A Discussion About Vince McMahon

[NYSandman]

Something on the aniversary show, which was very, very good, BTW, caught my attention.

Why is it that every other wrestler in the company can, in extreme situations, break character except Vince?

I thought of this when Austin invited all the wrestlers out, and even heels showed up. I thought it would have been good for them to help Vince to his feet, and show him some respect, which, yes, regardless of what anyone says, he deserves. 15 years is impressive, and he is largely responsible.

I know these decisions are Vince's, but why? It seems as if he's a little TOO into his character. I can see that when he addresses the troops, he really feels for them. He has the guts to perform where the NFL, NBA and other big sports dare not tread. He's allowed himself to be beaten senseless for the sake of a storyline, and has given guys 2nd chances who really didn't deserve them.

I find it interesting that the man who basically buried KAYFAB will not come out of character for any reason. I would say that in this day and age, even marks know that Vince McMahon is real and Mr. McMahon is a character. You no longer need fear the fans if you come out of character.

So, why is it that Vince never shows his true self to the fans? Is it a personal fear, or is it from a business perspective.

I also find it VERY interesting that the fans, who, again, I think are FAR more educated than fans from the past when it comes to angles, boo Vince constantly, even when he doesn't deserve it. You will always hear a heel being cheered from time to time, depending on circumstance, yet Vince is universally hated.

I think he has made some bad choices in angles and who he pushes, but I don't TRULY hate the man. I think he has done a great deal with very little, and he is self-made, which I respect.

He thought of things his father could only dream of, and turned A territory into THE territory.

It's a shame he doesn't allow himself to receive praise, because we, as fans, are only explosed to Mr. McMahon. It's interesting to ponder what this man is like in his personal life, what his family and friend's true feelings are towards him, and how does he truly regard us fans, as money machines, or as people who have helped him to succeed.

Maybe a biography will be written one day. We have bits and pieces from other wrester's books, but don't truly know Vince at all. I hope he's nothing like his character, and I don't believe he is.

Let's give Vinny Mac some love.

 

[RandyKO]

Why would he want to expose his personal life in front of all these people. It's like saying this about a soap oprea as wrestling is like one, we see characters and not the real person. Isn't that what we are only supposed to see?
I think his character is fantastic. I don't hate the person Vince McMahon because he obviously isn't like his character and to be honest I love his character, I think he is f**king hillarious! I would love him as a dad

 

[NYSandman]

I didn't mean expose his personal life. I meant that he should willing to accept praise and adulation, and break character like some of the other guys do.

Unless a wrestler dies, or he is in Iraq, Vince never breaks character.

 

[Mad Metal]

I'm not going to try to be "original" or "different" nor do I care what anyone else thinks, but honestly I like Vince McMahon as well as Mr. McMahon the character.

Let's start off with Mr. McMahon the character. Nothing like seeing a old man snapping and losing his temper just to make himself look like an ass. Nothing like seeing an old man with a huge ego always trying to overcome the odds whenever he always ends up looking like a jabroni. Even though majority of the times the Mr. McMahon character is nothing more than a jabroni that puts other people over to make them look good (Austin, Shawn Michaels, DX, etc), but at the same time it's entertaining. I guess the only way you can see things from my perspective is if you have a good sense of humor. Says who that bosses can't work? Verne Gagne was the champion of the AWA and was a major star, of course the difference is Verne was a good athlete and Vince is about making others look good by having other wrestlers make Vince look like an ass on the camera.

Here are my reasons why I like Vince McMahon the character. Look at Eric Bischoff trying to "break the rules" in pro wrestling to create controversy by becoming the number one promotion in America. Look at TNA when they tried (and yes, I did say TRY, not succeed) to create controversy last year by striking at the WWE with VKM and such. Who was the original one to create controversy in professional wrestling to ultimately succeed by breaking all of the rules? It was Vince McMahon who made controversy as an essential piece into the industry. If it weren't for Vince's success that was a huge influence, I doubt WCW would of been as big as it was. After Vince McMahon striked and started competing and "taking over", later on you have so many promoters that were influenced by Vince McMahon trying to follow his footsteps trying to take over as well as trying to create controversy to get disclosure. If it weren't for Vince's vision, do you honestly think there would be a TNA? Do you think wrestling would of reached it's all time high in the 90's? Or maybe we would of continue seeing wrestling matches that would consist of wrestlers putting on a headlock for 40 minutes throughout a match.

