What is the difference between an old WWE-star and WWE legend Hall of Fame Worthy?
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TheICChampion
The hardcore casual fan
The difference of an old-time star vs. an all-time legend would be Savio Vega up against someone like The Rock or The Undertaker. BTW I swear if they ever induct Savio then WWE officially loses all credibility with me when it comes to who gets into the HoF. But as far as making the cut goes they poll the fans on everything else so why not on this as well? Have a list of say 15 superstars of the past and have fans vote and the top 7 or 8 go in with the guy who gets the most votes as the headliner. Just don't let fans know the results until it's time to start revealing the class.
That N Word
Actively evolving
I do think the term "legend" get's tossed around too much these day's. I'd say and old time star would be someone who has been around for along time but didn't accomplish much or hasn't impacted their company or another superstars career.
Old Time Stars vs. All-Time legend exapmles
______________________________________
X-Pac - Hulk Hogan
Rikishi - John Cena
Koko B. Ware - The Undertaker
CM Punk (he will be one day) - Stone Cold
RVD (IMO, he really isn't except for in ECW) - The Rock
Matt Hardy (other than tag team) - Ric Flair
The thing is the beauty of the business is not everyone can be legends. You have to be one of the very best to be a legend IMO. However,there are cases where it isn't totally wrong to call someone a legend because they arguably are. Names that fit that criteria would be names such as Randy Orton,Owen Hart,Chris Beniot,Chris Jericho,Jeff Hardy,Batista,Bill Goldberg (WWE wise), Brock Lesnar among others. But to call someone like Sean Waltman,Matt Hardy(singles wise), Devon (single career wise),or CM punk one is a bit absurd. CM Punk will be a legend in the future but not now.
Old Time Stars vs. All-Time legend exapmles
______________________________________
X-Pac - Hulk Hogan
Rikishi - John Cena
Koko B. Ware - The Undertaker
CM Punk (he will be one day) - Stone Cold
RVD (IMO, he really isn't except for in ECW) - The Rock
Matt Hardy (other than tag team) - Ric Flair
The thing is the beauty of the business is not everyone can be legends. You have to be one of the very best to be a legend IMO. However,there are cases where it isn't totally wrong to call someone a legend because they arguably are. Names that fit that criteria would be names such as Randy Orton,Owen Hart,Chris Beniot,Chris Jericho,Jeff Hardy,Batista,Bill Goldberg (WWE wise), Brock Lesnar among others. But to call someone like Sean Waltman,Matt Hardy(singles wise), Devon (single career wise),or CM punk one is a bit absurd. CM Punk will be a legend in the future but not now.
Stars and Legends differ depending on the impression they left on the fans. How important were they to the product? Did people pay to see them in their prime? Would people pay to see them in the Hall of Fame?
Marc Mero would be considered a star. He had a somewhat high profile with WCW, and came into WWE as a somewhat big name, even winning the Intercontinental Championship. But after that, he didn't really do much, and there's not much fans remember about him. Same can be said for Ken Shamrock. Tag Champ, IC Champ, and King of the Ring. But can anyone name one memorable Ken Shamrock match or moment? Did Shamrock really have anything where a large portion of the audience will say "Remember when..." or "He really impacted the business when..."
Contrast that with Rikishi. Almost 15 years in the company. IC title, Tag Titles. And people remember stuff about him such as the stink face or the dancing. Or moments like his splash from the cage, or being thrown off the cell. Rikishi is a name that will get people to feel nostalgic, and will probably get a few people to buy tickets to the HOF (if Savage wasn't enough).
Want a more obvious example of a legend? Triple H. 13 World Title reigns Grand Slam Champion, and countless classic moments and matches. Love him or hate him, people will remember Triple H. That is a legend. That is a Hall of Famer.
If someone made a significant contribution to the business, and, more importantly, if their induction will make money for the WWE, then they will go in to the HOF. That's it.
Marc Mero would be considered a star. He had a somewhat high profile with WCW, and came into WWE as a somewhat big name, even winning the Intercontinental Championship. But after that, he didn't really do much, and there's not much fans remember about him. Same can be said for Ken Shamrock. Tag Champ, IC Champ, and King of the Ring. But can anyone name one memorable Ken Shamrock match or moment? Did Shamrock really have anything where a large portion of the audience will say "Remember when..." or "He really impacted the business when..."
