Is there honestly anyone who was headliner material, but never got the opportunity?

[Creepy Old Man]

Looking for guys who were headliner material in the bigs (WWE or WCW) and were never given "the ball" due to an oversight/backstage politics. I don't know if I can think of any. Jake Roberts, Scott Hall and Raven clearly had the required talent and "it factor" but were plagued by personal demons that likely prevented management from fully trusting them to carry the main event load. Curt Hennig was an unbelievable athlete and screen presence, but was hampered by long-term back problems. Davey Boy Smith got quite a few PPV main events in WWE and WCW, but was (IMO) correctly kept from genuine headliner status due to a lack of charisma. I saw Billy Gunn as Curt Hennig without the personality (ditto Dolph Ziggler). Owen Hart had just turned 34 when he died (Bret didn't get a main event or world title till he was 35; Owen had sporadically main-evented PPVs since age 29), so we can't definitively say he would never have been green-lighted.

What's your take on this?

 

[Papa Pillman]

An interesting, slightly outside-the-box suggestion that I could make is Tony Atlas.

If not for Vince securing Hogan back away from Gagne(and if not for Atlas's own drug problems), I could have seen a scenario where Vince cast Atlas in the Hogan type of role. He had the bodybuilder look that Vince was locked into at the time, had bodybuilding credentials, and could have been sold as the "Mr. USA" super babyface, and the WWF could've had the distinction of crowning the first African American World Champion.

Of course with Vince taking control from his father and forgiving Hogan's decision to do Rocky III, bringing him back into the fold and subsequently gaining from the notoriety Hogan had garnered from that Hollywood decision, there was no need to cast Atlas in a similar role. Yet he could have made a solid IC Champion and even a possible early challenger to Hogan who could likely have been built up to be a more legitimate contender than say Bundy at WMII.

Honorable Mentions: Rude(I'm sure someone will make a case for him in this thread), and a few former Horsemen like Windham and both Brain Busters.

 

[Jonyboyuk2]

Agree with the first poster (creepy old man). They were the first Wrestlers I thought of. But Scott Hall, Jake Roberts, Mr Perfect all had their own demons and could not make it to the final stage. That said; they all had wonderful careers and the fact they never held the world title doesn't paint the full picture of how great all 3 were in their prime.

Scott hall did main event a few PPV's and he made big money at one stage. His run as Razor in WWF was excellent too for its time. Bulldog; he was another who could not control his demons; but he did headline SummerSlam 1992 which was one of the best wrestling main events ever.

Billy Gunn was never a main eventer in my mind; he was suited to being in NAO with Road Dogg. They did not split the right way or they could have both been bigger singles stars than they were.

I do believe eventually Owen would have been WWF champion at some stage. He was a world class wrestler and his main event bouts against Bret Hart were some of legend in 1994.

Rick Rude would be another that should have had a WWF title run. He would have been a great opponent for his friend Bret Hart in 1993 had he been with the WWF. That would have been an excellent SummerSlam 1993 match up.

Dolph Ziggler could still be something special; but they cannot afford any more start/stop pushes with him.

Ricky Steamboat should have been a headliner too - he would also have been a great opponent for Bret Hart in 1993.

Shelton Benjamin; now there is a talent and then some; but he just could not break through that glass ceiling. He was so extraordinarily good at what he did; but he never made it. I have no idea why.

Kofi Kingston should become the sole leader of a bad ass faction. he could bring in some guys from NXT; after he has committed a vile heel turn. He would make a great bad guy if he was allowed to be. I would love to see him terrorise people in a Rumble match and eliminate 6/7 people before being tossed out; and try and avoid landing on his feet before a face turns around and smacks him down on his ass. That would be a spot!!

To be honest; it would be easier to get a list of people who did main event who should not have; Lex Luger, Jeff Jarrett, Bobby Lashley, Bob Backlund (1994 era not the previous ones when he was a great talent), Psycho Sid, Vince Russo, Great Kahli and David Arquette.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

The only two who truly do fit are Rude and Smith.

While COM mentions a "lack of charisma" there wasn't really one... perhaps not as great at mic skills as some others but if you really look back to that 1991-1992 period Davey was the 3rd most over guy behind Hogan and Undertaker.

