IWC's Criticism Of WWE: It's Not You, It's Me

[The Brain]

We all know the IWC can be very critical of WWE. It’s almost like they’re not happy if they’re not complaining. If it’s not PG it’s Cena and his “5 moves of doom.” If it’s not that it’s about their favorites not getting pushed. They crave the good old days when wrestling was great. The funny thing is the good old days are different to different people. Some say the good old days were when Hulkamania was running wild. Others say it was when Bret and Shawn were putting on great match after great match. Most will tell you it was when Austin was raising hell and The Rock was electrifying sold out arenas throughout the world during the attitude era. Whatever you consider the good old days to be a lot of people seem to agree we are not living in them now. All the typical complaints can be cast aside because I know the main reason why so many in the IWC are not happy with today’s WWE and it has nothing to do with the product.

It’s because we’ve grown up. We crave the good old days because it takes us back to a simpler more fun time in life. Everything is more fun when you’re a kid. Everything is a bigger deal and everything seems larger than life. I’m sure everyone has a certain movie or cartoon show from their youth that will always hold a special place in their heart. Nothing beats nostalgia. In 1989 the feud between Hulk Hogan and Randy Savage seemed like the biggest thing in the world. What else did I have going on in my life? Now I have a job to go to, bills to pay, family issues, and the real world to deal with. As we gain experience we lose imagination. With all the knowledge I’ve gained about wrestling over the years I highly doubt even the most brilliant storyline will capture my imagination as they did during my youth. I can still find entertainment in wrestling but regardless of how good a storyline is I doubt I’ll go to bed with it on my mind awaiting the next ppv like it’s the main thing in my life. I used to live for a WWF ppv. Now sometimes I forget there is a ppv until the day of the show. When I was a kid Hulk Hogan was a superhero. I cheered for him. I wore his t shirt. I hung his poster on my wall. I didn’t know and didn’t care about backstage politics or his somewhat limited repertoire. I was a kid and I looked up to him the way kids look up to Cena today. I respect and accept Cena as the face of the company today, but I am not going to cheer him like I did Hogan. It’s not because I don’t like him because I do. It’s because I’m an adult and although I still enjoy the product I’m not going to be hanging a poster of someone close to my own age on my wall. The ten year olds who have the Cena posters on their wall right now will be here in 15 years complaining about whoever the main event guy is and telling everyone about the good old days when John Cena was on top. I guarantee it.

I think I’m older than most on this forum. As life goes on you can keep wrestling in your life and while it can always be enjoyable it will become less and less important. The older you get the further away those good old days become. I wish I could be a kid all over again but those days are gone forever. It’s just something we all have to accept in life. Leave those days where they belong; in the past and in your memories. If all you do is wish for the good old days you won’t be able to enjoy today.

Believe me I’m just as guilty as anybody of yearning for the good old days and quite frankly a lot of us do it just for the sake of conversation. If we just accepted and agreed with everything we saw the forums wouldn’t be much fun. I guess my point is despite all the complaints WWE isn’t as bas as it’s made out to be. Are there some things I’d like to change? Sure there are, but I’m going to stick with it as long as I find entertainment in it. When it stops entertaining me I’ll say thanks for the good times and move on.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

I don't yearn of the good old days, I yearn for good wrestling. I yearn for good storylines. I yearn for interesting characters. WWE has little to no good wrestling. Their storylines are basic, thereofore bromidic. The characters are all bland. Faces are 90% the same. Heels are 90% the same. The ones that are different are the ones that have been in the company for a long time. Nothing new. Nothing fresh. Not even an old recycled gimmick but with a few tweaks to make it better. Nothing.

I don't complain about Cena. Cena's working his ass off and has more talent in his pinky finger than the entire roster, bar Orton. He's just not used in order to unveil his REAL potential.

I don't complain about the PG Rating Either. Fuck the PG Rating, it does not determine the quality of a show. If I want blood, I'll go watch a thriller. If I want boobies, I'll watch porn. If I want curses, I'll watch some indy wrestling, it doesn't make a product good, it just adds to the intensity of a promo when someone calls someone "son of a bitch" at the right time, or adds some drama to the match when someone's busted open. Not against it, but I can do with and without it. The PG Rating censors excessive language, sexual content and gore. Anyone who blames the PG rating for WWE's weak product is a fucking moron and should choke on his own shit. It's not the PG rating, it's WWE.

They have good things going on, no doubt. I do enjoy Orton, Ziggler and Bourne ( when he's not squashed ). What I don't enjoy is the fact that this is supposedly the biggest company in the world, and must, MUST have the best product in the world, not the flashiest. This is a company that has a WWE Title match as the second bout at a PPV and a Divas match a match before the Main Event. Degrade your titles, that's the way to go.

This is a company that pushes a guy like Daniel Bryan by making one of the most promising stars -- The Miz -- tap out to him, twice. Good, I'm having a hard time finding out what's so special about Daniel Bryan in the first place, but it's a great way to push somebody. And then on the next night he gets squashed by Sheamus. Push - nullified. It doesn't make him look horrible being killed by Sheamus ( who hasn't been ), but they could always throw some of the more irrelevant guys at Sheamus to chew on.

This is a company that pushes Evan Bourne, the best highflyer in WWE today bar NONE ( not even Mysterio ), and then completely forgets about him. Last time I saw him he was doing the Macarena over the top rope in a Battle Royal 2 seconds into the match. The commentators went "Evan is eliminated", in a negligent, non-caring fashion.

A company that pushed a TON of guys and completely forgot about them. I understand that not every person who gets a push ends up Champion, but if it doesn't work out, don't turn them into jobbers, turn them into credible low-mid carders and let them fight for another push.

Fuck the Attitude Era. I saw it once, I have enough of it. The storylines were sweet, the characters were intriguing, the booking was eh, and the matches were mediocre at best. That shit's gone and it would never work again (in WWE ). Attitude Era was a product of competition and being in the right place, at the right time. It was new, fresh and innovative. Nothing is innovative today.

I stopped watching complete episodes of RAW and Smackdown, not because I want the A.A back. Not because I "grew up". That's bullshit and you know it. It's the dumbest reason I've ever heard/read. Stop making excuses as to why people shit on WWE's product. They do because it sucks in their eyes. Not because they grew up, not because they compare it to the Attitude Era. They just don't like the product, and you'll have to live with that. Somehow. God forbid someone disliked the almighty WWE.

I stopped being a true fan because I just wanted to see AT LEAST above average wrestling, good promos, and storylines that make me give a shit. WWE does not provide it, so I, as a long time WWE fan, chose to watch a company that does provide it - TNA. They have their shit, they have their dumb moments, their booking is bad a times, but still, they give me what I want, and I am willing to ignore these problems because they give me a reason to watch, WWE, somehow, does not. Trust me, I tried liking it. The more wrestling I can watch - the better. But .. nothing. WWE has the exact same issues, not better and not worse, but TNA is more appealing to me - the wrestling mark. 'Cause I like a product, that means I'm a mark, right? They give me the storylines that make me care, they give me a variety of characters to choose and like, people with identities, people I can connect with emotionally and understand, they made that easier with Reaction. Reaction is innovative, one more reason to watch, it's interesting. They give me matches who are not always good, but most of the time please my tastes.

