Lucha Underground Season Two Discussion

Discussion in 'The Wrestling Archives' started by @smarkmouth, Feb 14, 2016.

  1. @smarkmouth

    @smarkmouth Friendly Neighborhood

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    We're three episodes in so far, and I'm eager to discuss the season as it continues with other "believers". Hey, I hate being a branded fan, but I like it more than being referred to as a Universe.

    If you've been caught kpgreece's thread (seen here), you may have heard me bitch ad naseum about the lighting design. I'm afraid this feud continues, and reached a boiling point this week. Admittedly, I've been watching it on dailymotion, so perhaps it's airing in a better quality. However, this week, the lighting robbed fans of amazing footage! While Fenix vs King Cuerno's Last Man Standing is far from my favorite match in the season (their first outing was much better), everything outside of the ring was shrouded. Cuerno's "Arrow" is the absolute best suicide dive I've ever seen, and he hit it from around the turnbuckle, and I feel like I missed it despite keeping my eyes on the screen the whole time. A second missed image was Fenix's atop Catrina's office. There he stood, victorious, staring across the temple at Mil Muertes, who is selling the outcome of the match in his own right. These two arguably have the most storied rivalry on the show, and you can't tell a damn thing because of the lighting. I'm sorry, but it's driving me mad.

    Now, in regards to production value, I also have to give a shout out to the finish of the Last Man Standing match. I absolutely loved how the editing team handled counts 6 through 10 after Cuerno crashed through the table. Quick cuts to the audience, to Fenix, To Cuerno, to Mil. Reminded me of some Kung Fu cinema. Awesome!

    As if Jim Cornette couldn't hate this show any more, Joey Ryan shows up. As a television audience for the show, we've always had a unique limited omniscient point of view. We know things that the live audience, even the announcers, don't know. This storyline is going to be very different, though. As revealed after the credits Cortez Castro has been an undercover cop trying to bring down Dario Cuerto. His captain, displeased with his progress, is now sending his partner Joey Ryan into the temple to speed up the investigation, and the two are to mock a feud. I'll admit, this borderlines on cringe and camp, but there is room for that on this show. As far as Joey himself goes, I'm excited to see him going forward. I just hope that there's no YouPorn Plex used. It was funny once. Once.

    Speaking of camp, I laughed out loud at the "a millenia ago" segment. A bunch of Aztec's in tribal costuming, and there's Aerostar wearing Spandex and LED lights. Fucking magical!

    Match of the night was Jack Evans vs Draco Looks like they're going to give Evans some more mic time going forward, as he's adopted the "Dragon Slayer" moniker. I'm all for a feud between these two, and can't wait to see them top this one. They might even sell the moves next time. Who knows?! Kobra Moon and Bengala rounds out the card. Kobra caught my attention with her characterization and mannerisms, and that first dropkick was pretty damn good. But then she started kicking. Yikes. Hurt me more than it hurt Bengala, that's for sure.
     
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  2. Black Anaconda Vise

    Black Anaconda Vise The LD Dweller

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    Watched the February 10th episode yesterday afternoon.

    -Bengala vs Cobra Moon sucked. Neither was very good, Bengala especially. He wasn't all that lean last season, but this season it looked like he gained a lot of weight as he looked fatter than usual.

    -The Aerostar segment was just way out there, but I liked it because they just sorta stuck with it and they keep things within their own world which I think is pretty cool.

    -Jack Evans vs Drago was good, although I just don't have much interest in Drago. It could be a good series though. There was also the wacky spot with Evans taking like a corkscrew bump off of a like a punch of something.

    -The Texano promo was cool as the guy went from being just there because of Alberto and then just a guy again to a Mexican that likes to kick ass and beat people up.

    -Fenix vs Cuerno was good, and LU's gimmick matches are usually quite good. King Cuerno is probably my favorite wrestler in LU right now as he looks good, he's good in the ring, and he speaks English quite well too. They've also built both guys well as Cuerno is still champion, but now Fenix has defeated the guy who can challenge for the championship too so both guys look like good contenders.

