Wrestlemania 8: A Retrospective Look

[Dagger Dias]

Here is the 8th of 29 Retrospective topics on previous Wrestlemania events. The purpose of these threads are to look back and observe the history behind the Wrestlemania brand before the biggest show of them all, which is approaching us more each day as we get closer to April.

In this topic we will talk about.... Wrestlemania 8!

Wrestlemania 8 took place on April 5th, 1992. It was held at the Hoosier Dome in Indianapolis, Indiana where 62,167 fans attended. Here are the results of the show....


0. The Bushwhackers (Luke Williams and Butch Miller) defeated The Beverly Brothers (Blake and Beau) in a tag team match for the dark match (10:00)

1. Shawn Michaels (with Sensational Sherri) defeated El Matador in a singles match (10:38)

2. The Undertaker (with Paul Bearer) defeated Jake Roberts in a singles match (06:36)

3. Bret Hart defeated Roddy Piper (c) in a singles match to win the WWF Intercontinental Championship (13:51)

4. Big Boss Man, Virgil, Sgt. Slaughter, and Jim Duggan defeated The Nasty Boys (Brian Knobs and Jerry Sags), Repo Man, and The Mountie (with Jimmy Hart) in an eight-man tag team match (06:33)

5. Randy Savage (with Miss Elizabeth) defeated Ric Flair (c) (with Mr. Perfect) in a singles match to win the WWF Championship (18:04)

6. Tatanka defeated Rick Martel in a singles match (04:33)

7. The Natural Disasters (Earthquake and Typhoon) defeated Money Inc. (Ted DiBiase and Irwin R. Schyster) (c) (with Jimmy Hart) by countout Tag team match for the WWF Tag Team Championship (08:38)

8. Owen Hart defeated Skinner in a singles match (01:36)

9. Hulk Hogan defeated Sid Justice (with Harvey Wippleman) by disqualification in a singles match (12:28)



Now, here are some discussion questions concerning the event:

What was your favorite match on this show, and why did you like it the most? What about the worst match of this show, why did you like it the least?

If you could change a few things about Wrestlemania 8, what would it be and why?

You may only use wrestlers who were available at the roster at that time or make changes that could have realistically taken place in April 1992. Please keep in mind the situations going into the show such as who could actually have been pushed into a title match, or what songs existed back then if you wanted to change the show's theme music, and so forth.

You may only discuss Wrestlemania 8 in this thread. The other Wrestlemania events will be getting their own retrospective threads shortly, any posts regarding other events will be considered spam and you risk getting an infraction.

Discuss!

 

[The Brain]

WrestleMania VIII was a fantastic event yet it is one that many people want to change. The popular opinion is going to be the main event should have been Hulk Hogan vs. Ric Flair. After all, that match was actually announced at first. For as much as I would have enjoyed the hype surrounding that big match the timing just wasn’t right. In fact never had there been worse timing in anything. For nearly ten years Hulk Hogan vs. Ric Flair was the ultimate dream match. Finally they were in the same company at the same time and it seemed like a lock to be the blockbuster headline for mania. Then the steroid scandal hit and Hogan had to leave the WWF. Yes, Hogan still competed at WM8 but Flair was champion. Either Hogan was going to win the title and immediately leave the company or NWA icon Ric Flair was going to beat WWF icon Hulk Hogan at WrestleMania sending Hogan out of the company he helped create at the event he helped create. Keep that in mind when you say you would have booked Hogan vs. Flair.

This is the first mania where it’s hard to pick my favorite match because there are two great choices. Both Bret Hart vs. Roddy Piper and Ric Flair vs. Randy Savage were excellent. You can’t go wrong picking either one of those. I’ll pick the IC match as my favorite. That match is probably my all time favorite when it comes to ring psychology and telling a story. Hart and Piper were good friends. Hart was the technician and Piper was the street fighter. Out of respect to his friend, and because he felt he had something to prove, Piper was going to try to out wrestle Hart. It started out as a good wrestling match at first but you could see Piper becoming more and more frustrated as Hart got the better of him. Piper fell for a couple of Hart’s tricks during the match and eventually he let his temper get the best of him and went back to his street fighting ways. Once the ref went down Piper went for the ring bell to finish Hart off. Piper hesitated and you could just read his mind as he held the bell over his head. Did he really want to go back to being hated? Did he want to lose the respect of the fans? Did he want to destroy his friendship with Hart? Ultimately Piper decided to toss the bell aside and use a sleeper to try to beat Hart fair and square. Hart countered the sleeper and got the pin on Piper to retain the title. Since this happened just seconds after choosing not to use the bell the fans wondered if Piper regretted his decision and would attack Hart. After a minute Piper presented the belt to Hart and helped him up as the left the arena together.

My least favorite match had to be Hulk Hogan vs. Sid Justice. It’s a shame that such a great show had such a dud for a main event. The feud was fine. The hype was good. The match just did not deliver. It could have easily been so much better. I felt like we missed the beginning of the match as Hogan was selling like he had been through a war very early in the bout. The finish was awful and would have been awful had Papa Shango been on time to cause the DQ. Why couldn’t Hogan just pin Sid? The surprise return of The Ultimate Warrior was a great mania moment and saved the end of the show. If that counts as part of the match it raises the quality a great deal but from bell to bell Hogan vs. Sid just didn’t deliver.

What would I change about WM8? That’s a tough one. I have a couple ideas but I’m not sure if any would actually make the show better. I think it’s a shame The British Bulldog didn’t get on the show. He was originally scheduled to wrestler The Berzerker but I believe time constraints caused that match to be scrapped. Bulldog definitely deserved to be on mania. I think I would have put him against The Mountie. Instead of the eight man tag I would have put Big Boss Man against The Berzerker and just left Duggan and Slaughter against the Nasty Boys. Since there was no time for Bulldog vs. Berzerker these changes don’t seem possible. They could be if mania was an hour longer. This was the first mania in a few years that was three hours instead of four. If they kept the four hour format more matches could have taken place. Like I said though, I don’t know if that really improves the show.

 

[LODemolition]

I never understood why LOD wasn't a part of this ppv. They had that promo with Okerlund where they brought Ellering back as their manager, but I'm not sure why they weren't on the card. They should've faced the Nasty Boys instead of the 8-man tag. I also would've put Davey Boy up against Shawn in the opener instead of Santana. I also would've put Papa Shango up against Tatanka. There were some good matches and feuds on the card, but it definitely didn't live up to it's potential. The Savage/Flair match should've ended the ppv, even with Warrior's return taking place after the Hogan/Sid match. They dropped the ball there if you ask me. My favorite match was definitely Piper vs Bret. The Flair and Savage post match promos were some of my favorite of all-time. Just outstanding work by both guys to make it feel like an extremely personal feud. Loved the Undertaker/Roberts feud as well, even though the match fell short of my expectations. And who can forget Papa Shango missing his cue to run down the aisle and break up the pin attempt after Hogan's let drop, forcing Sid to kick out? Lol

 

[Poop Master Flex]

WrestleMania VIII was a fantastic event yet it is one that many people want to change. The popular opinion is going to be the main event should have been Hulk Hogan vs. Ric Flair. After all, that match was actually announced at first. For as much as I would have enjoyed the hype surrounding that big match the timing just wasn’t right. In fact never had there been worse timing in anything. For nearly ten years Hulk Hogan vs. Ric Flair was the ultimate dream match. Finally they were in the same company at the same time and it seemed like a lock to be the blockbuster headline for mania. Then the steroid scandal hit and Hogan had to leave the WWF. Yes, Hogan still competed at WM8 but Flair was champion. Either Hogan was going to win the title and immediately leave the company or NWA icon Ric Flair was going to beat WWF icon Hulk Hogan at WrestleMania sending Hogan out of the company he helped create at the event he helped create. Keep that in mind when you say you would have booked Hogan vs. Flair.

