Some "Straight Talk" about the Unified Tag Titles & Tag Team Division

[Ambiguous Turd]

Let me get this out of the way, first.

To say I am not happy about the way the Unified Tag Team Championships and Division are being treated is an understatement. I am going to go into some issues that I have with the division, as well as the titles themselves.

In the process, I will say this. If Vince McMahon truly does not care about Tag Teams and thinks they are useless ... and doesn't want to invest a damn thing into the Tag Team Division, just take it to the next step and eliminate Tag Team Wrestling on your broadcasts.

Since you don't feel you make money off Tag Teams, and that they are essentially useless, and nor do you care what fans think about the Tag Team Division, then just eliminate the whole thing. After all, you know what's better for us than we do, right?

With that being said, let's discuss a couple issues I have:


1. One set of the Tag Team Titles needs to be eliminated

"Psssst, Vince. It's time to actually UNIFY the Tag Team titles together into 1 Championship. We don't need to see 2 sets of belts on Chris Jericho and The Big Show. The Tag Team Titles are supposed to be "Unified" remember?"

Especially, if you have no plans to split the two sets of titles any time soon, what really is the use of having the wrestlers come out with 4 belts? It looks ridiculous.



2. There is an ulterior motive to the rule of Unified Champions appearing on both brands.

Sure, the concept made sense. Since a set of Tag Titles were going to be eliminated, one could have only assumed that the Tag Team Champions would therefore be defending their titles against the Tag Teams on all shows ... since there weren't enough Tag Teams to actually merit each show having it's own set of Tag Team titles.

But, if you think about it, how many times have you seen Chris Jericho and Big Show defend their Tag Titles on Raw, Smackdown, or ECW or start a program with the established Tag Teams already on each of the rosters?

Cryme Tyme
Legacy
Hart Dynasty
Kozlov and Jackson




Which leads us to the REAL reason why Vince eliminated the set of Tag Team titles and made the new rule about the talent being able to appear on both shows .....



3. The Unified Tag Team Division was made primarily with the intent of giving the titles to two Upper Midcarders and having them appear on BOTH of the Main Shows.


In other words, for all the people who thought Vince actually cared about investing in the Tag Team Division, you were WRONG.

When he did this, he did it with the intent of his usual slapping a pair of wrestlers together and calling them a Tag Team .... but with this new rule in place, he devised a way to work two established Upper Midcarders into the Tag Team Division, to appear on BOTH shows, for the purpose of supporting the Main Eventers ... because of his stale Main Event problem.

And that is exactly why he originally made Chris Jericho and Edge the Tag Team Champions, so Edge could be shoved down everyone's throats on BOTH shows, which Vince seems to do at every chance he gets (which I'm sorry to say, was one reason I am happy that Edge got injured ... so Vince was forced to use someone else) .....

and is the reason why Big Show took Edge's place in that team.

Who is this team feuding with?

Other pairs of Upper Midcarders like Mark Henry and MVP ....

and now Triple H and Shawn Michaels.



So if DX wins the titles, which they have a good shot at doing, then Shawn and Triple H will be the ones appearing on both shows (although I would expect Smackdown appearances to be scaled down on the part of Michaels, due to his regular Tuesday commitments).



Let's cut the bull about investing in Tag Teams and this being a good thing. The Unified Tag Team Titles haven't done a damn thing to help the actual Tag Team Division out. Rather, it has only been used as a way to support the Main Event and Upper Midcard on both shows.


Again, just do away with one of the sets of Tag Titles ...

and Vince, if you don't care about Tag Teams, seriously, just do away with the entire Tag Team Division, instead of pretending to make everyone think you actually care about re-investing in it.


When I see someone hold the Tag Titles, other than established Upper Midcarders .... a team like The Hart Dynasty, or Cryme Tyme, then we will know that Vince is actually serious about the actual Tag Team Division again, instead of just using Singles wrestlers to appear on 2 shows, instead of being restricted to 1.


Feel free to discuss your thoughts about the entire Tag Team Division in this thread, and what should be done with the Unified Tag Team Titles. Should they continue with 2 sets of belts or eliminate a set?

Should the titles be split up like they used to be, with more Tag Teams added to the roster?

What do you think about slapped-together Tag Teams? Are they suitable or do you prefer teams like they used to be ... dedicated to the Tag Team Division, who complimented one another?

Lastly, do you agree or disagree that this is all that Vince has used the Rule of "Champions appearing on Both Shows" for ... giving each show an additional established Upper Midcarder (which he is low on) to bolster the other's roster and support the Main Event and Upper Midcards?

 

[And I'm Awesome]

1. One set of the Tag Team Titles needs to be eliminated

"Psssst, Vince. It's time to actually UNIFY the Tag Team titles together into 1 Championship. We don't need to see 2 sets of belts on Chris Jericho and The Big Show. The Tag Team Titles are supposed to be "Unified" remember?"

Especially, if you have no plans to split the two sets of titles any time soon, what really is the use of having the wrestlers come out with 4 belts? It looks ridiculous.

Absolutely concur. It looks stupid and awkward. Jericho has to balance a belt on his shoulder while cutting promos. When Primo & Carlito held them, Primo wore them around his neck...that looked like a real champion to me. There's a reason they're belts...to be worn around the waist! If Vince continues with the Unified Tag Team Titles (a.k.a. his way to have top stars on both shows), then they need a unified design. Hopefully they introduce new belts at the PPV this Sunday, because 4 belts hanging over the ring will look horrible.

2. There is an ulterior motive to the rule of Unified Champions appearing on both brands.

Sure, the concept made sense. Since a set of Tag Titles were going to be eliminated, one could have only assumed that the Tag Team Champions would therefore be defending their titles against the Tag Teams on all shows ... since there weren't enough Tag Teams to actually merit each show having it's own set of Tag Team titles.

But, if you think about it, how many times have you seen Chris Jericho and Big Show defend their Tag Titles on Raw, Smackdown, or ECW or start a program with the established Tag Teams already on each of the rosters?

Cryme Tyme
Legacy
Hart Dynasty
Kozlov and Jackson

Which leads us to the REAL reason why Vince eliminated the set of Tag Team titles and made the new rule about the talent being able to appear on both shows .....

Again, concur. We may have had hopes when these belts were unified and put on the Colons, but...it got demoted from the main WM card to the dark match?! That should have sent up red flags about Vince actually getting behind tag wrestling. Then, at The Bash, we expect Legacy vs. Colons. Putting the belts on Legacy and having them on both shows would have shown some commitment to the tag division. Instead, we get Edge and Chris Jericho thrown into the match at the last second, and they win?! Forget red flags, this is a damn burning bush shouting "I don't care about your damn tag team wrestling! I needed an excuse to put more SmackDown stars on RAW!"

3. The Unified Tag Team Division was made primarily with the intent of giving the titles to two Upper Midcarders and having them appear on BOTH of the Main Shows.


In other words, for all the people who thought Vince actually cared about investing in the Tag Team Division, you were WRONG.

