Who has the better tag team division WWE or TNA.IMO it used to be TNA a few years ago.Until they messed up and put guys in the tag division like the Nasty Boyz and The Band which it was mainly killed this year but a few years back Team 3D LAX and Beer money had many interesting feuds.Last year it was ok the bound for glory tag match looked good on paper but I never actually watched it.I would like to see motor city machine guns and generation me have a feud over the belts.That would improve tnas tag division all around.Right now WWE prolly has the better division because they are getting more tag teams.It still isnt very good but a few years ago they only had one or two teams.last year at the begning of the year it was only miz and morrison and the colons were the main teams.then it was realy only the colonsa for a while but now they got hart dynasty,uso,hawkins and archer,dude busters and some teams team up occasionaly like truth and morrison.If they were smart they would take unused talent and put them in a tag team but they wont because Vince is more focused on singles wrestling but what do you think?who has the better tag team division?
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Which tag division is better?
- Thread starter Disturbed
- Start date
youngbullzeye
Occasional Pre-Show
Lets see in TNA we have 3D they are ok getting old though,MCMG i really like Sabin and Shelly alot,Beer Money very good tag team get good heat i really enjoy their matches, Gen-Me idk i havent seen them in tag action on TNA so i dont know much about them,Hardy and Anderson i really i enjoy both of them but hopefully this is only so they can feud with fourtune,the Band idk what is going to happen with them so idk with them,INK INK they really dont appeal to me that much i really cant take neal seriously as a wrestler. Now lets go to the WWE you have the Hart Foundation really good team i can see them as one of the most succesful team of this decade,Uso havent seen a match but they look preety good also,dudebuster i see poteniel in them but only if the creative team books them right,Gate-Crashers saw them on Smackdown looked really impressing so i guess all i have read about them is true.(note i didnt post any tag teams from FCW because i dont read or watch anything from FCW)I gotta go with TNA just by a little bit even though i feel WWE might have have the better tag teams by the end of the year.
The Great Ace
Dark Match Winner
I vote TNA. I could get by with just mentioning the GREATEST tag team of all time, Team 3D. 20+ tag belts. Shall I mention more? I shall.
MCMG- One of the quickly rising tag teams in the world. Sabin and Shelley are so in sync, they could be the next Hardy Boyz, if they haven't already surpassed them.
Beer Money- Sure, these guys are the after-group of AMW, but they still put on a hell of a show. As heels or as faces, these guys can draw fans.
Generation Me- A GREAT tag team. If the MCMG are on their way to being the next Hardy Boyz, Generation Me is on their way to being the next Guns. I see many tag titles in their future.
Ink Inc.- Not so much a great tag team YET, but they show much promise. Shannon Moore, who has PLENTY of experience as a tag team wrestler, and Jesse Neal, who is trained by the greatest tag team to ever grace the squared circle. These guys have serious potential.
Jeff Hardy/ Ken Anderson- Dubbed the Enigmatic Assholes I believe. Jeff Hardy was apart of the greatest tag team of the century for a time, before branching off to become a singles star. Anderson and Hardy have some potential, although I believe this inevitably leads to Anderson turning on Hardy.
Onto WWE's Tag Teams-
Hart Dynasty- Until recently, the only real tag team WWE had since the split of DX(again) and Legacy. These guys have tag team gold engraved in their BLOOD. They have been trained to be wrestling stars since birth. Many tag team belts will come from these guys, mark my words.
Usos- New tag team to the WWE for the Harts to feud with. Another great dynasty, with even more tag team gold in their blood. A lot of promise with these guys. Future tag champs? Likely.
Croft/Baretta- Showed potential early on, but haven't heard much from them since. Dubbed the Dudebusters now, I believe. Could be something, probably not.
TNA wins, hands down. Tag team division is TNA's forte.
MCMG- One of the quickly rising tag teams in the world. Sabin and Shelley are so in sync, they could be the next Hardy Boyz, if they haven't already surpassed them.
Beer Money- Sure, these guys are the after-group of AMW, but they still put on a hell of a show. As heels or as faces, these guys can draw fans.
Generation Me- A GREAT tag team. If the MCMG are on their way to being the next Hardy Boyz, Generation Me is on their way to being the next Guns. I see many tag titles in their future.
Ink Inc.- Not so much a great tag team YET, but they show much promise. Shannon Moore, who has PLENTY of experience as a tag team wrestler, and Jesse Neal, who is trained by the greatest tag team to ever grace the squared circle. These guys have serious potential.
Jeff Hardy/ Ken Anderson- Dubbed the Enigmatic Assholes I believe. Jeff Hardy was apart of the greatest tag team of the century for a time, before branching off to become a singles star. Anderson and Hardy have some potential, although I believe this inevitably leads to Anderson turning on Hardy.
Onto WWE's Tag Teams-
Hart Dynasty- Until recently, the only real tag team WWE had since the split of DX(again) and Legacy. These guys have tag team gold engraved in their BLOOD. They have been trained to be wrestling stars since birth. Many tag team belts will come from these guys, mark my words.
Usos- New tag team to the WWE for the Harts to feud with. Another great dynasty, with even more tag team gold in their blood. A lot of promise with these guys. Future tag champs? Likely.
Croft/Baretta- Showed potential early on, but haven't heard much from them since. Dubbed the Dudebusters now, I believe. Could be something, probably not.
TNA wins, hands down. Tag team division is TNA's forte.
It's Damn Real!
The undisputed, undefeated TNA &
The WWE has a tag team division? Could have fooled me. All I ever see are the Hart Dynasty battle The Usos, while the Dudebusters make an occasional appearance and random singles wrestlers who aren't currently served by feuds otherwise are put together like piecemeal.
TNA wins this hands down, by default. TNA actually has a division with more than two actual teams, and more than two actual teams who've been a team for more than a month.
TNA wins this hands down, by default. TNA actually has a division with more than two actual teams, and more than two actual teams who've been a team for more than a month.
TNA may have the better division actually but they do not know how to use there tag teams.Generation Me and Motor City Machine GUns should be feuding over the belt.The Band should have never won the tag belts.DId they eveer even defend the belts?And all 3 men wrestled in all there matches.Also Beer Money is probalbly the best tag team in wrestling and they should get the belts once again also.I would like to see LAX make a return and feud with Matt Morgan and a tag partner.IDK who is partner would be.Hres a future world champ and doesnt need to be lost in a tag team.but just for the time being for a month or two.
Kenny Powers
Bulletproof Tiger
Maybe some can argue that the TNA tag division isn't what it used to be, but at least there is a division with more then 3 teams. Team 3D, Beer Money, Ink Inc., and The Band are regularly showcased. Motor City Machine Guns are a great team that don't get enough exposure, but at least they are more credible then the dudebusters or two random wrestlers like Koslov and Santino pairing together. The Hart Dynasty and The Uso's are the only real tag division shown on WWE.
Most of the other tag teams are singles wrestlers formed for a few nights and then never heard from again. The TNA tag division isn't great now, but at least they have actual tag teams that are established and not thrown together.
Most of the other tag teams are singles wrestlers formed for a few nights and then never heard from again. The TNA tag division isn't great now, but at least they have actual tag teams that are established and not thrown together.
While the WWE may be taking more of an interest in retifying the chaos that is the tag team division, TNA still has the superior teams. Right now the Hart Dynasty and the Usos are the only real tag teams in the WWE. They had a solid match at Fatal Fourway, but nonetheless, two teams does not make a division.
On the other hand, TNA has MCMG, Beer Money, Generation Me, Team 3D and Ink Inc., all of whom can work their asses off. TNA may not be putting their tag team division in the forefront (which should be criminal), but the talent is there and blows the WWE out of the water in terms of potential.
On the other hand, TNA has MCMG, Beer Money, Generation Me, Team 3D and Ink Inc., all of whom can work their asses off. TNA may not be putting their tag team division in the forefront (which should be criminal), but the talent is there and blows the WWE out of the water in terms of potential.
Although they are misusing it, TNA has a better tag division. They don't use the tag teams in the right way but they at least still have the tag teams. The Hart Dynasty is really all the WWE has. Usos still are new so who knows how they will play out in the long run although they seem to be very good tag team. Oh the WWE does have the tag team of Lay-Cool as well...and the fact that they were the third tag team I thought of is a very sad fact.
TNA hands downs.
TNA hands downs.
TNA by miles
WWE has 2 Tag Titles in a division where they have like.. 3 established teams (by this I mean they have been together for at least a 3 months on TV). The titles were unified due to lack of tag team depth, not because it was the cool thing to do.
TNA has a lot of good teams that don't get a run because the titles are usually tied up due to storyline needs. There are also a few teams in TNA that can reform to further beef up the division
TNA wins this battle but if they don't make improvements this won't be the case next year.