This, so fucking this.

Hogan vs. Flair was a great idea on paper and would have been a great idea if it was a year before or even if it was at Summerslam '91, for it to happen at Wrestlemania 8 just wasn't the right time. Sometimes the right answer isn't the one right in front of you. Besides, I think Savage vs. Flair was a great match and I seriously question if Hogan could have pulled off a better feud and match with Flair than Savage did. I always had a soft spot for Savage vs. Flair and I remember as a kid wanting Savage to KILL Flair for all the stuff he was pulling, even if I wasn't old enough to fully understand it. Even in hindsight that was a great feud, hit plenty of emotional buttons and made their encounter at Wrestlemania 8 feel important.

Hogan vs. Sid although not a great match by no means was good way to end out the event. At the time Wrestlemania 8 was being promoted as Hogan's last match and a monster heel like Sid (who was different from every other monster heel Hogan dealt with) was a great way for him to go out. You got a DQ finish to the main event which doesn't look ideal but it was the best way to go and even though Sid kicking out of the leg drop wasn't planned I thought it was awesome at the time because no one had done that before, it's just a shame Sid was gone almost immediately after this because they could have done some big things with him.

My favorite match of the card? I would have to go with either Bret Hart vs. Roddy Piper or Flair vs. Savage. I'm a huge fan of both matches and I like them both equally although for different reasons. Flair and Savage had more emotion and told a great story but I truth be told Bret Hart was my guy by Wrestlemania 8 and he had a great technical match that also told a great story as well. In both cases we are talking about 4 of my favorites in these matches so you really can't go wrong with either of them.

Worst match on the card was probably the 8 man tag they had, it was just there, the comedy stuff with Ray Combs just wasn't good and the match itself was boring to watch. It filled the time sure but it just didn't work for me.

I don't think I would have changed much if anything for this PPV. If I knew Sid was gonna be gone right after Wrestlemania 8 I wouldn't have had him in the main event but at the time he was the perfect guy to go against Hogan. It was more of an unfortunate side effect that by the end of '92 so many guys on the card wouldn't be working for WWE anymore. Hogan, Sid, Flair (who left a month into '93), Roberts, Savage (was there but became a commentator early '93) and Piper are all guys that were gone (more or less) by the end of the year and 3 of those guys were gone at the end of Wrestlemania 8 (2 of them being the main event of the show). Wrestlemania 8 was a great show at a shitty time for the WWE.

 

[The Fabulous Rougeau's]

I would have had no issue with a Flair v Hogan match with Flair winning but then again I'm not Vince. It makes sense for the reasons laid out here why Hogan v Flair didn't happen, but that's not to say that it should not have happened.

So Flair beats Hogan, its 1992 and not 1986. Its not the middle of Hulkamania anymore. If Hogan was on his way out why not have it be with him setting up another top guy? Flair was established of course, but he was still new to WWF and probably a large enough number of WWF fans. I was 9 at the time and had been a WWF fan for about 4 years or so but I had no idea what the NWA or Flair was and I'm sure I wasn't the only one. Also this was the tail end of the time where WWF relied on proven, older guys so it made sense from that standpoint to have Flair beat Hogan since Hogan was on his way out.

While I can see the case for Hogan v Flair, that doesn't mean I would go that route. And that is because Flair v Macho turned out to be a great match and even better feud. As good as Bret v Piper was Flair v Macho is clearly the match of the night.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

This and 9 will likely get the most "changes" from people and the card does deserve it... however it wasn't as terrible as it's made out to be sometimes.

First off the Berserker/Bulldog match was a misnomer, a classic case of trying to build Davey as a monster when his strength was not being that. If you're going to do that 8 man tag, then Davey was a better pick to be in there over Virgil.

I think a lot of this again had to do with talent lost in the year in between rather than medicore booking. Guys who had gone in that year from 7 were really noticeable including Jannetty (who was selling the Barbershop beating), Warlord, Barbarian, Haku, Kerry Von Erich, Crush (who was repackaged immediately after this Mania), Snuka, Curt Hennig (outside the ring but missed in it) and Warrior (who did return)

In that year the WWF had brought in a lot of new talent or repackaged old ones, with gimmicks that just didn't catch. Skinner, Repo Man, The Berserker were just a few examples. Sure on paper, Steve Keirn v Owen Hart is a good match, but Skinner vs Owen Hart could never really be more than a short squash for Owen just as the aborted Davey Match could never be John Nord vs Davey - the gimmicks ruined the workers in some cases and thus made the booking seem asinine.

I for one see no reason that Crush couldn't have had a solo outing at Mania, either debuting his "Kona" gimmick earlier - he'd have been a great "mystery" opponent in the 8 man and added to the "Family Feud" idea with Repo Man.... they could always have had Smash vs Crush, which would have been a much more interesting angle than the useless Repo Man gimmick.

The opener was a good match and it was for many the first introduction to "The Heartbreak Kid" - the match did it's job - Tito was in full "Open Contract/Jobber mode" by then so the win wasn't as impressive as it would have been even a year earlier but it was perhaps Heenan's "Shawn has left the building" that actually made people sit up and take notice... one comment but it made Shawn seem not only as cocky as he seemed but more important that he could do that. Rough as Sherri was you could almost (shudders) picture them getting it on in a limo while Heenan spoke... Heenan deserves a big assist when it comes to getting Shawn over, and it was perhaps the last one he managed to do (Luger bombed as the Narcissist) effectively.

The two "other major debuts" were Tatanka and Owen Hart, I touched on Owen's but it seemed very wasted when he ended up back in tag teams. Tatanka on the other hand did it's job well, credit to Martel for putting him over strong and making him seem important. Sure his look got tweaked for the better but you did sense something special about Tatanka and that it took 18 months for him (2 years in story) to lose a match shows they were serious about him and he was worth the push Mania debut. Personally, I think Owen could have waited for his moment till Summerslam to make room for a Davey match.

The Tag titles were to me at their least relevant at this point. DiBiase was very wasted in that division and as good as Rotunda was, he wasn't getting over at all even with DiBiase in his corner. The Natural Disasters face turn was a bust for me and as someone pointed out it took LOD off the card - I think this had a lot to do with the problems they were beginning to experience with Vince... if they don't get a tag title match which team was really good enough at that time to face them? They'd done the Nasty Boys already... it showed some real lack of foresight to disband so many great teams in a year, The Rockers, Demolition, The Hart Foundation, even the future Faces Of Fear and not adequately replace them. Hey, sounds familiar... what's happening right now?

