Thought on The Big Show

[wrestlingfanusa]

Ok so i got a question bout the big show. When he made his debut back in 1999 why didnt they give the streak to him? I dont mean the undertakers streak but why didnt they build him up with a undefeated streak of his own? People know Andre the giant had a 15 year undefeated streak of his own, so would a undefeated streak maybe be the right way to go with the big show? He is a monster so why not make him unstoppable? Was just wondering bc everyone does say he is misused incorrectly. It could be a wrestlemania undefeated streak or one in general, i think everyone knows wat i mean. So do u think it wouldve been a better way to have him be built up? IF so, how long would u have it last and who would end it?

 

[Skinsley]

I dont think that immitating Andre the Giant would have been a good move for WWE in terms of booking a Giant, just as they did with another Giant. Anyway Andre the Giant was around back in the times when it was ok for someone to be unstoppable and unbeatable just as it was ok for Titles to be held for years rather than the current Months/weeks/days.
WCW did very well with Goldbergs streak as it was fresh and new as the character was completely different from Andre. Then ofcourse WWE did an almost similar thing with a similar athlete(similar-ish) in Brock Lesnar but it didnt last so long as it had already been seen before.
As my personal opinion I really dont think that Big Show would have done well as a Monster Unstoppable and I think it was more bennificial for the company and the other wrestlers to get over, even if his defeats were'nt clean.

 

[GameOver]

Giants are built as unstoppable forces but dense in the old membrain. You can't have someone who has no weakenesses and is unbeatable, people won't care within a short amount of time, look at Hogan he was the most beloved til wrestlemania 5 then cracks started to show and the Ultimate Warrior became the new most beloved and why? because Hogan just kept winning all the time doing the same thing over and over again, it got boring

Show was no different. Just look back at history, all the oversized guys had one thing in common, they start off strong then someone "finds a weakness' and then they are easy pickings.

Andre was being beaten by everyone once Hogan beat him for instance.
admittedly mostly by DQ or count out but he lost none the less

Yokozuna was an exception he was still dominant til the day he died but he had alot more going for him then just size.

Why isn't Khali unbeatable? answer because he's dumb, easily outsmarted.
Why wasn't Kane kept as the unbeatable monster, why wasn't Undertaker/Zues kept as the men impervious to all pain

Show came in when Stone Cold was at the height of his popularity, why would they want him coming in to be unbeatable and on McMahons side and going after Austin, there'd be no hope for the face of the company, cause lets face it Austin was tough but he was no Hulk Hogan/Cena strength character.

Show is not great as a heel anyway, he is better suited to being the lovable giant like Andre was for most of his career. As a heel he talks a good talk but he doesn't back it up with his actions.

and Just an fyi Andre's streak was not accurate, that was as intended and dictated by Vince Sr. and eventually led to the ultimate way to promote WrestleMania 3. and Andre never won any titles til he was granted the world title for all of 30seconds in 1987. He had a 15yr undefeated record (no pins or submission losses) in WWE but he didn't wrestler every week and he still had losses by count out and DQ and outside of the WWE borders during that time he had several clean losses to other promotions champs including Harley Race and Nick Bockwinkle

on a personal note i do think Show was underused initially but since the attitude era ended he showed he like Mark Henry are not really that good other then looking imposing. WCW booked him initially as the bastard son of Andre lol

 

[UFOcalling]

Personally, I always thought that Big Show/Giant was never booked properly. The only time I really liked the way he was booked was when the WWE first put Big Show on the WWECW roster. That was when Paul Heyman was still around, and they booked Show as an "unstoppable" monster (and/or Giant).

In "real life", who could really pin Big Show unless he allowed it to happen? A guy that big shouldn't be jobbing to guys who are smaller than him (at least IMHO). I think the idea has passed it's prime by now, but booking Big Show as an unstoppable monster-heel should have been priority number one for every promotion he worked for (WCW and WWF/E). I don't know if a undefeated streak was necessarily the answer when Paul Wight first debuted for the WWF, but it certainly would have worked better than what they did. I think both WCW and the WWF/E dropped the ball with such an impressive physical specimen they had as an employee (that impressive physical specimen being Big Show/Giant/Paul Wight).