Contrast that with Rikishi. Almost 15 years in the company. IC title, Tag Titles. And people remember stuff about him such as the stink face or the dancing. Or moments like his splash from the cage, or being thrown off the cell. Rikishi is a name that will get people to feel nostalgic, and will probably get a few people to buy tickets to the HOF (if Savage wasn't enough).
Want a more obvious example of a legend? Triple H. 13 World Title reigns Grand Slam Champion, and countless classic moments and matches. Love him or hate him, people will remember Triple H. That is a legend. That is a Hall of Famer.
If someone made a significant contribution to the business, and, more importantly, if their induction will make money for the WWE, then they will go in to the HOF. That's it.
d_henderson1810
Mid-Card Championship Winner
Is someone like Jake Roberts a Legend? Did he impact wrestling? What did he bring to the table? He was entertaining, but is he worthy, because according to a lot of people's criteria, you have to have won titles.
The problem with impact on wrestling is that someone like Buddy Rogers, who made an impact, wouldn't be voted by most people, because most wrestling fans never saw him wrestle, so if you vote, the pioneers would miss out.
Is Ricky Steamboat a Legend? Based on his WWE performances, with one short IC title run, no WWE World Title or no WM main event, some would say no. Yet Ric Flair and SCSA have said that he was their best ever opponent, and he has been part of the greatest WM match in history.
What about "Million Dollar Man"? He won just a Tag-Team title in WWE?
What about someone like Junkyard Dog? No titles in WWE, yet he was big in the Mid-South, and a popular wrestler with audiences.
What criteria makes someone a Legend and HoF worthy? I think all the above guys should be in. But many wouldn't because they didn't do what you rate as important (titles, main eventing WM).
The problem with impact on wrestling is that someone like Buddy Rogers, who made an impact, wouldn't be voted by most people, because most wrestling fans never saw him wrestle, so if you vote, the pioneers would miss out.
Is Ricky Steamboat a Legend? Based on his WWE performances, with one short IC title run, no WWE World Title or no WM main event, some would say no. Yet Ric Flair and SCSA have said that he was their best ever opponent, and he has been part of the greatest WM match in history.
What about "Million Dollar Man"? He won just a Tag-Team title in WWE?
What about someone like Junkyard Dog? No titles in WWE, yet he was big in the Mid-South, and a popular wrestler with audiences.
What criteria makes someone a Legend and HoF worthy? I think all the above guys should be in. But many wouldn't because they didn't do what you rate as important (titles, main eventing WM).
Very good questions.
I have to say the criteria is how much impact you did on the fans and the company.
The most important thing is how they will remember you in that ring.
THTRobtaylor
Once & Future Wrestlezone Columnist
I keep hearing Koko as the kind of talent who shouldn't be in there and it's UTTER SHITE.
Koko was a good servant to wrestling and particularly the WWF, he had a big part to play in that early expansion era and remember the "Piledriver" song he sang on the album? All part of WWF expanding it's boundaries. Add to that he was screwed over BADLY in a racism situation with Vince's then #2 where he reacted and got fired... Bret details it in his book that Koko stood up for himself, was "right" but still released while Vince tried to save his buddy... Koko was soon back but like Jannetty the damage was done... so it's part "make up" for that.
So what makes Koko or a Nikolai Volkoff or a Baron Mikel Scicluna so unworthy? Is it unfamiliarity? Lack of main event or titles? Is it that they were basically jobbers? or is it just snobbery?
It comes down to this concept... Not everyone can be the main event and without the solid undercard guys then the show doesn't work. WWE have forgotten that in recent years and it's hurt them badly. Guys like Koko, Tito Santana, Greg Valentine all merit their place on talent and their careers in general but also as dedicated mid-card guys who allowed Hulkamania to run wild, the Warrior, Savage and the like to grow into main eventers by making them look strong.
Someone like Rick Martel is a classic example of this, not in the HOF yet but I defy ANY of you to say he shouldn't be... he was midcard in the WWF, even discounting the AWA title he held... he got one tag reign with Tito but he was a part of the furniture in the WWF for years... he played major roles in the careers of Jake Roberts, Shawn Michaels and Razor Ramon for instance. His personal issues with his wife's illness and I think death eventually, cut that career from what it could perhaps have been, but did he NEED to be the main event? No... cos he was a guy who MADE the main eventers the level required. He might be called a "stepping stone" and today a "jobber to the stars" but the reality is guys like Martel deserve the HOF more than many of the "bigger" names in there.
