US Title - Ryder or Ryan?

[Wade's Public Transit Bomb]

Ryan.. By a long shot. He use gets being a babyface. He is always doing something with the intent of getting the crowd fired up. He has complete and pleasant surprise with how on fire he has been. You can say what you want about his movez and his execution. But there is a real shortage of GOOD babyfaces; put the belt on Ryan. He has ways to go, but can anyone make a decent argument that there is much for Ziggles to do with that US belt?


Zack Ryder just feels more like a flavor of the month if anything.

 

[HoHo]

I'm pleading for Ryder as champ, Ryan will be champ but not right now.The problem is Ryder falling into a hole where he's a joke, and people don't take him seriously lik Eric Young with all the funny things he does.In time those laughs die down he needs to prove he can go for 20 mins and deserve a title.

 

[geroge86]

I'm gonna have to go with Ryder. He's been selling merchandise and working a program with Dolph for a while now that has been taken on more than just Raw as well as having Hugh Jackman being what started the feud. Celebrity involvement is usually a good sign of big things for someone. As for Mason Ryan he's well on his way to big things but he needs some more tv time before he's considered for something like that. Ryan hasn't said why he went after Ziggler so his motives are unclear to some people but the week before he returned Ziggler called Mason Ryan a robot during his segment with Hugh Jackman and then the next week he suddenly appeared as a member of Dolph and Swagger's team it wasn't a coincidence. I see Ryan's involvement being more of a way to counteract Swagger being in Ziggler's corner more than a contender for the time being. Things can change though look at Alex Riley. He started a program with Ziggler back in the summer but it kinda just dissolved without him getting a one on one title shot despite the buildup he had prior when he feuded with Miz

 

[The Hardcore Kid]

I personally hate both of them, And the US title itself is a joke these days. Get rid of the belt or unify it and just have one mid card belt.

Explain how the US Title is a joke right now?

Credible champion: Check.
Lengthy title reign: Check.
Credible opponents: Check.

Ziggler is one of the best guys going right now, and is honestly just about ready to take the step into the main event, thus making him too good for the US Title. The US Title hasn't looked this good in a WHILE. Same with Cody Rhodes and the IC Belt, to be honest.

On topic, Ryder needs it, and deserves it more, no doubt. He has been building his brand single handedly for the last year. I know this debate gets done to death on these boards, but seriously, name one guy as over as Ryder is when he did ALL the character development, ALL the promotion, ALL the promos himself? And up until a month ago was featured on TV twice this year? Mason Ryan is a beast, but he can't talk for shit and is boring as hell in the ring. But he's jacked as all hell so of course Vince has a hardon for him.

Hopefully Zack gets the US Title soon and Ziggler can move up to the main event; that would benefit them both the most.

 

[Good Golly It's Ollie]

Credible? the belt and all the people that surround it are a complete joke.

Ziggler, Swagger, Ryder, Ryan..... Etc. They are all terrible wrestlers and poor characters. They are all annoying and really shouldn't be on the air.

You haven't justified that opinion in any way whatsoever ... explain to me how two collegiate-based guys (that's Dolph and Jack, by the way, because you clearly didn't know this) are "terrible wrestlers"? Dolph and Jack are two of the best in-ring guys at the moment. As for "poor characters", well, Ryder got over with nearly no TV time, as Eboney said, Ryan 'gets' being a face and is getting over, and Ziggler and Swagger have enough to hold their own but are hugely benefitted by V. Guerrero.

As for Dolph - I don't get why everyone says "oh, he's good, but he needs Vickie. He's not got any charisma" Does he? Hasn't he? You see to me, Dolph's already proven that he's good on the stick (amidst his frequent lampshade hangings that he is in fact a #HEEL) and he has charisma. If anything Swagger needs VG more.

The US Title, also, is not a joke. That's a pretty old title (1975) with a fair bit of history behind it. It's been held by Harley Race, Ricky Steamboat and Ric Flair among many others, so I can't understand why you'd think it a "joke".

Anyway onto the topic at hand ... Ryan is growing on me, he really is, but I'd like Ryder to win it first. Just feels more appropriate to the build of the situation, you know? Ryan was shoehorned in here after Ryder was already getting on the US scene. But I would like to see Ryan with the belt eventually. He's a pretty cool face - one of the rare big guys who is better that way than as a heel, I think.