I constantly hear how Vince McMahon is responsible for how low professional wrestling is in 2007. In all honesty, I believe the only problem/s are Vince put the incorrect people in charge including his daughter and Johnny Ace. In the current year, majority of the times you would hear how Triple H or Stephanie turned down a genius idea. A lot of the times you would hear Johnny Ace is reaching out to male and female models for a possible future in the WWE. Like I just said, the main problem is the people that Vince McMahon puts in charge because every time when I seen Vince's own ideas thrown on the air, they are genius. Some were probably "bad taste" but like I said, this industry is about controversy and that's what Mr. McMahon knows best. Take his limousine explosion as an example and look how much the rating went up the next week as well as the exposure from the media and such.

I also think a lot of people usually gets the wrong impressions on Mr. McMahon. Lately there was so many WWE releases and many of these wrestlers had nothing but good things to say about the WWE and Mr. McMahon. I mean hell, recently I heard an interview by Kurt Angle saying how he gave kudos to Vince for letting him go after Vince heard Angle giving his notice and Vince was able to feel Angle's pain. The only times I would ever hear anything bad about Mr. McMahon wouldn't be anything directly to him, but to the WWE staff that would control the creative as well as hiring these "bad athletes".

Keep in mind that Vince doesn't get any days off. He works 24/7. You never hear how him and his wife spent the holidays or the weekend in Australia having the time of their lives. You never hear Vince being spotted in public having a good time. Even in wrestling matches, you would see him go through just about anything.

ALSO... you don't have to be a "mark" to be able to admit to any of what I typed above. I love wrestling. If there were a Verne Gagne discussion, I would give him credit. If there were a Eric Bischoff discussion, I would give him his credit too and the same with any wrestler or promoter that helped to make the industry I love to become a world wide force.

 

[Russo McMahon]

Most of you are WWE marks who idolize anything with a WWE logo on it and think Vince McMahon is this god-like genius.

McMahon is just a great business man and he also happens to be a good on-air performer. Creatively, he ran out in the mid 90s when he was getting his ass kicked by WCW.

That's where Vince Russo comes in, he reinvented WWF TV in the late 90s and helped put WWF back on track, eventually allowing them to be on the top spot again.

McMahon's character is good, it's entertaining, intense, it was more realistic in the Attitude Era though, in the Austin/McMahon feud, and other angles of that time.

Today, it's still entertaining, just a little over the top at times, and a little too charactertured. Still, it can still be entertaining. He's about the best on-air character they have, none of their wrestlers have the Rock or Austin edge. Somebody on creative needs to come along again and throw the rule book out the window, and create big stars, and place them in highly entertaining, intrigueing angles, we haven't seen that since the Attitude Era really.

 

[Colamania]

Most of you are WWE marks who idolize anything with a WWE logo on it and think Vince McMahon is this god-like genius.

There it is. The sentance that will finally make me break my run and dive back into the pit that is WZ's WWE discussions. Here comes the rant.

Just because you appreciate the fact that Vince McMahon is willing to take an ass kicking at his age to put over his company's stars, just because you respect a man who has done more for the pro wrestling business than any other, you're suddenly a WWE mark?

First up, the WWE is the largest pro wrestling company in the world. If you're a fan of pro wrestling, odds are WWF/E is where you began. So you're a "WWE Mark" if you ever liked it? I watch WWE, of course I do, and I respect both Vince's business accumen and his dedication to his wrestlers and company, along with the sport itself. But I'm not a WWE mark. I know they make bad decisions. Vince's limo. Bringing back Saturday Night's Main Event. John Cena's 13 month title reign. Khali... well, just Khali full stop. But Vince himself is a great man who has, I'll say it again, has done more for the business than any other. Without Vince's input, pro wrestling wouldn't have taken off. People in Britain (like myself) would barely even know what sports entertainment was.

