Yeah, I'm not talking about religion though, I'm talking about mental illness. I don't think religion was at the root of the problem here: it's an angry man who allegedly beat his wife and became enraged after his son saw two men kissing. He may have found inspiration to carry out this attack in religious texts or from religious teachings, but I don't think a level-headed American citizen turns to that level of radical Islam.
50 Dead, 53 Injured in mass shooting at Orlando gay nightclub
- Thread starter JGlass
- Start date
Yeah, I'm not talking about religion though, I'm talking about mental illness. I don't think religion was at the root of the problem here: it's an angry man who allegedly beat his wife and became enraged after his son saw two men kissing. He may have found inspiration to carry out this attack in religious texts or from religious teachings, but I don't think a level-headed American citizen turns to that level of radical Islam.
Dan Severn's Moustache
Patent Pending
Whether he has a mental illness is relevant, but what is more relevant is that he is able to use ultra conservative Islam as a trojan horse to express his retrograde and damaging views for so long, and how others across western civilisation are able to do this with no scrutiny of their ideology. Even if he was diagnosed with a mental illness and made fully aware of his condition, he would still think he is right using the pretense of his religious beliefs. Plenty of people who have no serious mental conditions are subscribers to this school of thought, and even if they don't go out and do what the gunman did in this instance, they still sympathise with the gunman for taking action against those they consider heretics.
That N Word
Actively evolving
Very unfortunate situation. And from what I read on Facebook, the FBI knew about the shooter since 2013. I don't know if anyone above has already touched on that yet. But my condolences to the friends and family of all the victims
Bully for them.
Dan Severn's Moustache
Patent Pending
Well yeah, of course they're going to claim responsibility. We don't exactly have the perpetrator alive to state whether or not he was actually linked with them, we can only go off past information.
If the continued existence and tolerance of their ideology is as much to blame as you insist, then they must be responsible.
Not sure why you're flip-flopping.
To clarify, you're suggesting that the larger issue here is that radical Islam is enabled to exist by a religious body that has not seriously critically reviewed their ideology and attempted to adjust it to modernity?
What's the solution then? I'm by no means an expert on Islamic culture, but I feel like the religion is far too decentralized for them to make sweeping reforms or change the culture around the faith.
Too add onto this, do you really think the fanatic, extremist crazies would fall in line with any attempts at sweeping changes?
If you're really plotting mass-murder in the name of something, you're probably the sort who will dismiss reformists as misrepresenting your faith's tenets.
It's obviously worth a try. But come on.
Pay Per Ghost
What they f*ck happened in the thread section here
You do realize that there is radical nature to almost every major religion sans Buddhism maybe.
Their religious fanaticism is something that comes from decades of Western Suppression and Interference for various needs, a scramble for power among themselves and mostly, the innate sense of control that any sort of pontiff or leader enjoys over the masses.
You say it's a problem coz it exists, but Christian, Hindu, Jewish crazy laws exist too, and people say/do stupid shit adhering to them as well.
Dan Severn's Moustache
Patent Pending
That's not a flip-flop, that's me being sceptical that ISIS themselves organised this attack. ISIS have nothing to lose by claiming they orchestrated the attacks; after all, it spreads more fear into the average citizens, it gives them notoriety, and it encourages new members and funds and sustains old ones. He was very likely inspired by the acts of ISIS; to suggest they are the same ideology is not immediately suggesting that he must be a member of ISIS.
As a friend of mine said: They'll take responsibility for a skinned knee if the person who pushed the wounded down was Muslim.
It's an extremely difficult issue to solve. Identifying the issue is really one half of the problem, the other half is solve it. Surprisingly, the people that are most outspoken about this issue are other Muslims, whether they be of Sunni or Shia faith, particularly in countries where Sharia Law isn't enforced, since they don't have the fear of being persecuted for their beliefs. I have a feeling if freedom of speech was more applicable in these theocratic autocracies, more and more people would be vocal against the authoritarian regime being enforced by Sharia Law. Unfortunately, with such an isolationist system, people are becoming products of the system, and are indoctrinated from birth until death.
