Edge, The Overated 'R' Superstar (Like what I did there?)

[SJM12492]

It seems to me that in EVERY match Edge is in, he seems to do the most little work possible and yet, still become a champion every 5 seconds... Mabye it's just me, but every time he's in a match, the other persons seems to always have the advantage, and when it DOES come to Edge to take the advantage, all he seems to do is strike moves. Punch, punch, kick, kick, stomp, stomp... That's all I see. I just saying that you'll be lucky to see him do more then 3 wrestling moves in a match (Not including Spear). It seems to me that he does the Spear because it's one of the most simplist of moves. The Spear is a move that really ONLY huge guys can use properly, because they make a huge impact with it (like being hit with a truck). Batista, Goldberg, Lashley... These guys used it well because they are massive! Rhyno used it because it suited his gimmick well, but why does Edge use it. He mabye tall, but he isn't really that huge.
In every championship match he's in, he has not won one fairly. I know that's because he's a heel, but if you're going to be a champion AT LEAST win one fairly. Or get to the point where you defend it sooo much that you deserve it. Look at Eddie Guerreo. He won the championship, everyone celebrated. Everyone clapping, Vince coming down (not to the ring) to congratulate him, them having a party backstage... THAT'S how a championship SHOULD be won. Not some guy cashing in a suitcase to beat up an already injured man and run off with the belt. And yes, I know he's a heel. But if he defended it well, then how come he won it 8 times? That just means he can't hold onto it long... 8 times champion means 8 times lost.

So the overall point I would like to make is this:

- Edge's moveset is WAY too small.
- He does barely any work for world championships.
- He shouldn't be used so much in main events (peg him down a knotch).
- Oh yeah, and apparently when things don't go his way, it's a 'travisty!' whatever that means...

So please, leave comments, discuse and remember this... This is just how I feel about the man, I'm not trying to influence anyone. If you're going to leave a comment make sure it's justified critisism and not stuff with swearing and 'How can you say that?' crap...

 

[SK]

You have to be kiddng right?
You say Edge does the littlest work possible... How? Please explain yourself because this man is clearly loyal to the company and has put his body through hell through the years to get to where he is.
His moveset you are describing is that of a typical heel, as they usually dont have high flying moves as this is associated with faces.
Whilst i'm not the biggest fan of the spear, it fits Edge and his gimmick properly because it can come out of nowhere. And with him winning championships in a heelish way.. THATS HIS GIMMICK! He will do anything to win it. Not holding onto titles long is clearly not his fault, just when he's booked to win and lose them. So no, I believe every single point you've made here is bogus as Edge is loyal, he sells well, he makes people hate him and he is one of the best heels in the last 10 years. You should really moan more about the booking rather than about Edges skills because your main gripes seem to be the way he wins titles and how long he holds them for. Dodge OUT.

 

[DJ-LyRiX]

- Edge's moveset is WAY too small.

As has been said, he's a HEEL. His moveset is bound to be smaller than the faces, as cool-looking and impressive moves get bigger pops from the crowd. Also, check out any of Edge's matches circa 2002/3 when he was a face, and he tagged with Hulk Hogan. This should show you that his moveset is available to him whenever he wants.

- He does barely any work for world championships.

Couldn't agree with Dodge more: this is his gimmick. He's the "ultimate opportunist" - which means he doesn't work hard for what he gets. He's hated by most fans for this reason.

- He shouldn't be used so much in main events (peg him down a knotch).

Ignoring the fact that notch is not spelt with a "K", his main event status is completely justified. He has worked his way through the WWE for around 10 years from Tag Team sensation to mid-card talent to tagging with Hogan to Money in the Bank to Main Event. He's at the top of his game both in the ring and on the mic and is the posterboy for the term "Main Event Talent".

- Oh yeah, and apparently when things don't go his way, it's a 'travisty!' whatever that means...

Not sure what you mean here... Suffice it to say that when things don't go his way, most fans are quite happy as it means Edge is losing usually...

I don't mean to stamp on your opinion, I'm just saying I disagree with it. I think Edge is both deserving of his ME status, and plays it well. Is there any other reasons you think this about Edge?

You have to be kidding right?

I think he was

 

[Chill]

It has already been said but the whole small moveset thing is to do with Edge being a heel. That's not to say that Edge can't perform...just watch his DVD and you will see that he can wrestle very well. Plus, at this point he is extremely over that he no longer has to perform loads of fancy moves in a match...he's no longer that guy trying to impress so that he can get a push - that's not to say that he no longer gives a damn, it's just he is a legit star now who works the crowd and draws money...it was the same with Austin and the Rock when they became main event superstars...in a way it's no longer about pulling off fancy moves all the time because now like others before him, Edge can elicit a repsonse from the audience using his charisma and ability to storytell in the ring.

