Have All Champions Become Transitional Champs to John Cena?

[MyNameIsMURF]

I think the reason everyone "waits" or expects John Cena to win back the WWE Championship is because it was JOHN CENA who created that specific belt. Everyone who looks at the WWE Championship, no matter whose waist it's around, mentally views it as John Cena's major attribute/accomplishment. Imagine Ted Dibiase Jr. losing the Million Dollar Belt, if WWE decides to legitimize it as a "real" defendable championship. Much like the Cena/WWE Title situation, you would find yourself wondering or "waiting" to see when Ted would regain it, would you not? I have found that anytime Cena wins the World Heavyweight Championship that even though he's wearing that belt, it's almost like he SHOULD be wearing the WWE Championship instead. This is the real reason why every champion that is NOT John Cena seems like a transitional champion. They are in fact NOT transitional, but the general feeling is that they are, simply because John Cena introduced the WWE Championship belt. Most people, if they are like me, even think that someday the WWE Title will spin again. It's always in the back of all our minds somewhere.

Once again... When Cena is World Heavyweight champion, he looks like a real champion, but he doesn't look "right" unless he's holding the WWE Championship belt. It's only then that looks like "THE CHAMP". So everyone "waits" for him to regain it by default, giving the appearance of transitional champions in the meantime.

It doesn't matter who faces who, or who carries the WWE Title, that specific belt pretty much belongs to John Cena. As for the World Heavyweight Championship, it is pretty well known that it belongs to Triple H, no matter who carries it. Case and point. Triple H hasn't been in the title picture for quite some time now, but still the WH Title belongs to The Game, and whenever he's ready, he'll take it back...just like Cena took back his WWE Title at WrestleMania XXVI.

 

[dethgar]

You're right. The WWE title dating back to last years draft:

Orton - Cena - Sheamus - Cena - Batista - Cena

When was the last time Cena was in a world title feud and didn't eventually win it? Even Trips has lost a feud going for the title. I can't recall Cena ever losing a feud out right and not becoming world champ at some point. They've even given Cena the Smackdown belt while on Raw(his feud with Edge and Show at WM25 and the amount of time after). You raise an incredible and well overlooked point, Tenta.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

No I don't think so, I honestly think it's more coincidence than anything.

Personally I think the reason the title always ends up back on Cena is because he is a proven commodity and its been proven that Cena can hold the title and be accepted as champion pretty much at anytime. I also got to mention that most of Cena's heavyweight title reigns lasted no more than 2-3 weeks (outside of the 2 long ones he had in 05-06). I think it all comes down to is the WWE want's to try putting the title on other people but they just keep going back to Cena because he can be generally accepted as the WWE champ and its also quite common for the top babyface to constantly hold the gold (it was the same thing with both Hogan and Austin from what I remember). Obviously there are others who are worthy of holding the #1 title, but none of those people are the top babyface, Cena is so he gets the gold the most.

 

[PedigreeTHE619Chokeslam]

Yes, John Cena is the Ultimate champion and the creator of the WWE Title.

 

[PedigreeTHE619Chokeslam]

And a little known fact about Cena: remember when he tore his pec muscle from the RKO on the announce table? yeah, no....he tore it from botching a HIP TOSS in that match. I'm sorry but I can't take a PROFESSIONAL seriously if he screws up a move like that, that bad. And please, no one say Orton may have no sold it, with Cena's build he should be able to hip toss any one on the roster...of course with his build and his status in such a big company he should be able to pull off more than 5 moves but we all know that will never happen. Although he did recently do his falling fist of doom from the turnbuckle....but that is just a top rope version of move #3. Baby steps I suppose.

Firstly, I'd really, really, really love to know how you know this. Your probably just one of those gay Cena haters, who nothing about the WWE, that just create a stupid scenario just to get attention on the threads. You no nothing. And anyways even if your stupid arrogant remark is correct, who cares, freak accidents can happen at any time. I'd love to see you join that line of work. Your scrawny ass would probably get hurt the second you hit the ring. You probably think it's easy work what they do. Trust me it's not.
And of coarse of the gimmick he is in right now those so called "five moves of doom"(which is gay by the way)fits his character well. Once again, you just show how arrogant, and how pathetic you are, and know nothing about the business.

