WWE: One world champion not enough

[No Count Pup]

This is the first time in decades wrestling has had one world champion. In the old days TV featured a WWF Champion, an AWA World Champion, an NWA Champion, a WCW Champion, an ECW Champion, and starting in 2002 a World Heavyweight Champion. Today one champion reigns supreme and everyone else is just there.

The dynamics were different way back when. If a guy couldn't win the big one in one company he could jump ship to another. Lex Luger went down south and beat Hogan for WCW gold; Mick Foley was a career midcarder until he headed north and hoisted the WWF Title on Raw. Such fluidity persisted (in its own way) during the early years of the brand extension. Without a second world title Edge, Jeff Hardy, Eddie Guerrero, CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, and Rey Mysterio might have never seized a championship.

This is not a call for a draft or brand extension. However, I think the absence of a second world title creates a programming malaise. A second world title would do wonders for Kevin Owens, Cesaro, Bray Wyatt, Ryback, Rusev, Roman Reigns, and Dean Ambrose. None of those guys have a meaningful chance to win the belt in the next 6-7 months. Once the December PPV ends the WWE Title situation freezes until WrestleMania.

I would like to see a world champion on Raw and a world champion on Smackdown. The titles can be exclusive to each show, but the wrestlers can still compete on both programs. Fans would also have reason to watch Smackdown, because right now there is no reason to tune in. What are your thoughts? Does WWE need a second world title? Something isn't clicking with the fans; even JBL did better numbers than what we see today.

 

[The Brain]

Why create another world title when they could just put some effort into making the IC title more important? Let the guys you mentioned compete for that. It might take a little time to get used since the IC title has been so badly mishandled for so many years now but if you shift whatever storylines you have in mind for a second world title to the IC title you could elevate an existing (and one time prestigious) title without devaluing the existing world title.

 

[No Count Pup]

Why create another world title when they could just put some effort into making the IC title more important? Let the guys you mentioned compete for that. It might take a little time to get used since the IC title has been so badly mishandled for so many years now but if you shift whatever storylines you have in mind for a second world title to the IC title you could elevate an existing (and one time prestigious) title without devaluing the existing world title.

I respectfully disagree. Midcard titles belong on midcard wrestlers. In today's WWE there are too many main event-level talent meandering in the midcard. Any of them (Cesaro, KO, Rusev, Wyatt, Ryback, Reigns, Ambrose) would have been world champions in the territories.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

WWE had another World Championship in existence for over 11.5 years and probably the single most frequent comment I saw in regards to the World Heavyweight Championship was "WWE should go back to having a single World Championship" and it'd be no different if they reinstated the WHC or created another title altogether. Much like the brand extension itself, it wouldn't be six months before the internet would be flooded with the same old complaints regarding two World Championships as there once was. The last few years of its existence, the WHC was essentially the unofficial upper mid-card title, occupying the spot the IC title enjoyed during its more prosperous days. WWE has been working hard to reinvigorate the mid-card titles over the course of this year; there've been setbacks with the IC title due to Daniel Bryan being injured shortly after winning it and Ryback being on the shelf for a few weeks due to a staph infection, but it's certainly in an overall healthier place than it's been for a few years now and it's going to take time to restore it.

One reason why things were so different way back when was because the business itself was so different. While Vince McMahon gets most of the credit for essentially ending the territory system, the territory system itself was quickly dying out due to the greatly expanding availability of cable television and syndication, the reluctance of older promoters to change with the times; some of these companies had been going out of business for years before finally having to close down. By the mid 80s, the glory days of the AWA were gone and the product itself wasn't all that interesting. I've watched some of the reruns of AWA Championship Wrestling on ESPN Classic and the vast majority of the time, quite frankly, it was like watching paint dry. WCCW ultimately went under because Fritz Von Erich refused to expand, Crockett Promotions ran itself out of business trying to compete with the WWF, WCW consistently got its ass kicked for the first 6 or 7 years of its existence before eventually putting all its eggs in the Hulk Hogan & nWo baskets, ECW was a victim of its own reputation as the fans were primarily interested in bloodbaths & crazy, over the top spots that risked life & limb and no network would put ECW on the air without editing out most of what made ECW stand out in the first place.

