Regarding Shawn Michaels' "Drawing power" in the 90s

[Mantaur Rodeo Clown]

Shawn and Bret couldn't draw, which is the pretty stock standard answer as far as things go.

Too many vanilla midgets in the kitchen spoil the broth.

But you also have to take into consideration that wrestling as a whole had taken a major downturn since the 1980's and in particular had attracted a social stigma which I believe still hung over it when Shawn won the title.

The steroid scandal and sex scandal pretty much crippled the WWF in terms of public image, and this might have contributed heavily to the difference in attendance.

I also know that the WWF was still quite popular in Europe (Bret especially was a god in Germany, go figure)

I'd love to see some research done into European figures, the effect of scandals on the WWF and other fun topics.

At the end of the day though, does it really matter if he was a terrible draw or not? Sure, the WWF MIGHT have nearly gone out of business, but it didn't. So all we're left with is a legacy of fantastic matches (looking at you Mind Games)

And gives the roster the WWF was working with in 1995/1996, there were very few other options to go with.

Except for Mantaur. He was ready, brother.

 

[Sweettre15]

What was also sad is that during that time for WWE, Undertaker drew worst than both of them during his title reign save for his program with Bret Hart when he lost the belt. Ironically Taker and Shawn's most viable programs in 97-98 was their work together at Badd Blood and the Royal Rumble where they main evented...The former was a number one contender match that closed the show.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Now first off I want to say that I'm a Shawn Michaels fan all the way BUT I will never say Shawn was the transcendent star that Austin and Rock became.

HOWEVER, I was interested when I looked over the attendance rates of the PPVs he main evented when he was on top during both title reigns he had and here's what I found...

PART 1 of 2

Wrestlemania 12 - Attendance at Arrowhead Pond/Honda Center: 18,853

Arrowhead Pond/Honda Center's Highest Seating Capacity: 18,900

Main Event: Shawn Michaels vs Bret Hart (c) for the WWF title - 60 minute Iron Man Match

In Your House: Good Friends, Better Enemies - Attendance at Omaha Civic Auditorium: 9,563

Omaha Civic Auditorium's Highest Seating Capacity: 10,960

Main Event: Shawn Michaels (c) vs Diesel for the WWF Title - No Holds Barred match

Now so far it would look like it was relatively smooth sailing for Michael's programs as far as drawing audiences to attend the PPVs but this is where things start to get a bit bad for Michaels' title reign

In Your House: Beware of Dog - Attendance at Florence Civic Center: 6,000

Florence Civic Center's Highest Seating Capacity - Concert (center stage) - 9,736

Main Event: Shawn Michaels (c) vs British Bulldog for the WWF title


King of The Ring '96 - Attendance at MECCA Arena/U.S Cellular Arena: 8,762

MECCA Center's Highest Seating Capacity: 12,700

Main Event: Shawn Michaels (c) vs British Bulldog for the WWF title


In Your House: International Incident - Attendance at General Motors Place/Rogers Arena: 14,804

General Motors Place/Rogers Arena's highest seating Capacity: 19,193

Main Event: Camp Cornette vs The People's Posse - 6 man tag match


Summerslam '96 - Attendance at Gund Arena/Quicken Loans Arena: 17,000

Gund Arena/Quicken Loans Arena's Highest Seating Capacity: 20,562

Main Event: Shawn Michaels (c) vs Vader for the WWF title


In Your House 10: Mind Games - Attendance at CoreStates Center/Wells Fargo Center: 15,000

CoreStates Center/Wells Fargo Center's Highest Seating Capacity: 21,315(with standing room)

Main Event: Shawn Michaels (c) vs Mankind for the WWF title


Survivor Series '96 - Attendance at Madison Square Garden: 18,647

Madison Square Garden's Highest Seating Capacity: 20,789

Main Event: Shawn Michaels (c) vs Psycho Sid for the WWF title


Royal Rumble '97 - Attendance at Alamodome: 60,525

Alamodome's Highest Seating Capacity: 65,000 (expandable to 72,000

Main Event: Shawn Michaels vs Psycho Sid (c) for the WWF Title

So from the looks of it, The downslope in his attendance drawing was becoming it's most lackluster during his program with Davey Boy Smith and had a slight increase during his once PPV match with Vader and his program with Psycho Sid. So is it safe to say that his title reign didn't help WWE against WCW due to these factors?:

- Lack of viable top heels

- Fans interest in WCW's product with the NWO

- Fans not buying Shawn's whitemeat babyface character

- Lackluster Television ratings, PPV buys, and lackluster Merchandise Sales for Shawn

Feel free to sound off and give your take below while I update with Part 2 of this post discussing Shawn Michaels' late 97 title pursuit and 1998 title reign's drawing power as far as attendance goes.

