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The Sports Bar

I'm not sure if they should deal him before the season starts. They should try to get more pieces around him first to try to entice him into staying. As long as Otis Smith is GM, though, I don't see that happening.
The reason I felt they should deal him before next season is because the longer they hold him, the lesser his value. They can get more for the guy when a team has an offseason to get used to playing with each other.

And if they are in a similar boat like they are this year, they may decide to make a run for it again, then end up getting nothing when he signs elsewhere. They aren't a championship contender, but they're a really good team.
 
The reason I felt they should deal him before next season is because the longer they hold him, the lesser his value. They can get more for the guy when a team has an offseason to get used to playing with each other.

And if they are in a similar boat like they are this year, they may decide to make a run for it again, then end up getting nothing when he signs elsewhere. They aren't a championship contender, but they're a really good team.

I don't disagree with any of this. I'm hoping they add a piece this offseason, if they don't deal Dwight during it, to make them into a championship contender. I'm not sure who that could be, though. It's a shame Otis Smith decided to trade away all the good young players that helped the Magic to the Finals a few years ago for over the hill players.
 
So is a Bulls vs. Heat Eastern Conference Finals match just a foregone conclusion? I realize they are by far the two favorites out of the east but the way the Chicago media talks about it it's like it's already offically on the schedule. Every day I hear talk about how the Bulls match up against the Heat in a seven game series. They use the word when instead of if. I've just never heard people just assume something so much so far in advance.

I don't see anything wrong with the Chicago media supporting their team and saying they are going to the Eastern Conference Finals, when the rest of the national media has all but crowned the Heat as the champs the last two seasons before they even stepped on the court, even though it didn't work out that way last year. Its what the sports media does, the way both teams are playing it is the most likely matchup but you never know...... and yes I am a lot biased when it comes to the Bulls. But like big sexy said in a earlier post the playoff are a whole different type of monster and you never know what team is gonna step up and injuries can change everything.
 
Tim Duncan just passed Paul Silas and Dikembe Mutombo Mpolondo Mukamba Jean-Jacques Wamutombo on the all-time rebounding list and now sits at 18th behind Charles Barkley.

I would like to say congrats to the surefire Hall of Famer. That is all.
 
I don't see anything wrong with the Chicago media supporting their team and saying they are going to the Eastern Conference Finals, when the rest of the national media has all but crowned the Heat as the champs the last two seasons before they even stepped on the court, even though it didn't work out that way last year. Its what the sports media does, the way both teams are playing it is the most likely matchup but you never know...... and yes I am a lot biased when it comes to the Bulls. But like big sexy said in a earlier post the playoff are a whole different type of monster and you never know what team is gonna step up and injuries can change everything.
Lakers baby, LA all the way!
 
I grew up in southern California as a Bulls fan so I really can't stand the Lakers but you never know, at least they made a couple of moves to get better.
I have been a Lakers fan since the early 90's pre-kobe while Magic was there. Gotta give my team some love. That loss to the Celtics really burned my butt.:disappointed:
 
I have been a Lakers fan since the early 90's
Oh yeah like when when we beat the Lakers for our first championship( had to say it) those were some good years for me! I've been a Bulls fan since 86-87, I was 12yrs old and the first game I ever watched was Lakers vs Bulls and I became Bulls fan right at that moment and been one ever since even through the post Jordan pre Rose years, those were some bad times hard to watch some of those years.
 
I'm happy the West made a lot of good moves at the deadline. As it stood it was the Thunder as heavy favorites and San Antonio with a chance at a pseudo-upset. Now I like the Lakers with about the same chances that San Antonio had before, San Antonio got closer to the Thunder with Jackson, the Clippers may or may not have gotten better with Nick Young, but potentially may have rescued their season. Three, possibly four teams now with legitimate chances of winning the West. I like it.
 
Alright in another fantasy league I went from

Wilson Ramos
Konerko
Zobrist
Tulo
Freese
Stanton
McCutchen
Crawford
Gardner
Kendrick
Crisp
Gaby Sanchez
Aaron Hill

Cueto
Wandy
Gallardo
Luebke
Francisco Cordero
Gavin Floyd
Garza
Bumgarner
Mike Minor

to

Avila
Konerko
Utley
Tulo
Michael Young
Stanton
Crawford
Gardner
Crisp
Nelson Cruz
Freese
Hill

Cueto
Cordero
Strasburg
Gallardo
Minor
Axford
Farnsworth
Luebke
Wandy
Floyd

Think I'm better off now?
 
I'm still overly giddy about the Yankees getting an All Star pitcher for essentially nothing.

Absolutely stunning that Pettitte came back now. Not 100% surprised he came back, but this was completely without warning. All of a sudden the reports came out that he signed a contract. No Pettitte is talking to the Yankees, no Pettitte is talking about coming back, no nothing.

