Rollar Coaster Relationship: Mother and Fiancée

[It's Damn Real!]

Most of you know I'm not one for airing issues on this forum, but I've reached a boiling point here and I'm honestly open to help from just about anywhere, so here goes...

I'm stuck in a classic relationship triangle. My mom and fiancée have an incredibly rocky relationship and are constantly at each others' throats over everything from wedding scenarios to whether or not I'd baptize a child her and I had (were we to have one). This is obviously taxing on our relationships, but is especially taxing on me because of the fact that I'm always the one stuck between the constant cross-fire.

Some quick background on both of them.. my mom is a hardcore Republican conservative Roman Catholic and a complete diva. My fiancée is a "bleeding heart" liberal, agnostic, and one of the nicest people you could meet on any given day. While they're both socially engaging and will greet you with a smile, my mom is not at all accommodating and will usually have an agenda to any discussion she's having. She'll talk over you and she's notorious for telling white lies to beef up her agenda and will go to great lengths in that sense to "get her way". She also falls back on her religion and religious experiences constantly as a source for authority behind a number of issues.

Just over the last few months:

• My fiancée asked my mom to look at specific styles/colors of dresses for the wedding this fall based on her age and the theme of the wedding. She gave her at least six or seven colors to choose from and probably five or six styles. My mom, probably in some form of protest, went out and got something completely off the grid that didn't fit her age or the wedding, that would have had her sticking out like a sore thumb. It took two or three weeks for us to talk her down from it, and to talk her into returning it and finding a dress that actually worked.

• My mom called me telling me how upset the family was over the fact we didn't invite her cousins to the wedding — a wedding that has a small budget and that can only really fit just over 100 guests. She told me my grandmother called her that morning livid over the fact, so I called my grandmother, and of course nothing of the sort ever happened. Neither my fiancée nor I know any of her cousins very well, but for whatever the reason, she was willing to go to an extreme to try and get them invited. We won that battle.

• My mom, citing the fact that "she" was paying for the wedding (even though it's my dad and my fiancée's dad actually footing the vast majority of the bills), "demanded" that we have a grand entrance at the wedding. My fiancée hates them and thinks they're tacky, and everyone in our wedding party wants nothing to do with them. We still haven't been able to put this to bed.​

There are literally dozens of instances just like this that I have't included here.

Last night my mom called me, again "telling me" that she "needed" me to send an invite out (along with a plus one for a date) to her friend who neither my fiancée or I know very well. I've met her twice, for a few minutes, and we tried to explain that we likely didn't have the room for it considering we were already over the 100 guest limit and budget, and that we actually left off friends/family from the guest list already and that we didn't see how it was fair to invite one of her friends over someone we actually know. She again told me that my dad "told me" to do so, so I called my dad tonight and of course that never happened. I explained the situation and he told me he'd talk to her. A few minutes later she calls back cursing me out, telling me how she doesn't give a fuck anymore and to do whatever the hell I want, before hanging up.

I tried to explain to my fiancée that I thought they were both at fault here and to pick her battles, because she knows how much of a diva my mom can be, but of course, she took major offense to it and stormed off to the bedroom frustrated, so now I have her angry in that room and my mother fuming, again, caught in the crossfire.

Seriously… what do I do? If shit can get to this point over a wedding, I can't even imagine how nasty they could get when the topic of religion comes up again regarding a kid, or when we go house-hunting, etc.

 

[Slyfox696]

Completely serious. But if you're not into that, decide how important your mom's money is to you and your wedding. If you can do it without her, tell her to either get on the train or hop the fuck off.

You chose your fiancee, you didn't choose your mother.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

We're two months away from the event. That's a ton of money washed down the drain if we actually did that. We'd lose every deposit and it'd be a huge shit storm of a situation to have to explain to all the guests. Honestly, that's not even an option I'd consider at this point. I want to mend this, not destroy it.

 

[Ty Burna]

Hell do it even less then Sly's suggestion. $30 (or however much it is for a marriage license) and a quick 5 minute stop in front of a judge and viola, you're married.

Edit: Damn it IDR you fucked up my reply already.

 

[klunderbunker]

Pretty much what Sly said. If you can get by without your mom, tell her to get over herself and drop it because this is your life, not hers. I'm as attached to my mom as probably anyone I know, but there's no excuse for her to be this ridiculous about her son's wedding.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

This may sound kind of douchy and I certainly don't know your fiance or Mom but at the end of the day it's your and your fiance's wedding, not your mom's.