WWE has 2 Tag Titles in a division where they have like.. 3 established teams (by this I mean they have been together for at least a 3 months on TV). The titles were unified due to lack of tag team depth, not because it was the cool thing to do.
TNA has a lot of good teams that don't get a run because the titles are usually tied up due to storyline needs. There are also a few teams in TNA that can reform to further beef up the division
TNA wins this battle but if they don't make improvements this won't be the case next year.
Dudebuster420
Occasional Pre-Show
Damn, this might catch me heat and you might think I'm dumb for this but I have to go with WWE honestly. That sounds so absurd I know but I have reasoning. I take the WWE over TNA because I at least could tell you what has happened with those titles for the last few years for starters without going to wikipedia. I have been watching TNA since before they were even on TV as well so it's not like I'm not familiar with the product. I also think that people are putting WAAAY too much stock on Team 3-D being there, I could go off on that rant for the next hour and a half but I'll save it.
What makes Ink Inc any good either? You've got Shannon Moore: a guy nobody actually wanted but got hired because of Jeff Hardy, and one of the most generic wrestlers I've ever seen Jesse Neil. Beer Money? Only worth a shit in TNA and AMW V.2. Motor City? Good enough to make it in WWE and the best tag team in TNA. GenMe? Where are they again? when's the last time we really saw them? Who else is there? Anderson and Hardy? Funny when WWE just pairs two superstars together it's unoriginal and lazy booking. TNA does it and they're making an amazing tag team? I call Bullshit! Well, that's it, TNA's Tag Division, sinking like the rest of the ship.
I take WWE because they already have a few really good teams, have had really good teams, and most of all; if they want to at any time they can pair two big stars together to make a mega-team.They've done it very well the last few years with JeriShow and ShowMiz most notably, DiBiase and Rhodes, Morrison and Truth, Rated RKO, etc. They can make a team at will that will skunk any team TNA could ever assemble or currently has.
The Colons were as good a tag team as anybody that has been or is in TNA right now, Paul London and Brian Kendrick were an amazing team that would definitely have given MCMG a few lessons in their time, Miz and Morrison was one of the best tag teams in the business and would give any team in TNA a rough go as well. The list goes on and on of great teams they've had in WWE over the last decade, even though the tag division wasn't their main focus. The story is, anything TNA can do WWE can do better and does. They have been more consistent than the short memories of the IWC are recalling and their current roster of tag teams and potential tag teams makes them the better of the two.
What makes Ink Inc any good either? You've got Shannon Moore: a guy nobody actually wanted but got hired because of Jeff Hardy, and one of the most generic wrestlers I've ever seen Jesse Neil. Beer Money? Only worth a shit in TNA and AMW V.2. Motor City? Good enough to make it in WWE and the best tag team in TNA. GenMe? Where are they again? when's the last time we really saw them? Who else is there? Anderson and Hardy? Funny when WWE just pairs two superstars together it's unoriginal and lazy booking. TNA does it and they're making an amazing tag team? I call Bullshit! Well, that's it, TNA's Tag Division, sinking like the rest of the ship.
I take WWE because they already have a few really good teams, have had really good teams, and most of all; if they want to at any time they can pair two big stars together to make a mega-team.They've done it very well the last few years with JeriShow and ShowMiz most notably, DiBiase and Rhodes, Morrison and Truth, Rated RKO, etc. They can make a team at will that will skunk any team TNA could ever assemble or currently has.
The Colons were as good a tag team as anybody that has been or is in TNA right now, Paul London and Brian Kendrick were an amazing team that would definitely have given MCMG a few lessons in their time, Miz and Morrison was one of the best tag teams in the business and would give any team in TNA a rough go as well. The list goes on and on of great teams they've had in WWE over the last decade, even though the tag division wasn't their main focus. The story is, anything TNA can do WWE can do better and does. They have been more consistent than the short memories of the IWC are recalling and their current roster of tag teams and potential tag teams makes them the better of the two.
I agree with you on Moore but I don't understand why nobody is giving Jesse Neal a chance. He is still relativey new. Plus I don't see how him not having developed much of a character yet affects his team, since Ink inc. does obviously have a gimmick. A stupid gimmick, maybe, but at least they have one.
Give Me a break. What does "only worth a shit in TNA" even mean? Are you implying that WWE woudn't want them? Is that why Roode turned down WWE when they offered him a contract, maybe a year ago?
It's a good team who has been holding together the division for over a year.
I'm honestly not a fan of them at all. But whatever.
I agree with both of those.
Yet you neglect to name one current WWE team in your post.
And they have shown with these teams that they love to split them up for no fucking reason. (Deuce and Domino, Cade and Murdoch, Cryme Tyme...)
Now I take back what I said about agreeing with you about Anderson and Hardy. You think it's stupid when TNA does it but it's a mega team when WWE does it? The only team of those that was remotely good was Rated RKO, because their gimmicks at the time worked together. DiBiase and Rhodes were nobodies who became lackies, hardly a "megateam". Neither of the two Show teams were really that entertaining, and I am not even going to comment on Morrison and Truth seeing as how a barely even remember it
Too bad one of them got fired. They are not a current tag team. On a different note, isn't it funny how you mentioned that Jesse Neal is too bland for Ink Inc to be a good team, yet you have no problem with Primo being even blander?
Other than the fact that I despised that team more than anything else at the time... this is yet another team that is not together anymore.
No. No they weren't. They were incrediby over rated as a team. They were a GOOD team, the best one which WWE had seen in a while, but really what good feuds do you remember from Miz and Morrison? I just remember this team as the one that made Miz a more credible wrestler.
Oh and YET AGAIN, this is not a current team.
If the current tag teams have so much potential WHY DIDN'T YOU MENTION A SINGLE ONE? All you did was bring up the past and trash the current TNA tag teams.
There is something WWE does that TNA does not - split up tag teams when they know it will not benefit either wrestler. TNA barely ever splits their tag teams. TNA also puts actual focus on their division, with actual storylines like the recent Matt Morgan one and the 3D and Jesse Neal storyline thing. It isn't always good, but at least they put an effort into the division.
Jamie and Adam investigate the tag teams of the WWE
TNA's tag division is better because it's deeper.
They have five teams: Inc Ink, Generation ME, Team 3D, Ink Inc and MCMG. The WWE has Archer/Hawkins, Dudebusters, Usos, Harts. That's only four admittedly, but the fact that Kozlov and Santino will end up being a team and the fact that Carlito's recent release cost them a team, means that WWE also like to keep theirs at about 5. Before anyone says "YEAH< BUT NASH GOT RELEASED TOO!!!" Just remember we aren't including groups, otherwise SES would surely count.
BUSTED
TNA always have their tag title on PPV, WWE don't
Last time WWE put on a PPV that didn't have the tag champions in a tag match: 21 February 2010. Last time TNA didn't: 13 June 2010. Last time before that, WWE: 31 January 2010, TNA: 18 April 2010. Ok, ok, last time before that. WWE: 22 November 2009, TNA: 14 February 2010
BUSTED
WWE just throw their tag teams together
WWE's 4 tag teams
The Usos: Debuted together, genuinely related
The Harts: Redebuted together, genuinely known each other for several years
Dudebusters: Debuted together
Hawkins/Archer: Redebuted together
TNA
Beer Money: Two singles wrestlers, put together
Team 3D: Debuted together
MCMG: Two singles wrestlers, put together elsewhere, eventually teamed in TNA
Generation ME: Genuinely related
Ink Inc: Two singles wrestlers, put together
BUSTED
WWE split their teams up too quickly
Well, perhaps there is some truth to this one. The WWE often splits tag teams up early, but often this reaps benefits. Since 2002 the following have made their name in a tag team then gone on to be a world champion in WWE: Jeff Hardy. Oh shit, looks like the naysayers are right, lets do it for TNA: Nobody. Ah well, at least the list of current big TNA singles stars who made their names in tag teams will be longer, here it is: Jeff Hardy. Oh. By comparison, the current big WWE singles stars who made their names in tag teams: Edge, Christian, Matt Hardy, John Morrison, The Miz, Cody Rhodes, Ted DiBiase...
What people fail to reason is that tag wrestling is a means to an end, and the only tag teams that don't get split are the ones that are greater than the sum of their parts, like The Dudleys, for example. TNA do the opposite, and keep teams together too long. Take Beer Money. Clearly, they are talented wrestlers, and clearly could be main eventers, but instead they are forced to stay as a tag team while men in their 40s inhabit the main event.
There's an argument that WWE jump the gun, so we'll leave this as
UNCONFIRMED
The quality of TNA's teams are superior
Wholly objective, but lets look at the facts. MCMG and Beer Money are decent workers, but so are the Harts. As for the others, I haven't seen the Usos yet, but they can't be any worse than the Dudleys and Ink Inc, it literally isn't possible, and not one of Generation Me, Dudebusters and Archer & Hawkins get long enough to really sell themselves. So, not really consistently better at all then.
