Bret Hart calls out Triple H, says HHH vs Taker at Mania 28 was mediocre....

[Wrestling101]

i can see where Bret is coming from as yeah HHH can do a half decent promo but is in ring abilaties are mediocre too say the least and im seriously dreading the day Vince retires as the will be the end of the WWE. As seriously HHH has no vision and btw whats wrong with WM mark twos we had HBK vs Taker 1 and 2 HHH vs Taker 1 and 2 and now Rock Cena 1 and 2 and probley brock vs HHH 2 WTF HHH SHOW SOME VISION KID

Goddammit, now I have to defend HHH again?

In the short amount of time HHH has been 'in charge' behind the scenes, he's shown he has very good vision. I dn't know what you're talking about. And to say he's 'mediocre to say the least' is just being dishonest.

I also don't know what you're talking about with WM and the rematches.....It looks like they are showing very vision, if their goal is to make money and break records. I suspect this WM will break last year's record, which broke the record of the WM before that. Looks to me like they have incredible vison.

 

[Dmbfantomas]

To say Mr. H's has never had a great match is wrong. Saying he was never the best part of a match wouldn't be off, but he's obviously been in at the very least a few great matches.

Was/is he a great wrestler? To me, no. He's a guy who was good at things, but not great at a single thing. He's VASTLY overrated as a story teller and ring general. I also feel that he got in the way of more great things than he created. There are too many things regarding him that leave a sour taste in my mouth. Booker T losing at WM XIX is the biggest black eye on that entire event. The Reign of Doom will probably be considered one of the most tedious and overlong reigns in history. The absolute burial of Orton after his title win (which I will give some semblance of a pass to, because I assume part of the reason was that Ort-man was a total prick at the time).

Would I put HHH in the top 10 of all time? No, maybe not even top 20. Is he in the elite of his era for me? No. Was he a reliable talent who was good at a lot of things (I never enjoyed his promos, but they got a reaction in his prime so I can't say he was bad at them)? Yes.

Although, his "I'm leaving" speech after Brock ruined him at Summerslam might be the worst moment in the history of TV. Worse than Cavemen.

 

[justinsayne]

At this point It's pretty common knowledge that the Montreal Screwjob was Triple H's idea, a clearly based on Hart's recent comments about Triple H, it's pretty clear that he still holds a grudge. Bret Hart is & always has been a huge mark for himself, when he says "I'm the best there is, best there was, & best there ever will be" he truley believes it. When it comes to his opinions of other wrestlers & where they rank you really can't take a word he says seriously. He overrates his friends, & underrates any one whom he's ever had an issue with.

Anybody who's saying Triple H was mediocre at best clearly hasn't watch much of the man's work, because in his prime he was one of the best heels in WWE history, & rarely ever had a bad match.

As for his "lack of vision" & all the Wrestlemania rematches. From what I understand Triple H is the guy spearheading the big youth movement in WWE right now, he's the guy that's trying to bring in more guys like Bryan, & Punk, because he realizes that's where the future of Wrestle is headed. The whole Wrestlemania rematch thing is just good business, & is hardly a new development in WWE either. We had Rock vs. Stone Cold headlining 3 out 4 Wrestlemania's in a row, Kane vs. Taker has happened twice at WM (14 & 20), & lets not forget the Hardy's, E&C, & the Dudleys all battled each other two years in a row as well (WM's 16 & 17). So the whole WM rematch shit is not new, they do it because these matches draw, it's the same reason why all these Hollywood movie studios are constantly producing endless squeals, & reboots, because it draws money.

 

[clare houghey]

Goddammit, now I have to defend HHH again?

In the short amount of time HHH has been 'in charge' behind the scenes, he's shown he has very good vision. I dn't know what you're talking about. And to say he's 'mediocre to say the least' is just being dishonest.