I agree that mid-card titles ultimately belong on mid-card wrestlers but, then again, you have to take into account the damage that Vince has done to his mid-card titles over the years with nonsensical, chaotic, lackadaisical and/or downright stupid creative decisions over the years. For instance, Wade Barrett was Intercontinental Champion 5 times and can you think of any wrestler over the past 20 years that's gotten less out of being IC champ than him? Whenever he'd get the title then, for whatever reason, Vince would start jobbing him out left & right. He did it with Miz, Kofi, Ziggler and a few others especially the past few years and it was enough to make you wanna tear your hair out by the roots. As for the US title, he had Ambrose carry it around for almost a year and had Ambrose defend it maybe two, three times tops at any TV or ppv event. Had Bryan not gotten injured, there's a strong possibility he'd have done great things for the title before, most likely, heading back to the main event picture, as we've seen Cena do for the US title. Main event guys, lower mid-card guys, upper mid-card guys....at the end of the day, if they treat the titles as if they matter and, overall, make them interesting, that's what's most important in my eyes.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

No. For the same reason there isn't two Super Bowls, two NBA Finals, etc. If there was two Super Bowls or World Titles, then both World Titles would be devalued. Like, I'm not the man, I'm just one of two men.

 

[The Brain]

I respectfully disagree. Midcard titles belong on midcard wrestlers. In today's WWE there are too many main event-level talent meandering in the midcard. Any of them (Cesaro, KO, Rusev, Wyatt, Ryback, Reigns, Ambrose) would have been world champions in the territories.

During the glory days of the IC title we saw champions like Randy Savage, Ricky Steamboat, Ultimate Warrior, Rick Rude, Mr. Perfect, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, etc. Are the guys you mentioned better than them? I don't think any of them would have been world champion during the period when the guys I mentioned were IC champ.

 

[Braineaters]

There definitely needs to be a second major championship; without its own title, Smackdown has become pointless garbage.

People can talk about the titles devaluing one another all they want, but the only thing that actually devalues them is bad booking.

Fans have long complained about Cena constantly being on top and hijacking the main event, and with no alternative, that's exactly what we're getting, and in even heavier doses than before.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

There definitely needs to be a second major championship; without its own title, Smackdown has become pointless garbage.

People can talk about the titles devaluing one another all they want, but the only thing that actually devalues them is bad booking.

Fans have long complained about Cena constantly being on top and hijacking the main event, and with no alternative, that's exactly what we're getting, and in even heavier doses than before.

Smackdown wasn't better with its own world championship. Cena hasn't been on top for a while, so you can't really bring up that point either.

 

[No Count Pup]

WWE had another World Championship in existence for over 11.5 years and probably the single most frequent comment I saw in regards to the World Heavyweight Championship was "WWE should go back to having a single World Championship" and it'd be no different if they reinstated the WHC or created another title altogether. Much like the brand extension itself, it wouldn't be six months before the internet would be flooded with the same old complaints regarding two World Championships as there once was. The last few years of its existence, the WHC was essentially the unofficial upper mid-card title, occupying the spot the IC title enjoyed during its more prosperous days. WWE has been working hard to reinvigorate the mid-card titles over the course of this year; there've been setbacks with the IC title due to Daniel Bryan being injured shortly after winning it and Ryback being on the shelf for a few weeks due to a staph infection, but it's certainly in an overall healthier place than it's been for a few years now and it's going to take time to restore it.

Well said, but I disagree. The talent pool is so much stronger than 2010-2013. We scratched our heads when Swagger, Henry, and Khali won the gold. But nobody would bat an eye if Rusev, Ryback, KO, Reigns, Ambrose, Cesaro, or Wyatt won the WHC. Ziggler could wow the crowds with five star main events. The landscape has changed, and main eventers should vie for something higher than midcard fodder.

Today is a WHC-friendly WWE. A second title would engage the fan base and give Smackdown the jolt it needs.

 

[Braineaters]

Smackdown wasn't better with its own world championship. Cena hasn't been on top for a while, so you can't really bring up that point either.

