Sheamus and the World Heavyweight Championship | WrestleZone Forums

Sheamus and the World Heavyweight Championship

Sheamus seemingly has it all; he's the World Heavyweight Champion, he's over with the crowd, he's got a unique look, and so on. Sheamus has been looked at as something special since his debut -- and he finally seemed to reach a sort of pinnacle, with his 18 second victory (and subsequent title defenses) over Daniel Bryan. The thing is, it's hard to look at Sheamus and think that he's a legitimate top tier superstar. It's nothing that he's doing wrong, it's just what's going on around him. His former challenger, Daniel Bryan, who Sheamus basically humiliated, is now fighting over the WWE Championship, rubbing elbows with the likes of CM Punk, Chris Jericho, and John Cena. What's Sheamus up to? Take tonight, for example: Sheamus was stuck in a randomly-paired mixed tag match, in the middle of the card. Considering that Raw showcases the entire roster and is supposed to be the best that the WWE can offer weekly, it's concerning to see Sheamus' position.

One could argue -- and I will -- that Sheamus is a glorified midcarder. The guy has all the potential to be a major player, but let's not kid ourselves and think that he's there yet. He's a clear step below all the people in the WWE Championship scene, and it goes without saying that part-timers like Brock Lesnar and Triple H are a clear step above him, too. That leaves Sheamus somewhere in the middle -- which isn't reflecting all too glowingly in the World Heavyweight Championship, either. The fact of the matter is that Sheamus, with how the WWE is organized today, can't be viewed as a bonafide main eventer and his World Heavyweight Championship really isn't on par with its counterpart, the WWE Championship. You can only curtain jerk and be in the middle of the card, facing midcarders so many times, before you realize that you're no different -- and that's what I feel is happening with Sheamus. He's a "main eventer," but only because the WWE won't give up on maintaining the facade of equality between Raw and Smackdown/the WWE and World Heavyweight Championships.

So, what do you guys think? What are your thoughts on the situation?
 
Yeah, you are looking way too much into it. He is the star on smackdown. Of course he is going to be wrestling with people lower on the card. They did give him a big defense and matches with Orton, Jericho, etc. But with Orton gone and Kane and Show over on Raw, along with Bryan feuding with Punk, Sheamus is left to carry the top card by himself over on Smackdown.
 
I think that the WHC has replaced the IC title as the 2nd tier belt. With the brand extension pretty much dead, the WWE Title is STILL the top title in the business, as evidenced by Cena, Punk and the true top guys being involved with it.

The WHC is the old IC title, it's the title people get to see if they're ready for main events on the flagship show. It goes on in the middle of PPV's in sub-main events in a ton of cases.

The IC title is the European Title, it's the lower card title, guys in it might move up but it's usually the curtain jerkers and really young stars or old vets who won't touch the WHC/WWE title who get it...

The US title is the Hardcore title. It's for comedy jobbers...like Santino end of story....



How does this apply to Sheamus. Sheamus is using this long WHC reign to establish himself as a slow build to the WWE title. John Cena held the US title on and off for about a year before becoming the WWE champ at mania 21

Orton held the IC title for 7 months leading up to his first title win in 2004, even though his face turn flopped...


Again, that was before today when the brand extension basically ended...

So Sheamus is just the slow build guy, and honestly, that's best, all he needs to do is lose the title in a triple threat match or something to the "next" guy (like Ziggler or Rhodes if they're ready) and then just use the "super show" idea to begin to slot in to the WWE title picture


OR

The WWE needs to somehow reset the brand extension and there's an easy way to do this.

The end of summer, pre-mania story line could feature the next GM fail miserably at their role. This works best if that person is a heel and the faces overcome their reign at survivor series, at this point, the Board of Directors step in and name TWO brand new GMs, one for each show

Give say, Regal Smackdown and Edge or HBK (if they're willing to do it) Raw, they do a roster draft where they each built an equal roster and they "reset" the company to be like it was 10 years ago with a strict brand split. Each show can have a "developmental show" (like Heat and Velocity) at that point, just BOOK Sheamus to be a dominant champion on par with Cena and Punk


It all comes down to which way the WWE wants to go, they need to pick one and go
 
Yeah, you are looking way too much into it. He is the star on smackdown. Of course he is going to be wrestling with people lower on the card. They did give him a big defense and matches with Orton, Jericho, etc. But with Orton gone and Kane and Show over on Raw, along with Bryan feuding with Punk, Sheamus is left to carry the top card by himself over on Smackdown.