Secondly, Vince is one of the greatest sports entertainers ever. The Mr. McMahon character is a great character, and I love it. The strut, the ego, the anger, the "You're FFIIIIRRRRRREEEEEDDD!" It's great stuff. It's one of those few things which is predictable yet still fresh. You know what he's gonna say but still cheer when he says it. And, as has been said, he's got absolutly no problem sacrificing his own body to put over his guys. Would Ted Turner have taken that elbow from HBK at WM22? I don't think so. Would Eric Bischoff have taken the bump off the cage at St. Valentine's Day Massacre for Stone Cold? I don't think so. He's dedicated to what he does. He's one of a rare breed. And that breed is simple. He's made his livelihood from wrestling - but he's willing to give back. Look at The Rock. He made himself a start in WWE, then buggered off to Hollywood without a look back. Hulk Hogan. WWF made him a star, and now all he does is comes back and makes someone job to him whenever he needs a pay-off. But Vince made his millions in wrestling, and now he's sacrificing himself for the very thing which made him what he is today - yes, both a star and filthy rich. And I for one am not afraid to stand up and say that I appreciate that. When he finally bows out, it will be a sad day for wrestling and it's fans all around the world.

 

[ExtremeIronChef]

Vince McMahon is a genius when it comes to business. We know this. As someone else said, it's the people he puts on the creative team who fuck up, not him. Vince's problem is that he listens to these people and believes that their ideas are the best, yet they are not what the fans want to see. Vince's own ideas are usually very good, but just like everyone else, sometimes he fucks up too. The slump WWE is in right now is because of bad storylines, not because of Vince McMahon himself. You really do have to respect the man for putting his body on the line to make an actual wrestler look good. He's taken some pretty sick bumps to help put someone over. I don't think you have to be a mark to see this. This is not blind worship or anything like that. It's just recognizing the good things. He has done so much for the business, turning it from the small time into a worldwide attraction. That's not the easiest thing to do, but he has succeeded with it. He works hard and has earned our praise.

The Mr. McMahon character is one of the most entertaining characters that has been in the wrestling business, period. If you don't think he is funny then you must have something wrong with you. It's always entertaining seeing the tyrannical boss getting his ass kicked by the babyface, yet never admiting defeat and just doing the same thing again. His mic work is the best going today and of course when he is on nearly every segment of the show sometimes, that can get to be a little too much, but that's the same for everyone. And there have been times when the fans cheered the Mr. McMahon character, but he is just so much better as a heel.

Now in closing, with all this said, I do believe that if any one man can be given the most credit for changing the business in the 90's, then that man is Paul Heyman.

 

[figure4]

Mr. McMahon is a great character. I just wish he would take a break from tv from time to time, like he used to do. There have been times when the character has waffled from face to heel, but McMahon is most effective as a heel, undoubtedly.

I think McMahon deserves all the respect in the world for being a big player in the development of the business that we all love and enjoy. And I do feel that he is a genius, it's just that pro wrestling is an up-and-down kind of business, filled with good times and bad times. He receives loads of praise in the good times and loads of criticism during the bad times.

 

[blackhart07]

I hate when people bash Vince. And say bad stuff about him. The only people that bash him are.

1. Wrestlers that bash him who had a bad experience there, and feel the need to do so to make themselves feel better.
2. People who seek attention.
3. And guys like VKM who try and start stuff when in reality Vince could probally buy out TNA.

