triple h acting like a baby

[Kasey]

are u kidding me? triple h is more than just a jacked up body builder. his matches r much more entertaining than billy gun. he has much better mic skills and carried raw for like 3 years. and as far as angle and hhh being separated. the reason is they had already had a long feud and both shows needed a top heel, so think before u just talk shit that makes no sense. hhh isnt some spoiled kid who gets everything he wants. hes earned his way and has a load of talent. much more than billy gunn so before u go listening to what everyone else thinks, remember than vince is a lot smarter than u think and he knows whats best for the buisness and i can guarantee guys like taker and stone cold have the same if not bigger stroke than trips.

When a belt is completely embedded on a man's waist, of course you'll say he's carrying the company. Notice that the ratings didn't agree with him carrying anything? When Rock, Stone Cold, and Undertaker were running things the ratings were higher. Triple H is good. I'm not denying that he's got talent. As for Mr. Ass, how many times has he ever received a shot at the title even? He's a good worker who has never had the opportunity to perform in that capacity. My comment in regards to him being nothing more than a jacked up bodybuilder was in reference to whether or not he could fight in real life, as working and shooting are separate things, and I hope you'd get that. Read my post and you might. They'd had a long feud when Angle was still a milk-drinking babyface and didn't have nearly the aura he has at present. Think before I talk shit? There were plenty of others who could've been the top heels if worked correctly. If Vince knew what was best for the business, by this rate WWE would be as big as football...nevertheless, it's not (even though they were close at one time on Mondays). I don't doubt Taker has stroke, then again he hasn't worn the strap in how long? Same with Stone Cold, but remember, it wasn't Triple H walking out on the company a few years ago because he didn't like the program (when they said Ol' Steve "took his ball and went home") they were working him in, which was completely ridiculous and out of character. Triple H would never have been in that situation and you know it, because he's married to daddy's little girl. What's best for the business is for WWE to pick up the pieces and rebuild what they've destroyed in the last three years.

 

[PauLwaLL]

I don't doubt Taker has stroke, then again he hasn't worn the strap in how long?

Taker does have stroke.. He decides when he wants to wrestle and who he wrestles.. Thats stroke if you ask me.. Just because he doesnt have a title doesnt mean he doesnt have stroke..

What's best for the business is for WWE to pick up the pieces and rebuild what they've destroyed in the last three years.

Whats have they destroyed? About 10 months ago they were getting 5.0 ratings.. They have went on to make a Movie Production co... They have three different brands of wrestling.. Because the ratings are down, that doesnt neccesarly mean the WWE "destroyed" anything..

If you sit here and honestly say Triple H hasnt worked to be at the leval that he is now.. Then I can say that you have only watched wrestling for about 3 years.. Yes some of "special" treatment he gets is because he's married to the boss's daughter.. But it doesnt mean he hasnt earned it either.. Triple H is well established by himself.. The fans wouldnt go nuts with boo's and or cheers for him if they thot he was a fake.

 

[Bad Ass]

Billy Gunn is not the best tag team worker in the last 15 years. Christian, Edge, or Matt Hardy are ten times better than him. Billy Gunn and Road Dogg should not be brought back for DX, they are old news and will not add anything specific to the WWE. They are doing nothing in TNA and they will do nothing in the WWE.

As for wether HHH influenced Vince's decision to bring him back, doubt the major reason is HHH. Vince saw that shoot and said fuck them, they aren't that good of a draw to put up with. If Hall and Nash are not being brought back, the NAO shoudn't even be thought about bringing back. The Outsiders draw ratings and NAO does not.

 

[Kasey]

Taker does have stroke.. He decides when he wants to wrestle and who he wrestles.. Thats stroke if you ask me.. Just because he doesnt have a title doesnt mean he doesnt have stroke..

I hope you're right, because if he okayed the program with Khali, he needs to have his meds upped.

Whats have they destroyed? About 10 months ago they were getting 5.0 ratings.. They have went on to make a Movie Production co... They have three different brands of wrestling.. Because the ratings are down, that doesnt neccesarly mean the WWE "destroyed" anything..

I don't disagree they have three brands of wrestling. Count up the amount of TV that they produce which I can actually stand, and it just might add up to one promotion that's actually good. They haven't pulled consistent 5 ratings since August of 2001. A shade more than 10 months, I'd say. I feel they have, and I guess it's a matter of opinion, though. For my money they blew the biggest crossover event in wrestling history and the storylines have suffered ever since. Then they tried to repair the damage and have roster draft and split the brands.