I will tell you that I've been over similar circumstances with my Mom and my girlfriend over kid shit and its literally driven me to drink sometimes. I'm sure you don't want to hurt your mom in anyway and even though she's your mom its not her place to make demands for your wedding. I also know its a sensitive subject to bring to your mom so I understand if you don't want to go this way.

At the end of the day it's your life and your fiance's life, your mom needs to suck it up and if it were me I would say something along the lines of this.

"Mom I love you but its my fiancee's and my wedding and we have a certain way we want to go in regards to our wedding. I don't want to start a fight but you have to accept how the wedding is going to be. Anyone I'm not inviting isn't personal but we are on a fixed budget with a fixed amount of guests, if it was up to me I would invite everyone, their dog's and everyone on WZ forums but unfortunately I can't. I would really love it if you can accept that and get on board with our special day".

That's the gist of it anyways.

Good luck man, I feel your pain and hope it all works out for ya.

 

[Ty Burna]

I will say however it's a similar situation my dad went through, though it was having issues with his future in laws.

My grandparents were basically trying to make every decision for the wedding, and my mom wanted to have these real fancy candle holders. My grandparents were trying to shut that down immediately, even though my dad was pretty much paying for the wedding on his own.

From my understanding my dad basically told them to shut the hell up because the wedding was all for his soon to be wife and they won't be involved with any decision whatsoever and if they don't like it then don't bother showing up. It worked pretty well, and knowing how my step grandfather is and what I've heard of past stories, he was a massive control freak.

I would probably take a similar stance with your mom. Tell her that this is your wedding and your wedding means that your fiancee gets to make the decisions not her and if she don't like it, then don't waste your time showing up. It may ruffle some feathers but honestly, it can't be much worse then where it's at now.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

This may sound kind of douchy and I certainly don't know your fiance or Mom but at the end of the day it's your and your fiance's wedding, not your mom's.

I will tell you that I've been over similar circumstances with my Mom and my girlfriend over kid shit and its literally driven me to drink sometimes. I'm sure you don't want to hurt your mom in anyway and even though she's your mom its not her place to make demands for your wedding. I also know its a sensitive subject to bring to your mom so I understand if you don't want to go this way.

At the end of the day it's your life and your fiance's life, your mom needs to suck it up and if it were me I would say something along the lines of this.

"Mom I love you but its my fiancee's and my wedding and we have a certain way we want to go in regards to our wedding. I don't want to start a fight but you have to accept how the wedding is going to be. Anyone I'm not inviting isn't personal but we are on a fixed budget with a fixed amount of guests, if it was up to me I would invite everyone, their dog's and everyone on WZ forums but unfortunately I can't. I would really love it if you can accept that and get on board with our special day".

That's the gist of it anyways.

Good luck man, I feel your pain and hope it all works out for ya.

That is probably the route I'm gonna go, but I'm really balking at the idea of confronting her again, because it never actually pans out how I hope it to, and as I already noted, she's a total diva who takes major offense anyone telling her otherwise. I just don't think, at least at this point, that I'll actually be able to calmly discuss any of this with her without it turning into some major philosophical/religious tirade or sermon from her about how she was raised.

We have enough to worry about as it is with things still not perfectly settled with the wedding. I really hate the idea of adding something like this to that pile. The idea is to make that pile decrease, not increase, ya know?

 

[The Crock]

Keep the pimp hand strong.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

I will say however it's a similar situation my dad went through, though it was having issues with his future in laws.

My grandparents were basically trying to make every decision for the wedding, and my mom wanted to have these real fancy candle holders. My grandparents were trying to shut that down immediately, even though my dad was pretty much paying for the wedding on his own.

From my understanding my dad basically told them to shut the hell up because the wedding was all for his soon to be wife and they won't be involved with any decision whatsoever and if they don't like it then don't bother showing up. It worked pretty well, and knowing how my step grandfather is and what I've heard of past stories, he was a massive control freak.

I would probably take a similar stance with your mom. Tell her that this is your wedding and your wedding means that your fiancee gets to make the decisions not her and if she don't like it, then don't waste your time showing up. It may ruffle some feathers but honestly, it can't be much worse then where it's at now.