Piper's best match by far and the one that you can tell meant the most to him. When he won the IC you could see that to him it was his World title, he'd worked hard, overcome the hip replacement and survived. I remember that I really wanted him to win this match. Bret could wait, Piper deserved a big win at Mania once... it wasn't to be and to later know they are cousins kinda seals why it has the emotion, even down to the promo Piper cut, mocking in tone but genuinely showing affection for Bret and the Hart family at the same time. I actually count it as my 2nd best Mania promo of the era behind Jake v DiBiase... of course it was a pretape and the story is Roddy was a little ahem "Rowdy" on the sauce when it was done, but it made it better and truly fit his character... The only weak point was the stupid ring bell stuff, he didn't need to do that to sell the turmoil, he just had to lock the sleeper in, release it, then lock it in again... would have had the same effect without the "dumbness".

The two main event principle has never worked for me... one match should have the honour and it should have been Flair v Savage. I understand the Warrior's return was the high point they wanted to end on, but they also knew how small he was in compared to before, how dumb his hair looked etc... they KNEW it was probably gonna go down like a fart in a sauna... yet Savage's win couldn't have missed if they tried.

The debate on the matches will rage forever... I for one believe that it SHOULD have been Flair v Hogan with Ric going over... I get it's Hogan's event, but he was leaving and just once, he should have had his ego removed from the equation. The problem with changing the match is twofold... one it made a clusterfuck of a situation, Tunney makes a match, then it changes cos Sid asks for it? Really? We were supposed to buy that the dream match was blown off cos Sid Justice wanted it blown off? It also sent a big message to Flair, that not only was he not "big enough" to headline Mania, even as champion, let alone walk out as champion... but the dream match he'd been sold to get him in was not happening. He had a verbal deal with Vince that he could walk if not "The Man" and he did just that, by November he had jobbed to Bret and handed his notice. If Flair walks out of Mania beating Hogan, Hart can still beat him but how much bigger would it have been rather than a "silent" switch in Saskatchewan from a pissed off and belligerent Flair? Hogan might not have been needed to return in a years time... Sid and Warrior might not have been needed at all on the show... Papa Shango wouldn't have looked a complete numpty for so obviously missing his cue...

More than anything it was the first time you ever noticed a "botch" so clearly at Wrestlemania...and it got worse when we saw what was now the Warrior....

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

I personally felt that WrestleMania 8 was a step up from the previous year, as we had not one, but two absolutely stellar matches in Flair Vs. Savage (gee, that name comes up a lot in great WM matches, doesn't it?) and Piper Vs. Hart for the IC title. I had a preference for Piper and Hart as my favorite match, since Hart was still very new in the single's realm at that point and was fresh blood. That's not to take anything away from Flair and Savage, however. That match easily should've gone on last, particularly given the fact that the WWF knew the Hogan retirement match was going to have a DQ finish.

That match wins the worst of the card for the simple fact that its ending was stupid in the extreme for the following reasons:

1. That they would plan a DQ finish to a Main Event match like that in the first place.
2. They would choose Papa Shango as the agent of that DQ.
3. They would have a de-roided Warrior run down to the ring, to supposedly save Hogan
4. The WWF was clinging to its big man theory of main events, even though Hogan and Sid couldn't put on a good match together if they tried. And they didn't try.

The only thing I would've changed about this match would've been the finish to the Hogan/Sid match and its placement on the card. It should've been the match before the intermission break. Probably a minor change really. Hogan would've gone over Sid clean, and they could've had a post match beatdown instead by Sid and Shango and hell, why not have The Berserker and The Warlord in there too or whoever else they wanted to throw in there because ohmygod I so didn't give two craps about that match or Warrior's return.

I also get why they didn't do Hogan/Flair in that event. They certainly could've, but the way it broke down, we got Flair's Royal Rumble performance and a better wrestled main event in Flair and Savage. I think a Hogan/Flair main event would've been good as well, but it likely would've ended with Hogan beating Flair since neither McMahon or Hogan seemed willing to let Flair go over in that position.

I also agree with THTRobTaylor's comments about the condition of the tag team scene at that point. They bounced the LOD off the card in favor of The Natural Disasters? On paper, Money Inc was a great team, but I can't point to a single match that I can really remember and say "Wow, that was a great match." And the reason was a lack of quality opponents at the time. All that remained of the tag team scene was the noticeably absent Legion of Doom, The Natural Disasters (or the Twin Towers, part 2), and The Beverly Brothers (lame).

 

[The Brain]

A few comments regarding some of the responses. The Legion of Doom was not on the card because they had not been seen on television since dropping the titles to Money Inc. at a house show in early February. I heard somewhere through the gossip grapevine that Hawk was suspended for a drug violation which is why LOD dropped the titles so suddenly and were off tv until mania. I remember watching WM8 live and being happy LOD was still with the WWF. There interview was not announced and by the time we got to mania I thought they left the company. They didn’t have a match because they weren’t around to build up to any kind of match.

I don’t understand why people think Savage vs. Flair should have closed the show. Is it simply because it was the title match? I guess that’s a good reason but the surprise return of the Warrior was the highlight of the night and the better way to end the show. That is not the kind of thing that just goes on in the middle of the show, especially considering it was Hogan’s last match.

Having Flair go over Hogan since Hogan was leaving the company makes sense. In wrestling the guy going out always puts over a current star. This should have been, and was the exception. It may sound petty but having Flair beat Hogan at mania and Hogan leaving immediately after would have sent the message that Flair and the NWA were better than Hogan and the WWF all along. Do you think that’s how Vince wanted WrestleMania to go off the air? With Hogan on his back and Flair standing triumphant? Does that really sound like a good idea in 1992? I was happy to have Flair in the WWF but even at the time it felt like he was just a rental. I figured he would be back with WCW eventually and sure enough by WM9 he was out of the WWF.

 

[LODemolition]

I did some searching online and found that LOD was originally supposed to challenge Money Inc at WM8, but Hawk was under suspension at the time. Makes me wonder why they were even at the event at all to cut that promo with Ellering.

 

[roipdh123]

This was an absolutley fantastic main events and the upper card was also great- I really liked the WWF title and the IC title matches.The undercard is the reason this is not one of the greatest WM of all time - because the only difference between this and the all time greats is the Undercard.

If I could have changed something I would have placed Flair vs Savage as the main event.Also I would have had Rick Rude defeating Tatnaka.

Basically - a really good WM - which could have been a lot more better if the undercard was better {at least in my opinion}.

 

[LODemolition]

I was more disappointed with Hogan and Sid ending the ppv because of it being a DQ finish more than anything. I also never understood why Savage vs Flair was in the middle of the card when it was part of the double main event. It should've gone on no earlier than 2nd to last.

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

I was more disappointed with Hogan and Sid ending the ppv because of it being a DQ finish more than anything. I also never understood why Savage vs Flair was in the middle of the card when it was part of the double main event. It should've gone on no earlier than 2nd to last.

It wasn't uncommon to have one of the big matches right in the middle of the card, because usually it was followed right by an intermission. They did the same the year before with Savage and Warrior. Even today, they'll usually have the Undertaker match somewhere in the middle of the card to get a big pop.