His height if anything held him back but he had a highly marketable look with the dreadlocks, tights, even Winston... every box was "ticked", once he won the IC title he could have easily moved up and taken the spot Bret ended up getting to take the WWF more "global". Had he not been released, WWF could have been a VERY different entity.

Later on again, he had the skill and was over enough and stong enough to be a heel champ, but his backstage issues probably cost him.

Rude was a bonafide main eventer as proved with his barnstorming US title run. He made that title worth more than the WCW and WWF titles, particularly against Sting and Steamboat. Rude given the nod in 1990 means big changes to how the WWF went, it might have cost them Hogan and Warrior but they'd have gained Hennig into that main event club (The next Heenan family split) and he'd have also helped Bret and Davey come along immensely... He'd also have been a great opponent for face Flair... and could even have tempted Sting over in 1994...

He got his run in WCW with the old NWA title and to most fans he was in the top 3 guys till Hogan showed up and fate intervened... had he not hurt his back, he'd have simply gone back to the WWF... Rude would have headlined 95-96 and helped Nash, Hall, Shawn, Owen... all those guys... Rude is the real "fuck up" WWF has made in 30 years...

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

I'd say Rick Rude and Brian Pillman. In the first case, you could make an argument that he was headlining as the #1 heel in WCW, but quite frankly, he could've been much bigger. He truly got shafted in WWF, and it was to their detriment. Rude was the consummate villain, and while he had a great run with Sting, he could've been headlining against Hogan, Flair, Savage, Hart...virtually anyone who was headlining at that time. He was truly THE missed opportunity.

Pillman was a missed talent, who probably WOULD'VE headlined if not for his accident and then death. He was on his way, it was simply too late. Of course, you could argue that he should've been well on his way to headlining prior to jumping to the WWF. WCW certainly wasted his talents in their unique tunnel vision way. The WWF and McMahon took a lot of crap over time for not pushing the smaller guys, yet no one mentions that WCW did the exact same thing with the sole exception of Ric Flair. If you look at the headliners though, you see the same muscle men and monsters that the WWF would've pushed, but no version of a Bret Hart, Randy Savage or Shawn Michaels amongst the lot. Instead you have Sting, Vader, Luger, Vicious, Hogan...odd given that JCP/WCW's mantra was "We Wrestle" for a time...

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Are we talking about guys who were NEVER headliners anywhere or who just were never headliners in WWE/WWF or WCW?

If it's the former, I'm leaning more towards Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard. They were great as a tag team, both were strong tag team wrestlers and both were strong mid-card singles wrestlers. However, I honestly believe that both of them had the capabilities of being headliners in Mid-Atlantic and the early days of WCW. With a little slight repackaging, I could have seen Anderson as NWA World Heavyweight Champion in the late 80s. I could see him as a tough guy babyface champion whereas Blanchard, I believe, could've been a good heel champion. Both also had good skills on the mic, especially Anderson, and I think they had the ability to rise higher than they ultimately did.

If we're talking about those who never headlined in WWE/WWF or WCW, I think the list gets a little bigger. One of the most obvious is Curt Hennig as he's arguably the best overall talent of the past 25 years to have never been WWF Champion. You also have to add Ted DiBiase to that list as one of the best to have never been WWF Champion, or a World Champion in any organization for that matter. They just happened to come along in the late 80s when Hulk Hogan was still an absolutely massive draw for WWF and, understandably, Vince didn't wanna upset the apple cart. By the time Hogan's star power had started to fade a bit from the glory days of about 1984 to about 1990 or 1991, the bloom was off the rose just a bit for Hennig & DiBiase. I think that Scott Hall & Jake Roberts had the ability, but they had too many personal problems that ultimately weighed them down. There's also debate as to whether or not Ravishing Rick Rude was technically a headliner in WCW as there was that whole mess with the WCW International World Heavyweight Championship. I sort of see the WCW IWHC as something comparable to what the World Heavyweight Championship was in WWE from about 2002 through about 2010. It existed as it's own World Championship separate from the WCW World Heavyweight Championship and was contended for by the likes of Sting and Ric Flair. WWE obviously doesn't consider those reigns as part of WCW continuity, so whether or not Rude was ever a headliner in WCW is somewhat ambiguous.