I also don't know what you're talking about with WM and the rematches.....It looks like they are showing very vision, if their goal is to make money and break records. I suspect this WM will break last year's record, which broke the record of the WM before that. Looks to me like they have incredible vison.

i Agree with part of that u say but come on be honest wouldnt u like too see WM this year with freah match's ?? since HHH has been running more things the WWE has become more predictable and boring. He should just sit back and wait too see if he gets in the HOF and let the up and comeing stars have the moment and stop trying too hog the main event picture and same goes for VKM

 

[Wrestling101]

i Agree with part of that u say but come on be honest wouldnt u like too see WM this year with freah match's ?? since HHH has been running more things the WWE has become more predictable and boring. He should just sit back and wait too see if he gets in the HOF and let the up and comeing stars have the moment and stop trying too hog the main event picture and same goes for VKM

If we're talking about what I'd like to see, that's different. If I'm putting my fantasy booker hat on, I would've done it differently, but that's true with 75% of what I've seen in wrestling over the past 26 years since I became a fan. But if we're talking about the WWE doing what was right for business, what was right for them to make as much money as they can while still giving us something entertaining, they're doing what they're supposed to be doing. Let's remember....they, as a business, are not supposed to be catering to the die-hard fans, especially around this time of the year. As a business, they are supposed to be trying to reach out to the casual fan and draw them in, and they are supposed to be trying to make new die-hard fans. As a business, that should be their main goal, as with any business....How do I get new customers to spend their money with me, and How do I get more repeat customers?

 

[clare houghey]

If we're talking about what I'd like to see, that's different. If I'm putting my fantasy booker hat on, I would've done it differently, but that's true with 75% of what I've seen in wrestling over the past 26 years since I became a fan. But if we're talking about the WWE doing what was right for business, what was right for them to make as much money as they can while still giving us something entertaining, they're doing what they're supposed to be doing. Let's remember....they, as a business, are not supposed to be catering to the die-hard fans, especially around this time of the year. As a business, they are supposed to be trying to reach out to the casual fan and draw them in, and they are supposed to be trying to make new die-hard fans. As a business, that should be their main goal, as with any business....How do I get new customers to spend their money with me, and How do I get more repeat customers?

but wouldnt they keep more of a loyal fanbase by giving the fans what they want instead of trying too force the same b/s evrey time WM comes around. and IMO you keep the fan's happy the more they spend and the more ppl will talk about it IMO keep HHH behind the seanes and have brock face taker or something as Brock vs Taker will be one for the ages. i aint a HHH hater but th he is past it in the ring and if he wants something too do get him too rebuild the tag divison

 

[AhSpicyDrop]

So I just watched Bret's latest spattering of bullshit to where he said "Triple H isn't even in the top 1,000 greatest wrestlers." It has me wondering if that little Montreal incident at Royal Rumble at the Fan Expo opened up some old wounds for Bret, because he's went from saying something ridiculous like"Triple H has never had a great match" to the even more ridiculous "Triple H isn't even in the top 1,000 of greatest wrestlers."

I honestly can't think of a single wrestler that's done more to piss on their legacy than Bret Hart at this point. I've watched most of Bret's documentaries and read his books, and he constantly comes across as patting himself on the back way too much. He buys way too much into the wins/losses side of things, and doesn't realize he was the champion and lead guy in arguably one of the worst eras of pro-wrestling.

It's pretty ballsy of Bret to be in a physical state to where he can no longer work in the ring, and can barely chime a sentence without it sounding ignorant, and yet he still gets the opportunity to earn the occasional payday... and STILL pisses on the people that are giving him the opportunity.

At this point Bret just needs to sit down and shut the fuck up because the whining is just shitting on a legacy that he's so proud of.

 

[clare houghey]

So I just watched Bret's latest spattering of bullshit to where he said "Triple H isn't even in the top 1,000 greatest wrestlers." It has me wondering if that little Montreal incident at Royal Rumble at the Fan Expo opened up some old wounds for Bret, because he's went from saying something ridiculous like"Triple H has never had a great match" to the even more ridiculous "Triple H isn't even in the top 1,000 of greatest wrestlers."

I honestly can't think of a single wrestler that's done more to piss on their legacy than Bret Hart at this point. I've watched most of Bret's documentaries and read his books, and he constantly comes across as patting himself on the back way too much. He buys way too much into the wins/losses side of things, and doesn't realize he was the champion and lead guy in arguably one of the worst eras of pro-wrestling.

It's pretty ballsy of Bret to be in a physical state to where he can no longer work in the ring, and can barely chime a sentence without it sounding ignorant, and yet he still gets the opportunity to earn the occasional payday... and STILL pisses on the people that are giving him the opportunity.