But you're right. It's not the WWE. WWE pulls huge ratings, they make a lot of money ( imo if WWE didn't have their precious money they wouldn't last a year. I really want to see them work with TNA's resources. That'd be fun ). Like it or not, they're popping numbers left and right - they're doing something correctly, and kudos for that. Shit don't fly with me. I'm just one guy. It's not them, it's me. I don't like it - I don't watch it. I shit on it 'cause I just like to shit on things I don't like, and I like to praise stuff I do. Last time I checked a lot of humans do that. It's pretty hip. But at least I know what I'm shitting on, unlike the people who never even bother to see a TNA show and comment on it. That's the difference.

 

[laughhammer]

You may say you're one of the oldest here as you talk about the age of Hulkamania. I was watching wrestling when Verne Gagne was champion, and way before Hulk Hogan made his debut as Sterling Golden in the AWA. I watched legends like Dick The Bruiser, his cousin Crusher, Yukon Moose Cholak, Pepper Gomez, Sheik Adnan El Kasey, The original Ivan Putski, Ox Baker, Sailor Art Thomas. Bobo Brazil, Baron Von Rasche, Wilbur Snyder, and one of the best ringside announcers ever Sam Meneker. A sunglasses wearing guy by the name of Mean Gene Okerlund was in the locker room doing interviews. So I think I'm in the older bracket. When I watched for the first time if a wrestler jump off of anything higher than the top rope he got disqualified, and if he threw his opponent over the top rope he was disqualified also. Hitting another wrestler with anything but an open hand was grounds to be disqualified also.

 

[GameOver]

I'm WWE through and through, no matter how bad it got it was still far superior to WCW and now TNA, but that's my opinion

I was a WWF fan a few years pre Hulkamania and we didn't get anything WCW until around the time Triple H turned up as Terror Rizing other than PPV's,
Hulkamania was my entire childhood, looking back the actual wrestling was very slow and boring for alot of it but it was still very entertaining. Characters made the entertainment not necessarily attitude actions, and much like the attitude era it was a total package from jobber to main event, sure everything revolved around Hulk Hogan, but still everyone did there job to push that

Then we headed into the 2nd generation, Bret Hart/HBK era, i was sad at first that all my childhood heroes were slowly fading, but i grew to love the new generation's ability in ring

That passed quickly into the Attitude era, once again more guys had left and the new attitude and violence rubbed me the wrong way, i remember thinking they've gone to far every single week, but i couldn't stop watching, there was still enough of the good stuff to keep a fan entertained, technically into my 3rd generation of wrestling evolution. The action was overall, in ring, out of ring everyone got a shot. THats what wrestling should be. Doesn't have to have all the sex and violence that was involved but the general idea that they were a team not individuals striving to be the only main eventer. And ofcourse the 2 biggest companies throwing everything they had at each other made for compelling entertainment

This also saw the demise of decent commentry across the board.

but alas that too went the way of the dinosaurs, along comes the Cena generation.
spoilt brats, who in some cases even if they did have ability are not allowed to think for themselves anyway (fear of them screwing up i guess) everything has to be super quick and we don't care about fueds, just aslong as the standard forumla for every fued is played leading upto each ppv and everything is obviously scripted down to the finest detail even the commentry. The only thing keeping this going strong enough is the guys from the attitude era still hanging around and new fans. and now it's PG advertsing galore for the WWE $$$$

Rules being changed on the fly or totally ignored and then explained why it was ignored.
We get it it's not real, but there still has to bee some semblance of reality in the way it's performed or why would these guys try to kill themselves on a weekly basis.

It's not all doom and gloom but the new era is not good. The wrestlers aren't all to blame either it's a total balls up from management down to the performers. Have to wonder what in the bleep are they thinking when stuff is obviously ******ed and is rating low yet they keep doing the same thing week after week

But i am just a fan, what do i know about running a WWE business.

 

[omphenom]

hey guys this is one of my very few post...i hardly ever post something cuz everyone seems to be older and know what they are talking about and im always scared i say something stupid.

now i remember when i was 8 it was 2001 and it was around wrestlemania 17 that started to watch wwe....and stone cold just turned heel at the time and i hated how steve and HHH used to beat up every body else, and from that and i remember the first time i saw taker and kane, taker was in his biker gimmeck and kane was masked and from that moment on i was hooked to the dead man....kane was just an awsome force even triple h was great looking , although i hated him i wanted to look like him talk like him and be as strong as he is

anyway what im saying is that i missed the entire AA era and knew nuthin about it, and a few years ago wwe got stale and boring and i didnt watch much as i used to and ppl asked me why?? and i told them it got boring, they told me maybe u grew out of it, and i thought i did,so maybe that was the problem (i didnt have the net and didnt listen to wrestling webs) and i started to buy wrestling dvds and open youtube in my friends house and i thought wow what did i miss???? and i watched houres and houres of old wrestling... promos matches ,from hogan to bret hart to steve austin and it was great

the point is that we did not grow out of it....wrestling is just not the way it was, i would love to watch complet episodes of raw evry week but i cant now thats why i buy the wwe dvds, wwe was truly better.....but we can also hope for a change, every now and then wwe loses intrest and who knows maybe one wwe well be as good as it was..

 

[Chameleon]

I don't yearn of the good old days, I yearn for good wrestling. I yearn for good storylines. I yearn for interesting characters. WWE has little to no good wrestling. Their storylines are basic, thereofore bromidic. The characters are all bland. Faces are 90% the same. Heels are 90% the same. The ones that are different are the ones that have been in the company for a long time. Nothing new. Nothing fresh. Not even an old recycled gimmick but with a few tweaks to make it better. Nothing.

I don't complain about Cena. Cena's working his ass off and has more talent in his pinky finger than the entire roster, bar Orton. He's just not used in order to unveil his REAL potential.

I don't complain about the PG Rating Either. Fuck the PG Rating, it does not determine the quality of a show. If I want blood, I'll go watch a thriller. If I want boobies, I'll watch porn. If I want curses, I'll watch some indy wrestling, it doesn't make a product good, it just adds to the intensity of a promo when someone calls someone "son of a bitch" at the right time, or adds some drama to the match when someone's busted open. Not against it, but I can do with and without it. The PG Rating censors excessive language, sexual content and gore. Anyone who blames the PG rating for WWE's weak product is a fucking moron and should choke on his own shit. It's not the PG rating, it's WWE.

They have good things going on, no doubt. I do enjoy Orton, Ziggler and Bourne ( when he's not squashed ). What I don't enjoy is the fact that this is supposedly the biggest company in the world, and must, MUST have the best product in the world, not the flashiest. This is a company that has a WWE Title match as the second bout at a PPV and a Divas match a match before the Main Event. Degrade your titles, that's the way to go.

This is a company that pushes a guy like Daniel Bryan by making one of the most promising stars -- The Miz -- tap out to him, twice. Good, I'm having a hard time finding out what's so special about Daniel Bryan in the first place, but it's a great way to push somebody. And then on the next night he gets squashed by Sheamus. Push - nullified. It doesn't make him look horrible being killed by Sheamus ( who hasn't been ), but they could always throw some of the more irrelevant guys at Sheamus to chew on.

This is a company that pushes Evan Bourne, the best highflyer in WWE today bar NONE ( not even Mysterio ), and then completely forgets about him. Last time I saw him he was doing the Macarena over the top rope in a Battle Royal 2 seconds into the match. The commentators went "Evan is eliminated", in a negligent, non-caring fashion.