 

[MCMG]

Owen Hart is a curious one. Not just because he passed away but because he had a lot of talent. He got to show some of it especially during the feud with Bret Hart which produced a couple of classic matches. From that feud with Bret to his death, there probably could have been more done with him. I'm not saying making him the top guy or anything but the WWE went through a massive lull. Hogan was gone and they needed anything. Kevin Nash and Mabel main-evented a fucking PPV for goodness sake.

Sure Owen had title matches and feuds with some of the best of all time but maybe he could have accomplished a bit more before teaming with Jeff Jarrett and becoming the blue blazer.

Curt Henning is another obvious name. The guy was just incredible at everything but, I suppose a bit like Owen, was around at a competitive time in wrestling. He could easily have been the WCW or WWF champion and had a lot of success in the business.

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

Are we talking about guys who were NEVER headliners anywhere or who just were never headliners in WWE/WWF or WCW?

If it's the former, I'm leaning more towards Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard. They were great as a tag team, both were strong tag team wrestlers and both were strong mid-card singles wrestlers. However, I honestly believe that both of them had the capabilities of being headliners in Mid-Atlantic and the early days of WCW. With a little slight repackaging, I could have seen Anderson as NWA World Heavyweight Champion in the late 80s. I could see him as a tough guy babyface champion whereas Blanchard, I believe, could've been a good heel champion. Both also had good skills on the mic, especially Anderson, and I think they had the ability to rise higher than they ultimately did.

I'm somewhat surprised that Anderson never was really given a crack at the title, though this may be my more modern day sensibilities kicking in. Today, a guy like Arn Anderson would've DEFINITELY been thrown into an angle with Flair for the title. It would be too much of a slam dunk the way things are booked today. He wouldn't have to hold it long, but if he were booked as a face for a bit, it would be a great feel good story...the guy who labored for years as the right hand man to the champ but was always overlooked despite his obvious talent, finally gets to hold the gold.

But...back in the 80s and 90s, guys like Anderson just held their spot and did their job. I have a tough time thinking of Arn as a headliner, but honestly, a guy like Harley Race today would probably not be a headliner either. But both of them could GO like nobody's business. I know Arn finally did get to wrestle Flair, but it wasn't with a title on the line, and the feud fell way, way short of expectations. Such was the state of WCW at the time.

 

[dd23beatlesfan1]

This is kind of a confusing topic, as the OP is asking about wrestlers that could've headlined or main evented shows, but never got the opportunity.

Many have already stated some classic examples of "guys that were never world champion, but should've been." But the fact is the majority of those mentioned did get the chance to headline shows, they just didn't win the belt. Big difference. As the challenger to the title is also "headlining" the show, not just the champion.

So in that regard, when we're talking just WWE, Ted Dibiase and Rick Rude both headlined plenty of house shows and even ppv events which were much less common back then. Ted Dibiase headlined Wrestlemania, Summerslam, and the Survivor Series all in 1988, not to mention just about every house show after Wrestlemania that year. He also headlined at Wrestlemania IX (though his match wasn't the main event) with IRS against Hogan and Beefcake. Dibiase headlined plenty of times during his run. And that's just the WWE. That's not counting Mid-South and other territories he wrestled in. Rude didn't headline as many shows in the WWE as Dibiase did, but he did headline Summerslam 90 and I would imagine plenty of house shows in 1990 against Warrior as champ. And beings in the late 80's it was common to have multiple house shows in the same day in different areas, I'm sure Rude and Warrior were headlining house shows in 1989 with the I-C title being the main event while Hogan was headlining other shows as the WWF Champion. And of course Rick Rude headlined plenty of shows in WCW and probably some in WCCW before he went to WWE. So even though Rude never won the WWF Championship, he still was a featured main eventer throughout his run.

Curt Hennig, is another popular example, but again, he headlined house shows against Hogan in 1989/early 1990, not to mention being the headliner for AWA shows during his run as champion. And it wouldn't surprise me if headlined house shows when he was the I-C champion.