BUSTED
In conclusion, the raw credentials of their tag divisions is fairly similar. The only difference, as I see it, is that the WWE doesn't feel the need to tell everyone that their tag division is the best, nor do they give lots of mic time to hasbeens like the Dudleys. Fundamentally, the divisions are of a similar standard, but I'm inclined to say that the WWE's division is better, because it actually serves its purpose - as a side show that is interesting enough to hold the attention, and a breeding ground for future singles stars - rather than TNA's method which is something mildly more captivating, but at the same time something which is a stagnant pool of otherwise promising talent like Robert Roode, James Storm, Chris Sabin etc.
TNA's tag division is better because it's deeper.
They have five teams: Inc Ink, Generation ME, Team 3D, Ink Inc and MCMG. The WWE has Archer/Hawkins, Dudebusters, Usos, Harts. That's only four admittedly, but the fact that Kozlov and Santino will end up being a team and the fact that Carlito's recent release cost them a team, means that WWE also like to keep theirs at about 5. Before anyone says "YEAH< BUT NASH GOT RELEASED TOO!!!" Just remember we aren't including groups, otherwise SES would surely count.
BUSTED
TNA always have their tag title on PPV, WWE don't
Last time WWE put on a PPV that didn't have the tag champions in a tag match: 21 February 2010. Last time TNA didn't: 13 June 2010. Last time before that, WWE: 31 January 2010, TNA: 18 April 2010. Ok, ok, last time before that. WWE: 22 November 2009, TNA: 14 February 2010
BUSTED
WWE just throw their tag teams together
WWE's 4 tag teams
The Usos: Debuted together, genuinely related
The Harts: Redebuted together, genuinely known each other for several years
Dudebusters: Debuted together
Hawkins/Archer: Redebuted together
TNA
Beer Money: Two singles wrestlers, put together
Team 3D: Debuted together
MCMG: Two singles wrestlers, put together elsewhere, eventually teamed in TNA
Generation ME: Genuinely related
Ink Inc: Two singles wrestlers, put together
BUSTED
WWE split their teams up too quickly
Well, perhaps there is some truth to this one. The WWE often splits tag teams up early, but often this reaps benefits. Since 2002 the following have made their name in a tag team then gone on to be a world champion in WWE: Jeff Hardy. Oh shit, looks like the naysayers are right, lets do it for TNA: Nobody. Ah well, at least the list of current big TNA singles stars who made their names in tag teams will be longer, here it is: Jeff Hardy. Oh. By comparison, the current big WWE singles stars who made their names in tag teams: Edge, Christian, Matt Hardy, John Morrison, The Miz, Cody Rhodes, Ted DiBiase...
What people fail to reason is that tag wrestling is a means to an end, and the only tag teams that don't get split are the ones that are greater than the sum of their parts, like The Dudleys, for example. TNA do the opposite, and keep teams together too long. Take Beer Money. Clearly, they are talented wrestlers, and clearly could be main eventers, but instead they are forced to stay as a tag team while men in their 40s inhabit the main event.
There's an argument that WWE jump the gun, so we'll leave this as
UNCONFIRMED
The quality of TNA's teams are superior
Wholly objective, but lets look at the facts. MCMG and Beer Money are decent workers, but so are the Harts. As for the others, I haven't seen the Usos yet, but they can't be any worse than the Dudleys and Ink Inc, it literally isn't possible, and not one of Generation Me, Dudebusters and Archer & Hawkins get long enough to really sell themselves. So, not really consistently better at all then.
BUSTED
In conclusion, the raw credentials of their tag divisions is fairly similar. The only difference, as I see it, is that the WWE doesn't feel the need to tell everyone that their tag division is the best, nor do they give lots of mic time to hasbeens like the Dudleys. Fundamentally, the divisions are of a similar standard, but I'm inclined to say that the WWE's division is better, because it actually serves its purpose - as a side show that is interesting enough to hold the attention, and a breeding ground for future singles stars - rather than TNA's method which is something mildly more captivating, but at the same time something which is a stagnant pool of otherwise promising talent like Robert Roode, James Storm, Chris Sabin etc.
shattered dreams
Hexagonal Hedonist
So we are not counting Nash and Young because they were a group that is not a group anymore because of a release? Makes perfect sense. Rule out the last tag champs that wrestled as a team before forming the group and have again after the group ended. You also fail to mention the enigmatic assholes, which in spite of brevity would surely qualify on the wwe side. No matter how you want to doctor the results, sure they have a similar number of teams. Now do they have a similar amount of TV time to fill? No WWE has double. So clearly impact has a deeper tag team scene than either raw or smackdown.
Cool. Just putting the belt on a PPV makes a division better. Man, those booking dudes sure do have an easy job. Although, this might explain the tag match I saw at wrestlemania. Otherwise what I saw was inexplicably terrible and IMO hurt the division worse than just leaving it off.
How is once since 2002 often or even applicable in a "the current state" debate? Christian won the NWA title in TNA if it means that much to you. Hernandez definitely made his name in a tag-team. Cody Rhodes is a big star? Still not really sure why for most of these guys it matters they were in a tag team years ago in a debate about the present.
RVD is 39. AJ who was champ for the 6 months prior just turned 32. AJ defended the title against people like pope, Wolfe, daniels, joe, abyss, tomko sting and angle. Only the last two are over 40. RVD won the title from styles, defended it against him, wolfe and sting. How is this dominance by 40+ year olds? Meanwhile two 40+ olds headlined wrestlemania. Oh right I forgot this is a TNA only problem. BUSTED.
Not even sure what this means. I think you mean subjective but type objective then you say the facts which are you opinions. You have not even seen a 4th of the wwe's tag division and think half of it does not get enough time to showcase themselves yet you are convinced it is better with one decent worker team for two shows? Especially when you give TNA twice as many decent workers to fill half the time?
If you admit it is more captivating isn't the whole point of this thread? You are basically saying wwe is better even though they are worse because you assume they will make some "stars" and TNA won't, which is something that cannot be proved and seems quite sketchy to me. WWE simply does not have the built up history that can add something extra to feuds and keep a division thriving. The hart dynasty won the belts for the first time two months ago and already they are the leader among active tag teams in number of title reigns and time holding the belts. To me this shows the idea that wwe breaks them up too quickly is confirmed. One team just cannot make a division and the wwe has been trying to pull that off for some time now.
Goliath Uterus
Getting Noticed By Management
TNA by far. WWE is definitley making leaps and bounds to recreate their fledgling tag team division but it is still nowhere near the level that TNA's is.
They've got MCMG, Gen-Me, Ink-Inc., Beer Money, Team 3-D and a few others, all WWE has is Hart Dynasty and the Usos, (the Dudebuster dont count cause, while they are awesome, no one knows who the fuck they are) so basically TNA wins by default.
They've got MCMG, Gen-Me, Ink-Inc., Beer Money, Team 3-D and a few others, all WWE has is Hart Dynasty and the Usos, (the Dudebuster dont count cause, while they are awesome, no one knows who the fuck they are) so basically TNA wins by default.
Dudebuster420
Occasional Pre-Show
Why? As I said, because he is a pretty generic character, and the fact that he is not developed means we know little about him which gives us little reason to care what he does or with whom. I promise you Vladimir Kozlov is a better wrestler than Jesse Neal, but you probably don't care about him right? Why? He is generic and there isn't much focus on him or his development. It's a difference of standards and perception.
It means exactly what it says, they are only worth a shit in TNA. Anywhere else that team wouldn't be a big deal, but because EVERYTHING in TNA is a big deal, so are they apparently. I am not implying that WWE wouldn't be interested in either of them individually since they are both good wrestlers, but as the team they are, they are useless to WWE and that is exactly why they only asked for one of them. Don't forget that former James Storm teammate "Wildcat" Chris Harris did go to WWE but couldn't hack it and left, so they've tested the TNA talent pool a little.
So you don't like the team that most people would agree is one of the best in wrestling period, but you like Ink Inc? Ok, that's all I needed to know to figure out that this is a futile effort.
That's because I didn't need to. Everyone else before me talked about all of them quite a bit. I felt it would be a little redundant to reiterate the same points about the same tag teams, excuse me.
You THINK they split the teams for no reason, but look at the superstars that have come from tag teams. I believe Tastycles already did the work for me there, go look at his post and get back to me. There is a great list of big stars that we wouldn't have if the WWE didn't split up tag teams. Let me give you an example of two from histories records: Shawn Michaels and Bret Hart, good enough?
As it pertains to the few teams you specifically named, they tried to make stars of one of the members of each group after splitting them up which you failed to mention or acknowledge. That means they broke those teams up for a reason, but because you and I are the watchers not the writers we don't always know why they do what they do. Shad and JTG are still in the process so we still have to see how that goes.