The Davey feud was Shawn's FIRST feud as champion... if he couldn't draw/sell that one then he was the wrong man for the title. Davey was picked as he was a strong heel, a good "match" in the ring and had a Bret Hart connection. It was argued that Shawn needed to lose in one of those matches and chase Davey a bit more, as people hadn't quite gotten their heads into him being champion.

He was struggling as that "Boyhood Dream" character and it was not down to his opponents. You took a guy whose strength as a character was being an obnoxious heel who the fans genuinely hated and through that whole "Dudes with Attitude"/ Marine beatdown debacle he became the worst kind of face, a pandering phoney. The HBK who had stolen shows and hearts wasn't a nice guy who'd look up his old teacher... he was a jerk who would sign a 7ft bodyguard to steal the title for him, who would throw his one time partner/best buddy through a window after betraying him... That Shawn as champ in 96 would have drawn... but what was presented was horrificly misguided but his backstage stroke kept him in position. Once Vader lost at Summerslam you knew there was no way back for him as a draw, he was literally dismantling the heel roster so he could end up feuding with his Kilq buddies just to hold the title. Even by then you had Taker referring him to a "little fucker" backstage... and the fans had twigged he wasn't the messiah, he was a very naughty boy!!!

 

[CrucifiedRaven]

Not fully true, it was more like a 50/50 split to be honest

One way of measuring could be to look at that Summerslam 1994 drew almost twice the buys as Summerslam 1996.

In the run up to Wrestlemania 12 the buyrates were mix and match between the two, Bret drew the two best but Shawn was more steady

Survivor Series 0.57 (Diesel vs Bret )
In Your House 5 0.33 (Bret vs Bulldog)
Royal Rumble 1.10 (Undertaker vs Bret)
In Your House 6 0.75 (Bret vs Diesel)

with the 4 PPVs Wrestlemania 12 after being

In Your House 7 0.65 (Shawn vs Diesel)
In Your House 8 0.45 (Shawn vs Bulldog)
King of the Ring 0.65 (Shawn vs Bulldog)
In Your House 9 0.70 (6 man tag featuring Shawn, Vader, Bulldog, Sid, Ahmed Johnson & Owen)

So it was pretty inconclusive between them

I agree it is inconclusive. These numbers to me say more about Diesel and Bulldog's drawing power instead of Shawn or Bret's.

The mid-90s was a tough time in general for wrestling, not just WWF.

To the original poster:
WCW until summer 1996 (pre Hall invasion) wasn't exactly drawing big ratings either. When Nitro debuted in 1995 they were jumping back and forth in the ratings with WWF. And they had Hogan, Flair, Savage, Sting... Are we going to say that Hogan, Flair and Savage couldn't draw either? Of course not. Yet they were flip flopping in the wars with Hart, Michaels, Diesel and Undertaker.

Why do we judge Shawn and Bret so harshly when until June 1996 they were doing just as well as Hogan and Savage?

Wrestling overall was a stale product in the mid 90's until the nWo angle, Austin vs McMahon and the more realistic, crash TV style of the attitude era made it popular again.

 

[CrucifiedRaven]

Shawn and Bret couldn't draw, which is the pretty stock standard answer as far as things go.

Too many vanilla midgets in the kitchen spoil the broth.

Raw, before the nWo, didn't draw that much lower of a rating than it does today. Sure there were some low weeks, but it wasn't unheard of for the show to pull in a 2.8 or even a 3.1 on any given week in 1996. I guess we should come up with a Cena can't draw as a stock standard answer as well.

It would even win the Monday night war some weeks in 1995 with a 2.5. A 2.5 rating would beat Hogan, Savage, Flair, Luger, Sting in WCW. Even those guys couldn't draw in the mid-90s before the nWo changed everything.

 

[USMNT]

If one wanted to tackle every possible angle, it could be said Shawn helped WWE stay afloat as they were building Austin, Rock, HHH and Foley. Those guys all (including Austin) had ups and downs with their characters and weren't quite ready to run with the ball. The ride may have been bumpy, but HBK kept the ship steady enough to get it headed in the direction of Austin and the biggest boom in wrestling history.

Also, drawing power solely as champion is a little dishonest. HBK made a lot of guys with DX and Attitude.

