[Official] Disco Nation

[Verbalcody]

Ok. I have a question. What the hell is up with the ludicrous gimmick matches?

I like a lot of what TNA is doing right now.... theres obviously a lot of garbage on the show too (Kute Kip? Karens Angel? Daivari? seriously? He ran that exact same gimmick into the ground already wow)

anywho... I gotta know what the 'creative' team thinks when they come up with these gimmick matches. Give me a break. I'm travelling 5 hours to see No Surrender so clearly im not a TNA hater. I have a lot of problems with TNA but I just love wrestling and have for 15 years. Let me tell you that its a joke the amount of crappy gimmick matches I have to see. Sonjay and Lethal feuding for months and are going up a ladder to retrieve a ring? Are you JOKING? please tell me its a joke.

After their terrible tuxedo match (who thought up THAT dandy... that anyone would want to see 2 GUYS not do any moves and tear each others clothes off instead?) We are treated to another pointless match. Is it too much to want to see 2 people wrestle to blow off a feud? Im not even going to get to see a pinfall from this debacle. A RING off a ladder give me a break.

And 6 sides of steel..... WITH WEAPONS!!! wow that was horrid. Reverse battle royals, a reverse cage match with 10 people in it, an electrified cage match that isnt even really electrified that was a douzy, I could go on listing match after match that my friends and I have to laugh at and make fun of because theres no way to take them seriously. Its like if a bunch of 6 year olds came up with matches for their toys, THIS would be the crap they would have. What the hell?

I'm 25 years old. Im a firefighter. for a scope of my character, today I am wearing a Hulkamania T shirt to work. watching THAT stuff makes me embarrased to be a fan of wrestling.

Also, man, what did you guys do with Samoa Joe? I have no insight into what he's thinking... EVER, because he doesn't even know. Its so confusing. He just moans at his enemies, yells at his friends, does ridiculous things, gets laid out.. he comes into the ring against sting and says 'in 20 seconds ill be on your throat' then gets in the ring and stands there doing nothing real exciting. When the ONLY audible cheers for a wrestler are 'sloppy joe' i mean you guys really blew his character... bad. Now you gotta get the belt off of him SURELY in Toronto so we have someone to cheer for.

 

[Marty2Hotty]

Yeah, WWE's programming is atroicious which is why i stopped watching. People need to bash how bad the shows are and have been compared to the passion that fans had when Russo was writing. Just look at the reaction and signs in the crowd now vs to the time when Russo was writing. People were just into the shows back then because they were so dman edgy/exciting. People need to bash WWE much more than they can for TNA

THe only thing I can think of about TNA is they need to just let Russo write nonstop. SOme shows they do are awesomely entertaining and full of exciting and sometimes they just do a lot of meaningless wrestling that is not necessary and does nothing but turn off the casual viewers.

In regards to the gimmick matches, you don't find the "Ladder of Love" match a hilarious gimmick match? Two guys wrestling to grab the ring and So Cal says she'll go with whoever gets the ring - decided in a wrestling match> SOmething is bound to happen. Dutt is hilarious as Guru. I think Lethal's macho man gimmick might be a little stale now, unless TNA decides to let him go even more extreme with it. I think Shark Boy as stone cold is still absolutely hilarious though...

 

[Disco Sucks]

1) marketing is a financial issue
2) did you think of the possibility that joe might be turning heel?
3) you're suppose to get heat on the baby faces
4) the sting angle is in the 2nd week of what is projecting to be a nine month angle. so if you want to disect what is happening in the second week of an angle, then just be prepared to come in here and say a few weeks from now, "oh. ok. now i see why they did that."
5) the show doesn't have room for EVERY character EVERY week.

i have answers to every single point you make, but i just don't feel obligated to give them all to you. but it just brings me back to my original point that you said wwe knows how to book, ratings given as evidence to the contrary. and you still haven't shown me, based on the ratings, which is all that really matters, a compelling argument that wwe knows how to book and tna doesn't. when you do, i'll stop pwning you.

When you were in WCW, did you tell yourself that you were in the main event against guys like Glacier when in reality you were the opening match? It seems as if you have to convince yourself you're winning this argument, especially when you just admitted that you're not responding to all of my points. You said to show how ratings show if a company is booked better. Well the WWE usually gets around 3.5 ratings, and TNA has been stuck at 1.2 or less for 2 years. If you want to go strictly by ratings, I think math is a great subject in school and that you might want a refresher because 3.5>1.2...

1) You don't get it, when Cena is doing his trademark 5 knuckle shuffle, and signature moves - that's marketing him to the fans. His promos, his music, his whole attitude is marketed to the fans which help drive merchandise sales and ticket sales. It's the same with any WWE or TNA star, but the difference is more people right now are going to want to see John Cena than Samoa Joe.

2) Are they turning him heel because they have no clue how to book him as a face? If they do turn him heel, and he becomes heel with the rest of the "new bloods" then that it a horrible booking mistake in its own. Yeah, make the "future" the heels in this feud, that'll get them over!

3) By heat do you mean sympathy? Heat is something heels get, not faces. If you mean sympathy, well, nobody at least in Orlando is buying it. For Joe or Styles.

4) You better be right.

5) Sure it doesn't, but THESE ARE YOUR CHAMPIONS. The X-Division champion should be on the show, in some form, even if it is just a promo. Same with and especially with Taylor Wilde who is struggling to get over because nobody knows anything about her. I'll never understand how TNA will keep the title on Petey Williams when he's barely ever on iMPACT!, and look over guys like Kaz who is actually over with the fans. Storyline or not, it's dumb.

Like I said Glenn, I am not a WWE fan, and in fact I still think TNA has a better overall product, but they are doing so many wrong things right now it's giving me headaches. This weeks show was pretty good, but it ended on a sour note for me because once again you have veterans making the "future" look bad, and unless there is a huge turn around that involved the young faces looking good, this feud has been horrible so far. Interesting, but just not there.

Look! I responded to all of your points! Was that so hard?

 

[gg inferno]

When you were in WCW, did you tell yourself that you were in the main event against guys like Glacier when in reality you were the opening match? It seems as if you have to convince yourself you're winning this argument, especially when you just admitted that you're not responding to all of my points. You said to show how ratings show if a company is booked better. Well the WWE usually gets around 3.5 ratings, and TNA has been stuck at 1.2 or less for 2 years. If you want to go strictly by ratings, I think math is a great subject in school and that you might want a refresher because 3.5>1.2...

1) You don't get it, when Cena is doing his trademark 5 knuckle shuffle, and signature moves - that's marketing him to the fans. His promos, his music, his whole attitude is marketed to the fans which help drive merchandise sales and ticket sales. It's the same with any WWE or TNA star, but the difference is more people right now are going to want to see John Cena than Samoa Joe.

2) Are they turning him heel because they have no clue how to book him as a face? If they do turn him heel, and he becomes heel with the rest of the "new bloods" then that it a horrible booking mistake in its own. Yeah, make the "future" the heels in this feud, that'll get them over!