The point still stands. He's the b-show star -- well, a placeholder for Randy Orton -- and he's not on the level of former World Heavyweight Champions. The title has taken a significant downturn recently and that may be due to Sheamus' challengers, but when you look at the limited resources Orton had to work with -- Mark Henry and Christian, love 'em both, but they're not legitimate main eventers either -- and you immediately see that the situations aren't that different. I have no qualms with Sheamus taking a backseat to the WWE Championship on Raw, but he's taking a backseat to the Raw Money in the Bank match, too. His former challengers are better off feuding for the number one contendership on Raw, than they were facing him for the world title.

When has the World Heavyweight Championship ever been booked on PPVs the way it has recently? That's exactly the point. Batista, Edge, 'Taker, etc. -- those guys all made the belt seem equally important to the WWE Championship. It's not completely Sheamus' fault that he can't live up to that, as the Supershow concept has really added to the image of Sheamus as a midcarder, but that doesn't change the fact that he's dropping down the card. On Smackdown, he can be the main event every night -- but that won't change the fact that he's being portrayed as a midcarder on the a-show, Raw.

To sum it all up, perception is everything. If Sheamus isn't perceived as a top tier guy, even on Raw, it's a problem.
 
I like Sheamus but essentially he has become the big smiley Irish version of Cena, who says arse a lot. He's very good in the ring but all the dominant wins don't give him any character to be a true main event guy.

Oddly enough as a mean and brutal heel he felt more like a main eventer as a character but was booked weakly in the ring.

Maybe if he got an actual angle as opposed to challenger #4 to work with then he may show more, but I think he's a guy that will always be a solid upper card talent without ever being in the elite set of top guys.
 
Sheamus is a good champ on smackdown. thats about it and thats where he should stay smackdown. i kno they are doing "RAW SUPER SHOW" but thats a joke. all that is is just 2 or 3 smackdown people wrestling on raw sheamus needs to be in a good rivalry with a up and comer. he needs to see if he can carry a youngster. i would like to see him vs damien sandow or wade barrett
 
The point still stands. He's the b-show star -- well, a placeholder for Randy Orton -- and he's not on the level of former World Heavyweight Champions. The title has taken a significant downturn recently and that may be due to Sheamus' challengers, but when you look at the limited resources Orton had to work with -- Mark Henry and Christian, love 'em both, but they're not legitimate main eventers either -- and you immediately see that the situations aren't that different. I have no qualms with Sheamus taking a backseat to the WWE Championship on Raw, but he's taking a backseat to the Raw Money in the Bank match, too. His former challengers are better off feuding for the number one contendership on Raw, than they were facing him for the world title.
I understand your point but I think we're missing a few key elements here. Its not that the WHC has taken a signifant down turn. Its that the WWE title and whats going on with it has taken an significant UPTURN. Lets remember that it wasnt that long ago that many of us felt that Punk was getting stale and something needed to be done with him. The WWE title itself took a massive backseat to Rock/Cena. Tonight was the first time in a long time I can remember Punk being in the Raw Main event. Its usually Cena in the main event. Punk usually had his match at the end of the first hour.

Now look at whats happened. Its taken the combined efforts of Punk and a now super-over Daniel Bryan to make the WWE championship picture interesting and thats also when you add in the great job AJ has done to spice up the WWE title and all thats going on with it. Without AJ and someone else who's over just as much as he is, Punk and his WWE title wouldnt even be nearly as relevant as he/it is right now. As far as Bryan now fueding for the WWE title, well thats what supposed to happen. You dont wanna have Bryan and Shaemus fueding for the WHC for years and years on end do you? New feuds need to be developed to keep things interesting.

As far as the WHC title taking a back seat to the RAW MIB match, well, anything involving Cena will be higher on the card than everything else...at least MOST of everything else. Thats not a knock on Shaemus thats the reality of WWE booking when it comes to Cena. Cena, more than anyone else in the company right now is the man relied on the most to get PPV buys...so of course Shaemus is going to take a back seat the RAW MIB match when Cena is in it.

And i didnt feel like Orton's last WHC title run was so much more impressive than Shaemus. Henry's run was much more memerable to me, and I remember reading a lot of posts on here from people who were praising Henry's run.
When has the World Heavyweight Championship ever been booked on PPVs the way it has recently? That's exactly the point. Batista, Edge, 'Taker, etc. -- those guys all made the belt seem equally important to the WWE Championship. It's not completely Sheamus' fault that he can't live up to that, as the Supershow concept has really added to the image of Sheamus as a midcarder, but that doesn't change the fact that he's dropping down the card. On Smackdown, he can be the main event every night -- but that won't change the fact that he's being portrayed as a midcarder on the a-show, Raw.