If you are going for strict criteria these would be them, bearing in mind this is a defacto WRESTLING HOF, not just the WWF.
Impact on the business as a whole - Is this a no-one jabroni or someone that even if they haven't been around for 20 years is still talked of fondly, as being great at what they did and their body of work stand up. This would be someone like Ray Stevens this year... few will bother to ever watch his stuff, but enough people know he was a player at one time. Some actually translate that impact into other areas... Jesse Ventura is a classic example, he wasn't in the WWF long enough to make much of an impact in-ring and in the AWA he was never the top draw he claims he was... but he WAS a big part of the WWF crossing over in the 80's with his Arnie movies and later the Gubernatorial period. Jesse made wrestling bigger by not being a wrestler... so he gets in just as Hogan did, and one day Rock and Brock will.
Longevity - If someone was around for a LONG time in their role then they deserve it. Kane is a lock but so are Goldust, Mark Henry and Billy Gunn... all of them have been with the WWE/F for the majority of their careers, perhaps with gaps in some cases but Dust has been there for basically 20 years... Henry debuted 19 YEARS ago... Billy Gunn was there as long as 1993, so in reality has spend at least 15 of those years in the WWE system. Even older guys like a Jim Duggan, Koko and Volkoff qualify here... Volkoff was around for 20 years by the time his final DiBiase run ended in 1995... that's in the WWF pretty much exclusively. Koko was around from 85 to around 1993 bar a year or so... remember in those days guys like Bret and Shawn had been in the WWF over 7 years before getting one world title... so longevity and loyalty is important to Vince and thus the HOF.
Legacy - As mentioned in another thread, if you have children who go on to success in the WWE then you are guaranteed a HOF place. That is what's happened with Rikishi and is also why Bob Orton and Rocky Johnson went in. Mike Rotundo will be the next on this score... all of these guys not only had kids who became wrestlers but who have either main evented or will do.
Political - Some guys get in on sheer political reasons, like Pat Patterson or why Scott and Jake went in together and (throat issue permitting) I am pretty sure DDP will go in this year. WWE have built a relationship with DDP and push his Yoga etc as it's seen as a good synergy. Jake and Scott going in together showed a "positive side" to the HOF along with Warrior's return. For the same reason some guys don't go in. A glaring omission is Demolition, part of it may be that there was bad blood between Bill Eadie and Vince for a long time over how he was "shut out" in 1990-91 and of course the most political absences of all, Bruno and now Savage... these came to an end likely because there was no real reason to continue it and doing so just fuelled gossip. Especially in Randy's case... even if the worst of the stories were true, a father 21 years on, knowing it didn't "mess his daughter up, cos she was as guilty" and knowing that not inducting the guy fuels it is always gonna come to the same decision eventually... Some people just aren't trusted... Scott wasn't for many years, Chyna is less to do with Trips' porn explaination than it is to do with the awkwardness that he once dated her, that would all come out and that they can't trust her to not "go into business for herself" during the speech about it. Someone like Tommy Billington is a glaring omission, but the impact of bringing a bitter Mancunian in a wheelchair onto the HOF stage isn't gonna work.. and he'd be uncontrollable, so sadly the Bulldogs don't go in till he dies. This also covers the celeb inductions... it's why Arnie goes in ahead of someone who has made more meaningful appearances cos the name association with WWE brings big bucks. The Rock can induct him and it will be news for the mainstream.
Being Alive - Sadly this is also a criteria... and one so many worthy contenders are falling foul of. It's not to say you will not go in posthumously, but as a rule only one a year will... and the sheer number of deserving cases like a Rick Rude, Davey Boy, Owen, Bam Bam, Bossman, Pillman mean that they're all gonna wait a long time. In some cases it'll stop it completely. Someone like Crush for example would be borderline, if Demolition went in he might get inducted but he would have been borderline as a solo if alive and out of the picture now he's dead, same for a Matt Borne or Crash Holly.
Koko was a good servant to wrestling and particularly the WWF, he had a big part to play in that early expansion era and remember the "Piledriver" song he sang on the album? All part of WWF expanding it's boundaries. Add to that he was screwed over BADLY in a racism situation with Vince's then #2 where he reacted and got fired... Bret details it in his book that Koko stood up for himself, was "right" but still released while Vince tried to save his buddy... Koko was soon back but like Jannetty the damage was done... so it's part "make up" for that.