3) By heat do you mean sympathy? Heat is something heels get, not faces. If you mean sympathy, well, nobody at least in Orlando is buying it. For Joe or Styles.

4) You better be right.

5) Sure it doesn't, but THESE ARE YOUR CHAMPIONS. The X-Division champion should be on the show, in some form, even if it is just a promo. Same with and especially with Taylor Wilde who is struggling to get over because nobody knows anything about her. I'll never understand how TNA will keep the title on Petey Williams when he's barely ever on iMPACT!, and look over guys like Kaz who is actually over with the fans. Storyline or not, it's dumb.

Like I said Glenn, I am not a WWE fan, and in fact I still think TNA has a better overall product, but they are doing so many wrong things right now it's giving me headaches. This weeks show was pretty good, but it ended on a sour note for me because once again you have veterans making the "future" look bad, and unless there is a huge turn around that involved the young faces looking good, this feud has been horrible so far. Interesting, but just not there.

Look! I responded to all of your points! Was that so hard?

did you even read anonymous' post?? what is so difficult to understand? you might be the only person on this message board that needs this explained to you. if one show has lost ratings over the same period of time that the other hasn't, then which one would you consider being booked better? i can't explain it any more simply than that? is there anyone else on this forum that can explain some common sense to mr. disco sucks, whereas i have failed??

 

[Darkshot77]

See TNA and WWE are hit and miss to me. TNA for example: Shane the Ref attacking Davari=Hit, Kip James=Miss. Ultimate X, Elevation X, That Terror Dome thingy=Hit, The Black Tie Brawl and Chain Match, Blind fold steel cage match=Miss. Now The WWE The Brian Kendrick=Hit, Kevin Thorn=Miss (ironicly the only thing that made him interesting now is in TNA) Hell in a Cell=Hit, The Championship Scramble=Miss.

Now you can't tell me the championship picture in TNA is bad because the WWE's isn't that much better. Hell at least TNA gives their women storylines. Now the WWE does do some things better than TNA, personally Impact has too many promos that all seem too run together and unmemorable. WWE has better pacing, everything has a purpose, but hell they've been doing that for years. What I like about TNA is they take chances, they work to bring something new. Thats why we have all the gimick matches, the good ones stay and the bad ones don't. WWE does what it dose well, while TNA is willing to take risks. What TNA needs is exposure, and Impact the game will help. What it needs less of is Flaming Haters like those in this thread that wont come at it with an open mind. Period. I am out.

 

[anonymous]

1) You don't get it, when Cena is doing his trademark 5 knuckle shuffle, and signature moves - that's marketing him to the fans. His promos, his music, his whole attitude is marketed to the fans which help drive merchandise sales and ticket sales. It's the same with any WWE or TNA star, but the difference is more people right now are going to want to see John Cena than Samoa Joe.

2) Are they turning him heel because they have no clue how to book him as a face? If they do turn him heel, and he becomes heel with the rest of the "new bloods" then that it a horrible booking mistake in its own. Yeah, make the "future" the heels in this feud, that'll get them over!

3) By heat do you mean sympathy? Heat is something heels get, not faces. If you mean sympathy, well, nobody at least in Orlando is buying it. For Joe or Styles.

4) You better be right.

5) Sure it doesn't, but THESE ARE YOUR CHAMPIONS. The X-Division champion should be on the show, in some form, even if it is just a promo. Same with and especially with Taylor Wilde who is struggling to get over because nobody knows anything about her. I'll never understand how TNA will keep the title on Petey Williams when he's barely ever on iMPACT!, and look over guys like Kaz who is actually over with the fans. Storyline or not, it's dumb.

1) Comparing John Cena to Samoa Joe is very similar to comparing the ratings. You are comparing John Cena who has been WWE's top wrestler for YEARS to Samoa Joe who has been TNA's Champion for a couple months. Also, John Cena appeals to children whereas Samoa Joe does not. John Cena still gets booed by adult males. Also, it looks as if WWE is targeting a more kid friendly program as evidenced by their PG rating. TNA is trying to appeal to a different demographic, and obviously Joe is a badass who does not appeal to children. Also, John Cena is simply more exposed in that he is exposed to three to four million fans while Joe is exposed to no more than 1.5 million fans. I would say that comparing Joe to CM Punk is much more fair. CM Punk lost to Chris Jericho recently even though Punk is Champion, and Jericho is feuding with Shawn Michaels. CM Punk is utilized in a similar to Joe except that I feel that Joe is used in TNA's top main event angles more. Even though CM Punk is past this, you can't tell me that feuding with JBL was WWE RAW's top angle. Oftentimes, even though CM Punk is the RAW World Champion, he gets overshadowed by Batista or Cena, and sometimes Jericho and Michaels.
2) I will agree that Joe's babyface run as Champion has not been great. I personally feel that if Joe is indeed a failure as a babyface Champion, why not cut your losses and see how he does as a heel? However, we do NOT know how this angle will turn out so we don't even know if Joe is turning heel. It is not like TNA hasn't tried at all to get Joe over. He beat Kurt Angle clean for the Title and beat the living hell out of Booker T at Hard Justice. I am a huge fan of Samoa Joe, but it has occurred to me that possibly (and only possibly) Joe has not been able to get HIMSELF over as a main eventer. I am NOT saying that it is not creative's fault as well. If this angle has it that the "established" stars make the "homegrown" talent look terribly weak, then I will say that this angle will be a failure. However, this angle has been going on for only two weeks, so anything said now is only assumption.
3) I thought that there is such a thing as "face heat" which is the opposite of "heel heat," but I could be wrong.
5) I agree that the Champions should be on every Impact. However, if you are talking about booking with both promotions, WWE and TNA, then make sure to acknowledge the faults of WWE as well. Even though TNA did not have all of their Champions on Impact, WWE makes many of their secondary Championships look incredibly weak and inconsistent at times. For example, John Cena beat the up-and-coming RAW tag team champion Cody Rhodes and Ted DiBiase Jr by himself. Also, when Orton was World Champion, he had the chance to be both World Champion and IC Champion but CHOSE to get DQed instead and not even have a match (I think that it was with Jeff Hardy). Having Creed vs Bashir for number one contender for the X Division Title makes the X Division Title seem important even though Petey wasn't there. Many times in WWE, the secondary Titles don't have much meaning. There are many times when the IC Title, US Title, both Tag Team Titles, the Divas Title, the Women's Title, and even the ECW Title are made unimportant. In some weeks or months they look important, and then others they are not very important. As of right now, TNA's Championships all mean something, yet in WWE that is not always the case.