I sure as hell think it was, and based on current ratings, many other fans seem to think so, too.

As for Cena, he's never NOT on top. Much as I dislike him as a performer, he didn't drop down the card when he took the US championship; the title rose up the card because he held it, and I give him credit for that.

If they wanted to, they could easily make either the US or IC championship the main event title for Smackdown; they don't need to make a new belt, or even bring the World title back. But for the sake of having a meaningful second program, and for the sake of increasing fans' interest in the product, I think a second major championship is necessary.

 

[laodaron]

Smackdown wasn't better with its own world championship. Cena hasn't been on top for a while, so you can't really bring up that point either.

He won the US Title at Mania, and was feuding with Rusev before that even. It's been almost ALL of 2015 that Cena hasn't been in the Main Title Picture, and Cena Derangement Syndrome is alive and well.

 

[No Count Pup]

During the glory days of the IC title we saw champions like Randy Savage, Ricky Steamboat, Ultimate Warrior, Rick Rude, Mr. Perfect, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, etc. Are the guys you mentioned better than them? I don't think any of them would have been world champion during the period when the guys I mentioned were IC champ.

After they won the IC Title they moved up. Today wrestlers lose the belt and go nowhere. This nagging issue illustrates part of the problem: the WrestleMania world title freeze is fast approaching. Who will McMahon freeze the title for? Lesnar, Taker, Triple H? That does nothing for the main event-level talent chomping at the bit. Until the freeze Cena, Rolllins, and Sheamus will dominate the world title picture.

One more note: The wrestlers in your post (HBK the exception) left WWE and main evented elsewhere. They went where opportunity knocked. Today's main event-level talent don't have that option.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

He won the US Title at Mania, and was feuding with Rusev before that even. It's been almost ALL of 2015 that Cena hasn't been in the Main Title Picture, and Cena Derangement Syndrome is alive and well.

Come on, I don't like Cena, but he should at least be in the upper mid card. I think his time in the main event scene has passed, but you're just being ridiculous.

 

[Anger]

I never understood why they unified the belts to begin with. It does leave a wealth of newer, floundering talent stuck in the mid-card or lower. Look at the great program Ambrose had with Rollins. He could easily be WHC and running with it, but is stuck assisting Reigns against Wyatt. Or Reigns could be making his bones as WHC instead of jumping from one meaningless feud to the next. Owens rightfully deserves a title run, but is instead most likely relegated to putting over Ryback in his upcoming feud. Certainly the U.S. and IC titles need to be built up and worked properly, but they and the unified WWE WHC belt are not enough for this much talent. Which is why I never was for unification at all.

 

[mkw1962]

As much as I would love to see it I would have to say no. What I would do is elevate the U.S. Title and I.C. Title, with main event wrestlers holding or battling for those belts on a regular basis, let Cena get it back and have the open challenges again. They should bring back the European and Hardcore Titles and make them mid-card Titles. I can see wrestlers jumping from main event to mid-card just to make it exciting.
EXAMPLE:
World Title Seth Rollins
U.S. Title John Cena
I.C. Title Ryback
European Title Neville
Hardcore Title Dean Ambrose

 

[The Brain]

After they won the IC Title they moved up. Today wrestlers lose the belt and go nowhere.

One more note: The wrestlers in your post (HBK the exception) left WWE and main evented elsewhere. They went where opportunity knocked. Today's main event-level talent don't have that option.

There were plenty of people that had good IC title reigns that did not go on to win the world title. In fact during the first 15 years of the title's existence only five champions ended up winning the world title. Once Hart and Michaels did it (out of necessity during and after the steroid trial) the IC title gained a reputation as a stepping stone to the world title. I don't think it was intended to be that. In fact I think it was created for the exact reason you want a second world title. Guys like Ken Patera, Don Muraco, Greg Valentine, and Tito Santana weren't going to be world champions but they were good enough to be at least a secondary champion. People really cared about the IC title for a long time because great wrestlers were put in intriguing storylines that revolved around the title.