Who knows, though? Maybe Big Show/Giant didn't want to be the center of attention on the show...I can't see why he wouldn't have wanted to be, I know he said he told Eric Bischoff (when he was still working for WCW) that he wanted to make more money. I know he wanted to be more "over" with the crowd, so maybe that's not it at all. Like I said before, I think both WCW and the WWF/E dropped the ball with him, when he was younger. Now I believe it's far too late to build him up as a credible monster. Then again, it worked when Paul Heyman did it when he debuted with WWECW -- so who knows?

Like I said earlier, who's really going to be able to beat up Paul Wight enough to pin him for a full three seconds (in "real life")? Then again, this is pro-wrestling...not MMA, boxing, or "real life". I know all the endings to the matches are fixed, but it just never seemed "real" to see Big Show/Giant being pinned by a wrestler who was smaller than him. Just my two cents.

 

[InsomGTS]

Big Show was an instant main eventer in both WCW and WWE. He didn't need to be built up. Guys his size don't come along often.

 

[dadubay]

The big show is a great talent but to say that he doesnt need a build up is an overstatement. He succeeded in WCW because he had the right back story. I think if he came into the WWE after they bought WCW and was able to have some continuity in his story line then he would have succeeded but something went wrong and he is at the point of Mark Henry where it would take something extreme to put him back on the map.

 

[wrestlingfanusa]

anyone think he could be undefeated in tna if he went there? I mean with his size a limited work schedule is a big plus for him. It would def help his health problems and plus who there would be able to go over him? I think Kurt angle once said he would make sure big show had a undefeated streak if he came to tna. Also he wouldnt be just some other wwe reject he would be the big show, and i think he and not john cena could do big things for tna. Sure john cena would bring alot of fans, but i think i would rather watch big show kinda come in and take over.

 

[Foshinzo]

The undefeated streak is always great booking for a giant. The key is for him to pretty much literally beat everyone except the big face, who will end the streak and prove he's the best. Either that, or you can have the giant shock the world and beat the big face when he's the champion, hold the belt and continue to beat people clean, and then have your new big face beat him. Either way, it's Hogan vs Andre or, I don't know, Eddie v Lesnar? I know that Eddie vs Lesnar wasn't exactly that, but it was kind of the story that they told going into No Way Out.

The reasons that I always thought Paul Wight never got this run was: 1) Vince loved to squash ex-WCW stars when they first got to his company; 2) Vince McMahon doesn't have the slightest clue on how to book big men, and he just sustained temporary genius when he booked Andre going into Wrestlemania 3.

I remember Big Show just getting caught up in the Corporation story, with him manhandling Mankind the night of Wrestlemania 15 and screwing everything up for Vince. This was the mistake that probably cost Paul Wight the most success he ever could have had. Instead of letting him go off on his own, maybe giving him a manager like Heenan was for Andre, they threw him into a feud where he was never going to be the focus and he was never going to get over. That feud was about Rock v Austin and McMahon v Austin. Period. I think, in my honest opinion, that if the WWF were intelligent in their booking of Giant, he would have had a big introduction night where he mauls a big baby face, kind of like how he came in and cost Mick Foley the title against the Rock, but he wouldn't have gotten involved in the Corporation storyline. He could have had a couple of matches where he just destroyed Mick, because Mick would have gotten him good heat for it, and then fallen into a middle area where he just ran over the lower card and mid card guys in single's competition. Before you know it, he's run out of guys and gets his first main event feud, maybe with Austin where he could win the strap from him. Carry it for a while, then let Austin or Rock get it back on a big stage, or maybe even HHH could have ended it, though HHH was not the baby face to do it. After this, he's the big man who has destroyed everyone, even the guy who beat him, and can start to put over new baby faces. Again, baby faces wouldn't even have to beat him; you've established that it takes top guys to beat him. But, if a young buck could just hang with him, he looks seriously bad ass for it and Big Show would have made him look good.