So what makes Koko or a Nikolai Volkoff or a Baron Mikel Scicluna so unworthy? Is it unfamiliarity? Lack of main event or titles? Is it that they were basically jobbers? or is it just snobbery?
It comes down to this concept... Not everyone can be the main event and without the solid undercard guys then the show doesn't work. WWE have forgotten that in recent years and it's hurt them badly. Guys like Koko, Tito Santana, Greg Valentine all merit their place on talent and their careers in general but also as dedicated mid-card guys who allowed Hulkamania to run wild, the Warrior, Savage and the like to grow into main eventers by making them look strong.
Someone like Rick Martel is a classic example of this, not in the HOF yet but I defy ANY of you to say he shouldn't be... he was midcard in the WWF, even discounting the AWA title he held... he got one tag reign with Tito but he was a part of the furniture in the WWF for years... he played major roles in the careers of Jake Roberts, Shawn Michaels and Razor Ramon for instance. His personal issues with his wife's illness and I think death eventually, cut that career from what it could perhaps have been, but did he NEED to be the main event? No... cos he was a guy who MADE the main eventers the level required. He might be called a "stepping stone" and today a "jobber to the stars" but the reality is guys like Martel deserve the HOF more than many of the "bigger" names in there.
If you are going for strict criteria these would be them, bearing in mind this is a defacto WRESTLING HOF, not just the WWF.
Impact on the business as a whole - Is this a no-one jabroni or someone that even if they haven't been around for 20 years is still talked of fondly, as being great at what they did and their body of work stand up. This would be someone like Ray Stevens this year... few will bother to ever watch his stuff, but enough people know he was a player at one time. Some actually translate that impact into other areas... Jesse Ventura is a classic example, he wasn't in the WWF long enough to make much of an impact in-ring and in the AWA he was never the top draw he claims he was... but he WAS a big part of the WWF crossing over in the 80's with his Arnie movies and later the Gubernatorial period. Jesse made wrestling bigger by not being a wrestler... so he gets in just as Hogan did, and one day Rock and Brock will.
Longevity - If someone was around for a LONG time in their role then they deserve it. Kane is a lock but so are Goldust, Mark Henry and Billy Gunn... all of them have been with the WWE/F for the majority of their careers, perhaps with gaps in some cases but Dust has been there for basically 20 years... Henry debuted 19 YEARS ago... Billy Gunn was there as long as 1993, so in reality has spend at least 15 of those years in the WWE system. Even older guys like a Jim Duggan, Koko and Volkoff qualify here... Volkoff was around for 20 years by the time his final DiBiase run ended in 1995... that's in the WWF pretty much exclusively. Koko was around from 85 to around 1993 bar a year or so... remember in those days guys like Bret and Shawn had been in the WWF over 7 years before getting one world title... so longevity and loyalty is important to Vince and thus the HOF.
Legacy - As mentioned in another thread, if you have children who go on to success in the WWE then you are guaranteed a HOF place. That is what's happened with Rikishi and is also why Bob Orton and Rocky Johnson went in. Mike Rotundo will be the next on this score... all of these guys not only had kids who became wrestlers but who have either main evented or will do.
Political - Some guys get in on sheer political reasons, like Pat Patterson or why Scott and Jake went in together and (throat issue permitting) I am pretty sure DDP will go in this year. WWE have built a relationship with DDP and push his Yoga etc as it's seen as a good synergy. Jake and Scott going in together showed a "positive side" to the HOF along with Warrior's return. For the same reason some guys don't go in. A glaring omission is Demolition, part of it may be that there was bad blood between Bill Eadie and Vince for a long time over how he was "shut out" in 1990-91 and of course the most political absences of all, Bruno and now Savage... these came to an end likely because there was no real reason to continue it and doing so just fuelled gossip. Especially in Randy's case... even if the worst of the stories were true, a father 21 years on, knowing it didn't "mess his daughter up, cos she was as guilty" and knowing that not inducting the guy fuels it is always gonna come to the same decision eventually... Some people just aren't trusted... Scott wasn't for many years, Chyna is less to do with Trips' porn explaination than it is to do with the awkwardness that he once dated her, that would all come out and that they can't trust her to not "go into business for herself" during the speech about it. Someone like Tommy Billington is a glaring omission, but the impact of bringing a bitter Mancunian in a wheelchair onto the HOF stage isn't gonna work.. and he'd be uncontrollable, so sadly the Bulldogs don't go in till he dies. This also covers the celeb inductions... it's why Arnie goes in ahead of someone who has made more meaningful appearances cos the name association with WWE brings big bucks. The Rock can induct him and it will be news for the mainstream.