Response to the Underlined
You couldn't have missed the mark on that one anymore than you did. I wasn't ragging on TNA for putting two random people together. I was ragging on the fact that when WWE does it they get a lot of heat for it, but when TNA does it people say they look like geniuses. It's a double standard I felt the need to point out, get it now?
Response to Italics
All those teams were successful for starters, and they played integral roles in whatever was going on in the WWE at the time, meaning they made sense to have. TNA has teams for seemingly no purpose, just to have teams, and the tag division is treated as almost a separate entity rather than one more part of the machine. Whether you liked any of those teams or not is irrelevant to how good they were or are, and all of them were good functional tag teams.
Response to Underlined
Doesn't matter that their not a current tag team, I was making the point that WWE has consistently had good tag teams and this was one of them.
Response to Italics
Yeah you're right, I don't have a problem with Primo being bland but that's because A. He still has more of a character being the brother of Carlito, and B. He is actually a good wrestler and entertaining to watch. I can't say the same for Jesse Neal who like his gimmick is very generic in the ring.
Yes, another team that isn't together, but was a great tag team in WWE whether you liked them or not. They were very good at what they did, and are yet another example of the consistency of WWE having good tag teams.
That's your opinion that they were overrated as a team and you're entitled to it, but just because you didn't like them doesn't mean they sucked. As a matter of fact they are partially responsible for the resurgence of the tag team division, they got people interested again. If you want feud material as well all I have to do is point to the team I was just talking about earlier The Colons. Great feud that unified the titles, got people interested again, and put both teams over in their respective roles. Did you forget about "The Dirt Sheet" as well, that was a pretty big deal too, I guess that makes them overrated though according to you. Again, an example of consistency and quality.
I already answered this one above, I didn't need to name the teams in WWE everyone before me went through talking about them, tearing them down, and propping up the TNA teams. I am of a different opinion so my job was to explain why I thought TNA does not have the better tag division and why I prefer one over the other which I did.
Response to Underlined
That is an objective opinion, once again that you are entitled to but does not carry any truth. WWE splits up the teams when the teams are of no benefit to either wrestler or the company. It's not a separate entity, it's a proving ground within the company. Read this part I quoted below from Tastycles as he already explained this very well and I share the very same sentiments.
Couldn't have said it better myself. Now, get the picture?
Ruthless-RKO
F*ck Friends, Rather die wiv ma AK!
Lets break it down!!
TNA
Beer Money Inc. - The best tag team in wrestling today... MY OPINION!!
The Enigmatic Assholes - New team..i don't think it will last long though..
Generation Me - 2 youngsters..are these the Bucks?? They are a great team...the future of tag team..if they jump to WWE..why not? they would jump in a second...
Ink Inc. - I don't like this team..but they both tattoo freakz..and the team does make good sense..had a decent first feud...
The Motor City Machine Guns - The most UNDERRATED team in wrestling today... Are they ever going to win the tag titles...we will have to see in their match against Beer Money Inc...These two are crazy high flyers...
Team 3D - What to say..they have over 20 tag titles under their belts..but not as good as they used to be..to have a good match, they have to have a Table in the ring...
WWE
The Dude Busters - Kinda remind me of Generation Me..not as good though...are the future of tag team division..
Hart Dynasty - This team is all about genetics...they are are great team and definite future tag team greats...come on wwe use them right..
Curt Hawkins and Vance Archer - This team looks to be decent...so far..
The Uso's - What can I say, they have been impressive...
Conclusion
Looking at it..TNA has more..i have to leave out stables here and some wwe tag teams just get hrown together now a days...but WWE have younger talent..Most of TNA's have been in WWE...most in TNA have more experience...From 2005-post...TNA have dominated Heavily in TAG TEAM DIVISION compared to the "E"...But recently we all have seen how wwe have recreated their tag division...it's looking better...
TNA
Beer Money Inc. - The best tag team in wrestling today... MY OPINION!!
The Enigmatic Assholes - New team..i don't think it will last long though..
Generation Me - 2 youngsters..are these the Bucks?? They are a great team...the future of tag team..if they jump to WWE..why not? they would jump in a second...
Ink Inc. - I don't like this team..but they both tattoo freakz..and the team does make good sense..had a decent first feud...
The Motor City Machine Guns - The most UNDERRATED team in wrestling today... Are they ever going to win the tag titles...we will have to see in their match against Beer Money Inc...These two are crazy high flyers...
Team 3D - What to say..they have over 20 tag titles under their belts..but not as good as they used to be..to have a good match, they have to have a Table in the ring...
WWE
The Dude Busters - Kinda remind me of Generation Me..not as good though...are the future of tag team division..
Hart Dynasty - This team is all about genetics...they are are great team and definite future tag team greats...come on wwe use them right..
Curt Hawkins and Vance Archer - This team looks to be decent...so far..
The Uso's - What can I say, they have been impressive...
Conclusion
Looking at it..TNA has more..i have to leave out stables here and some wwe tag teams just get hrown together now a days...but WWE have younger talent..Most of TNA's have been in WWE...most in TNA have more experience...From 2005-post...TNA have dominated Heavily in TAG TEAM DIVISION compared to the "E"...But recently we all have seen how wwe have recreated their tag division...it's looking better...
What I was trying to say was that a tag team can still be entertaining if one of the members does not have much of a gimmick. I agree that Jesse is generic right now, but the team he is in is not. The team's gimmick is very flashy, and while it isn't groundbreaking to have two guys with mohawks and ink, you can clearly tell just from looking at them that they share an "I'm desperately trying to appear punk" gimmick, which is at least a step up from no gimmick at all.
I disagree with the idea of Beer Money not being relevant in any other promotion. Beer Money started out as a "thrown together" team of two singles wrestlers which became successful as a team. To say that they could be worthwhile as individual wrestlers but not as a tag team in any other promotion is basically saying that any other thrown-together tag teams would not be worth anything in any other promotion, as well. Which would mean teams that you brought up in your other post, such as Rated RKO, were also not worth a shit. I don't understand why you think TNA hyping up a tag team is bad for their tag division. How is giving a team credibility a bad thing?
MCMG is a good tag team. I am not denying that. It's just my personal dislike for each wrestler in the team that makes me dislike them.
And no I don't like Ink Inc... I like Jesse Neal and think he has potential, but I think the team does not. I already implied in my other post that I think their gimmick is stupid. But at least they have a gimmick, which most in WWE really don't other than being brothers.
The thread title is "Which tag division is better?" not "Which company has had better tag teams in their recent history?"
Yes and while the singles wrestlers emerge from this, the tag division sinks. Why doesn't WWE have any permanent tag team guys / teams intended to stay a team for the entire career? It's widely accepted on here that some wrestlers are just meant to stay in the mid-card, so why is it in WWE that there are no wresters who stay in the tag division? It's good to use tag teams to introduce new singles wrestlers but it makes the division seem less legitimate when there are no tag teams that you know are not going to split up anytime in the near future.
I was going to respond to this by commenting on how they fired Deuce/Sim Snuka/ Whatever and only used him to make Cody/Ted look better, and how they RE-fired Lance Cade recently (they had hired him again after the seizure) before he made it onto TV... but you're right that "we don't always know why they do what they do" so I guess this part of the debate is just useless to continue with
I think you are exaggerating because I don't remember anybody calling TNA geniuses for the Hardy Anderson team. But whatever, moving on.
The teams may have been integral to WWE storylines, such as turning Orton face (even though that wasn't even intended supposedly...), but the teams were not integral to the division. Really... does the team of Show/Jericho, with no gimmick other than that they are two singles wrestlers, make you excited to watch their tag match? How about Orton's lackeys with no personality? The teams may have been important to other storylines but made the tag division itself boring as hell.
TNA having teams just to have teams... isn't that a good thing? Why can't they just have competitive tag teams? Do they always have to be involved in storylines outside of the tag division? I think I am misunderstanding what you mean because I don't think that makes any sense.
Being related to somebody does not give you character. Example: Priceless aka The Legacy aka The Lackies. Were related to not-so-boring people, yet they were boring as dirt.
I agree that Primo is a good wrestler, and I hope he does well in WWE, but him being related to Carlito does not make him less bland.
They were good but I despised them for being so boring out of the ring. And WWE may have good consistency or whatever but again this thread is adressing the current state of tag team wrestling, not the best tag division including all teams in the company history (which WWE would win in that case)
I. Never. Said. They. Sucked.
I know that they got people interested in WWE's tag team division again. I know they were a good tag team. I already said that. I was a fan of them. They brought life back into the division which at the time was at an all time low.
A good tag team in WWE was so rare at the time that people thought they were great. The feud with the Colons was a great feud? You mean the part where Miz/Morrison were making fun of their last names or the part where the Bella twins went on a date with them? Because that's all I remember. They had good matches in a mediocre feud. Nothing memorable.
Miz & Morrison were at their highest point at the same time Beer Money was at their highest point and honestly I think Beer Money overshadowed them.