I know that's a mouthful, but that's how you book big men in wrestling. Honestly, it has to be the easiest booking job in the world. VKM perfected the art with Andre, but immediately forgot what he'd done right, I think.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Show was a lot different to Andre in that he had more in the way of personality and earlier on agility. Remember this was a guy who could throw dropkicks at the start.

Show is naturally a "goofy", friendly giant, where as Andre was all about the size... Show's strength is that he can go from bad ass giant to aping others gimmicks and back to tag team specialist and still stay over and relevant.

WWE hasn't made many mistakes with Show, at times his attitude might not have been right but in the main he has been a much more valuable long term member of the roster than Andre.

 

[robbo316]

Personally, I always thought that Big Show/Giant was never booked properly. The only time I really liked the way he was booked was when the WWE first put Big Show on the WWECW roster. That was when Paul Heyman was still around, and they booked Show as an "unstoppable" monster (and/or Giant).

In "real life", who could really pin Big Show unless he allowed it to happen? A guy that big shouldn't be jobbing to guys who are smaller than him (at least IMHO). I think the idea has passed it's prime by now, but booking Big Show as an unstoppable monster-heel should have been priority number one for every promotion he worked for (WCW and WWF/E). I don't know if a undefeated streak was necessarily the answer when Paul Wight first debuted for the WWF, but it certainly would have worked better than what they did. I think both WCW and the WWF/E dropped the ball with such an impressive physical specimen they had as an employee (that impressive physical specimen being Big Show/Giant/Paul Wight).

Who knows, though? Maybe Big Show/Giant didn't want to be the center of attention on the show...I can't see why he wouldn't have wanted to be, I know he said he told Eric Bischoff (when he was still working for WCW) that he wanted to make more money. I know he wanted to be more "over" with the crowd, so maybe that's not it at all. Like I said before, I think both WCW and the WWF/E dropped the ball with him, when he was younger. Now I believe it's far too late to build him up as a credible monster. Then again, it worked when Paul Heyman did it when he debuted with WWECW -- so who knows?

Like I said earlier, who's really going to be able to beat up Paul Wight enough to pin him for a full three seconds (in "real life")? Then again, this is pro-wrestling...not MMA, boxing, or "real life". I know all the endings to the matches are fixed, but it just never seemed "real" to see Big Show/Giant being pinned by a wrestler who was smaller than him. Just my two cents.

Just as an aside to your comment; Paulo Cesar de Silva (Giant Silva) is actually around the same size as Big Show, 7'2", and around the 450lbs mark. He left wrestling and joined PRIDE Fighting Championships, and had 8 fights and only won 2 of them, losing 4 by TKO, and 2 by submission. One of those losses was against a guy who is comparable in size to Mysterio, or Bourne. It was Ikuhisa Minowa, 5'9", and 193lbs, and he lost via TKO. So in "real life", there is a precedent for a giant to be defeated by a much smaller opponent. In fact the biggest guy he lost to was Heath Herring, 6'4", about 250-260lbs, about Triple H stature.

 

[relentless1]

I think it started in WCW, he beat hogan for the belt right out of the gate, that was no good, have him come in and say he was andres son an all that then have him run through the roster to get his shot at hogan at starrcade or something, win it there, hold for a good six months, put him back as champ for the nWos arrival just like real life, have him lose same way at hog wild and join the nWo....i would have hogan fight piper at world war 3 and have giant win the battle royal to get his shot at starrcade, losing of course but keep him at the top of the card til sting beat hogan for the belt, but always keeping him at the top of the card, theres no way he shouldnt have been anything less than a four or five time wcw champ

when he came to wwf he shouldve been booked properly as well, big time heel beating everyone, shame how they misused such a huge athlete

 

[Bender]

Big, destructive powerhouse. A monster of a man, I liked him when he was in WCW, he was so fit. Especially in his early World Wrestling Federation days, sadly he put on weight. Now it's mostly fat, not muscle like his early stages in professional wrestling.

