W.W.V.D

[Hazardous]

What would Vince Do...

If it wasn't Benoit who committed the horrible actions he did, but rather someone of the stature of Stone Cold, Undertaker, or HBK?

While Benoit was a main event player at the time, he was best known for his mid-card work. The most US title wins, in the history of the title. Yet he wasn't most known for his WWE work the way those other big names are. In a way, Vince got lucky in the fact that he COULD remove everything with Benoit in it from history... That might not work with someone like HBK, or HHH. Someone who's whole career was in the WWE. Who main evented some of the most important matches in the companies history. Would things have been different? Could they still show that person in highlight packages? If Undertaker killed 5 people tomorrow, how would they do HBK's Highlight package at the Hall of Fame awards? If Cena were to snap one day and beat a woman to death with his hands, how would they make fans forget about him and erase him for they're history? Would it be possible to do for some of the biggest stars in WWE history? Someone like Christian, or Swagger, or even Kane.. Yes, it would be possible.. But I don't believe they would be able to do the same actions if it were a Mega star.
So W.W.V.D?

 

[Azane]

The same thing he had done with Benoit, he would stop mentioning him on broadcasts, and kill off any resemblence of their character from the events.
You only see Benoit in a random titantron in the background of a package once in a blue moon, and even a more prominent start, He would still do this.

 

[dizzle1119]

Wondering how Vince would handle a hypothetically awful situation doesn't seem like something we should openly talk about, does it?

Seriously, I imagine they'd touch upon the topic at the start of RAW and that'd be the end of it. The person would be blacklisted.......just like Benoit.

And while we're on this subject, I think I need to say something. I feel as if a lot of people think poorly of Benoit because of what he did on that horrible, horrible day, but that doesn't seem fair to me. Benoit, at the time those things happened, simply wasn't himself. The man had brain damage, whether it was diagnosed at the time or not, and he snapped. Unfortunately, that snap lead to a terrible outcome, but how much blame can one really put on Chris Benoit?

I'm not saying Benoit should get off scott free or anything like that, but the situation should be looked at for what it really is....A man with serious brain injuries, who obviously wasn't acting like himself, commited an atrocity. Benoit deserves to be looked at with disdain and/or sympathy, and his loved ones deserve to be looked it with sorrow, but I don't think Benoit would've harmed his family if his brain wasn't nearly scrambled.

Just my $.02

EDIT:


The Kevin Sullivan conspiracy theory is laughable at best...

 

[orton0384]

For the topic i agree with whats been said already by previous posts. I would argue one thing. Dizzle i understand what u mean man. However, hitler was by todays standards a man with mental issues. He was not himself. However, that doesnt make up for what he did, whether you are of right mind or not in my opinion the end result is what matters.

If i shoot your father in cold blood but i argue the fact that my heads screwed up and doctors confirm i have a mental disorder from too many whacks to the head from my job are you going to not blame me in any way shape or form? You would ask 'what did he do to get to this point' it could be found i willingly took on the job knowing i would suffer brain damage. Therefore i caused myself to be put in that situation.

I understand it wasnt the same benoit who kissed his wife and hugged his boy. The same benoit who cried with eddie at mania. But he was still benoit. He still continued on with im sure a doctor or two reccommending NOT to. The end result he STILL murdered two people. I think people more so hate the fact that happened than actually hate him.

 

[Hazardous]

I understand where you guys are coming from on that, and I still like chris for his in-ring work. He is a rare kind of wrestler. One of the last of a dying breed. I may not like what he did outside of the ring, but im not going to let that ruin what he did in the ring. Same can be said for guys like Hogan, and Flair as well, to a lesser degree of course.

But this wasn't a focus on WHAT he did, but rather what came from the backlash of it.. Would it be the same if it was one of Vince's "Poster boys". I don't think it would. They wouldn't go out of their way to show them on purpose, but I don't think they would do a full out deletion of them either. You can't erase someone like HHH, Cena, Hogan, or Undertaker from the history. Can't take them out of the minds of people young and old. Benoit appealed more to the 'rasslin fans, than the sports entertainer group. He was old school, and that's what made a lot of people respect him/take notice. On the other hand, you have one of the almost comic characters like Undertaker, Super Cena, or even Rey.. You can't just erase them. It wouldn't work. The rock could come out Monday night, and punch an 8 yr old in the face, he's still going to be cheered for it, because he's a larger than life character.

 

[dizzle1119]

For the topic i agree with whats been said already by previous posts. I would argue one thing. Dizzle i understand what u mean man. However, hitler was by todays standards a man with mental issues. He was not himself. However, that doesnt make up for what he did, whether you are of right mind or not in my opinion the end result is what matters.

If i shoot your father in cold blood but i argue the fact that my heads screwed up and doctors confirm i have a mental disorder from too many whacks to the head from my job are you going to not blame me in any way shape or form? You would ask 'what did he do to get to this point' it could be found i willingly took on the job knowing i would suffer brain damage. Therefore i caused myself to be put in that situation.