When he did this, he did it with the intent of his usual slapping a pair of wrestlers together and calling them a Tag Team .... but with this new rule in place, he devised a way to work two established Upper Midcarders into the Tag Team Division, to appear on BOTH shows, for the purpose of supporting the Main Eventers ... because of his stale Main Event problem.

And that is exactly why he originally made Chris Jericho and Edge the Tag Team Champions, so Edge could be shoved down everyone's throats on BOTH shows, which Vince seems to do at every chance he gets (which I'm sorry to say, was one reason I am happy that Edge got injured ... so Vince was forced to use someone else) .....

and is the reason why Big Show took Edge's place in that team.

Who is this team feuding with?

Other pairs of Upper Midcarders like Mark Henry and MVP ....

and now Triple H and Shawn Michaels.

So if DX wins the titles, which they have a good shot at doing, then Shawn and Triple H will be the ones appearing on both shows (although I would expect Smackdown appearances to be scaled down on the part of Michaels, due to his regular Tuesday commitments).

Yikes. Yeah, once we throw out Vince caring about tag wrestling, this is what's left. I don't want to say he always planned on putting it on upper mid card guys, but this is Vince... He just needed an excuse to have his top tier guys on multiple shows. He overloaded SmackDown at the draft, and it was backfiring due to injuries in his RAW main event scene. Hence the downgrading of Legacy and inclusion of Rated Y2J at The Bash.

At this point, I'd rather see Vince just do away with the damn division all together and quit bullshitting me. It's not gonna happen, but I don't enjoy being shit on by Vinnie Mac. I'm not saying he has to totally get behind the damn thing, but make it a bit more serious! Establish a few more tag teams and...actually use them! When's the last time the "World's Strongest Tag Team" actually wrestled a tag match on RAW? Yeah, I don't remember off the top of my head, either.

But, it's Vince. Forget it. Enjoy DX merch plugs on both shows. I'd rather see them stay on Jerishow, if for no other reason than I don't get SmackDown and I would rather still be able to watch Jericho.

 

[Dagger Dias]

Feel free to discuss your thoughts about the entire Tag Team Division in this thread, and what should be done with the Unified Tag Team Titles.

Great topic. I had a lot to say, so I did a brief section on each.

On whether a set of belts should be eliminated
I think the reason that there are still two sets that each of the champions come out with is because they intend to separate the belts again at some point. It probably won't be anytime soon, because they are making the tag team belts more important even though traditional tag teams aren't the champions.

On the champions appearing on both brands
This is VERY likely what's going on. Whoever holds the Unified Tag Team Championship can appear on Raw when they are from Smackdown, and vice versa. They kill two birds with one stone by doing this. The two randomly paired individuals (JeriShow currently) get to appear on all shows so it doubles their odds of getting more over. It also makes the belts more important. Thus, if this goal of "getting two guys onto all shows" is true.... then they are on the right track because they are solving two problems at the same time: getting two guys more over, and making the tag belts important.

On the future of the tag team division
I've already touched on this a bit. The belts need to remain unified for a bit longer. Once the prestige is brought back, then they can go back to having traditional tag teams win them rather than two random upper card guys like JeriShow. The traditional tag teams need to get built up though in the meantime. The Hart Dynasty, Cryme Tyme, Legacy, Barreta & Croft, they have enough tag teams for ONE division if you take all the "traditional" tag teams that are currently active. Until they have enough for two GOOD divisions; and until the belts prestige is at least partially restored; the belts need to remain unified for now. The future of the tag team division is looking better, but they need to fix a few things first.

 

[Toroc102]

Got to agree, I actually posted some of the same thoughts in the Baretta/Croft thread in the ECW forum, the WWE fooled me at first(they love to do this as a way of throwing fans off their scent, like bringing "ECW" back as a way to get people to watch what is basically Livewire)when they uified the titles and put them on Primo and Carlito, but as soon as two Main-Eventers like Jericho and Edge/Show(You may consider them just Upper-Midcarders, but imo any one of those guys can fill a Main-Event spot at any time, for months at a time, credibly) got them I knew it was the same old same old. Jerishow hasn't had a single feud with a Tag-Team that actually needs a rub and have kind've just been feuding aimlessly with D/X.

I really don't even see the point of this feud, if its not for a World Title, these guys shouldn't be feuding with each other, they are 4 of the most established names in the business. I really don't feel like seeing HHH/HBK feud again even if its for a retirement angle, they feuded for like 3 years straight already this decade. If anything HBK should feud with someone like Miz/Morrison when he's really ready to hang it up. HHH should just bite the bullet and go to SD for christs sake, I just think he is so played out on Raw, as both face and heel.

Anyhow, Vince more than likely doesn't give a shit about the Tag Division and this is what Sidious makes it out to be. I'd say the Tag-Division is actually worse off now then it was before because there is absolutely nothing that any of the REAL tag-teams are fighting for at the moment. I guess its a good thing that there are really only two teams left in the WWE at the moment in Cryme Time and The Hart Dynasty. Actually I take that back, The Hart Dynasty is the last team left, Cryme Time might as well by The Brooklyn Brawlers.

Oh yeah, I actually like that they come out with 4 belts, I've always liked that type of thing, like when Ultimo Dragon came out with like 8 japanese titles. I didn't know what any of them were called but I took Ultimo seriously from the first moment I saw him. For me unless ALL of the belts in the company were unified I don't think it would be neccessary to drop either set of titles.

 

[johnbragg]

One set of belts should be eliminated, and a new (or old) belt design should be used for the "Unified Tag Team Championship".

The move was definitely made to put one pair of low-main-eventers/upper-midcarders (Jericho/Edge/Show) on both shows. I'm actually okay with that, that by itself helps the tag belts by giving them something unique.

I wouldn't even mind the lack of focus on tag teams if Vince was using the tag belts to elevate upper midcarders.

Even the program with MVP & Henry, two thrown together singles wrestlers, would have been worth something if MVP and Henry had gotten the belts, even for a night or a week. They win on Raw, Jerishow gets a rematch on Smackdown, Teddy Long makes it a Triple Threat with Rey & Batista, Rey & Batista win, Jerishow gets the belts back at the pay-per-view.

That would have given the MVP&WSM team credibility to chase the tag belts for at least until Wrestlemania. Sure, they won't be a team forever, but they proved for at least one night that they have what it takes to reach the top of the tag team division. (/kayfabe) Post-Wrestlemania, have MVP & WSM in the tag team title mix with Jerishow, Edge & Christian, and Legacy. Hart Dynasty and Cryme Time still trying to work their way into that mix. Which would have elevated one or both into world title contenders when the team has run its course.

I don't mind using the tag team division to build up midcarders into main eventers. But WWE isn't even doing that right.

 

[King Patrick Star]

The Tag Team Titles right now are the only Titles that the WWE is using correctly. All the Titles should be formatted the way the Tag Titles are. Having a Belt shows you’re the Champ, but having two belts shows you’re the “Best in the World at what you do”. How does having more Gold look stupid?? The Titles are “Unified”, but one set doesn’t have to disappear. If they get rid of one, fine, but the appearance of 4 Belts doesn’t bother me at all. What about Jericho only having the Blue Belt and Big Show only having the Red Belt?? HAHA!!