 

[image1986]

I don't claim to be a expert in wrestling or how its booked but I dont believe the reason some fans don't like cena is based on the supposed" five moves of doom" and his lack of diverse move set. What seems to be the problem from what I have seen has been his character and constant title reigns. in terms of promotion, dedication and sales cena is the top player but his matchs seem bland and predictable. He's seems not to sell offense and puts away his challengers with a miracle comeback that makes his opponents look weak and when he does lose, its rarely clean. Cenas opponents lose legimacy in the tile wins against making it seem that their victory was a fluke. The way batista recently won the title from cena was the same way edge won the title, sheamus became champ based on an accidental fall through a table by cena. I do argee that not every wrestler needs long pointless title reigns but it is necessary to book the face of the company strong without burying the roster.

 

[Andy 2 Randy]

Image1986 - I have to agree with ya, because im no Cena fan myself ! Cena May have the so called '5 moves of doom' and have the 'superman' style of wrestling, but its what kids want, and they bring in the money for Vinnie Mac-Daddy. Anyone over the age of 16 dont want cena to always win matches the way he does (Epicly beatdown for 20 mins, somehow hits his Falling fist drop or whatever the PG name is for it, then wins in less than 2 mins). But if the Kid-Fans want Cena to have Every World title, then its going to happen, whether real fans want it or not.

 

[The Deadly Viper]

Yes this is the case and I'll tell you why this has become the case. WWE is out to make money and entertain people. Well what better way to do it than to have the most popular superstar with your largest fan base be at the top of the mountain. He sells everything that they have. If Cena isn't on the card that equals less buys, it's funny how that works isn't it. The kids love him and even though I personally dislike him, he does get the sales, and that is what the WWE want.

 

[Tenta]

No I don't think so, I honestly think it's more coincidence than anything.

Really, deanerandterry? Really? So, let me get this straight. You find it coincidence that champions typically do nothing in their reign unless it's Cena? Usually, it's slew of rematches that build up the champion, and that's about the only storyline they receive. Randy Orton and Batista fought for months over the Heavyweight Title, because they were in a holding pattern. The WWE didn't want too much to happen that would inevitably set up for the eventual Cena match. And this is all coincidence to you?

Personally I think the reason the title always ends up back on Cena is because he is a proven commodity and its been proven that Cena can hold the title and be accepted as champion pretty much at anytime.

But that's the case with plenty of wrestlers on Raw, Deaner. Triple H has proved that he's a very capable champion, and quite frankly, so has Randy Orton. Batista has found his niche in being a heel. That's plenty of names that can hold the belt for a while, and be proven champions. Still, they're more or less champions to be propped up until Cena returns. Not saying it's a bad thing, just an obervation.

I also got to mention that most of Cena's heavyweight title reigns lasted no more than 2-3 weeks (outside of the 2 long ones he had in 05-06).

Well, that's like avoiding the fucking elephant in the room, man. You can't just take away the two long reigns of Cena, man.

I think it all comes down to is the WWE want's to try putting the title on other people but they just keep going back to Cena because he can be generally accepted as the WWE champ and its also quite common for the top babyface to constantly hold the gold (it was the same thing with both Hogan and Austin from what I remember).

Well yes, but they also tried to give the belt to Savage, Warrior, and other names in Hulk's absence, and actually tried to build them up with proper storylines. Hell, they did the same thing with Austin from 98 to 99. We all were waiting for Austin to win back the title, but they still put in the effort of building up the champion, and creating another main event name. That's exactly what they did with Foley and Rock. They were champions, but they were given their feud, because the WWE believed they were far more formidible champions. And most of those reigns were a month, at most, for those men. Again, it's not about the length of the reign, but what they fucking have you doing in the reign, man.

Obviously there are others who are worthy of holding the #1 title, but none of those people are the top babyface, Cena is so he gets the gold the most.

Because, well, everyone around him is his transition champion. Don't get me wrong, we seem to agree on why Cena gets the belt. Just not the treatment of everyone else in between Cena's reigns.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

Really, deanerandterry? Really? So, let me get this straight. You find it coincidence that champions typically do nothing in their reign unless it's Cena? Usually, it's slew of rematches that build up the champion, and that's about the only storyline they receive. Randy Orton and Batista fought for months over the Heavyweight Title, because they were in a holding pattern. The WWE didn't want too much to happen that would inevitably set up for the eventual Cena match. And this is all coincidence to you?