If you sit here and honestly say Triple H hasnt worked to be at the leval that he is now.. Then I can say that you have only watched wrestling for about 3 years.. Yes some of "special" treatment he gets is because he's married to the boss's daughter.. But it doesnt mean he hasnt earned it either.. Triple H is well established by himself.. The fans wouldnt go nuts with boo's and or cheers for him if they thot he was a fake.

I think he's worked to be World Champion, but not enough to hold it as many times and for as long as he has for my taste. The only thing I've really had a problem with was him being the only heel they tried to build for about a two-year stint (a bit of a Jeff Jarrett-type deal). It's a situation where I see them painting themselves into a corner because without Triple H running the top heel spot, there has been a void left that Edge has been trying to fill as of recent because there aren't that many credible heels left for them.

 

[Kasey]

Billy Gunn is not the best tag team worker in the last 15 years. Christian, Edge, or Matt Hardy are ten times better than him. Billy Gunn and Road Dogg should not be brought back for DX, they are old news and will not add anything specific to the WWE. They are doing nothing in TNA and they will do nothing in the WWE.

I'd agree that Edge or Christian are talented, but either of the Hardy's are completely useless when it comes to ring psychology and they don't work very crisp in the ring, so that's where my agreement with you stops. Actually, Gunn has to be one of the best workers of the last 15 years because he's been brought back to the tag title picture 3 separate times with different partners since 1993. Apparently, Vince and company saw that in him. I don't want him coming back to DX because DX is quite frankly being bled to death at present. They have been doing nothing in TNA because they haven't been pushed at all.

As for wether HHH influenced Vince's decision to bring him back, doubt the major reason is HHH. Vince saw that shoot and said fuck them, they aren't that good of a draw to put up with. If Hall and Nash are not being brought back, the NAO shoudn't even be thought about bringing back. The Outsiders draw ratings and NAO does not.

Seeing as when they were tag champs and were over back around 99 and '00, the WWE's ratings were at their peak and stomping anything the Outsiders were involved in, I'd kind of disagree with the drawing point you made, but at present the mainstream doesn't care about wrestling much anyway. The Outsiders didn't do anything new for the ratings the last time they were brought in either. It's not that I think Gunn is God's gift to wrestling or something like that. Age-wise, he and Road Dogg are getting up there, and it's easy to see they are missing a step compared to the old days, but they can still move pretty damn good. I don't think the NAO were concerned with ever going back to the WWE so they did the shoot video. They don't want to go back, so it'll never happen, anyway. There is plenty of bitterness on both sides.

 

[PauLwaLL]

For my money they blew the biggest crossover event in wrestling history and the storylines have suffered ever since. Then they tried to repair the damage and have roster draft and split the brands.

So are you tryna say that you would rother have about 100 wrestlers all in one show? With that, you would see the same thing over and over again.. We wouldnt have the Randy Ortons, The Cenas, The Carlitos or anyone along those lines if it was all bunched together again..

It's a situation where I see them painting themselves into a corner because without Triple H running the top heel spot, there has been a void left that Edge has been trying to fill as of recent because there aren't that many credible heels left for them.

The thing right there is Triple H is just as good as a face as he was heel.. Right now Edge is doing something that noone else could have done, and thats taking Tripile H's heel spot.. Others have tryed to fill the void and havnt succeeded...

Now back to Triple H.. He deserves what ever lee way he gets... Ill jus name a few reasons why...

1. He can put anyone over
2. Great mic skills.
3. Best thing to happen to the WWE since HBK, that actually stayed.
4. Great in ring work.
5. Could change from top face to top heal in a heartbeat..

Now, if that doesnt deserve 10 title reigns.. What does?

 

[cmiller9291]

also during like 2003, there werent that many guys worthy of the title triple h's opponents were: scott steiner, booker t, kevin nash and bill goldberg. out of those guys bookers the only good one, but hes obviously not as good as hhh. now the only guy i think that could come close to doing the job that hhh did was jericho, but i still think trips is better. michaels didnt want the title so u see they werent left with many options. the reason i previously said hhh carried the company was that he was the one that main the raw main events decent because his opponents werent very good(with the exception of booker)

 

[Kasey]

So are you tryna say that you would rother have about 100 wrestlers all in one show? With that, you would see the same thing over and over again.. We wouldnt have the Randy Ortons, The Cenas, The Carlitos or anyone along those lines if it was all bunched together again..