At this point Bret just needs to sit down and shut the fuck up because the whining is just shitting on a legacy that he's so proud of.

Firstly the reason he can hardly talk or cant wrestle is because he had a stroke and he's lost more than anyone in WWE

i remember growing up watching bret and i was glued too the screen but in HHH's era id fast forward his matchs too the end as he is so prodictable in the ring and the only thing i can remember from his days that stand out is undertaker vs HHH 1997 EPIC!!!!
AND the two man power trip with austin

and u getting down on a stroke victim shame on u

 

[Bad Booking]

I know Bret had several massive brain injuries in the early 2000's, including a stroke. Most of Triple H's GREAT work happened during that time. He needs to investigate YouTube like the rest of the world, and perhaps his mind might change a little. He's not all move set I understand, but the little things he does in a match really helps underscore it.

 

[AhSpicyDrop]

Firstly the reason he can hardly talk or cant wrestle is because he had a stroke and he's lost more than anyone in WWE

i remember growing up watching bret and i was glued too the screen but in HHH's era id fast forward his matchs too the end as he is so prodictable in the ring and the only thing i can remember from his days that stand out is undertaker vs HHH 1997 EPIC!!!!
AND the two man power trip with austin

and u getting down on a stroke victim shame on u

It's pretty common knowledge that Bret had a stroke. I'm not bagging on him for having a stroke, but being honest he's not exactly much of a draw if he can't work in the ring or talk. He was never much of a talker in the first place. I would challenge anyone to show me a Bret Hart promo that wasn't dreadful from any of his face runs... His heel run doesn't count because it relied completely on cheap heat from bagging on America.

I'm not making this a who's better than who argument... I would take Bret Hart in his prime over any Triple H match. I'm a big fan of Hart's ring work, especially his matches with Hennig, Austin, and Michaels... But for Hart to say Triple H hasn't had great matches or even in the top 1,000 greatest is just extreme bitterness.

As far as losing more than anything in the WWE I will assume you're talking about Owen; and that's a sad situation but completely irrelevant to this topic and conversation. Bret made his own decision to leave WWF and join WCW for a bigger paycheck, and honestly has nobody to blame for the "Screwjob" but himself.

But to me if you're "burying the hatchet" it means what's done is done and let's leave it at that. You don't get brought back and say it's all good and then get a few paychecks and say "You know what, fuck you buddy, I take all the hatchet burying back." And that's what he's done. The only way I'm going to buy Bret's opinion as anything more than sour grapes is if he can list 1,000 wrestlers that he feels were better than Hunter and gives reasons for each.

 

[MrMojoRisin]

Hold up...your source for talking about fan mail and biggest international draw is his own autobiography? That's funny....And you had the nerve to call me a mark? Who's the mark now?

An autobiography that's been recognized as one of the most historically accurate one's written? Yeah.

Of course they're going to say that....they respect the business and their peers, especially those that came before them, enough to not flat out come out and say 'I'm one of the 4 biggest wrestling stars ever'......plus, they respect Hart because he helped get Austin, and by extension Rock, get to the level they got to. But make no mistake about it, Hart is not as big a star as they were. And the only people saying anything about the kayfabed accomplishments of anybody is the guy you're agreeing with, blackout, so have fun with that.

So bottom line, your opinion holds more weight than theirs, because they're just being politically correct when they speak, but you're just keeping it real?

The funny thing about your comment about kayfabed accomplishments though... is that anyone that is holding Hunter up to an exceptionally lofty standard, like you seem to be doing... has to do so based off of kayfabed accomplishments. Because Hart's basically talking about Hunter as a worker. Stripped away of the kayfabe, and how he stacks up based off of that. Strip away the titles, the mega pushes, everything and just look at his in ring work, and the guy's standard drops significantly.

Except that I do like Hart and I have no axe to grind.....Hart is clearly dissing HHH when he says he's not among the top 1000 wrestlers, he's never had a great match, etc. He's so fucking bitter it's ridiculous and sad.

Yeah and you're also not a HHH mark, as you mentioned off the top. Oddly enough though, you've done nothing but run down Hart like you do have an ax to grind, and you've propped up Hunter like you are a mark for him. Just saying those things doesn't make you objective, fyi. Demonstrating them does.