I, for one, would love to see the World Tag Titles on Raw, the WWE Tag Titles on Smackdown and even the ECW Tag Titles on ECW, but the way it is right now is working out great. I think Jericho and Big Show are doing a great job with the 4 Straps.

More Tag Teams should be added to the rosters. I think ECW should make the Superstar Initiative about Tag Teams and have all the new Stars start out in pairs. It’ll save a lot of time, career-wise, for up and comers.

Slapped together, established single Stars, no Team name, Tag Teams are okay in my book. They can only help the Tag division by being an additional team. The can even book the makeshift teams to lose against an actual Tag Team to show Team work beats egos.

And last, as far as Vince and his caring about the Tag Teams goes, of course he cares. If he didn’t then the Tag Titles would have been “Hornswoggled” by now. If VKM really didn’t care about the Tag Titles, he wouldn’t have given them to the first Undisputed WWF / WCW Champion in history and the only Superstar to hold the WWF/E, WCW and ECW Titles. He could have simply had himself and the Little Bastard win the Titles and retire them. If you’re looking for divisions or Titles that he doesn’t care about, talk about the Television, European, Hardcore, and Light Heavyweight / Cruiserweight Titles and divisions. That’s what he doesn’t give a $#!+ about.

 

[CardiffCam]

I agree completely with every word on here. Tag team wrestling is a very important part of a wrestling show, and Vince seems to have stopped caring about it. From an entertainment perspective, seeing a tag team perform amazing double team moves, and working as a unit is great and fun to watch. From a booking perspective, tag teams can create singles stars. Lets seee.... Shawn Michaels, Jeff Hardy, Edge, Christian, just to name some recent main eventers that started as tag teams. The tag team is a powerful tool, and vince is casting it aside.

 

[Bud78]

What in the name of hell do you people want. Bitch, bitch, bitch, complain, complain, complain.

All I have heard for the past three years was bitching about the lack of a tag division and I agreed.

Then to my amazement the WWE put an emphasis back on their tag team division. THe belts were given meaning again, they were being defended, there were even a few feuds over them. Now I have to come on here and read your thoughts on why the tag division still sucks.

Now this is something I have never understood, the tag division still sucks because the guys in the tag teams are too good. I mean that is really what you are saying, you are upset because they have two upper level guys holding the belts and two main eventers going after them. What you fail to realize is that when a real team finally beats one of these teams for those belts they will actually mean something. Like when the Hart Dynasty beat DX for them it will mean something rather that if they beat those two little twerps from ECW. And by the way every company does this they always have always will, like Beer Money.

Tag Teams made up of single wrestlers in WWE chronological order:
(I'll start in 89 but before but back in the day many teams were made up of two singles wrestlers)

Andre & Haku
Money Inc.
Natural Disasters
Marty & Kid
Diesel & Shawn
Kid and Bob Holly
Owen and Yoko
Owen & Davey
I'm not even going to list all the singles tag team champions from the Attitude era, take a look it was worse than it is now with a few teams sprinkled in. Think about it, but wait, what about WCW.

WCW

1991 Steamboat and Rhodes
Steamboat and Douglas
STeve Austin Pillman
Bagwell and 2 Cold
Bagwell and the Patriot
Sting and Luger (OH NO)
Kevin Nash and Scott Hall
Luger and the Giant
Then after that almost all of them are til WCW went out of business

Point is this is how they have been doing it in wrestling forever, except for a few small pockets where tag teams were very prevalent singles wrestlers made into tag teams is how it has always been done and will continue to be done. Isn't it more important that the titles mean something than that two guys who were the same outfits are going for them?

 

[Toroc102]

Slapped together, established single Stars, no Team name, Tag Teams are okay in my book. They can only help the Tag division by being an additional team. The can even book the makeshift teams to lose against an actual Tag Team to show Team work beats egos.

And last, as far as Vince and his caring about the Tag Teams goes, of course he cares. If he didn’t then the Tag Titles would have been “Hornswoggled” by now. If VKM really didn’t care about the Tag Titles, he wouldn’t have given them to the first Undisputed WWF / WCW Champion in history and the only Superstar to hold the WWF/E, WCW and ECW Titles. He could have simply had himself and the Little Bastard win the Titles and retire them. If you’re looking for divisions or Titles that he doesn’t care about, talk about the Television, European, Hardcore, and Light Heavyweight / Cruiserweight Titles and divisions. That’s what he doesn’t give a $#!+ about.

Vince has been slapping teams together for the past 6 or 7 years, I really don't see how it works at all, mostly since those teams beat about 3 or 4 teams without feuding with them, mostly feud with other singles wrestlers the two superstars had heat with previously, and one they do lose the titles its usually in a one off match where the challengers get a sneaky win and the makeshift tag-team usually breaks up right after.

Just because he gave the belts to Jerishow, doesn't mean a damn thing. The best way to tell if he cares is to pay attention to how the belts are defended. The Tag-Titles are secondary to Jerishow right now, they're just props. They almost never defend the belts, they just like to point out that they're the Unified Tag champs. They call themselves the most dominant Tag-Team ever even though they've feuded with....they've had matches with...I mean I think they had one each with The Hart Dynasty and Cryme Time, and oh yeah they fought MVP/Mark Henry(another Tag-Team with no future). And now they're feuding with D/X, I'll bet that when they finally do lose the titles it'll be to another pair of slapped together upper mid-carders/Main eventers, or Jerishow will begin breaking up and that'll cause them to lose the titles.

 

[Spillz3000]

The situation can be a lot worse guys. We could have a tag division like last year and the year before where we had two sets of tag titles and they were barely getting any PPV or TV time until Miz and Morrison had a set and even then I don't believe they had many PPV defenses. In this year alone the Tag Titles have been on more PPV's then the past two years combined.

I'm not saying that Vince is finally shifting his attention to the Tag Team Division but it's definitely in a better state now. I mean the only problem is is that Vince and Co. aren't developing new tag teams but I'm thinking give it time and it should be fixed. Yeah being put on two Main Eventers probably isn't the best thing but believe it or not the belts are getting prestige and it has already elevated a wrestler. Show of hands, who the hell gave a damn about the Big Show before him starting teaming with Jericho? Thank you! I know he was getting pretty damn stale and definitely being used as Main Event Fodder for the likes of Randy Orton, Triple H, and Cena. Being a tag champ with Jericho has rejuvinated Big Show's Career. If it wasn't for his recent stint with Jericho, Big Show would definitely be floating in the Mid-card/Lower Mid-Card. He had no direction fueding with all of Raw's Mid-Card for the U.S. title which is a belt a man of Big Show's caliber shouldn't be going for. Now that he's teaming with Jericho the man is being seen as an Unstoppable Monster and has firmly repositioned himself in the Main Event once again. Once Jerishow runs it's course(which I hope doesn't happen anytime soon) Big Show will be taken more seriously as a Main Event threat.