I didn't want that. You misunderstand me. WWF had a handful of shows airing each week. Instead of doing the smart thing and assigning WCW's roster to one of them (being a replacement for either Smackdown, Heat, Velocity or another one of those dumbass recap shows that waste airtime telling you about what's happening next Monday) and possibly controlling a restarted ECW in place of one of the others. It's just irritating to me that all the shows have a lot of the same flavor and there isn't much uniqueness to each one. Besides, even the non-mark now knows that it's all owned by one company, so seeing someone jump ship or crossover to another show isn't very special anymore unless they go to TNA. In my mind, it would've been way smarter to corner the market by keeping three distinct brands alive that would cater to each demographic. WCW was always bigger in the South. ECW was always bigger with non-marks. Instead, they left enough breathing room in the American wrestling market for TNA to exist.

The thing right there is Triple H is just as good as a face as he was heel.. Right now Edge is doing something that noone else could have done, and thats taking Tripile H's heel spot.. Others have tryed to fill the void and haven't succeeded...

Now back to Triple H.. He deserves what ever lee way he gets... Ill jus name a few reasons why...

1. He can put anyone over
2. Great mic skills.
3. Best thing to happen to the WWE since HBK, that actually stayed.
4. Great in ring work.
5. Could change from top face to top heal in a heartbeat..

Now, if that doesnt deserve 10 title reigns.. What does?

Triple H isn't horrible, but I still don't think he's as deserving as some of the other athletes who come and gone in the company. Guys who could work circles around him. Edge wasn't the only one who could've (and should've taken the top heel spot on Raw). Remember a dude named Kurt Angle? They yet again summarily avoided each other and Angle was once again dumped back off to fight...Mark Henry. Then it was off to the spacious ECW locker room wrestling half-used Smackdown table scraps in some matches that were shorter and less competitive than an Angle Invitational sleeper. It escapes all logic to me why he'll put over stiffs like Batista and Cena, yet Booker T was denied a title run in the highlight of his prime? HHH wouldn't put Van Dam over either, even though Van Dam doesn't even need a storyline to generate pops. Benoit's push was quietly squashed along with Orton's that same year so HHH could re-assume the top spot. I don't doubt he'll put over people, just the wrong ones in my book. And instead of generating great feuds with credible workers, he's spent the last two years building characters that can't wrestle. Not a good recipe for fiscal longevity if you ask me. IF he has the stroke everyone says, then his judgement is cosmically piss-poor on whose career he wants to further.

 

[Kasey]

also during like 2003, there werent that many guys worthy of the title triple h's opponents were: scott steiner, booker t, kevin nash and bill goldberg. out of those guys bookers the only good one, but hes obviously not as good as hhh. now the only guy i think that could come close to doing the job that hhh did was jericho, but i still think trips is better. michaels didnt want the title so u see they werent left with many options. the reason i previously said hhh carried the company was that he was the one that main the raw main events decent because his opponents werent very good(with the exception of booker)

I disagree that there were workers good enough to feud with Triple H in 2003. Chris Benoit, Eddie Guererro, Rob Van Dam, Booker T, and like you said, Jericho to name the prime ones. But what did the front office have most of them doing at WM that year? Wrestling the openers. Except for Booker T and Jericho who did the job to yep...two members of the kliq. Steiner wasn't worthy because of his problem with drop-foot syndrome and had reduced mobility as a result. Nash has the knees of a 78-year old lady, so saddling him with the strap was/is too risky. Goldberg was too one-dimensional and limited with offense to pour piss out of a boot in a main event, and he only knew how to growl, breath pyro smoke, and kick Canadians in the head and cause 'em to suffer strokes. Jericho could've been one of the top heels of all time, because he can work as good, if not better than HHH, and his mic skills and pop/heat magnetism is there. He actually reminds me of Triple H before all of the steroid use, when Trips could actually fly if he wanted to.

 

[cmiller9291]

i can consider guys like benoit and eddie, but those two were on smackdowna and eddie hadnt earned vinces trust because he was a drug addict. rvd was/is good but his mic skills r so poor. hes probably more exciting than hhh but not a better worker

 

[Kasey]

i can consider guys like benoit and eddie, but those two were on smackdowna and eddie hadnt earned vinces trust because he was a drug addict.