Scott Hall headlined some shows when he was in the NWO in WCW, although that's not as strong of a case as the previous three as he wasn't challenging for the world title and was teaming with other headliners.

And before anyone mentions Roddy Piper, he headlined tons of shows with Hogan during their feud in 84/85.


I think the best example I saw was Shelton Benjamin as he was a very talented wrestler that literally never got to main event any ppv events or even house shows. He did main event against Triple H a few times on Raw in 2004, but he wasn't really a bona-fide headliner.


I think today Dolph Ziggler is probably that guy that belongs in the category. He's a super talent that has barely tasted the main event at all and he's been with WWE for 8 years now. Hopefully his time will come eventually, or he could end up being the perfect answer for this question.

 

[dd23beatlesfan1]

Jake Roberts is actually probably the best answer to the question as he truly never did headline any shows. His feud was usually among the hottest in the company, but his feud was always the second or third most featured feud/match on the shows. I believe he did main event against Sting at Halloween Havoc 92, but that's his only main event match that I can recall. But his drug issues were a problem, though only later in his career. Jake was still pretty trustworthy and dependable during his run in the late 80's and very early 90's, even though he was starting to have problems with drugs at this time.

 

[HeroForHire]

Two guys who should have been on the top was Razor Ramon and Curt Henning. I understand their own problems is what stopped them from getting there.

One of my favorite matches was Razor Ramon Vs Diesel for the IC belt at the 94 Summerslam. Razor had Walter Payton in his corner in Chi-Town. The crowd blew up when Razor's music hit. He was so over it was crazy.

Mr. Perfect was such a great gimmick, and I think given a World title run would have enhanced the gimmick so much more. He would have been a great heel champion.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Jake Roberts is actually probably the best answer to the question as he truly never did headline any shows. His feud was usually among the hottest in the company, but his feud was always the second or third most featured feud/match on the shows. I believe he did main event against Sting at Halloween Havoc 92, but that's his only main event match that I can recall. But his drug issues were a problem, though only later in his career. Jake was still pretty trustworthy and dependable during his run in the late 80's and very early 90's, even though he was starting to have problems with drugs at this time.

Jake reached his appropriate level in the WWF, he was part of the group that didn't "need" titles or who having one would have taken away from what was getting them over. Some shit on this idea but it really is true when you think about it. Jake was over because he had great "psychology", a great promo and a snake in a bag... the crowd only really got or cared about the latter 90% of the time.

Jake was not "fantastic" in the ring, in many ways he was the Cena of his time, he had 5 moves in the main...his combo punches,kneelift, short clothesline, kneedrop and DDT and he stuck to them. He also had the sitting in the corner, the pointing and most importantly post match the snake reveal... a title would have taken those away for time... he couldn't sit in the corner at the start of the match and parade the belt... likewise he couldn't parade the belt after a win AND use Damien... it was either or and Jake's overness and "money shot" was Damien, so he never got a title and it wouldn't have worked if he had. Others like Bossman with the nightstick/policeman gimmick... a cop with a belt would look dumb...

Anderson is an interesting one... he had the tools to be the champ and to headline but his look perhaps was 7 years too early... basically he had what Austin had, trunks, goatee, rugged bad ass attitude...basically "no gimmick needed".

You could argue people weren't quite ready for that at the time.. for someone like that to be the "top guy"... They'd kind of seen it with Garvin and it didn't work. Arn was a bit like Windham, better as the sidekick than the actual man, in Barry's case he was too into the partying side to take his career too seriously...in Arn's he was perhaps that little bit "too" serious. Bret for example at least wore the pink and the shades... he was serious, but had a "look" that set him apart... Arn and Barry didn't so much.

The other thing that probably stopped a lot of guys was loyalty... Arn to Flair, Scott Steiner (in his WWF days) to Rick, Jacques to Raymond and Hawk to Animal... Arn going solo in his WWF stint would have worked, but he was too friendly with Flair, Tully to ever make that work and go solo... Scott was offered the chance in 94 but wanted to stay with Rick and Jacques waited probably 2 years too long for the Mountie gimmick, till Raymond had retired... had he been The Mountie in 1989, he could have been a serious main eventer.