So believe it or not the tag division is helping out a little bit. Give it a little more time and I think it will all pay off. I mean it may be a little premature of me to say but I think we'll actually have a Tag Title match at Wrestlemania and after the draft I think we'll see the belts being passed off to established tag teams and we'll see where it goes from there.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Eventually, I think that one set of titles needs to be eliminated and new belt designs created for the surviving championship. Me personally, I've never been a huge fan of tag team wrestling but I do hate to see potential go to waste.

What I'd personally like to see happen at TLC is for both DX and JeriShow to come away with a title. One guy from each team pulls down one belt simultaneously. A decision could be made for the titles to be separated temporarily for the purpose of showing which is the superior team as both teams would now have a legitimate claim to being the "most dominant" team and all that. Each team could defend the titles on different brands, the tag teams of each brand could be built up and the tag division. I'd leave the titles split for all of 2010, have both teams work on creating a legitimate tag division, maybe even have each team drop the titles at some point to another team but regain them after a respectable length of time. At the 2010 TLC ppv, they could unify the titles once again and actually have a tag team division.

Now, that's what I'd like to see happen. I'm all but 100% sure that it won't happen, but the WWE could have a great tag team division if it wanted to.

 

[Toroc102]

I don't think Big Show needed the tag-titles to get over as a threat, he will always be over just because he's huge. I will always give Big Show a chance to win the title if the WWE is pushing him for it.

I don't see how the division is better off, Jericho and Big Show would've been on Pay-Per-Views anyway, Tag-Team or not, except since their Main-Eventers they have a lot of things to distract them from actually defending those titles. The Tag-Division is a LOT worse off imo since the Tag-Teams really have no point if they aren't competing for the titles, which they haven't been. Now they just do aimless stuff, like neither the Hart Foundation or Cryme Time have any real purpose at the moment, they come out and compete and I think what are they even together for? I dunno how the belts are more prestigious either when the guys holding them have so many other agendas aside from the belts.

 

[JJYanks121]

Man, it's a terrible thing when belts are showcased on both major shows, defended at every PPV for the first time in years and held by guys who can actually sell tickets. Really? Will anything ever make you happy? I'm just going to guess, but you probably thoroughly enjoyed the Rock and Sock connection circa 1999. That's 2 main eventers in a tag team that succeeded as such. It wasn't the first time and certainly not the last time that has happened. Part of the beauty of the tag team division is that it has the ability to include wrestlers from all different levels of the company. Let's examine.

Of course, the type of tag team you enjoy are guys who come in as a tag team and work as such for years. Many such teams are tied together by family ties, friendships, common ancestry, or similar interests. Individually, many of these guys have zero credibility, but as individuals, they can seem legitimate. Let's take as an example Cade and Murdoch. These guys were tag team champions a couple of times, but as individuals, neither one was a serious threat to someone. The beauty of the team is that they have strength in numbers and their teamwork is what makes them good. However, if a team as such is beating a bunch of other nobodies, they will never make their way up a card. This is where main event teams come into play.

Main event teams are put together from time to time and from the onset, having two quality competitors together can look extremely dominant. We can look at teams like the Brothers of Destruction, 2 Man Power Trip, Rock and Sock Connection, etc as examples of this. More often than not, these teams are heel squads because the same way teamwork helps the lesser team, egos kill them dominant one. We can tell that Jerishow will likely go this route at some point. For a long time, they can be utterly dominant, as they are now. But if there is dissention among the ranks, the team crumbles. Imagine if you will a scenario where Jerishow is wrestling a young team, perhaps a face Legacy or Hart Dynasty if you will (neither scenario is going to happen, i'm just creating an image). Imagine a quality wrestling match but a botched move where Jericho hits Big Show with a Codebreaker which does little to him. Show gets angry and walks out on Jericho. With Jericho distracted by his partner leaving, the young competitor hits a finisher on Jericho and becomes champion. Thus, a young kid just pinned a former WWE champion. In a one on one, you won't get that type of scenario, but even mired in controversy, the team beat 2 industry stars and look credible. Had this same young team beat the Colons who had the belts previously, it probably wouldn't have been such a big deal. Every now and again, having stars in the division is a good thing, especially having them perform on both shows.

As for the double belts, GREAT IDEA. I can't stress it enough. If they have 1 belt, it is probably a thin, dull thing and in no way looks like something that should be defended on both shows. Hell, if the top individual title can't, why should that one? Having 2 makes it seem more important. When you see Jericho come out with one belt on his shoulder and one around his waist, he seems important. He's carrying 2 belts! It gives at least sort of an illusion that those belts mean as much, if not more than the WWE/World Heavyweight belts. Also, the way Jericho speaks of the belts, he makes them seem important. He speaks about how having them gives him credibility to the claim that he is "the best in the world at what he does". A couple of you made claims that Jerishow treats them like props.........have you listened to any promos Jericho has cut? Have you noticed what is going on? This team has beaten everyone from established tag teams like Cryme Tyme to Midcarders in HenVP (my coined phrase for that team), to established main eventers like Rey and Batista. By the time someone beats them, it will truly be an accomplishment. If DX does it (which could happen as the top up and coming teams are all heels), then the team that beats DX will also have something to hang their hat on.

Bottom line, I'm not sure what you want. The belt wasn't defended at last year's Wrestlemania. It was a dark match. Now it is basically on every PPV and the men holding the title have prominent roles on both 2 hour weekly broadcasts. The exposure for these belts is greater than it's been in years, and yet you want to get rid of it? Rome wasn't built in a day and neither will the tag division be rebuilt in a month. However, the exposure and the title reign have given the belts meaning again. Perhaps some of these young teams will rise to the occasion at some point. As of now, the only young team remotely capable of holding the belts is Legacy (please don't argue the Hart Dynasty because the only credibility they have is their name), but perhaps a future of Legacy vs. Dynasty is possible and I would expect other main event teams to be thrown together to dominate a team like that and thus, whoever beats that team will get that rub again. It's all a cycle and hopefully over time it works. I can't guarantee it, but I think the foundation is being laid. As long as these belts are on PPVs and the champs sell feuds, long or short, on weekly television, you can't say it's in a worse position than this time last year. It is on the up, and until something drastic happens, it will continue to be on the up.

 

[Toroc102]

The Titles haven't even been defended on the past two pay-per views.

It doesn;t matter if their held by two guys who can sell tickets, those guys we're going to sell tickets without the belt. If you're arguing that the titles are a good way of placeholding for Main-Event stars I can't argue with that, but I think it should be used to elevate actual Tag-Teams, not keep a spot for Main-Eventers, I mean Show and Jericho have pretty much maximized their potential already, so have DX, they can feud without belts.

I don't think the scenario you're talkin about ever works. The break-up/drop the title routine puts all the focus on the break up of the bigger stars, I don't think the new champs gain credibility from fluke wins. Shelton didn't gain any from his 3 or so fluke wins over HHH back in the day. Hurricane didn't get it from The Rock.