And at 2.5 Million (if he makes the big club), it's beyond a steal. He was extremely effective in 2010, the last time he pitched.
 
I'm still overly giddy about the Yankees getting an All Star pitcher for essentially nothing.

Absolutely stunning that Pettitte came back now. Not 100% surprised he came back, but this was completely without warning. All of a sudden the reports came out that he signed a contract. No Pettitte is talking to the Yankees, no Pettitte is talking about coming back, no nothing.

And at 2.5 Million (if he makes the big club), it's beyond a steal. He was extremely effective in 2010, the last time he pitched.

I would hesitate to describe Pettitte as an "All-Star pitcher" in 2012.

The problem for me is that his 3.28 ERA in 2010 is a big deviation from the mean - his average ERA hadn't been under 4 for the last 4 years preceding that. While BABIP was average, and his HR/9 was actually slightly under his career average, his LOB% went up dramatically; taken in conjunction with a K/9 improvement I would suspect that he's in for regression. Fangraphs is oddly lacking in data for his slider in 2010, which was his most deadly weapon, but judging by heat maps and my gut I'd say that K/9 rate was linked to being really on point with that slider in 2010 which. Now 40 and a full season from pitching, I really worry about whether he can have that same success again. I would also note that PITCHF/x suggests his cutter and curveball were better than average in 2010, which I worry about a 40 year old repeating. So, all in all, I would expect an ERA for Pettitte of about 4.00 this year. Certainly not bad, and a definite improvement over what they've got at the back of the rotation. The only sure things in the Yankees rotation are Sabathia and Kuroda. They're the only guys who you know what you're getting out of. Spring training is strongly suggesting Pineda could use some time in the minors to round himself out - while his offspeed pitches are improving, his fastball velocity has fallen off significantly. No doubt he still has the stuff, he just needs to work it out. To me, though Pettitte should far outperform what I would expect Garcia or Hughes to pitch in 2012.

No All-Star, but a quality guy that fits anywhere from 3-5 in the rotation (I would assume 3 or 4, depending on Pineda). I will say, though, that 2.5 million is damn good price for him, especially considering the leverage that he had after 2010, further proof that Cashman, despite his absurd finances, is a very talented GM.
 
I would hesitate to describe Pettitte as an "All-Star pitcher" in 2012.

That's funny. He was on the All Star Team in 2010, and twice prior in his career. I'm pretty sure that would make him an All Star.

The problem for me is that his 3.28 ERA in 2010 is a big deviation from the mean - his average ERA hadn't been under 4 for the last 4 years preceding that. While BABIP was average, and his HR/9 was actually slightly under his career average, his LOB% went up dramatically; taken in conjunction with a K/9 improvement I would suspect that he's in for regression. Fangraphs is oddly lacking in data for his slider in 2010, which was his most deadly weapon, but judging by heat maps and my gut I'd say that K/9 rate was linked to being really on point with that slider in 2010 which. Now 40 and a full season from pitching, I really worry about whether he can have that same success again. I would also note that PITCHF/x suggests his cutter and curveball were better than average in 2010, which I worry about a 40 year old repeating.
Do I expect him to be what he was in 2010? Of course not. That's unrealistic. He's older now (He'll be 40 in 2 months). But is he still an excellent starting pitcher? Yes. Was he still for all intents and purposes free for the Yankees? Yes.

So, all in all, I would expect an ERA for Pettitte of about 4.00 this year. Certainly not bad, and a definite improvement over what they've got at the back of the rotation. The only sure things in the Yankees rotation are Sabathia and Kuroda. They're the only guys who you know what you're getting out of. Spring training is strongly suggesting Pineda could use some time in the minors to round himself out - while his offspeed pitches are improving, his fastball velocity has fallen off significantly. No doubt he still has the stuff, he just needs to work it out. To me, though Pettitte should far outperform what I would expect Garcia or Hughes to pitch in 2012.
Honestly that's the likeliest of scenarios, Pineda going down to AAA for a while. He's not ready full-time for the big-leagues yet, if this spring is any indication.

And the Yankees only sure things in the rotation are Sabathia and Nova. Kuroda is ancient and never been in the AL East, Garcia is ancient and not expected to be where he was last year. CC is a legit Ace, and thus-far Hughes actually has looked like he'll bounce back to form this year.

No All-Star, but a quality guy that fits anywhere from 3-5 in the rotation (I would assume 3 or 4, depending on Pineda).
He'll be the 4 behind CC/Nova/Hughes by the time he is with the big club (remember it's a Minor League deal and he's not expected to join the club out of Spring Training since he missed significant time. I think Pineda will be down in AAA, or Garcia will be gone, depending on their performance.

