Randy Orton; Excellence of Execution?

[The Dragon Saga]

In a new interview with WWE's website to promote his role as SmackDown General Manager this week, Bret Hart shared his thoughts on Randy Orton:

"Randy Orton is another one of my favorites. Randy doesn’t necessarily get credit for being a great technician, but he is. People always use that term for me, “The Excellence of Execution” — and that’s what Randy is. I expect that he’s going to get better and better and better."

Well, if ever you were to get high praise I think this is pretty much it. Bret Hart says Randy Orton is the "Excellence of Execution".

I like Randy Orton, since his move to Smackdown my support of him has risen back to what it was when he was originally in Evolution, broke from it and then went on to battle with 'Taker at 'Mania 21. His wrestling as of late against anyone has been superb. Whether it be his series with Christian, his bouts against Sheamus over a month ago or even his match with Khali, hes been entertaining to watch and his persona has came on a lot more. I've loved the entire Christian program, it brought Orton back to me in a new light.

But is he at Bret Hart's level of in-ring performance? Can Orton be given the label or compared to the label "Excellence of Execution"?

 

[AngryCenaFan]

the problem for Orton is being on Smackdown, I do agree he's improved significantly, his matches with Christian were all great, and the storylines were well executed as well, he did used to be boring in my book, but not anymore

 

[The Crock]

I think Hart may just be putting Orton over really big, not necessary being honest while doing it, though. Look, Orton is a great wrestler, he's solid in the ring and I've really enjoyed him as of late -- But to put him on Bret Hart's level? Phew, that's really HIGH praise. Maybe as an overall superstar, but definitely not as an in-ring technician. Hart was one of the finest of all time, I don't think Orton is anywhere near him. That's not to say Orton can't have a great match, but he's just not THAT good of a technician.

We've seen this before, WWE gets a legend to put one of their guys over. Nothing new. Good for Orton, because this is Bret Hart after all.

 

[The Dragon Saga]

I think Hart may just be putting Orton over really big, not necessary being honest while doing it, though. Look, Orton is a great wrestler, he's solid in the ring and I've really enjoyed him as of late -- But to put him on Bret Hart's level? Phew, that's really HIGH praise. Maybe as an overall superstar, but definitely not as an in-ring technician. Hart was one of the finest of all time, I don't think Orton is anywhere near him. That's not to say Orton can't have a great match, but he's just not THAT good of a technician.

We've seen this before, WWE gets a legend to put one of their guys over. Nothing new. Good for Orton, because this is Bret Hart after all.

I was thinking the same thing, but if recollections serves me correct Bret Hart did say something similar about a year ago in-reference to Orton and how he thought that Randy was one of the most fluid in-ring wrestlers he'd seen in some time, hence why I thought that this could be an actual compliment.

Orton isn't in Hart's league, but the dude is currently in a zone that I think has all the top performers in-terms of overall ability up there to be frank, not to toot his horn, but I don't remember a time when Orton was as sharp as hes been in recent months.

 

[The Future Rises]

I don't like Orton's character. But he's a talented all around wrestler.

I wouldn't call him "The Excellence Of Execution".. That's going too far.. His problem right now is that he's just not a very good face. "The Viper" is supposed to be really dangerous and sinister.. It doesn't fit a babyface at all.

But other than that and Orton's personal attitude he's very talented in the ring but he's no Bret Hart that's for sure.

 

[The Dragon Saga]

I don't like Orton's character. But he's a talented all around wrestler.

I wouldn't call him "The Excellence Of Execution".. That's going too far.. His problem right now is that he's just not a very good face. "The Viper" is supposed to be really dangerous and sinister.. It doesn't fit a babyface at all.

I think this goes back to the define a face or heel arguement again which was pretty split. Was Stone Cold Steve Austin's gimmick representing what a good guy should be? No. Did the fans boo him? No, they cheered him relentlessly and led to the evolution of how a crowd influences professional wrestling behind-the-scenes, with WWE ultimately pushing Austin but making him the face of an era.

Randy Orton had something similar. WWE had him punt the Owner of the company in the head, hit Stephanie McMahon with the Rope Hung DDT, form a group that would see him constantly cheat to win and yet the fans began to like the persona and much like Austin; you can play the heel, but if the fans dig it, you ain't going to be a heel if they decide to cheer for you.

Orton punts people in the head. He attacked a guy after losing a match and drilled him with two RKO's, he RKO's people for even speaking in his presence and usually doesn't appreciate people interrupting him - none of these things are characteristics of a face, yet Orton is the most over face on the brand due to the reaction from the fans.