 

[The Fabulous Rougeau's]

A few comments regarding some of the responses. The Legion of Doom was not on the card because they had not been seen on television since dropping the titles to Money Inc. at a house show in early February. I heard somewhere through the gossip grapevine that Hawk was suspended for a drug violation which is why LOD dropped the titles so suddenly and were off tv until mania. I remember watching WM8 live and being happy LOD was still with the WWF. There interview was not announced and by the time we got to mania I thought they left the company. They didn’t have a match because they weren’t around to build up to any kind of match.

I don’t understand why people think Savage vs. Flair should have closed the show. Is it simply because it was the title match? I guess that’s a good reason but the surprise return of the Warrior was the highlight of the night and the better way to end the show. That is not the kind of thing that just goes on in the middle of the show, especially considering it was Hogan’s last match.

Having Flair go over Hogan since Hogan was leaving the company makes sense. In wrestling the guy going out always puts over a current star. This should have been, and was the exception. It may sound petty but having Flair beat Hogan at mania and Hogan leaving immediately after would have sent the message that Flair and the NWA were better than Hogan and the WWF all along. Do you think that’s how Vince wanted WrestleMania to go off the air? With Hogan on his back and Flair standing triumphant? Does that really sound like a good idea in 1992? I was happy to have Flair in the WWF but even at the time it felt like he was just a rental. I figured he would be back with WCW eventually and sure enough by WM9 he was out of the WWF.

I buy some of that but not the whole thing. I'm sure Vince would have preferred to have Hogan win if that were the match, but I don't buy the notion that Flair winning means NWA is somehow better than WWF just how when Flair won the Rumble it didn't mean that either. Had the show been something like Mania 3 or 4 than I could see it being a bad idea as that was in the midst of Hulkamania, but by 92 Hulkamania wasn't the same and Hulk was about to enter part time status for the company. To me that is not the same Hulk and Hulkamania which makes him open to losing against heels.

 

[Hard Hit Prince]

I agree with pretty much everyone in here about the best matches and how Sid vs. Hogan didn't deliver. But I see few people talking about that Roberts vs. The Undertaker bout. I remember watching the build up to this feud not to long ago as I was writing a review and it's really an intriguing story and very unique that showed a lot of personality on Jake's side. I mean I can only imagine the impact this story had towards the younger members of the audience and even those who understood the business.

It was quite obvious that The Undertaker was going to win this match since Jake was reaching the end of his career and as far as booking goes, this is one of those matches that legitimately helped Callaway's character to be seen as a good babyface. That DDT to Paul Bearer and the constant harassment of The Undertaker was pure villain genius. Even though the babyface turn came out of nowhere with no particular reason whatsoever - just a change of heart because an urn said so. The match could have been longer than six minutes no doubt about that but to me it delivered. The out of nowhere DDT's and the no-selling aspect is still one of the best images I have of the young Undertaker and probably my favorite memory of his first set of eight matches at least.

Also I always thought that Sid could have been much more if he had defeated Hulk Hogan. He had the looks and the "it" factor to carry the ball. In retrospective I'm glad he didn't, but it would certainly be cool to see Hogan defeated only to have Warrior come in and save him - but in realistic terms, there's no way Hogan would agree with that which is a damn shame.

 

[Elchicano15]

Wow! A lot of you guys hit the nail on the head. While this was another awesome Mania I would have been with the rest of the crowd on wanting to see Hogan vs Flair as well if I wanted to change anything and at least have Bulldog vs Berzerker on that card as well. Alas with time constraints I guess it wasn't meant to be.

Of course match of the night, or I should say matches defiantly are Bret Hart vs Roddy Piper for the IC belt and Macho Man Randy Savage vs Ric Flair. They both had a wrestlemania moment at the end but I think I'm warming up more so to the Bret Hart/Piper match. I kinda like how Piper added his days of training in the hart dungeon to put in his promos. Frankly I think the Savage/Flair match should have been moved up further on the card. Like after the Tatanka/Martel match or the Tag Team Title Match between Money Inc and the Natural Disasters. Some where between that and before the Owen Hart/Skinner match so people could have a breather.

While the Hogan/Sid match had some botches in the script it did deserve to go on last because of the Warrior's return. That was another mania moment and it was nice to see them celebrate and close the show.

As to what else I might have changed, I would have changed the Michaels/Tito match. Now correct me if I'm wrong but that match should have been Michaels/Janetty with the same outcome of Michaels going over. Now was it because Janetty had left the company or was he injured? I can't remember but it seemed like El Matador just got thrown in there randomly. Still a good opener. I would have also had the Disasters go over Money INC clean and winning the tag titles instead of Money Inc *****ng out. Earthquake and Typhoon were going to be champs later on that year anyway it might as well should have been on the grand stage.

 

[FlairFan2003]

Interesting...

First, one poster states that Brett Hart was IC Champ at this event, he was not, Piper was the defending champ, and Piper did have a fairly big WM moment at WM 3 when he had his retirement match as a fan favorite vs Adrian Adonis. As it was, I don't think much could have been done to improve this match, great storyline, playing on both wrestlers past as hated rulebreakers and the perception one of them could turn at any time to screw the other, but you didn't know who ? Good, back and forth match that allowed Piper to leave with dignity despite the loss (thanks to the growing federal steroid investigation) and elevate Hart significantly after the lackluster way his initial IC Title run ended.

Marty Jannety was out of the company at this point so he couldn't wrestle HBK, still liked HBK's WrestleMania debut as a singles star in his new, heel character, they had a close match that emphasized Michael's ring ability but he still cheated to win...the best kind of heel, good enough to beat you clean but willing (and smart enough) to beat you dirty.

I also liked Taker's match in as far as Taker needed a big win, his title win and quick loss vs Hogan did nothing for him as he was just a side show to the Hogan-Flair fued at the time, Jake Roberts was leaving the company so it fit he would "do the job", if I could change anything it would have been to make the match longer and more competitive

I understand why they didn't go with Hogan-Flair - If Hogan was on his way out it didn't make sense for him to win the championship, especially against Flair, the biggest name other than Andre he had ever faced up to this point in his career (actually in his whole career, period). A Flair victory would have been Vince basically putting over the NWA product as superior to his own which he wasn't going to do, Flair beating anyone in WWE other than Hogan didn't matter, Flair was the face of the NWA as much Hogan was the face of WWE, Flair beating Savage, Hart, Piper, Bulldog, all wins he had going into Mania, though impressive, validating his claims to greatness, were not the same as beating Hogan. If Hogan was staying, this is a No Brainer, with him leaving, then a throw away match and feel good moment were better suited. Part of the problem is that with the steroid investigation, no one knew when or if Hogan would be back. There fore, no one could say when or if Hogan could get the win back from Flair. Hogan putting over Flair in that situation would have been huge, basically validating half of the wrestling fans all over the country that already felt that way. By comparison, putting over YokoZuna a year later, even in a clear screw job fashion, did nothing to harm his image or validate Yoko, a relative new comer and unknown at that point, as superior to him, although it did even with the controversial nature of the win, give Yoko a nice rub. Notice Hogan didn't want to cleanly put over Hart a year later, when Hart was the heir apparent to Hogan's status as top draw and clear No. 1 Fan Fav in the company. People will always question Vince McMahon here but Hogan had considerable sway over his booking, even pre WCW. With Hogan leaving there was no way he would give Flair that win and Vince apparently didn't want to do a title tournament/retirement angle post WM.