 

[agentmichaelscarn]

I think a big problem with TNA is simple and that is that people view it as the minor leagues. As entertaining as it might be I dont think your casual wrestling fan will watch it because it isnt the WWE. Look at Arena Football, its still football which people love and in a way it can be more exciting then the NFL but do people watch it or attend it? Not really, why if football is so great? Because its not the NFL its basically the minor leagues and thats how people view it. Why does Raw consistently dwarf Smackdown in ratings despite Smackdown being the better brand?imo. I think its because people view Raw as the flagship program so your casual fan that watches wrestling once a week or so is more likely to tune into that. And that is what I think the problem is for TNA is. I know wrestling isnt considered a real sport like the NFL so it might be a bad analogy but alot of people look at it like that. Yes WCW made it despite being the number 2 organization for so long but they had Turner's money and probably the 3 biggest names in the sport at that time(Hogan, Flair, Sting) so its easy to see how they could pull it off. So basically Im saying that I just think TNA is fighting a losing battle as it stands now because of this reason. I know your die hard wrestling fan that will watch any wrestling will tune in but your casual fan who doesnt follow wrestling as closely is gonna choose WWE programming over it whether TNA is actually more entertaining or not because in their eyes WWE is the big leagues. Now Im not saying that is the only reason why but I really think it plays a part in it.

 

[Disco Sucks]

1) Comparing John Cena to Samoa Joe is very similar to comparing the ratings. You are comparing John Cena who has been WWE's top wrestler for YEARS to Samoa Joe who has been TNA's Champion for a couple months. Also, John Cena appeals to children whereas Samoa Joe does not. John Cena still gets booed by adult males. Also, it looks as if WWE is targeting a more kid friendly program as evidenced by their PG rating. TNA is trying to appeal to a different demographic, and obviously Joe is a badass who does not appeal to children. Also, John Cena is simply more exposed in that he is exposed to three to four million fans while Joe is exposed to no more than 1.5 million fans. I would say that comparing Joe to CM Punk is much more fair. CM Punk lost to Chris Jericho recently even though Punk is Champion, and Jericho is feuding with Shawn Michaels. CM Punk is utilized in a similar to Joe except that I feel that Joe is used in TNA's top main event angles more. Even though CM Punk is past this, you can't tell me that feuding with JBL was WWE RAW's top angle. Oftentimes, even though CM Punk is the RAW World Champion, he gets overshadowed by Batista or Cena, and sometimes Jericho and Michaels.
2) I will agree that Joe's babyface run as Champion has not been great. I personally feel that if Joe is indeed a failure as a babyface Champion, why not cut your losses and see how he does as a heel? However, we do NOT know how this angle will turn out so we don't even know if Joe is turning heel. It is not like TNA hasn't tried at all to get Joe over. He beat Kurt Angle clean for the Title and beat the living hell out of Booker T at Hard Justice. I am a huge fan of Samoa Joe, but it has occurred to me that possibly (and only possibly) Joe has not been able to get HIMSELF over as a main eventer. I am NOT saying that it is not creative's fault as well. If this angle has it that the "established" stars make the "homegrown" talent look terribly weak, then I will say that this angle will be a failure. However, this angle has been going on for only two weeks, so anything said now is only assumption.
3) I thought that there is such a thing as "face heat" which is the opposite of "heel heat," but I could be wrong.
5) I agree that the Champions should be on every Impact. However, if you are talking about booking with both promotions, WWE and TNA, then make sure to acknowledge the faults of WWE as well. Even though TNA did not have all of their Champions on Impact, WWE makes many of their secondary Championships look incredibly weak and inconsistent at times. For example, John Cena beat the up-and-coming RAW tag team champion Cody Rhodes and Ted DiBiase Jr by himself. Also, when Orton was World Champion, he had the chance to be both World Champion and IC Champion but CHOSE to get DQed instead and not even have a match (I think that it was with Jeff Hardy). Having Creed vs Bashir for number one contender for the X Division Title makes the X Division Title seem important even though Petey wasn't there. Many times in WWE, the secondary Titles don't have much meaning. There are many times when the IC Title, US Title, both Tag Team Titles, the Divas Title, the Women's Title, and even the ECW Title are made unimportant. In some weeks or months they look important, and then others they are not very important. As of right now, TNA's Championships all mean something, yet in WWE that is not always the case.

All good points, and as I said earlier, I still think TNA has a better product than the WWE right now, but if TNA is planning on growing, and I mean more than a 1.2 rating in 2 years, then they really cannot afford mistakes. They need to build their feuds properly, they need to market their wrestlers to the highest extent, even if this means somehow gearing Joe towards kids, (which I think can be done) they need to shift out of Orlando to fresh audiences for live iMPACT!'s, and they need to properly present their champions, and top stars along with wrestling that is far better and unique compared to the WWE to make them stand out.

 

[anonymous]

All good points, and as I said earlier, I still think TNA has a better product than the WWE right now, but if TNA is planning on growing, and I mean more than a 1.2 rating in 2 years, then they really cannot afford mistakes. They need to build their feuds properly, they need to market their wrestlers to the highest extent, even if this means somehow gearing Joe towards kids, (which I think can be done) they need to shift out of Orlando to fresh audiences for live iMPACT!'s, and they need to properly present their champions, and top stars along with wrestling that is far better and unique compared to the WWE to make them stand out.

I apologize if I am giving you the impression that I am simply bashing you, because I definitely am not. I agree with all the stuff that you said to make TNA better, and in the end, that is what we all want from TNA, even the IWFs (lol). No wrestling promotion is perfect, and sometimes I feel that with some TNA angles, they go from A to C with no B, or start at B, or have a beginning, middle and end but does not end making the wrestlers look better than when they came in. I think that we can all agree that the wrestlers who are feuding should come out of the feud looking stronger than when they came in. Robert Roode after the Booker T feud is a great example of this. Roxxi is another example after her whole head shaving angle and the fans were behind her. However, that is not to say that TNA hasn't made any of their performers look stronger after a feud is done, because they most certainly have. Like you said, continuity and consistency are key to TNA's success.

 

[dzonewrestle1]

I just wanted to say, this week on Impact, Samoa Joe and AJ Styles gave some decent promos where they both said logical things against Sting. Joe said that Sting takes money out of fans pockets when he doesn't wrestle. He said Nash didn't practice what he preached in the Angle/Nash bout from 2 weeks ago, so he shouldn't listen to Nash anymore. AJ has been saying that he never disrespected Sting and, and he earns his check on the road while Sting sits at home doing nothing.

While all these things Joe & AJ are saying are logical, I'm still not too sure who the heel or face side is in all of this.

Also, Sting's promo didn't make much sence. His line "there are a percentage of wrestling fans who can be part of the show, but they can't be the show, so he's drawing a line in the sand and "if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything, so where do you stand?" This line made zero sence. He rambled about some fans wanting Joe to take out Booker and AJ to take out Angle. A "percentage" is the line he kept using. OK I get that. Then Nash tells Joe to not use weapons, then Sting takes out Joe. This all seems heelish to me by Sting & Nash. Then Nash says "what is going on" when Jarrett's music is playing. Who is the face and heel in all of this? I know it's still on-going, but whose the face and whose the heel? And if No Surrender is one week away, why isn't Joe concerned at all about Kurt Angle, Christian Cage or Booker T on this show?

