After 2/14/2011, have your standard of main eventer gone up?

[huegtoad]

I refuse to get into the whole IWC and insulting people and who is right and whatnot, this is simply my opinion.

First of all, i watched that segment twice last night, it was that good. It was so fun and he was having fun. I loved it!!! But Cena's promo at the beginning was fun IMO. Do Vince Steph and HHH need to loosen the leash on Cena? of course but he's still effective. Alberto Del Rio is OUTSTANDING. Just his facial expressions alone are priceless, he just hasn't built the equity to headline Mania in my opinion. Remember the Rock midcarded WM13, 14 before being McMahon's pawn in 15(even though he was champ and preformed brilliantly, that match was really ABOUT Austin VS McMahon)16 was a fatal fourway so it wasn't until 17 where the Rock had that equity in the fanbase to headline the event full throttle. Same with HHH. Austin had an entire career before that equity paid off. WWE needs to use Rock, HHH, Undertaker, Y2J to buy some time and to have ADR, the Miz, Wade Barrett to build equity. If they share the card with the legends who are still able enough to go it will fast track their equity a bit. What this ISN'T is Hogan Vs Piper in a cage. As long as you don't put last night on that level, it's cool

 

[gooseholla]

Gimmicks have always been bad in the WWE/F once you get out of the main event league.... always... not just the Attitude era!

However, once Rock/Austin left after 2004, and with no top WCW guys left or being squashed I stopped watching as the new lot - orton, cena, etc... coupled with benoit, rvd, angle, jericho just didn't do it for me - they were all just too dull at the time for me to take an interest. (Oh, and once you have to start pushing JBL to the world title, when others missed out who should have held it, then you know WWE ran outta ideas and life!) They lacked that kinda, what is it, larger than life feel about them that made you feel like you weren't watching reality but a damn good superhero/action movie in a wrestling ring, with great dialogue and skits in between.

 

[a member of wwe universe]

They lacked that kinda, what is it, larger than life feel about them that made you feel like you weren't watching reality but a damn good superhero/action movie in a wrestling ring, with great dialogue and skits in between.

And thats what made the "wwf" so special. It captivated unlike any form of entertainment. The great one's return showed the current roster of the wwe is no doubt stale, dull. I just dont see any current talent in that mediocre roster that is capable to even reach 50% of the stardom, charisma of the rock austin hbk, u name it. You just dont get that type of intangible larger than life feeling from these new guys.

Your ziggler, swagger, shamemus, mcyntyre etc. dont have the ability to produce those larger than life effect. I dont see them to have the personality and character to become huge. When i mean huge i am not expecting these guys should be on the rock/austin level. But in the level like Kurt angle, eddie guerrero, chris jericho, mankind, hhh. These guys were just as entertaining as rock/austin.

I dont buy these young guy will step up and show true ability. That is BS because those guys i mentioned have been offered respectively an opportunity to be in the main spot and they all flopped (time will tell for ziggler), even shamemus. If shamemus is as good as he is, im pretty sure hhh wouldnt have ditched him for taker. The Miz is a good example that proved my point. He stepped up immediately the moment he was given that one chance in the main spotlight. So there is no excuse.

It is not completely the talents itself fault. I blamed the wwe for their inability to provide the proper build up and opportunity for them to showcase freely.

 

[triple_b2k]

My standard for mic skills has gone up.

Comparing to a lot of other guys on the mic, The Rock is/was energetic, spoke quickly and didn't mess up his lines. Guys that people think are good on the mic (Miz, Orton, Cena, etc) speak soooo slowly and pronounce every single word. There's no energy behind it. Yes they say the right things at the right time, but they're just slow and so dull compared to the Rock's energy. Hopefully people will step up and speak with more energy.

 

[Lawliet]

The AE had more than just The Rock and Stone Cold.

They had Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley, Triple H, a more edgy version of DX, Chris Jericho, Kurt Angle, Chris Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, Undertaker, Kane and Big Show.

They had talent and star power across the board who can control the crowd to a degree. They were all younger and some were in their prime.