A company that pushed a TON of guys and completely forgot about them. I understand that not every person who gets a push ends up Champion, but if it doesn't work out, don't turn them into jobbers, turn them into credible low-mid carders and let them fight for another push.

Fuck the Attitude Era. I saw it once, I have enough of it. The storylines were sweet, the characters were intriguing, the booking was eh, and the matches were mediocre at best. That shit's gone and it would never work again (in WWE ). Attitude Era was a product of competition and being in the right place, at the right time. It was new, fresh and innovative. Nothing is innovative today.

I stopped watching complete episodes of RAW and Smackdown, not because I want the A.A back. Not because I "grew up". That's bullshit and you know it. It's the dumbest reason I've ever heard/read. Stop making excuses as to why people shit on WWE's product. They do because it sucks in their eyes. Not because they grew up, not because they compare it to the Attitude Era. They just don't like the product, and you'll have to live with that. Somehow. God forbid someone disliked the almighty WWE.

I stopped being a true fan because I just wanted to see AT LEAST above average wrestling, good promos, and storylines that make me give a shit. WWE does not provide it, so I, as a long time WWE fan, chose to watch a company that does provide it - TNA. They have their shit, they have their dumb moments, their booking is bad a times, but still, they give me what I want, and I am willing to ignore these problems because they give me a reason to watch, WWE, somehow, does not. Trust me, I tried liking it. The more wrestling I can watch - the better. But .. nothing. WWE has the exact same issues, not better and not worse, but TNA is more appealing to me - the wrestling mark. 'Cause I like a product, that means I'm a mark, right? They give me the storylines that make me care, they give me a variety of characters to choose and like, people with identities, people I can connect with emotionally and understand, they made that easier with Reaction. Reaction is innovative, one more reason to watch, it's interesting. They give me matches who are not always good, but most of the time please my tastes.

But you're right. It's not the WWE. WWE pulls huge ratings, they make a lot of money ( imo if WWE didn't have their precious money they wouldn't last a year. I really want to see them work with TNA's resources. That'd be fun ). Like it or not, they're popping numbers left and right - they're doing something correctly, and kudos for that. Shit don't fly with me. I'm just one guy. It's not them, it's me. I don't like it - I don't watch it. I shit on it 'cause I just like to shit on things I don't like, and I like to praise stuff I do. Last time I checked a lot of humans do that. It's pretty hip. But at least I know what I'm shitting on, unlike the people who never even bother to see a TNA show and comment on it. That's the difference.

everything you said is utter shit! TNA sucks ok kid! i flipped the switch after watching dixie "cry" or try to do her bad acting like she always does! let me tell you why WWE is 10-100 times better than TNA:

1. WWE can sell out 10,000-100,000 seat arenas for RAW,SMACKDOWN,NXT,SUPERSTARS and PPV's like WRESTLEMANIA and other PPV's TNA can only sell out what? a 200-3,000 seat bingo hall in orlando.

2.WWE travels to different cities and arenas every MON,TUE, and FRI(live smackdown only) nights while TNA is always broadcasting from the bingo hall in orlando.

3. WWE appeals to me more than TNA! i can watch WWE (yes the over the top PG corny comedy sucks) but i can watch RAW, SMACKDOWN,NXT and SUPERSTARS and not get bored and get right into the action! but when i watch TNA i will always have to turn the tv to something else because the same shit and superstars that TNA is showing i saw when i was 16-20 years old.

4. i would rather watch a wwe show that keeps to themselves and don't mention the competition(until recently) rather than watch a tna show that will mention WWE every segment just to snag in viewers.

5. with wwe they are pushing young talent and giving stars a chance to reach that brass ring bryan,barrett,sheamus,rhodes,mcintyre need i say more... TNA would rather push old ex-wwe stars(hogan's band of merry thugs,a crackhead,2 stoners and a soma popping ex-olympian) rather than push their homegrown talent.

6 WWE's rating's are always in the 2.4-3.9 range while TNA ratings are always hovering around the 0.5-1.6 range!

7 if TNA always "deliver" as you say they do which they dont IMO why does dixie always put out tweets saying" TNA WILL CHANGE FOREVER" but when you "sheep" and "sympathizers" watch impact her delivery is always dead on arrival while WWE says they are going to do something AND THEY GIVE FANS LIKE ME WHAT WE ASK FOR!

8. and before i get flack for being a WWE mark i wasn't always a WWE mark
i was a wwf mark from 10-10-82(my third birthday) until the summer of '96 when the nWo and WCW caught my eye! i watched wcw nitro as a DIEHARD wcw fan from 1996-1998 when i heard tony (shchaivone?) mention that mic foley was gonna win the wwf title that's when i turned to raw and got hooked to the attitude era(the good old days) and been a fan of the WWF/E from 1998-2002 that's when i started getting tired of the wwf/e and my friend turned me on to TNA wrestling. i orderd every wed night PPV and was happy when they moved to spike tv but when tna started making promises they cant keep i said fuck it dixie! you suck and i became a wwe fan again for the 3rd time and i got hooked once again.

9.i can agree with you fans about wwe's over the top corny PG comedy, their horrendous guest host gimmick,stopping a match because a wrestler bleeds,hornswoggle,michael cole and that damn gm computer nonsense
IT SUCKS! but it's better than the over the top bullshit TNA spews out!
gotta copy WWE just to snag in viewers.

10. the IWC is just like the TEA PARTY MOVEMENT! always BITCHING and MOANING about "WE WANT THIS" and "WE WANT THAT" and other bullshit you fools spew out but when you get what you want..... you idiots will do a complete 180 and criticize and denounce the very thing you asked for! EXAMPLE: WWE is not pushing randy orton right he should be WWE champion instead of cena!!! but... when vince gives you assholes your wish and gives ORTON the title....you kids turn on the very thing you asked for!....EXAMPLE #2 i'ts too early for vince to put the title on otron!?! and you fools asked for orton to be wwe champ but now you denouce him as champion just like the tea party in wanting change this november but they are fighting amongst each other because they got the change they want and now they are doing a complete 180! it's just like me going to a bank sticking it up stealing 10,000$$$ and getting in my getaway car and driving away on monday just to return to the same bank on tuesday and return the money because it's not what i wanted! SORRY FOR THE LOOOOONG RANT! but if you IWC guys want change instead of bitching to eachother...write to....


WWE HEADQUARTERS:

1241 E.MAIN STREET

STAMFORD,CT 06902

PHONE NUMBER:203-352-8600

maybe if you idiots do that you might get the change you want!

WHAT I JUST WROTE IS MY OWN DAMN OPINION JUST LIKE YOU HAVE A SAY... I DO AS WELL! AND IF YOU TNA SHEEP AT WRESTLEZONE DONT LIKE IT....

 

[TheIcon2]

You do realize that WWE has been around vastly longer than TNA thus aiding in many of the "reasons" you give for WWE being better. I believe Vince bought the company around 1981 or so from his father. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

WWE travels to different cities because it rakes in more fans, more money, because it has been around for nearly 3 times as long. Ofcourse WWE ratings are higher because we already solidified the fact they been around for 30+ yrs gaining a following, selling more, thus more people watch.

Its like saying MS Windows is better than Linux because more people use it, it makes more money, and is used in more countries.