Hart's comment about him not being in the top 1000 wrestlers... is obvious hyperbole though. It doesn't do anything to support his argument, but I get the basis behind it. He's trying to demonstrate (poorly) that Hunter isn't exactly the greatest worker that's ever lived. Like I've already mentioned (you'll get around to reading it eventually I guess), he's a guy that did everything 'good', but never really did one thing 'great'... unless you want to consider being a politician a part of it. His best matches, were always with great workers. He rarely carried mediocre to average workers to great matches. His best matches again, were almost always gimmick matches. Nothing wrong with that, but again the great workers didn't need the types of crutches that Hunter relied on. That is going to bring him down in the eyes of actual workers, especially ones that didn't need crutches as often as Hunter did.

It's just the truth...you can choose to blind yourself to it if you want, makes no difference to me. Hart did well for himself at a time when wrestling was at a lowpoint. He got lucky that his time coincided with the steroid scandal that Vince was going through at the time, or Hart would've never gotten above the mid card.

Yeah you really sound like a Hart fan there.

Just HHH's stuff with DX has left a bigger footprint in the wrestling world than Hart left. I can't believe you're forcing me to take HHH's side, because I'm not a HHH mark or a HHH apologist

Yes you are a HHH apologist, and you absolutely come across as a HHH mark.

BTW, DX first made it's mark on the wrestling world on the back of HBK. Hunter was along for the ride at that time. Credit for keeping the ball rolling after HBK was gone, but I really don't know how well DX gets over in the first place if it wasn't for the star power that HBK gave it in the beginning.

, but Hart's comments are so stupid, out of line, and ridiculous that I'm forced to take HHH's side. But I can believe that it came from Hart, because he's so bitter towards HHH and HBK. What I can't believe is that there's a few people like you that actually put any weight into what Hart is saying. Yes, some people's opinions are so dumbed down that they can be wrong, and yours (and Hart's) is wrong (and stupid) now.

You know, I'm actually still waiting for you to try and explain why mine and Hart's opinions are so wrong and stupid. You keep saying they are. You keep throwing out a few tired cliches as your evidence. You keep saying you don't even like HHH and you do like Hart, so your opinion here must be legit. But I really don't see you refuting anything.

But sorry though, some of us actually get what Hart's saying. Why he's saying it all is something else, and I think you're really confusing the why with the what, because you're seeing it all as career suicide for Hart to be rocking the boat at all. Because I actually agree that it's dumb for him to speak like this... as long as he plans on working with the WWE in the future. He's mentioned he hasn't been happy with how he's been used though, so I'm guessing he doesn't plan on working with them in the future, so he doesn't really care at this point.

Please though. Actually explain how Hunter is a better worker than Hart's giving him credit for being. Let's leave the gimmick he was gifted out of it. The push he was gifted out of it. Let's strip everything down and focus on his actual work. Let's leave out references to "5 moves of doom", because you really just come across as ignorant when you say that, because you ignore the fact that:

A) that is the WWE main event style. You're hard pressed to find a top WWE wrestler over the last couple decades that didn't have their own "moves of doom" sequence.
B) it's not always just about the moves that someone uses, but how they build up to using those moves in a logical fashion... which is something Hart excelled at

Let's get a lesson here Wrestling 101. Let's here how Hunter is a better worker than Bret Hart's given him credit for being.

 

[Jenna.]

I respect the hell out of Bret Hart, I really do. I never been a HHH fan. I absolutely hated him, back in the Attitude Era. When I watch wrestling nowadays and he comes out to these pops, I always feel like they are forced. Like right at commercial break they have someone tell the audience "Listen HHH is going to come out after commercial, we want you on the count of three scream and applaud as loud as you can." Him being a face has never been authentic to me. But with that said, me hating him so much back in the day, proves how damn good he was. Bret sounds like an old bitter fool. This is not a knock on his health or who he is as a wrestler or whatever, but he sounds ******ed. Triple H isn't even a top 1000 wrestler, really bro? He's never had great matches? C'mon son.