 

[gg inferno]

I just wanted to say, this week on Impact, Samoa Joe and AJ Styles gave some decent promos where they both said logical things against Sting. Joe said that Sting takes money out of fans pockets when he doesn't wrestle. He said Nash didn't practice what he preached in the Angle/Nash bout from 2 weeks ago, so he shouldn't listen to Nash anymore. AJ has been saying that he never disrespected Sting and, and he earns his check on the road while Sting sits at home doing nothing.

While all these things Joe & AJ are saying are logical, I'm still not too sure who the heel or face side is in all of this.

Also, Sting's promo didn't make much sence. His line "there are a percentage of wrestling fans who can be part of the show, but they can't be the show, so he's drawing a line in the sand and "if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything, so where do you stand?" This line made zero sence. He rambled about some fans wanting Joe to take out Booker and AJ to take out Angle. A "percentage" is the line he kept using. OK I get that. Then Nash tells Joe to not use weapons, then Sting takes out Joe. This all seems heelish to me by Sting & Nash. Then Nash says "what is going on" when Jarrett's music is playing. Who is the face and heel in all of this? I know it's still on-going, but whose the face and whose the heel? And if No Surrender is one week away, why isn't Joe concerned at all about Kurt Angle, Christian Cage or Booker T on this show?

so i guess you're asking alot of questions that you don't know the answer to, and you have to watch next week to see where they're going with it so you can get your answers. that's why it's so great when people question the booking, and the ratings miraculously seem to do well, contrary to what they would've thought would've happened. that's why they call wrestling a male soap opera.

 

[dzonewrestle1]

so i guess you're asking alot of questions that you don't know the answer to, and you have to watch next week to see where they're going with it so you can get your answers. that's why it's so great when people question the booking, and the ratings miraculously seem to do well, contrary to what they would've thought would've happened. that's why they call wrestling a male soap opera.

I get that. I get that the Sting/Jarrett/Nash/Booker/Joe/AJ stuff is on-going.
However, I can't beleive the World Champion Joe didn't have his belt in his promo, nor did he mention No Surrender, or his challengers for that match. The PPV is sunday. They're buildin up the big angle I know, but wouldn't pushing No Surrender make sence too.

 

[Marty2Hotty]

There's a huge discussion that I created about this on another thread. I said:

Yeah, it is a nice twist. Sting thanked the fans, yet he's the heel in this story and Jeff is going to be the babyface...

I would have hated if he just came out and bashed the fans because that's a typical "heelish" thing to do.. I like that the fans have a choice.

I dont know who to pick.. but I like sting.. but aj/joe do have a point in their aguments. i guess i'll judge who i'd cheer for based on the characters' actions in the upcoming weeks and months

Good intrigue.

I understood Sting's talk on fans wanting Joe?AJ to beat up booker/angle - obviously, they were the faces beating up the heels. He said fans shouldn't "be the show" - i think referring to those fans who want to put themselves over "Fire Russo".

I didn't really get the if you dont stand for something line eitherm but that doesnt matter too much

Sting praised the fans. But fans are allowed to choose now. I would have hated if he just insulkted the fans and confirm with us that "HEY GUYS IM THE HEEL LIKE HOGAN WAS WHEN HE TURNED"

This makes it interesting. Nash is in the middle of Joe/Sting. Jeff is the supposed good guy i think.. but i dont care who is the heel and face. I would cheer for whoever based on the characters' actions in the upcoming weeks, and fans should cheer for whatever the characters do.

It's like the sopranos.. tony is the "good guy" yet he does do bad things for whatever reason. (not sure it relates here)

As for Joe.. yeah, he was more concerned with sting, than angle/booker. but watch next week and i'm sure there'll be the right pushes.. the PPV build up includes this main story with sting, jeff and everyone else.. and i'm sure (or hope) that Russo has this planned out long term

 

[gg inferno]

I get that. I get that the Sting/Jarrett/Nash/Booker/Joe/AJ stuff is on-going.
However, I can't beleive the World Champion Joe didn't have his belt in his promo, nor did he mention No Surrender, or his challengers for that match. The PPV is sunday. They're buildin up the big angle I know, but wouldn't pushing No Surrender make sence too.

that's one of my biggest pet peeves in wrestling, that the champ has to have the belt with him at all times, like carrying a big giant neon sign over his head that says "CHAMP", basically to insult the fans intelligence as if they might have forgotten. in every other fighting discipline, mma, boxing, the champ usually just carries the belt with him to the ring.

 

[Disco Sucks]

so i guess you're asking alot of questions that you don't know the answer to, and you have to watch next week to see where they're going with it so you can get your answers. that's why it's so great when people question the booking, and the ratings miraculously seem to do well, contrary to what they would've thought would've happened. that's why they call wrestling a male soap opera.

The questions need to be worth asking though. What stood out for me, was the fact that Sting gave his promo in the ring, and Styles and Joe gave theirs in the back, not in front of the fans. Then Joe gets beat up by Sting later that night. When you've made two of your top faces look weak two consecutive weeks, I would think it would make their fans angry or annoyed rather than "ooh, I wonder what happens next!?"

If this continues, where Sting is GOD and the rest fall beneath him, then nobody will be asking questions, they will instead be laughing.

 

[Disco Sucks]

so i guess you're asking alot of questions that you don't know the answer to, and you have to watch next week to see where they're going with it so you can get your answers. that's why it's so great when people question the booking, and the ratings miraculously seem to do well, contrary to what they would've thought would've happened. that's why they call wrestling a male soap opera.

I'm sorry but this type of thinking is just immature for a wrestling fan, especially a former wrestler. Now does the casual TV viewer see wrestling as a "male soap opera"? Of course, but is Oprah trying her damnest to get the demographic for "24", or say "Dexter"? No, because her show is geared towards women, the majority of her viewers. Well, shouldn't wrestling then be geared towards wrestling fans? Those who actually enjoy the in-ring product itself and do not need swervez, pole matches, weddings, poop and tranny jokes, and no clean finishes ever in their matches. Those who appreciate a clean finish between 2 competitors that tells a story and ultimately work towards a bigger one.

Those are wrestling fans, and sir while I respect the fact that you've been in the business, I wonder if you even like the business you're in, or if you were simply doing it because you had the right gimmick at the right time.

 

[gg inferno]

I'm sorry but this type of thinking is just immature for a wrestling fan, especially a former wrestler. Now does the casual TV viewer see wrestling as a "male soap opera"? Of course, but is Oprah trying her damnest to get the demographic for "24", or say "Dexter"? No, because her show is geared towards women, the majority of her viewers. Well, shouldn't wrestling then be geared towards wrestling fans? Those who actually enjoy the in-ring product itself and do not need swervez, pole matches, weddings, poop and tranny jokes, and no clean finishes ever in their matches. Those who appreciate a clean finish between 2 competitors that tells a story and ultimately work towards a bigger one.