WWE does some things right and TNA does some things right. Its all a matter of opinion but much of what you are discussing is based on economics and finance.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

everything you said is utter shit! TNA sucks ok kid! i flipped the switch after watching dixie "cry" or try to do her bad acting like she always does! let me tell you why WWE is 10-100 times better than TNA:

1. WWE can sell out 10,000-100,000 seat arenas for RAW,SMACKDOWN,NXT,SUPERSTARS and PPV's like WRESTLEMANIA and other PPV's TNA can only sell out what? a 200-3,000 seat bingo hall in orlando.

2.WWE travels to different cities and arenas every MON,TUE, and FRI(live smackdown only) nights while TNA is always broadcasting from the bingo hall in orlando.

3. WWE appeals to me more than TNA! i can watch WWE (yes the over the top PG corny comedy sucks) but i can watch RAW, SMACKDOWN,NXT and SUPERSTARS and not get bored and get right into the action! but when i watch TNA i will always have to turn the tv to something else because the same shit and superstars that TNA is showing i saw when i was 16-20 years old.

4. i would rather watch a wwe show that keeps to themselves and don't mention the competition(until recently) rather than watch a tna show that will mention WWE every segment just to snag in viewers.

5. with wwe they are pushing young talent and giving stars a chance to reach that brass ring bryan,barrett,sheamus,rhodes,mcintyre need i say more... TNA would rather push old ex-wwe stars(hogan's band of merry thugs,a crackhead,2 stoners and a soma popping ex-olympian) rather than push their homegrown talent.

6 WWE's rating's are always in the 2.4-3.9 range while TNA ratings are always hovering around the 0.5-1.6 range!

7 if TNA always "deliver" as you say they do which they dont IMO why does dixie always put out tweets saying" TNA WILL CHANGE FOREVER" but when you "sheep" and "sympathizers" watch impact her delivery is always dead on arrival while WWE says they are going to do something AND THEY GIVE FANS LIKE ME WHAT WE ASK FOR!

8. and before i get flack for being a WWE mark i wasn't always a WWE mark
i was a wwf mark from 10-10-82(my third birthday) until the summer of '96 when the nWo and WCW caught my eye! i watched wcw nitro as a DIEHARD wcw fan from 1996-1998 when i heard tony (shchaivone?) mention that mic foley was gonna win the wwf title that's when i turned to raw and got hooked to the attitude era(the good old days) and been a fan of the WWF/E from 1998-2002 that's when i started getting tired of the wwf/e and my friend turned me on to TNA wrestling. i orderd every wed night PPV and was happy when they moved to spike tv but when tna started making promises they cant keep i said fuck it dixie! you suck and i became a wwe fan again for the 3rd time and i got hooked once again.

9.i can agree with you fans about wwe's over the top corny PG comedy, their horrendous guest host gimmick,stopping a match because a wrestler bleeds,hornswoggle,michael cole and that damn gm computer nonsense
IT SUCKS! but it's better than the over the top bullshit TNA spews out!
gotta copy WWE just to snag in viewers.

10. the IWC is just like the TEA PARTY MOVEMENT! always BITCHING and MOANING about "WE WANT THIS" and "WE WANT THAT" and other bullshit you fools spew out but when you get what you want..... you idiots will do a complete 180 and criticize and denounce the very thing you asked for! EXAMPLE: WWE is not pushing randy orton right he should be WWE champion instead of cena!!! but... when vince gives you assholes your wish and gives ORTON the title....you kids turn on the very thing you asked for!....EXAMPLE #2 i'ts too early for vince to put the title on otron!?! and you fools asked for orton to be wwe champ but now you denouce him as champion just like the tea party in wanting change this november but they are fighting amongst each other because they got the change they want and now they are doing a complete 180! it's just like me going to a bank sticking it up stealing 10,000$$$ and getting in my getaway car and driving away on monday just to return to the same bank on tuesday and return the money because it's not what i wanted! SORRY FOR THE LOOOOONG RANT! but if you IWC guys want change instead of bitching to eachother...write to....


WWE HEADQUARTERS:

1241 E.MAIN STREET

STAMFORD,CT 06902

PHONE NUMBER:203-352-8600

maybe if you idiots do that you might get the change you want!

WHAT I JUST WROTE IS MY OWN DAMN OPINION JUST LIKE YOU HAVE A SAY... I DO AS WELL! AND IF YOU TNA SHEEP AT WRESTLEZONE DONT LIKE IT....

You think TNA sucks? Okay, I can deffinitely see why you don't like it. You like WWE? Great. Again, I can see why you like it. Very prosperous place, lots of money, lots of success. Still, I like TNA better. I sure respect your opinion, but I find it quite funny that you spent so much time explaining to me why TNA sucks and WWE rules, when it's not going to change my mind even a little bit. WWE themselves can't convince me that they have a good product, and I'm very positive that a random WWE fan can.

P.S: I like how you're so mad at TNA for pushing RVD, Hardy, Anderson and Angle. I seem to recall Jeff Hardy pinning Triple H to win the World Heavyweight CHampionship. I also remember Kurt Angle beating Shawn Michaels at Wrestlemania. It was RVD who beat Cena and held both the ECW and WWE Titles at the same time, right? And, correct me if I'm wrong, didn't Mr.Anderson win Money in the Bank? Damn you're smart.

WWE can sell out huge arenas, because WWE's been around for over twenty years. TNA has been alive for 8 years. I'm pretty sure they're doing far better in their 8th year than WWE was in THEIR 8th year. It's like comparing the physiques of a 30 years old bodybuilder and a first grader. Pretty idiotic.

WWE IS going to different cities. TNA isn't popular enough, nor do they have the financial backing to do so. Again, read what I said above about how long they've been around.

I'm glad that you like WWE more than TNA. We all have different tastes and if that's what you like, then that's what you watch.

WWE IS pushing young guys. Miz, Sheamus and Bryan Danielson are the ones that stand out the most and could/will be something in the future. I love Sheamus, I'm liking Miz more and more, but not a huge fan of Danielson. Cody Rhodes and Drew are the most random team ever. They ARE being pushed, and that's great, but WWE literally realized they had no tag-teams at Night of Champions so they put two completely different guy togethers and slapped belts on them, so people like you would believe they're good, while infact Cody Rhodes has the charisma of a wet napkin and Drew McIntyre has the charisma of that wet napkin after someone wipes his ass with it.

And I agree that TNA is not pushing their home grown talent enough. But if you look at it logically, and from a business stand point - what homegrown TNA star is better than Angle in the ring? What homegrown star is better than Anderson on the mic? The only guy that shouldn't be anywhere near a main event is Hardy. But he's there to attract the kiddies to watch, and he will. Bad for the wrestling fan, great for TNA.

And you're right, TNA's ratings are tiny compared to WWE. Anything TNA is tiny compared to WWE, really. It's just how it is and every TNA fan has to deal with it, and we all do and have no problem with it, but apparently it's a big issue with WWE fans. It's funny that you boast about having better ratings and having jam packed arenas over such a small company like TNA. Follow Vince's advice, don't care. Leave the caring to the people who like it. If anyone is allowed to boast when they're better it's TNA 'cause they're the underdog.

I enjoy blogging/shitting/praising both products, but it's very frustrating when some illiterate idiot is spewing crap without thinking. Constructive criticism my friend. That's what it's all about.

Show me how TNA copied WWE. That's one thing I want to know. I dare you to show it to me, 'cause I'm not in a mood to argue but I'll argue about this all day long, sister, and I'll make you look like an idiotic ass. Please.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

It's inevitible in any long term product that involves live attendance or watching on TV or theatres... Most people identify with one iteration or era and will forever want to stick to that forgetting that they as fans need to evolve with the product or their enjoyment will forever be ruined.