Vince has done so much for Wrestling its crazy. He is a self made to. WCW just had Turners huge bank account. And could play with all his money. Vince made his fortune. He works so hard, what guy do you know that works that much at his age?and not only at his age, handling a company that size? He is always getting humiliated on air for the people. He dosnt have to do that. You didnt see Bischoff, Jarret, or Heyman doing that.
-Look what Vince did for a company like ECW. He let them come and promote there PPV to a national base. When they were still very underground in the mid 1997. For along period of time there were ECW people on Raw in 1997. Also for most of that time Paul Heyman was on Vinces pay roll. So Vince is paying a guy that is competing against him.
-Give Vince his credit, he has done pretty much everything love him or hate him he deserves your respect.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

I dont understand how people can say he "never comes out of character"....um..ANYTIME someone dies? did anyone seethe raw the night Chris Benoit died? or the ECW the night after?? The first live events after 9/11?? The Night after Owen died?? Vince Mcmahon very much broke character, and was the respectable, damn successfull, head of a company that he is.

And of course, there is no disputing his contirbutions to the buisness, and being a "wwe mark" has nothing to do with acknowledging that whatsoever. His vision, and buisness sense has taken the sport from regional bingo halls and fairgrounds to be the increidble spectacle nd production that it is now. And apart from his off screen role, he, of course, puts his body through incredible abuse, and plays an incredible heel. I cant name ANY other CEOs of multi billion dolllar companies that would strut around in a doo rag and have Bobby Lashley nearly disembowel them.

But as far as the top topic of the thread goes....He does break character, at the memorial shows, or anytime when someone strong and respectable needs to step forward and be the face of the company, in whatever stressfull situation it may be.

 

[Rusty]

I have so much respect for Vince McMahon. A 60 yr old guy that works 24/7 and never takes time off definately earns my respect.

Every week when you watch Raw or Smackdown or even ECW.... jst remember Vince created all of this. Sometimes people complain about how bad wrestling is nowadays but I still love it. I love the excitement and suspense that Vinces product gives me. Vince works his ass off for what..... FOR US. He does it for WWE fans.

Sometimes I dnt think people appreciate what Vince provides us with. He visits the troops in Iraq every year. The guy sets up a ring and makes his superstars wrestle in front of the troops. He does it for the troops and proves to us that he has a big heart for the fans and for the troops.

When Eddie died Vince put on a great show and you could c how much the death of Eddie affected him. He could of said "Stuff it Raws cancelled for this week" but NO Vince put on a fricken show for the fans to especially show how much Eddie meant to this business.

Vince could have said years ago that his job is too hard and could have quit and left WWE/WWF forever but he didnt. In times of need Vince is always there. When Eddie died Vince was there, when Benoit died Vince was there, when Cena got injured and has to forfeit the title Vince was there.

Vince is the most reliable person in this business. Sometimes he shuld step out of his character because I can see that he must be a nice man.

You can tell that every superstar respects Vince and basicly every wrestler that has wrestled for him says that Vince is a great guy. Vince loves his job and has often mentioned that he doesnt see his job being 'work' because he loves it so much and thats great to hear.

He only breaks his character when he really really has to eg. deaths and tribute to the troops. But at the 15th anniverary Stone Cold shuld have helped him up and raised his hand because Vince truly is the greatest superstar(not wrestler) in the history of Monday Night Raw.

 

[AnthonyMango/NoFate007]

I actually love it when Vince breaks character. Its a shame he's as old as he is, because I'd have loved to have seen him turn face for a little while. He was a great commentator, too. Aside from singing him the normal praise, because its clear that he's worked his ass off for years and so forth, Vince really does do a great job at what he does. Shane's got a good head on him, it seems, but Stephanie seems to be a little "iffy" at times, so I'm not sure exactly where the future of the WWE lies. However, I for one would loooooove to see Vince take a spot as a color commentator or something when he gets too tired to do the physical stuff (including that walk, which looks exhausting lol). I think Vince deserves people to cheer him every once in a while, even though they say that if you get the proper boos, you've done your job as a heel and its worth the same as the proper boos as a face. Still, though, I'd like it if Vince turned face one more time.

 

[Guy]

I don't like the man...at all. Whether in or out of character. He killed ECW by making it a mockery of what it once was. He decided not to push people that deserved to get pushed.