Being Alive - Sadly this is also a criteria... and one so many worthy contenders are falling foul of. It's not to say you will not go in posthumously, but as a rule only one a year will... and the sheer number of deserving cases like a Rick Rude, Davey Boy, Owen, Bam Bam, Bossman, Pillman mean that they're all gonna wait a long time. In some cases it'll stop it completely. Someone like Crush for example would be borderline, if Demolition went in he might get inducted but he would have been borderline as a solo if alive and out of the picture now he's dead, same for a Matt Borne or Crash Holly.
FromGlasgow
Championship Contender
It should really be your own opinion who you feel is great or not and who you feel should be in the hall of fame but I guess at the end of the day that is up to Vince Mcmahon.
I have my own opinion like I think both the British Bulldogs should have went in long ago as well as the Fabulous Freebirds and as much as I like Donald Trump and Drew Carey I think its a joke their in the hall of fame but not the bulldogs and freebirds even if it is in a celebrity section but maybe some people do think Trump and Carey deserve it more for example so to each their own.
I have my own opinion like I think both the British Bulldogs should have went in long ago as well as the Fabulous Freebirds and as much as I like Donald Trump and Drew Carey I think its a joke their in the hall of fame but not the bulldogs and freebirds even if it is in a celebrity section but maybe some people do think Trump and Carey deserve it more for example so to each their own.
Honestly, I think we all need to stop taking the HOF so seriously. Instead of looking at it like the MLB or NFL HOF just accept it for what it is. Another wrestling show designed to sell tickets. I'm sorry to reduce it to that but that's what it is. I've seen people suggest only one or two people getting inducted a year so only the truly elite get in. That's not a full enough show to sell tickets. There isn't any set criteria. There are no comparative stats. Maybe someone like Rikishi isn't HOF worthy but what's the harm in letting him have his moment? He was a loyal employee for many years. Let him have his literal 15 minutes of fame to thank those important to him and reflect on his career. I don't necessarily consider him a legend but I'll be interested to hear Rikishi speak.
Let's remove the words Hall of Fame from the event. Let's just call it a reunion banquet with a few guest speakers. Would you be opposed to Rikishi or Koko B. Ware being one of those speakers? To me the HOF ceremony is all about that one night. As long as I'm interested and entertained by the person speaking on stage I'm happy.
Let's remove the words Hall of Fame from the event. Let's just call it a reunion banquet with a few guest speakers. Would you be opposed to Rikishi or Koko B. Ware being one of those speakers? To me the HOF ceremony is all about that one night. As long as I'm interested and entertained by the person speaking on stage I'm happy.
Jack-Hammer
YOU WILL RESPECT MY AUTHORITAH!!!!
I agree. When it comes to the WWE Hall of Fame, we keep having the same discussions, debates and criticisms year after year. People wanted Sammartino in, he's in, they wanted Warrior in, he's in, they wanted Savage in, he's going in. The Rock will be in there someday, so will The Undertaker, Sting will probably wind up there at some point. I imagine somewhere down the line we'll see Christian, The Dudley Boyz, The Hardy Boys and even Kurt Angle as well. Mid-card staples like Ricky Steamboat, Paul Orndorff, Greg Valentine, etc. Then you have those who feel that only a very, very, very select few should be inducted and only under very specific circumstances. The HOF is designed to be part of the WrestleMania money machine, which is smart as it just brings in all that much more revenue during WrestleMania weekend.
I don't consider Rikishi a legend but, in the grand scheme of things, what's the harm? He worked as a loyal employee in WWE for many years, he's part of a legendary wrestling family, namely the Anoa'i, his twin sons are the reigning tag team champions & will be the ones inducting him so I see no big deal with him getting some degree of recognition. I was never particularly a fan of the guy but, when it's all said & done, Rikishi still came in, made his mark and the rest is history. Most people aren't going to have careers distinguished enough to have their likenesses carved into the Mount Rushmore of professional wrestling, but that doesn't mean they haven't contributed in their own way.
whoopin' ass
Championship Contender
Hall of fame is supposed to be meant for something special. It could be an exceptional career, work done outside the business that helped the business grow, etc. Longevity, unless it is extreme, is not a good enough reason to get put in the hall of fame. No disrespect to Rikishi but name one memorable thing he did? and the dancing doesn't count. And there lies your problem with the wwe hall of fame - they have put in so many people who were just doing their job that there is no criteria anymore. He had a good career but nothing he did was exceptional. That's why I wasn't upset that Savage wasn't in there - it doesn't mean anything anymore.