A great wrestler none the less though.

 

[GameOver]

Show was a lot different to Andre in that he had more in the way of personality and earlier on agility. Remember this was a guy who could throw dropkicks at the start.

Show is naturally a "goofy", friendly giant, where as Andre was all about the size... Show's strength is that he can go from bad ass giant to aping others gimmicks and back to tag team specialist and still stay over and relevant.

WWE hasn't made many mistakes with Show, at times his attitude might not have been right but in the main he has been a much more valuable long term member of the roster than Andre.

Andre too was agile and alot thinner at the start, by the time WWWF became WWF Andre's growth spurt was bringing him to the end of his career and life. It's amazing he lasted that 6yrs with all the issues he had physically.

as for Vince doesn't have the first clue how to book big men. Pfft you are the one who has no clue. He loves big men but they can't all be unstoppable or there'd be no point watching the show, prime example The Natural Disasters were booked as unstoppable forces til they got "outsmarted" and that's the only way they were beatable, Andre only got cleanly pinned by Hogan and Warrior everyone else that beat him was only by DQ or countout.

Taker and Kane were unstoppable forces, but there comes a point when it's boring to see them be untouchable. Big Show atleast got a title run, and it SUCKED. He's better chasing and someone mentioned he shouldn't lose to people smaller then him, well ok so what's the point of 98% of the roster ever facing him? cause they can't win.

David vs Golliath you know?
Rey should never be able to beat most of the people he did over the decades but he did because it's Part Of An Illusion.

 

[WunNightStan619]

He barely had any respect in WCW, he wasnt THAT dominate there, he waqs very beatable. Having him then come to WWF and then being dominate would make the WWF roster look weak in comparison.

 

[poppycock]

Not sure really. I think we live in a generation in which most people want instant results and a really long unbeaten streak to build up a huge Wrestlemania main event a year or two down the line may be something a lot of people would have the patience for nowdays and probably complain that it is getting boring. I only say this as I think if he made his debut in todays era he could work through the lower and mid card wrestlers on one show before being drafted over to the next and doing the same thing perhaps leading only then to him taking out main eventers. Keeping him away from the main event title scene until the time is right and a huge Wrestlemania main event could be booked in which the WWE Champion defends against an unbeaten giant monster. I really like Big Show both as a face and as a heel but do not have many complaints about how the WWE went about his debut.

 

[yur_momma]

after the way wcw debuted big show as andre's son, i doubt wwe wanted to associate him with andre again.

 

[fenfool]

Show has a lot of personality, I think putting him behind a streak like Goldberg would have hid that, and limited him. He can come out and be terrifying or hilarious...with him, it's not as much about wins and losses, it's what he's doing right now. I remember seeing him do some dropkicks in WCW that looked amazing for a man that size. He also stole the show when Rock had him, HHH & Mick Foley on SNL. A guy like Goldberg lived in that mystique of the streak, but he was a terrible interview. Undertaker's streak was almost incidental...like someone suddenly realized he never lost at WM, so they started playing it up. I think Show has done fine as it is.

 

[UFOcalling]

Just as an aside to your comment; Paulo Cesar de Silva (Giant Silva) is actually around the same size as Big Show, 7'2", and around the 450lbs mark. He left wrestling and joined PRIDE Fighting Championships, and had 8 fights and only won 2 of them, losing 4 by TKO, and 2 by submission. One of those losses was against a guy who is comparable in size to Mysterio, or Bourne. It was Ikuhisa Minowa, 5'9", and 193lbs, and he lost via TKO. So in "real life", there is a precedent for a giant to be defeated by a much smaller opponent. In fact the biggest guy he lost to was Heath Herring, 6'4", about 250-260lbs, about Triple H stature.

I've never heard about this dude, or his MMA history...but I believe you, and I believe the facts you stated about his fight history.