But that was a different time. This generation may lack of a megastar on the caliber of The Rock, Stone Cold, and Hogan from the past, but this generation do have talent. The ability to cut a promo and control the crowd standard probably went up since The Rock came back.

 

[MrDASHINGaRROGaNCE]

My standards never changed...

I don't consider Miz Or Cm punk to be main eventers mainly because they talk so much and can hardly back it up in the ring. You don't have to be the best ring savy guy but at least put on a passable match.

Which they both fail to do so weekly back in the days Main event guys could talk the talk and walk the walk in the ring. No The Rock was never a great wrestler nor was HHH or Austin but they knew how to work. A crowd in their matches that's what it is all about getting the fans emotionally invested.

Now days Cm punk and Miz/Cena/Rey/ etc, all have the PG main eventer thing going on and it's quite awful. Reason why most of my favs are mid carders. End.

 

[DanielJames]

just cause the product isnt as good as it use to be doesn't make it terrible. you just cant get past the fact that we caught wrestling at its highest peak and now thats its stumbled down a little bit you've becomed spoiled.
yeah the Rock can cut a promo better than any stars of today could. but Daniel Bryan could wrestle circles around the attitude era. the main eventers aren't as big of stars because wrestling isnt as popular anymore so not everyone knows the wrestlers of today. but in the wwe universe they are stars. some guys would of lasted during the attitude era, maybe not being as good as they are now, but they would of lasted.
maybe you should be a little more open minded about this
its like any other tv show, you gotta stick with it through the highs and the lows

My standards never changed...

I don't consider Miz Or Cm punk to be main eventers mainly because they talk so much and can hardly back it up in the ring. You don't have to be the best ring savy guy but at least put on a passable match.

Which they both fail to do so weekly back in the days Main event guys could talk the talk and walk the walk in the ring. No The Rock was never a great wrestler nor was HHH or Austin but they knew how to work. A crowd in their matches that's what it is all about getting the fans emotionally invested.

Now days Cm punk and Miz/Cena/Rey/ etc, all have the PG main eventer thing going on and it's quite awful. Reason why most of my favs are mid carders. End.

cm punk is one of the best main eventers in the company. he could wrestle. he made cena look good in their match when mason ryan debuted.
cm punk knows how to work the crowd.

 

[vandalsavage]

My standards have always been high but after seeing The Great One just giving one of his greatest promos.I have realized no one on the current roster can touch him.Now after Raw I think Vince's standards have risen let's see if creative and Cena and Miz can beat The Rock's promo.

 

[MrDASHINGaRROGaNCE]

just cause the product isnt as good as it use to be doesn't make it terrible. you just cant get past the fact that we caught wrestling at its highest peak and now thats its stumbled down a little bit you've becomed spoiled.
yeah the Rock can cut a promo better than any stars of today could. but Daniel Bryan could wrestle circles around the attitude era. the main eventers aren't as big of stars because wrestling isnt as popular anymore so not everyone knows the wrestlers of today. but in the wwe universe they are stars. some guys would of lasted during the attitude era, maybe not being as good as they are now, but they would of lasted.
maybe you should be a little more open minded about this
its like any other tv show, you gotta stick with it through the highs and the lows



cm punk is one of the best main eventers in the company. he could wrestle. he made cena look good in their match when mason ryan debuted.
cm punk knows how to work the crowd.

If WWE is the pinacle of pro wrasslin why shouldn't i expect nothing but the best?? I mean the company has been around for a long time beating out numerous companies like WCW and ECW to name a few.

Simple fact is WWE has gotten lazy because there isn't any opposition to spark a fire under their tails. So they make guys like Sheamous and The miz top guys when they're far from main event status/material. And with WWE's fanbase being majority kids they eat it up because hello they're kids.

About C.m. punk's in ring prowess i know you guys here in IWC land think he's a wrestling god and such but truth be told he's just like Miz.
Sure he can cut a good promo but beyond that is limited yes i've watched him in the indies wasn't impressed in the least.

He's average at best and has to be carried or a train wreck will happen...
I can prove it go youtube Cm punk Botches....Nuff said.