    -Joey Ryan as a sleezy cop is such a great role lol. Why Cortez Castro/Officer Reyes is trying to get Dario rather than Matanza who was the person who killed Bael is beyond me but oh well.

    Good show, although the opener was pretty terrible
     
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  3. Rainbow Yaz

    Rainbow Yaz Sing about me, I'm dying of thirst
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    I typically watch on Dailymotion as well and the lighting has been atrocious when the action spills outside the ring. It became obvious how poor the lighting has become during the Last Man Standing match. I get the budget cutbacks for season two, but it seems like the lighting has been the only thing they cut. Well that and the band, which I could do without.

    I wish that Last Man Standing match could have gone longer, as it was only 12 minutes. I enjoy the rivalry between Cuerno and Fenix and Mil by association.

    I was discussing some of the over the top aspects the other day and I agree that I can't help but love how wacky some of the stuff is, especially Aero Star being a time traveler.

    Bengala totally looks like he put on thirty pounds.

    Speaking of Bengala, he really killed a lot of what Kobra Moon could do. Hopefully she gets a better opponent next time around. That entire match though, Striker was grating on me. So many snake references.

    I like that they are trying to give Jack Evans a personality. One of the criticisms I do have about LU is that most of the characters, as colorful as they are, are basically just 'guy who does flips.'

    I also dig that in every vignette the face character is beating up guys in lucha masks. They did it for PJ Black, Kobra Moon, and now Texano.
     
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  4. Pika

    Pika Pre-Show Stalwart

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    So far Lucha Underground hasn't been as impressive as I felt it was previously. Does that mean it's terrible? No. In fact it's still possibly my favorite thing going on in Pro Wrestling a lot of the time.

    In regard to the last episode I kind of felt it was jumbled a bit. So far the debut episode of season 2 has been my favorite, and the 3rd being the second. It feels kind of jumbled at times honestly. They do keep the Sci-Fi and themes somewhat away from the actual matches. I enjoy that idea and general show lay out as it is now. They are going in the right direction.

    The Kobra Moon vs Bengala match was not my thing. I tried hard to get into it, but it just seemed like a filler match. Don't care to much about physical appearance, but Bengala really does not much have going for him attire wise for me or in ring wise for that matter either...

    Jack Evans pulled a decent match with Drago. Wouldn't mind seeing more of the two with maybe some more bad blood or something at a higher risk. Jack seems to be haven given some more character and Mic skills as well. This was actually the best match of the night on second thought.

    That Aero Star thing was absolutely weird. I enjoyed it in the weirdest way even though I don't really have a set opinion on him or it.

    That Last Luchador/Man standing match was great. I really do wish it was longer though. I didn't realize how short of time they had to work with. Cuerno is awesome and has grown to become one of my favorite guys. Fenix is just a bundle of potential to.

    I can't wait to see what happens next. I feel like it can only get better.
     
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  5. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    The problem I'm having with the show is that the continuation from season 1 doesnt seem to be there at all from a story line perspective and it feels like we're playing a video game sequel where we're getting reintroduced to everyone on the off chance there are new people watching the show. I think we're finally going to get some kind of major story line now which should help things pick up.

    I really wish that they got someone else in to replace Vampiro as commentator so that he could fill his role as Pentagon's master
     
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  6. @smarkmouth

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    I think Cueto is the bigger fish. Reyes even said that he wanted to bring Dario down when he ordered Matanza to kill Bael, but I may be mistaken. Besides, classic cop film trope, a pesky sargeant who's getting in the way of good detective work.

    Glad to here it's not just me then, but I'd love for someone who watches on El Rey to weigh in.

