Elite 8 Preview and Campaign Debate

[IrishCanadian25]

Ladies and Gentlemen, as we head into the "home stretch" in the 2008 Wrestlezone Tournament, we are left with 8 men still standing, as it would take a miracle for any one of them to lose their Sweet Sixteen Matchup. Whom will you be supporting heading into the Elite 8, and why? The final 8 will battle King of the Ring Style.

This is a thread to proudly stump for your candidates, provide links to campaign HQ's, show sigs, etc. Have fun.

 

[Evan Snow-Wolf]

I chose Shawn Michaels. Mainly because he appears to be the most versatile of the bunch in a situation where stipulations aren't known yet (or they are and I was just lazy or oblivious to notice in another thread). I think Triple H, Vader and the Undertaker will be close as well. Honestly, this is a pretty good Elite 8 overall and this should be very interesting how it turns out next round.

Honestly, it could go many different ways. I think the margin of the lead I gave Shawn in my head is solely attributed to the fact that he can do nearly anything, and has innovated matches that didn't even exist before he did them. That's my little take... for now.

 

[Dan1708]

I vote Taker, and he SHOULD win.

Let’s get this straight first, what the undertaker has accomplished

Hogan era - defeated Hulk Hogan in his PRIME for the WWE championship
-Jake the snake Roberts
-Jimmy snuka
-Ultimate warrior
-King Kong Bundy
-Yokozuna
-Bret heart
-Macho man
Etc

Attitude era - The undertaker was the most consistent in this era as well as being one of the best and beating the very best.
-Stone cold
-The rock
-Mick Foley
-Kane
-HBK
-Triple H
-Big show
-Psycho Sid
-Diesel
Etc

New age era - He cam from the past and defeated the future!!!!!
- John Cena
- Randy Orton
- Batista
- Kennedy
- Jeff hardy
- Booker T
- EDGE
(He defeated Ric flair at this time lol)



And above all this he is 16 - 0 at Wrestlemania

He came into the ME and has stayed there ever since

He’s not like Hogan and flair, in the sense that he just gets better and better not fatter and fatter.



Okay now Lets talk about skill, wrestling ect.

9/10 gimmick matches favor him.

The undertaker is a step above the whole typical WWE champion standard (Hogan, The Rock, Austin, HHH, Orton, Cena etc) The reason this is, he is taller and much MUCH more stronger (kayfabe, deadman persona) and in some cases has far more explosive speed.

Then theres the monster types who are unbeatable, simple as that however The undertaker is the anti-Monster, just look at his whole career and see just why. In every sense of the word better but in some cases not as strong (kayfabe strength eg Khali, Henry giant gozales etc etc etc etc etc etc...........) (btw including VADER!! Although he has my respect for a very good SHW)


After these main two types of wrestlers the Undertaker has come across, it still does not mean Taker cannot excel at Other things
Submission type wrestlers...
He has show he can brawl with the best ANGLE, BRET HEART, CHRIS BEOIT etc. Angle said it himself “he’s just simply 'the best'.”
And now remember Taker still has that huge power force which is what makes him superior to these well talented wrestlers.


I would include the whole Steroid Moran clan but they make me sick!!!!!! E.g.
Batista (has beaten him)
Goldberg (not faced)
Brock lesnar (did infact lose to him, although he shouldn’t have) (on a side note ill admit he had talent but if it means he wont take the business seriously I would rather employ Khali)
Bobby Lashly (not faced)


And everything, anyone else, I hate to say but they would get pummeled by The undertaker as Jeff Hardy did in their ladder match.

Finally I would also like to bring in HBK, as many people think he’s the guy 'who can beat taker'. I have to say if someone comes close its HBK but so does Angle, so does BRET, so does Hogan in his PRIME.
Anyway The undertaker would Crush HBK in a gimmick match that’s simply not disputable except maybe ladder or something which requires speed.
However in a normal match it’s very different, but once again

Endurance Taker > HBK
Power Taker > HBK
etc
The only thing which HBK has over Taker is speed, and frankly it isn’t a HUGE difference and the fact that HBK is simple a Elite all round performer but once again so is Taker.

