Hulk Hogan vs John Cena: The Comparison

[PSachkovsky]

This thread is to discuss the fact that people keep claiming that John Cena is the modern-day Hulk Hogan. I want to sum it up to few questions, and I would ask everyone not to argue or bad mouth each other, it is just a discussion and let's discuss like adults.

We both know that John Cena and Hulk Hogan had a lot of impact on professional wrestling, and also became very popular outside of the the wrestling ring. Both became actors, and John Cena even became a singer for a short while.

So let's see the differences:

vs

Biographies:

Real Name:
John Felix Cena
Ring Name:
John Cena, The Prototype
D.O.B:
April 23, 1977
Trained by:
Ultimate Pro Wrestling
Ohio Valley Wrestling
Debut:
2001

Championships and Accomplishments:

Ohio Valley Wrestling
Heavyweight Championship - 1 time
Southern Tag Team Champion - 1 time

Ultimate Pro Wrestling
Heavyweight Champion - 1 time

World Wrestling Entertainment
World Heavyweight Champion - 2 times
World Tag Team Champion - 2 times
WWE Champion - 10 times
WWE Tag Team Champion - 2 times
WWE United States Champion - 3 times

Real Name:
Terry Gene Bollea

Ring Names:
The Super Destroyer
Hulk Hogan
Hollywood Hulk Hogan
Hollywood Hogan
Terry Boulder
Mr. America
Sterling Golden
D.O.B:
August 11, 1953
Trained By:
Hiro Matsuda
Debut:
August 10, 1977

Championships and Accomplishments:

New Japan Pro Wrestling
IWGP League Tournament - 1983
MSG Tag League Tournament - 1982, 1983

Southeastern Championship Wrestling
Heavyweight Champion - 3 times

World Championship Wrestling
World Heavyweight Champion - 6 times

World Wrestling Entertainment
World Tag Team Champion - 1 time
WWF/E Champion - 6 times
Royal Rumble Winner - 1990, 1991
WWE Hall of Fame - 2005

Questions for discussion:

1. Who in your opinion had more impact on the WWE?
2. Who in your opinion had more impact on the wrestling community?
3. Who is your favorite among this two?
4. Was Hulk Hogan's run in the 80s WWE any different from John Cena's run in the 2000s and 2010s?
5. What are the differences between Hogan and Cena?
6. What, in your opinion, is the reason John Cena is not loved by fans like Hulk Hogan did in the 80s?
7. Who do you like more, and why?
8. Will John Cena turning heel make an impact like Hulk Hogan turning heel back in the 90s?
9. Few words of your own, to sum up this discussion.

 

[IT Factor]

Answers;

1}I think Hulk Hogan was without a doubt the biggest icon WWE had ever seen when he got started. With all he accomplished, I believe most fans and wrestlers respect him and he's wrestling's first worldwide global superstar. I dare you to ask anyone who Hulk Hogan is and they'll respond "that wrestler guy". Even non-wrestling fans know who he is. I don't think Cena would be the same. Alot of people would say John Who?

2}Both stars have had their own contributions to their respective eras in wrestling. You can't overlook either one in that area.

3}Growing up in the 80s/90s, I'd definetely say I'm a bigger fan of Hulk Hogan than of Cena. Although I do respect all that Cena does for WWE. He's also a big Make-A-Wish contributor, which I think most fans would have to respect him for if only for that one thing alone.

4}Most definetely yes. Hogan's era was way different. Back then, they wrestled more shows and had less time off. That means all the different territories and locations got to see more of Hogan than most get to see of Cena. Look at the reactions Hogan was still getting in WWF and even early WCW. He had never been a heel before. Then, compare that to Cena and how he gets mixed reactions now. Different time and eras, which means their runs would obviously be different.

5}Image. Hogan is all-American and straight up good guy[even when he was heel, people still cheered him somewhat]. Cena was the thug rapper guy who became household and changed. Size is another difference, obviously. Their approaches to business is another big difference. You've never seen any rumors about Cena being difficult to work with or refusing to job.

6}The crowds are smarter. If this were the 80s and Cena had the similar gimmick to Hogan, they would've loved him just as much. As Hogan would've been different in this era. I don't think Hulkamania would've been forced upon the WWE Universe quite as long if it had existed in current era WWE.

7}Both guys have earned my respect as a fan. Although the nostalgia effect is definetely on Hogan's side.

8}Unless WWE drops being PG and starts being more realistic, I doubt Cena will ever turn. That's another major difference between Hogan & Cena. Hogan had a successful heel run and Cena has yet to have one on that level.