    As a theater geek, I have to give some props (no pun intended). Due to strict budgets, you sometimes are left with weaknesses in your production, and the best way to mask a weakness is to make it a strength. The dark temple plays well into Mil and Catrina's reign, but that's all the positive I'll say on the subject. It still reads like crap on screen.

    Fill me in here, should I know Kobra Moon by another name? I've been trying the occasional non-comital Google search but I haven't found any aliases yet.

    I caught that, too. A fun little piece of world-building.

    By the way, Yaz, I'm still waiting to know what Dario is going to do with 60$.

    Not to apologize for every fault the show has, but they did lose a small handful of important names (though if you've read the comic, you may know that Big Ryck has technically been in every episode so far). They do have to do a soft rebuild of their roster. Better that they introduce new characters now then later when storylines are on their rising action.

    That's my take on the newer characters, but I disagree about reintroductions for s01 alumni. The Menage a Trois storyline continues, though has evolved in the off season. Puma is chasing Mil. Mil now sits dominant atop the temple. Perhaps I misunderstand you, but none of this feels like I'm brought back to square one as a viewer.

    100% with you here. I was hoping at the end of episode one that he'd stand with Pentagon and fall back into full Vampiro persona. Instead, we have this strange non-commitment to what should be an evolved character from s01.

    I get that Ian wants to remain at the desk, and I get that full-Vampiro may not mesh as an announcer, but because they haven't changed the character whatsoever it seems there is a lacking of concrete decisions being made by Ian Hodgkinson and the LU creative team. My biggest beef with the season, save the lighting.
     
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  7. Black Anaconda Vise

    Black Anaconda Vise The LD Dweller

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    Did a quick google search, and she's also known as Thunder Rosa. She's worked matches in Stardom and All Pro Wrestling and she has a twitter to confirm that she's Kobra Moon. Apparently she's only been wrestling for under a year and a half.
     
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  8. Rainbow Yaz

    Rainbow Yaz Sing about me, I'm dying of thirst
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    What Black Aniconda Vice mentioned above is pretty much spot on. reddit was pretty big on her, so I had high hopes. Apparently she used to swear at the audience in Spanish when she was working in Japan and got decent heat from it.

    Mostly just Bengala is a fat sack though.

    He sure as hell isn't going to use it on the lighting.

    Maybe he is feeding Bengala all those cheeseburgers he is clearly eating. You can get a decent amount of burgers for $60.
     
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  9. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    Since when did Cage become a face? He just rocked up the other week during Mundo's promo and was a face. He continued it this week and it just doesnt feel right, i'd rather see the roid machine get dropped on his head

    Good to see some of the heavy kayfabe stories really starting to take shape, Mysterio's segment/scene was ace. The sooner dario gets back into the temple the better, because Catrina is nowhere near as good in promoter role and it seems Dario's return will drive a few of the narratives forward

    Was expecting Puma v Pentagon to be great. It was but I still wish it had more time. Dont think we'll have to wait too long before we get Vampiro taking up his role of master

    This week was easily the best episode so far
     
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  10. Rainbow Yaz

    Rainbow Yaz Sing about me, I'm dying of thirst
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    Yeah Cage as a face is completely random. Even at Triplemania he worked as a heel, getting arguably the best heel heat of the night.

    I can ultimately live with him as a face, especially against a good heel like Mundo, but it came out of left field with no explanation. I could see it if the break between seasons one and two was a reset, but they are continuing almost every storyline from the end of season one into this season. Maybe him putting Mack's face through the cinder block was his face turn :shrug:
     
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  11. @smarkmouth

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    Yeah, I agree here. I found it strange, and while I didn't agree with it, I think the justification is that LU tries to blur the heel/face diconomy. We've had heel v heel and face v face a handful of times. Sometimes who ever is the babyface may be de facto the least successful heel or vice versa. Johnny Mundo is THAT heel though. That video package was on point. Hyped him up as an egocentric shit and ran his mouth on cage. The beginning of this feud is strange, but it's shaping out

    Also, Cage and Joey Ryan had the match of the night! That's not a knock on Puma/Pentagon, but this one edged it out. Ryan played his role to a tee, and Cage is explosive! He's the Ryback that Ryback should be. On a show full of Lucha Libre, this match was so well paced, and Cage sold like a champ.

