WWE's Vision of a Star

[DCLXVI]

We're kind of a convoluted area - everything is PC... you can't actually do "bad ass" stuff like have edgy material without an apology from the company the next day, etc. There are wellness policy tests and if anybody is jacked they are automatically buried on the internet for being on steroids.

The big guys are on top, we saw last night with Reigns vs. Strowman and Lesnar vs. Joe. All four are closer to 300 pounds than 200. This really makes me wonder... what is WWE's vision of a star?

I see Curt Hawkins go out there, and legit looks like he'd beat Finn Balor's ass in real life... but he jobs to everyone in 30 seconds. I see The Drifter, he looks like a bigger Seth Rollins without the flips who'd be intimidating as hell in person. I see Dean Ambose doing a bunch of dives with no hair and a t-shirt on who looks like he never goes to the gym.

Now we see Austin Aries depart the company - being shelved into the cruiserweights and talent wasted. Same with Neville - the guy is more jacked than Benoit was and isn't on steroids. Why is a guy like Balor who they bill at 190 pounds not in the 205 Live division? Is that not strange to anyone else?

I am really confused as to what the hell this company is even looking for anymore.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

The answer you'll most often hear is that they're looking for that "it factor", which is pretty much the same answer that any top executive in any successful wrestling company will say. What is it? Nobody knows really, it's just that...well that thing, whatever it might be, that makes someone stand out. But yeah, I do agree that all the various accusations of "well he's on 'roids, just look at him" or "he's only pushed because he has a good body" stuff does get old.

As far as the whole PC stuff goes, it's sort of the double edged sword of success. WWE is by far and away the biggest and most successful wrestling company in the world; if you were to take every active federation in the world today, even the ones who put on a show maybe once a month, I'd comfortably say that it'd generate only a fraction of the revnue WWE does. WWE is a mainstream brand, you don't have ESPN or CBSsports doing stories and reviews on Ring of Honor anyone else and that means that WWE is going to be restricted in some ways. Why? because WWE is far more visual than any other wrestling company is and that means they're far more vulnerable to criticism than anyone else. In some companies, a wrestler could potentially portray himself as a KKK member, walk to the ring in the hood & robe and everything and hardly anyone would say boo about it. Why? Because hardly anyone would know or hear about it apart from the 40 or 50 people in attendance at that show. If WWE did it, there'd be a media shitstorm even though it'd be nothing more than scripted entertainment. WWE wouldn't be advocating the KKK or anything it stood for but millions of people wouldn't care. Even if the wrestler didn't do or say anything racist, just the fact that he wore something to the ring that was reminiscent of the KKK would be enough to put people into a frenzy. Edgy characters and storylines are fine for traditional TV programs but for some strange reason, it's not acceptable in the minds of a lot of people today for them to go down in pro wrestling. If ROH ever were to reach a level of success similar to WWE or if New Japan eventually does, they'll be faced with the same problems.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

All of these talking points reminded me that Jinder Mahal is the WWE Champion. The guy probably catches more hell online about looking like a roided up freak than anybody in today's product. This includes Brock Lesnar being on the roster. His entire character is this modern evil foreign anti-American cheater which in 2017 isn't Politically Correct in the slightest. He's also from Canada in real life, throwing fuel to that fire. He's as close to being edgy as there is. He practically walks out with part of his turban covering his face, alluding to the western's inaccurate conception of terrorism. Outside of bleeding everywhere and cussing like a 4th Grader who's trying to fit in with the cool kids, he's as edgy as you could possibly get.

Not sure what else you could want. Boobs?

 

[DCLXVI]

The discussion isn't really about the PG vs. non-PG... there are shows that air on the same network dealing with cocaine dealing, murders, etc... I guess at the end of the day it isn't looked at as a TV show (selectively - like Roman Reigns killing Braun Strowman in a car crash). The average viewer is now 58 years old and you have guys coming out playing trombones and selling cereal. I know they now make more on that third hour and merch revenue, but the product is pretty bad. Where are the compelling characters and stars? Everyone seems like they are in a box.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

WWE is a variety show. They are looking for multiple looks that they can use to develop roles that will interest their fans and make the fans believe. Ideally someone is attractive and athletic looking but that is no guarantee nor a deterrent to success in WWE. Looks are just one many factors in entertainment.

 

[DCLXVI]

They should have some notion that if you go on a playground in 2017 as a middle-schooler, people don't stand around and talk scripted promos to people - they think WWE is goofy and not hip. The rap that plays on mainstream radio is more controversial than someone saying "I'm gonna kick your ass". Everyone has a smart phone. The product doesn't seem hip at all. I don't wanna go down that road, was more looking at the talent.

