Wrestlemania 29: John Cena vs. Sin Cara

[TWJC: The Beginning]

^^^^^
I agree with pretty much everything you said. Cena vs Mistico in Arena Mexico is a HUUUGE draw. However, cena is bigger in mexico than Mistico is in the US.

Right now I'd put Cara at about Morrison's level as far as overness and ability. You might say bullshit and say that cara was huge in Mexico so he's automatically better than Morrison. However, was Michael Jordon the best baseball player ever? No. Same thing, different arenas guys.

Cara definately has the charisma and athleticism to be huge. MAYBE even go against Cena. However, the appeal of a babyface vs babyface only works if you're building it as the biggest star in mexico vs biggest star in us, even in that case it doesn't draw in the US because the US doesn't give a shit.

I think my Konnan example still holds true. sure a lot of mexicans are here, but are they buying tickets? Are they ordering PPVs? The ones I work with don't even have TVs. They know mistico, but they don't have TVs.

Cara is a great addition to the roster and once he figures out that we aren't wowed by spots, but spots as part of your hope spots and comeback and only after incredible selling and only when set up to look spontaneous do we care.


cara vs mysterio is more of a draw. People can relate to that better since they're both Mexican. People will believe that it's kinda cena/rock only with luchadores. That's fun to them. They'd have to build up Cara, which once he learns to work the US audience will be easier.

People will relate flying masked guy with charisma vs mysterio. They won't relate flying masked guy we're told was huge in mexico vs Cena because they don't invest that much into it.

 

[avi01]

Way way too early to even think this is possible. As of right now, I see Sin Cara as another of those exciting guys to watch that will end up stay in mid card for most of their careers. Unless of course he shock me by cutting some kind of awesome promo. I hope I am wrong cause he is spectacular. As for charisma, can`t see any but again it has been a week. Even he looks really doesn`t do it for me. So he`ll have to show he can cut a promo, emotionally capture the audience into a story else he`ll be just another Essa Ríos. i hope I am wrong and he succeeds tho.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Doesnt really matter if Cara can cut a good promo, if you are doing it in Mexico, Cara's promos can be in spanish just as well.

This idea could probably sell over 100,000 seats if Wrestling truly is as popular in Meixco still these days as people seem to talk shit about. IF that is the case, fucking MONEY to be made, for fucking sure.

Wont happen though. Absurdly dangerous, little kids will get stabbed, and I mean that in as serious as a way possible. No need for people to be throwing ziplock bags full of piss at the ring (do you think im joking?)

 

[CelticCorey]

I still don't get it. I just don't get it. How anyone could suggest at Sin Cara just being a midcarder after all the hype put on him.

He can't cut a promo- so what? People say promos sell. I for one, find wrestling skills to be more important to me than mic skills. If I were to order a PPV, I want a damn good main event. I love The Miz and all but him vs. John Cena and I'm supposed to pay for that? Hell no. Why? Because The Miz, though I love him, isn't the greatest wrestler and Cena, though not as bad as some exaggerate, is FAR from my favorite in ring competitor.

But I will admit Cena can put on good matches if he's carried. Dare I say it maybe if Sin Cara faced Cena we could get a good match? I don't care if two wizards on the stick are in the mainevent but if they can't wrestle worth a damn then I'm not ordering. But even if they have average mic skills at best but can wow me, then I'll buy. That's how it is for me.

Was Essa Rios hyped this way? No. And Sin Cara, I like his look a lot, like he's some sort of mystery man. I don't care if the whole board rises up against me, I stand by the notion that Sin Cara will mainevent in his career and will not just be a midcarder.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

how is "all the hype" at ALL an argument for him being a midcarder? There wasn't anymore hype for him than anyone else to gets vignetts. GLACIER had a shit load of promos and was hyped way more than Cara. If a guy doesn't get over, doesn't matter how much you invested in it, you pull the damn plug.

If you put 100K into one stock that you believe in, and it plunges down 75% to 25k, do you still hold onto it because "you put so much into it"? No, you pull out. The WWE would do no different with their assets (wrestlers).

Cena puts on good matches by himself, he tells stories, what you see as "carrying" is most likely you confusing MOVEZ for ability. Cena sells his ass off and tells brilliant stories regardless of who he's in the ring with. His matches are always over.

Rey Mysterio, Ultimo dragon, Chris masters, they were all hyped about as much as cara. How much you're hyped has nothing to do with where a guy ends up.

Doesnt really matter if Cara can cut a good promo, if you are doing it in Mexico, Cara's promos can be in spanish just as well.

This idea could probably sell over 100,000 seats if Wrestling truly is as popular in Meixco still these days as people seem to talk shit about. IF that is the case, fucking MONEY to be made, for fucking sure.

Wont happen though. Absurdly dangerous, little kids will get stabbed, and I mean that in as serious as a way possible. No need for people to be throwing ziplock bags full of piss at the ring (do you think im joking?)

Not really. First off, how much are you going to charge actual Mexicans for these 100,000 seats? You'd probably end up with the same amount as if you'd sold out MSG in new york. If you charge as much per seat as you would in the US, your audience won't be Mexicans (at least not the diehard fans) it'd be transits. So it wouldn't be as vocal and probably wouldn't sell as much. Plus the PPV buyrates, which trumps ALL money from attendance would be low because no one in the US (mexicans can't afford to drop 50 bucks on a mania) would buy it.

Think of it like this, according to wikipedia, Mania 27 grossed 6.6 for WWE off 71,600 fans, or roughly 95 dollars per ticket. You sell out a 100,000 seat arena and that gives you 9.5M in gate revenue. You charge 55 dollars for the show. You only need to sell about 175,000 PPVs to match that. Your money is made on the buyrates.

to give you a reference, wikipedia (not always reliable but this is good enough) says Mania 26 received 885,000 buys, at 50 bucks a piece, that's almost 45 MILLION dollars in revenue. You can (and do) make sooooo much more with strong buys. The large stadium really is just supplemental. It looks cool and since you can sell that many you get every last dollar you can. the only way you even think about putting it in mexico is if you can somehow sell the tickets for an average of 7 dollars (pretty sure 1 dollar = 13 pesos, I'm not real well versed on exchange rates and such) and sell like 5 millino tickets to the live show, it's not worth it.

 

[CelticCorey]

That's your opinion. I have yet to see a match that Cena sells well or a good match he carries. Unless he's facing Otunga or Riley, he usually always gets his ass kicked but somehow pulls it off. The way Cena is booked makes me to believe that wrestling IS predictable.

The Elimination Chamber really fucking pissed me off. Not that he won, I was expecting it. But he's just laid out almost the whole fucking match and then he does his FU and he is the number one contender. Or how about when the Nexus firing was badly no sold? I don't want to turn this into a Cena debate and I know this shit is not his fault but Cena's character, along with the way he is booked, gives me no reason to cheer for him whatsoever.