People yearn for the good old days of Tom Baker as Doctor Who, despite Matt Smith being very, very good... for when the original Guns 'n Roses toured, yet still pay to see "the poison chipmunk"'s new iteration turning up late..for when Sean Connery was James Bond despite being not as good as Dalton, Brosnan or Craig was...

It's all down to what hooked you in the first place... for me, my first exposure was that early Vince Jr. era... Sheik, Hogan... but I am old enough to remember it... Over the years of my childhood the WWF evolved to the point where there were characters I could identify with... The British Bulldogs v The Harts is what hooked me, but I don't judge all tag team matches by theirs cos it would be unrealistic... E&C/Hardyz/Dudleys and their TLC matches were not better, but evolved.. I loved both equally, but I don't now expect it today.

Wrestling really does work in cycles... A generation of fans who watched Bruno S., Pedro et al were turned off by Hogan and the Cartoon era but took their kids... Those fans grew into teens who dug the Attitude era and are now adults who are hating on the PG product but will take their kids cos secretly they still like it...

That works great until you factor in the true lost generation... These are us... the IWC... Teens/Twenty/Thirty somethings, often without kids as an excuse to like wrestling... Not saying no one in the IWC has kids, but if a study was done, i'd bet a fair price that most people who have the time to devote to the IWC, with the passion involved are not devoting time to kids...

So we have a group of fans who want to find something in the product but don't have the shortcut of their kids to fall back on, they can't get behind guys like Cena cos he is designed not to appeal to them... they leap on someone like Jeff Hardy or RVD cos "he was one of ours" back in the day as opposed to what they bring to a modern day product... they praise Orton as the 2nd coming of Austin, cos they need that figure as a reason to watch... that guy that lets them say "I like Austin/Orton cos he and I have the same FTW attitude". This group are more likely to boycott paying the WWE money, watching streams rather than PPV's and watching DVDs off of torrent.

But the downside of that attitude is the inbuilt resistance to anything that appeases the other groups...who in reality are the ones contributing the dollars needed to keep the juggernaut rolling... and WWE as a traded company will cater to those paying fans first and foremost every time...

 

[MMK]

Totally agree. I enjoyed this article. Well written.

It's funny how everyone seems to think that the era they grew up watching was the best. And like you said, that's because at the time it was all real to us back then (whenever then was for each person), and you didn't have any of the worries of adulthood to contend with.

Once that suspension of disbelief is broken for a person, you're never able to enjoy wrestling on the same level as the days of yesteryear.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

There are many different reasons as to why the WWE can't please the IWC. I think that one of the biggest reasons why is because far too many within the IWC have gotten it in their heads that the WWE should be some sort of fantasy league. These fans want wrestlers that they like a lot pushed even if those wrestlers don't encourage the same reaction from most other fans, they want what in their minds are dream matches made, they want what they feel are epic feuds to take place and they piss and moan when they don't get their way. These fans simply ignore the fact that pro wrestling is supposed to be a business, that wrestlers do what they do to make money and that no rational person is going to sacrifice their livelihood for the, often, momentary whims of internet fans that don't know a tenth of what they think they do.

I think another big reason is that a lot of fans that have grown up watching wrestling remember the "good old days" as being much better than they actually were. I can't count the number of threads and posts I've read in which someone begs for the Attitude Era to come back or tries to come up with some sort of strategy for the WWE to initiate a new one. A lot of fans look at the Attitude Era through rose colored glasses and from the way they talk, you'd think that every match was a 5 star epic and every feud, storyling and segment was the stuff that dreams are made of. The Attitude Era was fun when I was growing up, but there was also a lotta crap that found its way onto tv during that time. These fans conveniently gloss over Katie Vick, Val Venis getting his dick chopped off with a samurai sword, sleazy segments designed first and foremost to pop ratings, guys like Ken Shamrock & Steve Blackman running around, Chyna becoming Intercontinental Champion, Pat Patterson & Gerald Brisco wrestling comedy matches, etc. For the most part, I thought the wrestling content we saw on Raw during much of the Attitude Era was pretty lame. It was generally the skits and promo segments that carried the show. There were loads of crap that went along with the good during the Attitude Era.

 

[natlee75]

I started watching wrestling in 1991 - my first match was Bret winning the I-C title from Mr. Perfect at SummerSlam - and have been following the "sport" to some capacity since then.

I can understand your point of view, but I don't think I can agree that "growing up" necessarily has anything to do with the situation. I think it's more along the lines of "WWE/F has been a major entertainment product for about three decades now so really how much new stuff can they throw at us?"

Really, what's there left to do? What stories are there left to tell?

And, a more compelling question to me is why we've only just noticed that the stories are being recycled just now when we've been seeing the same thing over and over again for the better part of a decade?

Not that I'm complaining, really. I enjoy the current product for what it is. Even though I'm seeing mostly the same thing I've seen in the past, what makes it fresh and interesting are the people delivering those stories.

 

[ilapierre]

I'm one of those guys who found all the wrestling eras fascinating since Hulk Hogan. Wrestling entertainment since Eddie Guerrero died seems to be on par with the the pre-Hogan era when you had guys like Bruno and Backlund as champs (much better faces than Cena). I totally understand where the OP is going with his argument, cause I at one time a few years ago thought the same thing. But i've read many convincing arguments on here from some intelligent posters that have made me think otherwise.

I bet if you polled kids around 15 to 20 who haven't seen 1985-2005 wrestling while growing up watching wrestling in the past five years they'd think what we have now is awesome or at least entertaining. But one poster here who was about 18 said that he prefers watching the older era rather than the present one cause it's 'stale'. Then if you polled older pre-Hogan wrestling fans, i bet most would say the same thing as the 18 year old.

Wrestling is just not the same as it used to be. WWE has taken the fun out of things because tastes have changed and WWE is above all a business trying to make stable profits. WWE dictates wrestling entertainment, and thus dictates to TNA what they can get away with, so TNA is stuck in what they can do to win over the WWE audience. Although TNA could be much better, TNA isn't doing half bad with what they have, as zeven_zion pointed out above, and i couldn't have said it better. But WWE is stale, and anyone who says otherwise has the mentality of a 12 year old. At the best of times in WWE we have babyface John Cena who has been on top of WWE as long as Hulk Hogan was (8 years) and Cena's nowhere even near as marketable or as revolutionary as Hogan. Inappropriate overexposure. You have Triple H whose won 11 too many World Titles. Completely predictable and boring World Title scene. You have an over the hill Undertaker (still the most entertaining guy to watch but nowhere near as entertaining as he used to be).