 

[Mr.Maikeru_Sawyer]

WWE is a mainstream brand, you don't have ESPN or CBSsports doing stories and reviews on Ring of Honor anyone else

I have always had a feeling that the ONLY REASON ESPN OR CBS Sports does anything on WWE is because either Vince or Paul are PAYING THESE NEWS PLACES TO DO THE STORIES. ESPN would not be doing crap with WWE if it was not for Jonathan Coachman being there.

He's also from Canada in real life

NO HE ISN'T Lesnar was BORN AND RAISED IN Webster, South Dakota
He NOW LIVES IN CANADA.

 

[DCLXVI]

All of these talking points reminded me that Jinder Mahal is the WWE Champion. The guy probably catches more hell online about looking like a roided up freak than anybody in today's product. This includes Brock Lesnar being on the roster. His entire character is this modern evil foreign anti-American cheater which in 2017 isn't Politically Correct in the slightest. He's also from Canada in real life, throwing fuel to that fire. He's as close to being edgy as there is. He practically walks out with part of his turban covering his face, alluding to the western's inaccurate conception of terrorism. Outside of bleeding everywhere and cussing like a 4th Grader who's trying to fit in with the cool kids, he's as edgy as you could possibly get.

Not sure what else you could want. Boobs?

Yeah, the Iron Sheik did that better like 35 years ago with one or two camera angles and shitty production and way more heat. Jinder is being fed to Randy and was a jobber. He had no build to being a star at all. He isn't convincing on the mic on long promos, isn't that great of a worker, is jacked but that's about it.

 

[A11oftheLights]

I have always had a feeling that the ONLY REASON ESPN OR CBS Sports does anything on WWE is because either Vince or Paul are PAYING THESE NEWS PLACES TO DO THE STORIES. ESPN would not be doing crap with WWE if it was not for Jonathan Coachman being there.




NO HE ISN'T Lesnar was BORN AND RAISED IN Webster, South Dakota
He NOW LIVES IN CANADA.

Yeah the capital letters and inability to read are a good way to get people to take you seriously...


WWE wants a lot of things. I really believe at the top of that list is the ability to crossover into the mainstream. Its why they flog anything that is remotely successful in the mainstream. Its why they let the Rock do whatever the fuck he wants. And its why they are starting to let John Cena do whatever the fuck he wants to do as well. Mainstream crossover leads to more viewers, more merch sales and all of that

 

[Stone Cold Tea]

I have always had a feeling that the ONLY REASON ESPN OR CBS Sports does anything on WWE is because either Vince or Paul are PAYING THESE NEWS PLACES TO DO THE STORIES. ESPN would not be doing crap with WWE if it was not for Jonathan Coachman being there.




NO HE ISN'T Lesnar was BORN AND RAISED IN Webster, South Dakota
He NOW LIVES IN CANADA.

You said Paul. Edgy.

HE WAS TALKING ABOUT Jinder.

I don't believe there is really a profile a guy needs. You could know all the moves in the world but if you can't tell a story with them what good are they? You could eat a thesaurus for breakfast but if you can't talk with confidence what good is it?

Like some posters above have said, you need to ha e that it factor.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

Yeah, the Iron Sheik did that better like 35 years ago with one or two camera angles and shitty production and way more heat. Jinder is being fed to Randy and was a jobber. He had no build to being a star at all. He isn't convincing on the mic on long promos, isn't that great of a worker, is jacked but that's about it.

I thought the topic was on what WWE wants in a star. This is obviously about your vision of a star, not WWE's.

Mahal is everything that you complained in not seeing. Yeah, Sheik did it (though you need subtitles to understand what the fuck he's saying, making him objectively a worse speaker than Mahal). So did Hassan. So did Khali. Characters get rehashed and recycled all the time. And sure, Jinder jobbed. That was the point. He shocked fans by winning. Now WWE can tap into that sweet sweet Indian demographic which is almost triple the population of the United States.

That's the answer, by the way. A star is somebody that can make them the most money. Ergo, Jinder Mahal is a star and Curt Hawkins could leave and not hurt ticket sales at all.

And how is Jinder being fed to Orton if Orton keeps losing to him? That's not how that works.

NO HE ISN'T Lesnar was BORN AND RAISED IN Webster, South Dakota
He NOW LIVES IN CANADA.

How did you read Lesnar's name, skip the part where I mentioned Mahal's foreign heel gimmick, and jump to where I mentioned Canada?