 

[THE AWESOME MIZFIT]

Zack Ryder without a doubt. Ryder has been paying his dues and there is no one in the WWE who deserves a push more then him. Mason Ryan has done nothing ro prove himself. Is he big and have the look, yes but thats pretty much it. Ryder has gotten himself over without the WWE. The WWE has just realize how entertaining he is and and that they can really capitalize on his success. He has the size to be a good mid-carder. He may not be main event talent yet but who knows anything is possible. Ryder all the way.

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

A week before Night Of Champions CM Punk cut a promo in which he said that WWE favours big guys. Triple H was booked to defeat Punk in that promo war and that is what he did. But it had a pretty different effect on the community that often fails to seperate fiction from reality, the IWC. The IWC referred Punk as a boring, repititive and pointless promo man who could never be big and was shown his place by the great Triple H.

Why am I bringing all this up? Because the push of Mason Ryan proves that Punk was right. Sure small men have made it big in the WWE but they have had to work a lot harder than bigger man. Can you see any small man getting this "out of nowhere" style push that Ryan is getting. Nope. What has Ryan done to warrant this push? Build a few muscles and fail as a part of The New Nexus?

Now I know that someone will bring up that it makes sense to push big guys because of their size because it is more believable for them to kick someone's ass as compared to a small guy. But it is not that this formula has always succeeded. From Lex Luger to Ezekiel Jackson, plenty of big guys have been given pushes based on their size and a good number of them have failed. Yet WWE insists on going through with such pushes. Even when there is a better albeit smaller wrestler who is available for the job.

Which brings to Zack Ryder. I'm not a huge fan of Ryder and to be honest I do not think that he can ever be a World Champion in the WWE. But no one can deny that he is over and the fans do want to see him. He may have gotten over by unconventional means but what matters is that he has gotten over. He is pretty good in the ring and while I would not say that he is great on the mic, he does have an endearable style. In any form he is much better than Mason Ryan at the very least.

So yeah, I would choose Ryder ahead of Ryan.

 

[The Underking]

Mason Ryan I don't know why but I really have become a fan of him. It might just be that he looks like a steriod infused version of myself. Either way I would go with Ryan simply for the fact the WWE really need young power guys as Ezekiel Jackson is shit at it, The Great Khali is leaving, Big Shows old, and Mark henry has basically two years left. So I'm going for Ryan but I wouldn't have a problem if Zack Ryder won it he's been trying hard to earn the title I don't think it will lead to a credible reign but if nothing else it will be a fun one.

 

[The Future Rises]

Well, let me go through both Ryder and Ryan.

Ryder - Got himself over with the crowd, decent in the ring, has great personality, and has good chemistry with Ziggler.

Ryan - Not over yet, average in the ring, has shown little personality, and doesn't work well with Ziggler from what I've seen so far.

So my pick is obviously Zack Ryder. I want him to get the shot and I think the WWE are gonna give it to him. He can be something really big if he makes his character a little more serious in my opinion. Mason needs some time. he's a little green, hasn't established his character yet, and the crowd aren't behind him. I do see that changing in a few months if Mason works hard however. Ryder needs to feud with Ziggler for the title. I think they have great chemistry and like I said Ryder, if he can make his character a little more serious, has potential to be a big star.

 

[shitsngiggles]

You haven't justified that opinion in any way whatsoever ... explain to me how two collegiate-based guys (that's Dolph and Jack, by the way, because you clearly didn't know this) are "terrible wrestlers"? Dolph and Jack are two of the best in-ring guys at the moment. As for "poor characters", well, Ryder got over with nearly no TV time, as Eboney said, Ryan 'gets' being a face and is getting over, and Ziggler and Swagger have enough to hold their own but are hugely benefitted by V. Guerrero.

Don't really care what they have done in the past, they are still poor characters. Dolph looks like a joke with his bleached hair and swagger sounds like a 5 year old on the mic.

I turn off whenever Mrs G comes on, ugly, loud mouther idiot of a woman.

As for Dolph - I don't get why everyone says "oh, he's good, but he needs Vickie. He's not got any charisma" Does he? Hasn't he? You see to me, Dolph's already proven that he's good on the stick (amidst his frequent lampshade hangings that he is in fact a #HEEL) and he has charisma. If anything Swagger needs VG more.

He's OK on the mic. He actually has some good intense matches but still looks like a weak joke.