I understand it wasnt the same benoit who kissed his wife and hugged his boy. The same benoit who cried with eddie at mania. But he was still benoit. He still continued on with im sure a doctor or two reccommending NOT to. The end result he STILL murdered two people. I think people more so hate the fact that happened than actually hate him.

Your comments about Hitler are a reach of VAST proportions, man. Benoit wasn't suffering from mental illness alone. The man's brain was nearly destroyed. Hitler, on the other hand, was pure evil. Night & day, dude. For real...

I also clearly said that Benoit shouldn't get off scott free. The man should be "looked down upon" in my opinion. I just don't think he was some sort of monster. The issues with his brain being nearly destroyed lead directly to what happened to his family. In that brief period of time, one can only imagine what was going through the guy's mind. Hell, he may have thought they were possessed by demons or something equally ridiculous. I haven't read every single word of news concerning the Benoit situation, but I'm familiar enough with it to hold down a conversation. My viewpoint is simple. Murder, in any way shape or form, is a terrible thing. However, when that murderer is completely off his rockers due to significant brain damage, one can only hold him accountable to a certain degree. In all honesty, Benoit may have avoided a life sentence and/or the death penalty (if the state supports capitol punishment) had he lived. I'd almost guarantee his lawyers would ride the brain damage aspect of the scenario hard. He'd probably end up in a mental institution for the rest of his life...

 

[Great Tical]

Good topic. I think VKM did the only things he could do in the Benoit situation: distance the company from the event, denounce what happened, and make changes to hopefully avoid it happening in the future. I don't think it would have gone any differently with any other Superstar, as WWE is publicly traded and I'm sure VKM had shareholders breathing down his neck over every decision made during that time. It would have been a bigger storm of controversy had it been a Cena or Stone Cold, but let's not forget how huge the Benoit incident was in mainstream media. You couldn't turn past a news station without seeing Marc Mero or Jim Helwig denouncing VKM, WWE, and wrestling in general.

The one good that came of it was to shine a light on some of the "dirtier" corners of the wrestling business, which resulted in the current Wellness Policy.

Benoit being "old school" unfortunately means the Wellness Policy probably would have done him no good being as he was doubtless well on his way to permanent brain injury before even going to WWE. That diving head butt made me cringe each time he did it. The guy was one hell of a performer, my favorite wrestler for years, but he should have retired long before. Maybe 3 people would be alive today if he had, but maybe not. Maybe the damage was already done.

 

[boywithbluehanger]

I think The Rock is the perfect indication that they could wipe ANYONE away from the WWE without it affecting the feel of whatever current aura/era they are trying to promote. After Rock left, year after year we saw his face less and less to the point where it became a "known fact" (viewer's opinion) that there was a serious falling out between he and Vince. If you can totally ignore someone who many believe to be the greatest asset to the WWE and promote the PG Era while only alluding/embracing the Attitude era when talking about SCSA, then I'd say it's very possible to do the same with anyone.

Look at it like this, The Ultimate Warrior was able to be written off and forgotten. Much later after that, they managed to do the same with Bret Hart to an even better degree since there was so much talent in both the wrestlers and the story arcs. With The Rock, most of these kids watching wrestling in the past 6 years struggle to even know who the guy is and feel upset that Cena finally has a rival in someone more entertaining than he is to fry him on the mic. The only ones Vince/WWE would care to deceive would be the target audience; And as we all know given the past 25 years, that can vary from era to era.

 

[MizterColemine]

You can't erase someone like HHH, Cena, Hogan, or Undertaker from the history. Can't take them out of the minds of people young and old. Benoit appealed more to the 'rasslin fans, than the sports entertainer group.

To elaborate on this concept, this discussion is evidence that you can't delete Chris Benoit from history either. Not completely. From a different angle, its the same concept as other news stories or high profile situations in which the makers of opinion decide what to omit from the exposure of the masses, but there are always those who know and discuss that alternative opinion, or that hidden truth.
The hidden truth of the matter here is that Chris Benoit, in terms of pro wrestling, was a great. One of the best of all time. And we have the forums such as these where we can freely discuss his classic matches and character style safely without causing an uproar and without having to make a broad socio-political statement about human nature, or having to bring up what happened outside the arenas at all. And we have youtube and our DVD's in which we can go back and relive those truly unforgettable moments in WWE History such as WrestleMania 20, and other classics he's had with the likes of Guerrero, Jericho, Angle etc.
I find it relevant to note that ok, we have the facts we were provided from media sources, but we don't have eye-witnesses to his tragic last hours. Only God really knows what happened. And yes we can believe he did what they say he allegedly did, and act as if he did do it according to protocol, and I'm not insinuating he did or didn't or that theres a greater chance for innocence or anything like that, I'm just saying I'd prefer to waive my right to believe one way or the other. Once a man dies, final judgment is with God alone and it doesn't do anyone any good to revisit a man's bad deeds.

 

[orton0384]

Your comments about Hitler are a reach of VAST proportions, man. Benoit wasn't suffering from mental illness alone. The man's brain was nearly destroyed. Hitler, on the other hand, was pure evil. Night & day, dude. For real...