But then you have guys who really don't have anything unique or intriguing about them like Sheamus. And you have bland spikey hair guys with Lex Luger-like bodies and monotonous voices there to appeal to chicks. You don't have out of shape characters that make you laugh like the Bezerker or Papa Shango. Even Mr. Perfect, who was suppose to embody everything that was perfect, wasn't in visually perfect shape. In fact, there aren't many guys around these days shaped like Curt Henning. But Mr. Perfect was an intriguing character, and that was the most important thing back when WWE wrestling was watchable. Now its about being as good looking and in perfect shape as possible. There is limited tv time for uglier out of shape guys (or guys who are just not really really good looking or who are not in absolute perfect shape). TV is suppose to be about guys and girls who are carbon copies of beautiful people on other highly rated tv shows. We don't have crazy bad asses doing anything and everything like Stone Cold or Randy Savage (closest is Randy Orton..and he's allowed to because he looks more like the carbon copy of a beautiful person). You don't have charismatic guys (closest being the Miz) like Ric Flair or pre-PG era Shawn Michaels. What we have now is basically wrestlers who don't really care about anything but paycheques. You can tell there is no locker room chemistry among the boys and fascinating things going on behind the scenes i.e. Iron Sheik and Hacksaw getting busted doing weed or Mr. Fugi on a drinking binge. Wrestlers who got along behind the scenes were much better at intriguing audiences. I remember laughing so hard back in the day because none of the wrestlers, minus Hogan, took themselves that seriously. Now the things that are suppose to be funny are forced, awkward, and could only entertain a kid. I still watch stuff on youtube from 1990-2000 and laugh at some of the things i stumble upon that i've never seen before. But the stuff now barely warrants a response other than to change the channel.

Wrestlers these days likely keep to themselves in their individual hotel rooms the night before shows memorizing their scripts, puking up their meals, training 8 hours a day, and laying in tanning beds. These days you have these kind of guys like Randy Orton successfully ratting out guys like Mr. Anderson and getting them fired. You can tell that every one of these charisma-lacking guys in WWE are also narcissist prima donnas, like Hulk Hogan minus the charisma, who take themselves way too seriously. These wrestling personalities are beyond boring, the scripts these generic robots follow are TEDIOUS, and my qualms have NOTHING to do with the fact that i'm too old to enjoy wrestling. Because i am enjoying TNA more and more and its doing something WWE hasn't been able to do since the brand split. It's hooking me with a longterm storyline. And ex WWE guys like Jeff Hardy, RVD, Kurt Angle, Mr Anderson, who all got fired because they broke the cookie cutter mold by speaking out, are much more watchable in my opinion because they are individuals who speak their mind and don't let business completely dictate their actions. People who speak their mind actually translate better to audiences as entertaining wrestlers with intriguing personalities and charisma!!

WWE wrestling is basically programmed for children and women. Men between 18 and 35 should be angry and should STOP making excuses to defend their beloved wrestling program of choice. Objectively, we all know deep down wrestling entertainment could be A WHOLE LOT BETTER if WWE would justly reward the age bracket that made them the billion dollar company they are and ENTERTAIN them properly. The age bracket who still wants to be entertained and should count most. 18 to 35.

Is it just me or does Chameleon sound like a WWE employed WZ poster hired to promote WWE and shit on TNA???

 

[CripplerFrogSplash]

I started watching WWE in late 2002... the wrestling was extremely good, the promos backed them up well & every wrestler had their own uniqueness about them.

Fast forward 8 years, & the wrestling isn't very good, the promos are meh to rubbish & most wrestlers seem to be the same character with different faces.

The PG rating is just for the money purposes, & I know Vince loves money more than Wrestling. I just miss the intensity, the feeling of the fueds & the beauty of matches. I watch & see guys who don't really give a shit when they wrestle, I see wrestlers intensely hate their rival when they're in a feud, but I don't see it on their faces & I don't hear it on their voices. It looks like they're reciting the lines from the script without packing the punch into what they say, like they mean it. I see heels ALWAYS wearing suits & being almost immobile when they come to the ring making little to no expressions & faces always jumping around & smiling... I just can't see difference normally.

I want that to change, to make me feel like I have to emotionally invest myself like I would with my family & friends; like I know these people & want them to hurt each other... but at this moment WWE's blandness is making me fume inside & I just hope it changes soon, as Wade Barrett, Justin Gabriel, Bryan Danielson, Sheamus & Kane are the only things keeping me watching right now.

 

[The Brain]

I completely agree with those who say WWE could be better right now. There are many old school things I would like to see brought back that in my opinion would improve the product. Those old school things I would bring back probably would not improve the product in some other people’s minds. I just think that no matter what happens I will always look at the pre attitude days as the good old days and nothing will be able to match up. Even if everything went exactly the way I wanted that more innocent time in my life is over. I’ll still be able to enjoy the WWE product; just on a different level. I think it all comes down to one thing. As kids we don’t watch with a critical mind pointing out flaws and thinking of how things could be better. We just take what we’re given and accept it as is which allows us to enjoy it more.

By the way I’m sure I will continue to post about brining back elements about the good old days. I’m sure I will continue to post opinions about improving the product. I’m sure some of my future posts will seem contradictory to this thread. Despite that I will continue to post those opinions for the same reason I do anything related to wrestling. For fun.

 

[marklouis]

Isn't it possible that the product just isn't very good? I mean, there's a reason WWE is getting it's lowest TV ratings in years. There's a reason they can barely sell 10K seats for RAW or Smackdown when they used to sell 20K. The storylines are not as creative as they once were, and really, the company doesn't even allow storylines to take place. They just go from PPV to PPV, never really building anything long-term. I hope that will change with the Nexus/Cena angle. And I'm not one who says that blood & hardcore matches are needed for entertaining TV, but stopping a match because someone has a cut on their forehead is ridiculous. I think the one word that cand escribe everything about the WWE right now is bland. Even the guy many people here like, The Miz, is just a generic cocky heel. There's just no creativity or buzz to the product, and I don't see that changing in the near future.

 

[Rckstrtmmy]

For me personally, I don't miss anything from the old days because everything seems like a logical progression to me. With the Hogan era, McMahon got a lot of kids into wrestling. His product grew up with those kids (bringing in the Attitude Era) and became a more adult oriented show. Those kids that were lifelong fans spread the word of how awesome things got and the WWE skyrocketed. The ratings before the AE were similar to what they are now I believe. So now McMahon is trying to build up Cena as the next generation of Hogan and get more kids to watch this generations new superstars. It worked once, why not try it again?

The only main issue I have with WWE now is that the stories aren't nearly as involved as they used to be. I like the Nexus/Cena angle right now, but it's the first one in a while that actually has me contemplating a million different scenarios in my head. Also it seems like only the titles have stories around them. In the AE EVERYBODY had something going on. From Austin to the Blue Meanie, there was a story behind everything. Now they just throw shit against the wall to see what sticks and that is what has me down on the product a little bit. Give Evan Bourne and Mark Henry a story and they could be an interesting team. A good combo of strength and speed. Morrison is one of the more popular young faces so put him in a program with one of the more popular young heels like Sheamus and have them take each other to new heights (this may also allow Sheamus to actually win clean for once). It worked just fine for HHH and The Rock. I just think everybody should be utilized as it would make every match more interesting if they were actually fighting for something.

 

[Mr_Ratings]

BTW its over 50 years not 20. Lol but that just furthers the point. Oh I can see it now "Bruno in the WWE sold out 40,000 seat arenas all the time, where as TNA can only do 2000 - 3000 people".

5 words. No internet and no cable.

Kills that argument right there.

 

[3/4 Facelock]

IWC thinks they know wrestling, but they know jack shit.

The term IWC encompasses the entire internet wrestling community as well as its subgroups including those who are smarks, marks, true believers, and what I call “real fans”.

The majority of the criticism comes from the smark subgroup. These are people who follow wrestling in the same fashion their mother’s read the National Enquirer and their sisters watch Jersey Shore and whatever other god-awful IQ dropping dreck out there.