Already went down that road a while ago and told her exactly that. It exploded, in public, and caused a huge issue that took weeks to resolve. We're two months away from the date — I don't want to risk another one of those explosions right now because I don't actually want her not to come.

 

[jmt225]

IDR, are you the first of your mom's children to get married? It would explain why she's overly excited. She obviously doesn't mean any harm... she just thinks she knows what's right for her son and her future daughter-in-law, and she's also proud of you and wants as many people possible there to see her son get married. Of course, she's still in the wrong here, but you have to remain patient and just try and figure out a way where your mom feels like she's in control in some ways, but in reality you and your finacee are putting together the kind of wedding you two want. It's complicated and will have to involve some white lies, but it can be done and come the actual wedding day, I don't think any of it will matter and your mom will just sit back and enjoy seeing her son get married.

 

[klunderbunker]

At the end of the day, if she's going to make it all about her, tell her point blank that if she does something else like this, that she's gone. If you don't shut her down, she's going to try to control every part of your married life.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

IDR, are you the first of your mom's children to get married? It would explain why she's overly excited. She obviously doesn't mean any harm... she just thinks she knows what's right for her son and her future daughter-in-law, and she's also proud of you and wants as many people possible there to see her son get married. Of course, she's still in the wrong here, but you have to remain patient and just try and figure out a way where your mom feels like she's in control in some ways, but in reality you and your finacee are putting together the kind of wedding you two want. It's complicated and will have to involve some white lies, but it can be done and come the actual wedding day, I don't think any of it will matter and your mom will just sit back and enjoy seeing her son get married.

Yes. My brother has been dating a girl for the last six or seven years, but he's only just turning 25, so marriage hasn't been something they've really talked about much.

I tend to agree with what you're saying here, which is why I'm saying I want to mend this, not cause it to explode again. It's why I'm so hesitant to confront her again, but I've explained something very similar to this to her two or three times now, and all she does is yes me to death over it. In person, then and there, she'll agree that all that matters is that we're all together for the day, and then a few weeks later something else will happen between the two over some minor facet of the wedding and the shit hits the fan again. It's a never-ending cycle.

 

[Remy LaCroix]

Are you a mama's boy? Kidding, kidding!

There isn't anything I can say that hasn't been mentioned in this thread already except: do you believe she'll get over it in time for the wedding?

 

[ABMorales787]

Simple. It's your relationship and it's your wedding. Your mother is just a spectator and an aid. She's helping, not organizing. She can have opinions, but she doesn't have final say in anything. If you wanna have kids, baptism is a decision you and your fiancee make. No one else. I don't even have a girlfriend but I've dealt with the assertive type in the form of my sister's paternal grandmother. I'm assigned to keep an eye on my sister and the crazy old lady shows up to my house to dish out orders over my authority. Not cool. When you have these kinds of problems you need to lay down the hierarchy and let them both know who makes what calls. If your mom wants to dress up in an unfitting dress, let her. Her problem if she wants to stick out. But she shouldn't be the one to make the call as to who to invite to the wedding.

 

[jmt225]

Yes. My brother has been dating a girl for the last six or seven years, but he's only just turning 25, so marriage hasn't been something they've really talked about much.

I tend to agree with what you're saying here, which is why I'm saying I want to mend this, not cause it to explode again. It's why I'm so hesitant to confront her again, but I've explained something very similar to this to her two or three times now, and all she does is yes me to death over it. In person, then and there, she'll agree that all that matters is that we're all together for the day, and then a few weeks later something else will happen between the two over some minor facet of the wedding and the shit hits the fan again. It's a never-ending cycle.

Well, my advice is for you and your finacee to start answering your mom's suggestions with a lot of "maybes," "we'll see," "I'll try," etc. and maybe even just bold face lie on a couple of things, because like I said, I really think come the actual wedding day, it won't matter if you guys did what she asked of you. She'll have a great time and all will be forgotten.

 

[Harthan]

I'll give you that I'm 20 years old and uneducated in the ways of such things as these, but:

1) Your future wife should be more important than your mother.

2) It's your wedding.

I think your mom probably needs someone to stand up to her. Just my intuition, but she seems like the type that gets her way entirely too much.