 

[Skullz Crack'Em]

My favorite is Triple H so I will be backing him all the way to the end.

Shawn Michaels and Undertaker are the two most predictable wrestlers to win the whole tournament so I am not going to support them because they need no support. If it came down to those two in the finals, I would pick Taker over Shawn.

Triple H is going to have a tough match against Savage in the next round and I fear it might be the end for The Game, but I haven't given up hope yet. If Triple H is eliminated, I will be rooting for the controversial Chris Benoit to win the tournament, if he can get pass the Godly HBK that is.

 

[Uncle Sam]

Michaels and Undertaker were too obvious choices to back without somehow feeling like a traitor, particularly that bastard Michaels who everybody wants to hump... apparently. So, it was a choice between the Macho Man and Vader. I went for Vader for three reasons:

1) This is the tournament for SHWs, and who's better than Vader?

2) I have limited experience in the field of Machonomics.

3) I want a surprise winner, someone that can feasibly win it but isn't an obvious prediction.

There's also the secret fourth reason that he'll be my favourite wrestler ever after he squashes that little rodent Rob Van Dam cartoon style. If people weren't so ignorant about Ultimate X matches, this damn thing would belong to the olympic hero. Now he's considered to be on the same level as Christian Cage? The Rock being eliminated also broke my little British heart. So RVD, let's see what you're going to do when there's no ladder to climb up or no X to fall off and then inexplicably still win the match!

Who will win it? Personally, as long as Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Rob Van Dam or The Big Show don't win it, I don't really mind. Benoit winning would be a great anti-WWE cover up sentiment, but I don't know if I'd really approve of it. If I'm totally honest, I think The Undertaker will win it. I'll still be glad, he's probably my favourite wrestler left in it - only The Rock, Stone Cold and Kurt Angle outrank him on my current top five list - and hey, he's not Shawn Michaels. Still, I'd like someone much less predictable - I predicted 'Taker would win this at the very start.

 

[IrishCanadian25]

I chose Shawn Michaels. Mainly because he appears to be the most versatile of the bunch in a situation where stipulations aren't known yet (or they are and I was just lazy or oblivious to notice in another thread). I think Triple H, Vader and the Undertaker will be close as well. Honestly, this is a pretty good Elite 8 overall and this should be very interesting how it turns out next round.

Honestly, it could go many different ways. I think the margin of the lead I gave Shawn in my head is solely attributed to the fact that he can do nearly anything, and has innovated matches that didn't even exist before he did them. That's my little take... for now.

Evan, I like where your head is at. Not because you voted for HBK in this preview poll, but because you seem open minded and willing to learn about some new stuff and other wrestlers. I respect you for your open-mindedness above anything else.

Over the next few weeks, I will be continuing my vehement campaign for the greatest Super Heavyweight in professional wrestling history, Big Van Vader. I urge and invite you to take some time to read my posts, rebuttals, etc. I really feel I will be able to convince you about Vader.

The posts I put up will include some great Vader matches, and I'd also like to ask you (and all of you, for that matter) to take a few moments to be amazed and entertained by the athleticism of the big man. He brings more athleticism, agility, and stamina to the party than ANY other big man in wrestling history, and contrary to what some might say about the Elite 8 King of the Ring style finish not favoring a Superheavyweight, Vader is the exception, and should be the Wrestlezone Tournament Champion.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Well, of those guys, Savage and Triple H are the ones who have won tournament style crowns, Savage for the WWF title at WM 4, and Trips winning the KOR. Savages was more impressive, as he won FOUR matches in one night, against what can be considered tougher circumstances. I also have a coliseum video were savage goes to the finals of a old school "king of the hill' tournament, I think he wrestled in FIVE matches on that one. So I think given the tournament structure Savage has the best chance. Micheals is on Par with those guys as far as stamina, But im not sure if his smaller frame can take the punishment of these guys over the course of three matches in one night. Benoit has the stamina to make it, but he was cast in the smypathetic loser role far too much for me to be able vote him all the way through. Think MITB from WM 21. Of course I say Undertaker has a very good chance, becuase, well, he is fuckin undertaker.