True about Eddy. Benoit had always run strong and was eventually jumped as everyone remembers to Raw. His push was great for about six months (Rumble through Summerslam). After that, he should've retired. His career is no better off now than when he started with WWF.

rvd was/is good but his mic skills r so poor. hes probably more exciting than hhh but not a better worker

RVD's mic skills are decent, but he's not allowed to be the legit personality he was back in his ECW tenure. They let his ego run wild within his personality and his promos were solid because of it. WWE upped the stoner gimmick and had him act like a mix of Jeff Spicolli and Michaelangelo (the Ninja turtle). RVD is a fantastic worker who can go circles around HHH. The difference is that RVD is a chain wrestler and high flier. Two things that aren't conducive to the WWE style of wrestling most times because most guys can't mesh well with RVD's style. He was faster before he came to WWE because he actually worked with guys who could push him (like Jerry Lynn). When he tried to wrestle that kind of match with Lynn in WWE they were reprimanded for not wrestling the WWE style and actually going over ten minutes (the match was of course edited for TV).

 

[Skillz]

I agree with absolutely everything Kasey has said about Triple H.

 

[jefferson411]

Now back to Triple H.. He deserves what ever lee way he gets... Ill jus name a few reasons why...

1. He can put anyone over...

It isn't just that he can put them over, it is that he does. Batista and Orton are the 2 best examples of what HHH has done. Then, he goes away and makes his big return and everyone is like oh no HHH is back so he is going to take the belt, but no, he puts Cena over and backs out of the title scene and to this day has not gone for it again. No matter what you say about him, he does seem to care about what is best for the company and not just himself, otherwise he would take the gold cause everyone knows he would love to have it.

While we are on the subject of RVD, I just don't understand why everyone busts a nut over this guy. I am sure he was good in the original run of ECW and now everyone is like "WWE changed his gimmick and won't let him do his moves, so thats why he isn't as good as he was." I seriously do not see him as a good wrestler anymore. When he first came into WWE (I did not watch ECW so I only am familiar with his WWE run) he was fast and so much fun to watch, kind of like how i feel watching mysterio now. Everytime I watch RVD now he is slow, and makes it way too obvious that his punches and kicks are not causing legit damage. I have not been entertained by a single RVD match since he returned because he moves so slow, so freaking slow, and botches all of his punches and kicks and can't sell moves worth a dime. Go off on me but whatever, it is how I see it when I watch.

 

[cmiller9291]

While we are on the subject of RVD, I just don't understand why everyone busts a nut over this guy. I am sure he was good in the original run of ECW and now everyone is like "WWE changed his gimmick and won't let him do his moves, so thats why he isn't as good as he was." I seriously do not see him as a good wrestler anymore. When he first came into WWE (I did not watch ECW so I only am familiar with his WWE run) he was fast and so much fun to watch, kind of like how i feel watching mysterio now. Everytime I watch RVD now he is slow, and makes it way too obvious that his punches and kicks are not causing legit damage. I have not been entertained by a single RVD match since he returned because he moves so slow, so freaking slow, and botches all of his punches and kicks and can't sell moves worth a dime. Go off on me but whatever, it is how I see it when I watch.[/QUOTE]

i agree with what u said/ he used to be really good, but now just like sabu he messes up so much its embarassing. i think sometimes he sells stuff well like ddt's and some he doesnt like if he gets hurt he like kicks his legs like hes trying to ride a bicycle.

 

[cmiller9291]

While we are on the subject of RVD, I just don't understand why everyone busts a nut over this guy. I am sure he was good in the original run of ECW and now everyone is like "WWE changed his gimmick and won't let him do his moves, so thats why he isn't as good as he was." I seriously do not see him as a good wrestler anymore. When he first came into WWE (I did not watch ECW so I only am familiar with his WWE run) he was fast and so much fun to watch, kind of like how i feel watching mysterio now. Everytime I watch RVD now he is slow, and makes it way too obvious that his punches and kicks are not causing legit damage. I have not been entertained by a single RVD match since he returned because he moves so slow, so freaking slow, and botches all of his punches and kicks and can't sell moves worth a dime. Go off on me but whatever, it is how I see it when I watch.

i agree with what u said/ he used to be really good, but now just like sabu he messes up so much its embarassing. i think sometimes he sells stuff well like ddt's and some he doesnt like if he gets hurt he like kicks his legs like hes trying to ride a bicycle.