I will say, though, that 2.5 million is damn good price for him, especially considering the leverage that he had after 2010
Hell, the leverage he had 3 months ago. He told Cashman he was thinking about it 3 months ago, but wanted 6 weeks to make sure. Cash offered like $10 million back in december (what he'd get on the open market), but Pettitte wanted to make sure he was in good enough shape. By that time, the Yankees made their moves and he decided that he'd come back for nothing.
further proof that Cashman, despite his absurd finances, is a very talented GM.
Thank you. You don't know how many times I have heard people say that he's terrible, and that anyone could be the GM. There's honestly very few GMs better right now. He seems to always end up getting the better end of trades, and he turned the farm system from a laughingstock to one of the better systems in the league.
 
That's funny. He was on the All Star Team in 2010, and twice prior in his career. I'm pretty sure that would make him an All Star.

I meant it in the sense that he will probably not be an All-Star in 2012, which it seems we agree on.


Do I expect him to be what he was in 2010? Of course not. That's unrealistic. He's older now (He'll be 40 in 2 months). But is he still an excellent starting pitcher? Yes. Was he still for all intents and purposes free for the Yankees? Yes.

It must be nice to have a system where 2.5 million is as good as free. Just try to get the Indians to dish out 2.5 million. It's like pulling teeth.


Honestly that's the likeliest of scenarios, Pineda going down to AAA for a while. He's not ready full-time for the big-leagues yet, if this spring is any indication.

Yeah, I mean, there's a ton of encouraging things out of spring training for Pineda, but he's got to get that fastball back or else dramatically remodel himself as a pitcher. Fortunately his offspeed stuff looks a lot better so far, really the only thing is just working that fastball back to the level he was throwing it last year, or even better if possible.

And the Yankees only sure things in the rotation are Sabathia and Nova. Kuroda is ancient and never been in the AL East, Garcia is ancient and not expected to be where he was last year. CC is a legit Ace, and thus-far Hughes actually has looked like he'll bounce back to form this year.

Kuroda has a guaranteed spot in the rotation, from my understanding, and I think his numbers so far would suggest that you can make a fair projection of a high 3's ERA, closer to 4, though ZiPS is far less favorable to him than that, though age and a league transition might bear that out. I would tentatively expect him to be better than Nova, but Nova's limited sample size make that prediction difficult.


He'll be the 4 behind CC/Nova/Hughes by the time he is with the big club (remember it's a Minor League deal and he's not expected to join the club out of Spring Training since he missed significant time. I think Pineda will be down in AAA, or Garcia will be gone, depending on their performance.

Yeah, that seems most probable to me. Pineda spending some time down in AAA is just good sense. He needs work and he has the option, so why not, really.



Hell, the leverage he had 3 months ago. He told Cashman he was thinking about it 3 months ago, but wanted 6 weeks to make sure. Cash offered like $10 million back in december (what he'd get on the open market), but Pettitte wanted to make sure he was in good enough shape. By that time, the Yankees made their moves and he decided that he'd come back for nothing.

Thank you. You don't know how many times I have heard people say that he's terrible, and that anyone could be the GM. There's honestly very few GMs better right now. He seems to always end up getting the better end of trades, and he turned the farm system from a laughingstock to one of the better systems in the league.

Yeah, while Cashman certainly has more resources than anyone at his disposal, he also has a lot of talent at what he does. He uses that money for all it's worth, but he doesn't do it indiscriminately.
 
I meant it in the sense that he will probably not be an All-Star in 2012, which it seems we agree on.
Oh definitely. Especially since he's starting in the minors, and won't be with the Yankees til May.

It must be nice to have a system where 2.5 million is as good as free. Just try to get the Indians to dish out 2.5 million. It's like pulling teeth.
If he doesn't get to the Majors, the $2.5M doesn't happen.

And $2.5 Mil for a guy of Pettittes caliber is nothing. He's worth 10 plus.


Yeah, I mean, there's a ton of encouraging things out of spring training for Pineda, but he's got to get that fastball back or else dramatically remodel himself as a pitcher. Fortunately his offspeed stuff looks a lot better so far, really the only thing is just working that fastball back to the level he was throwing it last year, or even better if possible.
That there is, but there's plenty of things the Yankees aren't thrilled with. He came in 20 pounds over and his velocity is down. That's like the #31 and #2 things important for him. Had he been with the Yankees before and done their offseason workouts, they would be fuming at him being overweight.

Kuroda has a guaranteed spot in the rotation, from my understanding, and I think his numbers so far would suggest that you can make a fair projection of a high 3's ERA, closer to 4, though ZiPS is far less favorable to him than that, though age and a league transition might bear that out. I would tentatively expect him to be better than Nova, but Nova's limited sample size make that prediction difficult.
Kuroda has a guaranteed spot. But for a guy who spent his career in the NL West, he's got a lot to prove still. I think he'll be fine, but it's not a guarantee. Nova had success in the AL East, which gives him the upper hand.