I also clearly said that Benoit shouldn't get off scott free. The man should be "looked down upon" in my opinion. I just don't think he was some sort of monster. The issues with his brain being nearly destroyed lead directly to what happened to his family. In that brief period of time, one can only imagine what was going through the guy's mind. Hell, he may have thought they were possessed by demons or something equally ridiculous. I haven't read every single word of news concerning the Benoit situation, but I'm familiar enough with it to hold down a conversation. My viewpoint is simple. Murder, in any way shape or form, is a terrible thing. However, when that murderer is completely off his rockers due to significant brain damage, one can only hold him accountable to a certain degree. In all honesty, Benoit may have avoided a life sentence and/or the death penalty (if the state supports capitol punishment) had he lived. I'd almost guarantee his lawyers would ride the brain damage aspect of the scenario hard. He'd probably end up in a mental institution for the rest of his life...

Though hitlers heinous act was larger in number and history for impact hitler was evil in his actions however, evil as viewed by you is based off of the medias portrayal and what schools paint of him in pictures not giving you the human aspect of him. Hitler was doing what he believed was right. He was not of sound mind. One could argue they both (hitler and benoit) believed in their twisted minds they were doing right for everyone.does it make it ok? Does it perhaps make you want to view hitler with disdain or sympathy? It doesnt for me but i believe he and benoit were the same monster. To me its not that far a strech based upon actions and thought process. Both commited murder that was pre intended. Both took the cowards way out.

 

[Decarow]

I think this thread has drifted off topic.

Benoit was a star for sure, but not as big as Austin, HBK, Taker, or Cena. Hell, he did what he did after his star started to fade (granted, it was about to go back up).

But it would be a whole different ball game if it was a bigger star. Somebody that was an actual face of the company.

It can't just be something for VKM to ignore though. If a megastar were to commit such an atrocity,he would have to address it. And since he's Vince, he can apparently erase history.

Luckily for HBK though, they wouldn't have trouble finding footage for his HOF video if Taker snapped tomorrow. Yes, they had a huge history together, but there was more to his career than Mark Calaway.

 

[MMK]

Actually, this exact scenario nearly took place in 2007. Hulk Hogan openly admits that he was very close to doing something terrible to his wife and then killing himself when they were in the midst of their messy divorce and falling out.

For the most part, Vince has been able to erase Benoit and Wrestlemania 20 from the WWE history books, not sure he could erase Hogan and Wrestlemania 3.

 

[The Suplexer Perfecter]

I find it relevant to note that ok, we have the facts we were provided from media sources, but we don't have eye-witnesses to his tragic last hours. Only God really knows what happened. And yes we can believe he did what they say he allegedly did, and act as if he did do it according to protocol, and I'm not insinuating he did or didn't or that theres a greater chance for innocence or anything like that, I'm just saying I'd prefer to waive my right to believe one way or the other. Once a man dies, final judgment is with God alone and it doesn't do anyone any good to revisit a man's bad deeds.

We have facts reported by the autopsy report, the crime scene people, and the people who investigate it. The media just blows it out of proportion usually from the start.

If there was evidence of someone else doing the crime, they would have said it. But there wasn't.

You also have to revisit it because it correlates possibly to what performers do in the ring. I believe the diving head butt contributed a lot to the condition his brain was in. He didn't take chair shots every match, but he'd go for or do the head butt just about every match.

They also banned chair shots to the head after this (good move).

You can't ignore what he did when reflecting on Benoit. It will come up no matter what.

 

[Snoe]

If it was a top star it would definitly be a lot harder even now people talk about Hulk Hogan in th WWE.

I dont think people are being fair to Benoit, he was not himself probably had no idea he was even doing anything. When he found out what he did I doubt he was a coward. I think it was because he felt bad. He just killed his family being scared is probably the last feeling anybody would get. His family was gone and it was his fault he could have felt he had no reason to live.

 

[MizterColemine]

You can't ignore what he did when reflecting on Benoit. It will come up no matter what.

I agree. However I would also argue that now that the cased has closed, and the WWE has made adjustments to prevent such a thing from happening again, it isn't necessarily beneficial to reflect on Benoit, the person, in a negative light.
This might sound like it contradicts my argument, but now that I think of it, given the points both of us have made, couldn't there be a balance between: learning from the mistakes Benoit made in his career and what he put himself through to be a top notch performer and appreciating the level of performance he was able to achieve in the ring... without ignoring his existence or demonizing the man, himself?

 

[laddclan]

Well, Vince cannot erase what has already been packaged and shipped to stores as of today.

But look no closer than the opening montage of wrestlers that appear every Monday Night before Raw.

Where is Hulk Hogan?

Gone.

As if Hulkamania never happened.

If Hogan strapped on a chestful of TNT and walked into a RentaCenter and blew up 18 families tomorrow...

All future product emanating from Titan Towers would be devoid of any mention of Hulk Hogan, Hulkamania, the nWo, etc.

It would certainly hurt his bottom line overall, but luckily in the event of this crazy scenario, just about every package which prominently would feature Hogan is already created.