 

[justinsayne]

Just put your foot down, tell her you & your fiancee are doing things they way you want to because it's your guy's day, & not hers, & that's how it's gonna be. Then tell her if she doesn't like it then you'll talk to her after the wedding, & that you got enough shit to worry about right now, without adding her drama to the fucking pile.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

Well, my advice is for you and your finacee to start answering your mom's suggestions with a lot of "maybes," "we'll see," "I'll try," etc. and maybe even just bold face lie on a couple of things, because like I said, I really think come the actual wedding day, it won't matter if you guys did what she asked of you. She'll have a great time and all will be forgotten.

I've been doing that a lot, which is how I've gotten her to compromise on the dress, etc. but when it comes to specific scenarios like if there will or will not be a grand entrance, or whether she can or cannot have her friend come, there's no "maybe" to it. I have to tell her yes or no, and the answer to both is no. I don't see how I can really sugar coat it without explaining it as calmly as I can, which right now isn't possible considering she just cursed me out over the phone (granted, I can wait a day or so before trying again).

I just feel like this whole thing has been a pick your battles kinda fight, and we've picked quite a few since the start of this whole thing, including a really big one in this not being a religious wedding — something a hardcore conservative, Republican Roman Catholic woman still doesn't respect, but was painstakingly convinced to "accept" on the grounds of both of us being happy.

 

[Stormtrooper]

My mom, citing the fact that "she" was paying for the wedding (even though it's my dad and my fiancée's dad actually footing the vast majority of the bills), "demanded" that we have a grand entrance at the wedding. My fiancée hates them and thinks they're tacky, and everyone in our wedding party wants nothing to do with them. We still haven't been able to put this to bed.​

Dude, you DON'T want a grand entrance? I mean you can do it wrestling style, coming out to whatever cool entrance music you want. Hell, have someone announce you Ring Announcer style even.


Oh, and tell yo momma that she isn't the one getting married, and as such she doesn't have a say.

 

[hatehabsforever]

It's unfortunate that you did not take the easy option here and simply elope. Go somewhere tropical with closest family and friends only, do the deed, and then have a party with the rest of the people upon your return. Would save a lot of time, a shit load of money, and avoid a whole lot of stress and anguish.

That being said, it's clearly too late for that, so you got to figure things out. Obviously your fiancée has to, should, and I'm sure will, come first. But the sentiment being expressed by many here is not realistic, in terms of taking a hard stance with your mother and telling her the way it is without keeping her feelings in mind. She is still your mother after all, and you can't forget this either. I imagine there's a happy medium there, a balance where you can keep all parties appeased.

Regarding her dress, I'd be firm on that. She has to abide by your wishes and wear something you guys have chosen. You gave her plenty of options and lots of time, and she has to work within your parameters. Same goes for the last minute additions to the wedding list. I'd take a firm stance on that one too, it's too late to add people at this stage of the game, especially when others you likely would have preferred to be there have been left off the list.

Something like the grand entrance, though, that seems to me to be a relatively small compromise to make in the interests of keeping the peace. Would make her happy, make her feel important, without putting the happy couple out too much. There are probably other such minor compromises which can be made as well.

Don't stress about it, man, this is a big step in your life, something which you don't want to get messed up by drama and nonsense. Keep da wife first and foremost, but don't forget about your mom altogether. Look at it this way. In all likelihood, you guys will be parents someday as well, and how will you feel if your kid and their spouse exclude you (perception) from a position of importance, on their big day. I know how I'd feel if my kids made me feel unimportant on their big day. Find some middle ground. Let's face it, two months will be gone in the blink of an eye, don't waste this time stressing about unimportant bullshit. You should have no problem being patient over the next couple of months, and finding the positives in things when there doesn't appear to be any. Let's face it, you get plenty of practice with this, pretty much every Thursday night, not to mention each spring.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

Other ideas you may want to ponder:

1) Is there anyone that your mother will listen to? Grandparent, priest, best friend, sibling? Can you get them to speak to her.

2) Give her a difficult but meaningless task that will completely preoccupy her and make her feel special

3) Give in on something, she is your mom, she is paying somewhat and it is almost as important of a day to her as a your mother as it is to you.

I am sorry you are going through this. It will work out in the end.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

It's unfortunate that you did not take the easy option here and simply elope. Go somewhere tropical with closest family and friends only, do the deed, and then have a party with the rest of the people upon your return. Would save a lot of time, a shit load of money, and avoid a whole lot of stress and anguish.