Not to mention that after they split, Miz joined another team with Show, Morrison joined another team with Truth apparantally, and all of these have split by now, while Beer Money is still an active tag team.
By you not adressing the WWE tag teams I just assumed that you thought they sucked too.
I know what you are saying. But I do not agree with it. I think the tag teams lasting longer in TNA shows that TNA actually wants a competitive tag division while WWE wants to use their tag division solely as a way to build singles wrestlers, which makes the tag division itself less credible IMO
How many times have they wrestled together since Scott Hall was released? Zero. Yeah makes pretty fucking crystal clear sense, but as it aired after his release, we'll say the jury's out on this one.
Clearly not going to be a long term thing, and if they are, then gee, we might as well say that Ziggler and Chavo and R-Truth and John Morrison are teams, because both have had more matches than Anderson and Hardy.
They have the same number of PPVs to fill. I suppose you do have a point though, WWE have more TV time. However, The Usos last featured on 20 June, Harts on 20 June, Dudebusters last night and Archer and Hawkins on 18 June. They have more TV time, and have featured all of their teams wrestling or wrestling and managing in the last week.
TNA, you rightly point out have half the TV time, so we'll give them two weeks to showcase their teams, only seems fair. Right, well Beer Money and Team 3D were both on last week's iMPACT!, an Jesse Neal was on Slammiversery with Moore in his corner. Generation ME haven't been on TNA in over a month, and "Number 1 contenders" MCMG have not set foot in a TNA ring since May, and haven't wrestled together since Sacrifice. Generation ME last wrestled as a team on May 4. So, WWE may have twice the time, but they feature their teams with much more frequency than TNA, and actually use all four of their teams, unlike TNA.
As much as everyone bums MCMG and TNA's tag team division as a result, they'd do well to realise that they've wrestled as a tag team this year a total of 8 times. Shit the bed. 8 times.
Yeah, it'd be much better to have a totally shit singles star squash your teams, wouldn't it? Oh. TNA's last tag champions have been: A man who can hardly walk and a drug addict, occasionally helped by the company whipping boy, a shit singles star on his own, two singles stars slung together for no reason, a proper team - one of whom is about as competent in the ring as I am at rhythmic gymnastics, two singles stars slung together and now we're almost a year ago.
By contrast WWE's last teams have been two related people, two singles stars put together, two lifelong friends, two singles stars put together, two brothers. To suggest that there is some prestige in the TNA Tag titles is prepostorous. The WWE may have given the titles to Showmiz and Jerishow, but there were stories to go with that, unlike Hernandez and Morgan, and unlike Hernandez and Morgan, Jerishow put over a young proper tag team. Who did Morgan and Hernandez put over? Nobody. Then Morgan defends the titles on his own and drops them to wrestlers with a combined age of 101.
I'll give you Hernandez, but the point still stands. I meant people who had left tag teams in that time. If you want to add people who have ever been in tag teams then WWE have Edge, JBL, Booker T. TNA still have nobody.
Ages of world champions in TNA crowned since Beer Money formed: 49, 43, 40, 30, 39. Average age: 40.
For the record, though it is irrelevant, I just feel the need to make you look like more of a tard...
Ages of world champions in WWE crowned since Beer Money formed: 35, 31, 39, 29, 40, 32, 31, 38, 30, 44, 28, 35. Average age: 34
Bollocks. Yes you're right, I do this all the time.
Except a)We've already seen that they don't get on air much. I said that most tag team matches are so short that quality is largely irrelevant. The so called golden eras of tag wrestling in the late 80s and 90s ha matches that lasted about 3 minutes on PPV, quality really doesn't matter. I haven't seen The Usos, admittedly, but I've seen enough of Dudebusters/Gatecrashers to know they're about 50 times better than the Dudleys.
I'm saying the most entertaining team right now is probably in TNA. I'm saying that the overall enjoyment factor is probably about even. All things told, the total package is absolutely with the WWE. The question is "who has the best tag division?" and the WWE is the only company that actually offers a proper team.
So, instead you should keep your talented up and comers in tag teams forever. LAX are almost certainly going to get back together, which means that one of TNA's best hopes for being a singles star, Hernandez, will be going back to a team, aged 37. James Storm and Robert Roode are both older than Cena, Orton and CM Punk and yet both of them are still in the tag division, doing absolutely nothing except be a part of the four horsemen, without actually being allowed to be called that. Way to build stars TNA.
TNA's tag division is built around the Dudleys, a team that offer almost nothing these days. People wank off over MCMG, but they hardly ever feature on TV or PPV. If you want to watch Brother Ray turn face then SUDDENLY TURN HEEL AGAIN, or watch MCMG get squashed by main eventers when it looks like they're going to get pushed, power to you.
The WWE may split teams too soon on occasion, but lets be honest, there's turnover in the division. The main teams this time in 2008 in TNA were Beer Money, Team 3D and LAX. If the rumours of reformation are true, and it looks that way at present, then LAX will rejoin Team 3D and Beer Money as the main teams. There's only so many times those teams can turn heel and back again and hold my attention, to be honest.
shattered dreams
Hexagonal Hedonist
Just like those teams have had more matches than half of the teams in wwe's current division.
How hard is it to feature 4 teams in a week? Hell, you practically have to do it just to have a tag match on each show. The point is WWE would have to have twice as teams as TNA does to be as deep. Instead they actually have less. In fact they featured those 4 so much that you have not even seen one of them yet. I have no idea what you are talking about with featuring teams. On the last impact TNA featured 4 teams wrestling (ink inc.,Nash/Young,3D, Beer money) for the right to face a 5th (MCMG) and in the main event the dynamic between the enigmatic assholes was a big part of the story and on top of that half of gen-me had a match. So in one show TNA managed to put more of a spotlight on tag-team wrestling than wwe did in over a week and at least twice as much tv time.
The hardy boyz made their names well before 2002 as well. Are you really saying that the wwe tag division is presently better because the Hardy Boyz broke up around 2002 and then in December of 2008 one of them won the wwe championship? Jeff hardy held a title for 70 days out of 8 years and he is your only example. In fact if we push it to 2003 there is zero on both sides. If the criteria has almost no examples how can it be the best way to judge what is happening? Answer, it can't.
I like how you conveniently ignore that a 29-year-old Joe was champion for the first 4 months after beer money formed. I like how you weigh a 2 month Foley reign age equal to a 7 month run by styles. I guess you have to cheat the numbers or you would have had to call yourself a tard. Honestly, I think age is a dumb way to measure the wrestlers anyway. For instance, wow Angle is 40 he must suck, NOT. It is what can they still bring. If you still got it you still got it. Since beer money formed 24 months ago 13 months of someone less than 40 with belt, 11 months of someone over 40 with the belt. Does not sound like dominated to me. The only one that could not perform enough in the ring was Foley and that was all of two months, maybe sting should have had a slightly shorter run. Bottom line dominance by old 40+ wastes of space is a myth.
What is the difference between most entertaining and proper? Do you really sit down and watch a tag-match and say this team entertained me more but they are not almost related or something like that so I will choose this other team as better? Makes no sense.
In your own words TNA has a more captivating division and the most entertaining team. When are you going to quit pretending this does not make it better?
Well no shit, half of WWE's division is less than a month old. Your point for the WWE having a shit division appears to be that they have tag teams who have had more matches than other tag teams? Lets see how many matches teams have had this year:
Tag matches in 2010:
Hart Dynasty - 21
Usos - 1
Dudebusters - 8
Archer/Hawkins - 4
ShowMiz/JeriShow- 16
MVP/Mark Henry - 3
John Morrison/R-Truth - 9
D-Generation X - 6
Cryme Tyme - 6
Punk/Gallows - 7
Total - 78
Every single one of those teams shared something, be it copious backstage segments, ring attire, entrance music, there's no denying these are proper teams. You could potentially thrown in Khali/Hardy's matches too.
Dudleys - 15
Beer Money - 14
Inc Ink - 5
MCMG - 8
Generation Me - 5
Various Band incarnations - 9
Morgan/Hernandez - 6
Nasty Boys - 5
Total - 67
Now, on face value, TNA haven't done too bad, but I've included a hell of a lot of 8 man tags and multiple men matches in there, which probably shouldn't count. That's not the point I'm trying to emphasise though. Look at the numbers. WWE's dominant teams this year, Hart Dynasty and ShowMiz have had more matches than all of TNA's division. The only other teams that have been active all year - Morrison/R-Truth and the Dudebusters have each had more than the Band & MCMG respectively. The only place that TNA has done better than WWE is that their one feud teams - e.g. NAsty Boys - have more fights than the WWE's, e.g. Hardy/Khali, MVP/Henry. Seriously, those figures don't lie, MCMG, the team that everyone on the TNA bandwagon bums have had less matches than R-Truth and John Morrison.