I like Cesaro, Owens, and Ambrose but I don't see any of them as world champion. I do think they would make great IC champions. If you're going to take guys like that and give them a world title then what's the point of even having the IC title? I don't think another world title is necessary. All the guys you mentioned could give us great IC title matches if the booking team would just give that title some attention and actually stick to it.

 

[whoopin' ass]

So here is the question - does that extra World Title really have any meaning then? If you create a new title just to have another World Title for someone to wear, it is a meaningless title. The problem isn't a lack of World Titles, it is that you have 1 company that is so much larger than everyone else that most top guys don't ever leave. Both the ROH and TNA titles have a ton of champs - CM Punk, Bryan Danielson, Seth Rollins, Samoa Joe, etc. These guys are champs no matter where they go. But if you want to be successful, you have to work for wwe so what happens? You get one company with a ton of champs. Want to improve things? Support those companies so the guys have options of where to work. Creating titles just so you can have more champs makes all the titles meaningless. Those other companies prove that wwe doesn't make the talent, support those companies, treat their champs the same as you would a wwe champ and see what happens.

 

[L@RISANO]

After they won the IC Title they moved up. Today wrestlers lose the belt and go nowhere. This nagging issue illustrates part of the problem: the WrestleMania world title freeze is fast approaching. Who will McMahon freeze the title for? Lesnar, Taker, Triple H? That does nothing for the main event-level talent chomping at the bit. Until the freeze Cena, Rolllins, and Sheamus will dominate the world title picture.

One more note: The wrestlers in your post (HBK the exception) left WWE and main evented elsewhere. They went where opportunity knocked. Today's main event-level talent don't have that option.

You do realise that current champion Rollins is a new guy, and Reigns just Main-Evented WrestleMania, right? Not everyone can get the title at the same time. They need to be built up as belonging to the highest level with the Cenas, Ortons and Lesnars.


Guys like Owens, Ryback, etc. are amongst those who should be fighting for either the US/IC titles which should be booked to matter as opposed to bringing another World title to encourage more lazy booking by the WWE.

 

[laodaron]

Come on, I don't like Cena, but he should at least be in the upper mid card. I think his time in the main event scene has passed, but you're just being ridiculous.

I think that you mis-understand. Cena Derangement Syndrome (CDS) is the disorder in which a smark on the internet claims that John Cena:

A) can't Wrestle
B) won't Take a pin when necessary
C) Buries talent
D) Goes into business for himself
E) Can't promo
F) anything not inclusive above

I wasn't saying that you had CDS, I was saying that anyone complaining about Cena and the World Title just isn't even paying attention.

 

[No Count Pup]

So here is the question - does that extra World Title really have any meaning then? If you create a new title just to have another World Title for someone to wear, it is a meaningless title. The problem isn't a lack of World Titles, it is that you have 1 company that is so much larger than everyone else that most top guys don't ever leave. Both the ROH and TNA titles have a ton of champs - CM Punk, Bryan Danielson, Seth Rollins, Samoa Joe, etc. These guys are champs no matter where they go. But if you want to be successful, you have to work for wwe so what happens? You get one company with a ton of champs. Want to improve things? Support those companies so the guys have options of where to work. Creating titles just so you can have more champs makes all the titles meaningless. Those other companies prove that wwe doesn't make the talent, support those companies, treat their champs the same as you would a wwe champ and see what happens.

I'm not talking about bringing in a generic world championship. I am talking about the World Heavyweight Championship that goes back over a century. Yes the lineage is hard to keep up with (WWE can't make up its mind) but the WHC has headlined WrestleManias. It's not the Smackdown Title that Teddy Long wanted in 2005.

 

[No Count Pup]

You do realise that current champion Rollins is a new guy, and Reigns just Main-Evented WrestleMania, right? Not everyone can get the title at the same time. They need to be built up as belonging to the highest level with the Cenas, Ortons and Lesnars.


Guys like Owens, Ryback, etc. are amongst those who should be fighting for either the US/IC titles which should be booked to matter as opposed to bringing another World title to encourage more lazy booking by the WWE.

The ratings are a disaster. One world champion is the worst idea in history. Bringing in the WHC would be huge. It's time to make WWE great again. Sorry to talk like Trump, but that was fun. Now if I could be serious for a moment: ratings have suffered since the one world title thing began. Khali and Swagger drew better than Raw 2015. Something's gone terribly wrong.