I think Savage is the most logical choice, for his experience winning tournaments, and him being at least on par overall with every guy still left.

 

[tarp]

I vote Taker, and he SHOULD win.

Let’s get this straight first, what the undertaker has accomplished

Hogan era - defeated Hulk Hogan in his PRIME for the WWE championship
-Jake the snake Roberts
-Jimmy snuka
-Ultimate warrior
-King Kong Bundy
-Yokozuna
-Bret heart
-Macho man
Etc

Attitude era - The undertaker was the most consistent in this era as well as being one of the best and beating the very best.
-Stone cold
-The rock
-Mick Foley
-Kane
-HBK
-Triple H
-Big show
-Psycho Sid
-Diesel
Etc

New age era - He cam from the past and defeated the future!!!!!
- John Cena
- Randy Orton
- Batista
- Kennedy
- Jeff hardy
- Booker T
- EDGE
(He defeated Ric flair at this time lol)



And above all this he is 16 - 0 at Wrestlemania

He came into the ME and has stayed there ever since

He’s not like Hogan and flair, in the sense that he just gets better and better not fatter and fatter.



Okay now Lets talk about skill, wrestling ect.

9/10 gimmick matches favor him.

The undertaker is a step above the whole typical WWE champion standard (Hogan, The Rock, Austin, HHH, Orton, Cena etc) The reason this is, he is taller and much MUCH more stronger (kayfabe, deadman persona) and in some cases has far more explosive speed.

Then theres the monster types who are unbeatable, simple as that however The undertaker is the anti-Monster, just look at his whole career and see just why. In every sense of the word better but in some cases not as strong (kayfabe strength eg Khali, Henry giant gozales etc etc etc etc etc etc...........) (btw including VADER!! Although he has my respect for a very good SHW)


After these main two types of wrestlers the Undertaker has come across, it still does not mean Taker cannot excel at Other things
Submission type wrestlers...
He has show he can brawl with the best ANGLE, BRET HEART, CHRIS BEOIT etc. Angle said it himself “he’s just simply 'the best'.”
And now remember Taker still has that huge power force which is what makes him superior to these well talented wrestlers.


I would include the whole Steroid Moran clan but they make me sick!!!!!! E.g.
Batista (has beaten him)
Goldberg (not faced)
Brock lesnar (did infact lose to him, although he shouldn’t have) (on a side note ill admit he had talent but if it means he wont take the business seriously I would rather employ Khali)
Bobby Lashly (not faced)


And everything, anyone else, I hate to say but they would get pummeled by The undertaker as Jeff Hardy did in their ladder match.

Finally I would also like to bring in HBK, as many people think he’s the guy 'who can beat taker'. I have to say if someone comes close its HBK but so does Angle, so does BRET, so does Hogan in his PRIME.
Anyway The undertaker would Crush HBK in a gimmick match that’s simply not disputable except maybe ladder or something which requires speed.
However in a normal match it’s very different, but once again

Endurance Taker > HBK
Power Taker > HBK
etc
The only thing which HBK has over Taker is speed, and frankly it isn’t a HUGE difference and the fact that HBK is simple a Elite all round performer but once again so is Taker.

Ric Flair has been wrestling for reguarly for 31 years I'm counting after the plane crash. I'm sure when Taker has been there that long he won't look the same as he does now. He has 17 good years in and about 20 all together.
As far as my pick I'm going with HHH. He is one of the smartest wrestlers left. The biggest thing that hurts him is facing Savage next. That will be grueling on him. HHH knows how to wear down an opponent and I think he should be the last man standing.
Also I am including this question in here. I hope it isn't considered spamming but I didn't know where to ask. All I wanted to quote was the Flair comment. How do you quote just a portion of something. I have seen it done but don't know how. Thanks for the help.