Not very hard, that's why the WWE did it this week.
But that's the point isn't it? They haven't put a spotlight on anyone, they've put 4 teams together, giving zero of them a chance to develop in the fans eyes. Every single one of those teams listed in the WWE list have had a meaningful feud this year, the TNA tag division consists of this. "I want a tag shot", fatal-4-way tag match, Dudleys win, shout next week on Impact, lose on PPV.
But it's indicative of a trend though. Sure, Hardy is the only person in recent memory to have got all the way to the top, but people like Miz and Ted DiBiase are examples of what tag teams can produce in WWE. Who hae TNA got that their tag division has produced? Hernandez, who looks like he's going back to a tag team.
Do you understand what "crowned since" means? Obviously, if Joe was champion when they were singles wrestlers, they still had the potential to be the next champion. But fine, we'll include him if you want. Average age - 38
Oh, it's a weighted average you want is it? 38 years old. Take Samoa Joe out, as you should for the reasons expressed earlier, it's still 40. Either way, one TNA developed star has won the TNA title since Beer Money formed, and that is fairly indicative of their behaviour. TNA don't have a normal midcard, so the tag division is the only place they can build heavyweight stars, and the division has completely failed to do it.
My mistake, I meant to say proper team division. What WWE have is a division that evolves and has developed the stars of tomorrow, in the same way it always has. TNA is a stagnant division, where the same teams face each other in the same matches month in, month out, with the odd interjection by a Matt Morgan team put together so they can split up again.
I said they probably have the best team, and it is slightly more captivating at present, because two of its teams are brand new. 3 months ago, the reverse would be true. The WWE's division isn't perfect, but it does what a tag division is supposed to do - break up proceedings, make new stars, give people who haven't got a spot on the card something to do. The TNA division does the second of those, but neither of the other two, which its why it is a poor tag division. The question isn't "which tag division has the best team in wrestling today", its which is the best division, which means which is serving its purpose the best, which, is obviously WWE.
Dudebuster420
Occasional Pre-Show
Agreed, I was just saying still, it's not like they are some big deal tag team that changes the balance of power for TNA.
Again Agreed. I mean, I like the name, that's pretty witty Ink Inc. It's just not what trips my trigger as a personal preference and I think a lot of people share that same feeling.
That's putting quite a spin on what I was saying. How do you think they would fare against a thrown together team like Cena and Batista who did hold the tag titles for a time? They'd be eaten alive. How about any team in TNA against that thrown together team? Eaten Alive. How well do you think a team like Beer Money Inc. would draw in WWE? Odds are, not very well. WWE wouldn't use them as a tag team anyways because they are much better singles stars, so as I said THEY have no real value as a tag team to anyone else. Me saying that has nothing to do with any other team than them, who I was speaking about directly, their situation has no bearing on any of the teams in WWE.
Also, I never said hyping a team is bad, but in TNA they OVERHYPE EVERYTHING including them. Now, that's not their fault, but they pay for it because they can't deliver on the overzealous proclamations of the company they work for, that's what's wrong with it. When you go that route you go from backing them up and trying to give them credibility to taking away their credibility when you embellish their ability that far.
Understandable, I was once in that same boat. Then, when just started paying attention to what they do in the ring I was able to get past that and now they are one of my favorite tag teams in the business.
Potential for what? What could Jesse Neal amount to? Not to be a dick but I highly doubt he evolves into anything, let alone something. Is it better to just be a legit team without a real 'Gimmick or to be a team who isn't really good, and has a stupid gimmick? Hart Dynasty aren't brothers, neither were Miz and Morrison, Jerishow, Showmiz, Rated RKO, Cena-Batista, Cena-Michaels, DX, Hawkins and Ryder, London and Kendrick, E&C, on and on. The only brothers currently are The Uso's. Generally the tag teams in WWE's gimmick is that they have a shared interest and it has something to do with their personalities rather than the way they look.
But to show which tag division is better the histories of those divisions must be looked at as well as their current situations. People often times don't give WWE the credit they deserve for consistently keeping good tag teams in the company. What I did was show that not only have they had a good tag division, but that they still do in showing the actual weakness of the TNA tag team division.
That's a pretty valid point of view from a fans perspective, I get what you mean. The thing is though, you can't just hold talent in a tag team when they would be better used in singles. Most tag teams have never had great longevity anyways. As Tastycles said, and I said earlier: The tag team division is a developmental stage, a proving ground. They aren't meant to stick together for ever. I do share your distress though on wanting some teams to at least be more established before they are split.
Yeah dude, this business is so crazy half the time there's no telling why they make some of the ******ed decisions they do. Point Conceded.
Well, for comedic satire purposes of course I exaggerate a bit, but my point was still valid. A lot of the TNA fanbase has responded with adoration to the teaming up of Anderson and Hardy, and often times when WWE does it there is no adoration, only criticism. There is a double standard as far as what the fans condone and do not condone from the two companies.
The tag division isn't bigger than the singles competition though or the company. The intention is to tie those titles into everything else to keep the division alive, not tie everything to the division to keep the company alive. It's just not their top priority. And, Honestly Jerishow DID make me excited to watch some tag team wrestling because there was now BETTER superstars holding the titles, elevating the level of competition and thus enriching the division.
Well, take Matt Morgan and Hernandez for example, what purpose did putting them together serve other than making another tag team? None. The problem is that it's illogical and makes no sense with anything else going on. Everything has to be apart of one big machine, not a bunch of independent appendages doing whatever they feel like. Everything needs to tie in together to make one comprehensive body. I'd Think you'd want those tag teams to be involved in actual storylines as well with the teams they are feuding with, rather than the whole division being in one big feud or something.
Boring in the way that they have been used in tag team competition, now that they are in singles both are looking a lot more interesting. If we followed the TNA formula they'd still be in that boring tag team because We need to give them longevity.
That was just an exaggerated point. Still he is anything but bland where it counts, in the ring.
Boring outside of the ring? Dirt Sheet Dirt Sheet Dirt Sheet, Great Promos Great Promos Great Promos. That's my answer for that. Really, this comes down to a difference of opinion and preference, You say TomAto I say Tomato.
As long as you understand that they are one of the best tag teams in recent history and revived a dead tag team division, that's all that matters since they were a WWE team. Keep in mind though that before that, it was Kendrick and London feuding with M-N-M and while they didn't quite get the response that maybe they deserved and the division suffered as a result, those too were good teams. I say that because you insinuate that the only reason Miz and Morrison were a success was because Good tag teams were so rare Not the case, they just weren't embraced as much with everything else going on at the time. I would have to say in response that the reason people started paying more attention to the tag teams was because the singles competition was beginning to lack or at least get boring to a lot of people and here with Miz and Morrison was something fresh, original, and entertaining. The jokes, the dates, the matches, all of it was great. If you remember it as less, perhaps your interests are vested elsewhere.
Take a look again though, the jokes, the dates, the matches all had something to do with developing the characters of Miz and Morrison, and that all tied into a bigger storyline having to do with The Colons. Adding the Bella Twins in the mix with the vaine and superficial characters they played put something between them and the Colons so they had a legitimate feud over something. It wasn't just two tag teams going at each other because they are tag teams, everything had a purpose.
Overshadowed? That all depends on what you found more entertaining, what show you invested the most into. Quick! Without looking it up on Wikipedia, tell me what Beer Money Inc. was doing while Miz and Morrison were feuding with the Colons. You probably can't, so who overshadowed who? I'm sure you'll respond with an exact description of what they were doing after you look it up so don't bother, my point is clear.
Yeah, Miz went on to hold the tag titles again, and the U.S. Title, while Morrison went on to have a great I.C. Run and a momentary push in the main event scene, even taking part in the SmackDown! Elimination Chamber and looking really good in it, almost pinning both Undertaker and Jericho. What a shitty decision huh? I guess they should have stayed in the tag division and have no singles impact like Beer Money, maybe then you would consider them successful. Miz should have never went on to be the singles prodigy he has become, and Morrison should have just called it quits, even though they impacted the tag divisions seperately again, and even had an amazing feud shortly after their split.
No, you assumed wrong. It wasn't necessary to my points after other people covered the WWE teams so well, it would have been redundant to repeat the same things as I've had to do to explain why I didn't even mention the current teams.
Difference of opinion. I think the WWE using the tag division as a breeding ground for singles stars makes it more credible. If you have the some of the best singles stars coming from there, than how good must your tag division be? Really Good. On the contrary, if you don't have enough confidence in your tag team wrestlers to let them run singles, than how bad must they be, and how bad must your division be? Pretty Bad.
shattered dreams
Hexagonal Hedonist
Why do you continue to pretend it is fair to compare the amount of matches TNA has in two hours a week to what the wwe does with at least twice as much time? You continue to show that TNA almost matches or even exceeds WWE in spite of having significantly less time. Thus, it is obvious TNA dedicates a greater part of their product to tag-team wrestling.