The US Title, also, is not a joke. That's a pretty old title (1975) with a fair bit of history behind it. It's been held by Harley Race, Ricky Steamboat and Ric Flair among many others, so I can't understand why you'd think it a "joke".

Today it is a joke, there is no prestige. They need 1 middle card belt and it should be the Intercontinental championship. There needs to be more people challenging for the belt, and it should have some kind of stipulation added to the belt, that the holder is entitled to a World/Heavyweight championship match. That is afterall what having a lower card belt is all about, building people.

What better way to give the belt meaning again and get them up and coming stars into the spotlight?

Anyway onto the topic at hand ... Ryan is growing on me, he really is, but I'd like Ryder to win it first. Just feels more appropriate to the build of the situation, you know? Ryan was shoehorned in here after Ryder was already getting on the US scene. But I would like to see Ryan with the belt eventually. He's a pretty cool face - one of the rare big guys who is better that way than as a heel, I think.

Ryan, does work as a face. I think he needs a bit more credibility but I'm sure they will build it for him. That's what is letting me down on him at the moment. He needs a feud, or a good conquest to raise his image.

 

[Wade's Public Transit Bomb]

I think people are really, really underestimating how good Ryan has been as a face. Does he looks awkward while doing movez? Yes. Does it look like he is shitting his tights while he walks? Er.. Yes? But in three weeks he proved that if you just do shit that makes you likeable, people WILL get into you. No one knows who the f' he is, yet he has managed to make the crowd go crowd for a majority of his stuff.

Why am I bringing all this up? Because the push of Mason Ryan proves that Punk was right. Sure small men have made it big in the WWE but they have had to work a lot harder than bigger man. Can you see any small man getting this "out of nowhere" style push that Ryan is getting. Nope. What has Ryan done to warrant this push? Build a few muscles and fail as a part of The New Nexus?

The Ryan push so far is working. I don't get why so many people aren't getting this. Ryder's push was out of no where as well. Where is your criticisms for Ryder?

 

[BK Styles]

Credible? the belt and all the people that surround it are a complete joke.

Ziggler, Swagger, Ryder, Ryan..... Etc. They are all terrible wrestlers and poor characters. They are all annoying and really shouldn't be on the air.

Woah, what? Let me just stop you right there. So the two with good amateur backgrounds are terrible wrestlers, huh? Idiot.

Explain how Dolph is a terrible wrestler, please. Explain how Swagger is a terrible wrestler. In the ring, I would say Ziggler is better at telling a story, but as far as wrestling goes, they are both in the top ten of the current crop of guys. Easily.

Ryder has built himself a helluva lot of momentum, mostly off his own back, and deserves recognition, and he is getting that by being around the title picture.

Ryan is a 'WWE big guy'. I actually think this guy has something. I don't know what; it certainly isn't promo skills or ring skills, but he just...looks...like he belongs, and hopefully he'll improve. At the moment he hasn't earnt the place yet like the other three guys have.

With Ziggler holding the belt, the prestige is there. He's had it for a while now, and he's looked good with it. How you cannot see that is beyond me, but he's been one of the better US champs for a while now. And Ryder is a credible threat; not because he's amazing in the ring, but because the fans want him to suceed.

 

[FilthyMcPunk]

I get a kick out of ryder but i think a lot of us on the internet are blowing his rise this year out of proportion a bit.Its great that he pretty much got himself into the spot hes in now and he's getting more popular but to say hes gonna make a mankind like moment in a year or two is silly.

I don't see ryder ever being a top guy..in a cena/orton type spot with this character..over yes....focal point of the company..no.

There is huge difference between ryder and foley...foley toiled away going through crazy matches and sacrificing his body to get to the level he did..for years.Ryder has had a youtube show.(also i noticed someone mentioned foley was the main guy in the wwe for a while which isn't really true,he was one of but never made out to be the guy the company will go with as in a cena/hhh/austin/rock and so on)

 

[xg311]

When people talk about how Ryder isn't great in the ring, do they realize that none of his matches go longer than 3 minutes? Even in his tag matches he's barely in there to show more than a few moves.

While Ryder may never rise above the level of the comedic midcard, the fact that he has even gotten to this point is impressive. I'd love to see him have a reign with the US Title to see if he could actually do anything with the belt. Does he become more serious, turn back to a heel? He's even said his youtube show will be ending in the future, and this could be a chance to make him into a credible heel in the midcard.