I guess I understand your point here, but since this is Pro Wrestling I just can't see someone the size of Rey Mysterio going over on Big Show and making it "believable" (even though it's scripted, as Pro Wrestling is). I completely understand your point...but even in those "real" fights that de Silva (whatever his name is) had, I'd have to imagine that he was the favorite going into most (if not all) of these "real" fights. Who knows, maybe the fights he lost were fixed as well! LOL!! You never know, a lot of people believe that some boxing and/or MMA fights have been fixed in the past.

I do understand that size might not always triumph over speed, agility, etc...but to me, in the world of Pro Wrestling, it just seems like a guy the size of Big Show just shouldn't be able to be beaten by a guy smaller than him. I totally understand that Big Show could lose a legitimate fight, but in the scripted world of Pro Wrestling I would have Big Show as an unstoppable monster; because that's just more believable than seeing him job to guys smaller than him. I guess I'm saying that I would have booked Big Show in that manner (as an "unstoppable monster") if I was the promoter/head booker of the company that he worked for. Do you know what I mean?

 

[Heartbreak_Kid_707]

I have been pushing for Big SHow to be the giant killer persona for a LONG time. Yes hes funny, i get it..good for movies...BUT when people (in general) seer a 7 foot+ guy coming down the ramp they want a squash and they (again in general) want to see the big guy (whoever he is) destroy his opponent...

 

[KoC417]

anyone think he could be undefeated in tna if he went there? I mean with his size a limited work schedule is a big plus for him. It would def help his health problems and plus who there would be able to go over him? I think Kurt angle once said he would make sure big show had a undefeated streak if he came to tna. Also he wouldnt be just some other wwe reject he would be the big show, and i think he and not john cena could do big things for tna. Sure john cena would bring alot of fans, but i think i would rather watch big show kinda come in and take over.

Award for worst suggestion/idea of the night..goes to you ..Just kidding a lot of people have wondered about that.....

now with that said. I don't think TNA would ever do that. And why not? Because Big Show is a "WWE" guy (even though he was WCW). It's the same logic as to why Vince buried WCW's talent. Why put them over big time and have him beat everyone in TNA? That makes TNA look weak if an outsider comes in and wipes the floor with them.

As far as Big Show being booked improperly...yes and no. Yes he was from the standpoint that they could have pushed him to the moon and rammed the "unstoppable giant" thing down out throats but that gets real old real fast.
And no he wasn't badly booked because he has done what was good/right for business. He held the belt when needed, he played the perfect heel when needed. He is an incredible face. He played the bookings to perfection and IMHO excelled at it even better than WWE had hoped. Big Show has made himself so valuable to that company that he is basically in a position to negotiate for big $ if he wanted to. You don't become that valuable if you are poorly booked. I mean look at Santino, he could have been incredible. But HE was poorly booked and lost lots of credibility.

Now as it pertains to your original question: I wouldn't have given big show any kind of streak. Maybe give him a list of people he had "injured" or "taken out" due to his dominance but no undefeated streak... Undefeated streaks are a bit ridiculous TBH. With the exception of a few decent streaks (Undertakers Mania streak, Goldberg, Crimson etc etc) most are so poorly done that by the end people are like "FINALLY"...

 

[poppycock]

Award for worst suggestion/idea of the night..goes to you ..Just kidding a lot of people have wondered about that.....

now with that said. I don't think TNA would ever do that. And why not? Because Big Show is a "WWE" guy (even though he was WCW). It's the same logic as to why Vince buried WCW's talent. Why put them over big time and have him beat everyone in TNA? That makes TNA look weak if an outsider comes in and wipes the floor with them.

I do not think TNA have a problem using ex WWE guys and putting them over big. Kurt Angle, Jeff Hardy, Mr Anderson... list goes on.

Anyway I want to see Big Show remain in WWE for a while yet and I am sure he will. Hopefully getting another run as Champion before he calls it a day. I think he is booked pretty much the same as Kane as in yeah nowdays sometimes he can mess about and at times be a joke but if they do decide to give him a serious monster run where he destroys all the main guys, nobody would question it. It shows all sides of his character.