So when wwe has their teams wrestle eachother it is putting the spotlight on each one. When TNA does it, they are taking away from one another? Makes about as much sense as claiming a team had a meaningful feud with one total tag match for the whole year while no one in TNA has. TNA did not put 4 teams together. They had a tournament, the younger teams went over the older disbanding teams in the first round and now beer money or MCMG will be champs after PPV. Anyone who is familiar with the product knows that 3D was absolutely pivotal in making beer money what they are.
A one person trend? That is a new one to me. If the vast majority of the guys at the top in wwe were not grown from tag-teams, why is that the point of the division again?
So TNA probably has the best team, meaning most talented I would assume, that works in a more captivating environment, yet they are unlikely to be the stars of tomorrow because why? Just because they are in TNA? That is a stupid reason and a stupid argument for your case. Why is an inferoir talent, in a more boring atmosphere, showcased for a lesser proportion of the product, guaranteed to find greater success? By this logic WWE can choose whatever team they want to showcase, in spite of talent etc and you believe they will be better. Funny because this is basically what wwe does and you do claim it is better, albeit in ways that show the logical inconsistency of such a notion.
You dance around so much you often confuse yourself. For instance here you mistakenly say the only thing TNA does with their division is create stars. I especially enjoy the part where you claim beer money will never be stars because neither have won the big title yet even though a whopping zero people have done this in wwe either from the tag scene during this time. You also say the division is stale with the same feuds over and over yet turn around and say it is more captivating because of the new teams. Which is it? WWE has new teams as well. To me this says you think TNA's new teams are more interesting than WWE's. Yet again somehow you claim these better, more interesting teams make a worse division. Just admit you want the wwe to be better so you are making a convoluted case drawing on anything except what actually matters here. When wwe moves on so quickly they erase all the credible teams from the tag scene, so there is no one to put the future over. Not to mention the lack of strong team depth makes the division look weak.
Sigh, you don't get it do you? If you have your teams having 5 matches in six months, you aren't making a productive division. It's true that TNA's teams have had more matches pro rata, but the vast majority of those matches have been throw away 8 man tags etc.
Over half of the tag matches counted in the previous post were things like 4 way tag matches and 8 man tag matches. That's not building, that's throwing people together for no reason whatsoever. The Usos have had one match, but it came with a month's worth of build up. Only the Dudleys have had more than one meaningful tag feud this year in TNA, that's piss poor.
Disbanding? The Dudleys? How naive are you? Anyway, yes two teams have got to the final, but they're the two teams that have fought each other a billion times, and the two teams who should be prominent midcarders in TNA right now.
Of WWE's current main eventers, Edge, and arguably Triple H made their names in tag teams. Of their recently departed main eventers, you can add Jeff Hardy, Shawn Michaels and JBL to that list. Batista was brought to the fore teaming with Flair, upper midcarders like Christian, John Morrison, Ted DiBiase & The Miz also cut their teeth in the tag in the tag division. Not one of TNA's main eventers did, except for Hardy, though recently departed Scott Steiner amade his name in a tag division 20 years ago. So, I'll give them that. Of their upper midcarders, only Hernandez made his name there. The WWE tag division may not be the conveyor belt to the main event it once was, but the trend is that it produces singles stars.
Because TNA don't split their teams until it is too late. Of TNA's tag team champions in the last three years - One of the band was released, it remains to be seen what will become of Brutus Magnus, Booker T and Scott Steiner were released, Beer Money are still together, Consequences Creed was released, Kaz disappeared for a year and Eric Young became a whipping boy, Hernandez became a midcarder that keeps heading back to the division, Ron Killings and Adam Jones were released, Samoa Joe is a singles wrestler, and Sting and Angle were never really a team. Literally one moderate success story there.
In comparision, the WWE - Big Show has had world title shots, Michaels retired, Jericho had world title shots, but we'll ignore those, as they were established. Carlito got released, Hawkins and Ryder were repackaged, one is a tag teamer, the other a midcarder, Morrison and Miz both became midcarders, MVP and Hardy was more of an angle, Deuce n Domino were released, Rhodes and DiBiase both got mini pushes. Well, you know it's not perfect, but there are at least 4 people who have ended up much the better after a split. 4 is more than 1.
Because WWE know how to use the division. WWE could have kept the Edge and Christian together until the end of time, and they'd be far superior to any TNA team, yet they split them for the greater good of the company. Look more recently and see similar thing in Miz and Morrison.
The vast majority of TNA's teams are shite, don't get ahead of yourself. However, where WWE will split a team, which is one entity, to get two popular singles wrestlers, which is two. The WWE's tag division at this precise instance in time is in a state of flux, three months ago it was much better, and I don't doubt it'll be better again in a few months. The point is, is right now Beer Money is probably better than the Harts. But where the Harts will probably end up in the IC division by this time next year, Beer Money will still be together, having turned face about ten times in the mean time. TNA's tag division is totally rooted in the present, which is not the purpose of a tag division.
There not big stars because they've never had a singles feud of note. They should have at least wrestled for the main title. And also, shit the bed, I wrote two instead of three.
Poor syntax, I'm afraid, I meant the WWE had two new teams, so TNA's division was more captivating right now.
Nope, just missed out a word.
There's nobody to put the future over? Are you fucking ******ed. The Hart Dynasty won the titles, and everyone had a hernia. The WWE know how to inject star power to boost the division when it's neeed, TNA do not. Beating Beer Money won't get anyone over, because everyone has already beaten them.
I do not want WWE to be better, why would I? I don't care which has the better division, and I wish both were better than they are, but they aren't. People are desperate to see TNA be competitive, and they think tag wrestling is somewhere that is true, but if you look at the bigger picture, they really, really aren't.
That was probably one of the better debates I've been involved with on here, since we seem to agree to disagree on a lot of points I'll trim the fat
I don't think that is fair --- you are saying that a tag team of two mid card guys would not fare well against a tag team of two thrown together main event guys? Of course they wouldn't! Cena and Batista would not be a fair team since they are at the 'top of the mountain' in WWE (well not Batista anymore obviously). Had you said any tag team in WWE's history that had consisted of two mid-card guys, such as MVP and Matt Hardy when they were a tag team, then yes I believe Beer Money would have been good competition for them, and they would have done well in WWE.
I don't think the over-hyping is THAT much of an issue. It doesn't make me think anything less of the tag teams, if anything it just makes me roll my eyes once in a while.
I have no idea what Jesse could amount to. He hasn't wrestled a whole lot of matches and so I don't know if we have seen all of his abilites or if he is capable of getting better. What I have been trying to say about him this entire time is that I think he is very green and is capable of improving his game in the near future and that I think it is unfair that people are already declaring him a lost cause already.
I mentioned the brother thing because you had been talking about Primo having a slight character based on being related to Carlito, I wasn't implying that every tag team in WWE is based on being brothers lol. And by gimmicks, I agree they don't have to look the same, and I do agree that they can have a gimmick just by having matching personalities... but when it's more like a matching lack-of personality than a matching personality that makes the tag teams, that's when I get bored of them. Then again I will admit that I'm probably biased... I prefer flashy and/or obnoxious gimmicks in place of the "serious heel" gimmicks that people like Orton, Cody, Ted, Jericho, Big Show, etc. had/still have
I still think you focused too much on past WWE tag teams but we obviously aren't getting anywhere with this.
True. I think it's fine if they have a few teams that serve only to introduce singles wrestlers - in which case they should not be held back in the tag division - just as long as there is a mix of permanent tag teams in there as well.
Agreed, but please don't call me dude, I'm a female
There were a LOT of Rated RKO fans. Still are.
I can't argue with you on Jerishow just because that team didn't appeal to me but we all don't like the same wrestlers, so alright, I'll drop that.
However I do think there should be tag-team exclusive feuds. Having every feud based on nothing more than wanting the title shot is boring in any division, the tag included. You mentioned in one of your earlier posts, the Colons vs Miz and Morrison. I wasn't a huge fan of that feud, but it's an example of what I'm talking about when I say there should be tag teams feuds that are not connected to the singles division. The feuds don't have to be one of the top features of the show or anything; it would just be nice to have actual tag team feuds more often. (which WWE might actually be doing now, I haven't watched for a while)
I'll agree with you - the Morgan and Hernandez team SUCKED. It sucked because both Matt Morgan and Hernandez were over as hell, then they just got thrown together in a tag team, and all of their momentum died. Now that I understand what you meant, I agree with you. But then again WWE did the same thing with MVP and Mark Henry, a team which I hated. Both were pretty over when they were first drafted to RAW (Henry was getting pretty big pops after attacking Orton if I remember correctly) and then they decided to pair them up, and their momentum died.