Now just because I strongly dislike him doesn't mean I don't respect him. He has contributed to wrestling and still has.

What many people think is that Vince made wrestling. Nope it's the other way around. Wrestling made Vince.

 

[Harpa]

I personally admire Vince for what he has done for the WWE and wrestling as a whole in the past, and I'm certainly not the only one. He has changed the face of wrestling and created a huge wrestling boom not only in the US but all over the world. And in addition to that, he has one of the most entertaining characters in the WWE.

I've seen people complaining in the past when Vince appeared on the shows very frequently, but I don't see how those complaints are justified. Building a wrestler up with Mr. McMahon instead of just relying on the usual heel wrestler vs. face wrestler routine adds a whole different side to a feud. To humiliate the boss of the company is certainly an accomplishment for a wrestler, especially if he is hated as much as the Mr. McMahon character and as this created arguably the most popular wrestler in a long time I don't know why it shouldn't be used.

And as to why Vince rarely comes out of his character, well, you pretty much answered that yourself:

You will always hear a heel being cheered from time to time, depending on circumstance, yet Vince is universally hated.

For the boss vs. wrestler storyline to really work Vince just has to be hated as much as possible, and that is probably why he doesn't like to break kayfabe.

And since I personally like the concept of having Vince feud with a wrestler I'm very disappointed right now by how the Flair storyline is being used. They rarely give him any matches, and seeing as Wrestlemania is not far, we'll probably feel like something was missing when it's all over. The way it looks right now he's just going to get a match every few weeks until 'Mania. I don't care that Flair is old and of course not the best wrestler in the lockerroom anymore, he has done good matches recently and I would've liked to see him wrestling on all three brands, this is one of the few storylines of recent times which has (or had) huge potential.

But who knows, maybe the WWE decides to actually build this storyline up the way it should be, but right now I don't have high hopes.

 

[SpiralHands]

Vinny Mac is a legend full stop, so many people hate him for killing WCW, screwing Bret, Ruining the ECW legend and yes these are annoying things hes done. But my goodness he plays his character so well and he can work a crowd with click of a fingure people hate him so much they dont care if its wrestling or not they generally dislike him. I think his character has become apart of him himself and despite what alot of people think he does generally care about his fans, hes been running a wrestling business for 15 years and single handily brought down some many Indy promotions and two major promotions not literally single handily but you know! Hes a true legend and everytime I watch Raw and hes not on, it just doesnt seem like the usual Raw! And have to love his strut down the ramp lmao brilliant! Long live Vinny Mac!

 

[Batistabomb10]

This is a great topic to discuss, and how fitting for it to come this close to the Rumble.

First off, I just want to throw it out there that I am a die-hard WWE fan. Do I consider myself a mark? Well, the jury is still out on that one. However, what I will say is that Vince McMahon has made the most influential/successful contributions to the sports entertainment industry. What Vince McMahon has done to the WWE business as a whole is remarkable, spectacular, even amazing! He is a genius from a business standpoint. As has been mentioned before, he does take his bumps and bruises for his employees, and he gives back to the people who made him who he is.

Second, Vince McMahon is one of the major pioneers for professional wrestling. I hinted at this in the first point that I made, but it needs some more definitive reiteration. Vince was not only the man who took the market overseas, but he also has gone where no other promotion has gone before: Iraq. Vince took the fight to all of the competition, and came out on top! He is the man that has given us what we have now, and what we had back in the '90's. Sure, sometimes the product is not up to par with some of our standards, but to expect perfection at every turn is completely unfair! Vince is in the spotlight, no doubt about it. I agree that it's his Creative Team that does more screwing up than the man himself, but we all have our bad moments. Sometimes when we are in a rut, it takes a little bit of time to get out of it. Currently, the WWE is in a rut. Will they get out of it? Yes, eventually. Although we cannot predict how long it will take, we can at least put our trust and our faith into the man that has never permanently failed us.