Those are wrestling fans, and sir while I respect the fact that you've been in the business, I wonder if you even like the business you're in, or if you were simply doing it because you had the right gimmick at the right time.

wrestling fans will watch the show because there's wrestling. explain to me how you get people that don't like wrestling to watch the show, which is how you increase your fanbase. i would love to hear your explanation, because if you know the answer then i will do my damndest to get you hired by tna to save the business. don't you realize that the wrestling fans will watch the show regardless of how bad they think the booking is? do you even know what i'm talking about when i describe wrestling as a male soap opera?

 

[Disco Sucks]

Well, firstly wrestling fans will not watch the show regardless of booking. I stayed away from the WWE for nearly 5 years, and I know plenty of those who have refused to watch TNA for the same reason. So how do you get those "non-wrestling fans"? Well I question if they are still out there, if they would even be interested but if you think conjuring up a booking style that worked 10 years ago is going to work then that's just ludicrous even for business standards.

You must understand why the Monday Night Wars happened. It wasn't because of Vince Russo, in fact he had little to do with it. It happened because 3 things happened that the wrestling world had never seen.

1) Hulk Hogan turned heel.
2) For the first time in the Vince McMahon era, the WWF had stiff competition.
3) Vince's top stars left for WCW.

The culmination of these three facets are what drove interest into wrestling. People truly didn't know what to expect. Hulk Hogan led a stable that was the epitome of a good vs. evil storyline only times ten with the nWo, and along with the way Bischoff presented his product which was as if every Nitro was comparable to an NFL football game in regards to size and importance this ultimately got people to watch.

Now why Vince Russo and Ed Ferrara's style of writing worked, was because of the environment at the time between the promotions. It wasn't so much what was booked better, but "can you top this?". There was competition over the phrase "did you see what happened on Nitro/Raw!?". So racy storylines, and over the edge behavior was a byproduct of the environment that the Monday Night Wars set. It was simply 2 promotions trying to top each other every week. So when many fans were sucked in by the wars, castration angles, giving birth to hands, crucifixions, they were acceptable. Fans understood they what they watched was presented in an environment that "anything could happen"

Now when the WWE won the war, and kept with the same over the top, edgy type of programming, ratings started to drop as well as the quality of the show. People have already seen "edgy" in their wrestling. Many fans that stuck around during the Monday Night Wars were no longer watching, and what you have left are simply wrestling fans that do not want the same chaos in the 90's in their product because there is no need for it.

The key is, ultimately and only IF you can bring those fans back because as I mentioned I believe wrestling was a fad, is to try to take away WWE fans from their product. This is harder than it was in 1994-95 because when WCW acquired Hogan and company, the WWF was horridly booked, behind the times and losing money. Right now this isn't the case, the WWE is booked well enough, not behind the times as they now hire writers, and they are making more money than ever before.

So how do you take away fans from the WWE, or even simply get them to watch every Thursday?

It starts with touring. TNA runs house shows on the road a lot, and there is no reason why they cannot do iMPACT!'s on the road, with a fresh audience every week. Every business must take some calculated risks to succeed, and not only would TNA look better as a company by doing this, but you get the word out to more people across the nation. Instead of a TNA house show that nobody will see, you advertise a taping for iMPACT! that will be seen by millions on cable television. I promise more people will show up to those shows.

Secondly, you hire fresh writers. It doesn't have to be Heyman, or Cornette, but some new and fresh ideas. A guy that will say "Why not make Daivairi's gimmick an Arab who WANTS to be everyone's friend and wants to look past the stereotypes of an Arab?" TNA has simply become predictable. I never read spoilers, but I sure as hell knew that there would be interference during the Styles/Cage match. When it was Frank Trigg, I shrugged and said to myself "well that wasn't a surprise". A WWE fan has no reason to keep watching TNA. All of my friends at work who watch RAW every week ask me what happened on TNA, and when I tell them, they just sort of give a half ass reaction.

Thirdly, you PUSH YOUR YOUNG STARS. If you do not push your young stars, you at least freshen up your veterans. Every veteran in TNA is a mirror of what they were 5-10 years ago. Fans have already seen that, they could care less. Anytime you see a veteran in the WWE they are usually freshened up. Jericho got a new look, Triple H has gotten a makeover in the past year or 2 with his "King of Kings" gimmick. Now you look at Sting, and he looks the same as he did 10 years ago. Same with Nash. Booker T is an exact replica of what he was on Smackdown!, Kurt Angle is no different, neither is Rhino or Team 3D. Christian Cage on the other hand is someone who was repackaged to success in TNA.

In other words, to grab WWE fans, they need to see something awesome, but something new. Why TNA hasn't pushed the Motor City Machine Guns is beyond me. They're young, hip, exciting to watch and VERY over. A.J. Styles, Samoa Joe, Matt Morgan, Tomko, Abyss, (repackaged well) Kaz, Jimmy Rave, James Storm, Robert Roode, LAX, Christopher Daniels - You could create an entirely new and fresh main event, X-Division and tag team picture just from those names alone. You do it with creative writing, smart marketing of those wrestlers, and efficient booking. So when iMPACT! rolls into town, and people see how amazing someone like A.J. Styles, Samoa Joe, or Kaz can be in person - well marketed with fresh music, catchphrases, and good promos, those fans will attach themselves to these names. They will tell their friends, and it will snowball...

Right now TNA fans have nothing to write home about. There is much more I could write on this subject, but for now I'm taking a small break...

 

[gg inferno]

Well, firstly wrestling fans will not watch the show regardless of booking. I stayed away from the WWE for nearly 5 years, and I know plenty of those who have refused to watch TNA for the same reason. So how do you get those "non-wrestling fans"? Well I question if they are still out there, if they would even be interested but if you think conjuring up a booking style that worked 10 years ago is going to work then that's just ludicrous even for business standards.

You must understand why the Monday Night Wars happened. It wasn't because of Vince Russo, in fact he had little to do with it. It happened because 3 things happened that the wrestling world had never seen.

1) Hulk Hogan turned heel.
2) For the first time in the Vince McMahon era, the WWF had stiff competition.
3) Vince's top stars left for WCW.

The culmination of these three facets are what drove interest into wrestling. People truly didn't know what to expect. Hulk Hogan led a stable that was the epitome of a good vs. evil storyline only times ten with the nWo, and along with the way Bischoff presented his product which was as if every Nitro was comparable to an NFL football game in regards to size and importance this ultimately got people to watch.

Now why Vince Russo and Ed Ferrara's style of writing worked, was because of the environment at the time between the promotions. It wasn't so much what was booked better, but "can you top this?". There was competition over the phrase "did you see what happened on Nitro/Raw!?". So racy storylines, and over the edge behavior was a byproduct of the environment that the Monday Night Wars set. It was simply 2 promotions trying to top each other every week. So when many fans were sucked in by the wars, castration angles, giving birth to hands, crucifixions, they were acceptable. Fans understood they what they watched was presented in an environment that "anything could happen"

Now when the WWE won the war, and kept with the same over the top, edgy type of programming, ratings started to drop as well as the quality of the show. People have already seen "edgy" in their wrestling. Many fans that stuck around during the Monday Night Wars were no longer watching, and what you have left are simply wrestling fans that do not want the same chaos in the 90's in their product because there is no need for it.