 

[Kasey]

It isn't just that he can put them over, it is that he does. Batista and Orton are the 2 best examples of what HHH has done. Then, he goes away and makes his big return and everyone is like oh no HHH is back so he is going to take the belt, but no, he puts Cena over and backs out of the title scene and to this day has not gone for it again. No matter what you say about him, he does seem to care about what is best for the company and not just himself, otherwise he would take the gold cause everyone knows he would love to have it.

I'll concede about him putting Batista over. That was a miracle in and of itself. But as for Orton, sorry. He squashed Orton's push like a turd under his boot heel. One year removed from Orton's title win, and you couldn't even tell he was a former champion. Hell, you couldn't even tell by the next Wrestlemania. Even without the title HHH has still been main-eventing and his segments receive a majority of airtime. If he cared about what is best for the company he'd work at elevating wrestlers that can actually wrestle (Benoit and Orton). Instead he works at elevating schleps. It seems convenient to me, because in the end, HHH is always looked at as the saving grace of the World Title division. In reality, there are a few guys on each show that are just as good (if not better) than HHH.

While we are on the subject of RVD, I just don't understand why everyone busts a nut over this guy. I am sure he was good in the original run of ECW and now everyone is like "WWE changed his gimmick and won't let him do his moves, so thats why he isn't as good as he was." I seriously do not see him as a good wrestler anymore. When he first came into WWE (I did not watch ECW so I only am familiar with his WWE run) he was fast and so much fun to watch, kind of like how i feel watching mysterio now. Everytime I watch RVD now he is slow, and makes it way too obvious that his punches and kicks are not causing legit damage. I have not been entertained by a single RVD match since he returned because he moves so slow, so freaking slow, and botches all of his punches and kicks and can't sell moves worth a dime. Go off on me but whatever, it is how I see it when I watch.

Watch his ECW run, then if you can come in and say he was not better in the ring than HHH, I can certify you as insane. You're right about him now, though. He is way too slow. He telegraphs many of his maneuvers, and you can tell a majority of what he does is beyond fake. View an ECW match with RVD taking on Jerry Lynn and see exactly what he used to be like in his prime. The only thing that'll suck about watching it, is that you'll be depressed over seeing what he was like then...and what he's turned into now. He's another example of what happens when the WWE-style of working kills a wrestler's abilities. Al Snow is probably the poster-child of this.

 

[cmiller9291]

when we say that rvd isnt as good as triple h we mean that he hasnt been as good as hhh since he came to wwe thats why they wouldnt want to put the belt on rvd. u cant call seomone insane for thinking ones better than the other because their styles r different.now about randy orton, the reason they took the belt off of him was that he wasnt at all over as a face. thats not randys fault, its wwe's because they wanted him to be the youngest champ ever and not brock.

 

[Kasey]

when we say that rvd isnt as good as triple h we mean that he hasnt been as good as hhh since he came to wwe thats why they wouldnt want to put the belt on rvd. u cant call seomone insane for thinking ones better than the other because their styles r different.now about randy orton, the reason they took the belt off of him was that he wasnt at all over as a face. thats not randys fault, its wwe's because they wanted him to be the youngest champ ever and not brock.

It's not the difference in styles I look at, it's the overall ability and potential of having someone carry a belt. RVD was a champion for 23 months and never once did his popularity lapse during the whole thing (instead it grew), because he was that good. WWE neutered his character and saddled him in awesome angles like fighting alongside the Big Red Mistake. Even on RVD's first night on Smackdown he was getting pops from a crowd that had never even seen him before. He was basically a roster acquisition write-off that was saddled at the bottom of Smackdown's programming. Randy Orton was more over as a face than Cena was any of the times Cena held it (especially because he wasn't booed). His matches were also better because he was/is more talented. His match at Wrestlemania 21 against the aging Undertaker received way more audience response than Cena's (even though it was on the midcard). Workrate and good title defenses from a credible champion can establish a wrestler. Bret Hart's first world title run was nothing special (He won the belt in Saskatoon of all places). Through defenses and solid wrestling he brought his credibility (and the belt's) up a few notches and by the time he got to Wrestlemania XI, the belt meant something again. This is the same thing they should've tried with Randy, in my opinion.