 

[IrishCanadian25]

Well, of those guys, Savage and Triple H are the ones who have won tournament style crowns, Savage for the WWF title at WM 4, and Trips winning the KOR. Savages was more impressive, as he won FOUR matches in one night, against what can be considered tougher circumstances. I also have a coliseum video were savage goes to the finals of a old school "king of the hill' tournament, I think he wrestled in FIVE matches on that one. So I think given the tournament structure Savage has the best chance.

Norcal, I am glad you brought this up. It gives me a chance to educate everyone on Vader's tournament history and stamina. Below is a post I made in another thread, detailing ENTIRELY why Vader's stamina is on par with or greater than Savage's or HBK's.

Second Round, Vader gets either HHH or Randy Savage, who will be finishing up a greuling, tight match-up. I don't see a match-up featuring Savage and HHH in their primes lasting less than 25 minutes, no matter who picks up the win. As I will be voting Savage, let's say Savage wins.

People will bring up Randy's impressive run at Wrestlemania 4 in the WWF Title Tournament as reason why he holds on against Vader.

VADER FACT - THE BIG MAN WON HIS FIRST OF THREE IWGP WORLD HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPIONSHIPS BY WINNING A ONE-NIGHT, 8-MAN, SINGLE ELIMINATION TOURNAMENT ON APRIL 24TH, 1989.

In that one night, Vader defeated Japanese Legend Masahiro Chono in 5:52, another legend in Tatsumi Fujinami in 14:37, and ended by defeating Shinya Hashimoto in 9:47. The first two matches he won with a flying body press, and the last match with an inside cradle. Man can wrestle, brawl, AND fly.

Savage, on the other hand, wn 4 matches at Wrestlemania 4: defeated Butch Reed in 5:07, Greg Valentine in 6:06, One Man Gang in 4:05, and Ted DiBiase in 9:27 following a Hulk Hogan chair shot to DiBiase.

So don't give me the "Savage wrestled four times in one night. Look at the two performances. Savage wrestled a total of 24:45 and needed Hulk Hogan to hit Ted DiBiase with a chair. Big Van Vader wrestled 30:16 and required no outside interference. VADER WRESTLED 5:31 LONGER THAN SAVAGE DID!

Vader over Savage in around 15 minutes.

 

[klunderbunker]

This tournament looks like a dream come true as there really aren't any holes in the final 8. Each of them have been a world champion, and the worst of the bunch is I guess RVD? When he's the 8th best, that's quite a list. As for my pick, I went with Undertaker. Of all of the people, and I could be wrong about this, he's beaten I think 4 of them, and i'm not sure about vader, benoit and savage. He's a complete wrestler, but I'm not sure about his endurance. I can picture him losing, but I think he'd have the best chance of coming out the winner.

 

[X]

Clearly, the winner of this tournament will be Ron Paul. He will use his mighty doctorate degree and his outstanding political record to bash Vader and the rest of the "favorites" into submission easily.

Why has Ron Paul been the new random option on your polls these days IC? I could've sworn this is like the 3rd poll of yours I've seen with Ron Paul as an option.

I'm starting the Ron Paul Campaign HQ.

 

[IrishCanadian25]

Why has Ron Paul been the new random option on your polls these days IC? I could've sworn this is like the 3rd poll of yours I've seen with Ron Paul as an option.

All for you, X. I did it for you...and Da Rock.

Anyway, the last person who claimed a doctorate degree helped beat the hell out of opponents was Dean Douglas (a Dean position generally requires a PhD) and Dr. Issac Yankem, DDS. I seem to remember that not going very well.

So I still say Vader.

 

[X]

All for you, X. I did it for you...and Da Rock.

Anyway, the last person who claimed a doctorate degree helped beat the hell out of opponents was Dean Douglas (a Dean position generally requires a PhD) and Dr. Issac Yankem, DDS. I seem to remember that not going very well.