Trips, might not have been the best technical wrestler and he probably got handed a lot of shit to him being the husband of the boss' daughter, but he worked his ass off and made up his lack of "wrestling" skills in other places. Reason why I hated him so much, because he was such a great heel. He was an arrogant self centered asshole. It was believable to me at 8,9 10 years old. He could tell the hell out of a story, through his promos and matches. He's easily a top 20, top 15 wrestler in my opinion.

I'm sorry Mr. Hart you take a L here.

 

[BlackOut10]

To end this thread. I got to say its sad to see anyone who could even compare these too.. The whole thing is madness..

Given. Topic. Debate
Bret hart is a legend. Was triple h a great wrestler? No. WM27 and 28
One of a kind. Has he had a great match? No. HHH Contribution to wwe
Never be another
Unbelievable timeless matches

 

[harrythem]

In all fairness Bret classes his WM12 Iron Man match with HBK as a great match where as, to me, it was just a complete let-down filled with headlocks and other rest holds, so everyone has their own opinion....although to say Triple H has never had a great match is just mental.

Bret's entitled to his opinions, like everyone else, but I just don't think it's smart business to air something so blatantly over-exagerated and inflammatory about a guy who has the power to alter the way that the majority of wrestling fans can view Bret and his legacy to wrestling.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

From what I understand, Bret Hart has continued his remarks about Triple H in other interviews that he's participated in since this last one. It's got me wondering if the discussion panel at the Rumble, in which the Montreal Screwjob was the subject, has reopened some old wounds for Bret Hart. He seems to have genuinely moved past his animosity towards Shawn Michaels, so maybe he's transferred it to Triple H. Or, it's possible that he just simply, flat out doesn't like Triple H.

I respect Bret Hart and the man's entitled to his opinion. Looking back over his comments towards Triple H, to me, Bret Hart is starting to sound like another of these crotchety old veterans shooting off about how much they hate modern pro wrestling and/or some wrestlers. We've heard similar rantings from the likes of Bruno Sammartino and Superstar Billy Graham for years and it makes me wonder how much of this is genuinely how Bret Hart feels towards Trips and how much of it is just plain old fashioned ego that wrestling is going on without him and that guys who are contemporaries of his that he sees himself superior to are still active and relevant.

 

[Wrestling101]

From what I understand, Bret Hart has continued his remarks about Triple H in other interviews that he's participated in since this last one. It's got me wondering if the discussion panel at the Rumble, in which the Montreal Screwjob was the subject, has reopened some old wounds for Bret Hart. He seems to have genuinely moved past his animosity towards Shawn Michaels, so maybe he's transferred it to Triple H. Or, it's possible that he just simply, flat out doesn't like Triple H.

I respect Bret Hart and the man's entitled to his opinion. Looking back over his comments towards Triple H, to me, Bret Hart is starting to sound like another of these crotchety old veterans shooting off about how much they hate modern pro wrestling and/or some wrestlers. We've heard similar rantings from the likes of Bruno Sammartino and Superstar Billy Graham for years and it makes me wonder how much of this is genuinely how Bret Hart feels towards Trips and how much of it is just plain old fashioned ego that wrestling is going on without him and that guys who are contemporaries of his that he sees himself superior to are still active and relevant.

I've read before that a big part of the reason Hart started falling out of favor and the Kliq started getting more backstage political clout (I'm guessing this was sometime in '95 or early '96) was because Hart was so against any change the industry was going through or getting ready to go through. You're right, right now, he's just coming off as a modern era Billy Graham. Hart is his own biggest mark, and that's a dangerous thing. After bridges being repaired, it looks like he's trying to burn any remaining bridges all the way down. He just sounds like a jilted lover right now.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

From what I understand, Bret Hart has continued his remarks about Triple H in other interviews that he's participated in since this last one. It's got me wondering if the discussion panel at the Rumble, in which the Montreal Screwjob was the subject, has reopened some old wounds for Bret Hart. He seems to have genuinely moved past his animosity towards Shawn Michaels, so maybe he's transferred it to Triple H. Or, it's possible that he just simply, flat out doesn't like Triple H.