As for winning titles all the time, yeh it might appear cheap and repeatitive but it is all about his ultimate opportunist gimmick...wrestling is all about the gimmicks so we just have to deal with it i guess!

 

[colalella2891]

That's why he's known as 'the Ultimate Oppurtunist"... And heels always have smaller movesets than faces. Look at Matt Hardy. His moveset has definately gotten smaller. The ONLY move he's been doing in his matches is his side-effect. That's it. He hasn't even done the twist of fate since WM...

 

[hArdyPUNKmArk]

Fuck, this thread was done like 2 months ago and it's back?!

I thought Edge was overated too in the last thread about this but now i would say he isnt. I still think he gets too many championships handed to him though but he is a hard and loyal worker and puts alot into the business. He is not overated, bar the multiple reigns...

Also, the Overated R Superstar was the title of the last thread. This argument isnt going to go anywhere.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

Overrated? Wow. All this man has done is pay his dues. I remember the FIRST match he had in WCW...being fed to Kevin Sullivan. Then is debut with the Brood. How original was Edge? Coming through the crowd, no one knowing where the fuck he was...he'd run through the audience...'You think you know me'. Edge's dark character was very mysterious...he didn't say much if anything at all at first...then he went on to form one of the most successful tandums in the Attitude era with Christian. F

FIVE SECOND POSE! These guys were obnoxious, but were funny. Then Edge broke out as a smart ass tweener giving Billy Gunn hell about him making fun of his gimmick. I remember that promo like yesterday. Basically pwning one of the best talkers during the Attitude era in Billy Gunn...then making his way to IC Champion.

He's deserved every push he's had. He's done everything asked of him. He's over and still has a few good years left. Edge being overrated. Jeff Hardy? THAT'S overrated. A spot monkey with rainbow hair and the mic skills of Special Ed. Riiight.

 

[TheEvolution]

I agree that his move set is a bit lacking BUT he has been with and been loyal to the company for a long while consistantly having great matches and has IMO proved himself worthy of the success he has aquired. Now the only thing I see wrong with Edge as a whole is this BS storyline with Vicky it NEEDS to end but besides that he is a very well rounded, capable and entertaining superstar.

 

[savagelegacy]

This is so funny to me - you talk about Edge like you don't understand the point of storytelling. Edge is one of the best on the mic and is very athletic and a great worker. This makes him one of the best in the business and that is the reason why he is in the main event time after time. From the very first match he was in it was obvious to me he would be in the forefront of a new generation of wrestlers.

Why does he not wrestle much in his matches? Why does he complain when he loses? Why is he cheating to win championships? TO MAKE YOU MAD! It obviously is working

 

[King Patrick Star]

We are talking about a man who has paid his dues in the “E” since 1998. In about 11 years, Edge accomplished what some will say, amazing. Let me break down his accomplishments:

• WWE Championship (4 times)
• World Heavyweight Championship (5 times, current)
• WWF/E Intercontinental Championship (5 times)
• WCW United States Championship (1 time)
• WWF/E World Tag Team Championship (11 times) – with Christian (7), Chris Benoit (2), Randy Orton (1), and Hulk Hogan (1)
• WWE Tag Team Championship (1 time) – with Rey Mysterio (1)
• King of the Ring (2001)
• Mr. Money in the Bank (2005, 2007)
• Slammy Award for Couple of the Year (2008) with Vickie Guerrero
• Fourteenth Triple Crown Champion

And that’s just the WWE. How many other Superstars can say they were “essentially” a Double Triple Crown / King of the Ring / 2 Time Money in the Bank holder (I can’t say winner because he only won one MITB Match…you know the story) / Slammy winner?? I know this is scripted, and all that, but winning a Title in Pro Wrestling is basically like a director giving an actor the lead role in a movie or show, or basically like a head coach giving a player a starting position on a team. “Overrated” could be saved for a whole lot of other Wrestlers, but Edge is not one of them.

 

[Coco]

Edge is overrated, but it's nothing to do with how little offense he uses. People like Cena and Big Show can make the most of that limitation. His problem is that his offense is weak and midcardish. His spear looks like a running hug, a lot of his big moves leading up to finishes are unconvincing neckbreakers, his sharpshooter is pathetic. Add on to this the fact that in most of his lengthy, non-gimmick main event level matches he has no idea how to fill the first two-thirds of the match. Shit, he even managed to have a bad Hell in a Cell match with Undertaker.