The key is, ultimately and only IF you can bring those fans back because as I mentioned I believe wrestling was a fad, is to try to take away WWE fans from their product. This is harder than it was in 1994-95 because when WCW acquired Hogan and company, the WWF was horridly booked, behind the times and losing money. Right now this isn't the case, the WWE is booked well enough, not behind the times as they now hire writers, and they are making more money than ever before.

So how do you take away fans from the WWE, or even simply get them to watch every Thursday?

It starts with touring. TNA runs house shows on the road a lot, and there is no reason why they cannot do iMPACT!'s on the road, with a fresh audience every week. Every business must take some calculated risks to succeed, and not only would TNA look better as a company by doing this, but you get the word out to more people across the nation. Instead of a TNA house show that nobody will see, you advertise a taping for iMPACT! that will be seen by millions on cable television. I promise more people will show up to those shows.

Secondly, you hire fresh writers. It doesn't have to be Heyman, or Cornette, but some new and fresh ideas. A guy that will say "Why not make Daivairi's gimmick an Arab who WANTS to be everyone's friend and wants to look past the stereotypes of an Arab?" TNA has simply become predictable. I never read spoilers, but I sure as hell knew that there would be interference during the Styles/Cage match. When it was Frank Trigg, I shrugged and said to myself "well that wasn't a surprise". A WWE fan has no reason to keep watching TNA. All of my friends at work who watch RAW every week ask me what happened on TNA, and when I tell them, they just sort of give a half ass reaction.

Thirdly, you PUSH YOUR YOUNG STARS. If you do not push your young stars, you at least freshen up your veterans. Every veteran in TNA is a mirror of what they were 5-10 years ago. Fans have already seen that, they could care less. Anytime you see a veteran in the WWE they are usually freshened up. Jericho got a new look, Triple H has gotten a makeover in the past year or 2 with his "King of Kings" gimmick. Now you look at Sting, and he looks the same as he did 10 years ago. Same with Nash. Booker T is an exact replica of what he was on Smackdown!, Kurt Angle is no different, neither is Rhino or Team 3D. Christian Cage on the other hand is someone who was repackaged to success in TNA.

In other words, to grab WWE fans, they need to see something awesome, but something new. Why TNA hasn't pushed the Motor City Machine Guns is beyond me. They're young, hip, exciting to watch and VERY over. A.J. Styles, Samoa Joe, Matt Morgan, Tomko, Abyss, (repackaged well) Kaz, Jimmy Rave, James Storm, Robert Roode, LAX, Christopher Daniels - You could create an entirely new and fresh main event, X-Division and tag team picture just from those names alone. You do it with creative writing, smart marketing of those wrestlers, and efficient booking. So when iMPACT! rolls into town, and people see how amazing someone like A.J. Styles, Samoa Joe, or Kaz can be in person - well marketed with fresh music, catchphrases, and good promos, those fans will attach themselves to these names. They will tell their friends, and it will snowball...

Right now TNA fans have nothing to write home about. There is much more I could write on this subject, but for now I'm taking a small break...

"Well, shouldn't wrestling then be geared towards wrestling fans? Those who actually enjoy the in-ring product itself and do not need swervez, pole matches, weddings, poop and tranny jokes, and no clean finishes ever in their matches. Those who appreciate a clean finish between 2 competitors that tells a story and ultimately work towards a bigger one."

so what is your argument? you say one thing in one post, then preach the opposite in another. here's the bottom line. people are misinterpreting the budget that tna is operating under. wcw was taping at center stage theater in atlanta, ga, before we got the backing of billionaire ted to go head to head live with raw. tna is in that same spot right now, but panda doesn't have the finances to give us a chance to go head to head live, which until we do, we'll never know where we're at in comparison. but knowing from experience, i can tell you that the wwe is far more vulnerable to stiff competition today than they were in 1995. you guys continue to bury tna without fully understanding the budget which we operate under. you should be preaching against wwe for dragging the business down, as they are far more responsible than tna.

 

[dzonewrestle1]

Well, firstly wrestling fans will not watch the show regardless of booking. I stayed away from the WWE for nearly 5 years, and I know plenty of those who have refused to watch TNA for the same reason. So how do you get those "non-wrestling fans"? Well I question if they are still out there, if they would even be interested but if you think conjuring up a booking style that worked 10 years ago is going to work then that's just ludicrous even for business standards.

You must understand why the Monday Night Wars happened. It wasn't because of Vince Russo, in fact he had little to do with it. It happened because 3 things happened that the wrestling world had never seen.

1) Hulk Hogan turned heel.
2) For the first time in the Vince McMahon era, the WWF had stiff competition.
3) Vince's top stars left for WCW.

The culmination of these three facets are what drove interest into wrestling. People truly didn't know what to expect. Hulk Hogan led a stable that was the epitome of a good vs. evil storyline only times ten with the nWo, and along with the way Bischoff presented his product which was as if every Nitro was comparable to an NFL football game in regards to size and importance this ultimately got people to watch.

Now why Vince Russo and Ed Ferrara's style of writing worked, was because of the environment at the time between the promotions. It wasn't so much what was booked better, but "can you top this?". There was competition over the phrase "did you see what happened on Nitro/Raw!?". So racy storylines, and over the edge behavior was a byproduct of the environment that the Monday Night Wars set. It was simply 2 promotions trying to top each other every week. So when many fans were sucked in by the wars, castration angles, giving birth to hands, crucifixions, they were acceptable. Fans understood they what they watched was presented in an environment that "anything could happen"

Now when the WWE won the war, and kept with the same over the top, edgy type of programming, ratings started to drop as well as the quality of the show. People have already seen "edgy" in their wrestling. Many fans that stuck around during the Monday Night Wars were no longer watching, and what you have left are simply wrestling fans that do not want the same chaos in the 90's in their product because there is no need for it.

The key is, ultimately and only IF you can bring those fans back because as I mentioned I believe wrestling was a fad, is to try to take away WWE fans from their product. This is harder than it was in 1994-95 because when WCW acquired Hogan and company, the WWF was horridly booked, behind the times and losing money. Right now this isn't the case, the WWE is booked well enough, not behind the times as they now hire writers, and they are making more money than ever before.

So how do you take away fans from the WWE, or even simply get them to watch every Thursday?

It starts with touring. TNA runs house shows on the road a lot, and there is no reason why they cannot do iMPACT!'s on the road, with a fresh audience every week. Every business must take some calculated risks to succeed, and not only would TNA look better as a company by doing this, but you get the word out to more people across the nation. Instead of a TNA house show that nobody will see, you advertise a taping for iMPACT! that will be seen by millions on cable television. I promise more people will show up to those shows.