    Can't wait for Dario, either. I'm also curious to see how other key players react to his return. Ie; will Puma side with the devil he knows? More curiously, could Rey Mysterio side will Mil and Catrina?!

    The seven descendants storyline is intriguing. I wonder when time traveling Aergenis will re emerge. I think the descendants will be.... well, whoever the seven most over luchadors at the time are.

    Yup!

    Glad to see the team of Angelico/Havoc/Ivelisse in action. I love that the Trios championship is Lucha Underground's subplot. I look forward to this story arc of this team continuing.
     
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  12. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    The thing with cage is that he works so much better as a heel. He's a giant motherfucker with a shit haircut so its pretty easy to get heel heat on him.

    Well we know Puma is one. I'd imagine mysterio will be another, i cant remember the name of the bloke he's training but i'd imagine he'll make three. Drago seems a safe bet, though i'd rather he stays out of it because he's a dragon. Pentagon is obviously over but again I'm not sure. Cuerno and Fenix are also good shouts. And i'd imagine that sexy star will end up as one as well. Plus I'd forgetton Texano as well
    So my guess would be
    1. Puma 2. Mysterio 3. Guy mysterio is training 4. Sexy Star 5. Texano 6. Cuerno 7. Fenix
     
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  13. @smarkmouth

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    I'm a big fan of the Harry Potter books, but I always thought the biggest flaw was Potter being the chosen one. They certainly suggested it for the better part of the early series, but at one point they entertained the notion that Neville was the chosen one, and the universe didn't revolve around god damn Harry.

    Where am I going with this?

    That would be a fun swerve, and would be in keeping with the sophistication of storylines that I expect from Lucha Underground. Everyone hyping Puma as the One, but it turns out that it's only one of Konnan's many lies.

    My own list for the Seven Descendants; Pentagon JR, King Cuerno, Matanza, Dragon Azteca JR (for lack of a better name right now, perhaps in the Neville Longbottom role), Mil Muertes, Sexy Star (even though I can't stand her) and Fenix
     
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  14. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    I'm not saying he's the chosen one, just that he has the blood of the ancient aztec tribes. It's stupid that they give his gimmick that part but then book him from boyle heights but then still dont have him talk. Either they should have booked Puma from somewhere in mexico or they should just let him talk, how hard would it be to say his grandfather moved to the USA for an opportunity but always instilled the legends of the aztecs into him to keep the legacy alive (or some bullshit like that)
     
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  15. @smarkmouth

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    I didn't mean to put words in your mouth. 'Chosen One' is my own take on it, as they've clearly decided to build this promotion around Prince Puma since day one. Maybe not a Chosen One per se, but his place on the roster, with this storyline, has certain connotations.

    I actually like that Puma doesn't talk, though. He's a Blank Slate. There's a fine balancing act of making your main protagonist real and stripping away some of that so your audience projects themselves into the main character. A silent main protagonist is an easy way to get there. Critically speaking, some of the best FPS games have been Portal 1 & 2, Skyrim, Half-life and Fallout 3. All silent protagonists, all Blank Slates.
     
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  16. ABMorales787

    ABMorales787 Lord And Master
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    Pentagon Jr. has taken a ginormous chunk of the Prince Puma hype. This last week clearly showed that the show is no longer about just Prince Puma and now has Pentagon as the rival to him. And I'm not just talking about the feud they have right now. When they split, Pentagon will more than likely be even more important to the show than he was last year. I truly believe the end goal Ultima Lucha 2 or 3 is a rematch between these two with Pentagon taking the title finally.