When The Rock and Sock Connection were around their were many credible Tag-Teams around at the time as well such as The Outlaws, Edge and Christian, and the Hardy Boyz. However The Holly Cousins won it on what else, a fluke victory, I don't think they ever gained much credibility from that win.

Anyway, I think the main thing is that this is not too much of a change from the standard, its wolf in sheeps clothing. Whenever two Main-Eventers have the belts of course the belts are going to be on PPV's you're not going to leave Main-Eventers off the card are you? The Rock and Sock Connection wasn't going to be left off the card, Brothers of Destruction either. It Batista and Rey had held gotten the titles they would've been on every PPV too. The thing is this always happens and as soon as the Main-Eventers lose the titles to a good old tag team again the belts fall off the PPVs too. If Jerishow ever lose the titles to a traditional Tag-Team and the titles stay on the PPV scene(and we actually see some deelopment in the division)then I'll have reason to believe theres hope. Until then this just seems like the same circumstances as every other time two Main-Eventers hold the titles.

 

[jmt225]

What do I think about how WWE treats their Tag Division? I think it's absolute crap.

What WWE needs to understand is that a majority of the guys they have working for them won't be these big time stars, like they like to imagine. They'll be good company guys for a few years then get fired, quit, or just not resign. Not everyone is destined for great things; Steve Austin most will not be.

So they really should put a focus on tag wrestling as it would at least give them something to do with some of the workers they wouldn't normally focus on, in addition to helping give the show a change of pace. What I really wish they'd do is maybe build a pay-per-view around a tag team tournament and sort of model it after the King of the Ring. Name it after a famous team, wrestler, manager, whoever. Hell, maybe dedicate it to the entire Hart Family for their contributions to the sport. Call it the Hart Cup, and use it to promote your tag division. Regularly hold it in Canada each year and what not.

The fact of the matter is, WWE has a lot of employees, and a good amount of them have nothing to do except job out every single week. The sad part about that is those guys are way better than that. And today... it seems as if you get put in a tag team, you're being punished. We need to get to a point where people are proud to be apart of a tag team, and I think the idea above would be a great way to start. But don't make it these "MEGA TEAMS!!!!" like DX and Jerishow. Those "teams" are not good for the division, and they're not good for the business as a whole. Put REAL teams together, give them tag names, and see what they can do.

If they don't want to improve the state of the division at all, then I completely agree with Sid in just getting rid of it all together.

 

[Bud78]

Just so I get this straight, good wrestlers can't be in the tag team division because you want to see crappy wrestlers that wear similar outfits and have the same last name. Does it not occur to any of you that the titles had zero credibility for the last 3 years and for the first time in that span it is actually an honor to hold the belts and they are actually being defended. Not to long ago it was six months between tag team title matches. Just remember that when a real team does win the belts it will be because they deserve it and are over and then you will have your tag division you are hoping for. Just be realisitic and know that the Bushwackers aren't coming back.

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

Just so I get this straight, good wrestlers can't be in the tag team division because you want to see crappy wrestlers that wear similar outfits and have the same last name. Does it not occur to any of you that the titles had zero credibility for the last 3 years and for the first time in that span it is actually an honor to hold the belts and they are actually being defended. Not to long ago it was six months between tag team title matches. Just remember that when a real team does win the belts it will be because they deserve it and are over and then you will have your tag division you are hoping for. Just be realisitic and know that the Bushwackers aren't coming back.

You think it's an "honor" to hold the Unified Tag Team Belts? It isn't an honor. It's a Fucking joke.

Like Chris Jericho and Big Show, of all people, need to be holding titles to get over. Neither of them NEED titles. And that is why this "Unified Tag Team" rule of the title-holders appearing on both shows is really nothing more than a cheap way for Vince to get 2 Uppermidcarders to appear on both shows.

Whomever the holders of the Tag Titles are DO NOT make their Tag Team Titles as the focal point of the show. Rather, the feud with wrestlers Big Show and Chris Jericho IS the focus. The Tag Titles are secondary, because they still don't mean shit.

You mean to tell me that D-Generation X really could give 2 shits about the Tag Team Championship? Big fucking deal ... after all they have accomplished. They don't care.

And speaking of DX, there are once again, 2 more Upper Midcarders/Main Eventers (in this case, Main Eventers) to give the titles to ... just so Vince can continue the bullshit of getting 2 names to appear on both shows, and continue the same shit.

DX is the last two people that need to be holding the Tag Team Titles. Jericho and Big Show haven't added jack shit to the Tag Team Titles, because whenever they appear on Raw or Smackdown, they never defend them. Instead Vince focuses them on his real purpose, of simply using those two for filler ... and to help support the Main Event.

The Unified Tag Team Titles have gained absolutely NOTHING from Jerishow holding the belts. And it's clear what Vince is using the belts for. To keep giving to Main Eventers or Upper Midcarders to support both rosters.

 

[JJYanks121]

This is utterly ridiculous. There is no reasoning with Sidious and there never will be. Basically everything you just said in your last post makes no sense. You refuse to acknowledge JeriShow as a legit team which by itself is stupid but then you try to argue (with no evidence I might add) that the fact that they have belts is irrelevant. Do you honestly think these 4 man feuds would happen without JeriShow holding the tag belts? Do you think HenVP would have become a team? JeriShow has berated DX on numerous occasions about how they've never won the titles. That and the fact that they claim to have a TLC advantage are the focus of all their promos. Face it, JeriShow through their promos and health (they've been on every show Mondays and Friday since they won the titles) have made people care about the tag titles. Can you honestly tell me that most fans aren't interested in JeriShow vs. DX at TLC?

Again I say, Rome wasn't built in a day. The tag division was terrible for years. If you honestly want to tell me that the days of Londrick, Cade and Murdoch and Jesse and Festus were good, then you're nuts. If you try and argue that today the division is worse, you're clinically insane. The quantity of tag teams isn't there yet, that's obvious. Step one though was injecting life into the division so perhaps the young kids will be interested in forming tag teams and competing in that division. So far, you have 4 teams (I'm including HenVP because I think they might have potential as a team) not including JeriShow and DX, 5 if you count Barretta and Croft. In development you have the Rotundo brothers who I assume will be brought up as a team at some point and you have rumors floating that the WWE might be interested in the Briscoe brothers from ROH. These facts show that tag team wrestling is slowly infiltrating the WWE again. I'm not saying it's ever going to get to the hayday of the 80s, but it can be relevant. Part of being relevant in the last 15 years is having to beat established stars for the belts. If the belts had as little credibility as we believe, part of gaining credibility is having stars hold them. Remember, as much as you might like Miz and Morrison and the Colons, the WWE felt that people didn't care enough to see them fight on the grandest stage. If the belts are defended this year at 'Mania, there is an improvement and that's not debateable.