Like you said, Taker, Edge, Batista, Angle, JBL, HHH and HBK arent around anymore so there isnt enough star power to make the WCH stand equal to the WWEC when you have Bryan and AJ both on FIRE right now in a program with Punk. So when you say Shaemus is dropping down on the card, I dont know what you mean. He's underneath a John Cena upcoming PPV match and the WWE title picture. Of course he is...he has no choice BUT to be underneath those two programs. I dont think it shows that Shaemus is a midcarder though. I mean, a Goerge Clooney movie may be underneath a Tom Cuise and Daniel Day Lewis movie if they were all at the box office at the same time, but that doesnt mean Clooney is 'slipping.'

I think we need to remember how PPVs and wrestling in general is booked. There will be two matches on the card designed to sell the show. ESPECIALLY in this era with the lack of star power. There will be TWO matches that get pushed to draw the house and after that, EVERYONE is a midcarder, whether they have a title around their waist or not. Shaemus is where he's supposed to be right now. He is taking a back seat to Cena and Punk/Bryan/AJ. He's playing his role as the number3 match on the card of a rather unimportant PPV. So he will be booked accordingly for now.
 
I think it'll take time, but a lengthy reign by a dominant champ could well add more credibility to the WHC. One of the problems i have is that everytime a face is booked strong people scream noooo he's another cena. Sheamus is not cena nor is he squeaky clean, helll up until big Johnny left he was on that permenant probation thing for kicking a ref who made a bad call, could you see John doing a devastating (lol) AA to a ref? In short I feel the guy has everything going for him and just needs more time before he has his holy shit moment.
 
I agree completely with the OP here. The blame for Sheamus not quite being on the main event level isn't being blamed on him directly. Sheamus is doing a lot of things in impressive fashion, but he is still missing that last piece. The problem has been in the booking of his reign. Not him winning mind you, but rather his competition.

It started with the Wrestlemania backlash to his quick win over Bryan. This wasn't creative's fault, but fans' dislike turned Bryan from a hated heel to a more well liked, more appreciated one. Admittedly the matches were very good between the two, but look what happened. Bryan came out of the feud as the bigger star with more interest in him. Sheamus moved up in the card but didn't really move up the ladder.

Following that, Sheamus has suffered from lack of a real solid feud to solidify his reign. He doesn't really seem to have an issue with Del Rio, nor have they entered into an actual program. The Ziggler series was a mixed bag. Credit to both men, the matches were very good. However, the outcomes were never in doubt. The fatal 4 way was little more then a forgettable title defense. Sheamus retained the title, but in more a "survive the match" way then a "dominated all challengers" way. This is why I fault creative. The idea to push Sheamus is there. The effort to really distinguish this push as something special isn't. They want Sheamus to be "the guy" but haven't truly worked to that end.

Randy Orton has the most credibility to lend on the Smackdown roster. Before he was suspended, Orton said he was coming after the title. If that was the plan, with Sheamus going over in decisive fashion, then I can give them a pass for having to go with a plan B. If not, I shake my head. Imagine some of the opportunities they could have cashed in on to add to the Sheamus mystique instead of what we've got. Think of Sheamus had he been the one to beat Brock Lesnar. Think of Sheamus if he was getting the same treatment as the Big Show is now. Why not have Sheamus end Brodus Clay's streak? Why not Sheamus instead of Cena taking down Big Show in a cage? Why not have Sheamus crush Tensai? All missed chances to distinguish Sheamus as "the guy" instead of just a guy who currently holds the promotion's number 2 championship.
 
Sheamus is very good in the ring, decent on the mic, has a great look, but he's been suffering from garbage booking for close to a year.

First thanks to the thinness of their roster they struggled to build him up into the SD main event last year, as there was no one he could feud with and win (people like Cody or Barrett were also getting pushed and couldn't be losing to him). Then he won the Rumble, and yet again nothing happened until he picked Bryan as his opponent. Then...nothing happened still, they got almost no build for their WM match, then of course they had the squash match.


That match turned most smarks against him, while they'd been indifferent (thanks to his dull and tame face character) before, leaving only the kids supporting him, just like Cena, only Cena is well established as a the centerpiece.

Now his WHC run has been deathly dull. He's had great matches with Bryan and Ziggler, but he's had pretty much no storylines around his PPV matches, and he's not really done anything with the title. They've been determined to get him and Del Rio one on one at a PPV, but no one is actually very interested in that match.

He's just such a non-character, when he first turned face, he didn't change too much from his heel character. He was a violent brute looking for a fight all the time, wanting nothing more than to run through the roster, only now he was aiming at the heels. Over the last year he got watered down to this Cena-lite thing, where all he does is smile, say "arse" a lot, and pander to the kids in the crowds. There's no bite to him any more.

Hell, they've done something similar to CM Punk, where all the bite is gone.

It's like the only main event face they know how to write anymore is a Cena Super Face, so they force all their top faces into that role instead making them unique and using their strengths.
 

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