Are They Too Focused On The "E" Part?

[BillAlfonso]

First, an observation, to me the WWE is to the pro wrestling business as the NFL is to sports in general, they have a strangle hold. No matter what David Stern, Bud Selig, or Gary Betman(spelling?) does, the NBA, Major League Baseball, and NHL can't hold a candle to the NFL and pretty much is because the NFL puts out a much better basic product. How this translates into the WWE's problem is that they seem to forgo the basic product of wrestling, at least on Raw, to be entertaining. Here's what I mean, one week on the NFL Today, they were discussing the antics of the then Chad Johnson, you know him now as Chad Ochocinco. Bill Cowher said that his antics were unnecessary to which someone replied that he was merely trying to be entertaining. Bill Cowher was next heard to say that it's no question that we're in the entertainment business but the entertainment should come from the football being played, the basic product. Now, it seems to me that the WWE is trying to be entertaining first with the guest hosts and everything which is really hit or miss and I think Vince McMahon knows it because he alluded to it when William Shatner hosted. What do you think, are they putting too much emphasis on trying to entertaining instead of just putting on great matches and letting everything else fall in place?

 

[The Scarred One]

I certainly think so. With this stupid guest host angle going on, it makes me feel like I'm watching an episode of Saturday Night Live rather than Monday Night RAW. Every week, there's some stupid segment which involves the guest host that no one really cares for and makes me want to groan (the Price is Right, America's Got Talent, the rodeo contest, etc.).

That's not entertaining, it's stupid and I change the channel everytime something like that comes on because I don't want to see the likes of Santino Marella and Hornswoggle doing backstage segments that remind me of old school variety shows. That's going to alienate fans and make them want to stop watching. If TNA does eventually get their shit together, the emphasis on entertainment over wrestling might blow up in the WWE's face.

Personally, I think SmackDown is the better show because it places more emphasis on wrestling. But RAW is the "A" show and the WWE wants to make sure that it gets as much exposure as it can, which is why I guess they're doing the stupid crap they're currently doing with the guest hosts.

Wrestling may be considered a dirty word to Vince McMahon when talking about his product, but that's what his guys are suppose to be doing. Just let them go out there and do what they do best and let that be the entertainment.

 

[BillAlfonso]

Thanks for replying, I loved the avatar, I think Pillman is one of the things missing from pro wrestling today with his phenomenal focus on kayfabe. Seriously, the only guest host I wanted to see so far was Austin and the Hitman but Austin's was damaged because I think I've thrown my lot in with Impact on mondays but you can't keep me away from Smackdown and the Straight Edge Society. The only other host I'm looking forward to it The Great One.

 

[The Scarred One]

I forgot to mention this earlier but it just came to me.

The worst thing I've seen out of the whole entertainment emphasis, especially the guest hosts, was when Jon Heder and Don Johnson hosted one week and we actually saw Heder wrestle in a match. That just about made want to shut off my TV and walk away.

I remember seeing something about Mickey Rourke when he was promoting "The Wrestler" and his possible involvement with WWE for WrestleMania XXV. In it, he talked about how he refused to actually wrestle in a match because, even though he portrayed a wrestler in his movie, he wasn't part of the wrestling world. He said he had a lot of admiration and respect for what those guys do and didn't want to make a mockery of that.

When Heder wrestled, that's what he did: he made a mockery of what those guys do throughout the year. That was just as bad as having David Arquette win the WCW World Championship.

I have no problem with seeing celebrity involvement just as long as it's done right and done sparringly. But with the whole entertainment emphasis now in WWE, that's not the case anymore.

 

[Ghost of Benoit]

There is a flaw in your argument. The NFL is a "real" sport unlike pro wrestling. So, it is imperative that "real" sports focus on the sport and less on the entertainment. Pro wrestling has always been "fake". It made a name for itself based on storylines and larger than life characters. Its not real wrestling...its more a "wrestling-themed" soap opera. Key word is "themed"!!! A theme is merely a background and not the main focus/priority. If Vince wanted to be the focus, we would have an amateur "real" wrestling type event. They are merely actors on a tv sitcom with episodes...and YES WWE is a tv show...a wrestling-themed soap opera...plain and simple!