I call bollocks on his crappy ring work being a result of his heel status. Big Show and Chris Jericho make heel ring work look proper. Edge has just always been crap, but he wasn't major league exposed until he returned in 2004 and wasn't around superior workers like the SmackDown six or in an interesting tag team. Eventually, the crowd got tired of him and started booing him frequently but WWE was convinced to keep trying with him.

Edge is where he is because his heel run really took off hard when the Matt/Lita thing went down and somewhere in 2005 he developed proper mic skills. If not for that, he would not be a main eventer.

His ring work rarely merits main event treatment unless he is with one or several superior workers or in a gimmick match, and even then Edge isn't always the greatest.

A talent who falls short of greatness like him does not deserve to be a nine time world champion. He is a disgrace.

 

[Razor Blade Dream]

I will agree that his run with Christian was amazing. The 5 Second Pose was a highlight for me. I just can't get into his character now. I hope that when he said he was going to start having "fun" again means that we will see his goofy persona back. Like Coco said, his heel persona exploded with the Matt/Lita thing and he said that Cena made him the way he is. But that is over with now, so it's time to go back to having fun again.



And his spear sucks, I don't care how much it hurts getting hit in the midsection by anyone, spears should be reserved for big guys like Batista, Goldberg, Lashley, etc. It looks more effective and Edge's just looks weak as hell. I'd believe him more if he used anything other than a spear. He doesn't have that "snap" like Goldberg's had, it literally looks like he is, as Coco again stated, "hugging" the opponent.

 

[The Champ is here]

I like Edge but...........when he came back to the WWE in November 2008 his inring performance went way down.

He almost became like John Cena -gets his ass kicked in the ring during the whole match but does one or two moves and wins the match. -

I dont think he's overrated is just the simple fact that his inring performance went way down, could be Physcally and mentally due to scheduleing.


Edge vs. Jeff Hardy at Judgement day..........Hardy for Champ!!!!!!! -hopefully-

 

[Nate DaMac]

edge is anything but over rated. to you guys that say he is, rubbish. you guys can cash all you want, but he is extremely over. watch, if he turns face he will immediately garner hof status son. watch him blow cena and your boy randy abortion out of the water.

 

[Nero89]

though i agree that he is indeed overrated and doesnt do much in ring as far as offense anymore back in the day he was great. take a look at any of his matches while in team with christian, exp. tlc and etc.

 

[Mantaur Rodeo Clown]

Edge is overrated, but it's nothing to do with how little offense he uses. People like Cena and Big Show can make the most of that limitation. His problem is that his offense is weak and midcardish. His spear looks like a running hug, a lot of his big moves leading up to finishes are unconvincing neckbreakers, his sharpshooter is pathetic. Add on to this the fact that in most of his lengthy, non-gimmick main event level matches he has no idea how to fill the first two-thirds of the match.

Firstly, I don't think its supposed to be a sharpshooter, its his "Edgecation" or whatever, and he tweaks it so he's sort of sideways, and he doesnt use it that often I dont think. In terms of him not being able to fill two thirds of the match, I think its his style.
His match at Wrestlemania XXIV with Taker obviously wasnt him getting the upper hand and hitting a death valley driver then Canadian Destroyer because The Undertaker was too powerful and overwhelming. What you CAN see in the match for two thirds is Taker not being able to put Edge away. This is a defining quality in Edge, as he makes it seem like he's been underestimated and can hang on until the bitter end, not being able to be pinned no matter what. You dont need lots of moves for reversals, on the opponent does.

Shit, he even managed to have a bad Hell in a Cell match with Undertaker.

Personally I thought the match was great. Sure they didnt go on top of the cage and put some teeth through their nose, but not everyone is as mental as Foley. They did go outside and it had some great spots. Thoroughly enjoyable, regardless of the long ladder set up times etc.

Eventually, the crowd got tired of him and started booing him frequently but WWE was convinced to keep trying with him.

But he did get turned heel after Vengeance/Summerslam because he was being booed. I thought his Intercontinental match with Orton was very good at Vengeance, before he was even rated, let alone overrated.

Edge is where he is because his heel run really took off hard when the Matt/Lita thing went down and somewhere in 2005 he developed proper mic skills. If not for that, he would not be a main eventer.