Secondly, you hire fresh writers. It doesn't have to be Heyman, or Cornette, but some new and fresh ideas. A guy that will say "Why not make Daivairi's gimmick an Arab who WANTS to be everyone's friend and wants to look past the stereotypes of an Arab?" TNA has simply become predictable. I never read spoilers, but I sure as hell knew that there would be interference during the Styles/Cage match. When it was Frank Trigg, I shrugged and said to myself "well that wasn't a surprise". A WWE fan has no reason to keep watching TNA. All of my friends at work who watch RAW every week ask me what happened on TNA, and when I tell them, they just sort of give a half ass reaction.

Thirdly, you PUSH YOUR YOUNG STARS. If you do not push your young stars, you at least freshen up your veterans. Every veteran in TNA is a mirror of what they were 5-10 years ago. Fans have already seen that, they could care less. Anytime you see a veteran in the WWE they are usually freshened up. Jericho got a new look, Triple H has gotten a makeover in the past year or 2 with his "King of Kings" gimmick. Now you look at Sting, and he looks the same as he did 10 years ago. Same with Nash. Booker T is an exact replica of what he was on Smackdown!, Kurt Angle is no different, neither is Rhino or Team 3D. Christian Cage on the other hand is someone who was repackaged to success in TNA.

In other words, to grab WWE fans, they need to see something awesome, but something new. Why TNA hasn't pushed the Motor City Machine Guns is beyond me. They're young, hip, exciting to watch and VERY over. A.J. Styles, Samoa Joe, Matt Morgan, Tomko, Abyss, (repackaged well) Kaz, Jimmy Rave, James Storm, Robert Roode, LAX, Christopher Daniels - You could create an entirely new and fresh main event, X-Division and tag team picture just from those names alone. You do it with creative writing, smart marketing of those wrestlers, and efficient booking. So when iMPACT! rolls into town, and people see how amazing someone like A.J. Styles, Samoa Joe, or Kaz can be in person - well marketed with fresh music, catchphrases, and good promos, those fans will attach themselves to these names. They will tell their friends, and it will snowball...

Right now TNA fans have nothing to write home about. There is much more I could write on this subject, but for now I'm taking a small break...

--Disco's point about wrestling fans will always watch the show is true. TNA is in the 1.0 ratings a lot, thats the core fan group obviously. I've been a lifelong fan and I will continue to be. I watch WWE and TNA every week because I'm addicted and I always found somethin awesome in both companies. Tons of people on the net are too negative. I agree with Disco about this. A lifelong wrestling fan can say good things about a lot of TNA's past PPVs despite some weird booking decisions. I loved Hard Justice. Yes they do stupid shit sometimes, but so does WWE sometimes. How are you a wrestling fan and didn't watch WWE for 5 years? U gotta be a negative person at heart or had some personal issues if you r so angry or disapointed with WWE. Have fun in life.

--Russo had little to do with the Monday night wars? This is where I like to defend him. Russo with McMahon at that time was great. McMahon filtering Russo worked. I won't defend Russo's WCW experience. U said the Monday night wars were cuz of those 3 things, in my opinion it was a lot of different things, not just those 3 things. Ur right, but give Russo credit for the great stuff he did write in 97-99 in WWE. Russo isn't always great in TNA, but sometimes he is.

--Ur somehow have enough knowledge about TNA's inner workings to tell them how to run their business. I'm pretty sure they'll do some Impacts on the road in the future. They don't have the money WWE has.

--TNA has main-event names from a decade ago cuz their brand names. I'm sure Jeff Jarrett will tell you that it's smart business to have these big names for the casual fans who might stop by TNA one day and try em'. Yea they should be updated I agree with ya there, but TNA has these names for the reason I just said.

 

[dzonewrestle1]

"Well, shouldn't wrestling then be geared towards wrestling fans? Those who actually enjoy the in-ring product itself and do not need swervez, pole matches, weddings, poop and tranny jokes, and no clean finishes ever in their matches. Those who appreciate a clean finish between 2 competitors that tells a story and ultimately work towards a bigger one."

so what is your argument? you say one thing in one post, then preach the opposite in another. here's the bottom line. people are misinterpreting the budget that tna is operating under. wcw was taping at center stage theater in atlanta, ga, before we got the backing of billionaire ted to go head to head live with raw. tna is in that same spot right now, but panda doesn't have the finances to give us a chance to go head to head live, which until we do, we'll never know where we're at in comparison. but knowing from experience, i can tell you that the wwe is far more vulnerable to stiff competition today than they were in 1995. you guys continue to bury tna without fully understanding the budget which we operate under. you should be preaching against wwe for dragging the business down, as they are far more responsible than tna.

I just defended ya in my previous post. But I got a question, do you want TNA to go head to head with RAW on Mondays? In my opinion, TNA worring about staying profitable and branding themselves as the Thursday show seems 500 times more important to me. Why enter a MNW 2 when during MNW 1, one company won and the other died? Just stay profitable and brand yourself as the Thursday show.

 

[Marty2Hotty]

you should be preaching against wwe for dragging the business down, as they are far more responsible than tna.

I think if Russo was there in WWF without leaving, WWE would be doing 10.0 rating by now, I'd bet on it.

interestings tatement about TNA going head to head with WWE. Yeah, the business has certainly taken a dip because of WWE putting out a shitty product.

In regards to "wrestling fans", i agree that they will watch something to praise or to bitch about it. They watch all the wrestling they can get. Casual viewers are not goign to spend time to post on an online forum about the business. They may treat it as a TV show that they follow and discuss casually but not to the extent of a Keller/Meltzer or most peopel who preach what they say.

I also hate the argument that McMahon 'filtered' Russo. Watch all the nudity, profanity, godfather, Val Venis getting his dick supposedly chopped off, storylines that got on air. Percy Pringle said for every 10 ideas Russo pitched to McMahon, McMahon accepted 9 of them, and he was mainly concerned with teh main characters of the show: Austin/Rock/Foley, etc... he might use Russo's ideas and tweak it and make it better - this was coming from Russo and he admired McMhaon for that

McMahon's genius is he surrounded himself with geniuses.. Mcmhaon didn't filter Russo. McMahon PROTECTED Russo.. there's a HUGE diffference. If anyone got in Russo's way, McMahon would protect Russo

RUsso didn't have that in WCW, and people would talk behind his back and use politics gto get him out of the power

TNA, i'm not so sure, but if Jeff Jarrett is stupid enough to listen to the bullshit on the Internet, then he needs to get his head checked, because McMhaon was smart enough to let Russo write and turn his damn company around. TNA has good production and I think they can do a crazy publicity stunt down the line and get people talking but you need a consistent great product

I dont know why the rating is always 1.0 but if they get peopel talking on a weekly basis, and maybe go agianst wwe, the business might be turned around.