Yeah, that seems most probable to me. Pineda spending some time down in AAA is just good sense. He needs work and he has the option, so why not, really.
exactly. Nova spent time in AAA last year after he got hot, and it really helped him when he came back.
 
LMAO! Seems the Jets want Tebow.
If he's coming cheap, it's a great move.

1. The fans want someone to push Sanchez. Tebow will do that (but not be good enough to pass Sanchez, which is also important)
2. Tebow can heal the "fractured" locker room with his magical Jesus Powers.
3. He can be an incredibly useful Wildcat Snap-taker.

The Jets would want him for what he is worth to them, a reserve QB who plays in specific packages where his talents can be used. It's not like they want him to be the starting QB like he'd be in Jacksonville or Miami.

The Packers want him too. Not laughing at that? It makes less sense then the Jets.
 
The Packers want him too. Not laughing at that? It makes less sense then the Jets.

It actually makes quite a bit of sense. The Packers have little to no running game; Tebow would immediately improve that. Aaron Rodgers is one of the top QBs in the game, so having Tebow take a few snaps here or there will give him some breathers and spare him a few hits over the course of a season. The Packers would be much more dangerous with Tebow.
 
On the downside, there's concern Tebow's presence could create a distraction for incumbent Mark Sanchez, whose leadership came into question after the season. Sanchez recently received a three-year contract extension with $20.5 million in guarantees, all but ensuring he'll be the starter for at least the next two years.

At least one member of the Jets didn't sound too thrilled about the prospect of Tebow.

"We don't need Tebow," cornerback Antonio Cromartie tweeted. "We sell out every home game let him go to Jacksonville Tampa or Miami. Our wildcat offense can b ran by J. Kerley or Joe McKnight."

Cromartie also tweeted, "We have (Sanchez) and just signed Drew. Mark has taken us to 2 AFC championship game. We need to build on the team we have now."

Just the talk of Tebow possibly becoming a Jet is stirring shit up in the locker room. This trade would likely end up being an utter disaster if it were to happen. What do you think is gonna happen when Sanchez has a bad game, the NY media & fans are gonna be all over the Jets to pull Sanchez in favor of Tebow, & do you really think NY is really going to have any patience for Tebow at all?

Tebow to GB isn't likely, it's being reported GB isn't willing to give Denver what they're looking to get for him (For the record, I have no idea what Denver is expecting). Also GB has a perfectly good back-up in Tim Masthay.
 
It actually makes quite a bit of sense. The Packers have little to no running game; Tebow would immediately improve that. Aaron Rodgers is one of the top QBs in the game, so having Tebow take a few snaps here or there will give him some breathers and spare him a few hits over the course of a season. The Packers would be much more dangerous with Tebow.
So what you're saying is that the Packers fans should want to take Aaron Rodgers, Elite NFL QB in his prime, off the field (or split him out wide). That is the stupidest thing I've heard in a long time. You don't run gimmicks like that when you have an elite QB.


If I'm an opposing Defense, every play you take Aaron Rodgers off the field I'm praising Jesus because I have a better chance at stopping the offense. Hence why it's stupid.
 
So what you're saying is that the Packers fans should want to take Aaron Rodgers, Elite NFL QB in his prime, off the field (or split him out wide). That is the stupidest thing I've heard in a long time. You don't run gimmicks like that when you have an elite QB.

This. Aside from taking one of the best QB in the league right now off the field, your sticking one of the most inconsistent QB's in there. Also those types of plays are not characteristic of GB's offense at all.
 
First of all, Cromartie is an idiot and shouldn't be allowed to speak. Why he would start shit about a potential pick up for his franchise is beyond me. I don't like Tebow as a starting qb but as an H back and possible back up qb he would be great. Sporano brought the wildcat to Miami and is now the O-coordinator of the Jets so there will be a couple packages for him. Plus Rex Ryan has said he wants more of a power running game and Tebow is a better power runner then anyone currently on the Jets roster.
 
The Packers want him too. Not laughing at that? It makes less sense then the Jets.
I don't remember even knowing about that much less getting a chance to comment on it. And I laugh at anyone willing to trade for that scrub of a QB. He can run and thats about it.
 
First of all, Cromartie is an idiot and shouldn't be allowed to speak. Why he would start shit about a potential pick up for his franchise is beyond me. I don't like Tebow as a starting qb but as an H back and possible back up qb he would be great. Sporano brought the wildcat to Miami and is now the O-coordinator of the Jets so there will be a couple packages for him. Plus Rex Ryan has said he wants more of a power running game and Tebow is a better power runner then anyone currently on the Jets roster.
If he is used in a wildcat and never throws the ball fine, but if you try to ask him to throw the ball don't expect anything. He can't throw, he is better as a running back.
 

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