 

[The Poster known as GT]

Vince has always been about entertainment over wrestling. He see's proffesional wrestling as a form entertainment. He doesn't care what he does to entertain the crowd, as long as they're entertained. I remeber a qoute that he said when being interviewed for the Rise and Fall of WCW DVD when he stated that Ted Turner had called him as soon as he bought WCW. Turner said "vince im in the wrestling buisness" and vince replied "congrats ted, but im in the entertainment business" . So then it became pretty clear ( or at least to me) that Vince doesnt see Wrestling as anything but Entertainment, like a movie or a tv show. He's an entertainer who puts on wrestling matches for a living. He doesnt care how good the wrestling is, as long as people are cheering when they see their favorite guys, booing the most hated and most importantly, feeling like they got their moneys worth

 

[The Scarred One]

Vince has always been about entertainment over wrestling. He see's proffesional wrestling as a form entertainment. He doesn't care what he does to entertain the crowd, as long as they're entertained. I remeber a qoute that he said when being interviewed for the Rise and Fall of WCW DVD when he stated that Ted Turner had called him as soon as he bought WCW. Turner said "vince im in the wrestling buisness" and vince replied "congrats ted, but im in the entertainment business" . So then it became pretty clear ( or at least to me) that Vince doesnt see Wrestling as anything but Entertainment, like a movie or a tv show. He's an entertainer who puts on wrestling matches for a living. He doesnt care how good the wrestling is, as long as people are cheering when they see their favorite guys, booing the most hated and most importantly, feeling like they got their moneys worth

You're right in that sense. Wrestling, as far as Vince McMahon is concerned, is a form of entertainment. But I want to watch a match that has entertainment value. Something that is worth sitting down in front of the TV, purchasing the pay-per-view or going to the arena.

I know having amateur-based wrestling matches with no drama are boring, which is why the WWE provides over-the-top, soap opera-esque drama as part of its program. I watch the WWE to be entertained. But when I see someone singing, dancing or performing stupid magic tricks on it instead of actual matches, I'm not entertained.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

For most of 2009, the WWE's emphasis was primarily on the "Entertainment" aspect, at least when it came to Raw. For much of the second half of 2009, what you saw on Raw primarily were skits, most of which were bad, and shows that were set up primarily to revolve around the guest hosts. Sometimes that worked out alright and sometimes it didn't.

In 2010, I think that the WWE has put much more emphasis on the wrestling aspect of their product. The episodes of Raw are no longer centered around the guest hosts as they were in 2009. Some of the guest hosts haven't been great but they're also not dominating the show either. If you look at 2010 thus far, more emphasis has been put on wrestling content on Raw and wrestling in general has been the product in trade. The two ppvs the WWE have put on this year, in my view, have been two very good ones and the WWE has been using Raw to build these ppvs and that's something that should always be among the top priorities of WWE television as ppv buys are a major source of revenue. WrestleMania is another prime example of the WWE becoming more focused on what ultimately brought them to the dance. There isn't going to be some 25 minute concert at WM this year by Kid Rock, Snoop Dogg won't be part of some lame Divas match in which he beats up Santino Marella, the overly inflated ego of some boxer isn't going to be pumped up even more by "beating up" a WWE wrestler 10 times his size. And that's EXACTLY the way it should be. Feuds and wrestling matches that contain emotional and personal touches are the centerpiece of WrestleMania this year, not celebrities.

Now, Vince McMahon may see wrestling as entertainment and to some degree that's true. I've heard some people compare pro wrestling to performance art before. I can't say that I've been thrilled with the wrestling content of every Raw episode, but it's been much better this year than last year. But, the fact remains that you're not going to get 5.5 million people to watch a show that contains only wrestling matches. There has to be something underlying the matches, there has to be some drama and characters to make people tune in.

Some call TNA an alternative but it's really not if you think about it. They do more backstage segments, promos, even a few skits now and again than matches. Now, it may not have always been that way but that's the way it is now. To be fair, you may see an episode of iMPACT! that has 5 or 6 matches on the card, but hardly a single one of them will be longer than 2 or 3 minutes. So, I don't really see a difference in wrestling content and/or quality of TNA puts on half a dozen matches that total 15 minutes and the WWE puts only 2 or 3 matches that equal the same amount of time.

 

[Uncle Sam]

Professional wrestling and entertainment are one and the same thing - part and parcel. Someone has a, I dunno, eighty minute iron man match - that's entertainment. Hornswoggle cuts a brief promo on the importance of proper testicle support before humping David Arquette's leg - that's professional wrestling. To try and separate the two and say one needs more of a focus than the other is an excercise in futility.

 

[MEGAFAN420]

I am SICK of the stupid guest host segments every week. It is a major waste of time! I will never go to a RAW event again as long as there are guest hosts. The audience just eats it up while real "wrestling" is happening on SPIKE TV!