I know many won't like me for what i said but it's my opinion and i wasn't disrespectful or cynical in anyway. End rant.

 

[Serious Mozzarella]

Two things, OP.

1. You're comparing someone who's an absolute legend in the business to a group of guys who can barely maintain star power in the main event. The Rock has years on these guys, so it's not really a surprise that he can speak better than anyone on the roster at the moment.

2. The only reason we're looking at this as the "best promo of the past 5 years" is because of nostalgia. Yeah, it was a great promo, but if someone else other than the Rock delivered it, it would have been, "Yeah, that was a pretty good promo," rather than the absolute sperm-fest that exploded off in the 2/14 Raw LD.

 

[The Jeff]

Originally Posted by SmattyG View Post
I may cop a lot of heat for this - but am I the only one who thought The Rock seemed outdated? It reminded me of the Eminem line about kids embarrassed that their parents still listen to Elvis. Sure, The Rock was massively over in the Attitude Era and is probably the best on the mic of all time. I was just thinking "what's the point?" the whole time though.

It took 20 minutes away from the youth movement. It made WWE's top star look foolish. It made anyone over 20 forget that Morrison, Sheamus, Kofi, Drew, Barrett, Ziggler etc even exist.

Reminds me of an old Stone Roses' lyric - "The past was yours but the future's mine" Unless it's Rock V Cena at WM27 this was awful. Mason Ryan should've come out and kicked Rock's ass. Keep in mind I'm 40 and lived through Attitude in my 20s and consider it probably the greatest era in all of professional wrestling. But it's 2011 now not 1998, and I don't see what relevance The Rock has in WWE today.

So no my standards haven't changed - Rock and Stone Cold and Hogan and Flair are of course all better than today's stars - but why oh why would you highlight it this close to the biggest PPV of the year?
Listen, you fucktard. Hopefully you can take some time from pleasuring yourself to thoughts of Mason Ryan's oily ass and take what I'm about to say to heart.

You're pissed that Rock came back for two reasons:

1) He's too old for your liking. Your whole "he ruined the Youth Movement" thing reminds me of someone of a pedophile who's pissed when his kiddie porn site has a porn star over the age of 18 on it. If you don't understand that analogy, it probably means you possess the same mentality of the 12-year-old girls you make knuckle children to.

2) You said you're in your forties, which makes you older than The Rock, and thus jealous of the fact that he's a millionaire Superstar and you're a loser stuck at an hourly-wage job. Of course you would be pissed that he can come back and, in 20 minutes, make more money than you do in ten years and make more people like him than you've come across in your whole miserable existence.

Eat shit. The Rock is the greatest thing since, well, The Rock. Sorry he killed your young-guy-induced boner.

You may now return to Cheetos, Vasoline and images of middle school cheerleaders.

 

[itssoeasy123]

No, not at all.

All the young superstar's have a bright future ahead of themselves. Alot of guy's are very talented today. Guy's like Bryan, Ziggler, Barret, Del Rio, Punk, Miz, have very good future's ahead of them, which includes multiple title reign's and Wrestlemania main event's.

No, my standard of a mian evnter has not gone up. If your talented enough, the fan's love you or hate you, you exceptional good on the mic, your a main eventer. It's been like that since Vince McMahon first bought over Hulk Hogan.

 

[a member of wwe universe]

Two things, OP.

1. You're comparing someone who's an absolute legend in the business to a group of guys who can barely maintain star power in the main event. The Rock has years on these guys, so it's not really a surprise that he can speak better than anyone on the roster at the moment.

2. The only reason we're looking at this as the "best promo of the past 5 years" is because of nostalgia. Yeah, it was a great promo, but if someone else other than the Rock delivered it, it would have been, "Yeah, that was a pretty good promo," rather than the absolute sperm-fest that exploded off in the 2/14 Raw LD.