9}Common, typical. Considering both guys are/were faces of WWF/WWE in different eras. Obviously, people will make their comparisions although I believe there's more differences than similarities.

 

[braveh]

Cena was someone they had to push to get him over. JBL jobbed for Cena for a year, then it was HHH. I think in late 2005 some crowds were still booing Cena when he was the official babyface.

I don't know exactly how Hogan had his breakthrough but I imagine it was like Steve Austin in that just took off. It was planned like that.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Cena was someone they had to push to get him over. JBL jobbed for Cena for a year, then it was HHH. I think in late 2005 some crowds were still booing Cena when he was the official babyface.

I don't know exactly how Hogan had his breakthrough but I imagine it was like Steve Austin in that just took off. It was planned like that.

That's such a crock of shit. Ooooo, JBL jobbed to Cena. Holy shit guys jobbing to you get you over. I mean, Shelton Benjamin is a HUGE star after beating HHH and HBK....

Cena gets booed because he stirs an emotion. RVD, Samoa Joe, CM Punk, Ric Flair, Terry Funk, and Harley Race have all said he's good in the ring. The audience isn't uniform, you get boos and cheers from different demographics, if anything, Cena gets more emotion from a wider range of people than anyone else.

WWE didn't HAVE to push Cena to get him over. that's not how it works and you sound like a "shit in the bathtub" level ****** for saying it. Think about this smart guy, if all it took to get a guy over was to push him, and a guy getting over makes the WWE money, and the WWE wants to make money, wouldn't they fucking push everyone and wouldn't EVERYONE be over?

O wait, this is the IWC argument that Vince masterbates to muscular guys and only wants them to get over and hates it when guys like Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Chris Jericho, Steve Austin, or Eddie Guerrero get over and make him money.


Here are the differences.

Hogan, changed the landscape, was pushed a lot, got over a lot. Had a uniform audience to work to. Didn't have to bump very much because a majority of matches back then were squashes.

Cena, changed the landscape, was pushed a lot, got over a lot. Has an incredibly diverse audience to work too. Bumps a LOT because fans today are cynical and don't believe anything hurts and because at least once a month you are either blowing off a feud or you are continuing one.

This is a lot more subjective, but I think Cena's in ring psychology is a LOT better than Hogan's. Hogan was a million times better than move counters and spot marks give him credit for. Shit like doing stuff slower and looking to the crowd, really reaching back and punching "up" at taller guys.

Cena is just on a different level than most guys in terms of ring psychology. I think Bryan Alvarez or maybe even Meltzer was one of the first mainstream smarks to point that out so I'm not taking credit on how awesome Cena's in ring work is once you get passed the teenage girl cruch on the cast of Twilight-level love affiar many have with MOVEZ and WURKRATEZ. Just think about the variety.
vs HBK
vs JBL
vs Rock (perfectly worked super hyped-type match)
vs Jericho
vs Umaga

Hell, even Cena's work vs Khali had some pretty good stuff. He hits Khali 4 times then sells one hit by Khali like death to get over how big Khali is. He beats Khali with the STFU because that makes the most sense since that's not where Khali is used to being. The match is fairly short because otherwise Cena's character would be demolished.

Cena is smart. He works everyone. If you boo him, he wants you to boo him. He knows you'll keep showing up, keep making signs, keep booing. The other audience members will just cheer louder and make more signs. Before you know it, the whole arena is passionately making noise. Notice during Cena matches, fans rarely chant anything about the other guy.

It baffles me how dumb some Cena haters are. It seems like the majority of net wrestling fans realize this. Still some stragglers hanging onto the idea that they aren't being worked.

I guess at the end of the day I'd say that Hogan had an easier job. WWF was really the only show in town. Pioneering on national TV, no precedent (which is kinda hard), a uniform audience that was easy to predict. Cena is the man after most of this generation's favorite era. He has to perform in a PG setting (which is a HUGE advantage Rock and Austin and really, the whole Tude era had, take away the boobs, blood, cussing, and what do you have?), he has a diverse audience, and the WWE competes with 500 channels every night as well as online viewers and more and more phone/iPad viewers.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

and through all that ranting, I forgot the questions.