In terms of opponent Sid was a good choice for Hogan, he was over with fans enough to make it interesting but not enough that anyone thought he would beat Hogan, also without a title on the line the match meant less and hurt Sid's character less in the loss (though he was gone from WWE shortly after anyway). The problem was Sid was never much of a wrestler so this was a horrible, anti climatic match, the debut of the Papa Shango Character seemed so out of the norm here also, although Warrior's return to save the day was a nice show closing surprise, and immediately established a new No. 1 baby face in town with Hogan's departure.

As far as people who think the World Title Match should have gone last, I can see both sides. Most major cards, particularly Mania's stretch out and arrange matches not from least to most important but in a way that controls crowd response. Notice that they didn't have Taker-HHH go on right before Rock-Cena a few years ago because the emotion and crowd response from Taker-HHH would have been hard to top right away so they placed another match in between. A few years earlier they ran the Divas Specialty Match, basically filler, right after Flair-HBK, because they knew the match conclusion, no matter how special, would be a downer for much of the audience and would make it hard for matches like Taker-Edge or Cena-HHH-Orton to compete with right away, the crowd would have been numb for the first half of the match. They screwed up at WM 18 having HHH-Jericho come right after the highly emotional Rock-Hogan bout, the crowd had a hard time after the investment in that match getting into what was really a very entertaining World Title Match. In that regard they needed to keep the emotional roller coaster of Flair-Savage away from Hogan-Sid, unless you were content to ask Hogan in his last WM (supposedly) to not have the final match. Giving in to Hogan as your finale meant that both the World & IC Title Matches had to be separated from the final match, otherwise they would have overshadowed it too much.

You could however make a strong case that since Hogan was leaving he didn't need the finale, and since Savage was staying and talking over as Champ he should have gotten the finale. Certainly Flair-Savage had a terrific ending, great climax, and the kind of "Feel Good" moment that Vince likes in his big WM matches (where heels almost never win the finale), and while Warrior's return was an uplifting and dramatic way to end Hogan-Sid, the Savage match was a longer running and more well presented feud on TV and a way better match. This is one of the best examples at Mania of the matches not being arranged in terms of importance.

My changes .... Im cool with the Natural Disasters-Money Inc, especially in light of the LOD being MIA at the time...Keep HBK's WM debut as a heel, I would have given more time and more competitive match to Taker-Roberts but keep the ending, I would eliminated Owen Hart's match altogether and given Tatanka-Rick Martel much better showing since Martel was a good name and good heel character, the company was high on Tatanka at the time and wanted him to have a major push, and both could actually wrestle a good match.

In the big matches, I would have kept Hart-Piper the same.

I would have Sid's heel turn encompass Savage somehow and have Savage face Sid with an almost David vs Goliath factor to it given Sid's imposing size. Savage goes over clean with the elbow, post match beatdown, and have Warrior return here to save his former arch rival, immediately establishing his presence and validating Savage's face turn

In the Main event I would have let Hogan face Flair and win, even if he had to "retire" shortly after. Here, I would have let Hogan and Flair face off one on one with Hogan as champ at The Royal Rumble (No Title is held up Nonsense after Hogan-Taker II, I would have let Hogan take the belt back from Taker and tell Flair "you're next"). At the Rumble, Flair wins, he wouldn't make Hogan tap out to the figure four but he would win clean, maybe with a roll up or small package, not in a dominating way but in way that validates his win as earned, not the ridiculous screw job like Yokozuna got. Following the Rumble, I would have had Hogan disappear for at least a month while Flair & Heenan celebrate the "End Of Hulka-Mainia" on every TV show, house show, etc. I would also have escalated Flair & Company's ruthlessness each week Hogan was gone, with increasing violent post match beatdowns on vanquished opponents, etc, giving Flair, Heenan, and Henning a green light promo wise to anger the audience as much as possible. After 4-6 weeks, likely at Sat Nite Main Event, after another Flair win and unnecessary post match beatdown, I would have Hogan return and make the save, and given Hogan the chance in a promo to explain why he left (he felt he let the Hulka-Maniacs down with his loss and didn't believe he could beat Flair) and also why he returned (Hulka_maniacs aren't quitters, they face challenges, and with the vitamins, prayers, et all he would train like never before and vanquish Flair once and for all). Have Flair set the stage afterwards that if he can beat Hogan again, this time at WM, the event Hogan made famous, he would not only have clearly established himself as the best ever, but Hogan would have to leave WWE for good. Hogan would accept, but we'd have promos with Hogan leading up to the event talking about spending more time with his family, mounting injuries, etc, just enough to lay some doubt as to whether Hogan would win because "maybe it is time to go". In the match I'd let them do everything they could do together, ultimately giving Hogan the clean decisive victory. The following week Hogan could announce he was retiring to spend more time with his family and a tournament could be held to fill the vacant title, at which time I would let Flair win the tournament, only to use the "She Was Mine Before She Was Yours..." feud with Savage as the set up to SummerSlam, where Savage would win the title.

 

[FlairFan2003]

I was more disappointed with Hogan and Sid ending the ppv because of it being a DQ finish more than anything. I also never understood why Savage vs Flair was in the middle of the card when it was part of the double main event. It should've gone on no earlier than 2nd to last.

PPV's are arranged the same way bands arrange concerts, they don't run matches from least to most importance in order, they consider match quality, the need to get the audience hooked early in the event (rather than having them bored through undercard matches waiting for bigger bouts), and the matches endings...Even a really good match with good build up will fail to hold the crowd and seem underwhelming if the match before it had a particularly emotional, dramatic ending (See HHH-Jericho following Rock-Hogan at WM 18 - This was also why at WM 24 they put the Divas Filler Match on after HBK-Flair, because they knew the crowd would be so spent emotionally they would need a break before they could get into another big match like the Triple Threat Match for instance or Taker-Edge, which itself had a very slow pacing to it fans would have tuned out the first half had it come right after Flair-HBK)

When you see a concert, typically the act starts with a couple of well known hit songs, then mixes in lesser known tunes, new music, album cuts, and occasionally a few more major hits, this gets the crowd's attention immediately and enables them to hold their attention through lesser known and newer material, throwing in a few big hits every so often to make sure they are enthusiastic. Then you get a few big hits in succession for the finale, although typically they leave out their biggest or most noteworthy hit for the encore (where they will play a couple of newer or lesser known songs first because they got your attention with the hit filled ending and you know that last really big hit will be up soon in the encore).

The pacing and match placement for PPV,, especially big ones like WrestleMania, goes the same way.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Interesting...

First, one poster states that Brett Hart was IC Champ at this event, he was not, Piper was the defending champ, and Piper did have a fairly big WM moment at WM 3 when he had his retirement match as a fan favorite vs Adrian Adonis. As it was, I don't think much could have been done to improve this match, great storyline, playing on both wrestlers past as hated rulebreakers and the perception one of them could turn at any time to screw the other, but you didn't know who ? Good, back and forth match that allowed Piper to leave with dignity despite the loss (thanks to the growing federal steroid investigation) and elevate Hart significantly after the lackluster way his initial IC Title run ended.