They use terms and phrases like predictable, and prestige, and “he’s the next (Insert Wrestler Here)”, and buried, without knowing what the fuck these things actually mean. First off, predictability. With wrestling being a FICTIONAL show, predictability is what the audience wants. Fans want to see the good guy eventually winning at the end of the arc/storyline. It’s been that way for fucking centuries upon centuries in literature and film. There are very few stories ever that have the bad guy victorious at the end compared to the opposite. It’s the road they take to get there that keeps audiences captivated. This is the problem with the smarks. They are a microwave generation who think because they have access to the web and can check youtube and wikipedia that they “know” these actors/athletes. They present their opinions as facts and believe that they know about wrestling.

They know shit. In fact the only thing they know is how to watch the program incorrectly.

As for the prestige of the titles, well they also need to realize that a winner is a winner. There are titles all over the world (legitimate and scripted) that have holders who many would consider not worthy of the title they possess. In fact none of these idiot smarks know about prestige a wrestler brings to the title until many years later when the wrestler is retired.

Now on to when these jerk-offs use the term buried. I mean this is a word that I see them throw out way too often. Chris Jericho was buried. Daniel Bryan was buried. The Usos are buried. Everyone and anyone that loses an important match is buried. As a business it is not feasible for the company to pay you to do nothing. These characters are roles the wrester fills. This is the EXACT SAME THING as let’s say Harrison Ford playing Indiana Jones. Yes, Daniel Bryan and Chris Jericho can out wrestle just about anyone, but that is not what they are in the WWE for. They are there to play a character to further a storyline. Whether they win or they lose is irrelevant to their careers. They are getting paid to perform live theater stage combat as well as their talents and story allows.

If wrestling popularity were based on their technical skills then people like Arn Anderson, Chavo Guerrero, and Bryan Danielson would be household names.

Their criticism of the WWE or any wrestling in general is profoundly as stupid as they are. They come at all angles nitpicking. Anytime a thought is challenged or an alternative way of looking at something it posed they multiquote it. They multiquote any logical arguments posed at them and think that they are right.

Let me tell you something multiquoters….just because you have around 1,000 posts doesn’t mean jack shit. You are 1,000 posts deep into showing how fucking dumb and irrelevant you are to the discussions you shit all over. Multiquoting shows you don’t have the brain capacity to offer up rational counter arguments. It’s like talking without saying anything. I can pick apart the Constitution of the United States and “show” I’m right and the Constitution is wrong if I can pick it apart line by line instead of taking it and trying to argue against it as a whole.

It’s these people who are the biggest critics of the WWE. If any single one of them ever had a shot at booking or running, they would run the company in the ground faster than a backyard wrestling promoter. It’s these people who poopoo anything unique or any of the rare meaningful swerves that the WWE uses.

It’s these assholes who give the IWC a bad name. They are the cancers of the wrestling forums. Sadly, they are also the most visible.

 

[Arkham Noir]

A mature take on the "we all complain too much" concept.Nice.

We all change the way we perceive things, especially as we age. I found WWE to be more enticing during the attitude era, but I was also nine years old. Life as a whole was more exciting back than.

We all like to bash different aspects of the buisness and some people's opinions change way too fast. \but at the end of the day we're still talking about it.WWE and WCW had massive ratings back in the day, but the truth is that the people who take the time to post on the forums and actually formulate opinions on what's going on are the people who are still around, still watching. Those people actually care and aren't here because of fads or because wrestlings the flavor of the month. I love seeing people get so fired up about the product (still wish some would proof read though ).

All of us will most likely leave wrestling behind eventually, but focus on what you actually enjoy opposed to the bad while your here. You'll enjoy it that much more.

 

[GameOver]

I will never leave it behind it fades in as far as it's impact it once had and the die hardiness i once exhibited (use to know stats as far as the eye could see)

But the love of the occasional entertaining moment is still there and won't die unless they stop producing or i die

WWE always delivers something. period.... It may not always deliver spot after spot like it once did but it still delivers enough to keep people coming back. I don't agree with comments stating they listen to the fans and deliver, thats bogus as has been evident time after time with stupid concepts like the guest hosts

TNA has every opportunity and once in a blue moon they deliver.

Really wish ROH would be shown on cable, i'd watch that too.

 

[Mitch Henessey]

The Attitude Era is dead and gone, and it's not coming back. It's something people seriously need to get over. Did I enjoy the Attitude Era as a kid? Sure I did. I can still remember getting goosebumps went I went to live WWF shows. I literally jumped out of my seat when The Rock's music hit at Armageddon 1999. I also loved Raw(and still do to a certain extent). I used to anxiously sit in front of my TV every Monday night as a kid, because I couldn't wait to hear a Rock promo or see who Stone Cold would stun next. The Attitude Era did give us many historic moments, but I don't think the Attitude Era is as golden as some wrestling fans make it out be. Not every episode of Monday Night Raw or Smackdown was great. There was also a lot shit during that time. There was that disgusting storyline involving Mark Henry and Maye Young, where she gave birth to some sort of mangled fetus. Then there was the whole Katie Vick thing. Yeah, I know WWE has poked fun at this a couple of times, but that was still a very creepy and distasteful storyline. The Attitude Era did provide us with many memorable moments, but the WWE has changed, and it's something people need to accept.

Certain people just LOVE to bitch about the WWE now a days. Some of the stuff I've read on here just makes me scratch my head sometimes. Some people will never be satisfied. People complain when Cena is WWE champion, people complain when Orton is WWE champion, and if Triple H gets anywhere near the WWE Championship, then fans will be ready to riot. Then there are those who come up with these ridiculous "fantasy push" ideas. I don't care what case you try to make, MVP, Ted DiBiase, Matt Hardy, Santino Marellea, and Goldust should not be world champions. Maybe they're stuck in the mid card for a reason? Maybe they're just not that good? But some people refuse to accept it.

Then there are some people who think the PG Era is the worst thing to ever happen to pro wrestling. I've read so much bullshit about how WWE "needs" to bring back the Attitude Era. Why? Did the Attitude Era give us two outstanding Wrestlemania matches between The Undertaker and Shawn Michales? Was Undertaker's streak as popular as it is now? We've also seen some excellent feuds. Shawn Michales VS Chris Jericho and Jeff Hardy VS CM Punk are just a few that I can think of right now. We've also been able to see the rise of the Nexus over these past couple of months. Who could forget their debut? Watching them beat down John Cena(who was WWE Champion at the time) was such a shocking moment. I was there, and I can still remember the feeling of devastation throughout the audience.

Wrestling changes as time goes on, and the Attitude Era is dead. It's not coming back, so everyone needs to move on. I cherish the memories I have of the Attitude Era, but I don't complain about it not being around anymore. Is every Raw, Smackdown, NXT, or Superstars great? No. But as long as WWE can give me a reason to watch their shows and keep me entertained, then I will remain a fan.

 

[mrbooker]

Then there are some people who think the PG Era is the worst thing to ever happen to pro wrestling. I've read so much bullshit about how WWE "needs" to bring back the Attitude Era. Why? Did the Attitude Era give us two outstanding Wrestlemania matches between The Undertaker and Shawn Michales? Was Undertaker's streak as popular as it is now? We've also seen some excellent feuds. Shawn Michales VS Chris Jericho and Jeff Hardy VS CM Punk are just a few that I can think of right now. We've also been able to see the rise of the Nexus over these past couple of months. Who could forget their debut? Watching them beat down John Cena(who was WWE Champion at the time) was such a shocking moment. I was there, and I can still remember the feeling of devastation throughout the audience.