So I still say Vader.

We all know Isaac Yankem could squash Vader if he felt like it.

Ron Paul will still use his economic policies to beat his opponents into submission. Look out for his finishing hold, the The Texas Claw of Liberty.

 

[Shocky]

I'll break them down, but without giving my endorsement as of right now.

1. Shawn Michaels: Obviously the favorite to win this thing at this point. Michaels has the stamina and the cardio ability to make it through this thing. I ask you though, has Shawn Michaels ever performed well in a tournament, or has he even competed in a tournament at all for that matter? I can't remember the last time Shawn Michaels wrestled multiple matches against multiple opponents in one night. Shawn Michaels is great, but he's never been in an environment to face different guys in one night. This hurts him in my opinion.

2. Chris Benoit: Benoit I think has what it takes to win this whole thing, and I'll tell you why. The Michaels/Benoit match is a toss up, but I believe Benoit was in better shape to go a long ways and wrestle multiple matches moreso then Shawn Michaels. The advantage Benoit has over Michaels, Tournament tested to say the least. Chris Benoit won the Super Juniors tournament in 1993 and 1995, on top of a Super J cup win in 1994, three years in a row winning a tourney is pretty damn impressive. Not to mention several other tournaments he finished in the semi-finals as well. Also in WCW he was in the tournament of Champions to determine a new WCW champion, only to lose int he finals to Bret Hart. So clearly in my mind, Chris Benoit has a distinct advantage in this thing. As far as head to head with Shawn Michaels, if you want to throw in Shawn's Rumble win, throw it out, because Benoit did the same thing, only against better competition.

The Big Show: The Big Show makes it to the Elite 8 once again, but this time runs into the Undertaker. I don't like Show's chances. I think Show can beat the Undertaker, but there is no way in hell he can win three matches in one night against three different guys.

The Undertaker: Obviously another favorite to win this whole thing. Personally, I think he should have won it last year. He gets a big match against the Big Show in the first round, but Benoit and HBK should wear each other down enough to work in the Deadman's favor. I honestly think he has what it takes to win it all.

Rob Van Dam: He certainly has the cardio ability to make it far, but he is going to be facing a fresh, mean Big Van Vader in the first round. I think things could possibly have been different for RVD if he drew Vader int he 2nd round, but I can't see RVD making it out of the first match.

Vader: See IC 25, he can do it more justice then I could.

Triple H: He has tournament experience winning the 1997 King of the Ring. The guy is a cardio machine, but has a tough match against Savage. The problem with Savage or Triple H, is if they win, how much would they take out of each other? They will probably be facing a relatively fresh Big Van Vader, and that's never a good sign.

Savage: What else can I say. Probably the second most tournament tested guy left in the final eight. He won the Wrestlemania 4 tournament, and the 1987 King Of the Ring, wrestling four matches in each of those tournaments. Savage is tough. He has the technical ability, and the power to match up with Triple H in the first round. I would say that Savage's one year long title reign in the Hogan era maybe more meaningful then any of Triple H's title reigns as well.

So if I was looking at it solely based on Stamina and tourney experience.
1. Chris Benoit
2. Randy Savage
3. Triple H
4. Big Van Vader (he's tourney tested)
5. The Undertaker (tie)
5. Shawn Michaels (tie)
7. Rob Van Dam
8. The Big Show

 

[Bernkastel]

Technically I should be supporting the Undertaker (has he would become my new favorite now that Kane is out of the tournament) but I think that I will go with an undecided vote. I will try and vote fairly, and use my knowledge to try and influence my vote instead of just voting for whom I think is popular. I mean I think thats probably what most of everyone is going to try and do.