 

[Creepy Old Man]

A lot of people have mentioned Rick Rude, but I never included him in my original post because I saw him as having reached the top down south. Same for Ricky Steamboat. Maybe I'm off the mark there, but certainly, tremendous performers.

 

[SCrooked1]

Rude did headline in '90 but he wasn't really being pushed like a main eventer. He lost by pinfall to Warrior at every house show and Warrior easily handled him in the SNME match and the Summerslam cage match. The real main event during that time was Hogan/Earthquake and I think this along w/ Rude still being treated like a midcarder were why Rude/Warrior didn't set the box office on fire.

 

[JoshRP81]

I think Jake definitely would've main evented at least one program with Hogan if it hadn't been for crowd reaction. He talked in his DVD about them testing it out at a house show our something, and when Jake flattened him, instead of the crowd going "no Jake how could you etc etc," they start chanting Ddt Ddt.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Maybe there was an element of Hogan protection but for Jake to do the stuff he did best, it wouldn't have flown in the main event scene. He was the guy people faced before Hogan to get the required heat, or more often after Hogan to keep their heat and value... as many have called it... "The guy who works with the next or last guy"... rather than "the guy" himself.

Hogan was not losing or facing anyone who could even touch his popularity, but don't feel bad for Jake... he made tonnes of cash and had a GREAT spot which he blew himself. Rude didn't really get that chance and was far more deserving and better equipped to succeed in that role.

Someone like Hennig, you could argue, like Magnum TA didn't get their chance, so you'd never know...but if Austin could still do it with his neck problem, Hennig could have... but he was more concerned on collecting on his Lloyds policy than actually making the money in the ring.

Hawk from LOD is another I half mentioned.. there was a time where he REALLY could have taken off as a solo guy... had he stayed in the WWF once Animal was hurt... Hawk in the WWF in 1993-4 as a singles guy could have done some great things.

 

[whoopin' ass]

Lots. If Owen was still wrestling when Bret got hurt, I think he would have been given a push. Instead of trying to promote his Hart as the best out of the 2 companies, Vince did what he did and it was dumb. I think Ken Shamrock could have been if they used him better. He was a legit bad ass, they could have made him a corporate champ somewhere along the way to screw with Austin. I think his style might have been an issue but I would have bought him as champ.

 

[Charismatic Enigma]

Well, I suppose the first question to ask is what qualifies as a "headliner"? Because there are guys who've main-evented shows and PPVs that have never even sniffed the world title, and there are others like Roddy Piper who technically headlined WrestleMania but in my mind, is on a similar pedestal to guys such as Jake Roberts, Ted Dibiase, Rick Rude, Perfect, Davey Boy, etc. who are all well known, respected figures, with lengthy runs, but not necessarily what I would classify as a headliner, and that perception largely comes as a result of having never carried the title.

Then again, I ask what makes a headliner? Is it size, is it charisma, a combination of the two? And what about the era you wrestled in? In the '80s a guy like Rey Mysterio wouldn't have come within a mile of winning the title. So is he a product of his era? His move set and ring gear are flashy, but does he really have charisma? He's not much of a talker, and he certainly doesn't have the size. Yet, for a time I would've considered him a headliner. Which I guess would mean you don't really need to be a total package, you just need to be a product of right place/right time, and good booking. Size and charisma could help get you there faster, but depending on extenuating circumstances like roster depth, you may not even need those.

With all that in mind:

Charles Wright aka: Papa Shango/Kama/Godfather. With the right booking, I could see it, in the cartoony early '90s Shango could've beaten Hogan or Warrior. As Kama he certainly had an imposing look. Godfather not so much, but the attitude era had crazy booking, so I could've just easily seen it there too, he was very over.

Ken Shamrock: Like so many guys in his time, he was really a victim of circumstance. Without the explosive careers of Rock, Austin, HHH, and Foley, perhaps there would've been more room for him at the top. He certainly had the look, and in-ring ability.