I think the first step is to try and break down the barriers between the alt-right who claim that all Muslims have ulterior motives (bullshit) and the regressive left who believe Islam is above scrutiny (also bullshit), and let more people know that this is a specific branch of Islam whose goals are very much political in nature (the goal of the Islamic State is to basically reform the Umayyad caliphate from the 8th century, which controlled from western India to modern day Portugal and Spain and enforced an imperialistic will on its subjects.). You can't force a regressive culture to go away unfortunately, you can only do your best to try and discourage it as much as possible, and puncture as many holes in it as you can.
Nate DaMac
Fuck erbody but me
Oh goody. We get to do this again.
Your bullshit detector must be off. How much hand-holding do you need from me?
ÐаÑбоÑа
doesn't know REAL wrestling...
I don't think this is an ISIS planned attack. It is a policy of theirs to claim anything that has their name attached to it. It makes them seem more ubiquitous than they really are.
The real claim to make is that the shooter was a deeply closested homosexual...
The real claim to make is that the shooter was a deeply closested homosexual...
Dan Severn's Moustache
Patent Pending
I'm not going to deny that Western intervention has added fuel to the proverbial fire, but to suggest this is the primary reason they exist? That's not true.
The difference between Islamic extremism and other forms of extremism is that extremist views of Islam are still not only tolerated, but enforced by various states in the world as the national law people must adhere to. This basically allows for products of the system to be created en masse, and continue this aggressive cycle of backwards rhetoric to be forged.
There is a reason that Islamic terrorism is the only kind of religious terrorism that is prominent across the entire globe. It's basically the only religion where extremism can be considered a common collectivist view, not one based more on individualism.
Also, Coco, did I do a Dagger and read too deeply into sarcasm? I do have a trigger finger when it comes to cultural relativism, even it is sarcastic.
Come on, man. Everybody knows "doing a Dagger" is threatening to disown your gay son.
Nate DaMac
Fuck erbody but me
Glad to hear this won't affect TNA's scheduled PPV tonight. Now I can relax.
Барбоса;5510229 said:
This shouldn't even be an argument. No one goes into a gay club and starts shooting unless they have serious issues regarding their sexuality.
And honestly, the best way to remember the shooter is as a closeted homosexual.
Mighty NorCal
SHALL WE BEGIN?
Yea, basically.
ISIS is really a non factor right now, radicalized followers of conservative Islam is our issue.
And in 50 years, it'll be some other religion.
A11oftheLights
Getting Noticed By Management
I've skipped pages 2-4, because of the shit i read on page 1
- While i understand that you have a right to guns in america, why/how was he allowed to get into the nightclub with guns?
- To those bashing Muslims, you're playing straight into the hands of ISIS
- What the fuck isnt going to take for people to realise that guns in the hands of certain people is dangerous and that its safer for everyone to give them up. Its why drugs are illegal, i and many other responsible people can take a pinga or some other form of recreational drug and not harm anyone but because other members of public can't and end up killing themselves and others they arent legal
- While i understand that you have a right to guns in america, why/how was he allowed to get into the nightclub with guns?
- To those bashing Muslims, you're playing straight into the hands of ISIS
- What the fuck isnt going to take for people to realise that guns in the hands of certain people is dangerous and that its safer for everyone to give them up. Its why drugs are illegal, i and many other responsible people can take a pinga or some other form of recreational drug and not harm anyone but because other members of public can't and end up killing themselves and others they arent legal
Da Prophet
Mid-Card Championship Winner
Saw on the news that it's the 15th time Obama has done a post mass shooting speech since he was elected.
20 years on we're still waiting for the first since Port Arthur. It's crazy.
Mighty NorCal
SHALL WE BEGIN?
Those gun laws sure saved all those folks in France. While we are at it, we ought to make suicide vests and killing people illegal as well.
Yes, let us lament the lack of laws that would have prevented exactly fucking nothing in this situation, and ideology that encourages such violence
Yes, let us lament the lack of laws that would have prevented exactly fucking nothing in this situation, and ideology that encourages such violence