Are you saying that he wouldnt be main event talent without the Lita/Matt thing or without getting proper mic skills? Both are untrue. Edge could always work the stick, as seen in his goofy E+C days. He was being funny, but the charisma was there, rated R or not. Even without heat from the Matt and Lita thing, which I would think only a small amount of fans would know about, he still had it in him to go the distance. Besides, he's a company man.

His ring work rarely merits main event treatment unless he is with one or several superior workers or in a gimmick match, and even then Edge isn't always the greatest.

When they first started working together, I wouldnt have classified Cena as a superior worker at all, yet they still had good matches, even if they weren't gimmicked. Same with Matt Hardy. He blows big time and Edge could muster something out of him.

A talent who falls short of greatness like him does not deserve to be a nine time world champion. He is a disgrace.

Harsh. He has worked hard, and the only thing he doesn't deserve is a comment like this.

 

[DJ-LyRiX]

Harsh. He has worked hard, and the only thing he doesn't deserve is a comment like this.

I couldn't agree more. Edge is a solid worker, and does his job as a Heel very well. He makes fans angry, as his character probably doesn't deserve to be in the spot he's in, due to interference, opportunistic moments etc. But the man behind the Rated 'R' Superstar most certainly does. Edge has been a loyal employee of WWE over the years, had innovative TLC, Hell in a Cell, and Singles matches amongst others, had one of the best rivalries in recent memory (vs. Undertaker) and isn't a cool "anti-heel" - he does the job the way it's meant to be done, and fans hate him for it. Well done Edge, you deserve as many title runs as you can get.

 

[Coco]

Firstly, I don't think its supposed to be a sharpshooter, its his "Edgecation" or whatever, and he tweaks it so he's sort of sideways, and he doesnt use it that often I dont think.

He used to do that in 2005. He doesn't anymore. Recently, however, he's used the sharpshooter infrequently and it's looked really weak. Weaker than even Rock's.

In terms of him not being able to fill two thirds of the match, I think its his style. His match at Wrestlemania XXIV with Taker obviously wasnt him getting the upper hand and hitting a death valley driver then Canadian Destroyer because The Undertaker was too powerful and overwhelming. What you CAN see in the match for two thirds is Taker not being able to put Edge away.

The problem with his style is that it isn't engaging. Not everything needs to be a mile a minute, as is proven by Cena and Show being two of my favorites at the moment. Edge, however, is dull for the most part. It's not just the Taker matches. His bouts with Triple H and Batista play the same way.

Personally I thought the match was great. Sure they didnt go on top of the cage and put some teeth through their nose, but not everyone is as mental as Foley.

Don't speak as though you know my taste, please. Two of my favorite HIAC matches (besides the first one with Taker and Michaels) are Batista-HHH and Taker-Lesnar. It has nothing to do with the top of the cage

They did go outside and it had some great spots. Thoroughly enjoyable, regardless of the long ladder set up times etc.

The problem with the match was the overlong sequences setting up weapons followed by countless spears. It was bush-league and garbage-wrestling. It ended up being the worst match of their series which is surprising considering Edge is normally better in gimmick matches. It was just straight bad wrestling, with a finish that went too far to fit too much in.

I thought his Intercontinental match with Orton was very good at Vengeance, before he was even rated, let alone overrated.

That match was about as boring as it gets, but I blame that on Orton's love for overlong headlock sequences than Edge. Still not a good match.

Are you saying that he wouldnt be main event talent without the Lita/Matt thing or without getting proper mic skills?

Probably. The WWE would have tried to continue pushing him as they saw stars on him for some reason, but most people didn't buy him as a main event talent until that situation. And I remember some of Edge's serious (non-E&C) mic work after he won MITB. Passable at best and not always even that good. Thank God he eventually "got it" when it came to the mic game.

When they first started working together, I wouldnt have classified Cena as a superior worker at all,

Cena's matches with Jericho, his triple threat with Jericho and Christian, his matches with Undertaker and Lesnar in 2003, and his I Quit match with JBL rival most of Edge's non-SmackDown 6 work up until that point. And my feeling has always been Edge's game was raised as a result of the superior talent he worked with in those days. I've never really seen a worker get better as a result of working with Edge.

Same with Matt Hardy. He blows big time and Edge could muster something out of him.

Matt doesn't "blow big time." His matches with Gregory Helms, Finlay, Mark Henry, Roderick Strong, Jack Swagger and others rival Edge's best work and even surpass it in some cases. Edge didn't carry him by any stretch.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

I absolutely cant be bothered to read all these long posts about Edge being overrated somehow.