One of the biggest draws of all time? No. But, when it comes to most important/valuable guys in the 90's (the entire decade) HBK is near the top of the list.

 

[god-soldier]

I disagree with the claim that HBK drew those numbers in 96 for his title reign because he was the main event I still believe people came too see Undertaker, and the up coming superstars that had just arrived who were new faces to WWF FANS but familar faces to wrestling fans such as Mankind, Steve Austin, Vader,Marc Mero, Brian Pillman, etc real fans knew these guys came from WCW and they were great wrestlers and athletes and knew with the right direction they could be good. Plus Warrior's fake return helped draw whether he showed or not. I remember being so hyped for Vaders arrival in 96 because Yokozuna was great but he wasn't as mean and vicous as Vader and I went into every match known that guys like Michaels and Bret Hart weren't going to stand a chance against him. Yokozuna was great heel but Vader too me was a real life monster he ripped Mick Foleys ear off!!!! Michaels was champ but no one cared and the in your house numbers show that no one cared Royal Rumble, Summer Slam etc are big show the name alone draws big numbers Michaels didn't have anything to do with it. Plus the Mankind Undertaker feud the hottest feud in wrestling really was the reason people came the matches were brutal entertaining and helped push both guys over. I still believe even without an nWo WCW would have drawn more against WWF with Michaels as champion because they had an overal better roster even on the mid card would you rather watch Dean Malenko vs Rey Mysterio or Ahmed Johnson vs the Goon a lot of times it was no brainers which product was better. In 97 Michaels had nothing to do with the drawing again it was all Bret Hart Stone Cold, undertaker, and wwf trying to compete against the nWo. Michaels reign and Diesel reigns were waste of time and had Michaels put over Vader at summerslam maybe people might have wanted to watch his rematch against Vader at the rumble but its still hard to tell. Vince should have forced it on him plus him pussyfooting around and not giving the rematch at Mania too didn't help him gain more credibility either but I did enjoy Sid's title reign and win as the highlight of WWF in 96 because Michael and his lame kliq was over.

 

[FlairFan2003]

There are so many variables when looking at "drawing power".

First you listed marque events like W-mania & Royal Rumble, as others noted those events to an extent sell themselves due to their inherit importance to the product.

A big part of the draw for a show is the whole package, IE Main Event & Undercard. Why do you think W-mania spent so much time last year hyping Taker-Punk & HHH possible retirement vs Lesnar ? Because There was no way they were drawing big numbers on Cena-Rock alone, as big as it was, it needed support. In fact every W-mania has at least 2 or 3 undercard bouts that get the attention and promotion of the main event and significantly impact the drawing power of the show.

Finally, with reference to HBK, you cited PPV live attendance numbers. Where are the buyrates and what was house show attendance like during this time ? Again, the quality or lack thereof of the undercard has a lot to do with those numbers (especially PPV buyrates) but those numbers need to be factored in, as do TV ratings. These factors are what many cite as proof of WWE'S decline during Brett Hart's time on the top of the card (though live attendance at major shows remained very good). Of course no critique of either is complete without looking at how bad and unpopular the supporting card was during those times.

HBK's drawing power was solidified during his final run when his matches vs HHH, Orton, Cena, Taker, & Flair drew significant interest.

Lets not forget that Kevin Nash is often called the worst drawing WWE Champ of all time yet he was one of the biggest draws in the industry in the 90s. The NwO & his WCW run had a lot to do with that but without the promotion he recieved prior to coming to WCW that would not have been possible.

 

[Waylon Mercy]

I often wonder what would have happened if Bret had turned heel earlier on, using Shawn's perceived (or otherwise) favored status with Vince McMahon as his platform. The lines were already starting to blur between the two towards the latter stages of 1996, and the verbal back and forth between Hart and Michaels was definitely getting personal. Hart physically attacking a baby face Michaels in a brutal fashion could have elevated Shawn's run as champion at the time (in my opinion). If Michaels could have seen past his simmering hatred towards Hart, and looked at things from a business perspective, he would have seen how much this could have improved his run as champion. Instead, Shawn lost his smile and the rest became history. Austin could have become a linchpin between the two. Perhaps in between Austin and Taker could have had a bloody feud, vying to become number one contender to whoever won the feud between Hart and Michaels. It could have set up a compelling tag team match, where Hart and Michaels were paired off against Taker and Austin. All four men would have had issues between one another, and it would have made for a compelling main event at some point.