Though I also voted for Ron Paul on the poll

 

["Rush" GSP]

The obvious choose for me is Shawn Michaels the man has proven time and time again that he can go the distance in long matches and in his prime had no problem taking on and beating bigger men....Vadar. But i'm gonna be backing "The Game" Triple H. As someone said earlier the man is a cardio freak. Prior to his first injury please tell me a ppv match of his that lasted less than than 25 minutes when he was on top....hard to find. He can go the distance with any one multiple times and to me has that intangible when things are looking grim to pull out the win out of left field. Also with HHH, i think he has the desire and obsession with being the best more so than anyone else in this tournament. He will stop at nothing to win and will do anything to win i.e. cheat when the ref is down or use a sledgehammer. I think he beats savage in a long match and may be somewat fatigued but he has proven multiple times his cardio is up their if not the best in the business. Plus he is called the Cerebral Assassin for a reason and you know he has something up his sleeve for the rest of the tournament.

Against:
Vadar, Show, Taker : has size and strength to hanfg with them but has better cardio and speed by far in my eyes. How many of them could go an hour long?
HBK, Savage, Benoit, RVD: has the speed to hang, cardio is equal to all of them, and has a size and strength advantage

In closing Triple H can clearly hang with all and has an advantage over every guy whereas someone else might have an area better than him but not as significant as HHH's over them. And the two areas i think Triple H has leeps and bounds over the rest of the field is one the obseession to be the best and two he is willing to do whatever it takes to return to his thrown whether it be using a sledgehammer or whatever.

I like as performers HBK, RVD and Taker but....
i vote TRIPLE H.

 

[Dan1708]

Rush, you do know that Tripple H is very sloppy in the ring, and he is actually slow, no big show slow, but very slow considering the size of him.
For example Hogan in his Prime was abit bigger than HHH but he was still much faster.
Also btw being able to be active/ run / wrestle for an hour isnt all that special especially if you are an athelte.

 

["Rush" GSP]

Rush, you do know that Tripple H is very sloppy in the ring, and he is actually slow, no big show slow, but very slow considering the size of him.
For example Hogan in his Prime was abit bigger than HHH but he was still much faster.
Also btw being able to be active/ run / wrestle for an hour isnt all that special especially if you are an athelte.

Whats your experience in ring sports??? I'm very physically fit been lifting for a few years religiously. Just recently started doing jiu jitsu and let me tell you doing a five min round is no joke. Now i know there are rest holds in matches but still that only helps you regain your breathe for a few moments. Plus why do you think there arent many if at all iron man matches in the wwe. Now one reason is cause its an hour of a show or ppv but its all cause its hard to one trust a guy out there that long and to have a guy be able to hang and do it.

 

[strafro]

Although my sig suggests I am backing Savage, I only did that as an anti-HHH advertisement. My real support goes out to none other than the man who I feel has the best shot at winning this whole thing, in agreement with Shocky. Chris Benoit. It would controversial as hell and the guy merits this victory he is pure gold and has the stamina, ability, experience and wherewithal to win this tournament and I will wholeheartedly be supporting him against Shawn Michaels, which will definitely be his largest obstacle to overcome here.

 

[HBK-aholic]

I voted for Shawn Michaels to win this. But honestly, almost every one of these guys deserve it. Benoit, Taker, HHH, Vader, Savage; all are going to go down in history, and you can see why. Most of the best matches in history have involved at least one of these men, and they all deserve so much credit.

What sets Shawn aside, is how versatile he is, in practially any type of match up. He can put on a good match on, whether it's HiaC, Ladder, Singles, Elimination chamber etc, and pretty much every match could work in his favour. It doesn't even matter who against, he will always have a chance at winning due to this skill.

Also, he has never relied on an opponent to carry a match for him, because no matter what, he will make a match good, and make his opponent look good. People pay to see shawn Michaels, because they know they will never be disappointed, and will see an exciting match every single time.

Undertaker V Shawn Michaels: Hell in a cell
[youtube]3mbLnbxYXIU[/youtube]

Kurt Angle V Shawn Michaels: Wrestlemania 21
[youtube]RLv7oKr-aus[/youtube]

Shawn Michaels VS Razor Ramon Ladder match
[youtube]WxXEaTGHAPk[/youtube]