He has a small offensive moveset becuase he is a heel. Heels cant use a dazzling array of offense, becuase that pops the crowd. He uses sneaky bullshit ways of winning titles becuase thats his character. It also obviously doesnt have shit to do with him, his preformance i mean, as thats what his character is booked to do. Its not real guys, in case you didnt know. He is also one of the best, most deeply intense mic workers in the biz. You wont ever see an Edge promo thats boring, or monotonous.

Edge is one of the best guys WWE has, and one of the best heels in the biz. Hardly overrated.

 

[Coco]

Excusing his offensive moveset "because he's a heel" doesn't fly when the likes of Big Show and Jericho can use their movesets better and Orton can execute his better. His small moveset isn't the problem. It's his inability to use it convincingly to fill a lengthy main event match without said match becoming dull

If people can't this behind his great promo work, then yes he is overrated.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

What shows have YOU been watching? What ME with Edge in it has been dull? Nothing for the last three years, thats for damn fucking sure. And to use ORTON as you example is laughable.

yea, damn right, he can execute the ever livin fuck out of those scintilating headlocks. truly gets me on the edge of my seat, I tell ya. I have seen NARY a one dull ME involving Edge. If thats your argument, then the best of luck to you

 

[Coco]

Wrestlemania 24 against Undertaker. The first two thirds of that match, save for maybe two or three high spots, were dull and weak. And then we went into overly epic counter/counter/counter WWE finish mode which sucks since Edge's moveset consists of a bunch of neckbreakers that are best suited for the midcard.

His match with Triple H fell completely flat.

I layed out earlier what a failure his HIAC match with Taker was.

Orton is dull, but at least he executes his offense better than Edge. Stomps, sick neckbreakers, the punt, the RKO... The man is crisp. But I never said he was more exciting. That honor goes to Show and Jericho, in particular.

On point, however, is what non-gimmick headline matches on PPV has Edge had in the last couple years that are really deserving of any significant praise? I'd like to know what Edge's defenders have to say.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

I thought his match with Triple H was just fine. Both the non gimmick Taker matches were good. If you dont think so, then your simply LOOKING for it to bad, to hate on Edge. The triple threat with trips and Hardy was excellent. His one on one matches with Cena were damn fine as well.

and what do you MEAN "executes them better"...er, he doesnt botch anything. If he does, its surely not more regular than any other ME guys.

 

[Coco]

Edge's weak execution is that his offense just looks... WEAK. His spear, unless sold like death by Jeff Hardy, is a glorified running hug. At Mania 24, after his half-crap on Taker failed, the next submission where he crossed Taker's legs looked more like Edge was resting comfortably rather than trying to win the match... He over did the backdrop-countered-into-a-crossbody spot at that Mania by doing it faster than the original offensive move called for and Taker had to sell it like it was a brilliant counter. It's just bush-league stuff like that from Edge that gets on my nerves. His midcardish neckbreakers often suffer from them looking like a simple drop to the mat rather than a force to be deal with.

I don't want to hate him. I'd be thrilled if his ring work lived up to his character. But frankly, I only see value in his matches with multiple men, superior workers, or gimmicks (Backlash 2006, Armageddon 2008, Backlash 2005, No Mercy 2002, SmackDown with Eddie in a No DQ match). I want to like Edge and he has some decent matches under the right circumstances. But his hype as one of the best in the WWE is not justified.

 

[Mantaur Rodeo Clown]

His midcardish neckbreakers often suffer from them looking like a simple drop to the mat rather than a force to be deal with.

Thats like the 5th time you've made note of those goddamn neckbreakers. Dont you think if Edge is using them, they are no longer mid card but Main Event neckbreakers? Why arent you looking at the "fist into the head" of Cena or the blatant "boring ass chin lock that everyone hates" of Orton? Stop hating on Edges moveset, its fine.

I don't want to hate him. I'd be thrilled if his ring work lived up to his character. But frankly, I only see value in his matches with multiple men, superior workers, or gimmicks (Backlash 2006, Armageddon 2008, Backlash 2005, No Mercy 2002, SmackDown with Eddie in a No DQ match). I want to like Edge and he has some decent matches under the right circumstances. But his hype as one of the best in the WWE is not justified.

I think you do want to hate him. I mean if you have the Big Show and Cena as your favourites, and are able to see their strong sides, which no doubt they do have them, you must be able to see Edges. Enjoy the matches he's involved in, regardless of whether they are with superior talent or not. He is a consumate performer and has taken a whole mess of injurys and bumps to entertain fans. So maybe you shouldnt put him on your top 10 list, hell you dont even have to support his numerous title reigns, but at least respect how far he's come from Gangrel's brood.