All I'm saying is give it time. I'm not claming JeriShow to be saviors and I'm also not claiming that they are the type of team to be 100 percent focused on their titles. They are heels and they are greedy and always want more which is why they were captains of team and fighting each other for singles gold. It's part of their character and part of their story. However, they have worked hard to try and have feuds for their belts and have done and admirable job. If you refuse to see that or accept it, keep to yourself. You Sidious will never be satisfied with anything WWE. You gotta roll with the punches brother. Either that, or take your case to Stamford. I will go with you as I live an hour away on Long Island. If you want to voice your complaints to people that matter, I will gladly be your witness. Until then, relax and try and not be so negative.

 

[Toroc102]

OK I think the problem here, is that I don't see D/X/Jerishow/HenVP staying together past their involvement in this reign. I mean out of all of these "teams" I'd give maybe Henry and MVP a chance of staying together, but even they seem to be floating back to the singles division after their short involvement with Jerishow.

I'd say this feud wouldn't happen if the Title's weren't involved, but only because Jerishow wouldn't be involved, but both Show and Jericho would be involved in feuds as would D/X. Do you really think that WWE would sit Jericho, Show, HHH, or HBK out if they weren't involved with the titles? No they'd still be involved in something. However all the actual teams are still getting left out of the PPV's, and now they don't have anything to do on their own shows either, since the Tag-Titles are involved with two teams that are bound to breakup sooner or later. The Hart Dynasty is just lingering, Cryme Time, lingering and they don't have any reason to make put new Tag-Teams together anymore.

I don't know that the fans care about the titles anymore than they used to. I mean how do you quantify that? Because the Title holders and their competitors are getting pops? Again Jerishow and pretty much everyone they feuded with we're already over before becoming Tag-Teams.

 

[Belladonna29]

This is utterly ridiculous. There is no reasoning with Sidious and there never will be. Basically everything you just said in your last post makes no sense. You refuse to acknowledge JeriShow as a legit team which by itself is stupid but then you try to argue (with no evidence I might add) that the fact that they have belts is irrelevant. Do you honestly think these 4 man feuds would happen without JeriShow holding the tag belts? Do you think HenVP would have become a team? JeriShow has berated DX on numerous occasions about how they've never won the titles. That and the fact that they claim to have a TLC advantage are the focus of all their promos. Face it, JeriShow through their promos and health (they've been on every show Mondays and Friday since they won the titles) have made people care about the tag titles. Can you honestly tell me that most fans aren't interested in JeriShow vs. DX at TLC?

All I'm saying is give it time. I'm not claming JeriShow to be saviors and I'm also not claiming that they are the type of team to be 100 percent focused on their titles. They are heels and they are greedy and always want more which is why they were captains of team and fighting each other for singles gold. It's part of their character and part of their story. However, they have worked hard to try and have feuds for their belts and have done and admirable job. If you refuse to see that or accept it, keep to yourself. You Sidious will never be satisfied with anything WWE. You gotta roll with the punches brother. Either that, or take your case to Stamford. I will go with you as I live an hour away on Long Island. If you want to voice your complaints to people that matter, I will gladly be your witness. Until then, relax and try and not be so negative.

I agree with this for the most part. I'd like to add that I feel the main problem with the WWE and their tag team division is that they seem to have some sort of deep issue with creating tag teams from the bottom up anymore.
The philosophy behind a tag division should be that there are 2 or more wrestlers whom:

1.) Share a similar gimmick or complimentary persona

2.) Work MOSTLY as a tag team in matches and feuds

3.) Primarily self-identify themselves as a part of that tag team.

This is something that has to be established, repeated and most importantly, stuck to unless the chemistry isn't there or they just aren't producing any heat whatsoever. This is what produced the Hardyz and Edge and Christian and the like years ago. Currently, with the exception of Legacy, the Hart Dynasty and Cryme Tyme, this is not happening.
I have no idea why the WWE doesn't want to invest in their talent with that type scheme anymore. Working with a tag partner is usually a good thing for younger stars cause it gives them someone to develop their in-ring craft with and also someone who may excel where they are weak and therefore balance out the team while they correct their shortcomings.
Unless they know something I don't about it not being useful, I have no clue.

Now, when it comes to the Unified tag titles being used as an excuse to move around main event talent to equalize the strength of the shows right now, I do think that's a valid point. I think when the mid-year draft happened, the intention was to make Raw stronger, but we all know what happened instead. Sending Jericho, Morrison, Rey and Punk to SD made for the best overall show the WWE had produced in years, while Raw was floundering. The gap in quality between Raw and SD became so obvious that it was logical that they'd seek to correct it by whatever means could be conjured from the storylines.

That being said, to say that Jericho and Big Show ( and Edge for a limited time ), holding the titles doesn't help the titles isn't true.
Ideally, the titles are used to elevate someone who needs them, but putting the titles on main event talent and having them treat the titles with an elevated importance gives the belts the attention and credibility that they may have been previously lacking for a period of time.

So when that superteam drops the titles and a mid-card team eventually gets them, there's a relationship established between the potential of the new titles holders and the prestige of the previous holders. It may not always pan out, but the purpose of is happening is understandable.
The issue lies in knowing within the WWE, there's only so many mid-card teams the titles can drop back to because the division is so thin.

However, this doesn't negate the impact of the superteam having the titles, as long as its booked to be important.
There may not be emphasis on the tag division now, but there is emphasis on the tag titles because JeriShow has them and the titles are important TO THEM.
And to whomever wants to complain about how the titles mean nothing because the feud involving the title-holders is more about personal conflict than having the title, I've got one question for you?

Where and the hell have you been??

It's 2009.
The average feud that involved a title holder in the WWE or TNA is going to at least be equally about character conflict than just wanting the title. Because this isn't just wrestling, it's entertainment too. And if the only reason everyone wants a title is to have it cause that 'means I'm the best', that's noble and all, but fails to introduce the differences between the wrestlers' characters and doesn't capitalize on the drama that comes out of those character dynamics, which is why alot of people watch pro wrestling.

If Chris Jericho wants the tag title because it means he's a great tag wrestler, that's nice. But if Chris Jericho wants the tag titles because he's greedy and delusional and hates everything DX stands for and believes it secretly eats at them that they've never had it, while at the same time wanting to prove he's a great tag wrestler, what do you think sound more interesting?

Remember, the stars of these shows are the wrestlers, not the titles. People don't tune in to see the titles. They tune in to see the wrestlers involved with the titles. As long as the titles are important to the wrestlers and are booked prominently, then the titles will get the attention they deserve. And when the titles get that attention, they become more important to the viewer because it's important to the wrestlers.
That's the synergy that's at play here. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

This is utterly ridiculous. There is no reasoning with Sidious and there never will be. Basically everything you just said in your last post makes no sense. You refuse to acknowledge JeriShow as a legit team which by itself is stupid but then you try to argue (with no evidence I might add) that the fact that they have belts is irrelevant. Do you honestly think these 4 man feuds would happen without JeriShow holding the tag belts? Do you think HenVP would have become a team? JeriShow has berated DX on numerous occasions about how they've never won the titles. That and the fact that they claim to have a TLC advantage are the focus of all their promos. Face it, JeriShow through their promos and health (they've been on every show Mondays and Friday since they won the titles) have made people care about the tag titles. Can you honestly tell me that most fans aren't interested in JeriShow vs. DX at TLC?