    Pentagon is basically (as if this show needed more anime references) the Vegeta to Puma's Goku. Going from flat out evil to neutral and finally redeeming himself for the big moment. He's a separate story to the one of the 7 Aztec tribes.
     
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  17. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    Definitely agree here
    Not so sure about this point. If the rumour is true that they want to do a Lucha Underground movie, i could very easily see Pentagon filling the vader role with Vampiro as the emperor. It'll depend how everything plays out with Dario first
     
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  18. @smarkmouth

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    So even when nothing remarkable happens on the show, it remains consistent.

    Jack Evans being given mic time is only a good thing. I loved how much was accomplished in this segment; Jack shining on the stick, a decent match, PJ Black looking good, Evans/Dragon program continuing and PJ added directly into the feud. My favorite little moment was at the end; PJ taking Drago's nunchucks as a symbol of his revenge. That piece of narrative belongs in cinema.

    Of all the enhancement talents they could push, I'm glad they went with Famous B. I don't expect much out of him, but he stood out last season with his use of highly recognized finishing moves (RKO, Rock Bottom). Maybe Push is the wrong word. He'll likely remain a Jobber, but a highlighted one like the Social Outcasts.

    King Cuerno vs Killshot was the biggest piece of filler so far this season, and Killshot's sloppiness didn't help. The Fenix/Cuerno feud continues, culminating into a GotG title rematch in a ladder match next week. I'm excited for that one, but I hope Cuerno retains and both of them move on to new programs (namely the teased King Cuerno/Mil Muertes program).

    I have to reiterate my admiration for face-Cage. I know he's a better heel, but he's playing babyface very well, too. Playing both roles as well as he does will do wonders for his career. Great match with Mundo, but I wasn't a fan of the finish. I do appreciate that LU expects somewhat of a previous knowledge for Mexican wrestling, and the rest of us are expected to catch up. However, I don't know who this Taya is, and it didn't seem as if Vampiro and Striker had any accolades to list for me to care about.

    In regards to my previous complaints about lighting, I plugged my laptop into my TV and played with the brightness, and it looked a lot better. Yaz, I think it may in fact be the daily motion upload.
     
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  19. Bagpipes

    Bagpipes Top Guys Out

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    Taya (Valkyrie) worked a bit with Perro Aguayo Jr. As a member of Perros del Mal a couple of years back in CMLL. She also went on to AAA where I think she picked up the "Valkyrie" part of her ring name. She was known as "The Crazy White Girl (La Guerra Loca)" of the group and won their women's title once that I know of. I'd imagine Killjoy could elaborate a bit more on her, I'm just going off of what i remember seeing on YouTube.

    Hopefully she gets some ring action and isn't stuck in the valet role in LU, she can work.
     
    #19
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  20. @smarkmouth

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    Cool, thanks for the info. It's too bad Stryker or Vamp didn't mention that she ran with Perro (in a tasteful way without exploiting his name, anyway), otherwise offer a softer introduction.

    This season has been light on the women's wrestling so far, with Star being held captive. I wouldn't be surprised if she gets showcased sooner than later.
     
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  21. @smarkmouth

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    From the Main Page

    Good news! I'm glad I'll be able to support the product properly. I'll be purchasing the SD season pass for season 2. Anyone else?
     
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  22. @smarkmouth

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    Okay, I think Famous B's vignettes are the best ones they've produced yet, second to maybe Konnan's wizardly ways back in season one.

    Sexy Star is back in the ring against Kobra Moon. I was initially interested in this Marty The Moth angle but the pacing is getting a little dragged on. As is Mysterio training Azteca. In fact, I wonder if this is how I would have felt watching week to week in season one, instead of binging it all as I did. All in all, it's starting to feel like we're nearing the 'end of act I' phase of the season, so I'll allow myself more patience. They've earned that.

    Mil should be allowed to speak Spanish, because his English is rivaling Drago's.