1. Who in your opinion had more impact on the WWE? Hogan, without him, nothing else exists. Then again, without Cena, WWE might not be as big today. Hogan came first though so obviously, he had a bigger impact.
2. Who in your opinion had more impact on the wrestling community? Cena. Hogan had a bigger impact on the non wrestling fans, Cena is a guy who stirs more real emotion in an era where that is hard to do. Hogan, believe it or not, wasn't very liked in the southern territories because they were a "rasslin" area. Cena gets everyone to show up and make noise. Nobody will outdraw Cena anywhere. I bet Flair would outdraw Hogan in certain southern states in the 80s. Cena also is more talked about by a wider variety of wrestling fans. He makes people think. He's certainly made me a smarter fan. Eventually I thought "wait, I say I hate this guy, but I watch him more intently than anyone else, kinda like Hogan in the nWo when I was a kid, hmmm, I think he's working me".
3. Who is your favorite among this two? Cena. I respect them both equally as a performer, but Cena more as a person.
4. Was Hulk Hogan's run in the 80s WWE any different from John Cena's run in the 2000s and 2010s? Yes, he had it easier. Probably wrestled more, but let's face it, Hogan didn't bump and most of the matches were squashes. Cena wrestles less, but wrestles harder and has more extra curricular stuff.
5. What are the differences between Hogan and Cena? Cena appeals to a wider variety of fan and at a much deeper level. People cheered Hogan, and certain demographics would cry if he lost. Right now, certain demographics cry if Cena loses, certain demographics also cry if he wins. Pretty incredible.
6. What, in your opinion, is the reason John Cena is not loved by fans like Hulk Hogan did in the 80s? He is. People love to hate Cena. If you are an adult in 2012, you like the anti-hero. It's not cool to like the whitemeat babyface. It's not cool in wrestling, it's not cool in movies. More people dress up like the Joker than Batman. Essentially, Cena is a babyface to some demographics, and a heel to others. He's not a tweener, it's just that with a diverse demographic, that's what happens.
7. Who do you like more, and why? Cena, for reasons already stated.
8. Will John Cena turning heel make an impact like Hulk Hogan turning heel back in the 90s? No. The audience was uniform back then. If Cena turns heel, it'll just be an inverse reaction. No earth shattering change.
9. Few words of your own, to sum up this discussion.


People love to hate on both because people (stupidly) think it was all push that got them over. People also love to hate on both because neither (well, Hogan) has a huge moveset. If you pay attention and actually think, they both do some pretty intelligent things in the ring to get over. I don't remember who said it, maybe Lawler? He said "if you have two guys, one needs 100 moves to get over, the other needs 1, the guy that needed one is better because he understands the crowd". That, in a nutshell, is my philosophy. Some guys tell the same story over and over again with 100 moves. Cena, and to a much lesser extent, Hogan, can tell a greater story with less moves and more emotion and little details.

 

[ProWrestlingFan]

That's such a crock of shit. Ooooo, JBL jobbed to Cena. Holy shit guys jobbing to you get you over. I mean, Shelton Benjamin is a HUGE star after beating HHH and HBK....

Cena gets booed because he stirs an emotion. RVD, Samoa Joe, CM Punk, Ric Flair, Terry Funk, and Harley Race have all said he's good in the ring. The audience isn't uniform, you get boos and cheers from different demographics, if anything, Cena gets more emotion from a wider range of people than anyone else.

WWE didn't HAVE to push Cena to get him over. that's not how it works and you sound like a "shit in the bathtub" level ****** for saying it. Think about this smart guy, if all it took to get a guy over was to push him, and a guy getting over makes the WWE money, and the WWE wants to make money, wouldn't they fucking push everyone and wouldn't EVERYONE be over?

O wait, this is the IWC argument that Vince masterbates to muscular guys and only wants them to get over and hates it when guys like Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Chris Jericho, Steve Austin, or Eddie Guerrero get over and make him money.


Here are the differences.

Hogan, changed the landscape, was pushed a lot, got over a lot. Had a uniform audience to work to. Didn't have to bump very much because a majority of matches back then were squashes.

Cena, changed the landscape, was pushed a lot, got over a lot. Has an incredibly diverse audience to work too. Bumps a LOT because fans today are cynical and don't believe anything hurts and because at least once a month you are either blowing off a feud or you are continuing one.

This is a lot more subjective, but I think Cena's in ring psychology is a LOT better than Hogan's. Hogan was a million times better than move counters and spot marks give him credit for. Shit like doing stuff slower and looking to the crowd, really reaching back and punching "up" at taller guys.