Again I say, Rome wasn't built in a day. The tag division was terrible for years. If you honestly want to tell me that the days of Londrick, Cade and Murdoch and Jesse and Festus were good, then you're nuts. If you try and argue that today the division is worse, you're clinically insane. The quantity of tag teams isn't there yet, that's obvious. Step one though was injecting life into the division so perhaps the young kids will be interested in forming tag teams and competing in that division. So far, you have 4 teams (I'm including HenVP because I think they might have potential as a team) not including JeriShow and DX, 5 if you count Barretta and Croft. In development you have the Rotundo brothers who I assume will be brought up as a team at some point and you have rumors floating that the WWE might be interested in the Briscoe brothers from ROH. These facts show that tag team wrestling is slowly infiltrating the WWE again. I'm not saying it's ever going to get to the hayday of the 80s, but it can be relevant. Part of being relevant in the last 15 years is having to beat established stars for the belts. If the belts had as little credibility as we believe, part of gaining credibility is having stars hold them. Remember, as much as you might like Miz and Morrison and the Colons, the WWE felt that people didn't care enough to see them fight on the grandest stage. If the belts are defended this year at 'Mania, there is an improvement and that's not debateable.

All I'm saying is give it time. I'm not claming JeriShow to be saviors and I'm also not claiming that they are the type of team to be 100 percent focused on their titles. They are heels and they are greedy and always want more which is why they were captains of team and fighting each other for singles gold. It's part of their character and part of their story. However, they have worked hard to try and have feuds for their belts and have done and admirable job. If you refuse to see that or accept it, keep to yourself. You Sidious will never be satisfied with anything WWE. You gotta roll with the punches brother. Either that, or take your case to Stamford. I will go with you as I live an hour away on Long Island. If you want to voice your complaints to people that matter, I will gladly be your witness. Until then, relax and try and not be so negative.

I would take the days of Londrick, Cade/Murdoch, and Deuce/Domino over what the WWE is putting out now. The tag team division has been awful for the last few years and Jericho and Big Show weren't doing anything so they were put together. It's not because of bringing prestige to the tag teams. It was just giving them something to do. Jericho and Show were just upper midcarders added to RAW and Smackdown.

Where are the feuds with established tag teams? Cryme Tyme was basically their only feud and that was horrible. I'm not crazy about DX winning the titles but it's better because they are faces and most of the tag teams are heels. Hopefully, they will put over one of the tag teams.

Jericho and Big Show have not raised the prestige of the tag team titles any more than what it was before they held them.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

The theme for the WWE Tag Team category is one word: Sacrifice. In essence, if you want to see Jericho and Big Show on both shows, they need to be tag champions. Now, we know they don't need tag belts and other teams out there would love to be tag title holders and show some gratefulness in being the champs, but alas, this is the only way we can see two main guys on two different rosters.

The WWE sacrifices potentially good tag matches and good tag teams just to have two wrestlers who are big names be on two shows. It's shameful and to be honest, it makes me kind of sick. I love tag team wrestling. Midnight Express, Road Warriors, Brainbusters, Rock n Roll Express, were all great tag teams and Vince basically says that no one can be made a star in a tag team. Maybe he should take a look at the past.

Edge and Christian: Between them, they have an NWA title and WWE and World Heavyweight Titles. They were a great tag team and BOTH ended up stars.

Hardy Boyz: Matt is a solid midcard wrestler while Jeff is a former WWE champion and a bonafide star. All coming from Tag Teams.

Hart Foundation: Bret Hart got his start in a tag team. They dominated the Tag division in an era where tag teams were prominent.

Miz and Morrison. Both were US and Intercontinental Champions and dominated the Tag Team scene for an entire year.

My point is success comes from Tag Teams. Why not give a couple of them a shot at shining real bright. Legacy and Hart Dynasty are great examples. They'd be thrilled to be tag champs. Unlike DX, who don't care enough to have the belts on them during sketches.

 

[Tastycles]

Frankly I'm bored of trying to talk about tag team wrestling anymore, because people don't want to hear the truth. Tag team wrestling has always been shit, apart from when the main event was so good that top quality wrestlers could stay there.

Spoiler: more exhaustive account[quote="Tastycles, post: 1542507"

On the myth of strong tagteam divisions, by Tastycles

It's a myth perpetuated amongst wrestling fans that the tag team division was ever a primary focus of anyone ever. In wrestling history, there have been two half decent tag eras with long fallow periods inbetween that have churned out the odd decent team like the Steiners and MNM. Don't believe me? Then feast your eyes on the fact laden post that follows.

The early days

As far as I'm aware, there wasn't a major national tag team championship prior to 1970, so that is where we begin our tale. The 1970s saw both the WWWF and NWA start pushing a national tag belt in earnest. Lets look at the early champions, i.e. Champions before 1984.

In total there were 65 reigns, 30 of which were from consistent long term tag teams, and thats including two different versions of the Valiants. The rest, well over half of the total, were haphazard temporary teams with very limited longevity, and occaisionally teamed for the purposes of feuding. If you take out people who eventually won singles titles, and I mean World Titles, the number falls to 23, just over a third of the total. At this point, it doesn't look good for tag team wrestling. Take out the Minnestoa Wrecking Crew, and matters would have been much, much worse.

Tagamania is running wild

Then we hit 1984 and the tag division seems great. Between 1984 and 1992, there were a total of 45 tag team reigns in NWA/WCW and WWF. Of those, a staggering, and this is staggering compared to just a few years previous, 41 of them were from consistent tag teams. Not necessarily career tag teams, but remember those previous 28 included many that weren't.

So, what happened?

They say a picture speaks a thousand words, but this one requires me to speak for it. These two men provided consistency in the main event for two different reasons in this time frame. For two very different reasons, I hasten to add.

Taking Hogan, he was a champion, yes, and a long term one, yes, but that had been done before. What was it then about the balding one that made him different. I'll tell you brother, and it's a range of reasons. It was the fact he was the first truly national touring champion. It was the fact that he was extremely charismatic and could be put in the same feud for a very long time, thus freeing up everyone else to be in a tag team and it was because he was so over that other singles matches could be shit, and people could be left in the tag division. Want proof? Bret Hart was a tag team wrestler in this period and the longest running midcard champion was the Honkey Tonk Man.

Flair is a bit more complicated. Flair held the NWA title for almost all of this period, periodically losing it to various people. But that was the thing. Flair periodically lost it, but it was always him challenging whoever picked it up. Flair was also associated with a tag team, through the 4 Horsemen throughout the majority of this time frame. What does this mean? It means tag teams could get over, because they were either fighting with or against the Champion indirectly.

So, we have so far established that between 1984 and 1992 the tag team division was considerably more independant and stronger than it was in the years prior. Now lets look at what happened next.

