That was by no means a sign that he was just some other guy who only ever had a hope of getting over if he just managed to get his hands on some edgy material?
I'm not discrediting Austin's career at all, if that's the impression you're getting. What I'm saying is before the Attitude Era, he was only a mid-carder. After the Era ended, he still uses such material to get over. That links to the idea of 'right place, right time' because had the WWE decided to remain a family friendly product, you can question where Austin's career would have taken him. Yeah he was a mid-carder, so was Mr Perfect and so was Scott Hall, did either of them win a world title? Cena won his first world title in 2005 and was constantly main-eventing for years despite the change to a PG product in 2008. That shows he was able to make that adjustment and be a huge name in both periods. If you believe Austin still would have been a big name, OK, but I think it's fair to question that. I can't find it at the moment but I've seen a plan of what they wanted Austin during his WWE run. Let's just say that it didn't look hopeful and there's a reason they never followed through.
The fact that they had him win KOTR about a month later (28 days in fact), would seem to suggest the exact opposite.
Mabel had also won it the year before. Where is Mabel now? Besides, have you seen the contenders in the 1996 tournament? HBK wasn't in it, neither was Bret or 'Taker that year. Says a lot of the value of the KOTR in '96. Austin did get his big break after that tournament, but not because of beating Roberts but because of that speech. Oh yeah, one of the first
edgy promos the WWE fans had seen at that time.
I'm not really understanding.
Relate it to what I just said about Austin.
Probably their personalities and creativity... just like they actually did in real life.
So even you can agree that we're not certain what their careers would have been minus the TV-14 television.
do you think that Austin and Rock were the only guys allowed to be 'edgy' as you call it? The entire locker room had the exact same opportunity and took advantage of it as well.
Yeah, no denying, but what I'm saying is, well, I've said it a few times now...
Just sitting here and trying to argue that the reason these guys were as popular as they were was because they got 'edgy material'? Is so damn disrespectful to them.
Are you forgetting that I put these guys in my top 4? I love their promos, they're great in-ring performers and charismatic as heck. They're 2 of the best to ever go at it. Don't assume I'm saying they're overrated or garbage. They made a lot of money for the WWE and saved them from collapse.
I just stopped there. Holy fuck kid.
Yeah, cut out the part where I wrote
You don't seem to be understanding my point, because you seem to think that somehow I'm knocking Cena by saying it.
I'm not.
I know you're not, I read the rest of you're post.
With a publicly traded company though, they don't have that luxury, because the hit they take means that the stock price goes down, investors lose money and confidence in their investment, and they walk away. It actually limits the company in many ways.
It's a business, they take risks and Vince has been in the industry long enough to know what will make him a huge loss. As a business, they will take every opportunity they can to have another top star alongside Cena, like Austin and Rock were during their primes. With your logic, what do you expect them to do once Cena retires?
Wouldn't they want other people on top so that they can make more money? Of course, but do you ever notice that they rarely give others the same type of opportunity that they afford Cena?
Those names I mentioned? Sure, Cena's was taken further but that's because he capitalised on those small opportunities he had, therefore he was given
further spotlight.
I'm sure you just think that's because Cena is so far above everyone else. In reality though, it's because they're hesitant to take chances on others that may cause a temporary drop in investor confidence, so they keep going back to Cena because he's the safe choice.
But you're assuming they haven't given others any real chances. They clearly have. Remember, they're a business. Yeah they haven't been given that extra bit of attention but again they didn't make the best of what they were given. Remember, Cena wasn't given that number 1 spot straight away. He worked for it and was more over as a mid-carder in 2004 than anyone on the current roster.
Believe me, ratings would not have been trending downward for so long now with the same guy on top the entire time back in the old days.
Well, these are not the
old days. Time change, At one point the only way of watching wrestling was by going to a live show. Again, you've got the internet now, DVR, so many more entertainment options and TV channels, live streams which affect PPV numbers, etc. That's why they haven't gone into complete panic mode like they did in the mid to late 90's when the ratings were similar to that they are now, as at that point, TV was the only way of watching the product unless you were actually in attendance.
He also did have high hopes for both Austin and Rock from the start. They just got the gimmicks wrong initially.
Until when?
I remember debating Cena with you once before, in one of those WZ tournaments. I forgot what an unabashed Cena mark you are.
buckle up for this year!
I'm just glad I wasn't sitting beside you the first time you watched Trainwreck. That might have been scary.
He's been relevant and entertaining to you ever since his debut. For many though (the ones I'm assuming you just dismiss as haters), he grew stale... which is not surprising for anyone who's had a run at the top as long as he has.
So why didn't anyone else step up to the plate to make them a lot of money if he was growing stale? Because they simply couldn't? And/or was he still making a lot of money for them at the time so it wasn't necessary and only the IWC grew tired of Cena, who don't really count as a majority?
I've long said that it would be best for everyone involved if Cena took time off and gave his face a break.
But you're saying they keep pushing Cena because of the money he makes them? Why would they want to keep him off TV for a long time if he makes them loads of money and he's a safe choice for the investors? Remember, it's a business and they want to make as much money as possible.
It would force the WWE to start getting behind other guys and properly invest in creating new stars again.
Cena hasn't been main eventing monthly since we'll say when he lost to Bryan in mid-2013. Who's capitalised since?
It would allow those who are tired of Cena to begin to appreciate what he brings to the table.
Shows how foolish Cena haters can be. It takes for Cena to be gone for a while for them to appreciate what he brings to the WWE. How about they appreciate that when they see him week after week? Because he's the only top star at the moment? Again, that would be because...?
Take away the Rock's movie career, and it's arguable that Cena never gets his shot at being the #1 guy in the WWE.
There's a chance, but he'd still be a big draw. You don't only have to have 1 big draw in a given period. You had Hogan, Savage and Warrior and then you had Austin and Rock. But then again, I guess we're just used to 1 single huge draw because in the past 10 years, no one has really come close to Cena's drawing ability.
We do realize that I'm not just talking about WWE accomplishments right? Because I don't really know if it's fair to compare the championship and major win resumes of two guys when one of them worked almost 3 times as long to build his?
The fact that he's been on top for 10 years speaks volumes.
As for the rest... already addressed. No need to keep repeating it.
I feel like I made the same points a few times in this post, I'm not sure how clearer I can be. If you're good, you get pushed, If you capitalise, you get pushed even more and that's what the WWE wants as they're a business and want to make a lot of money. In regards to Rock and Austin, before TV-14, midcarders. After TV-14, use edgy material to get over, DURING TV-14, huge stars. John Cena, before PG and during PG, top guy. Hulk Hogan, as a goody and a baddy, top star.