Yes, so while they may be interesting now, the tag team sucked. Which shows how WWE does not care about tag teams being boring, as long as the singles wrestlers that break out from the team end up being slightly interesting. Which means that WWE may be better than TNA in regards to how they use wrestlers after they break up a tag team, but TNA is better than WWE at making the tag team itself less boring.
And again, I have no problem with using the tag division to make singles stars and give them experience... but man, did those two guys make the tag division such a chore to watch.
I was talking about London and Kendrick, not Miz and Morrison. I watched every single episode of the dirt sheet. I almost died laughing from the one where they were in the Irish bar making fun of Finlay and Hornswoggle.
I thought the promos that Miz and Morrison did online with the Dirt Sheet were hilarious but it came off really lame on TV.It did come off well sometimes though (when they were messing wround with the ring bell and mocking Festus for example, which was funny shit), I admit that, and I do realize that they revived the completely dead division. I'm just saying that the WWE tag division was so bad at the time that it really had nowhere to go but upwards.
You're right, it was an actual feud and while I wasn't able to get interested it, at least they were feuding over something other than titles, which I can appreciate.
Okay, that's not fair and you know it. Here's one for you: Quick! tell me what Miz and Morrison were doing while Beer Money was winning their second tag team championship. Don't pretend you actually know off the top of your head. And that doesn't mean Miz and Morrison overshadowed Beer Money, it means I don't remember the exact months that things took place (I'm lucky if I can get years right)
So yeah I guess this is just another "agree to disagree" thing. I thought Beer Money was much more exciting, if you didn't that's cool, it's not like I'm going to be able to change your mind.
You keep saying that what happens to wrestlers after they leave the tag division is what determines whether the tag division is successful. I keep saying that the credibility of the tag teams and the excitement / gimmicks / whatever of the current tag teams are what makes the division succesful. I don't think that Miz going on to win the US title makes the WWE tag division any more credible because he happened to be in a tag team once. I don't think HBK being a legend now makes WWE's current tag division superior to TNA's, just because HBK was in a tag team once. I don't think we are going to agree on this, but if you at least understand what I'm saying then it's all good.
This is the part I disagree with 100% and that bothers me. Two people being in a tag team for an extended amount of time does not mean that they can't be good singles wrestlers. The tag division in any promotion is now looked at like it's FCW, and like all people in tag teams are waiting to be called up to the midcard. It's not.
If some people are great singles stars and happened to be in tag teams before, that does not mean your CURRENT tag division is automatically good. Especially when you use somebody like HBK and try to say that he broke out from the Rockers like 9788679 years ago (gross exaggeration, I know) which means the current WWE tag division is superior. Seriously, that tag team isn't even relevant.
You can be in an extremely successful tag team that gets broken up, then you get shitty booking and don't become a big star. Once your tag team breaks up you rely on the booking of the singles division, you can't ride on the momentum that your tag team had forever and expect that to make you a big singles star.
So why do people insist that WWE's current tag division can ride on the momentum that a singles guy has and say "well, he was in a WWE tag team once, so WWE must have a better tag division." ???
I don't think that is fair --- you are saying that a tag team of two mid card guys would not fare well against a tag team of two thrown together main event guys? Of course they wouldn't! Cena and Batista would not be a fair team since they are at the 'top of the mountain' in WWE (well not Batista anymore obviously). Had you said any tag team in WWE's history that had consisted of two mid-card guys, such as MVP and Matt Hardy when they were a tag team, then yes I believe Beer Money would have been good competition for them, and they would have done well in WWE.
I don't think the over-hyping is THAT much of an issue. It doesn't make me think anything less of the tag teams, if anything it just makes me roll my eyes once in a while.
I have no idea what Jesse could amount to. He hasn't wrestled a whole lot of matches and so I don't know if we have seen all of his abilites or if he is capable of getting better. What I have been trying to say about him this entire time is that I think he is very green and is capable of improving his game in the near future and that I think it is unfair that people are already declaring him a lost cause already.
I mentioned the brother thing because you had been talking about Primo having a slight character based on being related to Carlito, I wasn't implying that every tag team in WWE is based on being brothers lol. And by gimmicks, I agree they don't have to look the same, and I do agree that they can have a gimmick just by having matching personalities... but when it's more like a matching lack-of personality than a matching personality that makes the tag teams, that's when I get bored of them. Then again I will admit that I'm probably biased... I prefer flashy and/or obnoxious gimmicks in place of the "serious heel" gimmicks that people like Orton, Cody, Ted, Jericho, Big Show, etc. had/still have
I still think you focused too much on past WWE tag teams but we obviously aren't getting anywhere with this.
True. I think it's fine if they have a few teams that serve only to introduce singles wrestlers - in which case they should not be held back in the tag division - just as long as there is a mix of permanent tag teams in there as well.
Agreed, but please don't call me dude, I'm a female
There were a LOT of Rated RKO fans. Still are.
I can't argue with you on Jerishow just because that team didn't appeal to me but we all don't like the same wrestlers, so alright, I'll drop that.
However I do think there should be tag-team exclusive feuds. Having every feud based on nothing more than wanting the title shot is boring in any division, the tag included. You mentioned in one of your earlier posts, the Colons vs Miz and Morrison. I wasn't a huge fan of that feud, but it's an example of what I'm talking about when I say there should be tag teams feuds that are not connected to the singles division. The feuds don't have to be one of the top features of the show or anything; it would just be nice to have actual tag team feuds more often. (which WWE might actually be doing now, I haven't watched for a while)
I'll agree with you - the Morgan and Hernandez team SUCKED. It sucked because both Matt Morgan and Hernandez were over as hell, then they just got thrown together in a tag team, and all of their momentum died. Now that I understand what you meant, I agree with you. But then again WWE did the same thing with MVP and Mark Henry, a team which I hated. Both were pretty over when they were first drafted to RAW (Henry was getting pretty big pops after attacking Orton if I remember correctly) and then they decided to pair them up, and their momentum died.
Yes, so while they may be interesting now, the tag team sucked. Which shows how WWE does not care about tag teams being boring, as long as the singles wrestlers that break out from the team end up being slightly interesting. Which means that WWE may be better than TNA in regards to how they use wrestlers after they break up a tag team, but TNA is better than WWE at making the tag team itself less boring.
And again, I have no problem with using the tag division to make singles stars and give them experience... but man, did those two guys make the tag division such a chore to watch.
I was talking about London and Kendrick, not Miz and Morrison. I watched every single episode of the dirt sheet. I almost died laughing from the one where they were in the Irish bar making fun of Finlay and Hornswoggle.
I thought the promos that Miz and Morrison did online with the Dirt Sheet were hilarious but it came off really lame on TV.It did come off well sometimes though (when they were messing wround with the ring bell and mocking Festus for example, which was funny shit), I admit that, and I do realize that they revived the completely dead division. I'm just saying that the WWE tag division was so bad at the time that it really had nowhere to go but upwards.
You're right, it was an actual feud and while I wasn't able to get interested it, at least they were feuding over something other than titles, which I can appreciate.
Okay, that's not fair and you know it. Here's one for you: Quick! tell me what Miz and Morrison were doing while Beer Money was winning their second tag team championship. Don't pretend you actually know off the top of your head. And that doesn't mean Miz and Morrison overshadowed Beer Money, it means I don't remember the exact months that things took place (I'm lucky if I can get years right)
So yeah I guess this is just another "agree to disagree" thing. I thought Beer Money was much more exciting, if you didn't that's cool, it's not like I'm going to be able to change your mind.
You keep saying that what happens to wrestlers after they leave the tag division is what determines whether the tag division is successful. I keep saying that the credibility of the tag teams and the excitement / gimmicks / whatever of the current tag teams are what makes the division succesful. I don't think that Miz going on to win the US title makes the WWE tag division any more credible because he happened to be in a tag team once. I don't think HBK being a legend now makes WWE's current tag division superior to TNA's, just because HBK was in a tag team once. I don't think we are going to agree on this, but if you at least understand what I'm saying then it's all good.
This is the part I disagree with 100% and that bothers me. Two people being in a tag team for an extended amount of time does not mean that they can't be good singles wrestlers. The tag division in any promotion is now looked at like it's FCW, and like all people in tag teams are waiting to be called up to the midcard. It's not.
If some people are great singles stars and happened to be in tag teams before, that does not mean your CURRENT tag division is automatically good. Especially when you use somebody like HBK and try to say that he broke out from the Rockers like 9788679 years ago (gross exaggeration, I know) which means the current WWE tag division is superior. Seriously, that tag team isn't even relevant.
You can be in an extremely successful tag team that gets broken up, then you get shitty booking and don't become a big star. Once your tag team breaks up you rely on the booking of the singles division, you can't ride on the momentum that your tag team had forever and expect that to make you a big singles star.
So why do people insist that WWE's current tag division can ride on the momentum that a singles guy has and say "well, he was in a WWE tag team once, so WWE must have a better tag division." ???