Even if WWE wanted to turn Orton uber-heel, they probably realize it can't be done, because when he was the dominant heel on RAW the fans were popping bigger for him than Cena on occasions, so what would be the difference if they change him now? He'd still get a face reaction so ultimately Orton can't really be changed, at all.

 

[JWGunslinger]

While I know it is not uncommon for WWE legends to come in and say good stuff about superstars to put them over, but I don't think it's the case this time. Over the last few years whenever Orton gets complimented by a big name it's all about his fluid in ring skills. John Cena said that Randy is the most talented wrestler he has ever seen, that his movements are fluid and he makes everything he does seem effortless. William Regal said that Randy has natural talent, that when he works there's never a drop of wasted motion. So after hearing Randy constantly praised for his technical skills does not surprise me, but this is the biggest of those compliments i've ever heard, especially coming from Bret.
I don't think that Orton is necessarily as good of a technician as Bret was when he was in his prime, but he could be one day. He is definitely the best technician on the current roster and he gets better every time we see him, I think Bret can see that and know that Randy Orton is the next Excellence of Execution.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

Orton's a smooth guy, very crisp. If there's a guy in WWE close to Bret's level, in terms of execution, it's Randy.

Never a waste move. That's how I would sum up Randy Orton, and before him, Bret Hart. Every move is done with purpose, no wasted movement. Orton is big on making his moves look clean and crisp, and Bret was the same way.

Do I see a lot of Bret in Randy? I'm not sure. Both seem to be perfectionists, which is a good thing. Bret was better than Randy is now, but I suppose Randy and Bret take similar approaches (clean execution, no wasted movement, etc).

 

[4LC]

I think orton needs a different category name for his ability its fluid and smooth and looks nice and yadadada so on so on its many good things but i wouldnt call it technical wrestling. its like a watching ken griffey jr play ball, he had the best swing in baseball in his time period but he was an athletic outfielder, not so much a mechanical/technical type of infielder or catcher. Orton is athletic and fluid in the ring though and alot of his moves just look very natural

 

[WWEIsLife2]

Thats some high praise coming from one of the best to ever step foot in a WWE Ring. I wouldn't say Randy Orton is on Bret's level but ever since his Feud with Christian started he has really picked it up as of late (not that he was bad before). The way he moves in the Ring is fluid and can go with the best of them.

 

[legendkillerbsal]

Orton is a great ring worker and being put high on the pedistal as being the FACE OF SMACKDOWN has really upped his game. But calling him the "Excellence of Execution"? No way but he's definately on his way there with the way he's been working lately. No one is ever going to compare to a Bret Hart but when u get praise from one of the best of all time, that means your doing something right.

 

[crswcw]

Bret hart is really losing his mind the man has cost so many careers I hope somebody throws the biggest tantrum in the ring with him I am praying mark Henry knocks him out and then quit the wwe. I think Tully Blanchard said is best a Technician is somebody who can put over anybody and knows his way around the ring something that Randy knows nothing about.

 

[dxparza]

I don't think randy is on Brets Level, he has far surpassed bret.I've always believed bret was overrated and a bore to watch (but that's another topic for another day). Randy is so fluid in the ring. If there a better word to use I would, but fluid works. Just consistantly putting on a good show. I truley have enjoyed the Evolution of his character over the last almost 7-8 years. And I'm sure he'll continue to grow over the next decade and beyond..

 

[x24hrs2livex]

I don't think randy is on Brets Level, he has far surpassed bret.I've always believed bret was overrated and a bore to watch (but that's another topic for another day). Randy is so fluid in the ring. If there a better word to use I would, but fluid works. Just consistantly putting on a good show. I truley have enjoyed the Evolution of his character over the last almost 7-8 years. And I'm sure he'll continue to grow over the next decade and beyond..

Everyone is titled to their opinion but WOW! I dont think randy is anywhere near Bret in terms of technical ability. He has gotten better as the years have progressed but i dont think he will ever get to Bret level

 

[Dagger Dias]

I find it difficult to think of Orton when I hear that phrase. I think it's because the "Excellence of Execution" expression is associated with Bret Hart who was on a completely different level. That being said, it is a massive compliment for Bret to say something like that about Orton. I have noticed that Orton has definitely improved in the past few years, if he continues at the rate he's going then perhaps it will be easier to think of him when hearing the "Exellence of Execution" expression. Bret could end up being right. I just don't see Orton ever coming close to being at Hart's level in the ring. He might have simply beeb putting him over, like others have said.