FreezeIzGAWD
Pre-Show Stalwart
I actually agree. I also don't think a lot of you guys are old enough to respect the difference between the way wrestling was and is today. You guys want ALL your favorites to get over and win the world title or you cry. Well back in the day that just didn't happen. A title change was HUGE! Oh and they didn't happen ever week either. So because of that a lot of guys put butts in seats but didn't get much hardware. That did not make their job any less important. If you guys aren't old enough to have seen HillbillyJim and JYD back in the day then you wouldn't understand that although by today's standards their careers STUNK at that time they put over CREDIBILITY for stars who were either rising or title contenders.
A guy brought up Martel who was known for being a hard worker in the ring and professional. This was needed. As far as Steamboat. You do realize that before Nash and Bret Hart that the only person to have held the WWE IC, NWA tag team, US and World title was Steamboat. He was just the WWE title away from having held all four Major title which at that time was CRAZY!!!!
You can't really judge the HOF because wrestlers from different eras have different roles.
It's like truly asking would LBJ have been a beast in 1960.
It's a different time with different rules
The HOF is a bit of fun but it is truly a great night. Last years event on the Network was a great idea. It just gives some of these wrestlers some closure or that one last moment.
Rikishi might not be one of the all time greats but he had a decent career. Honestly, he might be just below the HOF level but for the sake of the night, I reckon it is worth it. Plus, they will start to run out of names and you may as well induct him now.
It's interesting to see how some of the current names do in terms of the HOF. Some people want to debate if the likes of Kane should be in which is ridiculous. Open that up to guys like Ziggler, Sheamus, even Kofi Kingston and it becomes interesting. Not Hall of Famers in the traditional sense but guys who have entertained and accomplished a decent amount.
Win some belts. Entertain fans. Have a long career. It might not be the greatest criteria but it's enough in my eyes, especially given the amount of people who try this. When you really think about it; just by getting to WWE Rikishi is in a special group.
Rikishi might not be one of the all time greats but he had a decent career. Honestly, he might be just below the HOF level but for the sake of the night, I reckon it is worth it. Plus, they will start to run out of names and you may as well induct him now.
It's interesting to see how some of the current names do in terms of the HOF. Some people want to debate if the likes of Kane should be in which is ridiculous. Open that up to guys like Ziggler, Sheamus, even Kofi Kingston and it becomes interesting. Not Hall of Famers in the traditional sense but guys who have entertained and accomplished a decent amount.
Win some belts. Entertain fans. Have a long career. It might not be the greatest criteria but it's enough in my eyes, especially given the amount of people who try this. When you really think about it; just by getting to WWE Rikishi is in a special group.
King Patrick Star
K. O. T. R. 2007 - Team Undisputed
As of right now, I think the difference between an old WWE Star and a WWE Hall of Fame Legend is based on one thing
Pay Per View appearance. Any WWE SuperStar from the past, who wrestled from 1985 onward, is an old WWE Star. Any WWE SuperStar from the past, who wrestled from 1985 onward, that made an appearance on a WWE Pay Per View is a WWE Hall Of Fame Legend. This is the only possible way to explain Koko B. Ware. It might sound wrong, but take a good look at the WWE Hall of Fame list. The WWE Hall of Famers that wrestle prior to 1985 surely would have been on a WWE Pay Per View, had WrestleMania started sooner.
Mustang Sally
Sells seashells by the seashore
In that way, it's sort of a good thing WWE put Koko B. Ware in there. It gives us a benchmark to determine how seriously to take the whole Hall of Fame thing in the first place.
After all, Koko's inclusion is (imo) so ludicrous that it calls into question the process of choosing candidates. In other words, if that guy got in, how can we keep anyone else out? Just the fact the company chooses to induct four or five people a year means the talent pool is going to get thin pretty quickly, no?