Marty Jannety was out of the company at this point so he couldn't wrestle HBK, still liked HBK's WrestleMania debut as a singles star in his new, heel character, they had a close match that emphasized Michael's ring ability but he still cheated to win...the best kind of heel, good enough to beat you clean but willing (and smart enough) to beat you dirty.

I also liked Taker's match in as far as Taker needed a big win, his title win and quick loss vs Hogan did nothing for him as he was just a side show to the Hogan-Flair fued at the time, Jake Roberts was leaving the company so it fit he would "do the job", if I could change anything it would have been to make the match longer and more competitive

I understand why they didn't go with Hogan-Flair - If Hogan was on his way out it didn't make sense for him to win the championship, especially against Flair, the biggest name other than Andre he had ever faced up to this point in his career (actually in his whole career, period). A Flair victory would have been Vince basically putting over the NWA product as superior to his own which he wasn't going to do, Flair beating anyone in WWE other than Hogan didn't matter, Flair was the face of the NWA as much Hogan was the face of WWE, Flair beating Savage, Hart, Piper, Bulldog, all wins he had going into Mania, though impressive, validating his claims to greatness, were not the same as beating Hogan. If Hogan was staying, this is a No Brainer, with him leaving, then a throw away match and feel good moment were better suited. Part of the problem is that with the steroid investigation, no one knew when or if Hogan would be back. There fore, no one could say when or if Hogan could get the win back from Flair. Hogan putting over Flair in that situation would have been huge, basically validating half of the wrestling fans all over the country that already felt that way. By comparison, putting over YokoZuna a year later, even in a clear screw job fashion, did nothing to harm his image or validate Yoko, a relative new comer and unknown at that point, as superior to him, although it did even with the controversial nature of the win, give Yoko a nice rub. Notice Hogan didn't want to cleanly put over Hart a year later, when Hart was the heir apparent to Hogan's status as top draw and clear No. 1 Fan Fav in the company. People will always question Vince McMahon here but Hogan had considerable sway over his booking, even pre WCW. With Hogan leaving there was no way he would give Flair that win and Vince apparently didn't want to do a title tournament/retirement angle post WM.

In terms of opponent Sid was a good choice for Hogan, he was over with fans enough to make it interesting but not enough that anyone thought he would beat Hogan, also without a title on the line the match meant less and hurt Sid's character less in the loss (though he was gone from WWE shortly after anyway). The problem was Sid was never much of a wrestler so this was a horrible, anti climatic match, the debut of the Papa Shango Character seemed so out of the norm here also, although Warrior's return to save the day was a nice show closing surprise, and immediately established a new No. 1 baby face in town with Hogan's departure.

As far as people who think the World Title Match should have gone last, I can see both sides. Most major cards, particularly Mania's stretch out and arrange matches not from least to most important but in a way that controls crowd response. Notice that they didn't have Taker-HHH go on right before Rock-Cena a few years ago because the emotion and crowd response from Taker-HHH would have been hard to top right away so they placed another match in between. A few years earlier they ran the Divas Specialty Match, basically filler, right after Flair-HBK, because they knew the match conclusion, no matter how special, would be a downer for much of the audience and would make it hard for matches like Taker-Edge or Cena-HHH-Orton to compete with right away, the crowd would have been numb for the first half of the match. They screwed up at WM 18 having HHH-Jericho come right after the highly emotional Rock-Hogan bout, the crowd had a hard time after the investment in that match getting into what was really a very entertaining World Title Match. In that regard they needed to keep the emotional roller coaster of Flair-Savage away from Hogan-Sid, unless you were content to ask Hogan in his last WM (supposedly) to not have the final match. Giving in to Hogan as your finale meant that both the World & IC Title Matches had to be separated from the final match, otherwise they would have overshadowed it too much.

You could however make a strong case that since Hogan was leaving he didn't need the finale, and since Savage was staying and talking over as Champ he should have gotten the finale. Certainly Flair-Savage had a terrific ending, great climax, and the kind of "Feel Good" moment that Vince likes in his big WM matches (where heels almost never win the finale), and while Warrior's return was an uplifting and dramatic way to end Hogan-Sid, the Savage match was a longer running and more well presented feud on TV and a way better match. This is one of the best examples at Mania of the matches not being arranged in terms of importance.

My changes .... Im cool with the Natural Disasters-Money Inc, especially in light of the LOD being MIA at the time...Keep HBK's WM debut as a heel, I would have given more time and more competitive match to Taker-Roberts but keep the ending, I would eliminated Owen Hart's match altogether and given Tatanka-Rick Martel much better showing since Martel was a good name and good heel character, the company was high on Tatanka at the time and wanted him to have a major push, and both could actually wrestle a good match.

In the big matches, I would have kept Hart-Piper the same.

I would have Sid's heel turn encompass Savage somehow and have Savage face Sid with an almost David vs Goliath factor to it given Sid's imposing size. Savage goes over clean with the elbow, post match beatdown, and have Warrior return here to save his former arch rival, immediately establishing his presence and validating Savage's face turn

In the Main event I would have let Hogan face Flair and win, even if he had to "retire" shortly after. Here, I would have let Hogan and Flair face off one on one with Hogan as champ at The Royal Rumble (No Title is held up Nonsense after Hogan-Taker II, I would have let Hogan take the belt back from Taker and tell Flair "you're next"). At the Rumble, Flair wins, he wouldn't make Hogan tap out to the figure four but he would win clean, maybe with a roll up or small package, not in a dominating way but in way that validates his win as earned, not the ridiculous screw job like Yokozuna got. Following the Rumble, I would have had Hogan disappear for at least a month while Flair & Heenan celebrate the "End Of Hulka-Mainia" on every TV show, house show, etc. I would also have escalated Flair & Company's ruthlessness each week Hogan was gone, with increasing violent post match beatdowns on vanquished opponents, etc, giving Flair, Heenan, and Henning a green light promo wise to anger the audience as much as possible. After 4-6 weeks, likely at Sat Nite Main Event, after another Flair win and unnecessary post match beatdown, I would have Hogan return and make the save, and given Hogan the chance in a promo to explain why he left (he felt he let the Hulka-Maniacs down with his loss and didn't believe he could beat Flair) and also why he returned (Hulka_maniacs aren't quitters, they face challenges, and with the vitamins, prayers, et all he would train like never before and vanquish Flair once and for all). Have Flair set the stage afterwards that if he can beat Hogan again, this time at WM, the event Hogan made famous, he would not only have clearly established himself as the best ever, but Hogan would have to leave WWE for good. Hogan would accept, but we'd have promos with Hogan leading up to the event talking about spending more time with his family, mounting injuries, etc, just enough to lay some doubt as to whether Hogan would win because "maybe it is time to go". In the match I'd let them do everything they could do together, ultimately giving Hogan the clean decisive victory. The following week Hogan could announce he was retiring to spend more time with his family and a tournament could be held to fill the vacant title, at which time I would let Flair win the tournament, only to use the "She Was Mine Before She Was Yours..." feud with Savage as the set up to SummerSlam, where Savage would win the title.