Cena is just on a different level than most guys in terms of ring psychology. I think Bryan Alvarez or maybe even Meltzer was one of the first mainstream smarks to point that out so I'm not taking credit on how awesome Cena's in ring work is once you get passed the teenage girl cruch on the cast of Twilight-level love affiar many have with MOVEZ and WURKRATEZ. Just think about the variety.
vs HBK
vs JBL
vs Rock (perfectly worked super hyped-type match)
vs Jericho
vs Umaga

Hell, even Cena's work vs Khali had some pretty good stuff. He hits Khali 4 times then sells one hit by Khali like death to get over how big Khali is. He beats Khali with the STFU because that makes the most sense since that's not where Khali is used to being. The match is fairly short because otherwise Cena's character would be demolished.

Cena is smart. He works everyone. If you boo him, he wants you to boo him. He knows you'll keep showing up, keep making signs, keep booing. The other audience members will just cheer louder and make more signs. Before you know it, the whole arena is passionately making noise. Notice during Cena matches, fans rarely chant anything about the other guy.

It baffles me how dumb some Cena haters are. It seems like the majority of net wrestling fans realize this. Still some stragglers hanging onto the idea that they aren't being worked.

I guess at the end of the day I'd say that Hogan had an easier job. WWF was really the only show in town. Pioneering on national TV, no precedent (which is kinda hard), a uniform audience that was easy to predict. Cena is the man after most of this generation's favorite era. He has to perform in a PG setting (which is a HUGE advantage Rock and Austin and really, the whole Tude era had, take away the boobs, blood, cussing, and what do you have?), he has a diverse audience, and the WWE competes with 500 channels every night as well as online viewers and more and more phone/iPad viewers.

First of all you are one of those dumbasses who buy into the shit WWE makes Michael Cole say...

"OH John Cena is the most "Controversial" superstar ever. John Cena generates more emotion from the fans than any other WWE superstars "

Thats bullshit.

So getting booed and cheered makes you controversial ? All superstars generated emotion. Look at the crowd pops Rock and Austin got even HHH when he was a heel. Cena's pops are half of what they got. And when you are getting cheered as the top babyface you are not doing your job good. People never hated Hulk Hogan this way until he turned heel in WCW.

You see...when they say all this shit up you buy into that. Ever heard any commentator saying this during the eras of Hulk Hogan, Bret Hart, Steve Austin, The Rock, HHH ? NO. They didn't have to say that to get them over or to force fans to like Cena. WWE just wants all fans to like Cena, which is kind of working as some people like you buying into all the shit the commentators say.

 

[braveh]

That's such a crock of shit. Ooooo, JBL jobbed to Cena. Holy shit guys jobbing to you get you over. I mean, Shelton Benjamin is a HUGE star after beating HHH and HBK....

Cena gets booed because he stirs an emotion. RVD, Samoa Joe, CM Punk, Ric Flair, Terry Funk, and Harley Race have all said he's good in the ring. The audience isn't uniform, you get boos and cheers from different demographics, if anything, Cena gets more emotion from a wider range of people than anyone else.

WWE didn't HAVE to push Cena to get him over. that's not how it works and you sound like a "shit in the bathtub" level ****** for saying it. Think about this smart guy, if all it took to get a guy over was to push him, and a guy getting over makes the WWE money, and the WWE wants to make money, wouldn't they fucking push everyone and wouldn't EVERYONE be over?

O wait, this is the IWC argument that Vince masterbates to muscular guys and only wants them to get over and hates it when guys like Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Chris Jericho, Steve Austin, or Eddie Guerrero get over and make him money.


Here are the differences.

Hogan, changed the landscape, was pushed a lot, got over a lot. Had a uniform audience to work to. Didn't have to bump very much because a majority of matches back then were squashes.

Cena, changed the landscape, was pushed a lot, got over a lot. Has an incredibly diverse audience to work too. Bumps a LOT because fans today are cynical and don't believe anything hurts and because at least once a month you are either blowing off a feud or you are continuing one.

This is a lot more subjective, but I think Cena's in ring psychology is a LOT better than Hogan's. Hogan was a million times better than move counters and spot marks give him credit for. Shit like doing stuff slower and looking to the crowd, really reaching back and punching "up" at taller guys.