Well actually, YES i do think it's coincidence, also add on the fact that I don't actually believe EVERY champ has been transitional to John Cena. From October '07 to November '08 John Cena wasn't champion and a lot of the times wasn't even in the top feud (From October to January he was hurt, but they had plenty of opportunities to give him back the belt after that, but he didn't get it now did he?). Randy Orton was heavyweight champion for 6-7 months during this time (during the time he had feuds with HBK, HHH, Jeff Hardy and John Cena for the belt), not only that he actually DEFEATED John Cena in the RAW main event at Wrestlemania that year (if every wrestler was John Cena fodder, you would think he would have become champ at this time wouldn't you?)

But that's the case with plenty of wrestlers on Raw, Deaner. Triple H has proved that he's a very capable champion, and quite frankly, so has Randy Orton. Batista has found his niche in being a heel. That's plenty of names that can hold the belt for a while, and be proven champions. Still, they're more or less champions to be propped up until Cena returns. Not saying it's a bad thing, just an observation.

I actually agree with this part as I believe they have plenty of capable champs, just not the part where you say that they are just champions until Cena takes the reigns as champ again, as I stated above, the WWE has taken steps into building credible champions outside of Cena. In this day and age 7 months as champion might as well be 4 years.

Well, that's like avoiding the fucking elephant in the room, man. You can't just take away the two long reigns of Cena, man.

I can see why you took it that way, but in no way, shape, or form I am taking away from John Cena's lengthy title reigns (as in '05-'07, RAW was basically the John Cena show). All I was trying to say as Cena himself has been pretty much a transitional champion for the last 2 1/2 - 3 years, as since October '07 he hasn't had a monster reign like he did back in '05-'07. Not ignoring the fact that Cena had a monopoly on the title previously, but over the last 2-3 years I see the WWE taking a lot of steps forward to change that. 4-5 years ago I would of agreed completely, but not today.

Well yes, but they also tried to give the belt to Savage, Warrior, and other names in Hulk's absence, and actually tried to build them up with proper storylines. Hell, they did the same thing with Austin from 98 to 99. We all were waiting for Austin to win back the title, but they still put in the effort of building up the champion, and creating another main event name. That's exactly what they did with Foley and Rock. They were champions, but they were given their feud, because the WWE believed they were far more formidible champions. And most of those reigns were a month, at most, for those men. Again, it's not about the length of the reign, but what they fucking have you doing in the reign, man.

Well yeah but one thing I will say is that in 98-99 when Austin was trying to get the belt back, even though Foley/The Rock were having a great feud for the title (and did a hell of a job filling up time until The Rock and Austin faced off), the show still mostly revolved around Austin and his quest to become WWE champion. In the late 80's the only wrestler that got a true shot at being the WWF champion was the Warrior. True, Macho man held the title for a lot longer than warrior did, but the entire time he was champ he was SECONDARY compared to Hogan and the only reason he got a year as champ because Hogan was gone the whole time making No Holds Barred. Any time Cena disappears to make movies, its only for like 3-4 weeks outside of 7-8 months like Hogan. The Warrior was the only one who was actually PUSHED to be the WWF's top guy when Hogan was around because the WWF believed they found their new Hogan in the Warrior. Not only that are you saying that every title feud not involving Cena is worthless and a waste of time, because in many of the top feuds for the World titles didn't even involve Cena (such as HHH/Orton, Undertaker/Edge, Jeff Hardy/Orton, Jeff Hardy/Punk, Jeff Hardy/Edge), it sounds to me like the WWE does an admirable job trying to build the champ and make the champ relevent in Cena's absence from the title picture.

Because, well, everyone around him is his transition champion. Don't get me wrong, we seem to agree on why Cena gets the belt. Just not the treatment of everyone else in between Cena's reigns.

I agree 100%, I think a lot of wrestlers get fair shakes and treatment for the title, not just Cena. I know Cena is constantly shoved down everyones throats, but truthfully its not nearly as bad as it was 4-5 years ago. The WWE has taken plenty of time these days to build new champions and to give them meaningful title reigns, it may not seem that way because the storylines, creativity, and booking aren't nearly as great as it used to be, but that has nothing to do with them trying to build other credible champions besides Cena, it just means that their efforts sometimes fall flat. Also like I said (once again not discrediting the title reigns), if John Cena didn't have those 2 long reigns (with the last one being over 2 1/2 years ago), this wouldn't even be a discussion.