While I'm sure Mason Ryan will be shoved down our throats in the coming months and years it'd be great to see someone like Ryder get to hold a belt, if even for a brief time.

 

[slice_of_life]

Ryder has three cheap victories over Ziggler, while Ryan dominated him no contest on Raw. It wasn't even close. Doesn't make any sense since Ziggler is one of the better talents that the WWE has and should be in world championship picture in the next year. If Ryan can run through Ziggler, then he should be able to run through everyone other than Cena and Punk who he would still put close matches together with.

 

[Larry]

I can't say that I am particularly keen on either of those options. I don't have a problem with either of them. I can't go down a list of multiple reasons why either is unfit to be a champion. All I know is that the prospect of either of them being U.S. Champion does not intrigue me. I like both guys just fine, but I would rather see Dolph Ziggler either hold the title a while longer, or have Jack Swagger turn on him and get the title. I've been waiting to call The All-American American American the U.S. Champion for obvious reasons. A guy with that gimmick has just got to be the U.S. Champion at some point, it's just too good, and Swagger is too good not to be holding some gold somewhere. Some might argue that it would be a step down since Swagger is a former WHC, but I'd say it's quite the opposite. He's already taken a step down, and remains there as a lackey to Dolph Ziggler. I think they should put him up as U.S. Champ and let him roll with it for a while.

 

[shitsngiggles]

Woah, what? Let me just stop you right there. So the two with good amateur backgrounds are terrible wrestlers, huh? Idiot.

Explain how Dolph is a terrible wrestler, please. Explain how Swagger is a terrible wrestler. In the ring, I would say Ziggler is better at telling a story, but as far as wrestling goes, they are both in the top ten of the current crop of guys. Easily.

Ryder has built himself a helluva lot of momentum, mostly off his own back, and deserves recognition, and he is getting that by being around the title picture.

Ryan is a 'WWE big guy'. I actually think this guy has something. I don't know what; it certainly isn't promo skills or ring skills, but he just...looks...like he belongs, and hopefully he'll improve. At the moment he hasn't earnt the place yet like the other three guys have.

With Ziggler holding the belt, the prestige is there. He's had it for a while now, and he's looked good with it. How you cannot see that is beyond me, but he's been one of the better US champs for a while now. And Ryder is a credible threat; not because he's amazing in the ring, but because the fans want him to suceed.

I explained my views above, but I will go into some more detail.

Maybe they are good wrestlers, perhaps I should have said characters instead, but! They are one and the same in the WWE.

Swagger is like a big baby, can't talk properly looks like he is dribbling all the time and in general comes accross as a total moron in my eyes.

Ziggler has some great matches, he is probably one of the most intense people the WWE have but they stick him with that ugly loud mouthed slapper Vickie and it just totally ruins it for me.

Ziggler shouldn't need someone to help him, they are trying to make him into an Edge like character too much I think, with the whole Vickie BS.

Ditch her, pronto! Keep him as a heel but make him a dark hourse, and ditch the pathetic bleached hair, makes him look like a girl. when he had his black hair he actually looked credible for a change.

Ryder is an annoying, smiley faced doofus. No credibilty there at all! Poo poo poo, you blow it. Getting beyond a joke with his childish image. Probably great for the kids, but the kids should have better role models than this pathetic idiot.

Ryan is the only remotely credible one surrounding the not very credible US title, and that is only because of his size and mean look about him. He doesn't have good matches though and doesn't move too good but still has something there. Still not excactly a credible guy though (yet)

The belt itself.

Every person in the WWE should want to be WWE / World Heavyweight Champion. The US title is like winning the lottery but only getting $20.

I know why they have the lower belts, but they are not carrying any weight anymore in my oppinion.

 

[Dagger Dias]

Who do you think will get the next shot?

Mason Ryan. It's no secret that bigger guys get pushed faster in the WWE than smaller guys. Ryan is nowhere near ready for a title run yet especially as a face. He has the potential but is better off as a heel, maybe a bodyguard. That worked for Brodus when he was Del Rio's bodyguard. Ryan could be Del Rio's new bodyguard. He used to be an enforcer for Punk in the New Nexus but Punk doesn't need a bodyguard anymore. At the very least if Ryan takes the title then Ziggler can move up the card.