I respect Bret Hart and the man's entitled to his opinion. Looking back over his comments towards Triple H, to me, Bret Hart is starting to sound like another of these crotchety old veterans shooting off about how much they hate modern pro wrestling and/or some wrestlers. We've heard similar rantings from the likes of Bruno Sammartino and Superstar Billy Graham for years and it makes me wonder how much of this is genuinely how Bret Hart feels towards Trips and how much of it is just plain old fashioned ego that wrestling is going on without him and that guys who are contemporaries of his that he sees himself superior to are still active and relevant.

He flat out doesn't like either of them. Burying the hatched ≠ wanting to be friends, or "forgiving" them for destroying his career and the careers of so many others who the kliq/clique shit all over for years (Chris Candido immediately comes to mind). The way I see it, he was just "letting go" of the hatred that he was holding onto, and he covered this a bit in his book. What does that mean to me? That he still doesn't "like" either of them (nor should he), but that he's not going to focus much more of his life to keeping up with that dislike/hatred. I certainly don't think that added jab from Michaels when they had their show-down on Raw where he just had to insist that it was still all Bret's fault helped any, for the matter.

That said, my take on this is pretty straight forward. Triple H, to me, has always been a jack of all trades, master of none, so in terms of who I side with more with regard to Bret's comments? Bret. Easily. The term "great", when it comes to Triple H, gets thrown far too cavalierly for my taste, which is a slight against the men who were true greats.

I also find it hilariously inappropriate to throw the term "ego" around with Bret, like Triple H, of all people, is the picture of humility.

 

[theBec2101]

I thing Bret is slowly losing his mind. Also he shouldn’t bite the hand that feeds him. I know HHH might not be the best. He may not be top 5 or 10. He might be in some peoples top 50 or even 20-25. He might be in people top 5-10 heels too. He was a great heel. I think it is more personal and there is more to it then what we know.

 

[jacdnwarrior]

I'm sorry but this type of revisionism doesn't hold up when you post it to people who actually watched WCW and WWF back then.

Few points.

- 1996 was the WWF's worst year and that entire year was based on HBK being the top dog.



From a business standpoint, according to Shawn, Vince, and Bret from his book-- 1996 was the best business year they had in 6 years.

In a shoot interview from 1997 on RAW right in the middle of their intense heat, Shawn said that in 1996, when Bret took it off "to see if the WWF would fall flat on it's face without him," it was the best business WWF did in 6years. Vince said "You're right," when he asked Vince "your the boss am I right or wrong?" And Bret in his book said, when referring to that specific shoot Shawn did cus he took personal shots at Bret in it, that when he took the torch it was under the harsh light of sex and steroid scandals, which resulted in the bad business for WWF. Bret put most of that whole interview Shawn did in his book, explaining his side of it after each part Shawn said.

Please show me where in Bret Hart's book that Bret admits the company in 1996 had done the best business in 6 years. I just can't find it. What page is it on ? The only thing I saw was on pages 422-425 of his book. HBK makes the statement, in his little shoot on Bret in front of a crowd, Vince agrees with him right there. Is that what you're talking about ? Vince saying uh huh in front of a crowd to what HBK says, isn't proof.

Anyways, I disagree with Bret on HHH's place. HHH is definitely in the top 1000 performers, worked hard and had some good if not great matches. I am a fan watching on tv not a an actual worker and I'd be interested in knowing what Hart's criteria is for great performers, and I'm not a fan of HHH, but he deserves his due.

 

[edgefan14]

“Then you look at someone like Triple H. When I look at him he’s always had a good look as far as his body went he always had a pretty muscular physique. But you look at someone like Hunter and you wonder, what has he really done. One move that he ever
created that nobody ever saw before or some highspots or an idea for a match… He’s mostly a guy that just showed up and they made him. He’s always been a decent wrestler
I would consider him a good wrestler and pretty talented. But great? I don’t know, I
don’t think so."

DISAGREE. the pedigree. how many superstars have used variations of this move in any wrestling buisness? u culd create an entire offense using the pedigrees double underhook hold

“Before Triple H wrestled Undertaker last year, I remember watching it and going, ‘I can picture the whole match in my head, I can tell you exactly what this match is going to be
like and how it’s going to go. And I remember watching it and it went exactly how I
predicted it… I thought it was mediocre at best, maybe a 4 out of 10, or 3 out of 10."
“What has he ever done that’s great? He’s never had a great match, I don’t think ever. Whenever I look at Triple H’s matches, including the last one he had with Undertaker —and I don’t really mean it as a knock —but I told myself before I watched it because I’m trying to like Paul now these days, that I want to see him do something to make me think he’s got greatness in him."