TNA's product right now is much better on a creative-basis than WWE right now. I think the 3 million that watch WWE Raw, may not know that TNA is on.. but i want TNA to attract fans that don't watch WWE as well

It's difficult.

I was wondering what glenn thinks it would take to get TNA up to 2.0.. because i dont know the answer. I think the shows now are good and with WWE's level and better, but what's it going to take?

What's the problem

 

[dzonewrestle1]

I think if Russo was there in WWF without leaving, WWE would be doing 10.0 rating by now, I'd bet on it.

interestings tatement about TNA going head to head with WWE. Yeah, the business has certainly taken a dip because of WWE putting out a shitty product.

In regards to "wrestling fans", i agree that they will watch something to praise or to bitch about it. They watch all the wrestling they can get. Casual viewers are not goign to spend time to post on an online forum about the business. They may treat it as a TV show that they follow and discuss casually but not to the extent of a Keller/Meltzer or most peopel who preach what they say.

I also hate the argument that McMahon 'filtered' Russo. Watch all the nudity, profanity, godfather, Val Venis getting his dick supposedly chopped off, storylines that got on air. Percy Pringle said for every 10 ideas Russo pitched to McMahon, McMahon accepted 9 of them, and he was mainly concerned with teh main characters of the show: Austin/Rock/Foley, etc... he might use Russo's ideas and tweak it and make it better - this was coming from Russo and he admired McMhaon for that

McMahon's genius is he surrounded himself with geniuses.. Mcmhaon didn't filter Russo. McMahon PROTECTED Russo.. there's a HUGE diffference. If anyone got in Russo's way, McMahon would protect Russo

RUsso didn't have that in WCW, and people would talk behind his back and use politics gto get him out of the power

TNA, i'm not so sure, but if Jeff Jarrett is stupid enough to listen to the bullshit on the Internet, then he needs to get his head checked, because McMhaon was smart enough to let Russo write and turn his damn company around. TNA has good production and I think they can do a crazy publicity stunt down the line and get people talking but you need a consistent great product

I dont know why the rating is always 1.0 but if they get peopel talking on a weekly basis, and maybe go agianst wwe, the business might be turned around.

TNA's product right now is much better on a creative-basis than WWE right now. I think the 3 million that watch WWE Raw, may not know that TNA is on.. but i want TNA to attract fans that don't watch WWE as well

It's difficult.

I was wondering what glenn thinks it would take to get TNA up to 2.0.. because i dont know the answer. I think the shows now are good and with WWE's level and better, but what's it going to take?

What's the problem

I liked all of Russo's stuff in 96-99, and McMahon was smart to let Russo do a lot of the new stuff that he did. I've followed Russo for years and I agreed with him tons when he would do interviews and such. Up until the year 2000 I agreed with him. McMahon did filter Russo. Russo himself said it in Wade Keller's DVD shoot w/ him. He said McMahon would make his ideas better. My point about the filtering is, McMahon always made sure that the bottom line was profit, PPVs, and making sence to the masses. Russo went to WCW and thought because his new ideas worked in 96-99, his new idea of "bringing all the internet insider dirt sheet stuff to on-air Nitro & Thunder would help them turn around. Yes, people talked sh*t about him behind his back. So what... Russo steered the ship in WCW for 3 months when he built the entire company around his arm and a backstage office setting, "the Powers that Be". Standards and Practices wouldn't let him book Roddy Piper to call a woman wrestler fat, and he would bitch about that. How would Roddy Piper calling a woman wrestler fat, or wrestlers constantly swearing, turn around the company? Wouldn't building Bret Hart vs. Hulk Hogan built up for all of those 3 months without them touching each other once before the PPV payoff been more profitable? And Russo booked the Starrcade finish that no body cared about in December 99. Russo blames everyone but himself for his WCW experience. Russo had a chance to make Eddie Guerrero, Rey Mysterio & Chris Benoit as big of brand names as Hogan, Flair & Sting were in those 3 months in 1999, and he failed to do that because he was more concerned with dirt sheet shoots on Thunder and lazy run-in and DQ finishes that led no-where. Run-ins and DQs have a place in wrestlin, but Russo just did them carelessly. For example, he once booked a no DQ match in WCW that ended with a DQ! Russo could have slowed down the entire WCW product and repositioned guys, and Eddie, Rey, Benoit and others deserving could have been built up into money-makers for the company. Also, he booked Bill Golbderg as a heel cuz it was a "new idea". I'm all for new ideas, but some new ideas don't make money. Goldberg could have been built up in those 3 months as the WCW World Champion, and they could have branded him big. Instead, WCW style crash TV was put in place. At least WWE's crash TV was organized and thought-out w/ Russo, and organized after Russo, thats the difference. If McMahon owned WCW, common sence says he wouldn't have allowed Russo to do half the shit he did in WCW. Thats my point.

 

[Disco Sucks]

"Well, shouldn't wrestling then be geared towards wrestling fans? Those who actually enjoy the in-ring product itself and do not need swervez, pole matches, weddings, poop and tranny jokes, and no clean finishes ever in their matches. Those who appreciate a clean finish between 2 competitors that tells a story and ultimately work towards a bigger one."

so what is your argument? you say one thing in one post, then preach the opposite in another. here's the bottom line. people are misinterpreting the budget that tna is operating under. wcw was taping at center stage theater in atlanta, ga, before we got the backing of billionaire ted to go head to head live with raw. tna is in that same spot right now, but panda doesn't have the finances to give us a chance to go head to head live, which until we do, we'll never know where we're at in comparison. but knowing from experience, i can tell you that the wwe is far more vulnerable to stiff competition today than they were in 1995. you guys continue to bury tna without fully understanding the budget which we operate under. you should be preaching against wwe for dragging the business down, as they are far more responsible than tna.

Can I ask firstly you just ignored my entire post? Seriously. RAW was in the low 2's in 1994-95, now they are in the 3's. They have much more revenue, stars, and fans than they did in 1994. How is it possible that the WWE would be easier to compete with now? How the hell did TNA hire you? You seem incompetent to even handle a simple response to a question.

I pretty much laid out the basics of why the Monday Night Wars worked, and what TNA could do to compete, and by not even responding to said post, I'm going to assume that you simply have no response because either you do not understand it, or because you know I'm right.

As for those who believe Russo had a lot to do with the Monday Night Wars...Ah geez, you people...

It was a product of the environment! It was only because the "can you top this" competition between WCW and WWF did so many racy and edgy storylines work. Not because it was must see television. Seriously, do you really think a casual TV viewer is going to decide to tune into TNA iMPACT! to see what Sting is going to do next as apposed to shows like CSI, Big Brother, Grey's Anatomy, Smallvile etc...?

Seriously?

 

[Disco Sucks]

...and I didn't watch the WWE for 5 years for the same reason I go out of my way to watch promotions like Ring of Honor, Dragon gate and CHIKARA. I don't like watching shitty wrestling. When it's GOOD wrestling, I'll watch.