If a guy who has been absent for 7 years and can still cut a LIVE promo that is regarded by many ppl as the best in the last 5 years, then i think it is fair to make the comparison. No, i dont expect anyone to be on the same level as the rock, but i think it is a reasonable them to have the mic skill like angle, jericho, guerrero those guys. How long did it take rock, austin, cena, angle, jericho,hhh etc breakout in the wwe? all within three years. Austin and jericho may have worked longer prior working in the wwe, but they were never given the opportunity.

What exactly do you mean guys who can barely maintain star power? I thought the wwe is desperate to build new star. The young guys have been given their respectful opportunity by fails to make improvement, including mic skill. The Miz is a good example. He capitalized the opportunity and improve all areas of what it needed to get him over. So it is stupid to make excuses the young guys' inability to cut a good promo because of the lack of opportunity and experience.

I may agree with you if everyone cuts the same promo, it is considered decent and boring (it is the reason why the young guys fail to breakthrough). Though You failed to make a point saying the promo would be considered decent anyhow if somebody else can cut similar promo level as the rock. Simply because nobody can.

 

[Jason Scene]

I have to disagree with the opinion of The Rock or Austin not matching that of Hulk Hogan's. Hogan's reputation is lying on the ground, old, fragile and getting constantly beaten with baseball bats. Nobody cares for Hulk Hogan now, Hulk Hogan couldn't boost the ratings of TNA iMPACT! The ratings are increasing now, and only a miniature bit, but Hogan isn't even involved. Hogan doesn't draw for TNA, guys like AJ Styles, Doug Williams, Samoa Joe and Mr. Anderson draw. Hulk Hogan means little to wrestling today.

The Rock and Stone Cold Steve Austin are going from strength-to-strength. They've out-done Hogan, both in and out of the ring.

I agree with todays WWE television being more interesting and intelligently thought out than that of the Attitude Era. It takes actual skill to be doing well when your main demographic is kids, and you're rated PG. During the Attitude Era all you had to do was get guys to blade, stick a sex storyline in there, have a Hart either die or get screwed over and BOOM! You had ratings.

I'm for, todays young wrestlers. In both ROH and WWE.

WWE have good young talent. Ted DiBiase Jr isn't allowed to wrestle to his full capability. Watch his Japan stuff and you'll see what I'm talking about. Drew McIntyre was pretty good last night, and I'm not that much of a fan of his but last night I thought he was great. His aggression was really impressive, and within 50 seconds of him being out of his pod he botched a Powerslam on Rey through the "glass" and drove Barrett through another pod.

I could go on and list off every person. Tyson Kidd, Justin Gabriel, Cody Rhodes, Alberto Del Rio and others but there is no point. They all have positives and they all have negatives, its how shit rolls. WWE have a whole development fed full of good talent as well. Look at Tyler Black, he's sitting there. I watch his FCW stuff, he runs rings around guys like Richie Steamboat.

I prefer the WWE Superstars of today and going back to 2004 than the ones from the Attitude Era personally. AE brought names like The Rock, Stone Cold, Triple H and others up but let me remind you that when they all started even their careers were rocky; no pun intended on Dwayne's former ring name.

Stone Cold was the fucking Ringmaster. Triple H was a blue blood in Hunter Hearst Helmsley and The Rock was Rocky Maivia. And all three of them sucked in those carnations.

You've to give the guys today time. Dolph Ziggler has really came on leaps and bounds, from his former alias as fucking Nicky!

 

[nwocongo]

I have been dissapointed in what has been passed off as main events for some time now. Some of the guys now have a lot of potential, I think if used properly Sheamus, Ziggler,Drew Mc and a handful of others could both be believable main eventers, but when I see the Miz as champ nad Orton vs Cena for the 337th time I just feel kinda sorry for the younger fans now. Think back to when a PPV would have a mid card IC title match like HHH vs The Rock, or HBK and Bret Hart or HBK and Razor Ramon or Diesel vs. Razor, and now we have to settle for Miz and Cena as a main event. Basically my whole point here is that 10-15 years ago guys like CM Punk, the Miz, Wade Barret and even John Cena would be the generic jobber with no introduction who is already standing in the ring when Raw comes back from commercial break.