The wilderness years

The next period we shall look at is 1992-1999. This is different in the way it lacked a solid division, but all the while still very telling. Let's look at the figures. There was a total of 77 reigns, of which 53 were by recognized tag teams. Now, that seems like a reasonably high figure and there are two reasons for this. Firstly, WCW had a reasonably solid tag division over this time.

Secondly, and more importantly there is a second issue of longevity. Teams like the Steiners, Harlem Heat and the Nasty Boys artificially boost those figures. Of those 53 championships, there were only 11 multi time champions. The rest were largely slap dash teams with a name designed to get Marcus Bagwell over. This period is basically defined by two sets of brothers in Harlem Heat and The Steiners in WCW being good and lacklustre stars being put in tag teams elsewhere. Again, if we discount teams were one of the members eventually won a World Title, that 53 reduces to 30, which is again barely a third of all reigns.

What we saw in this period was singles stars retiring or becoming stale, and thus the tag division was used to quickly build stars into singles wrestlers. What you should take from this era is that there were proper tag teams as it were, but most of them were shortlived. Those that weren't, were totally shit and I'm looking at you The Godwinns.

The silver age of tag team wrestling

From 1999 to the invasion saw a second suprise boom in tag team wrestling. 56 out of 67 tag reigns were by teams that were together for a while and had names. The thing that probably unfairly sets this era above the others is the high quality of gimmick matches. This era, in my eyes, isn't as good as the 80s one, largely because a lot of the secondary level tag teams were alliances amongst main eventers. The longevity here was short, but the teams that lasted through the whole era were generally pretty good.

Now, the question needs to be posed here. Why was this era abundant in regular tag teams, just as it in the late 80s, but unlike the years before, and as we'll see since. The answer again is quite simple. This was a period of hotness in wrestling. Had I put the cutoff point at 1996, this would have been even more pronounced, but the point is still illustrated. At this time there were across both companies obvious and hugely popular main eventers.

What does that mean? It means you keep teams together and you can keep wrestlers in them. Edge didn't need to be on his own because The Rock was there. Mark Jindrak didn't need to be a midcarder because Scott Hall was there. The repurcussions are endless.

For the sake of posterity, I shall do the era from the beginning of the Invasion until the present, but you should by now see what my conclusion is going to be.

Modern times

The figures for the modern times involve both WWE tag championships until they were reunited, and the WCW reigns under the WWE banner. The number of reigns was 90 (counting Edge/Jericho and Jerishow as 1 each). Of those 90, 49 were won by regular teams, which is about half, and which is what we should expect given the fact we aren't in a boom period.

The TNA way

In a moment I'll present my conclusions, but first I want to address a point made by many that TNA has somehow developed a strong tag team division. To those people I ask when was the last time you saw a tag championship programme without either Beer Money or Dudleys involved somewhere?

I've given figures elsewhere, so it's only fair I should here. In TNA's history only three championship winning teams have stayed together for 3 or more years - AMW, LAX and 3D. In the same period, the WWE has had the same amount, funnily enough - The Dudleys, London and Kendrick and The APA. There's a few others that were very close to it too on both sides, suggesting that 2 years is about right as a cutoff point.

Conclusions

What we can conclude is the following.

Premise 1. Tag team divisions are only independant and strong when there is a strong and small main event.

Premise 2. For the largest proportion of wrestling history, tag team divisions have been around one third full of genuine tag teams.

Premise 3. Occaisionally there will be a popular long term team within these troughs, but they are few and far between.

Premise 4. A typical tag team lasts around 2 years in the modern age of TV exposure in televised companies.

So, for the WWE's tag division to be close to death, and not in the general cycle of tag team wrestling, it must be failing to meet these premises. Is it? Let us see...



There is not currently a strong main event, the viewing figures tell us that, so we cannot expect a strong independant tag division.





3/6 = One half.





I even put occaisional, and there's no denying that the fans like Cryme Tyme.





All of whom lasted around 2 years...


So basically, what we have shown is that the current state of affairs is what you should expect from tag team wrestling and basically people are guilty of looking at the past with rose tinted spectacles. Ric Flair and Greg Valentine were a team a hell of a long time before Jerishow, and this problem, if you see it as that, is as fundamental to wrestling as making big charismatic guys world heavyweight champions.[/QUOTE]

Anyway, there's no point in bitching about it, because its the way it has always been, and always will be.

However, I will address the points at hand. Firstly, the tag belts under their new regime have appeared on more PPVs this year than the previous titles put together for years. The current titles look awkward, and I'd probably go with just the one set of belts, but that really is a minor issue.

The choice you have to make with tag team wrestling is you either have people thrown together, or you have shit teams nobody cares about. The only alternative is to have one of the best main events ever, and that isn't going to happen right now.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

I think the biggest problem I have with the tag team division right now is the fact that there are NO TAG TEAMS!!! The WWE keeps putting together these random tag teams that have no reason for being. Big Show and Jericho? WHile I happen to like both of these guys, there is no reason for them to be tagged up. I understand I tend to look backward on professional wrestling and I also yap about the 'good ol days' but that's how I feel. Tag teams should be together to BE A TEAM, not just pass time. Teams like Legacy, the Hart Foundation, Cryme Tyme, etc. etc. are tag teams. Not Mark Henry and MVP or Jericho and Big Show. Put some teams together who share a gimmick and have several of them. That will be the key to a great tag division.

 

[IrishCanadian25]

Should the titles be split up like they used to be, with more Tag Teams added to the roster?

No, I also believe that there should be only one tag team championship. Where we differ, however, is in the fact that I believe (and have stated on the forums several times) that the Tag Team Division should be confined to only ONE show, and the same should hold true for the Women's division. RAW can have the Women's wrestling division, and SD can have the Tag Teams. Both the female and tag team wrestling divisions are FAR too shallow to support titles on two separate shows. I also feel the Cruiserweight Title needs to be placed on ECW to give guys like Bourne and Ricky Ortiz something to do with their lives.

What do you think about slapped-together Tag Teams? Are they suitable or do you prefer teams like they used to be ... dedicated to the Tag Team Division, who complimented one another?

I am ok with "slapped-together" tag teams in certain circumstances. With Jerishow, the two EMBRACED the tag team concept - they developed new tag team music, they came out together and cut promos together. It's not like the old Shawn Michaels / Diesel, Austin / HHH, or Rock / Foley teams that existed simply to advance other feuds. I really looked at Jerishow as a legit team. Sure, I knew it wouldn't last.

Overall, however, I prefer when the tag division is dominated by true tag teams. Besides, so many of the top stars in history are forer tag team wrestlers. Hart. Michaels. Austin. Morrison. Even Sting And Ultimate Warrior.

Lastly, do you agree or disagree that this is all that Vince has used the Rule of "Champions appearing on Both Shows" for ... giving each show an additional established Upper Midcarder (which he is low on) to bolster the other's roster and support the Main Event and Upper Midcards?

I do agree with your assessment, yes.