DISAGREE. hhh vs orton vs cena at wrestlemania. HHH has main evented wrestlemania the 2nd most amount of times only behind HBK. HHH vs HBK. DX'S battles with the dudleys and they hardy's. HHH vs Cm Punk was actually a great match. HHH vs stone cold at no mercy 1999. HHH vs Cena vs Edge backlash 2006. HHH vs the rock backlash 2000. His street fight vs cactus jack at the royal rumble 2000. BS bye hart

 

[Y2J-LionTamer-Y2J]

MEJ HHH vs Taker did not entertain me much.
I thought I was the only one who thought it was mediocre haha.

Honestly I never got the HHH hype,and I mean never.

 

[theHeadliner]

Please show me where in Bret Hart's book that Bret admits the company in 1996 had done the best business in 6 years. I just can't find it. What page is it on ? The only thing I saw was on pages 422-425 of his book. HBK makes the statement, in his little shoot on Bret in front of a crowd, Vince agrees with him right there. Is that what you're talking about ? Vince saying uh huh in front of a crowd to what HBK says, isn't proof.

Anyways, I disagree with Bret on HHH's place. HHH is definitely in the top 1000 performers, worked hard and had some good if not great matches. I am a fan watching on tv not a an actual worker and I'd be interested in knowing what Hart's criteria is for great performers, and I'm not a fan of HHH, but he deserves his due.

P. 420: "Then Shawn turned to Vince, who'd been standing silently beside him all this time. 'You're the boss, amd I right or wrong?' Vince smirked and he replied 'you're right.' What else could Vince say at that moment, with Shawn on a rol on live TV? But the fact is when I began my first title reign, the WWF was in the midst of the steroid and sex scandals, and business dropped off because of negative press-- not because I was champion. In fact, I carried the championship during the darkest days in WWF history, and any wrestler who was there at that time knows that. Vince knows that, I told myself."

So there is Bret justifying that when business was worse during his run, that there are the reasons why. I totally agree with Bret in the negative press and the WWF becoming a bad word though.

 

[RobstarEWN]

Bret must have missed the two matches against Foley on PPV in January & February 2000, the 2/3 falls match with Austin at No Way Out in February 2001, vs HBK at Summerslam 2002, various matches against Rock from 1998-2000 etc.

This is what annoys me greatly about Bret-criticises people he doesn't for doing the same moveset-while doing the same moveset himself over & over. Criticises people he doesn't like for doing chops, while praising people like Dynamite who threw some of the stiffest chops ever. Criticises people for working too light like Honky & then bitches about guys like Goldberg working too stiff. Criticises people for hurting their opponents in the ring & praises Dynamite who gurt people for fun-including breaking Foley's jaw & kicking blades into his cousins head etc.

Bret is of course the guy who still thinks his hour ironman borefest, ego booked WM match with HBK is a classic for the ages. All of the matches mentioned above are superior to that.

 

[ElGenericoUsername]

HHH was/is a decent wrestler with absolutely superb in-ring psychology, up there with the best ever in that respect. Easily in the top 1000 no matter what criteria you use. Bret is a bitter old man indeed and any time he comes back it's cringe-worthy television. He's had a horrible fall from grace.

 

[lowandmighty]

I don't agree with Bret Hart's views. He's way more entitled to an opinion than me but then again he's a wrestler and not a fan.

Bret Hart looks at wrestling matches differently to how a fan does. Personally I've seen a few good matches from Triple H over the years from a fans point of view.
I didn't see that many "great" Bret Hart matches either so I think he should maybe just tone it down a little on the criticism and not go on the same path as the Warrior.

Bret Hart had a huge amount of good matches in his career, he never really looked all that huge but did get bigger toward the end of his career and wasn't that great a personality, very bland in many ways. Although he had very good mat skills, very good but not great in my opinion like Kurt Angle who is an Olympic gold medalist.

Bret hart was a good wrestler, but great? I don't know...