Who do you want to get the next shot?

Zack Ryder. To say he is ready for his first singles title run is an understatement. He was given one of the weirdest gimmicks in WWE history when he got demoted to ECW back in 2009. He took the ball and ran with it. Now his popularity has skyrocketed online and he deserves to get a title shot. This would be the best of both worlds because Ryder gets his first title as a singles star and Ziggler gets to move up the card.

 

[ellax]

I guess after Vengeance today, we can officially say that Vince will only and definitely push Ryan more.. surely it's proven that Ryan is going win the US title from Dolph Ziggler..

if not, the WWE Creative team won't go all the trouble making Ryder lose this match today.. it's obvious.. Ryder has been screwed by Vincent Kennedy McMahon for his love and fetish for big guys..

 

[Workrate]

I don't like either option, but hopefully Ryan.

There probably isn't going to be room for Ziggler to jump into the WWE Championship picture between now and then -- they'll have a few Punk/Del Rio matches back and forth -- so I'd like to see Ziggler have a nice run with the US belt (which, honestly, I'm more interested in than the WWE title right now). But I want it to be one of the mid-90's style runs where each pay-per-view essentially restarts his rival. He beats Ryder, Ryder moves on and Ryan steps in. He beats Ryan, someone else steps in, and so on. Give him a resume of wins over different types of opponents to build him up.

In my opinion, neither Ryder or Ryan is ready for a title. Ryder is a decent athlete, I suppose, but he seems like comic relief to me. I don't see how his gimmick is all that different from Santino's, frankly. His whole character is making fun of a reality show that most people would agree is a wart on society. And Ryan gets basically no reaction at all even when he decimates someone. He's the kind of guy that could really benefit from having a mouthpiece as manager; right now he has no character.

 

[ellax]

I'm pissed off big time with WWE right now.. are they trying to make fun of Zack Ryder..?

First giving him title opportunity and screw it.. then next give him his first raw main event and once again screw him again..

WWE and Vince is obviously trying to make a fool out of Zack Ryder and the fans by thinking that giving him only TV time..? It's an insult!!!

 

[HollywoodLuthias]

I don`t think Zack Ryder should get the US title he doesn't get any cheers unless wwe puts those canned noises...As much as the 10% loves Ryder, he's a joke..

The US title would be a good rub for Mason Ryan and if it doesn't work, then just take it off him and try it with someone else.

 

[ellax]

Mason Ryan getting US Title is just a joke too.. if you say that Zack Ryder isn't getting any cheers.. i can tell you franking that Mason Ryan is getting none..

He's a Batista wannabe and the only reason he got push isn't because fans love him.. it's simply because of Vincent Kennedy McMahon's fetish..

 

[Larry]

Enough with the "McMahon Big Guy Fetish" crap. You know why McMahon likes to have bigger guys be more successful? Because they are more of a spectacle to behold and this makes them not only more credible but in turn more marketable. You think Hogan would have been anywhere as believable if he was the size of Ziggler, Rhodes, Ryder, Morrison or any of those guys? No. I'm sorry but those half-pint brawlers are not threatening or much to look at, I don't care how ripped they are. Put any one of them next to Andre who was ugly as shit mind you, and I can probably guess who you're going to believe in.

I'm sorry, but it was never believable that Popeye could beat up Bluto either, he had to take performance enhancing spinach. That's all this amounts to. There is an intimidation factor that rules in there. Would most of you be intimidated by Rhodes, Ziggler, Ryder, Morrison, or Kofi Kingston??? No. So there's a level of credibility there that they lack. But put you in front of say....Triple H, Big Show, Randy Orton, Kane, Undertaker, and I bet you'd believe they could rip your arms out of the sockets if I told you so. Are you going to believe that any of the smaller guys could actually stand to the bigger guys, when you're pretty sure you yourself could take them out? No. So it makes sense to have as big, believable, and spectacular specimens holding your titles as possible if you can.

I personally wouldn't give the title over to Ryan because I don't care for him much, and Ziggler is a better wrestler. However you have to understand the perspective of McMahon as well. It's nothing personal, it's not a fetish, it's just business.

 

[stephenjpunk317]

I don't think either guy is quite there yet. I like the idea of a three way match with Ziggler retaining, and making him look even more credible. He could lose it at the Rumble or pay per view after that. Maybe just wait till Wrestlemania.