Here is what happens EVERY Monday night on RAW:

1)The Bella Twins escort the guest host out of a vehicle, or are shown backstage with the guest host as arm and/or eye candy

2)Hornswaggle somehow is involved in a skit with the guest host

3)Santino shows up with the guest host and acts like a stupid uni-brow'd jackass... ha, ha, ha, it's so funny I want to piss myself just thinking about it! I can't wait for this week's guest host and to hear Santino's broken English! Can you detect the sarcasm?

Remember when Santino used to win matches. He is a former 2-Time IC Champion, now a "funny" low-card jobber! He beat Umaga the first time he won the IC Title which at the time was no joke!

The pre-recorded guest host segments are really annoying! ZZ Top was nothing but pre-recorded segments and they never went out to the ring.

Educated wrestling fans need to change the channel to TNA IMPACT on Monday Nights. We need to show the WWE that they need to step up their product on Monday Nights. I watch one, and record the other, like I used to when WCW existed. Hell, I want more wrestling on TV because I love it!

 

[marylandman301]

I feel that the WWE has gotten the shows back into whats important.WRESTLING. NXT is a good example. Raw and Smackdown, especially Raw is getting more focused on the wrestling. I dont see the guest host taking up all the time on the shows like last year.

 

[Marko Markovic]

Ha,you sad about Jon Heder and Don Johnson and they are one of the better pair of guest host GM lately.How come you never mention Jewel and her hubby and the stupid Bull ridding diva segment or Jerry Springer who I think is one of the worst guest host ever.At least Jon Heder did something interesting and involve himself into show rather than promothing his movie/series/TV show/book and not even caring about show

Santino is hilarious at the moments,Hornswogle is stupid but the kids love him and divas are there for adult male audience mostly(seriously,if they wanted them to be wrestlers they would wrestle suited not skimpy dressed and with fake tits)

WWE is more about E because thats what they do,they provide entertaiment to us.If it was different we would watch pro-wrestling instead and none of the stuff will be scripted

 

[Zeven_Zion]

Well I want entertainment from the matches not Hornswoggle or Santino. That's not entertainment to me because I'm not a 4 years old child.

Comedy doesn't ALWAYS equal entertainment.

Besides, each and every week we see the same match. When's the last time you saw something different? I get pissed when people go "Oh Triple H vs Orton was a great Match last week". no it wasn't, it's the same match we've seen before with a different finish.

 

[Attitude]

First I have a question. Does Donald Trump still own Raw or has the WWE dropped that storyline and hope we forget about Donald Trump?

Second, I didn't mind the guest host storyline at first. I thought it was awesome having Shaq host Raw. I've wanted to see a Big Show-Shaq confrontation for a while and finally got to see it. Then they had guest like Dusty Rhodes, Sgt. Slaughter, and Ted Dibiase. I didn't mind because they had something to do with wrestling. Then we had Dennis Miller, Bob Barker, and Cedric the Entertainer. They had nothing to do with wrestling and didn't really help anything. I still don't mind the guest hosts as long as they make sense like Brett Hart and Stone Cold where they were able to build and further storylines.

Yes, Vince focuses on the E to much. The guests host is a great example of that. Other great examples of things that had nothing to do with wrestling and pointless storylines is finding out Hornswaggle was Vince's son, The Great Khali Kiss Kam, Anything Satino does, and the Diva that only sings. These are wastes of time. They don't further storylines and have nothing to do with Raw, the wwe, or wrestling.

 

[The Poster known as GT]

You're right in that sense. Wrestling, as far as Vince McMahon is concerned, is a form of entertainment. But I want to watch a match that has entertainment value. Something that is worth sitting down in front of the TV, purchasing the pay-per-view or going to the arena.

I know having amateur-based wrestling matches with no drama are boring, which is why the WWE provides over-the-top, soap opera-esque drama as part of its program. I watch the WWE to be entertained. But when I see someone singing, dancing or performing stupid magic tricks on it instead of actual matches, I'm not entertained.

Then thats something to gripe about with the wrestlers themselves. They are the only ones who take pride in how good the quality of their matches are. Thats not to say management wouldn't complain if flop after flop was happening but unless they give the wrestlers orders to say "have a PPV quality match." or "X, go lose in a squash match to Y", it is totally up to the Wrestlers how good the match is going to be.

 

[The Poster known as GT]

First I have a question. Does Donald Trump still own Raw or has the WWE dropped that storyline and hope we forget about Donald Trump?