    I loved Pentagon JR vs Puma, and a good finish, no doubt setting up a triple threat match. The image of Mil Muertes ripping off his sling was so cool that I wish he had had more physical presence of injury, ie; a cast or whatnot. Writing him off with the injury so early in the season was wise, because now we've only seen him in the ring twice, and both times he was physically imposing and destructive.

    Speaking of Pentagon, Vampiro's really starting to annoy me. Whenever Striker mentions their connection or their matchup at Ultima Lucha, Vampiro disregards and changes the subject with some slight venom at Matt. Yet during the ladder match, he kept dropping little remarks like "I know that corner of the temple well" or "Reminds me of the last time a table was introduced, know what I mean?". I don't fault him as a colour commentator, because he's learning. I fault him for inconsistencies, that will likely be justified by Vampiro's split personality or outright ignored. Either way, it's a cop out.

    Now that ladder match was excellent! Loved the spots, and am a big fan of both guys. I will say this, though, it was excellent despite King Cuerno looking lost. I don't know his AAA or CMLL background, but he didn't look like he knew what to do with the ladders. It was if he set up the spots, but without a sense of urgency or purpose. Other than that, I really enjoyed the matchup. Maybe it went five minutes too long, but still a lot of fun to watch.
     
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  23. Rainbow Yaz

    Rainbow Yaz Sing about me, I'm dying of thirst
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    You forgot the best part of the show bro, Aztec Warfare is coming back!

    I agree with the point on Vampiro and Pentagon. I appreciate that Vampiro wants to distance himself from his old evil ways, but they need to be consistent with it. It is one of the two major complaints I have with commentary right now. The other being that they ask too many questions that the other will ignore. How many times do I have to hear Vampiro say "Know what I mean bro?" only for Striker to say silent, or Striker ask a question about Vampiro's in ring experience only for Vampiro to ignore it?

    Oh and while I'm asking questions, was there any purpose to Mack coming out during the Sexy Star/Kobra Moon match? I know he was in the last vignette when Sexy escaped, but his presence served no purpose.

    I feel like all in all this episode was a step in the right direction. They did well to advance multiple storylines. They made the announcement of Aztec Warfare in three weeks, furthered the Sexy and Marty story, set up Mil vs. Puma vs. Pentagon, and it looks like Fenix vs. Cuerno is wrapped up, for now at least.

    My biggest complaint was no Dario.
     
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  24. @smarkmouth

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    I meant to transition to that with my 'end of act I' remark, but it got away from me. I'm so glad they're bringing it back, this time as a match for the #1 Contendership as opposed to the vacant title. Both Matt and Vampiro also teased that it will be more violent while the Temple is under Catrina's rule. Even if they're blowing smoke, I'm just excited for the match, but if not, perhaps competitors will be encouraged to bring a weapon? A more Hardcore Aztec Warfare, if you will.

    I think we can count on at least one major debut in this one. Mysterio debuting could blow the roof off of the Temple.

    On Vamp's end, I chalk it up to his relative inexperience at the desk, although maybe he should have shown more progress by now. Striker should know better, though.

    Also, sad news to report. Sad to no one else but me, really. More accurately this is venting as opposed to reporting. I bought tickets for IWS (Montreal based) UnFNSanctioned this comingSaturday, mostly to see Pentagon JR. He and Vampiro just pulled out** for undisclosed reasons. Fack! Rey Mysterio is still main eventing the card, and Jack Evans is replacing Pentagon. Should be fun, but a little bittersweet. Konnan is also scheduled, so I may be thrown out for verbally abusing the talent.

    **Pulled out last week. I only just heard.
     
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  25. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    I thought fenix had broken his leg when he landed on that ladder. I also thought he was concussed at one point. Not sure if he sold really well or if it was legit.

    This episode wasnt as disjointed from the ring in terms of storylines. Which for me is the biggest fault of the show

    Really looking forward to wherever the Famous B vignettes are going
     
    #25

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