to happen not happening, rather than the other way around. Everyone thought it was going to be Christian, not Matt Hardy as it transpired. Because it wasn't a shit the bed revelation, people don't talk about it.

The thing is is that, thanks to Russo, people are always expecting turns so they lack their impact. If John Cena turned on DX when they were fighting Legacy, nobody would care half as much as they did when Hogan turned? Why? Because we expect the unexpected. Swerves are still there, you're just not as suprised by them. In the past few months we've seen Punk cash in on Jeff, Taker get screwed, Jericho pick the Big Show as his partner, MAtt Hardy turn face. While not exactly earth shattering, nobody widely saw these coming, but because you're programmed for the swerve, you aren't suprised. The swerves are there, you just don't care, because of their overexposure in the late 90s.

 

[Dave]

The thing about swerves is that no one legitimately wants to see them. I personally hate seeing shitty swerves at every PPV match. Just as the superstar you want to see win the title is about to win, the other superstar hits the referee and gets himself disqualified. That is the lowest of the low and not something that I would ever consider as being "badly needed". A heel turn, however, is something that I think is quite interesting. When I think of the people who have performed great heel turns, I think of Jericho. Jericho was a face wehn he returned and then without a lot of notice he completely turned and got over as a mega-heel. The same was true of Orton. Orton was a face at one point when he got his first title run and they turned him heel. Now, he is one of the best heels on the roster and one of the most over people in WWE.

When I think of the superstars who are on the roster now, I legitimately can't think of anyone who I would be interested in seeing a heel turn from, with the exception of John Cena. I think I would eventually come to hate Cena if he turned heel because I like him at the moment, although I do feel that him turning heel would shut a lot of people up and would also test him in a situation that he is not overly comfortable in. Cena is the only person on the roster, who if turned suddenly heel, I would even care about.