Cena is just on a different level than most guys in terms of ring psychology. I think Bryan Alvarez or maybe even Meltzer was one of the first mainstream smarks to point that out so I'm not taking credit on how awesome Cena's in ring work is once you get passed the teenage girl cruch on the cast of Twilight-level love affiar many have with MOVEZ and WURKRATEZ. Just think about the variety.
vs HBK
vs JBL
vs Rock (perfectly worked super hyped-type match)
vs Jericho
vs Umaga

Hell, even Cena's work vs Khali had some pretty good stuff. He hits Khali 4 times then sells one hit by Khali like death to get over how big Khali is. He beats Khali with the STFU because that makes the most sense since that's not where Khali is used to being. The match is fairly short because otherwise Cena's character would be demolished.

Cena is smart. He works everyone. If you boo him, he wants you to boo him. He knows you'll keep showing up, keep making signs, keep booing. The other audience members will just cheer louder and make more signs. Before you know it, the whole arena is passionately making noise. Notice during Cena matches, fans rarely chant anything about the other guy.

It baffles me how dumb some Cena haters are. It seems like the majority of net wrestling fans realize this. Still some stragglers hanging onto the idea that they aren't being worked.

I guess at the end of the day I'd say that Hogan had an easier job. WWF was really the only show in town. Pioneering on national TV, no precedent (which is kinda hard), a uniform audience that was easy to predict. Cena is the man after most of this generation's favorite era. He has to perform in a PG setting (which is a HUGE advantage Rock and Austin and really, the whole Tude era had, take away the boobs, blood, cussing, and what do you have?), he has a diverse audience, and the WWE competes with 500 channels every night as well as online viewers and more and more phone/iPad viewers.

That is a very hateful post. You biggest fault is that you think that I'm a Cena hater. I'm not, I respect Cena ahelluva lot more than I respect Punk and Daniel Bryan.

This is my impression, I watched most of Cena's appearances back in 2004 and 2005, and I followed some of the backstage stuff. It's my impression that Cena was given a golden push. They created pefect angles for Cena with JBL, but when he went Raw and HHH started jobbing to him that is what really stands out to me.

Cena had a little bit of rocky road where as someone like Austin just took off. And I remember reading in 2005 that inside sources said top people inside the WWE were concerned with crowd reactions to Cena when he was supposed to be the over babyface.

Credit where credit is due: when Cena took off in 2006 it was like nothing else. That will be legacy, those years of popularity.
´
And I remember reading in 2005 that inside sources said top people inside the WWE were conncerned with crowd reactions to Cena when he was suppposed to

I've read a few stories on Hogan's breakthrough and seems more similar to Austin's story than Cena's.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

First of all you are one of those dumbasses who buy into the shit WWE makes Michael Cole say...

"OH John Cena is the most "Controversial" superstar ever. John Cena generates more emotion from the fans than any other WWE superstars "

Thats bullshit.

So getting booed and cheered makes you controversial ? All superstars generated emotion. Look at the crowd pops Rock and Austin got even HHH when he was a heel. Cena's pops are half of what they got. And when you are getting cheered as the top babyface you are not doing your job good. People never hated Hulk Hogan this way until he turned heel in WCW.

You see...when they say all this shit up you buy into that. Ever heard any commentator saying this during the eras of Hulk Hogan, Bret Hart, Steve Austin, The Rock, HHH ? NO. They didn't have to say that to get them over or to force fans to like Cena. WWE just wants all fans to like Cena, which is kind of working as some people like you buying into all the shit the commentators say.

I don't buy into anything, including what the IWC tells me to think.

Getting booed doesn't make Cena controversial, it just means that an all american babyface is a heel to the adults (the anti-hero generation as I call them). How hard is that to imagine.

If people really dislike Cena in a "get off my TV way" then explain it.

Either:
A) they love to hate him
B) they are stupid and buy tickets to see someone they hate, spend countless hours on the internet bitching about something they hate, take the time and energy to make a sign about something they hate, take the time and energy to boo something they hate when they paid a ticket to be there

So which is it? After 7 years, do people just love paying for shit they hate? I mean, I don't go on to Real Housewives message boards and bitch, I don't watch the show, I don't go to Real Housewives conventions and boo. So either people love to hate him, or they're too fucking stupid to not spend time, money, and energy hating him.

Cena is a HEEL to some. "BUT HE ACTS LIKE A BABYFACE!!!" No, he acts like a heel. It's all perception. If the perception is that being an all american babyface is a bad thing, then that makes him a heel. He is a heel to some, a face to others, the demographic isn't uniform.

You have such an archaic understanding of pro wrestling. When Hogan, Rock, and Austin were at the top, the audience was basically uniform. One action would make you a face or a heel and the audience agreed on it. Now, the audience doesn't agree. Some thing one thing makes you a heel, others think it makes you a face. It's not a tweener, it's more like real life, I hate LeBron, some love him. It is what it is.