 

[DCLXVI]

I thought the topic was on what WWE wants in a star. This is obviously about your vision of a star, not WWE's.

Mahal is everything that you complained in not seeing. Yeah, Sheik did it (though you need subtitles to understand what the fuck he's saying, making him objectively a worse speaker than Mahal). So did Hassan. So did Khali. Characters get rehashed and recycled all the time. And sure, Jinder jobbed. That was the point. He shocked fans by winning. Now WWE can tap into that sweet sweet Indian demographic which is almost triple the population of the United States.

That's the answer, by the way. A star is somebody that can make them the most money. Ergo, Jinder Mahal is a star and Curt Hawkins could leave and not hurt ticket sales at all.

And how is Jinder being fed to Orton if Orton keeps losing to him? That's not how that works.



How did you read Lesnar's name, skip the part where I mentioned Mahal's foreign heel gimmick, and jump to where I mentioned Canada?

I liked Jinder winning the belt. He has no heat now though. Iron Sheik had natural charisma and still has more natural charisma in his curly boots than Jinder has. They've done nothing cool with him, same two matches over and over. You are missing the point - Sheik had charisma. Jinder has become an afterthought from that initial "shock" and nobody gives a shit about his feud with Orton. I hope he beats Orton and they get their market but damn he feels unready for that position as the face of the company. If it's all for the market great, but his matches aren't shit you'd watch without a stipulation at that point. His in-ring work is okay, his promos are okay. He looks jacked. He's boring. What is the story line? Americans hate Indian people or brown people?

 

[Phenomenal]

WWE doesn't care about what a superstar looks like now, they are not in competition with anybody so Ellesworth could be the WWE champion and it wouldn't matter.

Most of the company champions have been jobber/mid-card type wrestlers for the near decade, I don't think most of them would be even allowed on TV during the MNW. The 90's were special because not only did the wrestlers look like mega-stars but also had the personality.

 

[Psykohurricane55]

Here how i see it. WWE is a publicly traded company, which mean that they need to focus on what makes money in the end. So they go, and listen to the crowd reactions, watch the merchandise sales results and focus on being a more family oriented product because that's how you get advertisers. So when you look at it that way, Roman reigns is the more over guy outside of the part timers like cena and lesnar in the company so they push him. Seth Rollins is super over so they push him. Finn balor is over so they push him. That's pretty much how it works.

The other factors are guys like jinder who can actually bring in some money with being the face of a market that's not being explored before. So that's why somebody like Jinder is push.

In the old days, WWE/F would be more edgy because they didn't have to answer to advitisers and stockholders so they could be edgy, now, Vince as to answer to a lot of others peoples so they go we're the money is. So sometimes a guy that we might not see as a star will become a star because in the eyes of wwe fans, he got the it factor and that means money for the company. That's nothing against the neville and Aries of the world but that's just how Business works.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

Ultimately WWE just wants to make money, but what does WWE feel brings them that money? It's hard to narrow it down to just one things. WWE is looking for several traits.

1 - Presence/"It" - Some guys have this, and some don't. What even is it? Well it's hard to explain. You just know it when you see it. Like when you look at Strowman. He just has "it".

2 - Look/Marketability - Like it or not, this is a big deal. No not everyone has to be 6'2" and 260 lbs, but look is still very much a factor. Wrestlers like Balor, Ambrose, or Zayn will never be the top guy. Sure they will be pushed, but they'll never be the guy. Because well wrestlers like Reigns, Strowman, and Lesnar are more marketable. That's not to justify Reigns' mega push or to say I don't like those wrestlers. Ambrose is maybe my favorite wrestler, but I understand he's never gonna be the guy over Reigns, and quite frankly he shouldn't be. Of course Reigns push was done horribly, but that's another discussion.

3 - Charisma/Personality - This is another huge factor. Several wrestlers have flamed out because they were just boring. Apollo Crews is a good example. He has a great look and is good in the ring, but you gotta be more than "athletic guy who smiles a lot". Look at the cruiserweights. Cedric Alexander and Mustafa Ali are fine wrestlers, but they come out to silence nearly every week. Why? Because the audience has no reason to care about them. Of course a lot of that can be blamed on booking. The entire division has been severely botched since moving to Raw. Another example is Big E. He was extremely bland before the New Day, and now he's one of the most entertaining and charismatic wrestlers in the company. So are Xavier Woods and Kofi Kingston. Anyone remember what they were doing before New Day?

So to be a star in WWE you need to have all or a lot of the things mentioned above. Or you could just be a Maharaja.