Second, I didn't mind the guest host storyline at first. I thought it was awesome having Shaq host Raw. I've wanted to see a Big Show-Shaq confrontation for a while and finally got to see it. Then they had guest like Dusty Rhodes, Sgt. Slaughter, and Ted Dibiase. I didn't mind because they had something to do with wrestling. Then we had Dennis Miller, Bob Barker, and Cedric the Entertainer. They had nothing to do with wrestling and didn't really help anything. I still don't mind the guest hosts as long as they make sense like Brett Hart and Stone Cold where they were able to build and further storylines.

Yes, Vince focuses on the E to much. The guests host is a great example of that. Other great examples of things that had nothing to do with wrestling and pointless storylines is finding out Hornswaggle was Vince's son, The Great Khali Kiss Kam, Anything Satino does, and the Diva that only sings. These are wastes of time. They don't further storylines and have nothing to do with Raw, the wwe, or wrestling.

WWE totally dropped the trump storyline. Investors got confused because alot of them thought it was real and it caused alot of panic.

One last thing. The Guest host concept wasn't even Vince's idea. It was NBC's. NBC which owns both SYFY and USA networks ( the networks which air RAW and NXT ) has a special relationship with WWE as they are the one outside influeince that the the WWE's Management has to listien to. The orginal idea was to get Ric Flair to be the GM of Raw but since he couldn't do it NBS suggested the Guest host idea, and WWE obliged

 

[LigerBomb]

The E part is what drives the cash registers, so no, they are not overly focus on it, at least not to their detriment. At the end of the day this is a business and they need consumers of the highest amount. It's somewhat accepted that the iwc marks watch no matter what, sure they bitch and moan, but WWE gets their cash all the same, so no real reason to appease them. Instead they're going after the casual fan who could give two shits about "work rate" and the technical qualities of the matches, and instead just wants some cheap, quick, meaningless (and often mindless) entertainment.

 

[AndyUK]

It's part of pro wrestling. I don't complain about the skits and segments because we're not getting enough wrestling because we get that on PPV, I complain about the skits and segments because a lot of them are absolutely pointless and are just bad television, such as a lot of the Guest Host stuff.

Look at the Attitude Era. It's largely considered the best time to be a wrestling fan. When you think of that era, you probably don't think of the great wrestling because there really wasn't that much. You think about the storylines. Most RAW's had very little wrestling on them during 1998 and 1999. The difference was, those segments were actually entertaining and were to further a story.

 

[Blade]

Are you kidding me? So, basically you're saying that great wrestling matches don't entertain you? Professional wrestling is entertainment. It's not a sport, it's a fictional semi-athletic drama programme of some sort. That people watch for ENTERTAINMENT. If WWE could entertain people by having 1 hour, 50 minutes of skits and segments and 10 minutes of wrestling on Raw, they would. But they're aiming towards wrestling fans, so that's not acceptable.

Wrestling all the time would make people sick of wrestling, you need promos and segments to give people a break. All segments would anger wrestling fans, so they've got to have a few wrestling matches in there. And yes, they will have comedy skits because every drama needs comic relief. And yes, the comedy segments will be hit and miss, but they're a wrestling show not a comedy show.

Basically, your complaint is completely and utterly unfounded.

 

[Travaje]

I agree with Ghost of Benoit. I'd also like to add this to his argument.

People forget that these wrestlers are wrestling 300 dates a year. It's no longer 1985. Ric Flair used to have 60 minute matches, but back then, you could put someone in a headlock and that one move in itself would take 3 minutes. Is that what you really want to see? I highly doubt it. I'm gonna guess you want to see spot after spot and after spot. When you're wrestling 300 dates a year and doing these kinds of spots, whoever you are, you're gonna get hurt eventually. The office has too much time and money invested into these wrestlers and their company to risk their attractions getting hurt frequently. They can't afford it. These guys have to pick their spots.

So, instead of having a 2-hour show, half of which if filled with headlocks, arm bars, sleeper holds, and the such, they've replaced that with Diva matches, guest hosts, and other segments. Be honest....between the two, and you have to choose one...which would you pick?

I think quite a bit of you want way too much out of these guys and your expectations are very unrealistic and they need to be tempered. On the PPV's, the wrestlers should be taking spots and wrestling their asses off (and keep in mind, there are 12 PPV's now, there used to be just 4). At the house shows, they should be having these 80's style matches. But on RAW and Smackdown, they are just trying to make their product known and relevant. The office is exactly doing the right thing with their guys.

If these guys wrestled the way you want them to, they'd all drop dead by time they were 40.