I'm smarter than you. I'm not buying into what the WWE says. I'm not buying into this ignorant IWC groupthink either. I see things how they are. WWE doesn't care that people boo him. They don't want everyone to cheer him. Everyone cheering him is BORING. Having a mixed reaction, where everyone is 100% feelign an emotion is much better than any standard reaction.

Also, Cena gets as loud of pops as anyone. Punk vs Cena at MITB was a more electic atmospher for more true emotion than any other match I can recall.

I think maybe you should stop buying into the IWC bullshit and start thinking on your own. I don't like Cena because he's a good guy. I don't like Cena because he "always wins". I like Cena because he gets the IWC to hate him and they keep watching, and they keep buying tickets, and they keep making signs, and they keep going to events, and they keep spending time and energy bitching about him and then some (dying trend) still don't think he's been working them.

People like you are becoming more and more of a minority. Bryan Alvarez in 2008 said that "if you think Cena can't wrestle, you lose credibility". RVD, CM Punk, Samoa Joe, Terry Funk, Harley Race, and Ric Flair have all said that he's pretty good in the ring. So that excuse that "he can't wrestle" has been discredited a long time now.

Now more and more people are seeing the character for what it really is. It's John Cena. You love him, you hate him, whatever, you feel emotion. If you hate him, you probably hate him like a heel. I know big smart IWC guys like you don't feel like you can be worked, but he does it, and it's really smart.

I mean, I've been talking wrestling on message boards since about 2002. If you were to say "make the perfect IWC heel". I'd say "well make him muscular, handsome, classic all american babyface". Guess what, that's Cena. The IWC HATES that type of wrestler. If you were to say "create the perfect IWC babyface" I'd say "guy who says ******** things but is still good, smaller guy, preferably wears kickpads and has indy street cred". Hmmm, DB? CM Punk?

The IWC is a LOT easier to work than they think they are. If anything, they're easier to work than the mainstream audience because the IWC is so predictable. There are so many IWC cliches that I've thought about listing them in a thread so that I can more easily go "yea dude, IWC cliche number 56, why don't you have an original thought?"

That is a very hateful post. You biggest fault is that you think that I'm a Cena hater. I'm not, I respect Cena ahelluva lot more than I respect Punk and Daniel Bryan.

This is my impression, I watched most of Cena's appearances back in 2004 and 2005, and I followed some of the backstage stuff. It's my impression that Cena was given a golden push. They created pefect angles for Cena with JBL, but when he went Raw and HHH started jobbing to him that is what really stands out to me.

Cena had a little bit of rocky road where as someone like Austin just took off. And I remember reading in 2005 that inside sources said top people inside the WWE were concerned with crowd reactions to Cena when he was supposed to be the over babyface.

Credit where credit is due: when Cena took off in 2006 it was like nothing else. That will be legacy, those years of popularity.
´
And I remember reading in 2005 that inside sources said top people inside the WWE were conncerned with crowd reactions to Cena when he was suppposed to

I've read a few stories on Hogan's breakthrough and seems more similar to Austin's story than Cena's.

Hogan and Austin were also much older when they took off. They had many more years of toiling and fighting to get over. Cena took a push and ran with it. Just like HBK, just like Hart, just like Austin, just like Hogan, just like Rock. Pushes don't get you over.

 

[FlairFan2003]

Hogan was a transformative figure, the biggest assett on screen to Vince's take over of the industry, his national expansion. Cena, much like Rock, Austin, Sting, Goldberg, in the 90s were very popular but not industry transforming figures.

Wrestling as a whole was more popular in the mid to late 80s than it has been in the last decade. How much of that you attribute to Hogan's popularity and how much you attribute to the product not being as new today is debatable. The internet also means we can get show results without watching shows and TV reviews without actually watching TV. Those advantages didnt exist in the 80s, helping to fuel better numbers. Like it or not the popularity of the product depends on more than one guy, no matter how popular he may be. Its hard to look at todays crop of stars and compare them in popularity and acceptance to 80s icons like Savage, Flair, Rhodes, Piper, Andre, etc.

Cena is a better ring worker to be sure, I cant see Hogan doing a TLC match or even being able to carry a regular match for over 30 minutes. He doesnt get as much credit as he should for being good however, it was McMahon's strategy for much of that time to keep Hogan in simple matches vs the likes of Zeus, Kamala, King Kong Bundy, etc because the audience liked it and it protected him from being exposed. Hogan's matches vs Savage & Flair however were way better than that typically but I still give the edge to Cena.