I disagree on Jannetty, the main reason he was gone was to sell the Barber Shop beating so early 93 popped as it did, which worked like a charm until Shawn was a scumbag... their feud on the road had rave reviews and Marty didn't do much wrong in that match bar pop out a shoulder... but he carried on... if he was considered anything else, he isn't in that spot to begin with. Add to that that Vince gave him the only real "Billy Martin" in WWE history,a guy fired for a "crime", rehired at the same level as before, with no heat or punishment and that proves he was ok, Vince DOESN'T do that, he punishes, jobs people... but on that one occasion he restored the guy to his original position. The closest in recent times is Bryan being "let go" for several months post Nexus cos of a "choke with a tie"... some say all part of the plan, all designed to make him bigger down the line or they realised he got screwed and made it right... but in Marty's case, he was up against a cold blooded guy who was fighting for his spot at every turn, fucked every opponent he had over at the time and who Vince had a soft spot for... Shawn in 92-95 was a See U Next Tuesday, no question and seemingly Vince's...

The Hogan, tourney idea would never have worked... they tried it at Mania 4 having Hogan involved and it didn't work... this was the point Vince should have said to Hulk "No, you want to leave, fine but Flair is your replacement if you do... you do the favor as Andre, Backlund and Sheik did for you...and if not, you know where the next few months is going for us all...cos fof the roid trial..."

The biggest criticism of Hogan I can have is he could never once, until it was forced from him in later years remove his ego from the equation... Had he worked with Rude at 7 - better outcome, had he lost to Flair at 8, better outcome, had he lost to Bret at Summerslam 93, better outcome... he just decided he was gonna do it once for real and he did it for Warrior... that it didn't work was Vince's problem not his.. Mania 8 didn't work as it should cos Hogan was indulged one last time... well we thought so, he got away with it at 9... but even then it was cos he'd said he'd job to Bret... Vince never trusted Hogan again after and rightfully so... The saddest thing is Rick Rude left for this shit... Rude at WM8 instead of Hogan is a much better show.

 

[Pedigree1]

People do forget that the steroid scandal brought shock waves and it almost ended WWF. The timing was not indeed right for the Hogan vs Flair match,Hogan wasn't champion and if he was,he was gonna lost it anyway. Bulldog was always underutilized IMO,and its a shame. He definitely deserved to be on that WM card against the bezerker. My least favorite match was the Hogan vs Justice match.

It just had zero flow to it,and never really got off the ground. The ending was shit,really a DQ that is no way to end a WM main event.. I wanted a decisive finish. Sid justice was forced to kick out of the leg drop due to Papa Shango,being very late to hit the ring. The Piper Vs Hart Match though,a thing of beauty and the best of Pipers career IMO. Its a classic and I love the way after,Piper embraced hart and handed him the belt. Awesome stuff.

The Savage vs Flair match was another great one. A classic all the way around,and everything a title match should always be. It was a great WM card upper card had some quality matches,Undertaker performed and destroyed the Snake Man! I would have liked to see the Natural Diseasters go over Money Inc,as Money Inc in that match was pretty much getting tossed around like rag dolls. I would have liked to have seen LOD on the card

 

[thebarber]

Jannetty was supposed to meet Michaels at Wrestlemania 8, he got fired for on of the many times for his partying/no shape to perform antics he was known for.
LOD dropped the titles to Money Inc in a match that, from the Animal autobiography, didnt even take place. Once Hawk got suspended, Vince ordered them to return the belts, they put them on Money Inc and they just announced on WWE Superstars of Wrestling that the titles changed hands on a house show, but the match itself didnt actually happen.

Bret vs Piper was a solid IC Title match, not sure if it was a classic, but it was up there with the WWE Title match as the best match on the card.
Hogan vs Sid was a shit fight, and if Warrior wasnt booked to run in at the end, Im sure Flair vs Savage would have been a better fit for mian event honours(last match).
Regardless of the politics, WWE should have booked Hulk Hogan vs Ric Flair whilst they were both their in in possibly their prime. I know Hogan was leaving, maybe if they had the dq ending, Flair could have kept the belt and Hulk could have got his win still. Or, and smarter, Flair got the win and Hoganb left, only to return at mania 9 for the rematch. Flair only left WWE in early 1993 due to him not liking his spot in the company after dropping the belt to Hart. Vince had an agreement with Flair, which is also spoken of in Flair's book, that he could leave any time he was not happy with his spot in the company. Flair holding the title for all of 1992 would have kept him happy Im sure, Hulk could have returned and won the 1993 rumble, and gone on to headline Flair vs Hogan II and Hulk could have got his win back, then gone on to elevate Bret Hart............wishful thinking maybe.

 

[shooter_mcgavin]

If you were to rate WMVIII the first half would have been a grade "A" event. Piper and Bret Hart was intriguing and probably the most underrated of all WM matches since it's barley mentioned these days and Savage and Ric Flair was an absolute classic a match that was not just great in terms of basic wrestling but how it told it's story and drama. Then you had Savage winning the title. Then you had Michaels, Tito, Roberts, and Taker in the first two bouts. Then you had Ric Flair and Hening delivering epic promos. Heck even the 8-Man tag team match served a purpose.

Then you had the 2nd half. Everything was very forgettable except the Warrior run in from match that ended in DQ and a confused as heck finish. Sid vs. Hogan just felt wrong to close the show, it felt like a throwaway match for Hogan and Sid was terrible here. I know most people didn't like Slaughter vs Hogan at WMVII but at least Slaughter looked like a man on a mission when he fought Hogan. He also had a story he projected when trying to inflict pain against Hogan.

 

[Ubermensch]

This was a great PPV. Easily one of the best WrestleManias. You can see where the WWE tried to pull out all of the stops between the double main event, Reba, and The Warrior's return.

I have always loved watching the Flair and Savage feuds in the WWF and WCW. It always involved Flair getting to Elizabeth and Savage flipping out. The combination of Flair's cocky underhanded rich gimmick and Savage's uncontrollable nature was always great. Those two worked extremely well together and don't get the credit that was due.

HBK had a great match against Tito.
Hart and Piper went well.


Bobby Heenan spit hot fire on the mic like always.

Sid Vicious has always been one of those guys that never seem to hit the mark to me. It had a run in the Horsemen and in WCW early on that just didn't seem to click. I think he went to the WWF and the Hogan feud didn't really bring anything to the table. Sid wasn't really a guy that Hogan could have the chemistry he needed. He was big, but not the unstoppable big guy that was impressive for Hogan to slam. His gimmick also didn't leave much for Hogan to overcome. I think after he went back to WCW and didn't do much, then back to the WWF and held the title, but he never caught on. He was on those guys who had just enough size and talent to fill up an empty spot on the main event scene, and the fans never felt too strongly one way or the other, even in his final WCW run.

Flair and Hogan should have happened at Wrestlemania 8. It went over decently in WCW, and the two genuinely work well together. Before the NWO, Flair worked well against Hogan's face gimmick, and two should have done more after Hogan went Hollywood.

 

[Wrestlingaholic]

Why Papa Shango? That's perhaps the most pertinent question. As far as I'm aware, there was no friendship or business relationship between Shango and Sid/Wippleman. They could and should have used that spot for another wrestler, though I'm not sure who - perhaps a returning Crush? His face run was poor, he could have started as a heel managed by Wippleman, being a similar stature to Sid.