 

[SteelRevenge]

I was an orton mark for years and even I have to say the excellence of execution is going too far if we are refering to technical ability.

Orton is very good in the ring though, and his style almost needs its own name. He`s certainly above a brawler looking at the brawlers of the WWE, but he isn`t quite a technical wrestler like dolph is or hart was. Somewhere inbetween with excellent and fluid movement.


Viper Style :S . . . . . .

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

I think that because of the characters that Bret Hart and Randy Orton have portrayed over the years, it is very difficult to imagine Bret and Randy as anything alike. Bret had a simple gimmick of a humble, honest and an overall virtuous guy. You could say that it was a cookie cutter gimmick. His in-ring work was the focal point of his character and therefore it was easier to buy him as the "Exellence of Execution". Randy, on the other hand, is a wrestler who portrays a great gimmick and therefore it is this gimmick of his that sometimes overshadows the fact of how good he is in the ring. He is certainly very good. His psychology and selling are just off the charts sometimes. In the ring, much like Bret Hart, he seems to be wrestling with a purpose. The execution of his moves is very crisp. The wrestling styles of Bret and Randy are different as chalk and cheese though but that has a lot to do with the characters they have portrayed.

I would say that while Randy is very good, he is not as good as Hart was in his heydey. I have never seen Hart have a bad match....ever. Whereas Randy has had opponents with whom he struggles to have a good match with, most notable among them being Triple H.

I would say that inside the ring, Randy reminds me a bit of Austin. Both were very purposeful wrestlers with a great grasp of ring psychology and selling. Both guys' wrestling talents were overshadowed by the gimmicks that they portrayed. Both guys have had a bogey opponent with whom they have not been able to have the greatest of matches with. In Austin's case, it was Undertaker though I would say that most HHH vs Orton matches have been worse than Undertaker vs Austin matches. Orton is more fluid in the ring than Austin was after his neck injury, which is understandable. Austin has had better matches, though.

 

[Mustang Sally]

I find it difficult to think of Orton when I hear that phrase. I think it's because the "Excellence of Execution" expression is associated with Bret Hart who was on a completely different level.

Agreed, and it took Bret many years to reach that level. When he first showed up in WWE(F), he was a bad guy, a lot chunkier in build.....and not nearly the technician he eventually became. Sure, he had the grounding from his father's school in Calgary, yet it still took years to perfect the technique.

Randy Orton is still young. Comparing him to Bret Hart is flattering, especially when Bret himself is doing the comparing. But Randy is still a ways off from Bret's level, and it's natural this should be so.

I'll say this for Randy; he almost never botches spots, and that's really an accomplishment for such a young guy. In fact, he has little tolerance for those who do botch in matches with him (see: Kingston, Kofi). But Randy's matches have a flow to them and he's getting better all the time. Frankly, he's stepped up his game since he moved to Smackdown and became the #1 performer on the brand.

Will he eventually be Bret Hart's equal as a technical wrestler?

Sure.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

What exactly made Bret such a great technician in all your minds? Do you instinctively know who does the moves most perfectly? No, they promote guys as such.

Bret did a LOT of basic stuff, but he did it all deliberately, which made it seem like he paid attention to every little detail of the move. Orton is pretty similar. He doesn't do moves in one singular motion. He grabs the hold, moves into position, then snaps it off. Very much like how Bret used to wrestle.

I'm not saying Bret wasn't technical, because obviously if other pro wrestlers say he is then he is and it's not just a gimmick.

It's what bothers me when smarks say "so and so isn't technical". "Technical" skills are simply being able to apply the move. Like how the manager on a factory line has more "technical skills" than the plant manager, he can actually do all the stuff. So none of us can really say who is "technically superior".

I believe Orton is technically gifted. For one, he's in the WWE, and if you have shit technique you usually don't last because you hurt people. But for 2, Bret Hart said so. Has nothing to do with the amount of moves he does, how good his moves look to you or me. A pro wrestler who knows how to execute all of the moves says he executes them with technical proficiency.

Is he on the technical level of Bret Hart? Maybe, Bret didn't do a lot of complex stuff and I honestly believe that Bret as being this technical wizard was more of a gimmick. He WAS definately technically gifted, but being able to do basic chain wrestling and basic slams with technical proficiency doesn't scream out to me like it does when I see Mike Quackenbush do some crazy shit. Then again, I don't know how to do too many moves.