As far as Mr. McMahon breaking character, I think he quite enjoys his role and has no need to. He does do it at the appropriate times like while addressing the troops, and all of the 'Tribute' shows, but other than that, Vince McMahon plays his role perfectly. He is a man that deserves each of our respect and gratitude, for not only what he has done for us, but for what he has to us, which is: given us a great product to tune into each and every week.

 

[X]

Am I the only one here who knows anything about Vince McMahon?

Obviously Vince McMahon is a legend in the promotion of wrestling. He revolutionized wrestling with Wrestlemania, no doubt about it.

But he's also ruined thousands of lives. And taken money out of the pockets of hard-working people who needed to feed their families.

When Vince went around buying up every territory he saw and closing them down, he effectively created a monopoly on the wrestling business. Do you know how many thousands and thousands of wrestlers were out of jobs when Vince came by and did this? And it's not like you're a cameraman or a commentator, which is a profession you can use in other fields besides wrestling, because if you're a pro wrestler, and the only promotion in the region just got shut down, and the WCW or WWF doesn't want you, what are you going to do? Go to Japan? Puerto Rico? I'm talking about those guys that weren't big draws on a national level, who could go from territory to territory like a Ric Flair or Dusty Rhodes.

And thats not the only bit of cut-throat business McMahon has done. What about when he effectively blackmailed PPV providers across the country into airing the first Survivor Series in 1987 over WCW's Starrcade?

Here's another one of my all time favorite Vince McMahon stories; when he tried to get the AWA/WCCW Superclash show in Chicago shut down when he informed the Illinois Athletic Commission that Kerry Von Erich, who was wrestling in the main event, had a prosthetic foot, which would violate a century-old ordinance that people with prosthetic limbs couldn't compete in sporting events. Illinois weren't dicks about it and let the show go on, but how down-low and classless of a thing to do is that? Especially to a family like the Von Erich's, who have been plagued with more untimely deaths then the Kennedys? To try and muck up their financial dealings when they were bordering on bankruptcy and two of their sons had died, one from suicide? Despicable.

Not to hate on Vince so much. Because for all of his faults (and his increasingly stupid backstage decisions) he is still a man for whom we all owe quite a bit as wrestling fans.

God bless that son of a bitch.

 

[TimmyTallsoxx]

Vince is one of the greatest heels of all time i like how he can get a small cheer out of the crowd and then go back on it and make it where people hate him. He revolutionized the sport/entertainment.

The attitude era was pure genius. However i think that the invasion was not it sounded great but all of a sudden faces were heels and vice versa.

I read in batistas book that the guy is great you can tell him bout your one night stand the next day and hell laugh it off. thats rare in men with authority

another reason i like vince is that he trains harder than most of his employees hes sixty two and will do about anything in the ring like the elbow he took from hbk in wm22 that takes balls specially at his age.

However i think since there is rarely hardcore matches on ecw he should have named it wcw since it is used as a kind of stepping stone instead of extreme wrestling

But in conclusion i think that wwe will ride the top of the pro wrestling world until he leaves and hands steph and hhh the reigns thats where it will be complete bullshit i hope vince stays untill trips retires at least or longer

oh and a little side note i gotta say that the only thing i wonder is does he get tested for roid like his employees because dude is jacked like lesnar

 

[HBK-aholic]

Vince McMahon is World Wrestling Entertainment. Without him we wouldn't have what we have today. People have given credit to the likes of Hogan, Shawn, 'Taker and Cena for making the WWE what it is today, but all that credit goes to McMahon. Hell he made those 4 wrestlers what they are, along with the others.

I've said often I don't think one man can carry a company on his own, but if I had to choose one, I'd choose McMahon no doubt. He made the WWE what it is today, and he deserves every bit of credit he deserves and then some.

He really does need to write an autobiography. Whether you love him or (somehow) hate him, everyone respects the guy. And IMO I think his autobiography would sell more than any of the other wrestlers. It would be so interesting to learn about McMahon, his life and everything he has to say about WWE. He may even gove his honest opinions on all the wrestlers, because I'm sure he could never have liked them all.