I understand the dq finish, though not a way to close the biggest ppv of the year. Sid was being heavily positioned and in line for a major push, which likely would have occurred had he not been suspended for drugs (the same reason LOD were stripped of the tag titles) and subsequently (and petulantly) quitting rather than serve his suspension, in the aftermath of WM8.

Also, the story of Papa Shango missing his cue doesn't sit well with me. Are we supposed to believe that, at the biggest match on the biggest ppv of the year, Shango was left to his own devices, and not a single agent was responsible? Surely Shango should have been in position the entire match, and told exactly when to go out. A huge error that someone likely pinned on Shango as a rookie rather than taking the heat themselves.

 

[Hitman80]

This was a decent PPV.
Best match has to be Bret vs Piper, two legends of the business put a great little match with a good storyline resulting in a Bret being the first to pin Piper in 17 and a half years.
It's a shame Shawn Michaels vs Marty Jannetty didn't feature here as it would have been the ideal time after the dramatic split just a few months earlier but nevermind.

 

[spaldoni]

This and 9 will likely get the most "changes" from people and the card does deserve it... however it wasn't as terrible as it's made out to be sometimes.

First off the Berserker/Bulldog match was a misnomer, a classic case of trying to build Davey as a monster when his strength was not being that. If you're going to do that 8 man tag, then Davey was a better pick to be in there over Virgil.

I think a lot of this again had to do with talent lost in the year in between rather than medicore booking. Guys who had gone in that year from 7 were really noticeable including Jannetty (who was selling the Barbershop beating), Warlord, Barbarian, Haku, Kerry Von Erich, Crush (who was repackaged immediately after this Mania), Snuka, Curt Hennig (outside the ring but missed in it) and Warrior (who did return)

In that year the WWF had brought in a lot of new talent or repackaged old ones, with gimmicks that just didn't catch. Skinner, Repo Man, The Berserker were just a few examples. Sure on paper, Steve Keirn v Owen Hart is a good match, but Skinner vs Owen Hart could never really be more than a short squash for Owen just as the aborted Davey Match could never be John Nord vs Davey - the gimmicks ruined the workers in some cases and thus made the booking seem asinine.

I for one see no reason that Crush couldn't have had a solo outing at Mania, either debuting his "Kona" gimmick earlier - he'd have been a great "mystery" opponent in the 8 man and added to the "Family Feud" idea with Repo Man.... they could always have had Smash vs Crush, which would have been a much more interesting angle than the useless Repo Man gimmick.

The opener was a good match and it was for many the first introduction to "The Heartbreak Kid" - the match did it's job - Tito was in full "Open Contract/Jobber mode" by then so the win wasn't as impressive as it would have been even a year earlier but it was perhaps Heenan's "Shawn has left the building" that actually made people sit up and take notice... one comment but it made Shawn seem not only as cocky as he seemed but more important that he could do that. Rough as Sherri was you could almost (shudders) picture them getting it on in a limo while Heenan spoke... Heenan deserves a big assist when it comes to getting Shawn over, and it was perhaps the last one he managed to do (Luger bombed as the Narcissist) effectively.

The two "other major debuts" were Tatanka and Owen Hart, I touched on Owen's but it seemed very wasted when he ended up back in tag teams. Tatanka on the other hand did it's job well, credit to Martel for putting him over strong and making him seem important. Sure his look got tweaked for the better but you did sense something special about Tatanka and that it took 18 months for him (2 years in story) to lose a match shows they were serious about him and he was worth the push Mania debut. Personally, I think Owen could have waited for his moment till Summerslam to make room for a Davey match.

The Tag titles were to me at their least relevant at this point. DiBiase was very wasted in that division and as good as Rotunda was, he wasn't getting over at all even with DiBiase in his corner. The Natural Disasters face turn was a bust for me and as someone pointed out it took LOD off the card - I think this had a lot to do with the problems they were beginning to experience with Vince... if they don't get a tag title match which team was really good enough at that time to face them? They'd done the Nasty Boys already... it showed some real lack of foresight to disband so many great teams in a year, The Rockers, Demolition, The Hart Foundation, even the future Faces Of Fear and not adequately replace them. Hey, sounds familiar... what's happening right now?

Piper's best match by far and the one that you can tell meant the most to him. When he won the IC you could see that to him it was his World title, he'd worked hard, overcome the hip replacement and survived. I remember that I really wanted him to win this match. Bret could wait, Piper deserved a big win at Mania once... it wasn't to be and to later know they are cousins kinda seals why it has the emotion, even down to the promo Piper cut, mocking in tone but genuinely showing affection for Bret and the Hart family at the same time. I actually count it as my 2nd best Mania promo of the era behind Jake v DiBiase... of course it was a pretape and the story is Roddy was a little ahem "Rowdy" on the sauce when it was done, but it made it better and truly fit his character... The only weak point was the stupid ring bell stuff, he didn't need to do that to sell the turmoil, he just had to lock the sleeper in, release it, then lock it in again... would have had the same effect without the "dumbness".

The two main event principle has never worked for me... one match should have the honour and it should have been Flair v Savage. I understand the Warrior's return was the high point they wanted to end on, but they also knew how small he was in compared to before, how dumb his hair looked etc... they KNEW it was probably gonna go down like a fart in a sauna... yet Savage's win couldn't have missed if they tried.

The debate on the matches will rage forever... I for one believe that it SHOULD have been Flair v Hogan with Ric going over... I get it's Hogan's event, but he was leaving and just once, he should have had his ego removed from the equation. The problem with changing the match is twofold... one it made a clusterfuck of a situation, Tunney makes a match, then it changes cos Sid asks for it? Really? We were supposed to buy that the dream match was blown off cos Sid Justice wanted it blown off? It also sent a big message to Flair, that not only was he not "big enough" to headline Mania, even as champion, let alone walk out as champion... but the dream match he'd been sold to get him in was not happening. He had a verbal deal with Vince that he could walk if not "The Man" and he did just that, by November he had jobbed to Bret and handed his notice. If Flair walks out of Mania beating Hogan, Hart can still beat him but how much bigger would it have been rather than a "silent" switch in Saskatchewan from a pissed off and belligerent Flair? Hogan might not have been needed to return in a years time... Sid and Warrior might not have been needed at all on the show... Papa Shango wouldn't have looked a complete numpty for so obviously missing his cue...

More than anything it was the first time you ever noticed a "botch" so clearly at Wrestlemania...and it got worse when we saw what was now the Warrior....

You made a great point about gimmicks. Gimmicks did limit a lot of great wrestlers, especially at this point in time. How great could this card have been if Owen Hart battled the 80s version of Steve Keirn or Bulldog clashing with the crazy AWA John Nord or even turning the Bushwhackers heel and their Sheepherder characters going against LOD in a wild brawl. You are so right that those little things can make a huge difference. In the main event I have to go with 'Real World Champ' Ric Flair vs WWF Champ Hulk Hogan in the dream match. I was a huge wrestling fan in the 80s and this is the match that had to headline WrestleMania 8. Speaking of gimmicks, I always felt the WWF never really let Flair be Flair. I wanted to see him in his suits more and show off more of his lavish and arrogant lifestyle that he did in the NWA. Once again you brought up an awesome point about gimmicks and how it did change things.