Back to my point about guys promoted as technicians. I bet there are a lot of guys who are more technically gifted than most people on here think. They just aren't promoted as much so people don't associate them with technical ability, case in point with Orton.

I mean, what makes a guy technical to you? Lack of botches? Well, that can be the other guys' fault and we wouldn't always know. Fluidity? Sometimes a more herky jerky style (on purpose) adds realism. Just look at the difference between Alex Shelley doing 40 moves in 10 seconds in chain wrestling and Bryan Danielson doing 4 moves in 10 seconds. Danielson's looked more like a struggle and was more over. Not just the courtesy claps for doing shit clean and fast. Is it a ton of suplexes? Hart didn't do a lot. He had a beautiful looking vertical suplex and did a back suplex but those are pretty basic.

So we really don't know. I just trust that Bret knows more about wrestling than me and I trust his opinion.

 

[Hunted-RKO]

I dont think people actually realise how good he is in the ring!I even heard some people say before that he does his 5 MOVES OF DOOM and then the match is finished? Randy does more than than 5 moves in his momentum.But anyway for someone like Bret Hart to say that then you can't go against it and Orton is solid in the ring.As you can tell by my name im a HUGE orton fan and just the way he goes about his matches is great.the way he wears down his oppenants with them stomps and has no wasted movement.

If you go back to when Orton was a heel,the match would always be fluid throughout.He has a lot more to offer and has much more moves than what he shows.I just hope one day WWE allow him to actually show us all of his arsenal and then we will see how good he realy is.Plus this isn't the first time someone in the WWE has said he is the best or is a great wrestler.

 

[NovaScotia]

My 3 fav's who i'm glad atleast 2 of the 3 are likely to be in halifax on the 10th Randy and Sheamus and of course Eve being my third but anyway i'll cut to the point. This guy has so much charisma in the facial expressions and expresses his character are is something that only Alberto Dorito can match and gives 110% in every match with just how fluid he moves in the ring and is alway's ready to strike when his opponent is down. Hat's off to randy i think he does an excellent job !

 

[James]

Orton is actually a lot more bearable than he was the last 2-3 years but he's will never have that name for me. He's an above average wrestler but he isn't great.

 

[xBANEx]

While I personally don't see it, unless I'm thinking "Excellence of Execution" in a different manner, like a poster above me said; if Bret says so I'll trust his judgement.

 

[TheHitMark-SirJoseOle]

I don't think randy is on Brets Level, he has far surpassed bret.I've always believed bret was overrated and a bore to watch (but that's another topic for another day). Randy is so fluid in the ring. If there a better word to use I would, but fluid works. Just consistantly putting on a good show. I truley have enjoyed the Evolution of his character over the last almost 7-8 years. And I'm sure he'll continue to grow over the next decade and beyond..

No fucking way, Bret Hart's matches were more dynamic and had better twists and turns, Orton might have Bret on a personality factor (Bret's best talking got done in the ring) but there's no way in hell you can compare the two as far as their matches go, I call bullshit.

Watch King Of The Ring 1993, WrestleMania VII and WrestleMania X, and not to mention Survivor Series 1995 to see Bret in situations where not every match ended the same. Bret in the 1990s proved that you can still have good WWF Title and main event matches without the Hulk Hogan formula and Bret changed the face of the WWF World Title along with guys like Shawn Michaels in the mid to late 90s. Granted, WWF's business was not as good as it was in that time compared to the Hogan years. But in-ring ability wise Bret Hart showed he could offer versatility that guys in previous generations since Bob Backlund (and this is coming from someone who is not even a Backlund fan) couldn't.

Hart>Orton if you want to talk about in the ring and even though Orton's personality factor might be a bit better than Bret's, Bret's in ring ability balances that one out in my view. And as much as I like Orton's character, I still see major limitations compared to guys like John Cena (who as much as I personally don't like as a character has an it factor that Orton can't touch and I have not seen any of the supposed evolution in the past 7-8 years that you claim to) therefore making him a far cry from surpassing Bret at this point.

 

[Hunted-RKO]

orton heel = god

What has that got to with this thread?Anyway Orton will never be on Brets level but he is great in the ring,knows how to sell moves,he can mat wrestle!,and is a great in ring techinican.His one of the best at the moment but can't compare him to Bret Hart.Look at Brets matches back in the 90's some of them were incredible,Orton won't be on that level but has potential to be one of the best.