My point is simple, the WWE has done alot over the last 2 1/2 - 3 years to make other credible champions outside of Cena, they are not all transitional champions, and there are other champions that have been giving meaningful title reigns outside of Cena (the 2 big examples being Randy Orton and the Undertaker and that covers BOTH titles so there you go).

 

[Andy 2 Randy]

deaneandterry - great point dude, totally forgot about the Triple threat at WM 24.
Yes Cena did lose, but only due to a pin-point Punt Kick. If the kick didnt happen, then Cena would of won with the so called '5 Moves of Doom'. But Good point anyway :Back to Current Cena title reigns though, This past RAW, its easy to predict whats going to happen... Batista picks the match type, thinks he's unbeatable, John wipes the smirk off his face = Lengthy Title Run Again...Im just sayin!!

 

[Poop Master Flex]

deaneandterry - great point dude, totally forgot about the Triple threat at WM 24.
Yes Cena did lose, but only due to a pin-point Punt Kick. If the kick didnt happen, then Cena would of won with the so called '5 Moves of Doom'. But Good point anyway :Back to Current Cena title reigns though, This past RAW, its easy to predict whats going to happen... Batista picks the match type, thinks he's unbeatable, John wipes the smirk off his face = Lengthy Title Run Again...Im just sayin!!

Very true, but the thing is Orton punted HHH, not Cena, if I recall correctly (and I do because I checked it out) HHH Pedigreed Cena, pinned Cena, then Orton punted HHH and then pinned Cena, so either way Cena lost the match and in both cases Cena was the one who got PINNED and took the loss, not being smart just defending my point is all.

I think its pretty much a given that Cena will most likely beat Batista (and I am certainly not denying that), but that doesn't necessarily mean he will take a long title reign from it, I mean this is a guy who lost the title to Sheamus for god sake, he obviously doesn't have a problem losing the title to ANYBODY, and with the way the WWE is willing to give any mid carder the title these days, I think Cena (in the same way he did with Sheamus) could very well be used to make another heel into a main eventer since it seems to be the new way to make a wrestler these days. I'm not saying you're wrong, but honestly when Cena beat Orton for the title, I saw him having another long title reign, but then he ends up losing the title to Sheamus. I'm just saying that although there is a chance Cena will have a long title reign (I could see it happening no question), but with the WWE being a little more unpredictable in their bookings these days there is a decent-to-good chance that he won't be champ for as long as everybody thinks.

 

[Andy 2 Randy]

Big Respect to your knowlege! you obviously know quite a bit!

With you saying about Sheamus' 'Shock' win over Cena, and saying he gives the mid-carders a chance... Totally agree, however, WWE really need to use differant champions time and again and not just Cena. For example, Royal Rumble 2010, Randy vs Sheamus. Very good match (apart from Cody's interferance). Randy the Champ and giving other Mid-carders a chance (not just Muscley Irishmen) like, say Shelton Benjamin or Kofi Kingston, would make better matches than Cena constanly as champ.
Speaking of Sheamus...Wheres his Re-Match??? He lost at Elimination Chamber and has been out the Title picture ever since (yes a feud with HHH, but no mention of him...)

 

[Vega]

I agree. That is, I think, one of the main reasons a lot of people prefer SmackDown!. You can't really say who'll hold the World Heavyweight Championship in two month and who the contender(s) will be. That makes it unpredictable and exciting. There is real competition. On Raw, people know that Cena will never fall out off the title picture for more than two or maximum three PPVs. It's all about Cena and that makes a lot of fans dislike him. A WWE Title feud without Cena is right now almost unimaginable. I think it could do wonders if Cena would have a high-profiled non-title feud for half a year or so. It also works for HHH, Edge, Jericho, Orton, Punk and so on and wouldn't hurt Cena too much, just taking away some heat. The overall hierarchy of "Cena - Main Players - Midcarders - Jobbers - Slackers" is too strict in my opinion.

 

[cinderboy]

1. Like what 99% of the people agree with, Cena sells merchandise and tickets, WWE is a business afterall.

2. The other winners were just there to "refresh" the whole championship scene.

I don't think its a necessarily bad thing, WWE did push Batista etc before, while Sheamus still has a long way to go. Which wrestler now can sell more merchandise than Cena and is around his age and kid-friendly?