Cena is the one legit star, able to work in the mainstream media, able to draw crowds & ratings consistently, post Attitude Era, no doubt he was integral to the success of this past WrestleMania. Hogan though was bigger in his heyday, plus you cant discount his contribution to the NWO angle.

I do give Cena props for being a company guy, it is true you dont hear the same kind of stories about him that you hear about Hogan with regards to match finishes, etc. Both guys have given extensive time to charity and The Make A Wish Foundation which deserves praise.

One poster said that Hogan wrestled more in his heyday than Cena. Thats not true, it was common knwowledge, even written about in the wrestling mags, that as champ Hogan rarely wrestled more than a few times a month. That in fact was always one of the criticisms leveled against him by NWA fans, Flair wrestled 5 times a week at least while Hogan barely exceeded that in a month. That was the reason given by Pro Wrestling Illustrated Magazine for consistently ranking Flair over Hogan in their monthly Top 10. Cena puts in more time at house shows than Hogan.

 

[FlairFan2003]

As for the poster who said Cena draws everywhere but Hogan wasnt as big down south that is partially true. WWE handled its live show expansion into Mid South & NWA areas very slowly in the 80s, although they would saturate the local markets with their TV programming, drawing a distinction with fans at home with their shows featuring more comedy, more kid friendly product, and slicker production values. I dont know if I would say Hogan wasnt a big draw there however. When WWE came into a lot of those towns they did well, although they still struggled a bit to match the NWA popularity in Carolinas, GA, Kentucky, the region in the 90s nicknamed Flair Country.

By contrast Jim Crockett wanted to hold live shows in all regions of the country on a monthly basis, almost like he wanted to up the stakes on McMahon and WWE. The touring costs became astronomical however, killing the NWA financially. It proved Vince's strategy was better, focus most of your touring business on the areas where you are traditionally strong, your territory, make only occasional live trips into the other guys territory and try to gin up attendance by promoting your appearance as something special as opposed to the same old stuff you've been getting. Could Flair outdraw Hogan in the south in their 80s heyday ? Maybe in certain key NWA strongholds but Hogan and WWE wese drawing crowds nationwide. Its amazing when you look at Meltzer's yearly rankings of the biggest draws when you see Hogan was No. 1 in all wrestling from 84-89 and again in 91 (I think Ultimate Warrior may have gotten it in 90, I could be wrong). Flair for his part finished 2nd in 82, 1st in 83, and 2nd (behind Hogan) 84-87 (he was 3rd in 88). He also ranked No. 1 in 92 & 95 and was near the top in 96 & 99 as well.

Hogan had his detractors in the 80s, partly because WWE actually had a legit business rival. Cena has detractors today, mostly from an older fan base that wants a gimmick more challenging than what he presents. I cant help but think if it was 1987 todays anti Cena crowd would be all over the limited, one dimensional Hogan and cheering wildly for Flair.

Detractors aside I think Hogan was the biggest star of his time, a bigger star than Cena although the last decade clearly was Cena's, just ahead of Triple H. I'll take Cena in the ring or behind the scenes over Hulk. Thats pretty much the comparison.

 

[braveh]

Hogan and Austin were also much older when they took off. They had many more years of toiling and fighting to get over. Cena took a push and ran with it. Just like HBK, just like Hart, just like Austin, just like Hogan, just like Rock. Pushes don't get you over.

Here is the difference though.

Austin gets a push -> super over

Cena gets a push -> halfway over -> Cena gets a push -> almost over -> Cena gets a push -> super over

I don't know for sure but believe Hogan's story was similar to what happened to Austin even though you can't compare wrestling 30 years ago to the mid 90s and early 00s.

edit great post FlairFan2003!

 

[Wald]

Questions for discussion:

1. Who in your opinion had more impact on the WWE?
2. Who in your opinion had more impact on the wrestling community?
3. Who is your favorite among this two?
4. Was Hulk Hogan's run in the 80s WWE any different from John Cena's run in the 2000s and 2010s?
5. What are the differences between Hogan and Cena?
6. What, in your opinion, is the reason John Cena is not loved by fans like Hulk Hogan did in the 80s?
7. Who do you like more, and why?
8. Will John Cena turning heel make an impact like Hulk Hogan turning heel back in the 90s?
9. Few words of your own, to sum up this discussion.