Hardcore Holly: With a nearly two decade run in the company, and respect in the back, clearly there was something there. He had the size, probably could've tweaked the look a bit, but with the right booking around 2002-2005, while the current crop of stars were just beginning to get their footing, and the attitude era stars all on their way out, I easily could've seen the stars aligning to give Holly a brief run at the top.

 

[wrestler36]

He's been overshadowed by his gimmick, but at 20+ years in the business, I think it's very easy to forget how good Goldust is. In his mid 40s now and at 6'6, most that size would be in the twilight of their career, if not retired. He's in the best shape of his life and probably wrestling better than ever now. But wrestling wise, charisma wise, and longevity wise, I'm surprised he's never held the big title in either organization.

 

[MMA Mark]

Muhammad Hassan will always be a huge 'what if' to me. He was right on the cusp, feuding with Taker before that controversy ended his career, through no fault of his own. Unfortunate he decided to retire after that.

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

I always thought that Raven could have made it big in the industry. Raven was involved in two of the biggest feuds in ECW against Sandman and Dreamer and did good work in WCW as well with his flock. Even in ROH, he had a great feud with Punk which formed the basis for the latter's feud with Jeff.

Raven really knew how to cut a promo to get the audience interested in a storyline. He is probably the best promo guy never to win a major title. In the ring too, he could get the job done. In WCW, he had a shot had they been a sane organisation that pushed young talent. In WWE, they just went with him being hardcore and never gave him the opportunity to have a long feud with anyone. He had no character there. Hell, a feud with Undertaker or even Kane would have really elevated him.

But I think he can still contribute to the industry in some manner if he wants to. If I were in the WWE, I'd have him as a trainer or perhaps even in the booking team. I'm pretty sure that he had some input in his feuds with Dreamer, Sandman and Punk, so he can't be too bad at writing this stuff.

EDIT: Also, the guy has an IQ of 143. So he can't be all that bad at this stuff.

 

[CMZombie]

An out of the box one and not someone who is in the same ballpark as some of the legends mentioned here but someone who.. maybe??

Vampiro

He was getting quite big in WCW when it went belly up and I always thought he should have done better. He did eventually make quite a name for himself in Mexico after stints in NJPW and TNA.

 

[SCrooked1]

Maybe there was an element of Hogan protection but for Jake to do the stuff he did best, it wouldn't have flown in the main event scene. He was the guy people faced before Hogan to get the required heat, or more often after Hogan to keep their heat and value... as many have called it... "The guy who works with the next or last guy"... rather than "the guy" himself.

Hogan was not losing or facing anyone who could even touch his popularity, but don't feel bad for Jake... he made tonnes of cash and had a GREAT spot which he blew himself. Rude didn't really get that chance and was far more deserving and better equipped to succeed in that role.

Someone like Hennig, you could argue, like Magnum TA didn't get their chance, so you'd never know...but if Austin could still do it with his neck problem, Hennig could have... but he was more concerned on collecting on his Lloyds policy than actually making the money in the ring.

Hawk from LOD is another I half mentioned.. there was a time where he REALLY could have taken off as a solo guy... had he stayed in the WWF once Animal was hurt... Hawk in the WWF in 1993-4 as a singles guy could have done some great things.

Ultimate Warrior

But then again Hogan made sure that Warrior didn't succeed as champion by doing the injury angle w/ Earthquake and having the focus for the rest of the year being put on him.

And people say Hogan "took a backseat" that year, sure.

 

[justtxyank]

An out of the box one and not someone who is in the same ballpark as some of the legends mentioned here but someone who.. maybe??

Vampiro

He was getting quite big in WCW when it went belly up and I always thought he should have done better. He did eventually make quite a name for himself in Mexico after stints in NJPW and TNA.

Eventually? He had made a name for himself in Mexico before he ever turned up in WCW. He debuted in Mexico in 1990 or so and was a pretty big mainstream star during the early to mid 1990s.

He was a pretty big factor in WCW at the end, but personally I was never convinced he was good enough for a main event spot.

 

[TOM93BITW]

I personally felt John Morrison could have been a headliner if he had been given the chance, I liked how he incorporated his parkour skills into his matches and he had great charisma aswell. He could've been one of those guys who worked well as both a heel and a face.