Wrestling changes as time goes on, and the Attitude Era is dead. It's not coming back, so everyone needs to move on. I cherish the memories I have of the Attitude Era, but I don't complain about it not being around anymore. Is every Raw, Smackdown, NXT, or Superstars great? No. But as long as WWE can give me a reason to watch their shows and keep me entertained, then I will remain a fan.

Are you kidding its not about PG or Attitude Taker, HBK, Jericho, CM punk, JEff hardy these are GREAT wrestlers the PG era didnt do shit those guys are simply MEGA Stars so you watched, I have said this a billion times WWE uses their wrestlers as crutches for their horrible storyline. As long as people are watching their mainstays like orton or punk they are happy, just like people were happy to see HBK, Rock, o Austin. Regardless of storyline

You are putting the pistol in your own mouth Nexus was awesome but eveything after that has been a dud, and cena is not going to stayin nexus.

I use to think it was me that maybe im just getting older being 22, but my younger brother is a sophmore in highschool and even he said the WWE is dull and he watches to see Miz and Orton but wishes the WWE would go back to how it use to be when everyone had storylines, and it felt like the roster had variety.

So i throw that im getting older shit out the window, its this simple WWE is losing viewers, losing ppv buys, because people got tired of their shit and rather bank on their magazines, video gamesm and t shirts. Once WWE became a traded stock in the New York stock exchange it has not been the same because it has to worry about peoples investments lots of suites and ties not tights and wrestling boots.

alll these reasons made me switch to TNA they are actually a wrestling company, not a sports entertain business company. The match quality in TNA is superior, and the WWE only + is they have Mega stars that will end in the next 3-4 years, TNA has done far better their first 8 years compared to WWE, and in 3 or 4 years when HHH, jericho, edge, Undertaker, maybe the WWE will smarten up and have some consistent interesting storylines instead of banking on names to bring in viewers

 

[Xan Evans]

I started watching wrestling back in 1986 and like most of you was caught up in the disbelief of wrestling being real. I was into the Hogan Era and into Macho Man, Piper, Snuka, Steamboat and all those guys from back in the day. I stuck through the low points of the early 90's where Bret was being billed as the face of the WWF and they struggled then to get ratings. Do I think the low ratings had anything to do with bad storylines, bad wrestling or horrible gimmick characters, no (though the gimmicks didn't help) for me personally it had to do with all the casual fans that the WWE and more over Hogan brought in during the 80's.

I see the same logic being applied to the whole attitude era having high ratings while the new PG era having such lower ratings. The attitude era IMO brought in about a new form of casual fans, the ones that were into watching south park (when it was new), springer and all those shows on tv at the time which had the same kind of product.

Once those casual fans of the attitude era left (which I think had to do with guys like Austin/Rocky & Foley taking off) the WWE were left with their standard base fans and had to change their product once again to attract new casual fans which at the moment are the kiddies who want to see a superhero wrestler, or a guy who thinks hes a snake and even a 5ft'6 wrestler with a mask on, thats what they like.

Unfortunately in appeasing the new casual fans they are isolating the base fans who have all seen this stuff before, we've been through our PG era, we've been through the superhero character and the good guy always winning and bad guys always losing. We've seen these same old storylines before, which I think also has an effect has to why a lot of people on here who were fans of WWE go to TNA because there is no history with TNA everything is new, even if they have wrestlers from ECWCWWE it's all new to them.

Now in all honestly I dont think every WWE base fan goes to TNA, I mean I still watch and enjoy WWE weekly from RAW, Smackdown and even NXT but I also do watch TNA not to shit on what they do but because its different than WWE to me. Being stationed in Korea like I am, I dont really know if the ratings of military members overseas watching WWE tv actually count but I believe the whole internet generation actually hurt the ratings of both companies, without torrents sites or youtube, I think the ratings for both companies would be a bit higher because people would be forced to find a way to tune into the show to see for themselves whether the show sucked or not.

Now dont get me wrong I fully understand that everything I said could be wrong and am willing to accept it but thats my take on this whole issue.

 

[Mitch Henessey]

Are you kidding its not about PG or Attitude Taker, HBK, Jericho, CM punk, JEff hardy these are GREAT wrestlers the PG era didnt do shit those guys are simply MEGA Stars so you watched, I have said this a billion times WWE uses their wrestlers as crutches for their horrible storyline. As long as people are watching their mainstays like orton or punk they are happy, just like people were happy to see HBK, Rock, o Austin. Regardless of storyline

I really don't know what you're trying to get at here. You don't think the Chris Jericho/Shawn Michaels storyline was great? It was an excellent feud. Jericho was peaking as a heel around this time, and you seriously wanted to hate him. This made you want to root for HBK. You wanted to see him destroy Jericho, especially after he showed no remorse for punching his wife. The Hardy/Punk feud was epic. You had the squeaky clean drug-free and alcohol-free Straight Edge superstar VS the known drug addict and screw up, Jeff Hardy. It's something you could not have scripted any better. Also, I'm a huge fan of Punk's, but I don't think you can mention him in the same breath as Jericho or HBK as far as WWE mainstays go.

As far as the Attitude Era goes, I think watching Stone Cold Steve Austin go up against his evil boss played a big part in getting people to watch back then.

You are putting the pistol in your own mouth Nexus was awesome but eveything after that has been a dud, and cena is not going to stayin nexus.

Nexus did become stale for a while, but having John Cena lose to Wade Barrett has revitalized the Nexus storyline. Did you not see the crowd's reaction at Hell In A Cell? They were in shock when Barrett got the three count. And of course Cena won't stay in Nexus. He will eventually rise up and find a way to free himself from that stable. I don't get how anyone could have a problem with this.

So i throw that im getting older shit out the window, its this simple WWE is losing viewers, losing ppv buys, because people got tired of their shit and rather bank on their magazines, video gamesm and t shirts. Once WWE became a traded stock in the New York stock exchange it has not been the same because it has to worry about peoples investments lots of suites and ties not tights and wrestling boots.

The Raw rating came back up this past week. As far as people buying their merchandise goes...why do you think they're doing it? Maybe it's because they enjoy the current WWE product? Maybe they want to support the WWE?

alll these reasons made me switch to TNA they are actually a wrestling company, not a sports entertain business company. The match quality in TNA is superior, and the WWE only + is they have Mega stars that will end in the next 3-4 years, TNA has done far better their first 8 years compared to WWE, and in 3 or 4 years when HHH, jericho, edge, Undertaker, maybe the WWE will smarten up and have some consistent interesting storylines instead of banking on names to bring in viewers

So because I enjoy the WWE, I'm not a real wrestling fan? Statements like this never cease to amaze me. You obviously haven't been watching Smackdown, because that show usually has a nice set of solid or very good matches every Friday night. Raw can have a few gems every now and then, and Superstars might give us a treat sometimes.

As far as interesting storylines go, did you manage to catch The Miz/Daniel Bryan feud? It's been one of the best feuds of this year, and the match they had at Night Of Champions was easily the best match on the card, and the last time I checked, Miz and Bryan aren't on the same level as far star power goes, especially when you want to talk about guys like Taker, Edge, Jericho, or Triple H.