Answers:

1. Hogan without a shadow of a doubt and it's not even debatable. The reasons are too obvious.
2. Hogan, same as above.
3. Hogan. The guy understands the craft of wrestling a lot better than Cena does and treats it with a lot more respect.
4. Hogan made it more believable that he could lose, or that he was in danger, throughout his run, no mean feat when you consider his win/loss record. Cena doesn't ever convey that he's worried or that he's too bothered by losing when he does, so he cares less and I care less.
5. Same as above. Hogan thought only about himself whilst respecting the wrestling business. Cena couldn't give two hoots about anything other than himself.
6. What I just said. That and he hasn't shown any inclination to be bothered improving himself.
7. Same question as number 3
8. Not for me, but for kids growing up loving Cena it will
9. People talk trash about Hogan, rightly in some cases, a lot, but at least he respected the business and the idea of selling PPVs and cards. He made everyone from Macho to Earthquake seem like a legit threat to him and his title and made a lot of money through doing it. Compare that with Cena's happy go lucky attitude in the face of adversity, where he trashes gimmicks (think ADR), no sells moves (every match he's in), doesn't care about threats (the Rock feud) or doesn't care about losing. I used to stick up for him but he's gotten so much worse at this stuff that I can't any more.

 

[lowandmighty]

1. Who in your opinion had more impact on the WWE? Hulk Hogan.

2. Who in your opinion had more impact on the wrestling community? Hulk Hogan.

3. Who is your favorite among this two? Hulk Hogan.

4. Was Hulk Hogan's run in the 80s WWE any different from John Cena's run in the 2000s and 2010s?
Its was very different. There was nobody else to fall back on if Hogan wasn't there to "carry the flag" Hogan was the be all and end all of wrestling. If something had happened to him the wwf would've had to start almost from scratch.
If something happened to Cena there's 5 other main stars.

5. What are the differences between Hogan and Cena?
Lots. Hogan was bigger, less articulate and much less of a pretty boy than Cena. Hogan came across as a man standing up for his people "the Hulkamaniacs" and fighting for what he perceived to be right. A kind of role model even.
Cena comes across as a punk kid.

6. What, in your opinion, is the reason John Cena is not loved by fans like Hulk Hogan did in the 80s?
This is somewhat of a conundrum because Cena is the embodiment of todays pop culture similarly to how Hogan was the embodiment of his hey day using expressions like "dude, brother, daddy" etc to seem cool for his time.
I guess the answer is people are just different now to how they were in the 80's. People act different, look different and think different these days compared to back then. Todays society demands much more in order to be entertained.

7. Who do you like more, and why?
I like Hulk Hogan more simply because I grew up with him and he kept me watching wrestling for a long time. he made wrestling awesome when he formed the nWo. Then he briefly made it cool again with his face turn back to the wwe.

8. Will John Cena turning heel make an impact like Hulk Hogan turning heel back in the 90s? Maybe, who knows but I don't think so, its been done before. Its the same principal as the first movie is always the best one.

9. Few words of your own, to sum up this discussion.
Its a tough comparison, its the kind of thing where opinions will differ depending on which one of them you identify more with.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Here is the difference though.

Austin gets a push -> super over

Cena gets a push -> halfway over -> Cena gets a push -> almost over -> Cena gets a push -> super over

I don't know for sure but believe Hogan's story was similar to what happened to Austin even though you can't compare wrestling 30 years ago to the mid 90s and early 00s.

edit great post FlairFan2003!

Here's the difference

Austin gets a push in WCW in a PG climate -> somewhat more over
Austin in his mid 30s gets a push in a crude climate -> super over

Cena was younger when he got the push. Most people on here are ******ed and think a wrestler's prime is their 30s. It's not. Wrestling is sooooo mental. To be good at 25 is weird. most guys peak in their early to mid 30s when they're both fit enough and smart enough to put it all together.

I think a lot of people think "oh, these guys would get over in any era" but most of the attitude era guys were guys that had been around for a long time Papa Shango, Rocky Maivia, RingMaster, but they didn't get super over until they were more crude. Makes you wonder if Swagger could cuss and really push the envelop, how over he'd get.

I'm not discrediting a guy like Austin, but having a lot less creative restrictions is an advantage you can't overlook.

Second before you say "well then get rid of PG", you can't. It's not a good long term plan. A trash TV style of show works at first because people are like "holy shit what is going on" then you have to keep pushing the envelop to keep their attention. You can only push the envolop so far before you have Sable getting gangbanged and a live Mankind decapitation.