That being said, it's clearly too late for that, so you got to figure things out. Obviously your fiancée has to, should, and I'm sure will, come first. But the sentiment being expressed by many here is not realistic, in terms of taking a hard stance with your mother and telling her the way it is without keeping her feelings in mind. She is still your mother after all, and you can't forget this either. I imagine there's a happy medium there, a balance where you can keep all parties appeased.

Regarding her dress, I'd be firm on that. She has to abide by your wishes and wear something you guys have chosen. You gave her plenty of options and lots of time, and she has to work within your parameters. Same goes for the last minute additions to the wedding list. I'd take a firm stance on that one too, it's too late to add people at this stage of the game, especially when others you likely would have preferred to be there have been left off the list.

Something like the grand entrance, though, that seems to me to be a relatively small compromise to make in the interests of keeping the peace. Would make her happy, make her feel important, without putting the happy couple out too much. There are probably other such minor compromises which can be made as well.

Don't stress about it, man, this is a big step in your life, something which you don't want to get messed up by drama and nonsense. Keep da wife first and foremost, but don't forget about your mom altogether. Look at it this way. In all likelihood, you guys will be parents someday as well, and how will you feel if your kid and their spouse exclude you (perception) from a position of importance, on their big day. I know how I'd feel if my kids made me feel unimportant on their big day. Find some middle ground. Let's face it, two months will be gone in the blink of an eye, don't waste this time stressing about unimportant bullshit. You should have no problem being patient over the next couple of months, and finding the positives in things when there doesn't appear to be any. Let's face it, you get plenty of practice with this, pretty much every Thursday night, not to mention each spring.

I think you're onto something there, with maybe compromising on something smaller and less significant to get her to back down from the larger more important issues like this one about inviting her friend.

The grand entrance may not be the one, but there are half a dozen other issues still not totally settled yet that we'll probably be able to work on.

Appreciate the input.

 

[MrHashasheen]

Like others have said, you probably should have just eloped and saved yourself the trouble.

But here's what I think you should do:
1. Contact your dad and ask his advice on how to confront your mom, and if he can possibly be there to cool her down when/if she freaks out. My dad's played mediator on more than a couple of occasions.

2. Make it private, none of that public shit. Mothers can and always will have a fit in public just to embarrass you, make you like a bad son and make you back down.

3. Let your fiancee know, but don't involve her in the meeting. When your mom flips out or gets angry, she'll probably blame her and if she's present, there's a shouting match to ruin the entire confrontation/intervention.

4. Couch you telling her to quit this shit out in friendly and sympathetic terms. Say you know that because your her first married child she's just being anxious and wants everything to be perfect. That she wants all her family members and family members to see her son and his bride have the perfect wedding and all that. But stay firm and emphasize that just like how she wouldn't have wanted her parents or parents-in-law telling her how to plan her wedding, your fiancee shouldn't expect this massive power grab on what is her special day. Tell her you still value her input and ideas, but that your fiancee comes first now and for the rest of your life.

5. At this point, she'll probably cry and say she's such a bad mother (the whole self-pity regimen) and you'll have to repeat that she's not and she's just trying too hard, or she'll say yes and never actually listen to you, and probably bitch about you to her friends and your older relative, or she'll get angry and start yelling, at which point all you do is silently take it (even if she insults the fiancee), and point out that it's you two's wedding and that while you want her there, it doesn't come at the cost of upsetting the wedding or your wife-to-be. As you actually want her to come to the wedding, consider this last one to be a risky bluff because she might just play it to make you grovel later to have her back.

 

[Lowdown]

If you hadn't paid all those deposits already, you could've done like my wife and I did and have a cheap ceremony on the beach or something. The whole thing including the license was less than 200. But on topic, I understand this is a trying time for you, and you do love your mother. But you shouild be frank and tell her that she's being difficult. This is your wedding, and she should at the very least be accomodating to you. Some in-laws never end up getting along. Yet there has to be boundaries and respect. When my mother passed, I relied heavily on my godsister to help me out with all the funeral arrangements. My older cousin, while in his way trying to be helpful, insisted on adding a bunch of names that were questionable family members and such. But in the end, my sister and I handled things the way moms would've wanted. Your mother just needs to know she needs to take a step back.