And on the booking comment, I would guess it is easier to book a midcard title than a world title. How does the WHC lead to lazy booking?

 

[No Count Pup]

I like Cesaro, Owens, and Ambrose but I don't see any of them as world champion. I do think they would make great IC champions. If you're going to take guys like that and give them a world title then what's the point of even having the IC title? I don't think another world title is necessary. All the guys you mentioned could give us great IC title matches if the booking team would just give that title some attention and actually stick to it.

This points to a fundamental difference in our arguments. I see world champion in those guys. If WCW was around they would win the Big Gold Belt. To see them wrestle in tag matches, or suffer from 50/50 booking is frustrating. The current main eventers are rating-anemic anyway. Might as well let the uber talents rise to the top on the WHC side.

 

[Kodo Sawaki]

That would solve couple of problems and expand mainevent scene a bit. For example Cesaro- Owens now doesnt mean a thing in terms of significance. Now if it was for WHC Championship it would be something else. Though its WWEs fault that they give us generic feud and not something more compeling in terms of story.

Other thing is what people said about IC title. But IC title(unlike US title) has been treated like a lesser title and not some prize even before Cena took US title. Even now you have Ryback vs Big Show vs Miz for that title which almost nobody wants to see while US title is special prize even for Seth Rollins who is WWE WHC Champion. So now instead of anyone new challenging for US title who you made prize title you have rematch of Cena- Rollins and you have partimer(I like Sting, dont get me wrong) chalenging for WWE WHC title. Meanwhile you have feuds like Sheamus- Orton, Ziggler- Rusev(that one kinda has story though it sucks), Reigns and Ambrose vs Lame Wyatt and Owens vs Cesaro. And not one of the "all mighty creative" could think: Hey, lets shuffle things up a bit and get Owens and Cesaro to challenge Ryback instead of letting Big Show to do that so people can yell "retire" to him. Or lets have someone like Reigns challenge Cena for US title and win it in good match if we wanna elevate him good and see how he would do with title before we hand him WWE WHC. So, I blame creative, you have tons of possibilities but you just dont use them.

So yes, two titles would maybe solve few problems but even right now you can do exaclly same. You just need creative to be, ehm, creative.

 

[wrestler36]

I wouldn't mind them doing the brand extension again. They would also have to make the IC and US titles exclusive to a show. I would change the premise of the Royal Rumble and Wrestlemania though, just to shake things up. Maybe the winner of the RR chooses to face either champion at No Way Out. Then have it the Raw Champion faces the Smackdown Champion at every Wrestlemania, kind of like how all major sports play their championship. I suppose the same can be done for the US/IC titles

 

[Slash-LN]

If you put the second world title on guys like Ryback, Roman, Cesaro, KO or Ambrose no one would bat an eye.

Ryback can't make the IC title feel important. How exactly would he make a world title feel important? One that we already know is going to be treated as second tier anyway so it's going to need a champ that can make it feel important. It shouldn't be used to make the wrestler feel important. Not right off the bat anyway.

Roman, so many people already complain that he's shoved down our throats. You really think no one would bat an eye if they put the title on him and made him the face of Smackdown?

Cesaro, he's a phenomenal wrestler. He's probably only a singles wrestler right now because his partner got hurt and he can make the guys they want to push look good.

Dean doesn't need a title but I could see it being a decent possibility.

Kevin Owens would make sense to us internet nerds. We understand his history. And while I think he could get there in the next year or two, he isn't the guy yet to make the face of your brand when you're trying to get it out of the gutter. He doesn't have enough name recognition yet.

Bray? The guy that so many people already complain about does the same feud with different names. He's going to be the face of the brand?

You didn't mention Randy Orton who may never touch the world title again. It worked out so well having him as the face of Smackdown before. (sarcasm). Let's put the title on him and have him save Smackdown.

You know what they SHOULD do? Put the current WWE title on Smackdown and Raw and have their major stars on both shows and progress story lines on both. Because if that isn't going to raise ratings on Smackdown then having a second title certainly isn't going to.