Then again, there was actually debate these past years on whether Randy Savage should be inducted. This is a question? If you're going to have a HOF, how do you not include the Macho Man?
More to the point, did Koko B. Ware accomplish more than Randy Savage in WWE? Once someone has been inducted, no one is going to care about the politics or other factors that kept him/her from getting in earlier; all we'll see is the person's name on the list of the enshrined.
Honestly, after Koko was honored, I stopped taking the time to wonder about this HOF garbage, anyway.
I'm starting my campaign early for Hall of Fame 2016......I want Katie Vick in there. If Randy Savage can get in posthumously, so can she.
d_henderson1810
Mid-Card Championship Winner
I don't get the hate for Koko B. Ware.
People loved "The Birdman" when he was around. He was hugely over, with his parrot and his dancing. If Junkyard Dog is a Hall-Of-Famer, then Koko B. Ware has had a similar career and was also as entertaining. Neither won titles in WWE, yet you have no problems with JYD being in (and he deserves to be), but then don't want Koko being in for doing the same thing. I know entertaining kids means nothing to you people, but he was popular with WWE's core group at the time.
He also was the main singer on "Piledriver", which was a big wrestling album that sold a lot of copies.
I suspect that most people bagging Koko B. Ware, and his induction, have never seen him, or barley watched him. They are the same people who bag Rey Mysterio now, after cheering him for years.
Yet, these same people will support Daniel Bryan, who is barely taller than Koko or Rey, and think that he could beat Brock Lesnar. It just shows how many of you have no f...ing clue when it comes to wrestling.
THTRobtaylor
Once & Future Wrestlezone Columnist
People forget Koko was one of the first "high flyers" and more importantly a major African American role model/hero in the 80's for kids...and none of them in that late 80's period did the high-flying stuff he did. The next one was 2 Cold Scorpio for gods sake... now if they'd put Flash Funk in there, people would call bullshit and understandably, but Koko would be better than Flash Funk/2 Cold and even Tony Atlas so why is it an issue... he inspired kids and was popular, he was there when guys like Ron Simmons were "coming up" in the business so they could look at him and see it was possible. While Rocky had his dad, when he was a kid he'd also have someone like Koko there to look up to and see the work other guys of colour put in to make it, not just his dad.
If Koko isn't featured in WWF for so long, Ron Simmons never takes the mask off or rises above being Doom #1, much less the first Afro-American World Champion... Rocky Maivia is never given that face platform that bombs... other kids like Kofi don't then have that role model to get them into the business knowing they can contribute and get over, if not make it to the main event... think about it guys...
His entry is also a bit of a political thing than based on in-ring criteria. Vince dicked him over once badly, knows he did and made it up later.
That happens a lot in WWE and the HOF is increasingly becoming the best way to do that... they get a nice weekend on the company, a bit of exposure and they think and speak happy thoughts on the company and probably inspire a few of there comrades of the time to do the same.
If Koko isn't featured in WWF for so long, Ron Simmons never takes the mask off or rises above being Doom #1, much less the first Afro-American World Champion... Rocky Maivia is never given that face platform that bombs... other kids like Kofi don't then have that role model to get them into the business knowing they can contribute and get over, if not make it to the main event... think about it guys...
His entry is also a bit of a political thing than based on in-ring criteria. Vince dicked him over once badly, knows he did and made it up later.
That happens a lot in WWE and the HOF is increasingly becoming the best way to do that... they get a nice weekend on the company, a bit of exposure and they think and speak happy thoughts on the company and probably inspire a few of there comrades of the time to do the same.
Mustang Sally
Sells seashells by the seashore
Well, since you quoted my post, I presume I'm one of the people who has "no f...ing clue when it comes to wrestling."
Still, while it's true Koko and his damn bird were popular with the fans.....at least for a little while.....it takes more than a flamboyant appearance and participating in a record album to make someone HOF eligible, in my opinion.
Before any "showmanship" characteristics, I think accomplishments in the ring should be considered.....and Koko B. Ware didn't have nearly enough to qualify for enshrinement. In fact, I did watch and didn't hate him at all.....yet, as I recall, he fell into the category of "opponent" much too quickly to qualify him for entrance to the HOF. He jobbed for a long time before they released him. For that reason, he's my benchmark for comparing who should be in....and who shouldn't.
Personally, I liked his act, at least at first. But Hall of Fame?.....uh uh.
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